Prabhupāda: Everything mismanaged, cheating.
Harikeśa: So until the top man is Kṛṣṇa conscious, this cheating will basically continue.
Prabhupāda: Who is the top man? Everyone is top man. Instead of one king, now you have got one hundred kings. The minister, the secretaries, the under-secretaries, the deputy minister, and so on, so on, so on. So there was only one unfortunate king. Now you have got three dozen kings, and you have to maintain them like kings. This is going on.
Harikeśa: They can pay them with their phony money.
Prabhupāda: And they are seeking this post because they know that without doing anything, money will come. That's all. And as soon as you approach some minister, he will ask you, "All right, give me an application." And after six months' reminding, he will say, "No, it is not possible."
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Because so many people have to apply for any one post. That's a fact. Then he will put his son there.
Prabhupāda: All rogues and thieves.
Harikeśa: So actually it is not possible to change the...
Prabhupāda: Change—if they become Kṛṣṇa conscious.
Harikeśa: But the system itself is defective. How can...
Prabhupāda: No, the defective will be correct when you become Kṛṣṇa conscious. Just like in your past life you had so many defects. Now it is corrected. That is practical.
Harikeśa: Let's say somebody is a minister...
Harikeśa: ...but his occupation is cheating.
Prabhupāda: That's all right. Let him become Kṛṣṇa conscious. He will stop this cheating business.
Harikeśa: But he has to stop.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Rājarṣi.
Prabhupāda: Yes. He has to stop. It will be stopped as soon as he becomes a devotee.
Harikeśa: So then gradually it will become the varṇāśrama, with the one central head.
Harikeśa: So we don't try to make a revolutionary system.
Prabhupāda: This is revolution.
Harikeśa: We try to just make them Kṛṣṇa conscious, then it's automatic revolution.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Peaceful revolution. Other revolution will not stand. (break) (in car) ...perfect philosophy.
Harikeśa: Your method is also the perfect method, the books in the colleges and libraries, educated people and... Wonderful. Actually, you have set everything up to do this.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Everything is spoken by Kṛṣṇa. I am simply putting them for modern man's understanding. That's all.
Prabhupāda: Because they cannot understand, they think, "Dogmatic." It is not dogmatic. Most scientific.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But they're all dull-brained. Satisfied with a few scraps, work like dogs. Would you like to walk here, Śrīla Prabhupāda?
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: This place is okay?
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: It's very close to the temple.
Harikeśa: Nobody plays golf that early in the morning?
Prabhupāda: (break)...they have to manage, and the vaiśyas will produce, and brāhmaṇa will give the brain. Then the society will be peace... And at the present moment these śūdras, they are, by artificial votes, they are becoming the brain of the society. How it can be happy? The rascals, they are voted to the legislative assembly, and they are passing every day law which is never perfect. This is going on.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Stopgap measures.