Mistake (Conv. 1967 - 1975)

Expressions researched:
"mistake" |"mistaker" |"mistakes" |"mistaking"

Notes from the compiler: VedaBase query: mistake or mistaker or mistakes or mistaking not commit*

1967 Conversations and Morning Walks

Discourse on Lord Caitanya Play Between Srila Prabhupada and Hayagriva -- April 5-6, 1967, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: That scene you have to describe very nicely. Mother seeing that her son has taken sannyāsa, no more He'll come to house. So (s)he was crying. And Caitanya Mahāprabhu fell on his(her) feet and begged, "My dear mother, yes. This body belongs to you. This body should have been engaged for your service. Unfortunately I've done a mistake. I have already taken sannyāsa. Please excuse Me." In this way. That scene described in the Dilip Kumar's house, that Caitanya is consulting mother, that is a false scene. The actual scene is that after accepting His sannyāsa, His mother came to see Him at Advaita's house.

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Interview -- March 9, 1968, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: A community is suspicious of another community. So how can you have peace and prosperity? Suspiciousness means animal, animalistic. A dog is suspicious of another dog. As soon as it finds another dog, immediately begins to bark." Row! Row! Row!" So is that human civilization? So what is the mistake of the human civilization? The mistake of the human civilization is that they have forgotten the relationship with God. So here is the scientific statement of our relationship with God. And then, according to that relationship, exactly in the same way, just like understanding your relationship, your citizenship in a state you can act nicely, similarly if we know our relationship with God, we can act very nicely and that is peaceful life. And besides that, this life, the present life is not all. We have got life after death. That is a fact. Just like we are continuously in life, in this present life, you were a child, I was a child. Everyone of us were a child. That was a life. Then we became boy, then we became youth.

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- May 10, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Prabhupāda: Well, when one is a professional, there may be something wrong. That doesn't matter. But you try to discharge your duties, rightly, whatever you are prescribed to do. Then everything will come to the right point. Your only business is to follow the four principles of regulative life and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa sixteen rounds. So there may be sometimes mistake. That will be corrected automatically. Because we are coming from a different platform, so it may be. And that is also said in the Bha... Api cet su-durācāro bhajate mām ananya-bhāk, sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ: (BG 9.30) "If one is found doing mistake or doing something wrong, but because he is sticking to this principle of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, he is sādhu." Sādhu means a holy man. He is holy. He is not doing any wrong consciously. But due to habit... Suppose just like most of you were, in your former life, you were smoking or taking intoxication. But by some influence, if you sometimes take to it, yes, if you are conscious, "Oh, I have done wrong," but that is excused if you have done unconscious. But if you think that "Now I am Kṛṣṇa conscious. Whatever I do, it is right," then it is great sin. But accidentally it happens—that is excused. Never mind. So accidental mistake is not dangerous. Willful mistake is dangerous. That we should be careful. We should be very careful always so that accidental mistakes also may not take place. But if it takes place, it is excused.

Room Conversation with Allen Ginsberg -- May 14, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Prabhupāda: Then the analogy and metaphor should be like that. Nothing should be twice repeated. So there is Sāhitya-ratna in Sanskrit, Sāhitya-ratna. Caitanya Mahāprabhu defeated one great scholar simply by little mistake. Yes. Keśava Kāśmīrī. Keśava Kāśmīrī was great scholar, and Sanskrit great scholar means he must fluently speak in Sanskrit verses everything.

Allen Ginsberg: Everything he says must be done in perfect Sanskrit verses?

Prabhupāda: Oh, that is... Yes. That is Sanskrit scholar. Not in prose. He'll go on composing verses. So Caitanya Mahāprabhu at that time was sixteen years old boy, but He was very learned logician. So the Keśava Kāśmīrī, he was traveling all over India by, I mean to say, competing other paṇḍitas, other learned scholars. So he, everywhere he was victorious. So he came to Navadvīpa. And in those days Navadvīpa and Benares and Udipi and Kashmir, four, five places, were very scholarly.

Room Conversation With John Lennon, Yoko Ono, and George Harrison -- September 11, 1969, London, At Tittenhurst:

Prabhupāda: So therefore attraction for any flower is not the solution of the question. That is also stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, ye yathā māṁ prapadyante tāṁs tathaiva bhajāmy aham (BG 4.11). Kṛṣṇa is Supreme Absolute. Anyone wants Him in any way, He also presents Himself in that way. Just like the same example. If you want a yellow flower, never mind whether there is any scent or any flavor or not, so that flower is there. It is for you. That's all. But if anyone wants rose flower, Kṛṣṇa gives him rose flower. But when you make a comparative study which one is better, then rose will be considered better. (chuckling) So ye yathā māṁ prapadyante. That means the Absolute is realized... Of course, varieties there are, but the original division of the Absolute is three: Brahman, Paramātmā, and Bhagavān. Now, Brahman, Paramātmā, and Bhagavān is the same Absolute. Different names. The jñānis, or the empiric philosophers, they reach or they aim at Brahman, impersonal Brahman. The yogis, they, I mean to say, focus on the Supersoul, Paramātmā. And the devotees, they aim at Kṛṣṇa, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Now, this Kṛṣṇa and the Supersoul and the impersonal Brahman, they are not different. They are light. They are not darkness. But in the light also, there is difference The example is given: just like sunlight, sun globe and the sun-god. Everywhere you find light. In the sunshine there is light. In sun globe there is light. And what to speak of the predominating deity in the sun-globe? He also must be light; otherwise wherefrom this light comes? So so far light is concerned, everywhere there. But you cannot say because sunshine has come through your window in your room, you cannot say the sun has come. That will be mistake. Sun is many, many miles away. But so far light is concerned, now there is question of degrees of light, intensity of light. So the degrees of spiritual realization in Brahman, degrees of spiritual realization in Paramātmā, and degrees of spiritual realization in the Supreme Personality of Godhead, they are different.

Discussion with BTG Staff -- December 24, 1969, Boston:

Prabhupāda: This Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is composed of four different stages. The first stage is to understand the relationship with Godhead, or Kṛṣṇa. Because the conditioned souls at the present moment, they have forgotten self. They have forgotten their relationship with Kṛṣṇa. Actually the relationship is there, eternal, but under the influence of māyā he is thinking that "I am something of this material world," identifying himself with this body. So we have to awake them from that illusory existence, what he is not. The whole mistake of the modern status of life... I don't say modern civilization. This is coming up since the creation of this material world. Sometimes it is in greater degree and sometimes in lesser degree. In Satya-yuga the same condition, but in lesser degree. But in Kali-yuga the condition is in greater degree. So the first business is to awake the conditioned souls from their illusory position, that he is thinking, "I am this body and anything in relationship with this body is very important." Janasya moho 'yam ahaṁ mameti (SB 5.5.8). This is illusion. We speak of illusion, māyā. This is illusion, that "I am this body and anything in relation of this body..." I have got special relationship with certain woman, so I think, "She is my wife. I cannot do without her." Or another woman from whom I have taken birth, "She is my mother." Similarly father, similarly sons. In this way, country, society, at the most, humanity. That's all. But all these things are illusion because they are in bodily relationship. Yasyātmā-buddhiḥ kunape tri-dhātuke sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13).

1970 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- November 7, 1970, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: They are attracted to Kṛṣṇa. These people, they are... (Hindi) But you are taking Kṛṣṇa as Hindu. That is your mistake. Kṛṣṇa is... Hindu ne. He is God. He is God. God Hindu ne, Mussulman ne, Christian ne, Parsi ne—God is God. (Hindi) And I am also not interested to preach Hindu dharma. (Hindi) ...Kṛṣṇa dharma. Kṛṣṇa consciousness, that is the only dharma. (Hindi) ...Kṛṣṇa literature. It is not a Hindu dharma literature. (Hindi)

So they are not interested in many gods, Durga, Kali, or Śiva, or... (Hindi) Strictly, if you take the version of Bhagavad-gītā, why Bhagavān says that "You give up all religion. Simply you take to the shelter of My feet?" That means to take shelter of Kṛṣṇa's lotus feet is the only religion. (Hindi) Practically that was against Hindu conception. (Hindi) We are not talking of God, (Hindi) we are talking of love. Why you misunderstand? Don't misunderstand the philosophy. We are teaching love of Godhead. It is not we are teaching that you become afraid of God. (break) (Hindi) Bahut easy process hai. You come, sing, dance, and take prasādam. Is there any difficulty? If people come to us, in melodious songs they sing and they dance and when they are tired they take sumptuously prasādam, so what can be the more convenient way? (Hindi) You are a qualified lawyer, but you cannot do for want of money. (Hindi) He has no right because he does not know what is name. Nāma-cintāmaṇi-kṛṣṇaś caitanya-rasa-vigrahaḥ. (Hindi) Yes. Because you are responsible, if you cut throat of a goat, then you'll be responsible. Just like in your jurist(?) law, if you commit murder—you are lawyer—you have to be hanged. So, (Hindi) "...life for life." So I am killing one life. I shall not be liable to repay by my life.

Room Conversation -- December 12, 1970, Indore:

Prabhupāda: Self-preservation. So self-preservation... They do not know what is self-preservation. That is another ignorance. They consider this body as the self. Their self-preservation means to keep this body. And that is also not possible. If you do not follow regulative principles, it is not possible to keep your body in good condition. That is also not possible. Those who do not follow the regulative principles, mostly they are diseased, some kind. We find in the medical, modern medical shop the customers are educated people. Mass of people, they are not customers in the medical shop. You'll find it. They are not so much diseased. In every gentleman's house, modern, you'll find so many bottles of medicine. But you won't find such medical bottles in any house of less educated persons. They are not so diseased. So this is one of the items. If you want to advance in spiritual life you must follow the regulative principles to rectify your mistakes in the past life and this present life. Without being freed from all contamination nobody can understand God. That is not possible. Bhagavad-gītā says, yeṣāṁ anta gataṁ pāpaṁ: "One who has become completely freed from all kinds of sinful reaction," yeṣāṁ tv anta-gataṁ pāpaṁ janānāṁ puṇya-karmaṇām, "Persons who are engaged in pious activities only," te, "such person," te dvandva-moha-nirmuktā... (BG 7.28).

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Discussion with Indians -- January 18, 1971, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: You be satisfied with yourself. You are liberated.

Guest (5): That means those who are to follow you are not liberated.

Prabhupāda: I am not follow... Er, I don't say, "Follow me." I say, "Follow Kṛṣṇa." Why...? Don't mistake that. I say... My vision is that Kṛṣṇa says, "Surrender unto Me." I say, "You and everyone, surrender to Kṛṣṇa."

Guest (5): That you make wherever you are spreading, not...

Prabhupāda: Well, that is my business. Where I am spreading or not, that is my business. But I am saying this, that Kṛṣṇa says you surrender unto Kṛṣṇa, "Surrender unto Me." I say, "Surrender unto Kṛṣṇa." Is there any difference?

Guest (2): (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Is it not according to Gītā? Is it not according to Gītā? If I say, "Surrender unto Kṛṣṇa"...

Guest (5): ...if each and every person has an individual identity of (indistinct) soul above the body consciousness and unless you treat him as equal, there is little...

Prabhupāda: No, nobody... You cannot say... Even though they are equal, you can see equal but they are not equal. They are not equal. There are three guṇas, and in the Bhagavad-gītā that is analyzed, that "These persons are in the sattva-guṇa, these persons are in the rajo-guṇa, these persons are in..."

Guest (5): That is not personality of the ātmā, but the ātmā is everybody's soul.

Discussion with Indians -- January 18, 1971, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: No, here... Yes, that is sama-darśinaḥ because here it is said clearly, vidyā-vinaya-sampanne brāhmaṇa (BG 5.18). A brāhmaṇa, learned brāhmaṇa, and vinaya, very humble... That is the sign of goodness. Vidyā-vinaya-sampanne gavi hastini śunica. Śunica means dog. Now he is seeing a dog and a learned brāhmaṇa-same. Now, dog is supposed to be sinful, and this learned brāhmaṇa is supposed to be virtuous. Therefore his vision, the virtuous and the sinful, the same. That is sama-darśi.

Guest (1): I think that they have made a many mistakes in writing of the ślokas.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. Now you are finding mistake with Vyāsa, so who can talk with you?

Guest (2): No, but, but...

Prabhupāda: Please excuse me. Please go out. Please go out. Don't trouble. You are finding faults with Vyāsa.

Guest (4): We only want you to be understood here.

Prabhupāda: (shouting) I am not sama-darśi! I don't say I'm sama-darśi! I don't say, sama-darśi. So you say sama-darśi. Sama-darśi.

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1971, Gorakhpur:

Prabhupāda: That by, through Kṛṣṇa's representative. He should certify, "Yes. Your duty is nicely peformed."

Guest: How he may perfectly judge it? How the person will judge himself that I am doing...?

Prabhupāda: No. He'll not judge. His spiritual master will judge. Kṛṣṇa's representative. He'll not judge. He will make mistake. Therefore, if one has accepted a bona fide spiritual master, that means he is in direct touch with Kṛṣṇa. Transparent media. He has to see Kṛṣṇa through the transparent medium of spiritual master. Therefore it is imperative, one has to accept a... Tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta jijñāsuḥ śreyaḥ uttamam (SB 11.3.21). And what kind of guru? Śabde pare ca niṣṇataṁ brahmaṇy upāśamāśrayam. So this is a big science. One has to study. One has to understand. The things are there. There is no difficulty.

Guest: Just you have told about liberation, and in Adhyāya Two Kṛṣṇa has told that jīrṇāni vaśtrāni vihāya...

Prabhupāda: Aparāṇi. Navāṇī vaśtrāni aparāṇi, gṛhṇāty aparāṇi.

Room Conversation -- July 18, 1971, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: We require help from personalities like you, because it is very important movement, checking a great mistake in the modern world. Modern civilization is very risky. Risky in this sense: that the human form of life is an opportunity for self-realization, but our leaders, they are miseducating that "You are this body." A basic mistake. But I am not this body, but just like you are sitting there, if I take account of your shirt and coat only, not you as a person, then there is a great mistake. Similarly, the modern civilization, education, everything is based on this bodily concept of life. But actually we are not body. Body is my shirt and coat. Mind, intelligence and ego, that is the shirt, finer dress. And this five element body—earth, water, fire, air, ether—this is gross. Just like shirt and coat. Similarly, we are dressed, the spirit soul. The spirit soul is also a measure one ten-thousandth part of the tip of the hair. So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is very important in this sense, that they are trying to bring people to the constitutional position. A living entity is transmigrating from one body to another, as well in our present body also, we are transmigrating. In my childhood I had a small body. That body is no longer existing, but I am existing. So there is no reason to believe that when I give up this body, I'll not exist. No. I shall exist, but in another body. So people are not interested to make the research work how the soul is working. This is ignorance. The Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is trying to revive the pure consciousness of the human society so that he can know himself and act accordingly. Then his life is successful.

Room Conversation -- July 20, 1971, New York:

Pratyatoṣa: And for $185 a month, we could have forty hours a week of computer time, eight hours a day. And they have courses, this company gives computerized courses that'll teach children how to read and how to do arithmetic through the terminal. And also, it has a fantastic editor. If you type in the text, and any mistakes you make, you can just type in a few instructions with a computer and it'll change them. Then after you get all the text the way you want it, it's stored on a magnetic disk at the computer. And then when you get it perfect—you can change it a hundred times if you want—but when you get it perfect, then you just have the computer automatically type out the whole thing.

Prabhupāda: You know how to do that?

Devotee (4): Yes, Prabhupāda, I got A's in that.

Room Conversation -- August 21, 1971, London:

Prabhupāda: Now, the important subject, he may do slowly, but...

Haṁsadūta: Like Bhagavad-gītā or Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Others may be done by others. You print it. Even there is some mistake, that doesn't matter.

Haṁsadūta: Yes. And another thing I wanted to ask Your Divine Grace is this. This Bhagavad-gītā, I would like to print it as it becomes finished chapter by chapter. Otherwise it will be a long time before we have a book.

Prabhupāda: No, no, you can publish, chapter by chapter.

Haṁsadūta: This is all right?

Prabhupāda: Oh yes.

Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London:

Prabhupāda: No. Sometimes it is done deliberately. Sometimes it is done deliberately because everyone in this material world is imperfect. Therefore there is tendency of cheating. That is one of the qualifications of the conditioned soul. He becomes mistaken. He becomes illusioned. He cheats and his senses are imperfect.

Dr. Weir: Well, I'm sorry I think you're using the word cheat in a much broader sense. We would use cheat as conscious mistake as opposed to a person who doesn't realize that what he says doesn't happen to be true.

Prabhupāda: No, no, conscious... Suppose you think it is right but it is wrong. That is also cheating. Without knowing the thing perfectly well, if you deliver your knowledge to somebody that's cheating.

Dr. Weir: Well, I think that's being a bit hard when a person is not... If he's tried his best to do something and he doesn't intend to mislead, to call that cheating is a bit hard.

Prabhupāda: No, even if not intend, but if you misguide some way or other without sufficient knowledge, that is also cheating.

Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London:

Mensa Member: Coming back to your previous point, if he made a mistake and it's the wrong medicine, would you say he cheated you? Isn't that the point you were getting at?

Dr. Weir: This is what worried me.

Śyāmasundara: Yes, because if he purports to be a physician...

Mensa Member: I think he is a physician, and he makes a mistake, a healthy, genuine mistake.

Prabhupāda: Therefore we say, we have to receive knowledge from a person who does not commit any mistakes. That is our proposition.

Dr. Weir: Well, that would be going like God if you define it that way, you're (indistinct).

Mensa Member: That does seem a bit...

Prabhupāda: Therefore I said...

Śyāmasundara: This can be proven. This can be tested, if someone's cheating or not cheating can be tested on a factual basis. Similarly, this science can be tested...

Prabhupāda: Observation and experiment.

Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London:

Dr. Weir: But then some people have to have a concrete example or they haven't any (indistinct) It's when you analyze the analogy that you can see it's difficult...

Prabhupāda: No, analogy, of course, is not always the perfect method. Analogy means the greatest number of similar points. That is analogy. Perfection of analogy is there when there is the greatest number of similar points. But we give sometimes the analogy as we understand it, but so far this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, there is no need of analogy. It is accepted as truth and Kṛṣṇa is accepted as the Supreme Personality of Godhead and whatever He says is truth. There is no mistake and if we carry that message there is no mistake.

Dr. Weir: In other words, Kṛṣṇa is the voice of your God then.

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is God, (indistinct). That is accepted. We accept Kṛṣṇa, īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ (Bs. 5.1). Īśvara. Īśvara means the controller. Just like here there are controllers. But here any controller is controlled by another controller. But param īśvara, God means Who has no other controller. He's the supreme controller. That is described in the Brahma-saṁhitā: īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ (Bs. 5.1). He's the supreme controller. Here any controller, he's controlling, just like this physician. He has learned his medical science from another physician, another physician, another physician. So we are not the supreme physician or supreme controller.

Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London:

Dr. Weir: That's what interests me. One has this hierarchical or superior attitude even in the statement you've just made, that things, you know, about (indistinct) which is what I feel is easier.

Prabhupāda: Because we take from God there is no mistake. There's no mistake. Otherwise He cannot be God.

Dr. Weir: I mean this is just unnecessary. It is just tautological. This is in your definition of God. You don't have to go any farther.

Prabhupāda: But God means He's above mistake,

Dr. Weir: Yes.

Prabhupāda: ...above the illusion, above cheating, above imperfection. This is God.

Room Conversation with Mayor -- November 10, 1971, New Delhi:

Devotee (2): Some tapes.

Prabhupāda: Oh, that's nice. Yes. Whenever somebody comes from there, something must be brought, because these things are not available. (break) ...Indian, you cannot excel in mechanical knowledge the Europeans, American. That is not possible. We will always remain hundred years back. Everyone has got some special talent given by God. We should cooperate. That's it. The hand can work in this way. We cannot walk with hands. That is the business of the hand. Similarly, I cannot cut the papers with leg. So all living entities are endowed with special... We should cooperate. The hand and leg should cooperate for maintaining the whole body. Similarly, everyone should use his talent for satisfaction of Kṛṣṇa. That is perfection. Not compete with one another. That is mistake.

Devotee (2): (unwrapping package) It's not the microphone.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Devotee (2): I don't think it's the microphone. (break)

Prabhupāda: They never reply.

Interview with Reporters -- November 10, 1971, New Delhi:

Reporter: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: No, no. These four castes... Not caste. We say caste, but varṇāśrama varṇa. Varṇa. Anyway, it is division. That division, vibhāga, the exact word is "division," not "caste." How you can say caste, it is not there, difference? Division, these four divisions are there. So these divisions are not made by birth. Just like if you are a lawyer. So in the society there are lawyers, engineers, medical men, they are divisions. But these lawyers, medical men or engineers, they are not born as engineer or as lawyer. That is mistake. Anyone who is qualified by the real knowledge, he is a lawyer. Not by birth. Suppose a lawyer's son, a big, big lawyer's son, does it mean that he's lawyer?

Reporter: No. But this is what we have been (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: So you have been something mistake. That should not be accepted.

Reporter: Well, sir, you should know the problem all that there is a...

Prabhupāda: What is that problem?

Reporter: All the (indistinct), harijanas will (indistinct) you.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Reporter: If you proclaim that this is the real Hinduism, the people are getting fed up with Hinduism.

Prabhupāda: No. No Hindu. Why you are bringing Hinduism?

Reporter: Our, this system...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with John Griesser (later initiated as Yadubara Dasa) -- March 10, 1972, Vrndavana:

Yadubara: Many other societies make compromises. Many other religious groups make compromises in their doctrine.

Prabhupāda: Yes, because they have no clear idea. They cannot push forward their concept. Just like the other day (indistinct) lady, she asked if Kṛṣṇa was a naughty boy. Yes, because He is God He must be naughty boy. Otherwise, wherefrom this idea of naughty boy comes if that quality is not in God? God is the origin of everything, creator of everything. So if He hasn't got this naughtiness in His person, then how this thing comes to be? That is the Vedānta version, janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1). The Supreme Absolute Truth is that from which or from whom everything emanates. So wherefrom this naughtiness comes if it is not in the person of God? Wherefrom this stealing propensity comes if it is not in God? But because He is absolute, His stealing is also as good as his blessing. Mākhan-cora. Kṛṣṇa is stealing butter, that is worshiped, mākhana, by the very name. Just like in another temple, Kṣīra-cora-gopīnātha. Gopīnātha is known as condensed milk thief, Kṣīra-cora. He is famous by the name cora, thief. But that cora and this cora, you cannot compare. He is famous as cora, or thief, but thousands of people go every day to worship that cora, that thief. And in the material, if one is known as thief, then thousands of people will beat him with shoes. (laughter) That is the difference. If you say, "Oh, Kṛṣṇa was a thief, then I can become a thief," then your will be beating of shoes on your head, and Kṛṣṇa will be eternally worshiped because He is thief. That is the difference. That is Absolute. He will be worshiped as thief, and He will be worshiped as very honest. That is Absolute. (aside:) No, no, this (indistinct) is not good. I will take little fruit.

Kṛṣṇa is a woman-hunter. That is the highest pastimes of Kṛṣṇa, rāsa-līlā. But here if a man becomes woman-hunter, he will be most abominable person. That is the mistake of the people: they consider Kṛṣṇa as ordinary man. Avajānanti māṁ mūḍhā (BG 9.11). They are rascals, fools, mānuṣīṁ tanum āśritam. This sense has to be learned-Kṛṣṇa, how He is Absolute in all circumstance. Kṛṣṇa is teaching, "Just go and tell little lie to Droṇācārya." People will be surprised, how God is teaching somebody that "You go and tell this lie"? So they become bewildered. So one has to understand actually what is Kṛṣṇa's position in all circumstances. That requires intelligence.

Room Conversation with Maharishi Impersonalists -- April 7, 1972, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Because it is the thing required. Therefore it is recommended in the śāstra. Because it is recommended that... What is recommended in the śāstra, spoken in the śāstra, that is perfect. There is no mistake. Therefore it is being accepted. Anywhere we are going, beginning from old man to child, everyone chants Hare Kṛṣṇa. Therefore it is recommended. Our intelligence should be applied there, that what is recommended in the Vedas, that is perfect. There are so many instances. Just like cow dung. You know cow dung? Stool of the cow? So according to Vedic principle, if you touch stool of an animal you become impure. Even my stool, I pass in the WC, and immediately I wash and become purified. Oh, this is my stool, personal, and what to speak of other stool? So stool is impure. But the Vedas say that the stool of cow is pure. So if you argue that "Cow is an animal. So animal stool is impure. How the cow stool can become pure?" that is puzzling, but because it is said by the..., ordered by the Vedas, it is fact. You analyze cow stool; you find all antiseptic matter. So therefore we accept the Vedic injunction as truth. We haven't got to make research. We save time.

Room Conversation with Maharishi Impersonalists -- April 7, 1972, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: According to Vedic system, marriage is a long program. The father of the girl and the boy first of all select. Then their horoscope should be consulted, how they will mix together, and then the family, then personal qualification, so many things... Then dowry... After all this consideration, when everything is satisfactory, then the father and mother of both sides will agree, and they will be married. That is marriage. Now, at the present moment in Kali-yuga, it is said, svīkāram eva hy udvahe. Boys and girls will loiter in the street and two of them, as they agree, "Yes, we will live together." That's all. Bas. This is stated. And that is happening. So this is called śāstra. Five thousand years ago, what was predicted, that is now happening. Therefore we give so much stress on the śāstra that it is perfect. There is no mistake. If you write one book, I write one book, because we are imperfect, it is all imperfect.

Room Conversation -- June 14, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That may be, but you may be cheated, that is another thing. Suppose you ask something from somebody. If he cheats you, that may be your mistake or his, but the process is the same; you cannot avoid it. If you want to know God, then you have to go to a person who knows God. You might have gone to a person who does not know. That is another thing. You went to a wrong person. But actually if you want to know God, you must have to go to a person who knows God. That you have to search out. That requires intelligence. But you cannot give up the idea. Because you have been cheated, "I could not get information"; therefore, you cannot give up that business. You have to find out somebody else. But because you say "I have been cheated. I could not get the right information. I stop this business," that is not allowed. You must. Therefore, according to Vedic order it is said, tad vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). Abhigacchet means you must to a person to understand that science of God. You must go to a guru or a man who knows. Guru means who is more intelligent. Guru means weight, heavy, heavier, heavier in knowledge. So you have to find out a person who is heavier than you, not ordinary. Must go.

Morning Walk Conversation -- September 28, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That also they do not understand properly, because they do not see the spiritual energy. Just like we know that within this body there is a small bit of spiritual energy, spark, which is ten thousand part of the tip of the hair. How small it is. But due to its presence within the body, the body is working so nicely. We know that, that how a small particle of spiritual energy can work so wonderfully. They do not know it.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So nowadays the scientists are also thinking that there have been so many mistakes, so...

Prabhupāda: They will find out.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So they say that this atomic energy, this bombing, was a tremendous mistake on the part of the... They say this mostly responsible by politicians, not on the part of scientists, the scientists say. But on the other hand, the public say, people say, the scientists are responsible because they discovered the...

Prabhupāda: Yes, they are responsible. If you give a sharpened razor in the hands of a child, the child will cut here and there. So who is responsible: the parent or the child?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Parent.

Prabhupāda: So the rascal scientist is responsible for giving such things in the hands of the rascals. Politicians are the most rascal; the most scoundrel, they go to politics. Politician means a tenth-class man. No first-class man goes to politics. Suppose if somebody says to me that "You come and become president." Why shall I go there? What can I do there? I know I shall not be able to do anything, so why shall I take the post?

Jayatīrtha: They just like to lord it over.

Morning Walk Conversation -- September 28, 1972, Los Angeles:

Jayatīrtha: They're so corrupt.

Prabhupāda: So corrupt. (indistinct) Even one wants to do... just like President Kennedy, he wanted to do something good—he was shot down. Gandhi wanted to do something—he was shot down. So the politics is so corrupted that as soon as you are prepared to do something actually, you will be killed.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So seeing that mistake also, now the scientists, they are proposing that they should make a governing body, not the politicians, so when they discover something the result can be completely controlled by this group of...

Prabhupāda: That is another foolishness. That is another foolishness. They will be bribed and they will vote. They will get money, that's all.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Another thing that is coming up is genetic engineering, which they are afraid about, just like they say remember like atomic bomb incident. The politicians will utilize the...

Prabhupāda: So why they discover all these nonsense and waste their time? Why do they not discover something which will stop all problems of life—no death, no disease. Why do they do not know? They are also rascals, combination of rascals. Why do they expend their energy and intelligence for this nonsense purpose? (break) ...which will be reduced.

Morning Walk Conversation -- September 28, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: These scientists, they are trying to travel in the outer space, but they do not know where to go.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, that's a fact. They are just wandering in the wild.

Prabhupāda: That's all. (indistinct) beyond the sky there is another sky (indistinct) and we are trying to go there according to the perfect knowledge (indistinct). (break) ...of knowledge is misunderstanding, so how they can get perfect knowledge? If you begin from mistake, misconception, then where is your perfect knowledge? The beginning is this body. Beyond this body, they have no knowledge. Their rascal knowledge..., this rascal knowledge, how they can help you? Anything, suppose any mathematical calculation, if the beginning is wrong, then how you will come to the right conclusion? What do you think?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, when the...

Jayatīrtha: In logic, if the hypothesis is wrong then the conclusion is wrong.

Prabhupāda: The hypothesis is always wrong.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: If the starting point is wrong, then there is nothing...

Prabhupāda: Then there cannot be any perfect knowledge. So the modern so-called scientists, philosophers, their starting point is wrong. Just like a great scientist... Darwin is a scientist?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: He's not a scientist. He's called a naturalist.

Morning Walk Conversation -- September 28, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Then there cannot be any perfect knowledge. So the modern so-called scientists, philosophers, their starting point is wrong. Just like a great scientist... Darwin is a scientist?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: He's not a scientist. He's called a naturalist.

Prabhupāda: Naturalist. Anyway, you can call him a philosopher. So the basic point is wrong. Starting is wrong. Starting point is mistake and illusion. Therefore, the next point is cheating. If you start from wrong conception of life, then if you distribute knowledge, that means cheating. You do not know, still you are distributing knowledge. But this rascal Darwin, he has no clear idea. He is simply theorizing, speculating, and misleading people. Therefore, he is cheating. So if I cheat you and you cheat me, then how you can expect perfection of life? It is a society of cheating, and that is actually going on. Everyone is thinking, "How I have gorgeous way cheated you." That is politics, diplomacy. If you can cheat your friend very cleverly, then you are supposed to be very bi

Morning Walks -- October 1-3, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: There is no temple in India. As we are maintaining our temple, there is no such temple in India. There are temple, they are neglected. Just like here, the churches are neglected. (break) ...demons, and here we are manufacturing demigods.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I read in the news that in the next five-year plan, they are planning to spend about thirty-two billion rupees for education, the greatest for ten years. They said that there were so many mistakes for the last ten years in introducing the basic education that everybody said there is no success. So they are planning another thirty-two billion rupees from 1974 onwards.

Prabhupāda: What education? To eat meat and beef.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: That education. And no restriction of sex even amongst the leaders.

Jayatīrtha: And all advanced contraceptive methods.

Prabhupāda: This Jawaharlal(?) was implicated with his sister, and some say with his daughter also, and he was the prime minister. This is their position. In our Indian system, education is mātṛvat para-dāreṣu: every woman except your own wife, all mothers. That is education. Mātrā svasrā duhitrā vā (SB 9.19.17). Either your mother or sister or daughter, you don't live together alone. These are education. And they're freely advocating sex life. What is the (indistinct) difference? In India they're doing, so many leaders. (indistinct), it can be done. The leaders are speaking while doing that. No discrimination, just like hog. No discrimination.

Introduction Speech By Dr. Kapoor and Conversation -- October 15, 1972, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So blessings of Dr. O.B.L. Kapoor. He is a Vaiṣṇava. Although by age he is my younger brother, we are Godbrothers, and for the last forty years perhaps, since he was a student at Allahabad and I was doing some business there, we are known to each other. So his association is a great blessing for us. But this reception is actually not my reception. It is the reception of my foreign students. Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu wanted that His message should be broadcast all over the world, in every village and every town, and my Guru Mahārāja attempted. Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura distributed his literature. I think, in 1896, he sent his first book, Teachings of Lord Caitanya, and I saw in McGill University that book. And I do not know. That was the year of my birth also, 1896. So somehow or other, later on, I came in contact with Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī Gosvāmī Mahārāja in 1922, and he immediately asked me that "Why don't you go to the foreign countries and preach Caitanya Mahāprabhu's blessings." So I was little surprised. Especially at that time, I was very young man and I was newly married. I got one son also. So it was my mistake that I did not take up the words of Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī Gosvāmī Mahārāja immediately. I thought that "I am now married. Let me settle down." Perhaps if I would have joined from 1922, by the blessings of Guru Mahārāja, I could do more preaching work. Anyway, it is better late than never.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- February 28, 1973, Jakarta:

Prabhupāda: (indistinct) Why he's not married man?

Devotee (1): Another wife, second. He says it was a grave mistake because if we had come sooner (indistinct) So we're trying to engage him. Also this girl which you're going to initiate, she can speak a fair amount of Indonesian already, and she can help translation work (indistinct). That girl has a sister who also chants sixteen rounds and follows the rules. Though sometimes in her past she failed and stopped and she is not as steady. So I didn't recommend. I don't know...

Prabhupāda: (indistinct)

Devotee (1): (indistinct) ...that is better because they're sisters and if one is a devotee...

Prabhupāda: (indistinct)

Devotee (1): Because also, even if someone is expert in English, if they don't practice or come in touch with Kṛṣṇa consciousness, they still cannot say.

Morning Walk -- April 25, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: In Bhagavad-gītā it is said: duḥkhālayam. This is a place for suffering only. This material world is a place for suffering. It is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā: duḥkhālayam... And that suffering, that also you, you cannot make any, what is called, compromise. "All right, it is suffering. I shall remain here." But that also you cannot. Some day nature will kick you out. "Get out." Duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam (BG 8.15). Even if you accept this place of misery to be your permanent residence, that also you cannot have. You have to go out. Today or tomorrow or fifty years after, you have to go. That is the mistake. I am thinking: "Now I have got this American body, or this body, that body. I am very happy." But how long you'll remain in this condition? Any moment, you will be kicked out. This is laws of nature. Therefore my intelligence will, will be shown when we are trying for the real eternal life. That is (indistinct).

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So this suffering is all due to the desire of the individual souls.

Prabhupāda: That... The...suffering is there. Suppose you are in the ocean. It is suffering, but if you have got a good ship, you may think that: "I'm very well situated." That good ship also can sink at any moment. Suffering is always there. You cannot avoid the suffering. Because you are in the ocean. Suppose you are in the air in a very nice plane. Does it mean you are secure? Any moment it can be... There is dangers everywhere. Therefore this place is always dangerous. Padaṁ padaṁ yad vipadām (SB 10.14.58), always dangerous. So the real intelligence means you have to find out where there is no danger. That is the... Where there is real happiness. In the material world, we cannot have happiness.

Morning Walk -- May 5, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So consciousness is also subject to body's changes, change of body.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Body's circumstances association. Saṅgāt sañjāyate kāmaḥ. According to association, atmosphere, circumstances, the desires changes. So that is, desire means consciousness. Just like our boys, they had different consciousness before coming to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Just like you are also scientist, there are other scientists. But your consciousness is different from theirs. Therefore you could challenge him like that. If you can create life by accumulation of these facts. He says that I do not know. He is not confident in his science.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: He is not experienced. He has not seen yet.

Prabhupāda: He is not above the defects, four defects of conditioned life. You know these four defects?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Illusion, mistake, cheating, imperfectness. They are aware of the imperfectness of the senses. Still they are proud of their knowledge. This is illusion. (end)

Morning Walk -- May 14, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: The material energy, it is also coming from Kṛṣṇa. The spiritual en... Kṛṣṇa Himself is spiritual energy. Exactly like that is. This weather is coming from sun but sun is covered. The weather created by sun makes himself covered; not himself covered, it is covering our eyes. Sun is not covered. My eyes are covered. Therefore material means when our consciousness is not developed. That's the meaning. It is somehow or other covered. That is material. Where is our scientist? They... The mistake of the scientist is that they do not accept two energies, the material and spiritual.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No.

Prabhupāda: They accept one energy. We accept also that. But they, defect is they are beginning from the material. That is their method. Just like this weather is beginning from the light and gradually it is becoming dark. So darkest part or the dark part is called material. But the dark is beginning from light, not the light is beginning from dark. That is their method. They are thinking that from matter, consciousness is coming. Now consciousness is there. When it is covered, degraded, that is unconsciousness. So material means when the consciousness is forgetful of Kṛṣṇa. That is material. Material means gradual development of forgetfulness of Kṛṣṇa. That is material. And spiritual means full consciousness of Kṛṣṇa. Is it clear? Try to understand this. Darkness is coming from light. Where the light is not visible that is called darkness.

Room Conversation with Krishna Tiwari -- May 22, 1973, New York:

Krishna Tiwari: ...big difference between subjugative authority and being a part of the nature.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Subjugative, when you are forced to become old, when you are forced to become diseased, you are under subjugation.

Krishna Tiwari: Mistake. Not forced. It's automatic, it's, it's just a chain. It's a growth into. It's a factor; it's no force.

Prabhupāda: That automatic means just like you become criminal.

Krishna Tiwari: That, that's the way progress, I'm a part of it. I'm not under or over anybody, and no one is over, under, or above me. You are not under me. You are not over me.

Śyāmasundara: You're under nature's law.

Krishna Tiwari: Right, we all are. You, me, Swamiji, you, all of us are.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Exactly. Exactly.

Krishna Tiwari: Neither you are above me, nor you are below, nor I am above you. I may have respect for you, because I, on my own, believe that you are respectable. That is entirely different thing.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: That's up to you.

Krishna Tiwari: Then authority. That's what I'm saying. This is up to me. But authority and subjugation are, are the two things which will not come.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: It's a matter of your choice. Accepting...

Krishna Tiwari: It's a matter of personal choice.

Prabhupāda: If you are not under subjugation, that does not authority?

Krishna Tiwari: I'm no, I'm no, I'm no subjugation to anyone. I'm a part of the nature.

Prabhupāda: How is that you're not...

Krishna Tiwari: If nature moves, I move with it. If the nature makes me old, I get old.

Prabhupāda: You have here subjugation.

Room Conversation -- July 9, 1973, London:

Haṁsadūta: This point is revolutionary in spiritual circles.

Prabhupāda: Because it is Kṛṣṇa's property. It is not my property, neither George's property. This is mistake. Everything belongs to Kṛṣṇa. So it must be utilized for Kṛṣṇa.

Revatīnandana: Simply they don't know Bhagavad-gītā.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Revatīnandana: They don't know Bhagavad-gītā, therefore they don't understand us.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Therefore I say, all... Immediately, how you are all rascals. We have got a test. Test tube. As soon as one is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he is rascal, he is miscreant, he is lowest of the mankind, he has no knowledge. These, these are groups, they belong to. Na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ. He maintains that he is very big man, Nixon, but we know that he is a rascal number one. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. You can understand immediately what is what.

Room Conversation with David Wynne, Sculptor -- July 9, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: What is that? Sometimes it is not successful?

Śyāmasundara: When we try artificially to impose our idea on something, say, a sculpture, sometimes we make a mistake and it comes out not good.

Prabhupāda: That mistake you are responsible.

David Wynne: Yeah. Yeah.

Prabhupāda: Because at the present moment, as I told you, we are acting according to our whims. So if there is mistake, I am responsible.

Śyāmasundara: In, in,... Sometimes they call inspiration... They say, "Oh, I've been inspired," and they create something beautiful by, automatically almost. What is that inspiration?

Prabhupāda: That inspiration means you created an idea, that "I want to do like that," and because you are persistent to act, so God helps you, "All right, you act." That is inspiration. But you are responsible. God gives you... You are persistent, that "I must have it." "All right, do it." That is inspiration. We should not do that. Unless it is desired by God, we should not act anything. That is bhakti. Anyābhilāṣitā-śūnyaṁ jñāna-karmādy-anāvṛtam, ānukūlyena kṛṣṇānuśīlanam... Anyābhilāṣitā-śūnyam (Brs. 1.1.11). You should not have any (indistinct) for your satisfaction. Then it is all God's responsibility. Jñāna-karmādy-anāvṛtam (CC Madhya 19.167).

Room Conversation with Two Buddhist Monks -- July 12, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Buddhist Monk (1): And I told them directly and indirectly, "Your systems, which have transplanted the well, type systems, especially of India, has created a catastrophe. We have made mistakes in the past. But we profited by them, and we want a successful educational system that taught the individual how to give himself peace within himself, mentally and physically. Within his family, within his relations society, nation and the world. And today that system has been overtaken by this materialistic system. One calls himself materialist directly. Another, camouflage, just under the name of religion. That's the only difference I know of in these two systems in the West. That's the only difference." And I told them. I said, "We want peace. Śānti, śānti, śānti. And we know the danger of playing with the fireball of materialism, which is throwing its tentacles into every part of society: divorces, nervous cases, mental cases, cancers, suicides, family life is breaking. And it reminds me of Gibbon's writing about the decline and fall of the Roman Empire. And all those symptoms are there in this so-called progressive, civilized culture." I used the word "so-called." And this mind...

Prabhupāda: But what remedy you have suggested?

Buddhist Monk (1): Reduction of greed, and substitution of liberality. There is no other remedy.

Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: No, dictatorship, I told you...

Lord Brockway: And even a, a good dictatorship is a bad thing. I would rather have...

Prabhupāda: No, how good dictatorship can be a bad thing?

Lord Brockway: I would rather have people make mistakes when they had self-government than if you had a dictatorship which didn't make mistakes and imposed it's own...

Prabhupāda: No, but my proposition is that they should not commit, either the king or the elected person should not commit mistake. But if you try to educate the mass of people to become educated to elect the right person, that is very difficult. But if a king, a person, is educated nicely, that is easier. That is my point of view.

Lord Brockway: Yes. Yes, but the mass of people in poverty, the...

Prabhupāda: No, everything will be all right. Because the man on the head is perfectly, he'll manage, he'll manage. But if he's not perfect, then it is not possible. Therefore the endeavor should be made... Either call it dictator or president or king, it doesn't matter. The man on the top of the executive must be a perfect man.

Garden Conversation with Mahadeva's Mother and Jesuit Priest -- July 25, 1973, London:

Mother: But he had a false religious experience, due to the LSD.

Prabhupāda: No, I am talking generally, not of him, that everything must be, there must be division. Just like naturally we have got division. The whole object is to keep the body fit, but there is division: the head division, the arm division, the stomach division, and the leg division. So similarly, there must be four classes of men in the society: the intelligent class of men, the administrator class of men, the productive class of men, and the laborer class of men. Everything is required. But not that the intelligent class of man has to learn the business of the laborer class of men. That is not required. Just try to understand. The laborer class of men, they are required. But one who is intelligent class, he, he cannot be trained up as laborer, ordinary laborer in the factory. That is mistake. He must work according to his capacity. If he's intelligent, he must be preacher, he must be God conscious. He would educate people that "This eating, sleeping is not all. There is God. You should understand. You have got a relationship with Him. If you want to have better life next, then you must become God conscious, you must be sinless." These things are required in the society. (loud noise of jet going over). What is the use of talking?

Room Conversation with French Journalist and UNESCO Worker -- August 10, 1973, Paris:

Reporter: You accept to answer my questions?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Reporter: Thank you very much. Well, the first point is people are used to seeing that your Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is completely out of life and doesn't take any interest into the real life, materialistic, you know. So, but I think it's a mistake perhaps. It's a mistake. And that...

Yogeśvara: (French)

Reporter: (French)

Yogeśvara: Ah, oui?

Reporter: Oui. I've heard that... It's a mistake. And your movement, your consciousness of Kṛṣṇa, engloves, takes all the direction of economics and political possibility.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.

Reporter: Can you speak, explain me about that?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Our aim is realization of God.

Room Conversation -- August 11, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Oh, it is wrong.

Bhagavān: That's always questioned in Bhagavad-gītā.

Prabhupāda: It is not, has been mis-edited. If you identify with body, how you know it? Oh, it is a very great mistake.

Bhagavān: We can, we can write them, make that correction.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Write immediately. One must know that I am not this body. That is knowledge. That is knower. That is common sense. I say: "It is my body." I don't say: "I body." That I explained. One who does, one who knows that "I am not this body," he's real knower. And one who knows that: "I am this body," he does not know. He's in ignorance. Just like Danielou.

Yogeśvara: A Kṛṣṇa conscious person, he can maintain his position in family, government, business, anything.

Prabhupāda: Why not? All these Pāṇḍavas, they were government men. How they maintained Kṛṣṇa consciousness? Yudhiṣṭhira Mahārāja... They were fighting for political reasons. So they were Kṛṣṇa conscious, fully. (break) ...who identifies with this body, he's described as cow or ass. How he can be knower? It is wrongly edited. The word: "Not". It was edited by whom? Hayagrīva?

Room Conversation -- August 11, 1973, Paris:

Haṁsadūta: Yes. Their argument is... They will say that just the fact that the living entity has the independence and, and the possibility is there for him to make a mistake, they consider it to be a flaw.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Yogeśvara: If it's better to be...

Haṁsadūta: But they consider it to be God's flaw.

Prabhupāda: No, why God's flaw.

Yogeśvara: Because He has given us the chance to fall down.

Prabhupāda: Independence means that you may obey me or not obey me. It is not my flaw. Otherwise, independence has no meaning. Independence has no meaning. If I give you independence... Just like Kṛṣṇa is giving independence to Arjuna: "Now I have explained to you everything. Now I give you independence. Either you accept or not accept, that is your position." So if this independence has no such quality, acceptance... That is not independence. If one has to be forced by the law of God, that is not independence. Then one does not know what is the meaning of independence.

Room Conversation with Dr. Christian Hauser, Psychiatrist -- September 10, 1973, Stockholm:

Prabhupāda: Mistakes.

Haṁsadūta: He's subjected to make mistakes. He'll make a mistake. Everybody knows. To err is human, right? And he...

Prabhupāda: Cheating.

Haṁsadūta: Has a propensity for cheating. Propensity for cheating means that although he's imperfect senses, subject to make mistake and he's illusioned, he will write books giving...

Prabhupāda: Instructions.

Haṁsadūta: Instructions. Because... But he's not qualified. So he's cheating.

Dr. Hauser: He's cheating.

Haṁsadūta: Yes.

Dr. Hauser: He's also cheating himself.

Haṁsadūta: Yes. Cheating himself and...

Prabhupāda: Cheating others.

Haṁsadūta: ...cheating others.

Prabhupāda: But that is going on. Recently it happened in Los Angeles, one big professor came to lecture there, and he has got Nobel Prize. I forgot his name. He has written one book, Chemical Evolution. So he was speaking on that Chemical Evolution, and his theory is life begins from four chemicals. So he gave lectures. After that, there is one student. He's also Doctor in Chemistry. He's my disciple. So he asked that professor that: "If I give you the chemicals, will you be able to produce life?" He replied: "That I cannot say." He says that life begins from these four chemicals. And he lectured hours. And when he was asked: "Suppose I give you these four chemicals, will you be able to produce life?" He answered, "That I cannot say." Just see. Is it not cheating? He's, he's saying that life is produced from these chemicals.

Morning Walk -- December 3, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They say, "At the time of evolution, the cells, the genes, sometimes..." Normally the gene is perfectly copied for the next generation, but sometimes there is a mistake in copying. Just like in the printing press sometimes we do some mistakes. Just like that, there are some mistakes along the path of evolution. So those mistakes, sometimes they just, according to the circumstances, they can stand, and they form a different living entity because of the difference of the genes.

Prabhupāda: But the mistake is continuing forever, because you'll find the varieties of living entities ever-existing. Therefore the mistake is permanent. So when it is permanent, it is not mistake. It is intelligence.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They'll say if there is no mistake, there will be only one living entity in the whole universe.

Prabhupāda: Why? Because you have got different mind, therefore you create different situation. Just like we are walking here. Not that everyone is coming to join us. Because they have got different mentality. They want to sleep. We want to rise early in the morning. Why this difference?

Śrutaśrava: It is a great mistake they're making.

Morning Walk -- December 3, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: It is not mistake. It is your desire. And exactly according to the desire, you get a body. It is not mistake. No. Yaṁ yaṁ vāpi smaran bhāvaṁ tyajaty ante kalevaram (BG 8.6). At the time of death, whatever you think, exactly nature will give you a similar body. That's all. That is not in your hand. That is in the nature's hand. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27).

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But scientifically it can be proved that there is a mistake.

Prabhupāda: Then that is your mistake. In the laws of nature there is no mistake. There is no mistake. Your mistake. Just like in the railway carriage there is first-class, second-class, third-class. So you have purchased third-class ticket. By mistake, you can go to the first-class and just give him, but you will not be allowed to stay there. So it is your mistake. But these first-class, second-class, third..., that is not a mistake. That is arrangement. Similarly, these varieties... God is so clever that He knows that so many mistakes can be done, and so many varieties are there. As you commit mistake, you enter... "You come here. It is ready." And it is very exact mathematically calculated. Because the nature is working in three modes, so you mix up these three modes, it becomes three into three equal nine, and again you multiply nine into nine, equal to eighty-one. Again eighty-one into eighty-one. So many varieties come.

Morning Walk -- December 3, 1973, Los Angeles:

Yaśomatīnandana: And also, if nature made a mistake, then how could nature supply the necessities of all the living entities? After all...

Prabhupāda: No, no, there is no mistake. Mayādhyakṣeṇa (BG 9.10). It is said, mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ sūyate sa-carācaram. Under the supervision of Kṛṣṇa, God, nature is working. How there can be mistake? In the Brahma-saṁhitā it is said, sṛṣṭi-sthiti-pralaya-sādhana-śaktir ekā chāyeva yasya bhuvanāni vibharti durgā (Bs. 5.44). This nature is working just like shadow. Real direction is from God. Icchānurūpam api yasya ca ceṣṭate sā. By His will, nature is working. So how He can be mistaken? Nature is working under the will of God; so how there can be mistake in the part of God? There is no mistake.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They use these terms to explain their proposed theory. This terminology.

Prabhupāda: Which terminology?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Like "mistake" and all these things.

Morning Walk -- December 5, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: ...has done a great mistake. I never expected... (noise) ...all of a sudden... (break) You see the so-called swamis and yogis. They could not do anything, because they are outsider. They are not within the jurisdiction of Kṛṣṇa. One must remain within the jurisdiction of Kṛṣṇa. Then his spiritual life is assured. Otherwise, paramour(?). (break) Similarly, everything, everyone belongs to Kṛṣṇa's family, but we have to see what he's doing for Kṛṣṇa. Just like everyone is citizen of the state. Why a man is given high position and big title? Why? Because he's recognized.

Sudāmā: Right.

Prabhupāda: So one must give service. Simply to feel, "I belong to Kṛṣṇa's family," and doing nothing for Kṛṣṇa, that is not...

Sudāmā: That's no good.

Prabhupāda: That's no good. That is not good. That means he'll... Very soon he'll again forget Kṛṣṇa. He'll again forget Kṛṣṇa.

Sudāmā: Actually, the other element is so powerful. These people here, because, even though they are part of Kṛṣṇa's family, but because they have forgotten, then we become influenced by their forgetfulness.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Forgetfulness means māyā.

Morning Walk -- December 9, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Gap of understanding because the basic principle is wrong, because everyone is fool. And they are trying to understand things with their foolish background. There is the wrong. They are trying to be advanced in knowledge on the foolish background. They do not accept that, that they are foolish rascals. And they are trying to advance in knowledge, active-foolish, fourth class men. Their background is wrong. No scientist, no politician, no philosophers, at the present moment, believe in this, that there is soul, and the soul is transmigrating from one body... Nobody believes it. So their whole background is foolish. So their so-called advancement must be all foolish. They're all fools, rascals, animals. An animal does not know that there is soul and the soul is transmigrating from one body to another. This is animal conception. You cannot teach these pigeons that "You are spirit soul. Your body's different from you." They will, they have no power to understand. So if a human being cannot understand, what is the difference between these pigeons and cats and dogs and him? Then basic principle is wrong. Just like in mathematical calculation, if at one point you have mistaken, then will that be correct ever? It will go on, mistaking, mistaking, mistaking, mistaking. If the, if one point, while adding, you have made two plus two equal to five, then after that, everything wrong, everything wrong. Everything wrong. So that is their position. Their basic principle is like animal.

Morning Walk -- December 10, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Just like the so-called scientists, the philosophers, they think, "Oh, what is this Kṛṣṇa consciousness?" But they do not know that they are in the fool's paradise. Tad viddhi praṇipātena paripraśnena (BG 4.34). If you have surrendered, then you can ask some question. And sevayā. That paripraśna should not be challenge. By sevā, by service. This is our process. We must find out guru, we must satisfy him by service and surrender unto him. Then guru will explain. Upadekṣyanti te jñānaṁ jñāninas tattva-darśinaḥ. He knows everything. He'll explain. This is our program.

yasya deve parā bhaktir

yathā deve tathā gurau

tasyaite kathitā hy arthāḥ

prakāśante mahātmanaḥ

(ŚU 6.23)

This is the process of understanding. But sometimes we mistake. One who has not seen the truth, we approach him and accept him as guru. Then we are baffled. Jñāninas tattva-darśinaḥ. You must approach a guru who has seen the truth. Then surrender unto him. Then serve him. And then make question. Everything will be revealed. These are the statement of Bhagavad-gītā. They'll not surrender. They'll not serve. They cannot find out who has actually seen. So many difficulties. Therefore they are cheated. They go to this man, that man. Maharishi, Dr. Mishra, this, that. Therefore they are cheated. They do not know. This is the position.

Morning Walk -- December 13, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Suppose a business is not going very nicely. It is going at loss. Somebody says, "Close it." But one experienced man comes: "Why should you close? All right, I shall do it properly. You'll get profit." So who is better? One, by disappointment, he says, "Close this business. There is no profit." And another man says, "No, don't close it. We shall make you profit. We shall show you profit. Just manage it properly." This is our proposition. We don't say that "Stop all these material activities." No. Just do it properly so that you get real profit and real benefit. That is our program. We don't want to make it zero, no. Why shall I make it zero? (break) ...can be taken just like there is business, but the workers, the assistants, they have no idea who is the proprietor. So everyone is doing something, taking pocket, something this, take pocket, his pocket, so how the business will go on nicely? That is being done. Everyone, these rascals, they have no idea who is the proprietor of this world. So they are doing in their nonsensical way. Therefore there is confusion. The business is not profitable. But if they accept, "No, the real proprietor is such and such gentleman, so he wants to do us like this," then the business will be profitable. Everyone is thinking that he is proprietor, so how this business will profit? This is the position. Everyone is thinking that he is the proprietor. He forgets that he is worker. He is not proprietor. That is the mistake. Therefore the business is mismanaged, and there is no profit, simply chaos. That is the position.

Morning Walk -- December 18, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That is God. God is always existing. Not "come from." That is God. Nityo nityānām. You are also existing. This knowledge, they are lacking. Just like I am, you are, we are eternal. We are eternal. We are changing body. Because they do not believe or do not try to understand that I am not this body, therefore the whole mistake is there.

Devotee: The scientists would use the same argument. The scientists would say, "Well, since I have not experienced that I am eternal, therefore how can I accept that I am eternal?"

Prabhupāda: Yes, you are eternal. Because you were a child and now you are grown up, but you know that you were a child. Therefore you are eternal. You were a child, but you have no that child's body. Now you have got a different body. So although you have got different body, you know that you had a body like a child. Therefore body has changed. You have not changed. That is eternity.

Girirāja: And nobody wants to die.

Prabhupāda: Nobody wants to die.

Morning Walk -- December 30, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Oh, that's all right. They say, "Conservation of energy." So why there is crisis? Find out the reservoir and find out the energy. That is the scientific theory, "conservation of energy." Find out where the energy comes from. When it is finished, so I ask, "Just go to the kitchen. Find out some more to eat." So that is the source of energy. You find out the source of energy. Then there is no crisis. (laughter) But the rascals they do not know where the puri is being made. He is going to the privy. (laughter) "Might be puri here." That is their mistake. He does not know the puri is being supplied from the kitchen, not from the latrine. That is their mistake. Instead of going to the kitchen they are going to the latrine. Their advancement of knowledge is up to latrine. That's all. That is the Vedānta information. The conservation of energy if first explained in the Bhāgavata: janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1), that here is... (break) (end)

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- February 20, 1974, Bombay:

Guest (1): No, no, no, no, no. That is a... (Hindi) That is the mistake, you see, of the...

Dr. Patel: All right, I am quiet. Lay down now. (laughter)

Prabhupāda: No, actually, this is a fact. This gañjā smoking, they have learned from India.

Dr. Patel: No, but gañjā, they say, some of the people say that you come in such trance. It's an artificial trance.

Prabhupāda: They say also like that!

Dr. Patel: Hm. These boys.

Prabhupāda: They... These hippies, they also say that by marijuana... They call marijuana... They call marijuana? Or what is called?

Devotees: Marijuana.

Prabhupāda: Marijuana. So they learned this gañjā smoking... They came here for spiritual enlightenment, but they do not know who can give them spiritual enlightenment. They went to these rascals, gañjā-smoker, having long beard...

Dr. Patel: But there is a great smuggling racket the whole world, Swamiji.

Prabhupāda: No, no. When they... I know that Allen Ginsberg. He learned this...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, in India.

Prabhupāda: But he's a great poet. He learned this gañjā smoking from India.

Morning Walk -- February 20, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: They say "Christ is God."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, they also make mistakes.

Prabhupāda: They also make that mistake.

Yaśomatīnandana: No, they are mistaken. That is, they understand their position is servant, but...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This, this philosophy, that there's allegory, that Kṛṣṇa never danced with gopīs, that...

Prabhupāda: That is...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: ...directly leads to Māyāvādī philosophy.

Prabhupāda: That is Māyāvādī.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Guest (4): (Hindi for couple sentences.)

Prabhupāda: He knows also.

Morning Walk -- March 6, 1974, Mayapura:

Jayapatākā: Ācchā, the way back we passed. Do you want to go back yet or around to the end?

Prabhupāda: Eh? (break) ...In every life, there is āvaraṇātmikā-śakti. He'll think that "I am very well situated." Even in the hog's life. That is māyā. Similarly, even if you are thinking, "Now we have got human body. We are well situated than the hog," that is also mistake. That is also mistake. "I am European, American, I have got so comfortable." Everything is wrong. Because you have to transmigrate. You do not know what is the next life. So what is the meaning of this well-situated. That is the mistake. That is māyā. You are not sure that you'll continue this life. You'll have to die. You have to accept. So this is māyā. Somebody well-situated, he's thinking, "Oh, I haven't got to do anything with Kṛṣṇa consciousness. I am well situated. I am European and American."

Jayapatākā: Watch out here.

Prabhupāda: Where is our... (break) (kīrtana-party in background) ...that "Europeans and Americans will come, and they will dance here with the chanting, "Jaya Śacīnandana, Jaya Śacīnandana!" So that is being done.

Morning Walk -- March 9, 1974, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: (Bengali) (break) Adjust their cash.

Guest (2): Cash is different...

Prabhupāda: No, no. I mean to say, account computer. But they must tally with their daily balance.

Guest (2): Well, they put in the suspense. When they find out this mistake, that somebody pointed out, then they adjust it. So many times it has happened. But this computer system is not hundred per cent efficient.

Guest (1): One Indian girl, Śakuntalā, went to London and America and stay on (?) these computers. She was able to work out computer, one...

Guest (2): She challenged. She challenged.

Guest (2): Śakuntalā?

Guest (2): Śakuntalā, yes.

Prabhupāda: Some girl came to see me. She's little fatty, that girl?

Guest (2): Yes.

Room Conversation -- March 16, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: You follow, evaṁ paramparā-prāptam (BG 4.2), gopī-bhartuḥ pada-kamalayor dāsa-dāsānudāsaḥ (CC Madhya 13.80), servant of the servants of the servant of, then this is our.

Guru dāsa: That's the consideration. Advancement is (indistinct). (break)

Harikeśa: I know I am making mistakes.

Prabhupāda: Why do you preach?

Harikeśa: That's my question.

Prabhupāda: Stop preaching.

Harikeśa: Ah.

Prabhupāda: If you know your mistakes and you're preaching, why this nonsense preaching?

Harikeśa: Preaching must be perfect.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Perfect means as you have heard from your spiritual master. (indistinct) We are not perfect, none of us, but if you perfectly follow the orders of the perfect, then you are perfect. You should not think that "I have become perfect." Caitanya Mahāprabhu also said, guru more mūrkha dekhi (CC Adi 7.71). He presented Himself as fool number one. So we should always keep ourself as fool number one, that "I am not perfect. I am fool number one." But whatever I am doing I am carrying the orders of the perfect. That is my credit. I am not perfect. Suppose I give you, (indistinct), five thousand dollars. That is not my money. I am not rich man. But the money is paid by somebody else and I deliver, that's all. That is my perfection. If I don't touch it, I do not take from five hundred dollars a paise even, and I deliver it, that is my perfection. I may not be rich man, but if I deliver this amount to you, in perfect order, that is my perfection.

Morning Walk -- March 18, 1974, Vrndavana:

Guru dāsa: Rahu?

Prabhupāda: Yes. There are many planets invisible. So there is a Rahu planet which comes in front of the moon planet, and that is called eclipse. So there is a planet rotating. I think they are going to that Rahu planet, not to the moon planet.

Haṁsadūta: How can they make such a mistake?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Haṁsadūta: How is it that they made such a big mistake?

Prabhupāda: Their whole life is mistake. (laughter) They cannot do anything but mistake. Why you are so much confident about that? Their whole life is simply mistake.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda, they see a little fire, and they see that it has heat and light, and so they see a huge thing having heat and light, and so they conclude that that's also a fire. So if that's their deductive method, then if they see that whenever there's intelligence, there must be a person, then why don't they conclude that behind the universe, there's so many wonderful things, that there must also be a person?

Prabhupāda: Yes, we say there are persons, combination of fiery persons. Therefore it looks so bright.

Morning Walk -- March 24, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: These boys, these cowherds boys, they have accumulated, kṛta-puṇya-puñjāḥ, heaps of pious activities, therefore they are now allowed to play with Kṛṣṇa. Kṛta-puṇya-puñjāḥ. Not ordinary thing. So the impersonalists, they cannot understand, "What is this, playing with Kṛṣṇa, cowherds boy?" But here it is said, kṛta-puṇya-puñjāḥ. This is not ordinary thing. Itthaṁ brahma-sukhānubhūtyā. Satām. Those who are trying to appreciate brahma-sukha, for them, here is the Supreme Truth, Kṛṣṇa. And dāsyaṁ gatānāṁ para-daivatena. And those who have accepted to become the servant of the Lord, for them here is the Supreme Personality of Godhead. And māyāśritānāṁ nara-dārakeṇa. Mūḍha. Māyāśritānām. They are thinking, "Oh, He is Kṛṣṇa, ordinary boy. What is this?" But they are playing. These boys are playing with Him. Why? Kṛta-puṇya-puñjāḥ. Of many lives pious activities, they have come to this position, kṛta-puṇya-puñjāḥ. Māyāśritānāṁ nara-dārakeṇa. Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...to understand Kṛṣṇa and to engage himself in the service of the Lord, it requires a qualification, that completely... Yeṣāṁ tv anta-gataṁ pāpaṁ janānāṁ puṇya-karmaṇām (BG 7.28). Janānāṁ puṇya-ka... Those who are simply... This is the highest puṇya-karma, to engage one life's activities only for the service of Kṛṣṇa. That is the greatest puṇya-karma. And material puṇya-karma, a little discrepancy... Just like Nṛga. Nṛga. What is that? He was very charitable, distributing cows, and little mistake, he had to become an alligator.

Morning Walk -- March 30, 1974, Bombay:

Chandobhai: And will stop soon.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. That... Because the switch is now off, it will stop. Śaśvad bhavati dharmātmā. Śaśvad bhavati dharmātmā. Because he has taken to the shelter of Kṛṣṇa, therefore his all past business is finished. Although, due to past habit, sometimes you find some mistake, it is not to be taken. Because this thing will go.

Chandobhai: This thing will go. That is a part of past actions.

Prabhupāda: Very soon. Yes. Very soon.

Chandobhai: Because that wheel has to move and it will stop of its own.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Śaśvad bhavati... What is that verse? Śaśvad bhavati dharmātmā. That?

Chandobhai: Śaśvac chāntiṁ adhigacchati, kaunteya pratijānīhi...

Prabhupāda: Ah. Na me bhaktaḥ praṇaśyati.

Chandobhai: (quotes Sanskrit in background) (break)

Prabhupāda: ...may be callous. Just like some, somebody was asking me... That rascal Bharati's article. Who? That one Australian sannyāsī. So this rascal may speak something, but we cannot stop our movement. You see? Our movement is increasing, all over the world in, in spite of all criticism. We don't care for that. Because we know that we are following the footsteps of predecessor ācārya, that's all right. We don't mind. And actually, it is happening. Otherwise, within six, seven years, so much progress could not be possible. (break) What is the word, exact?

Morning Walk -- March 31, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Then again comes to that, here... Kṛṣṇa is within the dog, but he is not dog.

Dr. Patel: Yes.

Prabhupāda: And if you say "dog-nārāyaṇa," that is mistake. (laughter)

Mr. Sar: Tribhir guṇamayir bhāvair...

Prabhupāda: (laughing) "Dog-nārāyaṇa!" Mean... If daridra can become Nārāyaṇa, why not dog? What he has done?

Dr. Patel: mayā tatam idaṁ sarvaṁ jagad avyakta-mūrtinā (BG 9.4).

Prabhupāda: No, so that I am explaining. So if you take in that sense, because He has expanded Himself everywhere, so why do you say, "daridra-nārāyaṇa"? You say, "dog-nārāyaṇa, dhani-nārāyaṇa, cat-nārāyaṇa—everyone is Nārāyaṇa." Why you particularize this section?

Mr. Sar: Because they are human beings. That's why I take in that way.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no human. If you have got so broad vision, because the Nārāyaṇa has entered everywhere, so you cannot say simply "daridra-nārāyaṇa." You can say, "the sun-nārāyaṇa. Sun-nārāyaṇa." There is also.

Morning Walk -- March 31, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: (laughing) No, you are younger brother. Sons are on the same level. So I have got the right to say sometimes "Rascal, fool." Don't be angry.

Dr. Patel: And we accept it also. We know that within yourself you take us to be something different.

Prabhupāda: That is out of love. (break) He thinks he's government. Because "Unless he's satisfied, if I do any mistake, immediately he'll arrest me." So he thinks "This constable is government." That's all. He does not know behind the constable, there is head constable, there is... (break) He sees directly, "The constable harasses me. So, 'Sir. Namaskara.' " Just like in the village, there are so many (break) done. Somebody is killing the hens. We have got here? Before some deity? So there are so many deities.

Dr. Patel: All these Hindus, they always worship those... (break)

Prabhupāda: ...and (Hindi), and this, that, so many, hundreds and thousands.

Morning Walk -- April 2, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Ah, this is the example.

Dr. Patel: Tathā sarvāṇi bhūtāni mat-sthānīty upadhāraya.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Just like this cloud. The cloud we say, "In the sky." The cloud is not in the sky. It is on the air. They mistake this, that "Nārāyaṇa is there." Nārāyaṇa is not there. Nārāyaṇa is separate. That is their foolishness.

Dr. Patel:

sarva-bhūtāni kaunteya

prakṛtiṁ yānti māmikām

kalpa-kṣaye punas tāni

kalpādau visṛjāmy aham

Prabhupāda: Yes. Because everything is coming from Him. Yato vā imāni bhūtāni jāyante. Again they are given a chance to prosecute the result of his karma. And there is chance also to become a devotee. Therefore Kṛṣṇa by His confidential servant, He preaches, "Take to this." But if they do not take, then again kalpa-kṣaye, again enters.

Morning Walk -- April 5, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Purāṇas are not Vedānta?

Indian man (2): Purāṇas, how can it be? (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: That is your mistake.

Indian man (3): Well I, I'm not a...

Prabhupāda: You see, Madhva... (break) They are supplementary to the Vedas.

Dr. Patel: These are the agamas and nigamas.

Prabhupāda: This is the Māyāvādī's version. They do not accept the Purāṇas. This is Māyāvādī version. But our paramparā system, Madhvācārya, he has accepted Purāṇas, Rāmāyaṇa, Mahābhārata, as Vedic literature. So we have to follow the ācārya. Ācāryavān puruṣo... Yes. Not only Madhvācārya, all, all other ācāryas.

Indian man (2): Ācārya, ṛṣis, they have got all different...

Dr. Patel: But those people are following Śaṅkarācārya...

Prabhupāda: Yes, but Śaṅkarācārya accepted Bhagavad-gītā. Then... He commented, and he accepted Kṛṣṇa.

Dr. Patel: His commentation is different, you see.

Prabhupāda: No, no. No, no. He has accepted Kṛṣṇa, sa bhagavān svayaṁ kṛṣṇaḥ. He has accepted. You have read, Bhagavad-gītā. He has accepted.

Morning Walk -- April 17, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...feverish. But these people, they take bhakti as a means of liberation. That is their mistake.

Dr. Patel: That is their mistake.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: That is where we were quarreling very often.

Prabhupāda: Yes. We have now made a conclusion not to fight.

Dr. Patel: (laughs) Yes.

Prabhupāda: Otherwise he can become a Jamadagna.

Kirtirāja: I know.

Prabhupāda: You know Jamadagna? You know Jamadagna?

Dr. Patel: Jamadagni.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: Who asked Paraśurāma to fill his bowl up.

Prabhupāda: No, I mean to say Jamadagna.

Morning Walk -- April 18, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: We are by more tamas. They are indolent, don't want to work.

Prabhupāda: (break) Everyone makes this mistake. So as he is accepting, as Arjuna accepted, this is paramparā acceptance. (break)

Girirāja: "...the material luminaries, Your transcendental effulgence is identical with brahma-jyotir." (break)

Prabhupāda: ...advised and all the ācāryas advised, Caitanya Mahāprabhu's advised. Why should we go somewhere else? Take shelter of His lotus feet. That's all. Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekam (BG 18.66). This is right conclusion. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate (BG 7.19). (break) Mahātmā, immediately by surrendering to Kṛṣṇa. Immediately. (break) A child, if he is informed, "God is everywhere," he will never understand what is God. He knows that God is there, that this God consciousness is there. So what is the use of educating him, "Oh, God is everywhere. You don't require to go to temple?" This is nonsense. It is kaniṣṭha-adhikārī. He must know, "Here is God." He goes there, offer respect. All the children come. (break) ...a man, military man like Arjuna.

Morning Walk -- May 3, 1974, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: But jñāna, you say, bhakti or jñāna automatically comes up.

Prabhupāda: No, bhakti does not depend on jñāna, but jñāna depends on bhakti. Without bhakti, one cannot get liberation simply by jñāna. But if one develops bhakti, automatically he gets jñāna. Karma-kāṇḍa jñāna-kāṇḍa, kevala viṣera bhāṇḍa. Viṣera bhāṇḍa, amṛta baliyā yebā khāya. If one mistakes that this is the pot of nectarean, ambrosia, then what is the result? Nānā yoni sadā phire: "He remains within the cycle of birth and death." Nānā yoni sadā phire, kadarya bhakṣaṇa kare. And if he gets the body of a hog and dog, then he eats all the abominable things. Nānā yoni, tāra janma adhah-pāte yāya. So he condemns his human form of body in this way, spoils. So one should not be attached to karma-kāṇḍa, jñāna-kāṇḍa. Anyābhilāṣitā-śūnyam (Brs. 1.1.11). (break) The inhabitants there, they can go from one planet to another without any aeroplane. That is Siddhaloka. Hm. Go on.

Dr. Patel: The highest is Satyaloka, no?

Prabhupāda: Brahmaloka. No highest Brahmaloka, where Lord Brahmā lives.

Morning Walk -- May 9, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yajñārthe karmaṇo 'nyatra loko 'yaṁ karma-bandhanaḥ (BG 3.9). That civilization is yajñārthe karma. You work, but for yajña. Yajña-śiṣṭāśinaḥ santo mucyante sarva-kilbiṣaiḥ. (Hindi) ...modern science... (Hindi) ...This is mistake.

Indian Man (4): This is not the ultimate solution.

Prabhupāda: No, that is not.

Dr. Patel: Ultimate solution, nobody knows.

Prabhupāda:

na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ

durāśayā ye bahir-artha-māninaḥ

(SB 7.5.31)

They are captivated by the external energy. They think by material advancement they will make solution of all problems. That is not possible.

andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānās

te 'pīśa-tantryām uru-dāmni baddhāḥ

He does not know that he is bound up, hands and legs, by the laws of nature, and he is trying to solve it by his own method of material civilization. That is the mistake. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ, ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā (BG 3.27). They are all vimūḍhas, mūḍhas, duṣkṛtina, mūḍhas. (Hindi) (break) He asked me, "What is the conception of hell?" I said, "It is your London. By artificial way you have kept it as heaven. But otherwise, it is hell." So this was published.

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1974, Rome:

Yogeśvara: There was a report in the New York Times that last year alone in the United States there were over 300,000 abortions, and more than two-thirds were performed on girls under twenty years of age.

Prabhupāda: Yes, this is civilization. Poor girls, they are victims. These rascals are enjoying without any responsibility of marriage. And sex impulse is very strong between thirteen years up to thirty years. So people take advantage of it, and the poor girls become victim. So many anomalies. This is a doggish, demonic civilization. This is not civilization at all. They are not interested. They do not know what is the aim of life. First mistake is that "I am this body." This is doggish. Just like the dog is barking. He is thinking, "I am a big dog here. Don't come." Similarly, if a man thinks, "I am a big American, I am great Englishman," then what is the difference? The dog is also thinking like that. And Vedic civilization says, "No, you are neither dog nor human being." Ahaṁ brahmāsmi: "I am spirit soul." This is Vedic civilization. One is being trained up to understand this philosophy, that "I do not belong to this, any material condition. I am Brahman part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa." Where is that conception?

Bhagavān: Now they have... the other day in the paper that India exploded its first atomic bomb.

Prabhupāda: Yes, and therefore yet it has become very great.

Morning Walk -- June 3, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: ...the moon planet, there is no rainfall?

Karandhara: No, according to scientists there is no (indistinct) of rainfall on the moon.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Bhagavān: It's very hot and very cold.

Yogeśvara: Have they made another mistake?

Prabhupāda: And there is no water also.

Karandhara: No.

Bhagavān: No, water.

Yogeśvara: They say that the moon is covered by a very thick layer of dust.

Prabhupāda: But according to our śāstra, moon is one of the heavenly planets. (break) ...is moon in any way? Because there is no water?

Karandhara: They say that if they want to set up some houses there, they have to, everything has to be brought there. There's nothing there to use.

Prabhupāda: How the house will be brought there?

Karandhara: Well, they plan on in the future building stations and...

Prabhupāda: The water has to be taken from the station?

Karandhara: Yes. Air, water, everything has to be taken.

Prabhupāda: Oh. And still they must go there. And we are proposing another planet, Vaikuṇṭha planet. They are not willing to go there.

Morning Walk -- June 11, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Then why shall we make compromise? That gentleman, Mr. Herbert, Gene Herbert, he said that "It has taken eighteen years to write these books." I said, "Still, there are so many mistakes." Immediately I said. And he could not say anything. Do you remember that?

Devotees: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Immediately I said, "Yes, you have labored eighteen years. Still, there are so many mistakes."

Nitāi: Anyone else would have said, "Oh! Very nice."

Prabhupāda: (laughs) Eh? I did not say.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: He said that morning "What can we do, Prabhupāda?" He said, "What can we do? If we do not compromise, we will make enemies."

Prabhupāda: No, you'll not compromise; at the same time, you'll not make enemies. That is tactics. If you make enemies, then what is your tactics? You must speak the truth; at the same time he'll not be displeased. That is tactics. If you can defeat him by your argument, then he'll not be displeased. After all, everyone is human being. If you can find out his defect, why he shall be enemy? Therefore, it is said, "You better make a reasonable man an enemy, but don't make a friend fool." You don't make friendship with a fool, but if a man is intelligent, better make him an enemy. Because, because he's intelligent, although he's an enemy, he'll not do any harm. Because intelligent. But a fool, he may pose himself as friend, and he can do anything which is very harmful.

Room Conversation with devotees about Twelfth Canto Kali-yuga, and Conversation with Guest -- June 15, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: That word, sound, is the Vedas. So before creation, Vedas were there. So you cannot find out the history of Vedas. You find out the history where the creation began. Then, before that, Vedas were there. (French)

Yogeśvara: He (the Bishop) says that he finds many things agreeable in this Vedic tradition, but he says that he thinks it might be a mistake to say that the Bible is exactly the same thing as the Vedas. He says there are still distinctions.

Prabhupāda: Then, then, distinction, then it is to be considered which is perfect, the later edition or the original.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Professor Durckheim: May I put a question, master? On the way there should be progress, inner progress. How to realize that there is a progress? I would say one thing is very important. There are three sufferings in the world of mankind: fear of annihilation, despair if you are taken by something which is absurd, and loneliness, if you are alone. These three sufferings in the world for the natural being. I realize that you make a decisive step on your inner way when you feel life in the very moment when you have to die, when you feel the great meaning in the very moment when you are just having despair, and when you feel the great love of the person God exactly while you are a lonely in the world. And I have realized that we are now in a very decisive moment in the western world because for the first time in the history of mankind, the western people, in Europe and the States, start to take seriously certain experiences, inner experiences, where this truth is revealed. In all times, as far as I see, the great condition of the east, they knew about those experiences where death loses its terrifying character and becomes the threshold to some bigger life. And I always see with also my disciples, as soon as they learn to go through some kind of death, they awake on a new level. So I will say if people are in my place and after a week, they still sleep very well, then I have made a mistake. About that sleep, just to realize something in overcoming their usual needs, their usual fears, their usual habits, in order to touch inwardly another level, and then suddenly they realize there is some quite different principle at work as they see usually in their natural mind.

Prabhupāda: So that different principle, for a devotee is already realized. Because a devotee never thinks of this body, that "I am this body." He thinks "I am...," ahaṁ brahmāsmi: "I am spirit soul." So without that realization, there is no question of devotional life. So that is first understood. That instruction is being given by Kṛṣṇa to Arjuna, that "You are considering very seriously on this body, but a learned man does not take this body very seriously, either dead or alive." That is the first realization. So everyone in this world, they are concerned with this body, dead or alive. When alive, they take care of the body in so many ways, and when dead they erect big statue upon it. So that realization is this body. When it is alive, very nicely dressed, nicely groomed, nicely everything on account of this body, and when dead, then again the statue, the tomb, that's all, but missing the active principle. He is taking care of this body even after death by erecting very nice memorial, but he has no knowledge where the active principle has lost. That is ignorance.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prof. Pater Porsch (Indian man): May I please add one thing. Perhaps it makes a difference if the person thinks "I am the spirit. I have a body." or he thinks, "I am a body, and I possess a soul." That is an important point.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. That is his mistake, that he is body and he possesses soul. But not that. He is soul; he is covered by this body. Another example. Just like your coat. So long you use it, it is important. And if you don't use it, it has no importance. But if he takes coat is very important... Important, it is important, so long you use it. But if you don't use it—it is torn—you throw it away. You take another coat. (German)

Prof. Pater Porsch: Can we not also say that self and not self must separate, either in death involuntarily, or through destiny.

Prabhupāda: Must separate, must separate.

Prof. Pater Porsch: Either through death or destiny.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is called death. You separate from this body; you accept another body. This period is called death. (German) So the body which you occupied previously, that is false now. Now the body which you have occupied now, that is important now. So you are giving stress on the body which I am changing after few years. That is the problem, misunderstanding.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Professor Durckheim: That is exactly what you say, that real life, real eternal life, means nothing but to recognize the father in the son.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is real business. And we have created so many unnecessary, superfluous business. We have set aside the real business, to know the father. And that is the mistake of this civilization. (German) (break)

Haṁsadūta: Professor Durckheim's question was: "Very simply, what is our way or what is our method to realize the highest truth, the absolute truth?" What is our process?

Prabhupāda: The simplest method is to associate with the Father, or the Absolute Truth. By association. This association can be possible. God, His name, His form, His pastimes, His abode, His paraphernalia, everything is God, because absolute. First of all you should understand this Absolute Truth. Just like here in the relative world the name of a person is different from the person. But in the absolute world the name and the person the same. So we are teaching or preaching this, that you chant the holy name of God, you associate immediately with God. And if you associate immediately with God then gradually you become Godly. The example is, just like you put one iron rod in the fire it becomes warm, warmer, warmer and, at last, red-hot. When it is red-hot, it is no longer iron rod, it is fire. Similarly, if you simply associate with God then gradually you become Godly or or all the qualities of God. Then you understand God and your life becomes perfect.

Room Conversation -- June 20, 1974, Germany:

Guest: Contaminated?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Just like if you contaminate some disease, then you must develop that disease. Similarly, if your mind is contaminated with some material designation, then you have to.... By nature's law. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya (BG 13.22). Because mind associated with a particular type of the modes of material nature, (indistinct). There are three qualities—sattva-guṇa, rajo-guṇa, tamo-guṇa and mixed up. At first mixing it becomes nine and again mixing up it becomes 81. Each quality there are thousands and thousands of varieties and that means by mixing up these qualities there are 8,400,000 species of life. So, it is by the God's law, nature's law, they take account of the particular color and award the quality. It is not man-made law. That there may some mistake. There is no mistake. If you have contaminated this disease, whether small pox or whatever or (indistinct), you must develop. Therefore desireless. Desireless means material desires. Material desires begins with this designation. Just like the child, he has got a childish body and he plays like a child. The same child when he'll get a youthful body (indistinct). The soul is the same but on account of the type of the body, he is acting. This is material. Small child in the childhood talks like nonsense, people enjoy it. But the same child when he is grown up, if he talks like a nonsense, people will call him nonsense, rascal. Why? The body has changed, the circumstances have changed. This is (indistinct) that we have changed this body and on account of the bodily situation we are acting different. That they do not understand. There is not school or college, they do not know about the soul and soul changing different positions, different bodies. In this way he remains materially entangled and the real relief is to get out of this bodily consciousness and advance in spiritual life.

Morning Walk at Marine del Rey -- July 13, 1974, Los Angeles:

Bali Mardana: They can protest in front of Downing Street, in front of the Prime Minister's residence.

Prabhupāda: Yes, protest meeting, go on, organize. Go, all of you. What is the talking here? They have seen that the movement is growing more important. So this is discrimination. In England the Church is very strong. They have organized like this. You quote the publication, "There is no alarm." Of course, it is on the plea of police protest, police objection. The police objection means one's religious ceremony should be stopped? What is this? Simply for some technical mistake, now they can warn that "You must do it. Otherwise it will be stopped." How is that? No. That means this is police government? Does it mean it is police government?

Bali Mardana: Police state.

Prabhupāda: Police state? And why they are declaring Commonwealth and, British Commonwealth. So if it is governed by the police, how it is Commonwealth? There should be very strong agitation. And all the Hindus will join. So who will organize it? Don't make it childish. It is very serious. (pause) Police should have taken task when the rules were broken by Mahādeva. Why they did not take action in that time? They did not say anything. Police, if there is discrepancy, violation of the rules, they should have taken immediate action. Why they did not take? Now they have manufactured by conspiracy that "This movement should be stopped. Now take this plea." This is going on.

Room Conversation -- August 5, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Chewing the chewed, that's all. Punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). They do not know. That is the mistake of the whole civilization. They do not know what is the necessity. They are manufacturing, durāśayā bahir-artha-māninaḥ. By adjustment of this external energy they are trying. You'll see the whole world, especially in the western world, they do not know what is the necessity. Here at least there are śāstras, there are gurus, people at least taking, still, although it is dead now. But in the western world they do not know at all. Their only happiness is this sex. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi sukhaṁ hi tuccham kaṇḍūyanena karayor iva duḥkha-duḥkham (SB 7.9.45). Itching. Itching sensation. More and more itching and the itches are increasing. Kaṇḍūyanena... They examples are given very nice. Kaṇḍūyanena karayor iva duḥkha-duḥkham. Karayoḥ means hands. There is itching sensation, like this, like this, like this. And the itching disease is increasing. So therefore it is advised that tṛpyanti neha kṛpanā bahu-duḥkha-bhājaḥ. By itching, by satisfying the senses, itching sensation, then troubles and miserable condition increasing. That they do not know. Increasing. Tṛpyanti neha kṛpanā bahu-duḥkha-bhājaḥ. Bahu means much, duḥkha means miserable condition. Therefore one who is sensible: kaṇḍūtivan manasijaṁ viṣaheta dhīraḥ. The dhīra, one (who) is sober, he understands, "What I am doing? I am simply trying to eat and the disease is increasing. Therefore it must be stopped." This is called dhīra. That is called dhīra.

Room Conversation -- August 12, 1975, Paris (with French translator):

Prabhupāda: So the God, He is also with me always as friend. So one, it is said in the Upaniṣad, there are two birds in one tree. The two birds means I, individual soul, and God, the Supreme Soul. The individual soul is limited within this body. And God is everywhere, in every body, in every atomic particle, everywhere. Because I am individual soul, I can understand my bodily pains and pleasure. But I cannot understand your bodily pains and pleasure. But God, being all-pervading, He can understand my pains and pleasure, He can understand your pains and pleasure, He can understand cats' and dogs' pains and..., everyone. This is the difference between me and God. Sometimes they mistake, because God is also within this body, I am also within this body, therefore they think that there is no other individual soul than God, therefore I am God. So if I am God, then you are also God. And if there is more than one God, there is not God. God is one. There cannot be two. So if I think I am God, then everyone is also God, so God becomes plural, so there is not God. God is one. Therefore, God is great, we are small. In quality we are one. Just like the president and the citizen, as man they are one. But in power, the citizen and the president, they are different. So these things can be understood if one is sober and very great thinker: they can understand that God is situated with me, He can help me also.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Sanskrit Professor, other Guests and Disciples -- February 12, 1975, Mexico:

Prabhupāda: Perfect knowledge means what you say, it is correct. There is no mistake.

Guest (5): Under any and all circumstances.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is perfect knowledge, not like the scientists. They changes: "Yes, it was this. Now it is now changed." This is not perfect knowledge. They simply change. Therefore we say, mūḍhās. Perfect knowledge is that what you say, that is correct forever. That is perfect. Just like man dies. If somebody says, "Man dies," it is perfect knowledge. It is correct forever.

Guest (5): Suppose he is reincarnated?

Prabhupāda: No, no, "dies" means the body dies. The soul does not die. Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). When the body annihilates... Body becomes old. Just like this cloth. I am using it, but when it will be old, no more useful, then I throw it away. I get another dress. This body is like that. Soul is eternal. Na jāyate na mriyate vā kadācit. It does not die, it does not take birth, but because he is in material condition, therefore he has to change the material body because no material thing is permanent. Therefore the aim of life should be how to avoid this material body. That is real business. Jīvasya tattva-jijñāsā. That is called athāto brahma jijñāsā. This is only business, how to stop acceptance of this material body. And that is very clearly and simply stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, janma karma me divyaṁ yo janāti tattvataḥ, tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9). We can do that. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, that you try to understand Kṛṣṇa, then you are not going to accept any more material body. That means there is no more birth, no more death, no more disease, no more, and what is called, old age.

Room Conversation with Professors -- February 19, 1975, Caracas:

Prabhupāda: That he thinks. But the authority thinks otherwise.

Professor (Hṛdayānanda): He says he doesn't know.

Prabhupāda: Then that is his mistake. Just like a man does not know what is law, but that is no excuse.

Professor (Hṛdayānanda): He says that he can accept that man is born perfect, but that his development is imperfect, but he cannot accept that man is born imperfect.

Prabhupāda: No, that we don't say. Therefore man is advised to associate with perfect so that he can keep his perfectness.

Professor (Hṛdayānanda): He says, "The problem is there are so many millions of people, but there are so few perfect persons."

Prabhupāda: One perfect person is sufficient to teach thousands of imperfect persons.

Professor (Hṛdayānanda): He says he thinks you are right because the example is Buddha and Christ, and so many people follow them.

Prabhupāda: They are perfect, but the followers do not follow the instructions. That does not mean they are imperfect.

Room Conversation with Psychiatrist -- February 22, 1975, Caracas:

Hṛdayānanda: So I'll tell you what else he said. He said that even though we may not be this body, even though we should be looking for God, still, for example, he, as a doctor, if a patient comes to him and has, for example, say, some disease, he can, within twenty-four hours, cure the disease and stop the person's suffering. And he feels that even though he may be looking for God, that does not mean that he should let someone go on suffering if he can very easily stop it.

Prabhupāda: No, no, it is not I am talking of God. I am talking of the constitutional position of the living being. That is science. So just like the same example: the driver is different from the car, but when there is some defect in the car, we are not advising that don't take care of the car. But if you simply take care of the car and don't take care of the driver, that is the basic mistake of the civilization.

Psychiatrist (Hṛdayānanda): He's saying because this body can be used for intellectual advancement, therefore he's saying that sometimes people become so much concerned with intellectual things that they neglect their body.

Prabhupāda: It is not... It is beyond intellectual. The intellect also belong to the body. But understanding of the soul is beyond intellectual.

Room Conversation -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta:

Prabhupāda: Just make that Dr. Agarwala also interested.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, he can...

Prabhupāda: He is the also scientist, professor of physics.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: "Defects and Errors in Scientific Research," it will be a title and we will find out all the mistakes that normally found in scientific research. That will be written by Mādhava Prabhu.

Prabhupāda: And add "and how to make it perfect." Find out the defects. Don't be, what is called...?

Rūpānuga: Negative.

Prabhupāda: Negative only.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No, we want to bring the, our four defects in our sense perception.

Prabhupāda: Sense perception is defective.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, there are four defects.

Prabhupāda: And if you go beyond the sense perception, that is perfection.

Room Conversation with Reporter -- March 9, 1975, London:

Haṁsadūta: Have we found any problems or difficulty is bringing this teaching, which appears to have originated in India, to the West? Have we found any problem?

Prabhupāda: No, there cannot be any problem. Just like I am speaking to you. If you are sane man, you will have to admit this. The mistake you will have to admit, if you are a sane man. If you are something else, then you will not admit the mistake.

Reporter: Uh huh. But...

Prabhupāda: Now, the mistake is... You are talking with me; I am talking with you. Your body is there, my body. But which is important? Your body is important, or the force which is talking, that is important? Which is important?

Reporter: The force.

Prabhupāda: Just see. So who is giving? Where is the educational institution to give lesson about this living force? Is there any education all over the world?

Reporter: But you don't find that the fact that your monks are wearing robes or shaving their heads is a difficulty in the West, where not many people...

Prabhupāda: It is not the question of East and West. It is the question of human life. There is no question... The Western people also have this living force, and Eastern people also have this living force. So where is the difference, West and East? There is no question of West and East. It is the problem for the whole human society.

Room Conversation with Canadian Ambassador to Iran -- March 13, 1975, Iran:

Ambassador: Contaminated.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Just like if you contaminate some disease, then you must develop that disease. Similarly, if your mind is contaminated with some material designation, then you have to accept similar body, by nature's way. Kāranaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya (BG 13.22). Because the mind associated with a particular type of the modes of material nature, he got this body. There are three qualities: sattva-guṇa, raja-guṇa, tamo-guṇa. Now you mix up. By first mixing it becomes nine, and again mixing up, it becomes eighty-one. And each quality, there are thousands and thousands of variety. And that means by mixing up these qualities there are 8,400,000 species of forms of life. So it is very... God's law, nature's law, they take account of the particular color and awards the body accordingly. It is not man-made law, that there may be some mistake. There is no mistake. If you have contaminated this disease, either smallpox or cholera or this or that, you must develop that disease. Therefore we should be desireless. Desireless means material desire. That material desire begins with the designation. That... The child, he has got a childish body, and he plays like a child. The same child, when he will get a youthful body, he will do like that. The soul is the same. But on account of different type of body he is acting differently. That is practical. A small child, in the childhood he will talk like nonsense. People will enjoy it. But the same child, when he is grown up and he talks like nonsense, people will call him nonsense, rascal. Why? The body has changed. The circumstance has changed. This is the real education, that we are changing body, and according to our bodily situation we are acting differently. That they do not understand. There is no school, college or education about the soul and the soul's changing different position of different body, and in this way he remains materially entangled.

Room Conversation with Yoga Student -- March 14, 1975, Iran:

Atreya Ṛṣi: The attachment to the body...

Prabhupāda: No, attachment to the body is not bad. Just like you have got a nice car. So you have got attachment for it. But you must know that you are not the car. That everyone can... A child can understand. But because I have got attachment for something, it does not mean I am that thing. I have got attachment for so many things. That is natural. Anything I possess, I have got attachment. But that does not mean I am that thing. But here the mistake is that because we have got attachment for the body, I am identifying myself as the body. That is ignorance, illusion.

Young man: Yes, but one is egocentric... My egoism is very close to my body.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Everyone says "I am." But the mistake is: he is thinking "I am this body." That... When one is in knowledge, he understands that "I am not this body; I am spirit soul." The "I am" is there. But "I am" is now falsely identified with this body. That has to be cured. Then spiritual knowledge begins.

Young man: When one is aware of that fact, that he is not the body?

Prabhupāda: As soon as he come into knowledge.

Room Conversation with Yoga Student -- March 14, 1975, Iran:

Prabhupāda: By chanting, yes.

Lady: ...by chanting of worldly name, tuned on prayer...

Prabhupāda: That is not worldly name. Why do you mistake that? God's name is not worldly.

Lady: Because if you, if you really know the tuning of God...

Prabhupāda: Do you think Allah is wordly name?

Lady: We recognize that it is before Kṛṣṇa...

Prabhupāda: That's all right, you recognize it. Allah, Allah is not worldly name. It is given by the authority Muhammad so you have to chant it, who knows God.

Lady: But he didn't really mean Allah is the name of God.

Prabhupāda: If... Why do you say he didn't mean?

Lady: Because...

Prabhupāda: That is you say. Muhammad did not say that "What I say, I did not mean it."

Conversation with Devotees -- March 31, 1975, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: When the Deity was given to them, they could do anything.

Acyutānanda: Yes. 'Cause his son was all hopeless that "The ācārya is dead and my father is dead." He didn't know what to do. But they have written... They have pictures. They draw pictures of Śrīnāthjī on Govardhana, and Vallabhācārya is worshiping Him, all over.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That is a big... That's the reason. It's a big mistake. I had a discussion with one man. So I was stating that Mādhavendra Purī found this Deity, Gopāla, but their teaching is that Vallabhācārya found the Deity. I said, "No, Mādhavendra Purī handed the Deity over later on for worship, but it was he who found the Deity and originated the worship on Govardhana, and all the villagers..."

Prabhupāda: It has been confirmed in the court that this Deity belongs to Gauḍīya Vaiṣṇavas. There was big case amongst themselves, and the court gave judgement that "This Deity belongs to the Gauḍīya Vaiṣṇava."

Acyutānanda: Oh. When was that court case?

Prabhupāda: Say, about four, five years ago. No, about ten to fifteen years ago.

Morning Walk -- May 16, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: Latin, yes. People's vote. The people may be asses, but still, their votes will be taken, the vox populi. The fourth-class, fifth-class men, and they are giving vote. And the mistake is detected. Just like this Nixon was voted and the mistake was detected. But still, they follow the same process, vox populi. What is the value of the votes of the fourth-class, fifth-class men? Better one intelligent man, if he knows things, if he is liberated, if he says, "This is right," that should be taken. That is Vedic civilization. We are accepting Kṛṣṇa. We are not accepting the vox populi. One person, the Supreme, that's all. This is our process. We don't accept vox populi. All these Vedic literature are accepted not on the people's vote, but who is presenting? Vyāsadeva is presenting, Kṛṣṇa is presenting. Parāśara Muni is presenting. Therefore they are accepted. You cannot expect the mass of people very intelligent. That is not possible. So what is the value of their votes if they are not intelligent?

But in the Western countries this is the disease, vox populi. Socrates said there is soul, and he was killed because vox populi was against. Christ was killed because vox populi was against. This is the defect of the Western civilization. During the lifetime of Christ, nobody accepted. When he was killed, or crucified, then the other saintly persons, they gave their experience, what they learned from Jesus Christ. Christ could not give any words. Some sporadic words were there, and the Bible was made on that basis. Actually, the Bible is not the word, directly words of Christ.

Room Conversation with Journalist -- May 19, 1975, Melbourne:

Journalist: What about other artifacts of civilization like television and motorcars...

Prabhupāda: Yes, it is very good, just like we also use motorcar, but not for fashion. Suppose if we go for preaching. If we can go by car quickly, we take advantage of the car. We have got many cars for preaching work. So everything is good, provided it is used for progressive goodness. (coughs) That our mistake is that when... Now listen, there is the mistake in Darwin's theory also. He has no information that the evolution is taking place, of the body, by the desire of the soul. That he does not know. Just like sometimes people were happy and living in a small cottage. Now they are making big, big skyscraper building. So what is the difference? The cottage and this... The cottage is not becoming the skyscraper building but the man who was living in the cottage, by his desire the skyscraper building is coming. Similarly the evolution means the soul within the body desires a certain type of body and he gets it. Not that the monkey body has developed into human body.

Room Conversation with Dr. Copeland, Professor of Modern Indian History -- May 20, 1975, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: People call, that is another thing. That is the defect of the modern civilization, that vox populi. The people may be asses; still, their votes are accepted. The people are trained up as the fourth-class, fifth-class men, and their votes are appre... This is the defect of the modern... They are not trained up as first-class men, and still, their votes are accepted. Therefore, even a very advanced country, America, there was mistake, Nixon. They elected him president. Then they dragged him down. That is the mistake. Yes.

Dr. Copeland: Yes, yes.

Prabhupāda: They did not elect a first-class man, and later on, they could understand. So everywhere it is going on. Vox populi, the people, are less intelligent. They do not know whom to vote. And besides that, votes can be purchased. They do purchase by paying according to the country. So what is the value of this vote?

Dr. Copeland: Um, when...

Prabhupāda: Now, what is your opinion? A third-class, fourth-class man, if they vote, do you think it has any meaning?

Dr. Copeland: Well, I don't define the people first, second, third, and fourth class like you do, obviously.

Prabhupāda: You don't find? You don't find first person...?

Dr. Copeland: Well, I'm not as willing to judge other people. I'm not willing to say whether you're first, second, or third class, just as I'm not willing to say...

Prabhupāda: No. At least, you are educationist, you are professor. According to the modern society, you are one of the first-class men. Do you think your position and the lower class man, the same?

Morning Walks -- June 18-19, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: He is very intelligent.

Siddha-svarūpa: He speaks straight from his heart so you can... (break) ...that Yogi Bhajan's philosophy though. He wants everybody to come to the... (break)

Prabhupāda: ...is responsible for the mistake of the followers.

Siddha-svarūpa: Yes. So now he must have many leaflets printed up with this information about the prime minister's guru. But now it's out of date. It will be out of date. He will have to print new thing.

Prabhupāda: He was distributing leaflet like that?

Siddha-svarūpa: Yes, literature inviting people, you know, about the conference. (break) Is Cāṇakya Paṇḍita widely available in India?

Prabhupāda: That is not very important thing. It has nothing to do with spiritual..., but moral instruction.

Siddha-svarūpa: For kṣatriyas?

Prabhupāda: No, for everyone. You can get from India, Canakya Paṇḍita. It is called Cāṇakya-śloka, "Verses composed by Canakya," Cāṇakya-śloka. (break) ...western country, they have come to a stage in which by nature they are now seeking after some spiritual importance. And that is available in India. But these rascals, they are taking advantage of it and exploiting, this Guru Mahārāja, these yogis, these... But these people, western people, they are searching after this. So it is our duty especially to give them the right thing. They are searching after, and they are taking advantage of it and exploiting them. (break) ...is one of them.

Room Conversation with Dr. John Mize -- June 23, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: So we can see on equal level when (sic:) you become a brāhmaṇa. Brahma-bhūtaḥ, not in the United Nation, passing resolution and fight is going on outside, because they have no vision, samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu. So the politicians should be guided by the brāhmaṇas. That is social structure. Those who are first-class men in the spiritual understanding... Or the politicians, the administrators, they should take instruction from the brāhmaṇas and take part in politics. Then they will be also first-class men. You haven't got to drag him down again. First of all elect, and drag him down. This is mistake. Just like you elected Nixon president; again you dragged him down, because there was mistake. You do not know who to elect because you are not guided by brāhmaṇas. This is the fault. The whole society is being guided by the mle..., śūdras and some portion vaiśyas. Mostly śūdras and some certain percentage, mercantile. And no kṣatriya, no brāhmaṇa. Therefore, for the peaceful life in human society, there must be four divisions. Find out this verse, cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13).

Room Conversation with Dr. John Mize -- June 23, 1975, Los Angeles:

John Mize: They think there's a mind, but not a soul.

Prabhupāda: No, that's all right. Something is there which is working. Now that may be mistake. You call it soul or mind. That is next understanding. But the machine is not working independently. That should be understood first. Then how the machine is working that will be next chapter. So they have no understanding even that how the machine is working. Mūḍhā nābhijānāti mām ebhyaḥ param avyayam. Mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ sūyate sa-carācaram (BG 9.10). That they do not know, mūḍhas. So if you do not know how the machine is working then what is the value of your education? Education means enlightenment. You do not know what is the final cause, that huge body is working as nature, so many planets, so many big, big planets like sun, moon, they are floating in the air. Who has made this arrangement? They are... We see every day. They will never accept God is the original cause. That thing does not come to their brain. They are putting forward different theories and that is being accepted. One theory is accepted today, and tomorrow, "No, no, this is not. Here is another, advanced theory." That advanced means he does not know.

Garden Conversation with Professors -- June 24, 1975, Los Angeles:

Dr. Pore: Is it possible to find Kṛṣṇa in the Christian tradition or in Islam?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Oh yes. Why not? Christians are seeking after God. You are going to the church. "O God." You accept God has created everything. Here also He says, "Everything is My energy." Where is the difference?

Dr. Pore: The Christians describe Kṛṣṇa in a different way. Are they making mistakes?

Prabhupāda: That is... Just like the heat, the question of energy, the heat 93,000,000's miles away from the sun, heat may be different, and in the sun-globe the heat may be different. But the heat is there; and light is there. The same thing: heat and light is the same, but the degree of presentation of heat and light may be different.

Dr. Pore: Is chanting absolutely necessary in the knowing...

Prabhupāda: That is the easiest way of being directly in touch with God. Because God and God's name, they are absolute, so your chanting the name of God means that directly in touch with God.

Morning Walk -- June 25, 1975, Los Angeles:

Jayatīrtha: That's a good idea for devotees to give to their parents. (break)

Dr. Judah: ...it has many imperfections of which I am well aware. Mistakes that I hope in another edition can be corrected.

Prabhupāda: But many parents are very happy because their...

Dr. Judah: Yes.

Room Conversation -- June 26, 1975, Los Angeles:

Devotee (2): Wait. I am not speaking with you. He said he did that and he did it in the name of his authority as a sannyāsa. So if you say, Prabhupāda, that everything that they say is absolutely true, then they will have absolute power and can do anything that they want, and anything that they say and any opinion they express is taken to be the same as yours, then it becomes implied that you agree with and condone such things, because they do them with absolute license. And we don't believe that to be true. So we think it is some kind of mistake.

Prabhupāda: They say like that?

Devotee (1): Everyone says like that.

Devotee (2): They do, Prabhupāda.

Satsvarūpa: No, they don't. Śrīla Prabhupāda has said these things don't apply to you. Don't worry about them because you are not following the principles.

Devotee (1): But they do say, and we are following and you don't know what we're doing, Satsvarūpa, because you haven't known me for two years. So you really don't know what I'm doing. You're not around.

Satsvarūpa: But our society is going nicely. It's not...

Devotee (2): In some respects it's going fine. But these are problems which can be dealt with amongst us, and they are affecting all of us. And for some people these are problems though they may not be for you. I think, as far as I know, your conduct has always been very honorable. But for some people who it's not and where these misconceptions apply, it's a real problem and we're trying to deal with it because it affects our lives.

Upendra: The strength to deal with those problems comes from following sādhanācāra.

Devotee (2): We are also attempting to follow sādhanācāra. And if we are imperfect...

Prabhupāda: Anyway, if he has said so, that is wrong.

Morning Walk -- July 3, 1975, Denver:

Brahmānanda: I was reading that in order to go to the moon, it took ten years and the cost was 25 billion dollars.

Prabhupāda: Just see how foolish they are. And again they are trying. Punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). Chewing the chewed. This is their business. Horrible civilization.

Kāśīrāma: Mistaking suffering for happiness.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Ambarīṣa: They are always trying to look for the bright side, but there is no bright side.

Prabhupāda: Just like north of Sweden, there is no sunrise?

Brahmānanda: No.

Prabhupāda: So where is bright side? Where is bright side? Vedic injunction is tamasi mā jyotir gama: "Don't remain in this darkness; go to the bright world." Jyotir gama. (break) ...to create some bright side. He will not be allowed to enjoy it. He will have to die. So where is your bright side? (break) ...for preparing?

Brahmānanda: For the moon? 25 billion dollars.

Prabhupāda: So again I am trying to go another planet. Where is the guarantee that it will be successful?

Brahmānanda: On the contrary, if they failed once, then we should think that they would fail again.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is animalism. A dog is coming, and you show him some stick or beat him. He will go away for the time being. Again he will come. That is dog. He doesn't get lesson by one. Therefore it is called punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). Repeating the same thing again and again. That is animalism.

Room Conversation with Mr. & Mrs. Wax, Writer and Editing Manager of Playboy Magazine -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda: They are trying to dominate the material nature, the so-called scientists. But they do not know that they are under the domination of material nature. They are forgetting that. If you are more powerful, if you are dominating me, how I can dominate you? That they do not know, that we are under the domination of material nature. Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi (BG 13.9). The domination is manifest by four things: birth, death, old age, and disease. I cannot dominate my birth, death, old age, and disease and I am trying to dominate over nature. Just foolishness. Big, big scientist, did he dominate over death, Professor Einstein? Did not he die? Why he could not find out any means that he will not die? What is the meaning of the science? If you are dominated by the laws of material nature, how you are thinking that you shall dominate over material nature? When death comes can you dominate? "No, no, I am scientist. Just wait." No, you must die immediately. So where is your domination? You are dominated by material nature. That is the mistake of the present society, that everyone is being dominated by the material nature and the so-called scientist is trying to dominate over material nature. How it is possible? Therefore it is said,

daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī

mama māyā duratyayā

mām eva ya prapadyante

māyām etāṁ taranti te

(BG 7.14)

Find out this verse. (aside:) Just wait. (gets up and leaves room) (pause) (break) So you have read that verse, daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī?

Morning Walk -- July 10, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda: (chuckles) That is fact. She is prostitute, that's all. If you classify, then she is prostitute. (laughter) That's all. There is no other way.

Jayatīrtha: " 'Is that,' asked a male reporter, 'what is wrong with Mrs. Indira Gandhi?' The Swami hedged." Then actually they made a mistake. " 'I cannot say. I would be arrested.' " That was actually a misquote. (Prabhupāda laughs)

Brahmānanda: Well, it's the idea, though.

Jayatīrtha: Yeah. "The Swami now lives in Los Angeles, and he trains his followers there. Their income is from sales of his books, magazines and incense. He says he has about ten thousand followers. 'We do not have so many,' he said..."

Prabhupāda: The inner meaning is there: "I shall be arrested."

Brahmānanda: Yes. (laughs) That shows what is the position.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- July 12, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prabhupāda: That is another nonsense. That is also speculation. (laughter) "Because I have failed, therefore there is no knowledge." This is also imperfect because how I can conclude like that? I am imperfect. I cannot decide this way or that way. So that is also. Vedic knowledge says that a conditioned soul has got four defects: illusion, mistake, imperfectness and cheating. Any conditioned soul. Even Brahma, he is receiving knowledge from Kṛṣṇa. Tene brahma hṛdā ya ādi-kavaye (SB 1.1.1). Ādi-kavi means Brahma. He is the most perfect person within this universe, Lord Brahma. So he is also receiving knowledge from Kṛṣṇa. Any conditioned soul, beginning from Brahmā down to the ant, they are defective in four ways: illusion, mistake, imperfectness and cheating. They know that "I am imperfect." Just this Darwin. He knew that he is imperfect, and he cheated so many persons—by false theory, which he cannot explain. He simply gives, "Perhaps millions of years' gap...," this, that. That is not knowledge. So the imperfect person is prone to become a cheater. So we should not take knowledge from the cheaters. What do you think?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: We should take knowledge from Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Conversation with Professor Hopkins -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prof. Hopkins: So it's the mistake... The mistake of the impersonalist then is to identify the complete reality with Brahman, which is only one aspect of the complete reality.

Prabhupāda: Just like finger. Finger is one of the item of the whole body. You can't say, "Yes, the finger is my body," because the finger is not the whole body. Similarly, everything is part and parcel of the whole but that does not mean that everything is whole.

Prof. Hopkins: And these realities are in a hierarchy in the sense that Brahman, Paramātman...

Prabhupāda: Brahman is everything. Brahman is also māyā Brahman, (indistinct) is Brahman. Śabda idaṁ khalv brahman. Because it is the manifestation of Brahman. Brahman's energy. Just like here in this room. Daytime there is sun, but sun is ninety three miles away; ninety three millions miles. But where there is sunshine we can say, "Here is sun."

Prof. Hopkins: So that the problem is not the identification of everything with Brahman, which is correct, but the failure to realize that there is the Paramātmā or the Puruṣottama.

Prabhupāda: Supreme Person.

Prof. Hopkins: Which is beyond this and includes...

Prabhupāda: Just like I have got so many branches, hundred branches. So everyone knows that I am something, but that does not mean I am present everywhere. My student(?) has got this tape..., hundreds of thousands of tape recorders to record my speech and then you speak the same thing that I am speaking, but I am not there. And that is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā.

Press Conference -- July 16, 1975, San Francisco:

Bhaktadāsa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, one press man wanted to know what is this Rathayātrā festival? Why is it going on over here in the western world?

Prabhupāda: Well, that is the mistake. If God is the proprietor of everything, He is also proprietor of the western world. Is there any dispute? If we say, "God is the proprietor of the western world," what is the wrong there? Is there anything wrong? Who will answer this.

Jayatīrtha: Nothing wrong.

Prabhupāda: So if the western world has forgotten God and He comes to remind him, where is the wrong?

Reporter (3): Is that the significance, then, of the festival, to remind people of God?

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. This is the significance. Jagannātha. Jagannātha. Jagat means the whole universe, and natha means the lord or the proprietor.

Room Conversations -- July 26, 1975, Laguna Beach:

Prabhupāda: But everyone wants sunshine. Why in one place denied, and one place there is sunshine? You are not free. Even though you want sunshine, there is no sunshine. So how you feel free? You bring sunshine. But that is not happening. There is superior arrangement. So to accept that superior arrangement, that is real business, not to declare freedom falsely. That is not possible. If I say, "I am free from the law-abiding process, law given by government; I am free from the law of the government," that is not possible. If you become outlaw, then you will be arrested and put into jail. So what is the use of declaring that "I am free from the government laws"? There is no freedom. Whatever little freedom is given to us, if you utilize it properly, that is very nice. If we unnecessarily declare that "I am free from any obligation," that is madman's proposal. That is the mistake of the modern man, that, especially in the Western countries, unnecessarily they are declaring freedom in so many ways. Unnecessarily. He is not free, but he is declaring. That is described in Caitanya-caritāmṛta, I think, or in some other. No? Prema-vivarta. Yes, there is a book, Prema-vivarta

piśācī paile yena mati-cchanna haya

māyā-grasta jīvera se daśā upajāya

The freedom is declared by persons who are completely under the clutches of māyā. He declares freedom. And he is so much haunted by the ghost māyā that he thinks his bondage as freedom. Just like a drug-addicted person or drunkard. He is thinking, "I am free." He lies down on the street sometimes in madness: "Who can forbid me?" You have seen madmen lying on the street... I have seen it, all traffic stopped. So this kind of freedom has no meaning. It is involving oneself with the strict laws of māyā. There is no freedom. And just like a child. If he becomes free from the parents, it is not good; it is dangerous. His life is at risk. If a child without the help of the parents go on the street, is... That freedom is nice? That kind of freedom. Therefore Kṛṣṇa says that "Whatever little freedom you have got, just surrender that freedom to Me." Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ (BG 18.66). (to someone:) You can come forward.

Press Conference at Airport -- July 28, 1975, Dallas:

Prabhupāda: Well, we are not very much concerned with political situation. But our proposition is—either political, social, economical or philosophical, anything—without Kṛṣṇa, it is all zero. So far Mrs. Gandhi is concerned, she is inclined to some spiritual understanding. So actually if she becomes very advanced spiritually, then this emergency situation will improve. Otherwise... and it is the public opinion against democracy. So democracy is not very much beneficial anywhere and everywhere. In your country also, you voted Mr. Nixon, democracy, but you were not satisfied with him. That means democracy, ordinary men they select somebody and again they try to bring him down. Why? When he was selected, it means it was a mistake. So according to Vedic civilization, there was no such thing as democracy. It was monarchy, but the monarchy means the king was very highly spiritually advanced. The king was called rājarṣi, means king, at the same time, saintly person. We have got another example in our country-Gandhi. When he was political leader, he was practically dictator, but because he was a man of very high moral character, people took him, accepted him as the dictator. So dictatorship is good, provided the dictator is highly qualified spiritually. That is the Vedic verdict. The battle of Kurukṣetra was there because Lord Kṛṣṇa wanted rājarṣi, Yudhiṣṭhira, should be on the head. So the king is supposed to be the representative of God. So he must be a godly person. Then it will be successful. That's all right. (end)

Room Conversation -- July 31, 1975, New Orleans:

Prabhupāda: The perfect civilization, Kṛṣṇa has giving idea, there must be first-class, second-class, third-class, fourth-class \en. And less than fourth-class, fifth-class. So, first-class man is described, śamo damaḥ tapaḥ śaucaṁ kṣāntir ārjavam, these are the qualifications, second-class these are the qualifications, third-class, fourth-class. So there are different varieties of men, so divide them according to the instruction of Bhagavad-gītā, then whole human society will be... There are four division of your body—the head division, the arm division, the belly division, the leg division. If you engage the head for walking, that is mistake, and if you engage the leg for thinking, that is mistake. Similarly, there are different types of men, combine together, and it will be nice body, the leg will walk, the hand will protect, the head will give instruction, and the belly will get energy by eating food. Those divisions are required. Not that everyone is all. No, there must be division of labor. So that is described, how to make civilization perfect, who is going to hear and take it. Cātur varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). If you can adjust things, you can utilize things, then everything will be useful. And if you do not know how to utilize things, then everything will be useless. Take instruction from Bhagavad-gītā and make everything useful. Then the human society will be perfect. Otherwise you'll go on manufacturing ideas, you'll never be successful. Because nature's law is working, you cannot interfere with the nature's law. That is not possible. You may think yourself very much advanced in science, but nature's law, you cannot interfere. Just like now there is movement, man and woman, equal.

Morning Walk -- August 6, 1975, Detroit:

Ādi-keśava: In this country, when they had the slavery, the masters were not qualified either.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the defect. That is the defect. Either the master is defective or the servant is defective or the system is defective. That is material world. Doṣa-catuḥsthānī, four faults: mistake, illusion, cheating, and imperfectness. (break) ...the struggle for existence—one mistake after one mistake, one illusion after one, one imperfectness after another. Like that, it is going on. (break)

Mādhavānanda: It's our duty in society to show everyone how to work for Kṛṣṇa and become happy in life.

Prabhupāda: That is yajña. To work for Kṛṣṇa means yajña. Yajñarthe karma: "For yajña, performing yajña, one has to work." To work for Kṛṣṇa means yajña. That is performance of yajña. (break) ...Communistic idea is borrowing this idea from... But because they are imperfect, they have made center, state. And because it is imperfect, it is not successful. They have made center the state. (break) Tamo-guṇa means laziness and sleep. The śūdras, they are in laziness and sleep. So if they have got something to eat, they will not work. Laziness. Or eat more and sleep. This is tamo-guṇa. And rajo-guṇa means they are working for sense gratification. That is also useless. Tamo-guṇa is laziness and sleeping, and rajo-guṇa means working foolishly or for sense gratification. And sattva-guṇa means they know how to work. And therefore above this sattva-guṇa they become devotee, work for Kṛṣṇa. So without working for Kṛṣṇa, everyone is under the spell of these modes of material nature. And there is no training how to work for Kṛṣṇa. That is the defect of modern civilization.

Morning Walk -- August 27, 1975, Vrndavana:

French devotee (2): If a devotee step on the ant, does the ant receive some benefit?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

French devotee (2): If a devotee step on a ant by mistake, the ant...

Prabhupāda: You should be careful. Why should you commit mistake? But if unconsciously, by mistake it is done, that is another thing.

Brahmānanda: He wants to know does the ant receive benefit?

Prabhupāda: No. Then he will be lenient to kill them to give them benefit. (laughter) He'll be so...

Brahmānanda: Like they say "mercy killing," that "This is good for you. I will kill you and it is good for you."

Prabhupāda: Yes. You should always think that you are responsible for its killing. But it may be Kṛṣṇa may excuse you. That is another thing. Consciously you cannot kill.

Morning Walk -- September 29, 1975, Ahmedabad:

Prabhupāda: There are so many.

Indian man (2): "And he comes only because of that woman. Otherwise he is not willing to be your personal writer. So I have complained." Then Gandhiji said, "All right, when did you know it?" So she said, "I was thinking for the three months, but fifteen days before I came." "All right, Mahadeva, you come here. You will fast for fifteen days." And one week later (indistinct) Mahadeva Desai was that he wanted food very badly. So after seven days he was about to die. Then that woman, wife, came again, "Mahārāja I made a mistake. I made a complaint. All right. But now this man will die and where I will go?" (indistinct) "Then why have you made a complaint? So you can take off for seven days but you fast for seven days." So he is relieved.

Prabhupāda: One—there are so many cases. This Lilavati Munshi, this is the same thing. You know that? There is a big history behind this.

Kartikeya: The failures are due to some basic reason. All the big people have failed, and they have not been able to deliver the country or anything because their moral character...

Prabhupāda: No, no, even they have delivered the country, these physical elements you cannot avoid. You cannot avoid unless you are on the transcendental platform, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So long you are on the physical platform, you cannot avoid. It is impossible. (Hindi) Gandhiji... (Hindi)... mistake. (Hindi) "And physical? Oh, you have done this? Fifteen days fasting."

Morning Walk -- October 2, 1975, Mauritius:

Brahmānanda: In the Bible there are so many things that were... about the world that were mistakes, and then, by their scientific knowledge, they found the real fact. Like they say the earth was flat...

Prabhupāda: Bible may be wrong, but we are talking generally. So if you are scientist, you can say the right thing. But why should you deny God?

Brahmānanda: Well, if the book of God has made mistake, then we don't have any faith...

Prabhupāda: Book of God... Then throw it. Kick it out. But I say that you are scientist. How you can deny God? That is our propaganda. The so-called book of God, you throw away. But you are scientist. How can you deny the existence of God? Why you are misleading? Bible misleading, that's all right. Why you are misleading? That is our point.

Morning Walk -- October 2, 1975, Mauritius:

Indian man (3): But our country depends upon sugar.

Prabhupāda: No, that is mistake. Your country, you can produce your own food. That's all. Why you should depend? You produce food grains. You produce milk. Then your all necessities is supplied. Why should you produce unnecessarily?

Brahmānanda: Here they use powdered milk because they have no cows.

Prabhupāda: Just see. And here even by this sugarcane, what is called? Upper part? This part?

Indian man (1): We call it ag.(?)

Prabhupāda: Ag, yes. You can maintain thousand of cows.

Indian man (1): But that's actually best food, you know. In Punjab they use that. They store it for a year.

Prabhupāda: But you do not know how to be happy.

Press Conference -- October 2, 1975, Mauritius:

Guest (2) (Indian man): What was the necessity of creating this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement?

Prabhupāda: Necessity is that the human form of life is meant for advanced education. Unfortunately, they are being educated to live like animals. That is the mistake. So we want to correct this mistake.

Guest (2): But the spiritual organizations in India, all the spiritual teachings in India, have always put great emphasis on the fact that we are spiritual beings. So what was the necessity of creating another movement to say the same things?

Prabhupāda: No. We are... You have brought in the question of India. We are talking of the human society, so why you are bringing India? We are not talking about India only. Human being does not mean only Indian. You see, human being—all, outside India, inside India, everywhere. Wherever there is human being, they require this education. And it is the India's duty. Because India has got the opportunity to be spiritually advanced by the grace of learned, saintly persons, so they should first of all make their life perfect by taking education and distribute the knowledge throughout the whole world. That is India's mission.

Morning Walk -- Durban, October 13, 1975 :

Harikeśa: Scientists are always doing that. They’re always saying that.

Prabhupāda: Therefore they’re all nonsense.

Harikeśa: “Last year we made a mistake. Now it's all right.”

Prabhupāda: "Now we advance." And what is the guarantee that it is all right? You will advance again. That means you are always incorrect.

Harikeśa: But people always think that it's always getting better.

Prabhupāda: Therefore they are rascals. This is called māyā. They remain rascal; still, they think that they are advancing.

Harikeśa: Nobody thinks about that point, nobody.

Prabhupāda: If everyone is rascal, how he will think? We say mūḍha, all rascals.

Room Conversation with Reporter of The Star -- October 16, 1975, Johannesburg:

Prabhupāda: He...? He has not seen his father. That is my reply. Now, the person whom he accepted as his father, he is lying there on the bed. And now he is crying that "My father has gone." That means he has not seen his father. So this is going on. The whole world movement is on the basic principle of that living force which makes the body so important. Either a politician or a philosopher or a scientist, so long the living force is there, the body is important. And as such, the living force is gone, then it is simply a lump of matter. So we are taking care of this lump of matter, not of the living force. This is the mistake of the whole civilization. We do not know what is that living force. There is no scientist, there is no philosopher, nothing of the sort. Simply as child we cry, "Oh, my father has gone away. My father has gone." Why did you not see who is your father or who is your son? Where is that education? Where is that enlightenment? Where is that university? Therefore I say the whole civilization is being misdirected. They do not know what is the important factor in civilization.

Room Conversation with Reporter of The Star -- October 16, 1975, Johannesburg:

Reporter: But what message would you give to people in terms of helping people, perhaps, to live better lives?

Prabhupāda: Yes. But if the basic principle is wrong, then all their plans for becoming happy is also wrong. So he does not know what is the important factor. So when he comes to know that he is not this body, he is spirit soul—he studies what is the nature of the spirit soul, what is the necessity of the spirit soul—then he becomes happy. If he is under misconception... Suppose if I take you, Mr. Singer, as the coat, and I take care of the coat and not of you, person, then is that very good proposal? So that is going on. They are taking care of the shirt and coat, not the person who is putting on the shirt and coat. This is the mistake of the modern civilization. And the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is an attempt to correct it, not theoretically, but by scientifically, by philosophically, economically, religiously, everything. Therefore we have got so many books. We are trying to distribute, enlighten people. This is our business. Then people will be happy. Unless one who knows "what I am, and what is my business, what is my aim of life," then how he can be happy? Just like a dog is jumping here and there, here and there, but he does not know what is the aim of life, so if we do not come to the spiritual platform, that we remain animal like cats and dogs, then what is the civilization of cats and dogs? If you keep the dogs as dog and if you ask some of them to come together and make a peace formula, is it possible the dogs will be able to make any peace formula? Because they are dogs, they will go on barking. That's all. So we are attempting so many peace formula, but we are keeping the consciousness on the body, exactly like the dog. And therefore there is no peace. There cannot be any peace. First of all you must come to the real platform, the living force, what is that spirit soul, what is the necessity, what is the aim. That you do not know.

Room Conversation with Reporter of The Star -- October 16, 1975, Johannesburg:

Reporter: Your Grace, a great many of South Africa's church leaders from some of the big churches are fearful that South Africa is going to find itself in a situation, or find... What message would you give this country in terms of avoiding any...

Prabhupāda: No, I am going to every country because everywhere the same mistake is going on, bodily concept of life. So I am trying to bring them to the real life and then make their plan. They will be happy. It is not for South Africa. For any Africa, or any country, South America or South India or anywhere. The problem is the same. Everywhere the same conception: "I am South African." "I am American." "I am Indian." "I am this." "I am that." So all these things are on the bodily concept of life. Nobody says, "No, I am not this body. I am different from body." Nobody says. We are simply preaching that "You are not this body. You are different from this..." That is our unique situation. Perhaps throughout the whole world we are trying to preach that "You are not this body. You are different from body." And we have not manufactured this idea.

Morning Walk -- October 28, 1975, Nairobi:

Girl devotee (1): Yes. Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes. You know? What is that? Argumentum vaculum? Hm? With fools and rascals, with animals, there is no logic. Take the stick and beat them. The dog, if he is a dog, what is the argument with him? Take the stick and beat him; then he will go away. That is called argumentum baculum. That is, Sanskrit logic, also said, murkhasya laṭau śādhi (?) "One who is a fool, his only remedy is beating him with stick." This is material. But we are not doing anything material. It is all spiritual. Therefore, especially in this age, Caitanya Mahāprabhu,

tṛṇād api sunīcena

taror api sahiṣṇunā

amāninā mānadena

kīrtanīyaḥ (sadā hariḥ)

(CC Adi 17.31)

So we should preach like this, any rascal, because anyone who has no information of Kṛṣṇa, who is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he's a rascal. That's all. That we must know. That is definite. There is no mistaking it. But if you say that "You are rascal. There is no mistaking it," then you cannot preach. If you directly call a rascal a rascal, he'll be angry. Murkhāyopadeśo hi prakopāya na śanta...: To give good instruction to a fool rascal will increase his anger, that's all."

Morning Walk -- November 1, 1975, Nairobi:

Jñāna: If I eat a lot I become fat. If I stop eating I become thin.

Prabhupāda: You stupid, you eat so much, but God is not stupid. He is conscious perfectly. He has nothing to eat. Still, He can grow. That is the difference between me and God. You don't require to eat even. There are many saintly persons they do not eat. How they are working? Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī was not eating. He was... Every alternate day he was, little butter, so much. That's all, not daily. Every alternate day. So actually we do not require to eat. Eating, sleeping, sex and defense—this is bodily necessities. But you are not this body. When you come to the spiritual platform there is no necessity of these four principles. So that is your mistake, that you are thinking, "God has got a body like me. He requires eating for nourishing it." That is your foolishness. Aṅgāni yasya sakalendriya-vṛttimanti. His body is so made that He can perform any limb's work by another limb. Just like we can see with the eyes. As soon as close the eyes, we cannot see. But Kṛṣṇa can see by His ear. As soon as you pray to Kṛṣṇa, immediately He sees you, "Oh, here is My devotee," by hearing the sound of your prayer.

Morning Walk -- November 2, 1975, Nairobi:

Brahmānanda: If they set a bad example, then they will follow bad example, then the criticism of the Indians will be justified.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That's it. So those who cannot follow, they should not come here. And ask from the origin that "Those who cannot strictly follow the rules and regulations, they should not come at all. It will set a bad example. They should be forbidden to come here." That I was speaking, that instead of filling with bad cows, better keep the cowshed vacant. That I was speaking. Those who cannot strictly follow our principles, they should not come here. It is bad example. By mistake, if somebody does, he should be regretful and he should rectify. That is another thing. But not willingly he should neglect. Then such person is not required at all.

Morning Walk -- November 3, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, why you should be misled?

Dr. Patel: Now we are going to lead them. Are you not leading them?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Your forefathers might have been misled, but why you will commit the same mistake again?

Dr. Patel: Now we have improved upon the mistake and we are leading them, and we will lead them.

Prabhupāda: No, that is not the fact. These boys, European, American boys, they were misled from the very beginning of their life, but how they are improving in spiritual consciousness? The thing is we are not prepared to take up our own culture. That is...

Dr. Patel: That's right, sir. God must have some, something to fulfill.

Prabhupāda: Take for example our big leader, Mahātmā Gandhi. He was supposed to be very good scholar in Bhagavad-gītā. Did he ever preach that "You are not this body?"

Dr. Patel: I come from the ashram. Yes, he did.

Prabhupāda: Then where is the question of nationalism?

Dr. Patel: He never says... When he went to England...

Prabhupāda: Then why he asked the Europeans to go out? "Quit India."

Morning Walk -- November 4, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Huh? Death? He's already dead. What you can bring? Rascal, don't you see that he is already dead? If you have to bring something you have to bring life. Death is already there. (dog barking, woman yelling) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. (break) Bhāgavata has analyzed, yasyātmā-buddhi kunape tri-dhātuke. And this is the beginning of mistake, taking this body as everything and then bodily issues, bodily... Sva-dhiḥ kalātrādiṣu. And because I have got relation with some woman... There are thousands and millions of women, but because I have got bodily relation with some woman, I am so much attracted. That is due to the body. Actually I am not attracted to the woman. There are many millions of women, but that particular woman, wife, because I have got bodily relation with her, I think, "Oh, she is mine." Sva-dhiḥ kalātrādiṣu. Kalātrādiṣu, beginning from kalātra, then go on—children, grandchildren, father-in-law, mother-in-law, this one, this one. The beginning is the kalātra. If there is no kalātra, there is no father-in-law, mother-in-law. So sva-diḥ kalātrādiṣu. Then bhauma idya-dhiḥ—"This is my country. I am national," "I am American," "I am Indian," "I am this." Why? The body has grown from this land. You see, every, the whole world activities is going on on this basis. Sva-dhiḥ kalātrādiṣu bhauma idya-dhiḥ. Idya. Idya means worshipable. The brain is full with this idea, dhiḥ. Dhiḥ means buddhi. The brain is congested with all these ideas.

Morning Walk -- November 14, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: But what you can see, rascal? Therefore we say you are rascals. Why do you believe your eyes? You cannot see so many things. We don't find any living entity in the ocean. Does it mean there is no living entity? So what is the value of your seeing? That is the defect. They believe in too much their eyes. Although eyes are... Every sense is imperfect. You can see here: "Oh, we don't find anything. It is all zero." Does it mean the sky is zero? There are millions of planets and millions of living entities. So that is their rascaldom. They think that they are perfect. Whatever they see, that is perfect. That is their mistake. If I say, "No, there is no life. I cannot see," is that very good statement? And in the..., externally you don't find any living entity, but is it void of living entities? Then why shall I assert that "There is no living... I cannot see"? Is that very good proposal? Therefore they are rascals. There cannot be any place within this universe which is without life. There cannot be. We see there is life even within sand. How you can say there is no life? "Because I cannot see." What is this argument? What you are? You are a rascal. Because you cannot see, therefore we have to accept? First of all we say you are rascal. And if he says that "I cannot see," is it to be accepted? And the example is there. "I cannot see any life. It is simply water." But there are millions and trillions of life, big, big fish. Where is your perfection of seeing?

Morning Walk -- December 10, 1975, Vrndavana:

Indian man: Women are subordinate.

Prabhupāda: Not subordinate actually. The occupations are different. It does not mean... That is another mistake. Just like the leg is walking, and the head is directing, so although the occupation is different, both of them are important. We require the head and leg also. If simply head is there, if there is no leg, then who'll walk? This is the understanding, not equal. Everyone must have his separate duties to serve the whole. That is the arrangement. This is real understanding. The most important part of the body is head, but that does not mean the leg is not important. Leg is important in its work, and head is important in its work. So we require both, head and tail both, not that simply leg or simply head. But when we make comparative study, we can understand that head is more important than the leg. If you cut your leg, you can live, but if you cut your head, you'll die. Therefore the conclusion is: head is more important than the leg. Comparative study. Otherwise head is also required and leg is also required. You collect some flowers, nice flowers, and, add with it some green foliage, it becomes more beautiful. Simply flower is not so beautiful. When it is arrayed with some green foliage, then it becomes more beautiful. So we have to take in that sense. But comparatively, the flower is more important than the foliage. But the both of them are required.

Morning Walk -- December 14, 1975, New Delhi:

Devotee: ...is starting to sell, to make more money. It's not very big (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: No. He has done a mistake so he wants to rectify it. He wants to bring money, (chuckles) but if the money is lost, it is lost, let him come back. What is there? A life saved is more important than save the money. So if I could know the address... (to passerby) Hare Kṛṣṇa! Then I could write.

Bhāgavata: Well, we can... Revatīnandana, I think is staying in the, by Los Angeles, right near San Diego. San Diego or... I thinks it's San Diego or that other one, Laguṇa Beach.

Prabhupāda: So I wanted to write him a letter.

Bhāgavata: Revatīnandana might be able to give you the address.

Prabhupāda: (greets a man in Hindi) Jaya! Ha. Vṛndāvana hogya. No, if you know Revatīnandana's address, he can forward.

Morning Walk -- December 24, 1975, Bombay:

Indian man (3): Then how can you avoid that, because conflict takes place.

Prabhupāda: No, it will be, there will be no more material duty. When you wash the shoes of your son, that is love, that is not a shoe washer; you don't remain a shoe washer. You remain in love with your child. Hm? A mother takes care of the child, washes, when he passes stool, that does not mean she becomes maṭharāṇī (sweeper woman). Maṭharāṇī is material. But when the mother out of love washes the child, she is not maṭharāṇī, she is Rādhārāṇī. (everyone laughs) And if you conclude, "Ah, she is washing the stool of the son. She is maṭharānī," that is your mistake. She remains Rādhārāṇī. Just like Mother Yaśodā is binding Kṛṣṇa, that does not mean that His supremacy is lost. The Mother Yaśodā is binding; He still remains the supreme. Therefore Mother Yaśodā became exhausted to try to bind Him. (laughs) And when Kṛṣṇa saw that "My mother is perspiring now, she is exhausted," "All right, let Me agree to be bound up by her." (pause) That's not a fact, otherwise how Kṛṣṇa says, "Anyone who is engaged in My devotional service, sa guṇān samatītyaitān brahma-bhūyāya kalpate (BG 14.26)." So this is a mistake to say that devotional service is saguṇa. (indistinct) Huh? These are one gentleman came to talk with me? Saurabha: About the apartment? Prabhupāda: Yes. (end)