Prabhupāda: Initiation means you surrender to the spiritual master. That is the first qualification. And if there is still hesitation to surrender to the rules and regulations and honor such spiritual master, they should not become.
Siddha-svarūpa follower: I think it is pretty clear to me, Prabhupāda. It's just for clarification, that they're working, they have a store on Maui, there is a very nice store. They're distributing foodstuffs to all the other stores on the island, and they're working a lot within the society with the karmīs, like this. So their thinking is that "If we shave our heads and wear robes, and like that, then it will . . . they will not look at us . . .
Prabhupāda: That is not . . . Don't become initiated. Officially don't . . . Chant. Who is prohibiting to chant? You can chant, you can dance, you can take prasādam.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Can they actually say that "His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda is my spiritual master" if they haven't accepted all of the instructions?
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Can one actually say that my spiritual master is such-and-such person if I am not following all of the . . .
Prabhupāda: What is the use of calling that I am spiritual master? If you have not accepted him, spiritual master, what is the use? False propaganda. Because you think that "We could not accept at first, but we are trying to follow his instructions."
Devotee: That's honest.
Hari-śauri: One of the differences that first sprung up between the two groups was that one group was going out when you were saying, "Go out and distribute the books profusely," so they were going and distributing. And they had various means of doing it. Some were not so good, but still the books were going out. Then the group that split away, they were saying, "Ah, you're disturbing the public by these methods of book distribution. We don't want . . ." This is what happened in Australia, the one temple in Brisbane. They became very much against the saṅkīrtana methods, and as a result they gave up the saṅkīrtana program altogether and then went to live on farms like this, and they left the temple, and the temple was finished. So like this, they were saying that "We're still following Prabhupāda's instructions, but we . . ." But they were saying that the devotees who were distributing the books, they were not following instructions. Like that.
Prabhupāda: "His Divine Grace has said that 'You distribute book,' and why do you say that?"
Hari-śauri: Well, their idea was that because sometimes the public is becoming disturbed by the book distribution, then therefore it's not being done correctly, so it should be stopped.
Prabhupāda: Public may be disturbed, but we are following our own course of action. It is not obligatory. We are requesting you, "Take this book." That is not obligatory. If you like, you can take. If you don't like, don't take.
Siddha-svarūpa follower: I think that . . .
Hari-śauri: So what their idea was that we shall build some public relations, like you said with this store. They prefer to try to spread Kṛṣṇa consciousness by public relations, give good impression, and then people will come.
Prabhupāda: Then you are dictated by the public, not by the dictation of your spiritual master. Spiritual master has ordered to distribute books; we shall do that. That is obedience. Now, the public may take or not take, that is public's option. But my duty is—because spiritual master has said—I must try my best. Spiritual master has not said that "You must sell so many books daily, otherwise I will reject you." He has not said like that. So everyone may try his best, that's all. The public may take or not take, it doesn't matter. And if you are . . . want to please the public, public says that "You dance naked, I will be very much pleased, I will give you some money." So I'll have to do that. Then what is the use of making a spiritual master? Public, they have got their whims how to become pleased. So we have to follow all these things? We have to follow our instruction of the spiritual master. That is initiation. Why do you manufacture, "The public will be pleased like this"? Public may or may not be pleased; we don't care.
Hari-śauri: Our success is in the spiritual master's pleasure, not the public's pleasure.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that is bhakti. Otherwise why Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66)? "You haven't got to please so many religious instructions. You simply please Me." That is Kṛṣṇa's idea.
Siddha-svarūpa follower: I don't think the devotees who factioned off were against book distribution. I think that a little bit was that some of the devotees were using very, very forceful tactics and trying to give people books and take their money, and people were becoming very offended . . .
Prabhupāda: That is not required.
Siddha-svarūpa follower: That is not what you want.
Hari-śauri: That's all right, but don't give up the book distribution.
Siddha-svarūpa follower: Yes.
Hari-śauri: This is what happened. The temples fell down, the devotees went away. The ones who were distributing the books went on and distributed more books, became more expert, so that the public were not so much disturbed, and still they're distributing books. But these people who factioned off are not distributing books even now, two or three years later. So it was simply actually a question of faultfinding more than an earnest desire to please the spiritual master.
Prabhupāda: Yes.