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Shock (Conversations)

Conversations and Morning Walks

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

It is more shocking than killing?
Room Conversation with Mister Popworth and E. F. Schumacher -- July 26, 1973, London:

Popworth: What is at issue is that in your beliefs you are saying it is wrong to kill an animal. It is possible, I don't say this to justify the killing of animals. But it is possible for an animal to be killed by a man in a way that involves far less suffering to the animal than it would die in its natural state. But what seems to be such an infinitely greater evil, an infinitely greater crime against the natural order is, for example, to take one chicken and put it in a cage the size of a shoe box, and then add more two more chickens to it, and then keep them there for the whole of their short natural life, unnatural life. But it seems to me, and, I think, to Dr. Schumacher, that this is an abomination of the spirit far greater than the mere killing of animals. But if it... It seems to be an insult against creation to treat the animal life in this manner. And yet, you do not appear to be shocked by it as you are shocked by the mere fact of killing.

Prabhupāda: It is more shocking than killing?

Popworth: Far more.

Vicitravīrya: What happens is they have large factories where they have thousands and thousands and thousands of chickens in a very tight space, and they breed them for slaughter.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Popworth: And young cows, calves are kept in a dark shed, deliberately kept in a dark shed and fed on an unnatural diet. They are not allowed to move, they are just kept in a space the size of their body. And for eight weeks, three months, they are fed on unnatural food, milk powder or something, devoid of certain necessary vitamins, to make the flesh whiter so that it gets a market. But that unfortunate beast, instead of walking in the fields under the open sky, he's shut him down.

Prabhupāda: All right, if you are so compassionate, you can kill those animals. But why you are maintaining slaughterhouse, killing nice animals.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Jesus was shocked. Yes. That the Jews were sacrificing animals in the temple.
Morning Walk -- February 23, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: This is also very good, good in this sense that they do not eat without restriction. There is some restriction.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: To sacrifice.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That if you want to eat meat and chicken, then you first of all sacrifice before that deity. So at least they'll be restricted from eating meat purchased from slaughterhouse. But this rascal civilization, one side they're advertising "Stop cruelty to animals," another side they're opening unrestricted slaughterhouse. Just see. One side they're allowing marriage of woman every week, another side contraceptive. Just see their contradiction. Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...there is animal sacrifice in the church. Is there any such pre...?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Jews, they have got.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. That was one of the things that Jesus was against.

Prabhupāda: Shocked. Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That the Jews were sacrificing animals in the temple.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Just like a man is suffering from tuberculosis, and if his physician says that "You are attacked with tuberculosis," then he'll shocked. But the fact is there.
Morning Walk -- February 26, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Hm. He has mentioned, "From the Vedic standard, we are all uncivilized. We Westerners are uncivilized." He has admitted that. Actually they are.

Dayānanda: Yes, they will be shocked when they find this out because the idea is that...

Prabhupāda: Now, just like a man is suffering from tuberculosis, and if his physician says that "You are attacked with tuberculosis," then he'll shocked. But the fact is there.

One boy, Rancor, his father and mother divorced and he was young child. And the mother, he said, would daily bring a new friend. Daily night. And he was shocked.
Room Conversation -- June 18, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Wine and sex. They see from childhood. One boy, Rancor, so his father and mother divorced and he was young child. He was the first child of his mother. And the mother, he said, would daily bring a new friend. So he could understand.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: A new woman.

Prabhupāda: Not new woman, his mother, he was under the care of mother.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Oh, mother had new husbands, new boyfriends.

Prabhupāda: Daily night. And he was shocked. One of my Gauḍīya Maṭha Godbrothers, big, he became the head of this Bhag Bazaar Gauḍīya Maṭha. So his wife was debauched, and she was bringing new paramour, and the child protested.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: New?

Prabhupāda: Paramour. And the boy, he was ten years or twelve years old, he could understand: "Who is this man?" So he protested and said, "I shall tell all these things to my father." And he was killed.

Naturally, he became shocked, that "This is my family life—the wife is prostitute and son is killed. What is the value of my life?"
Room Conversation -- June 18, 1976, Toronto:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: His son was killed, isn't it?

Prabhupāda: His wife was a regular prostitute, and she killed her child, and on this shock, he took poison and died.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: He killed himself, oh.

Prabhupāda: Naturally, he became shocked, that "This is my family life—the wife is prostitute and son is killed. What is the value of my life?" This was his spiritual realization. Just see. (laughs) And he was made the chief, and one of the supporter was Śrīdhara Mahārāja.

Perhaps it was some shock when I said that "What you have not done?"
Conversation in Airport and Car -- June 21, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: There was no preaching. There was no education on this subject. The Christian priests, they are unable to...

Kīrtanānanda: They have no knowledge themselves. How they can teach?

Hari-śauri: They are all giving up out of hopelessness themselves.

Prabhupāda: Yes. They are now asking... In Melbourne the priest asked me, "Swamiji, why Christian religion is dwindling? What we have done?" I told them, "What you have not done?" (laughs) They were little insulted.

Hari-śauri: That first time you visited that monastery, the man that was in charge, the head monk there, after you had visited, a short while later he left and he went to India looking for enlightenment.

Prabhupāda: Perhaps it was some shock when I said that "What you have not done?" They received me very well.

Therefore we have engaged these scientists. They are going to publish one paper.
Morning Walk -- July 10, 1976, New York:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It is such a challenge. Your statements are such a challenge to their so-called science that they're still in shock. I still think that they do not take us seriously yet because it's such a difference to what they are saying. Soon, gradually, they'll take...

Prabhupāda: Therefore we have engaged these scientists. They are going to publish one paper.

Shocked...Just like he is not well dressed, but anyone who will see, he'll immediately find he's cleansed. That is wanted. Cleansed dress.
Evening Darsana -- August 9, 1976, Tehran:

Nandarāṇī: He wants a separate place. Because it is difficult for all of us to do two things. It's very..., it's just very difficult. So having two places would mean we could have one run like a temple and one run like a home. If many devotees come here and wear old clothes and live... Devotees, sometimes they want to dress in old clothes, they want to be very strict, they want to be very austere, but when the businessmen come and they see a devotee with shaved head and old rags on, then they think...

Prabhupāda: Shocked...

Nandarāṇī: Yes. "What is this?" you know. So, but at the same time we don't want to always dress very nicely, we want to be devotees.

Prabhupāda: We must be clean.

Nandarāṇī: Clean, yes.

Prabhupāda: The dress is not important-cleanliness.

Hari-śauri: You can dress in karmī clothes and still be very strict Vaiṣṇava.

Nandarāṇī: Here we wear mostly street clothes, like the Iranians, suits and dresses.

Prabhupāda: Just like he is not well dressed, but anyone who will see, he'll immediately find he's cleansed. That is wanted. Cleansed dress. Dress is not important.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Their greatest shock that "Our people being taught 'No illicit sex, no meat-eating, no intoxication.' Then where is our civilization?" This is their greatest shock.
Morning Walk -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: Buddhists all eat, are meat-eaters the world over.

Prabhupāda: Not a question of Buddhist. That is Christian, Hindus, everyone. Rascals. Lord Buddha, he was nonviolent, and this Jawaharlal Nehru was observing Buddha-jayantī and at the same time sanctioning cow-killing. What is that? Cow-killing. "What is wrong in eating meat?" He has said that. (break) ...advertising our movement. Everyone's asking, "What is this Hare Kṛṣṇa?" That is the whole American people. Even if one did not know, he is "What is Hare Kṛṣṇa?" And our books are selling, "What is this Kṛṣṇa book?" So indirectly they're advertising. (break) Their greatest shock that "Our people being taught 'No illicit sex, no meat-eating, no intoxication.' Then where is our civilization?" This is their greatest shock. Any sane man can understand that this Hindu culture is being forcibly introduced.

First thing is that my students are advised, "No illicit sex, no meat-eating, no intoxication up to the point of smoking cigarette and drinking tea, and no gambling." But this is their life. How they can give up this? It is a shock.
Morning Darsana and Room Conversation Ramkrishna Bajaj and friends -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Guest (10): Opposition is natural. Because you are converting their churches into temples.

Prabhupāda: No, there are many... First thing is that my students are advised, "No illicit sex, no meat-eating, no intoxication up to the point of smoking cigarette and drinking tea, and no gambling." But this is their life. How they can give up this? That is... It is a shock. Therefore they say, "brainwashing," that "How a gentleman can give up all these things?" Many... No many. A few of my students, they left. They said that "Swamiji is denying the primary necessities of life." They left. They could not tolerate even. So I do not make any compromise. That you want to become my student you have to give up these things. So the responsible parents, they are appreciating that "My son is now purified." But some of them, there are...

Guest (2): They feel that you are kidnapping their children. (laughs)

It is Kṛṣṇa's grace.
Room Conversation -- January 22, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Gargamuni: No. I told him "Actually Prabhupāda, he has done more work than Vivekananda in helping to spread India's dharma all over the world." I had to very careful because there were many other people sitting around, including the manager, and I didn't want to start a fight. So I said, "Actually Prabhupāda has done greater work." He said (in shocked tone), "What have you said? You have said that your guru is greater than Vivekananda?" I said, "He has done more work." And he started, "No. You cannot say that." Then two other men who were sitting there stood up and said, "No! He has done more work. I was at the Olympic games, and I heard the whole thing was chanting in Montreal. Last year I was at the Olympic games, and I saw them all chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. He has done more work." Two men, they came. So I just sat there and let those two men argue.

Prabhupāda: It is Kṛṣṇa's grace.

So what improvement you have done, rascal?
Morning Walk -- January 24, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Now we have, hundred years after, we have learned how to kill ox and bulls. That is your advancement. And kill your own children also. Rascal civilization. They say "primitive." I was talking with a priest in Australia. So he said, "This civilization you are suggesting, this is primitive." Do they call it primitive?

Satsvarūpa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: And what is the wrong with the primitive?

Satsvarūpa: They think it's shocking that the way they used to live hundreds of years ago, they're still living. But in America...

Prabhupāda: So what improvement you have done, rascal?

Gandhi was actually very sexually inclined.
Evening Conversation -- January 25, 1977, Puri:

Satsvarūpa: Kennedy.

Prabhupāda: He was always associating with naked woman.

Satsvarūpa: Yes, it's been discovered.

Prabhupāda: Just see. And he is the President.

Satsvarūpa: Now Gargamuni says a new book has come out about Gandhi, telling things about Gandhi that are shocking.

Prabhupāda: Gandhi was actually very sexually inclined. In his autobiography he was written that when his father was dying, he was having sex with his wife. After finishing sex with his wife, then he came to see his dead father. He has admitted. And his association with his granddaughters, granddaughter-in-law, that is also this... A new book has come out?

Dangerous community. These scientists, the so-called, they are dangerous community.
Room Conversation -- January 26, 1977, Puri:

Prabhupāda: Yes. They say that "There is a brain. There is a tissue. There is cerebrum. On account of, they are thinking spiritually. Otherwise if it is cut off, there will be no more opportunity." They'll do that, brain operation. And whatever nonsense they will do, we'll accept.

Gurukṛpā: They have electric.

Satsvarūpa: Electric shock.

Prabhupāda: Dangerous community. These scientists, the so-called, they are dangerous community.

The most important point is: these boys who come to me, they forget forever their families or father, mother. No family. That is their great shock.
Room Conversation with Two Indian Guests -- January 27, 1977, Jagannatha Puri:

Prabhupāda: (Bengali) Theoretically, if our principles are adopted by the American people in general, as my disciples have done, then their whole industrial structure will be broken.

Guest (1): Not actually. Don't affect so much because all are not going to be... Even in India it is not.

Prabhupāda: This is one thing. This is one thing, that... No, they are taking seriously. And another thing is that if the public opinion becomes in favor of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then they will get vote and they'll capture government, because it is republic. That is another point, another. The most important point is: these boys who come to me, they forget forever their families or father, mother. No family. That is their great shock.

Because they're rascals. Modern people in India, they are all rascals. Whole population is bokā.
Morning Walk -- January 31, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Hari-śauri: The one thing that shocks the Indians the most is Vivekananda.

Prabhupāda: Because they're rascals. Modern people in India, they are all rascals. Whole population is bokā.

No, then the authorities are, mean, determined to stop this.
Evening Darsana -- February 15, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: That is brainwash.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. That is brainwashing. In fact, they may have given her shock treatments and drugs. They give very heavy drugs with the idea that they will make her forget about Kṛṣṇa, and now they will bring her to court to testify against the Society, that "They did this to me. The Society was making me do this and this, and now I'm much healthier."

Prabhupāda: No, then the authorities are, mean, determined to stop this.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yes. It's a dangerous position. This is actually is dangerous position, because they are very powerful. There are many lobbying people. In other words, there are big groups of Christian, Jewish groups. They are especially active because they see that these other movements, not only ours, are taking the young people away from their religions. So they are actively collecting money and giving it to the deprogrammers.

No, no. They were talking, barking. He was barking, and he was barking. One barking dog became fainted.
Morning Talk -- April 25, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So when Pakistan accused India, he became so shocked that he fainted?

Prabhupāda: No, no. They were talking, barking. He was barking, and he was barking. One barking dog became fainted. (laughs) That's all. Nobody could achieve anything.

They are simply making false propaganda to keep their prestige.
Discussions with Devotees and Conversation with Dr. Ghosh -- June 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Yaśodānandana: There was a discussion today that in some time, after this preaching to the scientists starts, if we get exposed, it will be a very, very big world news item, especially with jagat theory of the universe, to explain how all the planets are exactly together, how life comes from life. It will be a very shocking news to the whole scientific world. They have so many misconceptions which are simply due to ignorance.

Prabhupāda: They are simply making false propaganda to keep their prestige. Useless. Now here is a scientist. He'll confirm it. What do you think?

I do not wish to recall that. It was intolerable.
Room Conversation -- June 17, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Actually at that time we were massaging your heart. It was such a shock to you. And I remember, the only medicine you want... We were massaging your heart and reading Kṛṣṇa book. And you developed a very bad cough.

Prabhupāda: I do not wish to recall that. It was intolerable. Then these things were now brought to... Otherwise I did not like to come back. I would have stayed.

And then Kṛṣṇa, yes. (laughs) (Bengali) They are not shocked?
Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- June 21, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: And life never comes from physical and chemical condition, but it comes from life.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But...?

Prabhupāda: It comes from life.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: This is to be discussed.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: And that original life is Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: And then Kṛṣṇa, yes. (laughs) (Bengali) They are not shocked?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Well, they will be shocked. Actually science doesn't know anything about life. That's what I was pointing out today. Science studies only matter, like physics, chemistry, biology, just chemical reactions...

He was from very beginning. Brahmānanda. He has worked very hard from the beginning.
Room Conversation-Recent Mail -- July 14, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He says, "Arjuna was a great, powerful devotee, and he could overcome the shock. But we are most fallen and cannot endure such a shock of having you leave us. We are already mortified by such a thought. Your movement is just now being accepted, and we want you to remain to lead all your devotees towards successful spiritual life. Despite our offenses, all of us deeply have great love for Your Divine Grace, and our world will become dark without your presence. Materially you have provided all of your devotees with everything: big temples, money, prestige, and honor, nice prasādam." (chuckles) That's not material. "But I would relish more being with you without all of these things..." He says, "But personally I would relish more being with you without all of these things, as we began at 26 Second Avenue. Simply hearing you chant and talk for hours is my only solace. I don't want anything else. We left all these material things to be with you only, so please have mercy with your devotees by allowing us to have your personal appearance as long as..."

Prabhupāda: He was from very beginning. Brahmānanda. He has worked very hard from the beginning.

You said this Trivedi is worse than him?
Room Conversation -- October 20, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They were planning, in my... I talked with Girirāja about this. They were thinking "Here is an old sannyāsī, Prabhupāda. He has many foreign disciples, he has money. Let us get the money in fixed deposit. Then if he should pass away, then somehow by trick the money will be kept here and we'll never let them take it out." That was their plan. Therefore whenever Prabhupāda suggested that Gurukṛpā would sign, co-sign, "No, no," they would never allow. Their plan is that Prabhupāda would pass away, and all the foreigners would be there, and they'd never let them take it. When I showed them this power of attorney, they had a great shock. They were shocked how this had happened to them. I think this was their plan. Very deceiving type of people. Because they are here in Vṛndāvana. All their money is from fixed deposits from āśramas. So they know how to do this business of keeping the money. Now everything is clear. The money is there in Delhi. The Delhi office is not like that. They're businesslike. And we can keep dealing them, but on regular accounts. None of these fixed deposits. Not now. They "Now you must gain their confidence again." We told them, "We have nothing against you. But you deal properly, then again we'll deposit. But deal properly in a businesslike way." We have nothing against them. Punjab Bank is a good bank. Anyway, it's settled now, Śrīla Prabhupāda. It's finished. I wanted you to know that it's been successfully completed due to Girirāja's good efforts. Girirāja went to Bombay. His parents went with him.

Prabhupāda: You said this Trivedi is worse than him?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

So what is to be done now?
Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, it seems like it was Kṛṣṇa's desire that we didn't go. I was pretty shocked when I saw that the cars only arrived by four o'clock in the morning. There was no way that we would have been able to go on time.

Prabhupāda: So what is to be done now?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What is to be done now? Well, we're going to stay here for ten days or so, and you'll get better.

What other news?
Room Conversation -- November 3, 1977, Vrndavana:

Śatadhanya: Even the airport officials were disappointed. They were saying, "Where is our Guru Mahārāja?" I was shocked to hear them saying. "Where is our Guru Mahārāja?" They had purchased very nice fruits and vegetables of all different varieties, and Prabhupāda could choose which he liked-portal, jinga, so many things.

Prabhupāda: What other news?

Page Title:Shock (Conversations)
Compiler:Archana, Labangalatika, Sureshwardas, Visnu Murti
Created:20 of Dec, 2008
Totals by Section:BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=25, Let=0
No. of Quotes:25