Mr. Wax: In your many visits around the world, do you see a desire among many men to try to improve, to become first-class men?
Prabhupāda: Yes, in your country there are so many.
Mr. Wax: Is there a great desire around the world? We here are a small group.
Prabhupāda: Everywhere. Everywhere. In Africa also.
Mr. Wax: There's hope for our world today?
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Otherwise, why we are trying, unless there is hope? We are not hopeless. If you train . . . if you can train a monkey to dance according to your will, why not human being? You can train even a tiger in the circus; he will act as you desire. It is the question of training. If the animal can be trained, why not a human being? You must know how to train. That knowledge is lacking, how to train. That we are giving, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement.
Mr. Wax: Is there also a girls' appearance of . . . (indistinct) . . . I mean, Kṛṣṇas are somewhat . . . (indistinct)
Indian guest: Swāmījī, I'll ask one last question. What advice do you give to a man of family? I am taking my case, I have got four children, and they are, their ages, between six and thirteen. I have to see that they grow up nice, I have to see that they educate themself so that they are as according to you . . . I don't know. I don't call myself first class, second class, third class. As you said, there are no first-class men, second-class men. But then how, apart from making them first class that they should follow the religious . . .?
Prabhupāda: No, no, if you become first class, and they will follow you. You remain last class, and how you can train your first class? (laughter) In the śāstra it is said: "Unless you can create first-class man, don't beget children." Pitā na sa syāj janani na sa syād gurur na sa syāt, na mocayed yaḥ samupeta-mṛtyum (SB 5.5.18). It is the duty of the father to raise his children first class. Otherwise he should not become a father. That is contraception. Just like Vasudeva and Devakī.
Formerly they were Vasus, and they were asked by Brahmā to create progeny. So the husband and wife, they practiced austerities very severely. So then God appeared before them, "What do you want?" And they said that, "We can enter into family life provided You become our son . . ." no, "If we get a son like you." Then God said: "Where is second person like Me? So I shall become your son." Then, in next life, Devakī got Kṛṣṇa as his child. So every father and mother should take this vow that, "Unless our children become first class, we don't want children." This is ideal. What is the use of begetting cats and dogs? You must have first-class children. That requires tapasya.