Prabhupāda: What is your idea of Brahman?
Kim Cornish: From my own understanding I took it to be just the world, everything that is, but I don't understand.
Prabhupāda: Not clear idea.
Kim Cornish: I had an experience in New Zealand . . .
Prabhupāda: So therefore you have to experience from authority what is Brahman. This is explanation of Brahman. So this Brahman realization is first, then Paramātmā realization, then God realization. Just like you realize the sunshine, very big, all over the universe, but you have to see wherefrom the sunshine is coming—the sun globe. That is localized. You are seeing just like a small ball, but actually this big thing, sunshine, is coming from it. Is it not? So which is important, the sunshine or the globe? Which is important?
Kim Cornish: They are both important, but the sun is what produces the sunshine.
Prabhupāda: Similarly God the person is important, and by His bodily rays the whole thing is going on. Yasya prabhā prabhavato (Bs. 5.40). Brahmaṇo hi . . . (aside) Find out this verse—brahmaṇo hi pratiṣṭhāham.
Amogha: Shall I read?
- brahmaṇo hi pratiṣṭhāham
- amṛtasyāvyayasya ca
- śāśvatasya ca dharmasya
- sukhasyaikāntikasya ca
- (BG 14.27)
Translation: "And I am the basis of the impersonal Brahman, which is the constitutional position of ultimate happiness, and which is immortal, imperishable and eternal."
Prabhupāda: Purport?
Amogha: Purport: "The constitution of Brahman is immortality, imperishability, eternity and happiness. Brahman is the beginning of transcendental realization; Paramātmā, the Supersoul, is the middle, the second stage in transcendental realization and the Supreme Personality of Godhead is the ultimate realization of the Absolute Truth. Therefore both Paramātmā and the impersonal Brahman are within the Supreme Person.
"It is explained in the Seventh Chapter that material nature is a manifestation of the inferior energy of the Supreme Lord. The Lord impregnates the inferior material nature with the fragments of the superior nature, and that is the spiritual touch in the material nature. When a living entity, conditioned by this material nature, begins the cultivation of spiritual knowledge, he elevates himself from the position of material existence and gradually rises up to the Brahman conception of the Supreme. This attainment of the Brahman conception of life is the first stage in self-realization. At this stage, the Brahman-realized person is transcendental to the material position, but he is not actually perfect in Brahman realization. If he wants, he can continue to stay in the Brahman position and then gradually rise up to the Paramātmā realization and then to the realization of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. There are many examples of this in Vedic literature. The four Kumāras were situated first in the impersonal Brahman conception of truth, but then they gradually rose to the platform of devotional service."