Girirāja: Purport. "The Lord's descent from His transcendental abode is already explained in the 6th verse. One who can understand the truth of the appearance of the Personality of Godhead is already liberated from material bondage."
Prabhupāda: Yes. He is already liberated. When one understands Kṛṣṇa properly. Then.
Girirāja: "And therefore he returns to the kingdom of God immediately after quitting this present material body."
Prabhupāda: That return to God is eternal. Suppose I am your guest here, so you may provide me for some days, but I cannot expect that you can provide me for all the days. That is my mistake. But if you go to your father's house, there is no question of. He takes. That is the required. Go to your father. Mām eti. Therefore this is the way of eternity, that you understand who is your father and you go back to Him. Then his life is successful. And who is the father?
Indian man: (laughing) Not the body.
Prabhupāda: (laughing) Not body. It is in the Bhagavad-gītā. Find out this verse. Sarva-yoniṣu kaunteya sambhavanti mūrtayaḥ, tāsāṁ mahad yonir brahma ahaṁ bīja-pradaḥ pitā. He is the father.
Girirāja:
- sarva-yoniṣu kaunteya
- mūrtayaḥ sambhavanti yāḥ
- tāsāṁ brahma mahad yonir
- ahaṁ bīja-pradaḥ pitā
- (BG 14.4)
"It should be understood that all species of life, O son of Kuntī, are made possible by birth in this material nature, and that I am the seed-giving father."
Prabhupāda: This is all very easy to understand. Mother means from whom the child is coming, is it not? That is mother. Everyone knows. So you see this whole world, wherefrom everything is coming, you see, practically, gross knowledge. I see a plant is coming from the earth. A tree is coming from the earth. And according to evolutionary theory... Not theory, fact. The dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). When his plant life is finished, he takes another body, insect life. So the mother is the earth. That's a fact. I am eating the things which are... Jīvo jīvasya jīvanam. I am a life. I am taking either grain or I am taking flesh, the material is supplied from the earth. The animal also, he is also eating the grass. That is coming from the earth. The earth is the mother. That is a fact. Now we should be intelligent, that simply mother cannot beget a child. There must be father. So who is that father? The answer is here. Ahaṁ bīja-pradaḥ pitā (BG 14.4). So where is the ignorance?
Indian man: This is Brahman.
Prabhupāda: And again. Kṛṣṇa says aham, why do you interpret in different way.
Indian man: Now this indication is...
Prabhupāda: That means you make purposefully complicated. The father is saying, "I am father." Then why you are bringing this meaning, aham means...
Indian man: No, it's that "aham" is indicated to Who? The physical posture of Kṛṣṇa which we know or the...?
Prabhupāda: Why do we say like that? Why? (shouting) Why you are bringing physical concept He is a person, He is saying. Why do you say physical, material, and this and that way. He is father.
Indian man: Because He is saying, we should accept it?
Prabhupāda: Yes, you accept. Accept, Kṛṣṇa is in your front. And why should physical, metaphysical and chemical? Kṛṣṇa is a person. A person says...
Indian man: Earth is mother...
Prabhupāda: Yes. And He says that "Earth is mother, I am the father." You have to understand it. That yes, earth is mother, because everything is coming from earth. But who has given the seed in the mother? That Kṛṣṇa says, "I am giving." Sa asṛjata sa īkṣata. This is Vedic version. And He says personally.
Indian man: As you say earth, mind accepts immediately. But...
Prabhupāda: But if your mind cannot accept, your mind cannot accept, that does not mean the things will change. You should know that you are a fool. You do not know.
Indian man: I accept.
Prabhupāda: Yes, then as Kṛṣṇa says you accept it. How the father has given seed to this earth? That is not your business. You try to understand...
Indian man: (indistinct)
Prabhupāda: Because you are trying to understand in your own way.
Indian man: Trying to understand in my own way?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Just like you beget a child, you give seed. The seed of the child in the womb of your wife in a method, you know that. Therefore you are thinking, "How it is possible?" You do not know that God is almighty. He can beget children in His own way, but you are thinking in your own way, that "I give birth to a child in this way. How is that He is seed-giving father and earth is producing?" Because you are thinking in your own way.
Indian man: I have to think in my own way.
Prabhupāda: Yes, but that is not God. God is almighty.
Indian man: And now you are explaining that.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore you have to go to the right master.
Indian man: They say in their own way. How you search out the right master.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So I am speaking on the basis of the Bhagavad-gītā. I am not manufacturing.
Indian man: True.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is master. Master means he will not manufacture. Lawyer means who will speak in the court with reference to the lawbook. Not that "My Lordship I have manufactured this way. You accept it." "Get out. Get out, rascal. You are not a lawyer." So this is going on. The rascals are going to be lawyer, without understanding.
Indian man: No sir, the way you explain mother earth, similarly father's explain to me.
Prabhupāda: Father He says. Because you have no advanced knowledge, how you can understand? The father says, "I am father."
Indian man: So beautiful you explain mother. Similarly just let me understand father also.
Prabhupāda: No, no, beautifully, yes, everything is beautiful. We first know that without father, mother, there cannot be birth. So everything, whatever you, sarva-bhūtāni, sarva-bhūtāni, whatever is coming out, they are coming out as child of the earth. And you do not know who is the father. The father says ahaṁ bīja-pradaḥ pitā (BG 14.4). You understand the father. How you do not understand? The father says, "I am the father." You are searching after the father, and father says, and mother certifies, "Yes, He is your father." You don't require any other knowledge.
Indian man: This is fact. I am not understanding.
Prabhupāda: It is a simple truth (indistinct). The father says, I am the father. Therefore what can be done? He says, the father says that "I am the father." Mother certifies, "Yes, he is your father." Still if you do not understand, what can be done?
Indian man: You indicated very beautifully mother. I accept that.
Prabhupāda: Yes, this is also beautifully indicated. The father says personally, but you are so dull-headed you cannot understand.
Indian man: You say Lord Kṛṣṇa, but I must know what Kṛṣṇa is.
Prabhupāda: Then it is very difficult to make you understand. Everyone knows what is Kṛṣṇa?
Indian man: I don't know.
Prabhupāda: Then you should learn it, what is Kṛṣṇa. Therefore it is said, anyone who knows Kṛṣṇa, he is liberated. Because you do not know, you are not liberated. Otherwise, as soon as you understand Kṛṣṇa you become liberated.
Indian man: It is plain fact. I don't know.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So try to understand Kṛṣṇa from the right source. Otherwise, you will remain a rascal. That's all. That is your first business, to understand Kṛṣṇa. And Kṛṣṇa is explained in so many śāstras. If I am so rascal that still I cannot understand, that is my misfortune.