Prabhupāda: So the news was there that Jesus Christ, after crucification, he was alive, and he went to... (aside:) Not so near. And he went to Kashmir. So by the yogic process, in samādhi one can remain alive although superficially he is seen that he is killed. That is possible. Hiraṇyakaśipu did that. He was undergoing tapasya for one hundred years of the demigods. Their duration of time is: our six months, their one day. So such a long time he was undergoing austerity, penance, and thus he became perfect. So his body was practically finished by the earthworm, what is called, moths and ants.
Brahmānanda: Because he was standing still?
Prabhupāda: Yes. For so many years everything was eaten. Only on the bones were there.
Brahmānanda: So he appeared to be dead, but he wasn't.
Prabhupāda: No, he was not dead. He was living on bones. Bones were there. Mean, life is not dependent on this material body. One can practice this by yoga. Without this body he can live. Just like ghost. That is possible.
Brahmānanda: Yes, the yogis are able to stop their breathing...
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Brahmānanda: ...and stop their heart beating, and still they are not dead.
Prabhupāda: Yes. This is perfection of astanga-yoga, samādhi, to remain in trance. (break) Yes. Actually he was not dead.
Cyavana: He never died.
Prabhupāda: Yes. He practiced yoga from India. For twelve years he was there.
Brahmānanda: In India. So is that a fact, that he went to India?
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Otherwise how he came to Kashmir? He knew. And when he was in India his mother died. That Aquarian Gospel? Father and mother died.
Brahmānanda: In the book that Haṁsadūta published, of Christ, Kristos and Krishna, these things are there.
Prabhupāda: Yes. It is in the Aquarian Gospel. (Break) Dr. Wolf has said that he cannot accept from Krishna to Krista. Then, by that word, he has proved himself another rascal, because he does not know the Sanskrit way of philology. Sanskrit, there are vargas—ka-varga, ca-varga, ṭa-varga, ta-varga and pa-varga—five vargas. So Kṛṣṇa is in the ṭa-varga. Ṭa, ṭha, ḍa, ḍha, ṇa. So Kṛṣṇa, it can be replaced by ṭa also. (laughter) He does not know that, this rascal. That is the difficulty. These Western rascals, little knowledge, they think very good scholar. That is the difficulty.
Brahmānanda: He is very proud.
Prabhupāda: Because he has got that doctorate title, so he thinks that he has conquered all over the world. Sapari jala-matrena phora-phoraya. (?) You'll find some fish, a small-little water: (makes sound) "phrr, phrr, phrr, phrr, phrr, phrr."
Brahmānanda: Making big noise.
Prabhupāda: And a big fish, they'll remain in the middle, whale fish. And a small fish, (makes noise) "phrr, phrr, phrr, phrr, phrr." Sapari phora phoraya. So he is a small fish. He is thinking that he knows everything. What does he know about these five vargas? Does he know anything? Ka-varga, ca-varga, ṭa-varga. So ṭa-varga means ṭa, ṭha, ḍa, ḍha, ṇa. So the ṇa is there. So it can be replaced by ṭa.
Harikeśa: I think he was also the same one who was saying the Aquarian Gospel was just somebody's dream.
Prabhupāda: Yes, but you are also dreaming. Why do you claim that your dream is all right; his dream is wrong? Dreaming is wrong. If his dream is wrong—you are also dreaming—you are also wrong. Why do you claim that your dream is all right? That is nonsense. Everyone thinks that he is right and everyone is wrong. We do not think like that. We take the words of the authority, that's all. Or we have no respect(?). This is our program. That is the way of paramparā. Not only we accept, but our previous ācāryas, all the big, big ācāryas, they have accepted. Śukadeva Gosvāmī said. He is ācārya. Vyāsadeva says from the very beginning. Kṛṣṇa says. That's all right. We take these authorities. We do not dream. That is not our process. Dream, your dream or my dream, this is all rascal. Dream is dream. Why do you think that your dream is right and my dream is wrong?
Brahmānanda: That's why they're always bickering with one another.
Prabhupāda: Yes. There is no standard idea. I dream some way; you dream some way. That's all. What is this?
Cyavana: Seaweed.
Brahmānanda: It looks like a sponge.
Cyavana: Plant.
Prabhupāda: That is their defect. If my dream is wrong, why your dream should be right? That they did not conceive of, that "My dream is right(?)." And if you say that "Your dream is also wrong," yes, I do not dream. I take the facts from the authority. We do not dream. Dream is dream, either yours or mine. It doesn't matter.
Brahmānanda: Well, some people question whether that Aquarian Gospel is authority.
Prabhupāda: Why Bible is authority? Who cares for Bible? Nobody cares for Bible. So there, some supporter for some book, these, you will always find it. Huh? Now they are decrying, deriding Bible also. So how do you say that Bible is authority when so many things have changed?
Brahmānanda: Even they are changing their interpretation of the...
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Brahmānanda: ...Bible regularly.
Prabhupāda: So if you don't accept Aquarian Gospel authority, who cares for your Bible? At least Aquarian Gospel has been written by some Christian. It is not outsider.
Harikeśa: They say he was a drunk.
Prabhupāda: But you are a mad. He is drunk, and you are mad. Where is the difference? So, if we can go? (break) It was a statement that the earth is flat. Eh? Where it was stated the earth is flat?
Harikeśa: Oh. That was a theory of one of the contemporary Roman philosophers.
Prabhupāda: It is not in Bible.
Harikeśa: No.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: (Break) There is no information in the Bible at all about God. There's no information about God, simply that God is there, He's the creator, but nothing more.
Prabhupāda: That is in no scripture excepting the Vedic scripture. Clear conception of God is there in the Vedic. Definition of God, clear conception of God, everything is there.
Brahmānanda: Their idea is that God is so great that you cannot see Him.
Prabhupāda: That's all right. You cannot see because you are worthless. But those who are worthful, those who have attained liberation, they can see. Just like it is stated in the Bhāgavata, apasyat puruṣam purnam. Apasyat: "He saw, Vyāsadeva." Huh... Bhakti-yogena manasi samyak pranihite amale apasyat (SB 1.7.4). When your heart will be completely cleared of all this material conception, then you can see. So long you are materially contaminated, it is not possible. That's a fact. But bhakti-yogena samyak pranihite amale. When the heart is cleansed, that is the process. Therefore we are insisting that "Let them hear Hare Kṛṣṇa." Ceto-darpana-marjanam (CC Antya 20.12). The heart will be cleansed. Then they will understand. All of a sudden, if you speak all this philosophy "Kṛṣṇa said," they will accept that "Why Kṛṣṇa? Kṛṣṇa is an ordinary man. Why shall I..."
Brahmānanda: They will argue.
Prabhupāda: Jaya. Because the heart is full of dirty things, so therefore ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam, this is the process. First of all cleanse the heart. Just like slate. If it is unclean, or the mirror, if it is unclean, you cannot see. So you have to cleanse his heart. That we can do. The Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra... And that is proof. Otherwise how could you come to this camp unless the heart is cleansed? That's a proof.
Brahmānanda: They came by the chanting.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Some fish? No.
Brahmānanda: In the Old Testament, God was speaking to Moses. So Moses wanted to see God. He was on a mountain. And he turned around, but then God became a burning bush.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: That was supposed to be the back of God. The burning bush was the back of God.
Prabhupāda: Burning bush?
Brahmānanda: A bush that was on fire.
Prabhupāda: Oh.
Brahmānanda: That's what...
Prabhupāda: God has no material body.
Brahmānanda: Because he was not qualified to see God.
Prabhupāda: Ataḥ śrī-kṛṣṇa nāmādi na bhaved grahyam indriyaiḥ (Brs. 1.2.234). By these material senses, you cannot understand God. Nāmādi. Even you cannot understand His holy name. Our understanding of God begins by chanting the holy name. So by chanting, chanting, because God is not different from the name, you associate with name..., er, with God, and then you become cleansed. This is the process. God is not different from His holy name. So you chant the holy name of God. That means you associate with God immediately. Just like you associate with the sun immediately, er, sunshine—you become warm—similarly, by associating with God, you become God conscious. This is our program. We are giving chance people to associate with God directly by chanting His holy name. God is omnipotent. His name is as omnipotent as He is. These fools, they do not know that.
Brahmānanda: They think it's some lesser, ordinary.
Prabhupāda: Yes. And if you say, "Why, then, Kṛṣṇa? There are many names," so Caitanya: "Yes, any name of God, if it is God's name, it is as powerful." If it is God's name. "Any name" does not mean you manufacture some name. That is not. Any name by which one can understand this is God's name, that is there said. Nāmnam akari bahudha-nija sarva-śaktis tatrarpita niyamitaḥ smarane na kalaḥ. This is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's preaching. If you do not accept Kṛṣṇa as a God's name, then if you have your own name of Kṛṣṇa, er, God, chant it.
Brahmānanda: But it must be standard.
Prabhupāda: Must be God's name.
Brahmānanda: Yes.
Prabhupāda: That is wanted. But if you do not know what is God's name, then what you will chant? What you will chant? Then you chant Kṛṣṇa. We know it is God's name. Take. Take to our principle. If there is no medical college, come to our medical college. You are welcome. Why you are envious? You have no medical college; at the same time, you are envious of my medical college. Why? Why this nonsense? If you want to learn medical science—you have no medical science, college-come here. This is our proposal. Why you are envious? That means rascal. "Our gold." Gold is "our gold," everyone's gold? "Our gold." What do you mean, "our gold"? Gold is always gold, either in your hand or in my hand. In your hand it is not Christian gold and in my hand it is not Hindu gold. Gold is gold.
- nāmnām akāri bahudhā nija sarva śaktis
- tatrārpitā niyamitaḥ smaraṇe na kālaḥ
- etādṛśī tava kṛpā bhagavān mamāpi
- durdaivam īdṛśam ihājani nānurāgaḥ
In the Bible there is no specific name of God. Eh?
Brahmānanda: Well, they say, "Jehovah" and "Yaweḥ."
Prabhupāda: Not fixed up. The Māyāvāda... If you have no fixed name of God, then why don't you chant Kṛṣṇa? What is the harm? But envious. Therefore paramo nirmatśaraṇaṁ (SB 1.1.2). One who has completely eradicated from the envious conception of life, they can take to this way. (Break) ...climate of this island is good.
Cyavana: It's pleasant.
Prabhupāda: (Break) ...right time. I don't think he had many followers.
Cyavana: Very few.
Prabhupāda: Only twelve, and out of them some proved infidel.
Cyavana: Yes.
Brahmānanda: One betrayed him.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Cyavana: Peter?
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Judah.
Prabhupāda: And after resurrection he had to go away to India.
Cyavana: Yes. That's 'cause they tried to kill him.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Because if he had declared that "I am not dead," perhaps he would have been again crucified.
Cyavana: Yes. They would keep trying to kill him.
Prabhupāda: Because the people were so intelligent, they would not believe him, so out of fear he went away. "All right, stop my preaching. Come on. (laughs) Let me go to find some safe place." (laughter)
Cyavana: He created a great impression on the minds of men for many, many generations.
Prabhupāda: Imperson?
Cyavana: Impression.
Prabhupāda: What is that? Impression.
Cyavana: Yes. By his preaching he left a strong impression.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Cyavana: Christianity.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: It's like the flowery words of the Vedas, flowery words of the Vedas, mostly simply dealing with moral principles.
Prabhupāda: That also broken. He said, "Thou shall not kill." They broke it.
Cyavana: Yes, they broke every...
Prabhupāda: Everything.