Dr. Kneupper: Is that what is meant when a man thinks when he dies, at the moment...
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Dr. Kneupper: He goes there. Are there many places, let's say, beyond the physical?
Prabhupāda: So many places. Don't you see, night?
Dr. Kneupper: No, I mean beyond this physical, three dimensional universe.
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. This is only one-fourth part manifestation of God's property. The three-fourth part is the spiritual world.
Dr. Kneupper: Are there different reasons for these higher worlds?
Prabhupāda: Beyond this universe. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. Find out. Paras tasmāt tu bhāvo 'nyo 'vyakto 'vyaktāt sanātanaḥ (BG 8.20). Find. He'll find out. Every information is there in the Bhagavad-gītā.
Dr. Kneupper: In the Bhagavad-gītā.
Prabhupāda: Mm. That is the beginning of God consciousness.
Hari-śauri:
- paras tasmāt tu bhāvo 'nyo
- 'vyakto 'vyaktāt sanātanaḥ
- yaḥ sa sarveṣu bhūteṣu
- naśyatsu na vinaśyati
- (BG 8.20)
Prabhupāda: Naśyatsu na vinaśyati. When everything of this material will be annihilated, that will exist. There is another world. Read it.
Hari-śauri: "Yet there is another nature, which is eternal and is transcendental to this manifested and unmanifested matter. It is supreme and is never annihilated. When all in this world is annihilated, that part remains as it is."
Prabhupāda: Purport?
Hari-śauri: Purport: "Kṛṣṇa's superior spiritual energy is transcendental and eternal. It is beyond all the changes of material nature, which is manifest and annihilated during the days and nights of Brahmā. Kṛṣṇa's superior energy is completely opposite in quality to material nature. Superior and inferior nature are explained in the Seventh Chapter."
Prabhupāda: There are two natures. One is material nature; one is spiritual nature. The material nature, earth, water, fire, air, sky, mind, intelligence, ego, and beyond that apareyam itas tu viddhi me prakṛtiṁ parām. This is inferior nature. Beyond this, there is a superior nature. And that superior means, jīva-bhūtāṁ mahā-bāho yayedaṁ dhāryate jagat (BG 7.5). That is the living entity. This big universe, this is material. But the living entities, because they are using this material for their so-called advancement, comforts... And because they have the power to utilize these material matters for their own purpose, they are superior. This is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā. And because this nature is being utilized, one is being utilized and one is utilizer. The utilizer is the superior, and the things utilized, they are inferior, but both of them are nature, God's nature. This is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā.
Dr. Kneupper: Is there time in the higher nature?
Prabhupāda: Hm?
Dr. Kneupper: Is there time?
Prabhupāda: No. Higher nature means eternal.
Dr. Kneupper: There are no changes in the higher nature?
Prabhupāda: Changes when he gets into this material, inferior nature. He has to change the body, one circumstance to another, another, another, according to his desire. Just like you get a lump of dirt. You can mold it. You can make a pot. You can make a doll. So we are doing that. Child. The father has given birth to the child and father has given the child a lump of earth and he's playing. That's all. For both of them, the father is the proprietor. If the child wants to play, father says, "All right, play." So he's sometimes breaking, sometimes crying, sometimes laughing. This is going on.