Prabhupāda: Because even if you find somebody diseased, still, spiritual consciousness is not hampered. That is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, ahaituky apratihatā (SB 1.2.6). Apratihatā means without any impediment. There is no checking. Just like in the Ganges water you will sometimes find the stool is floating there. But that does not mean the Ganges water has become polluted. It is practical. In Calcutta, in our childhood, I was taking bath in the Ganges with my father. Many gentlemen regularly takes bath in the Ganges. And the modern scientific method is: all the garbage, throw into the river. So we were taking bath, and here is some stool floating. So we used to drive away the stool and take bath. The stool is unable to pollute the Ganges water. You will find in India still. The advanced gentlemen . . . "The dirty water," they say, Ganges water. But you will find practically that anyone who is taking regular bathing in this dirty water, he is healthy. You will find. It is very healthy. No disease touches him ordinarily. Of course, the body is susceptible to disease, but generally, those who are taking regular bath in the Ganges water, they are not diseased. You will find it practically still. So as the stool floating in the Ganges water cannot pollute the Ganges water, similarly, a devotee, even if you find scientifically that he is crazy or he is diseased, that is not impediment.
Dr. Gerson: I don't expect to find it, and if I do, I understand . . .
Prabhupāda: No, even if you find . . . you cannot find it, but even if you find, that is not impediment.
Bahulāśva: Śrīla Prabhupāda, what these tests will show is that when a person came first he was doing some drugs or some nonsense, and now that he's taken to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, he has become so much more of a healthy and wholesome person.
Prabhupāda: That is the test. That is the real test, how we got so many devotees from the hippie group, so how they have given up all their bad habits. This is the real test.
Revatīnandana: The function of his testing is to show that, that that change takes place in a way that other scientists will accept it. That is his purpose.
Prabhupāda: Oh, that's nice. That is already admitted by educated class. Therefore they are becoming attracted.
Dr. Gerson: But there are still many who aren't familiar with the movement, and I hope to familiarize them.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that is nice. Yes. But I say that even there is something wrong, it is not impediment. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. Api cet sudurācāro bhajate mām ananya-bhāk, sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ (BG 9.30). Even if you find in devotee something bad, and his behavior is not in the standard, but because he is Kṛṣṇa conscious, he has no other business, he is sādhu. Api cet sudurācāro bhajate mām ananya-bhāk, sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ (BG 9.30). He is sādhu. He is saintly man. Even if you find some defect in his character, because he is sticking to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, he is saintly. Kṛṣṇa says. How is that, a saintly man has got some this bad character? So that answer is next verse:
- kṣipraṁ bhavati dharmātmā
- śaśvac-chāntiṁ nigacchati
- kaunteya pratijānīhi
- na me bhaktaḥ praṇaśyati
- (BG 9.31)
"Yes, there are some defects. It is right. But it will be very soon finished." Just like you make the switch off, electric fan. So after the switch is off, still it is moving. But that movement is not real movement because the switch is off. It will stop very soon.
Dr. Gerson: Many of the defects that the tests might measure are defects that are measured against an insane society that considers itself sane. And so they aren't defects even if they show up.
Prabhupāda: Yes, you will find defects. But if the devotees stick to Kṛṣṇa consciousness principle, these defects will soon become finished.
Revatīnandana: One thing specifically he wants to do in order to counteract this propaganda against the Gurukula, which had serious impact, he wants to do some of this testing with the children in a way that is specifically done with children to show that these children are actually happy and they're developing nicely. He wanted to know if that would be permissible for him to do some testing at the Gurukula with the children.
Prabhupāda: That depends on your management, how you are raising the children. If they are Kṛṣṇa conscious, then it is all right. So far bodily defects, you might find. But we are denying from the very beginning, "I am not this body." So by finding some bodily defects, how you will decide about the spirit? Because spirit is not this body. You cannot conclude that because there are some bodily defects, therefore he has got spiritual defect. That is not right conclusion. The same example, "Because there are some dirty things in the Ganges, the Ganges is no more good," that conclusion is wrong.
Dr. Gerson: There has been a lot of bad propaganda that the children at Gurukula are unhappy and that they're not developing normally as children or human beings, and I would like to overcome that propaganda by showing that they are.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that the managers of the Gurukula, they should take care of. But if they follow the instruction which I have given for conducting Gurukula, then there is no question of . . . what is the general defect they are finding out?
Bahulāśva: No, they are not finding . . . they are just making up these defects, Prabhupāda.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: One thing they say is that the parents are not allowing the children the freedom to choose whether they want to be trained in this way or not. They are forcing the children to be trained in a very limited view—only Kṛṣṇa.
Bahulāśva: And they say that by repetitive chanting . . .
Prabhupāda: That means they do not know Kṛṣṇa means everything. That they do not know.
Bahulāśva: And big professors are saying that just by reading Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam you can learn everything. All the knowledge is given in there.
Prabhupāda: That is the Vedic injunction. Yasmin vijñāte sarvam evaṁ vijñātaṁ bhavanti (Muṇḍaka Upaniṣad 1.3). If you simply understand Kṛṣṇa, then you understand everything.