Yogeśvara: Last night, at the conference hall, this lady heard your lecture about how the soul reincarnates in different kinds of bodies. So she wants to know how is this possible because in the West, our understanding is that the animal forms do not possess a soul.
Prabhupāda: How does..., she can prove that she does not, it does not possess a soul.
Pṛthu Putra: She just doesn't understand. She does not say that. She does not understand.
Prabhupāda: No. She admits man has got soul, and animal has not soul.
Yogeśvara: See, what she says this is the traditional western idea.
Prabhupāda: But that idea is wrong.
Yogeśvara: (French)
Lady (1): (French)
Yogeśvara: She was open to receive a more detailed explanation of the process.
Prabhupāda: First of all, let us see what are the symptoms of having soul.
Yogeśvara: (French)
Prabhupāda: See, you can come here. Let her come.
Yogeśvara: Ask the lady to have a better seat.
Prabhupāda: Come.
Pṛthu Putra: See, there she has a seat.
Prabhupāda: Never mind, we can sit down here. Bring that chair.
Devotee: Prabhupāda?
Prabhupāda: Hmm?
Yogeśvara: Sylvie (?) has a question.
Lady (2): I want to ask you. What does it (indistinct) when you, when there's talk of this religion of Kṛṣṇa. Is it before Christ or more?
Prabhupāda: Hmm?
Yogeśvara: This, the question of religion, did it come before Christ or before Buddha?
Prabhupāda: Yes, 5,000 years ago.
Lady (2): Yes, before.
Prabhupāda: 5,000 years.
Pṛthu Putra: (translates into French)
Lady (2): 5,000 years, eh?
Prabhupāda: This is now. Before that, this was spoken some millions of years ago to the Sun-god. You find out that verse, imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1).
Yogeśvara: Four, one.
Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Fourth Chapter.
Pṛthu Putra:
- śrī bhagavān uvāca
- imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ
- proktavān aham avyayam
- vivasvān manave prāha
- manur ikṣvākave 'bravīt
- (BG 4.1)
(French)
Prabhupāda: So, if you take the calculation of Manu, Manu lives for 72,000 of yugas. One yuga is 4,300,000 of years.
Pṛthu Putra: (French)
Prabhupāda: 4,300,000 years, one yuga.
Pṛthu Putra: (French)
Prabhupāda: Multiply by 72. So that is the age of Manu. So, at least so many years before, Bhagavad-gītā was spoken to Manu's father, Sūrya. Sūrya, the Sun-god.
Pṛthu Putra: (French)
Prabhupāda: Sun-god. So how many millions?
Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: About 120,000,000 years ago.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Pṛthu Putra: (French)
Prabhupāda: So this philosophy was spoken 300 millions of years ago. And then again, He spoke 5,000 years ago. This is the history of Bhagavad-gītā. Now, your question. You say that animal has no soul, is it not?
Yogeśvara: (French)
Prabhupāda: That a man has soul, you admit?
Yogeśvara: (French)
Lady (1): (French)
Yogeśvara: Generally in the West it is admitted that the man possesses a soul and not the animals.
Prabhupāda: So why this difference? What difference you find in animal from the man?
Yogeśvara: (French)
Lady (1): (French)
Yogeśvara: She says it is only the body that is different.
Prabhupāda: Only body difference? The man who is there has got body different. The, the Africans, they have got different body. And the Europeans have different body. There are so many men. The aborigines have got different body. So there so many men, human also.
Yogeśvara: So then that is not the real difference?
Prabhupāda: So what is the real difference, that I want to explain.
Yogeśvara: (French)
Prabhupāda: So what is her reply?
Yogeśvara: (French)
Prabhupāda: Suppose a child has a different body...
Lady (3): (French)
Yogeśvara: This young lady suggests that the animals do have a soul, and that they also pass from body to body, and perhaps ultimately can come to the human form.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the explanation. You are right.
Guest (2): (French)
Pṛthu Putra: He says the evolution was already before, because in the vegetables is already this process of evolution of the soul.
Prabhupāda: Every living entity has soul. The body is just like the dress, just like you are sitting here under different dresses, but that does not mean we are different. That is stated in the Śrīmad Bhagavad-gītā: vāsāṁsi jīrṇāni. Find out this, vāsāṁsi jīrṇāni yathā vihāya (BG 2.22).
Yogeśvara: Second Chapter.
Prabhupāda: You can take it. Vāsāṁsi jīrṇāni yathā vihāya, navāni gṛhṇāti naro 'parāṇi.