Prabhupāda: Yes. Any gentleman, any sincere man, must accept this proposition. It is so logical.
Prajāpati: They will come forward and say: "Now, what practical can we do to help implement these in the government, in the world? What can we do practical?"
Prabhupāda: Yes. That you take instruction from us. Because you are all rascals, you do not know. We are experienced. Take advice from us. First thing is that you close the slaughterhouse, close the liquor house. Will they do that?
Prajāpati: It is a question of business. Businessmen have so much control . . .
Prabhupāda: Business or whatever nonsense it may be. But our first proposal is that you become sinless. But they will not agree. They will remain sinful, and still they will say: "In God we believe, we trust," these slogans. "We go to church, we pray," like that. This is the defect. A man has come for your . . . you are a physician for treatment. As soon as the physician says that, "You don't do this," you say, "I cannot give up this." Then how he will be cured? Let him rot. This is the position.
Śrutakīrti: You said to me in the garden the other day that there are two kinds of ignorant people. One is innocent ignorant and the other is rascal ignorant, and that we should preach to the innocent. But all these politicians, they are not innocent, they are rascal.
Prabhupāda: They are rascal. They are rascal. Maybe some of them are innocent also, but mostly they are rascal. Because without being first-class rascal, one cannot go into politics. Just like if somebody says . . . now, election. Somebody says that, "You become vice-president." So why shall I become vice-president? Because I know I shall not be able to do anything. So why shall I waste my time? So another rascal, he will be ready: "Oh, offering vice-president?"
But I know that if I want to manage the State, I have to make the people sinless. So if I propose that "Stop this slaughterhouse," so who will accept me? So why shall I go there? Nobody will accept me. Senate, senators, they will say, "Oh, this is business. This is impractical. You have no experience." He will immediately reject. So therefore mass of people must be conscious what is God, what is sin. So when they will be prepared, these rascals will be changed.