Yaśomatīnandana: These Christians are very blasphemous.
Prajāpati: Very blasphemous.
Karandhara: Party spirit.
Prabhupāda: No no, what is their value? When they are sanctioning abortion, homosex, now they are finished. They have no value.
Karandhara: Well, most or a greater proportion of the traditional Christians condemn homosex and abortion. A good quantity of the traditional Christians, they condemn abortion and homosex.
Prabhupāda: Yes, they are good, but mostly, as you were telling me that, that Pope is disgusted... Yes. Nobody cares for the Bible or the Pope. That is everywhere, not only Christian. Actually there is no religion at the present moment. All animals. We don't blame only the Christians. The Hindus, Muslim, everyone. They have lost all religion.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Actually Prabhupāda, I read in the Time Magazine that Indira Gandhi, she said to one reporter her birth control program has not become successful because in Kerala there are a lot of Catholics who are opposing this kind of process. In other words the Hindus are approving of it but the Catholics are rejecting it, it looks like, to some extent. She says that because the Catholics in Kerala, they are opposing the birth control program so she has got trouble like that. She is completely atheistic.
Prabhupāda: Unless she become atheist how you can stay in that post? She must be atheist. Or she may not be atheist, but for political reasons she must become atheist. Otherwise she cannot maintain her post. All these politicians, they are simply duplicity. Actually they are something else, but in political post they must show themselves as something else. This is politics.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: When Nehru said that all factories, chemical factories and these iron factories are our temples, these are our temples.
Yaśomatīnandana: Nehru was a big atheist too, he openly declared.
Prabhupāda: Yes, he was first-class atheist. Now he has become a dog. Yes, some astrologer has said. He has become a dog in Sweden. A man has got two dogs. Out of the two he is one.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is quite believable.
Yaśomatīnandana: Yes Prabhupāda, it's a fact.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: How does he know that is...?
Yaśomatīnandana: It's fortunate to become a dog.
Prabhupāda: Ha? The astrologers, they sometimes approached. Ah, what is the position of this man, Vivekananda, Ramakrishna, Gandhi? And they say something. So he has said about Nehru like this. Astrologer, he was hesitating, then he said. It was spoken by one very respectable person, Śrīdhara Mahārāja.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Who?
Prabhupāda: My godbrother.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Śrīdhara Mahārāja. Oh.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Similarly also, Śrīla Prabhupāda, some astrologers say that Śrīla Prabhupāda...
Prabhupāda: No, no. Suppose if he has said, how can you disbelieve it? How can you disbelieve it? That is... Because in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). "After giving up this body, one has to accept another body." So he has accepted another body but nobody can tell what body he has accepted. If the astrologer says, you have to accept it. You cannot say, "No, he has not accepted dog body." You cannot give any proof. So anyone can say anything. But it is a fact that he has accepted another body.
Prabhupāda: That is a fact. That you cannot deny because it is said by Kṛṣṇa, tathā dehāntara-prāptir dhīras tatra na muhyati (BG 2.13). That you cannot deny. He has accepted another body. What kind of body he has accepted... If you want to suggest, that is also given in the Bhagavad-gītā,
- ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti sattva-sthā
- madhye tiṣṭhanti rājasāḥ
- adho gacchanti tāmasāḥ
- (BG 14.18)
He was in tāmasic, so he has gone down to the animal kingdom. That's a fact in the Bhagavad-gītā. He has gone to the animal kingdom. Now he may be tiger or dog. That is a different thing. But he has gone to the animal kingdom. That is the verdict of Bhagavad-gītā.
Bali Mardana: He looks a little like a dog.
Prabhupāda: Adho gacchanti tāmasāḥ, he was in completely tamo-guṇa.
Prabhupāda: That's a fact.
Yaśomatīnandana: He claimed himself to be brāhmaṇa. And he was eating meat.
Prabhupāda: No. He never claimed.
Yaśomatīnandana: He never claimed.
Prabhupāda: He never claimed. He said, "You call me brāhmaṇa. That's your... but I, I do not follow anything." He never said that.
Devotee: And Mahatma Gandhi, Prabhupāda, he said Rāma, Rāma, Rāma three times before he died.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So he'll get birth as human being.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Śrīla Prabhupāda, are these astrologers, ah, are, can we believe in them, what they say? Called pseudo-science.
Prabhupāda: No. Astrology is a science. (break) ...that I shall go to the foreign countries and throughout the whole world I will establish so many temples, so many things... this...
Svarūpa Dāmodara: So they have some intelligence to tell that...
Prabhupāda: No, no. That is calculation, calculation. This astrologer, this astrologer was a very big astrologer and when I was in service, Dr. Bose's laboratory, so Dr. Bose was treating one patient. He was vomiting blood. So he was treating as tuberculosis. Then he could not cure him after giving all medicine. Then he asked the astrologer, this astrologer who made my horoscope, "What is the matter? Panditji, can you tell?" So he calculated. He said, "You are making wrong treatment. He has got some sore in the throat. It is not heart." And he treated, he was cured.
Yaśomatīnandana: Vedic science is so perfect.
Prabhupāda: Yes. He knew it.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Who is this Dr. Bose, Śrīla Prabhupāda?
Yaśomatīnandana: Jagadishacandra Bose?
Prabhupāda: No, he's another Bose. There is...
Svarūpa Dāmodara: There is a Bose Institute in Calcutta in...
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is, (coughs) that is Sir Jagadishacandra Bose. Sir J.C. Bose...
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes.
Prabhupāda: ...who discovered, he discovered this wireless telegraph.
Yaśomatīnandana: Wasn't that your father's friend?
Prabhupāda: No. He, this, he's Dr. Karttikacandra Bose.
Devotee: Oh, I see.
Prabhupāda: There is a road, K.C. Bose, Dr. Karttikacandra Bose Street. He was my father's friend.
Devotee: Did you work for Jagadishacandra Bose too?
Prabhupāda: No, no. I worked for Dr. Dr. K.C. Bose, under whose name the street is going on, Dr. Karttikacandra Bose. He's also famous man, this Bose. He was the, I mean to say, the starter of this Bengal Chemical Company.
Yaśomatīnandana: Oh yes, they are a big company.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Dr. Bose's labora... Practically chemical industry was...
Svarūpa Dāmodara: I think it was Acarya Prafullacandra Raya, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that starting of chemical industry in the Bengali...?
Prabhupāda: Acarya Prafullacandra Raya was one of the director and this K.C. Bose was a managing director. Actually the life was given by Dr. Karttikacandra Bose to Bengal Chemical. But because Prafullacandra Raya was a famous chemist and he was attached to it, therefore his name become famous.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Oh.
Yaśomatīnandana: Also you mentioned Mullik family in Calcutta to be your grandparents or someone?
Yaśomatīnandana: That is also mentioned in the Bhāgavatam.
Prabhupāda: Yes. One of the members was our relative. So we are staying with them, these Mulliks. He had no sons. So we were staying, some relatives. Therefore I was born in that family, although they are our distant relations. But when I was, my father was staying there, I was born. These Mulliks they are also De. Their original title is De. This Mullik is their title.
Yaśomatīnandana: For being in the Mohammedan service?
Prabhupāda: Yes, not service. Sometimes the Mohammedans used to give... Just like the British government used to give titles, "Sir", like that. Mullik, Mullik comes from the word "mallika".
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Mallika means owner, the owner?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Mullik, Chaudhuri, Raya. These are Mohammedan titles. Khan. Like that. (break)
Svarūpa Dāmodara: ...family names, we said two family names, like Raya Chaudhuri, like Datta Gupta. How this happened?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Just like the Mulliks they're De Mullik. The original title is De but they got the title Mullik. Similarly, there is another family. They are called Sil Mullik. The original title is Sil but they got the title. As De we belong to the same family. But because, somehow or other, they got this title, so they... It is not different but... (break)