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The pledge. Should I read the pledge (the Oath of Allegiance)? I have written it

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Expressions researched:
"I have written it" |"Should I read the pledge" |"The pledge"

Conversations and Morning Walks

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Yes, yes, yes... Everyone may hear.
Conversation with the GBC -- March 27, 1975, Mayapur:

Atreya Ṛṣi: The pledge. Should I read the pledge? I have written it.

Haṁsadūta: What about the situation in Germany?

Jayatīrtha: All right, situation in Germany we'll also discuss.

Atreya Ṛṣi: Put the pledge on the agenda, Prabhu.

Jayatīrtha: You want to read that pledge?

Atreya Ṛṣi: You want me to read it, Prabhu?

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, yes.

Jayatīrtha: I think so.

Prabhupāda: Everyone may hear.

Atreya Ṛṣi: I... The same pledge, that the Indian gentleman has written, where it says, "Prabhupāda, I, Mr. So and So, karmī name, initiated name in parenthesis, date of birth, at present residing at, of certain nationality, do hereby solemnly affirm, declare and state as under as follows: I state I have been elected or nominated a member of Governing Body Commission, under the recommendation of my Guru Mahārāja, His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda, founder and ācārya of Kṛṣṇa Consciousness Movement..."

Rūpānuga: Supreme Authority.

Atreya Ṛṣi: Shall I...

Satsvarūpa: Yes, Prabhupāda wanted it...

Rūpānuga: Ācārya and supreme authority.

Atreya Ṛṣi: It's down... There as well?

Jayatīrtha: There as well.

Rūpānuga: Everywhere. Everywhere.

Atreya Ṛṣi: "Ācārya and..., of Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement under the banner of International Society for Kṛṣṇa Consciousness. I state that I have imposed all my faith, integrity and honesty in my aforesaid Guru Mahārāja with the result he is the sole responsible person and supreme authority of my present position and status which I have gained and I am holding in the organization of the International Society for Kṛṣṇa Consciousness. I, the said Mr. So and So, both names, do hereby swear in the name of Kṛṣṇa that I will bear true faith and alliance to the constitution, by-laws, rules, regulations and directions which," and this has been added, "which have been given, including four regulative principles..."

Madhudviṣa: They should be stated too.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Madhudviṣa: The four regulative principles should be stated.

Prabhupāda: No, that may not be. We know, everyone.

Madhudviṣa: We know it, but does someone else know it?

Prabhupāda: Is it necessary to mention?

Rūpānuga: It's a legal document also.

Bhagavān: Yeah, it should be mentioned.

Prabhupāda: Mentioned? Mention.

Rūpānuga: If it was in parentheses, it would be better for a legal document.

Jayatīrtha: That's not a legal document.

Rūpānuga: It's a legal document. This is a legal document.

Atreya Ṛṣi: "And chanting sixteen rounds very seriously."

Madhudviṣa: Daily.

Atreya Ṛṣi: "Daily."

Madhudviṣa: At least.

Brahmānanda: And free from the offenses.

Haṁsadūta: We have to take some...

Jayatīrtha: Who's chanting free from the offenses?

Prabhupāda: No, no, don't...

Atreya Ṛṣi: "Very seriously" is all I can say.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, do that.

Atreya Ṛṣi: I cannot say "free of offenses." Because...

Prabhupāda: "Seriously" means without offense.

Atreya Ṛṣi: ...I am degraded. "Very seriously, or may be given to me from time to time directly, these directions, by my aforesaid Guru Mahārāja, or through his books, or..." In other words, direction given, instruction given, directly by him or through his...

Prabhupāda: Better directly.

Atreya Ṛṣi: No "His books"?

Prabhupāda: No.

Atreya Ṛṣi: Not necessary.

Prabhupāda: Because I may give direction according to the time.

Atreya Ṛṣi: "Or" means both.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Atreya Ṛṣi: "Or" can mean... All right. "Or through his commissioners..."(?)

Prabhupāda: Direct, direct instruction is important. Just like Kṛṣṇa. In the books He has given many instructions, but then He says, sarva-dharmān parityaja. If one says that "You gave me instruction before like this. How can I give up this?" so that is not important. The direct instruction is important.

Atreya Ṛṣi: "To me from time to time directly by my aforesaid Guru Mahārāja, or through his commissioner..."

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Atreya Ṛṣi: "Or through his authorized person or persons, and I shall obey faithfully all such instructions and directions which shall be, which shall be binding on me, and that I will uphold the sovereignty and integrity of my Guru Mahārāja, His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda, and the managing body commission and, or, any other body appointed by His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda working under the said International Society for Kṛṣṇa Consciousness. And I shall faithfully discharge the duty upon which I am about to enter or I have already appointed to that effect." Now this is an addition. "I further pledge that His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami is the only source of authority, represented by his instructions and books, and I shall follow his instructions, I shall follow the instructions of the books..."

Madhudviṣa: Only these books.

Atreya Ṛṣi: "Only these books" Rather than "I will not follow any other book."

Prabhupāda: No, why you'll put? (laughs) This is...?

Atreya Ṛṣi: It's not...?

Prabhupāda: This is required?

Rūpānuga: You mean the part about the books, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Rūpānuga: You mean the part about the books?

Haṁsadūta: It's already said that you're his direct instructions.

Atreya Ṛṣi: This is to protect, like, if somebody chanting sixteen rounds...

Haṁsadūta: It's redundant.

Madhudviṣa: Well, I thought if someone was chanting sixteen rounds and following the principles and reading someone else's books, like Siddha-svarūpa's people...

Haṁsadūta: Yeah, but we've just already read one portion where it says that we will follow direct instructions of Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: That's it.

Haṁsadūta: So again he's repeating it.

Prabhupāda: Instruction, follow that.

Atreya Ṛṣi: So then it's not necessary about this "only" sort part of...(?)

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Madhudviṣa: What if there is no direct instruction?

Prabhupāda: Yes. I don't think that part is anymore important.

Atreya Ṛṣi: "I further state that I am holding monies and movable and immovable..."

Prabhupāda: No, why he's...? He's not holding money, GBC.

Atreya Ṛṣi: So this I'll take out.

Prabhupāda: No, GBC, practically does not hold any money.

Atreya Ṛṣi: No.

Prabhupāda: Then why you...?

Haṁsadūta: You can say, "Any monies or properties under my direction..."

Jayatīrtha: That's what it should say.

Prabhupāda: Eh? What is that?

Haṁsadūta: Under, under his direction. Any monies or properties under his direction.

Atreya Ṛṣi: That would be a separate oath. That would be a separate thing, Prabhupāda.

Haṁsadūta: Maybe that should just be left out because if we're going to have some legal document like an umbrella, then that will take care of all those things.

Atreya Ṛṣi: Well, that should be in the pledge, in the agenda.

Prabhupāda: No, no, GBC... Does GBC members deal with money?

Haṁsadūta: No, he does not personally. He doesn't have anything personal.

Prabhupāda: No, no. I mean...

Brahmānanda: But he puts his signature.

Atreya Ṛṣi: No, no. As GBC, we do not deal with money. In other words, if you're dealing with money, it's the temple president.

Prabhupāda: The GB...

Atreya Ṛṣi: Not as...

Prabhupāda: The GBC should see that it is being done properly. Why he should...?

Haṁsadūta: But sometimes it...

Prabhupāda: ...involve himself in the...

Rūpānuga: Well, for example, in New York...

Prabhupāda: ...internal management?

Rūpānuga: Well, in New York, for example, I just recently signed with Gopī-jana-vallabha Prabhu the papers on the farm. I signed conjointly with him on the farm because the officers had to sign, and we just recently had a thing in New York, ISKCON, Los Angeles, New York.

Prabhupāda: No, no, "sign" another thing. That I have signed, many.

Rūpānuga: So that's all right.

Prabhupāda: The one thing is that GBC is wandering. If the checks are to be signed, then where is the GBC?

Rūpānuga: There's no account, no GBC account.

Prabhupāda: The... The money matters should be dealt with the president, secretary and the treasurer, three men. Out of three, two should sign. And GBC's business is to see that things are going on, money matters. That's all. GBC is not supposed to deal directly. He has to inspect. That's all.

Atreya Ṛṣi: So I can cross this...

Prabhupāda: Just like... But the thing is, if the GBC and the president is the same man, that is not good. That is not good. The president should be separate. So the president, treasurer and secretary, they will deal directly, and GBC should inspect book, account, that it is done very nicely. That's all. You can question, "Why you have done this?" That's nice. Otherwise, in the..., it will be difficult to manage.

Rūpānuga: Yes. We don't want to become entangled in that money.

Prabhupāda: Ah!

Rūpānuga: We don't want to become entangled in that money.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Madhudviṣa: What controls? What controls in the matter of money then?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Madhudviṣa: Who has control of the money?

Prabhupāda: Control means if there is vigilant, I mean to say, examination, inspection, then there is control of money.

Madhudviṣa: Well, let's say someone gives the temple president some money, and he puts in an account with his name and the treasurer's name, and they both conspire and take the money. Then there's no...

Prabhupāda: Yes. That you can do also.

Atreya Ṛṣi: Anyway...

Madhudviṣa: Yes, but...

Prabhupāda: GBC can do also.

Madhudviṣa: But isn't the GBC supposed to be more trusted than the temple president?

Prabhupāda: Then everyone can do, who has got the...

Bhagavān: The BBT trustees did it.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Bhagavān: The BBT trustees also did it. They took unsanctioned loan from the BBT.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes.

MadhuGopaldas +  and Rishab +
July 15, 0011 JL +
July 31, 0012 JL +
BG: 0 +, SB: 0 +, CC: 0 +, OB: 0 +, Lec: 0 +, Conv: 1 +  and Let: 0 +