Chemical (Conversations 1975)

Expressions researched:
"chemical" |"chemically" |"chemicals"

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- January 27, 1975, Tokyo:

Prabhupāda: And others, other atheist in the dress of very good sannyāsī, they say jagad mithyā, mithyā. But they say also, brahma satya, they accept Brahmān. They are not so atheist, at least they accept. Then?

Nitāi: Jagad āhur anīśvaram (BG 16.8).

Prabhupāda: Ah, jagad āhur anīśvaram (BG 16.8). There is no God, it has come automatically by interaction. But even it is so, how the interaction is taking place? That is intelligence. Interaction, just like acid and alkali. Just like oil and caustic soda. These are two chemicals and mixing them, interaction, the result is soap. Accepting this principle, but there must be a mixer, a person who is mixing. Otherwise, how the soap and oil is being mixed? The soap is there and the oil is there and the caustic soda is also there, that is material ingredient. But they are not coming together automatically. That is not possible. Where is the evidence? There are so many soap factories, and let them keep oil and caustic soda and there is no question of labor, let them become soap. Where is that evidence? But these rascals say like that. Aparaspara sambhūtam. Interaction of the two things. But where is the interaction of two things unless it is arranged by some third element? Where is the evidence? So these are foolish theories, that there is no God, things are taking place automatically and things are coming out, these are all foolish theories. There is no evidence. Pramāṇa, there must be evidence. Otherwise... Just like science means simply not to see observation that things are taking place, but experiment. It must be substantiated by experiment. Just like theoretically everyone knows that two chemicals, soda and alkali, mixes together and there is interaction, effervescence. But who is mixing the soda and alkali, er, alkali and acid? There must be. Therefore the answer is there in the Bhagavad-gītā, mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ suyate sa-carācaram (BG 9.10). "Under My superintendence." That is God. Under God's superintendence things are coming. Parasya śaktiḥ vividhaiva śruyate. He has got many multi powers and energies, they are working.

Room Conversation -- January 27, 1975, Tokyo:

Prabhupāda: Ah, jagad āhur anīśvaram (BG 16.8). There is no God, it has come automatically by interaction. But even it is so, how the interaction is taking place? That is intelligence. Interaction, just like acid and alkali. Just like oil and caustic soda. These are two chemicals and mixing them, interaction, the result is soap. Accepting this principle, but there must be a mixer, a person who is mixing. Otherwise, how the soap and oil is being mixed? The soap is there and the oil is there and the caustic soda is also there, that is material ingredient. But they are not coming together automatically. That is not possible. Where is the evidence? There are so many soap factories, and let them keep oil and caustic soda and there is no question of labor, let them become soap. Where is that evidence? But these rascals say like that. Aparaspara sambhūtam. Interaction of the two things. But where is the interaction of two things unless it is arranged by some third element? Where is the evidence? So these are foolish theories, that there is no God, things are taking place automatically and things are coming out, these are all foolish theories. There is no evidence. Pramāṇa, there must be evidence. Otherwise... Just like science means simply not to see observation that things are taking place, but experiment. It must be substantiated by experiment. Just like theoretically everyone knows that two chemicals, soda and alkali, mixes together and there is interaction, effervescence. But who is mixing the soda and alkali, er, alkali and acid? There must be. Therefore the answer is there in the Bhagavad-gītā, mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ suyate sa-carācaram (BG 9.10). "Under My superintendence." That is God. Under God's superintendence things are coming. Parasya śaktiḥ vividhaiva śruyate. He has got many multi powers and energies, they are working. Just like in nowadays electronic.

Room Conversation -- January 27, 1975, Tokyo:

Prabhupāda: So you have to understand like... That is sura. And asura, they will say, "No, there is no God. It is taking automatically, it is going on," This is foolishness. The asura means foolish, first-class foolish, that's all. Why it has become so? That is explained here. That they do not know how to behave, nāpi cācāraḥ. Na satyaṁ teṣu vidyate, neither they know what is the actual truth. They are defective themself and they are explaining in the defective way that so many rascal chemists they say that the chemical evolution is the cause of life. What is this nonsense? Chemical evolution, you get the chemicals and make a experiment and produce life. Then your proposal is all right that by chemical evolution there is life. No, that is not possible. You have got all the chemicals. Why don't you revive a dead man by injecting chemicals again into life, where is your power? So why do you talk foolishly like that? This should be challenged that "You are foolish number one." Actually it so happened in California. One big chemist he came there to lecture the chemical evolution, by mixing of chemical life has come into existence. So there was one student, he is my disciple, Dr. Svarūpa Dāmodara, he said that (break) ...first-class cheater, that's all, mūḍhā. Na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ (BG 7.15). (indistinct) ...people are suffering for want of this knowledge. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, we are trying to bring people in true platform of knowledge, not to increase death like these rascals and fools. That is our proposal. They are trying to obstruct us because if everyone becomes Kṛṣṇa conscious then they can't cheat anyone. Now Acyutānanda Swami, he went to some place, there was a big sannyāsī, very well-known sannyāsī. So he went to sell some books in their āśrama first of all. So one of his student, one of his disciple, he canvassed Acyutānanda, "Why don't you ask some question to Swamiji?" He clearly said, "I have nothing to question from your Swamiji. I know better than him." (laughter) So actually bring any so-called yogis, swamis or incarnation, our student will challenge him. He does not know anything. We have got such a nice book of knowledge, Bhagavad-gītā. By the arguments and proposition in the Bhagavad-gītā we can capture all these rascals and nonsense. All right? Yes, question is very good to understand clearly. (end)

Room Conversation with Woman Sanskrit Professor -- February 13, 1975, Mexico:

Professor: I heard that you were a chemist before.

Prabhupāda: I was not chemist, but I was manager in a big chemical factory. Therefore, automatically, I learned something of chemist. And later on I started my own chemical factory.

Professor: You were belonging to Bengal?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Professor: And you were having also a guru there?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes, certainly. Without guru how can you...

Professor: Yes, naturally.

Prabhupāda: He is my guru. Show the photo.

Devotee: It's just above you, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. He is my guru.

Room Conversation with Professors -- February 19, 1975, Caracas:

Professor (Hṛdayānanda): He says that because he doesn't know what the transcendence is, there's no value for him. It's only a name. He doesn't know why to look for it.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So first of all, as I say, that you are also transcendence, you just try to know yourself first. Then you will know what is transcendence. You are the sample of transcendence, and if you see the sample, you can know the whole thing. Just like if you taste one drop of sea water, then you can understand what is the chemical composition of the sea water. Therefore your first business is to know yourself, that you are not this body. In this way, when you know yourself, then you know the original transcendence.

Professor: Why do you make so much emphasis on (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: Because without this, you are animal.

Professor: What's wrong with being an animal?

Prabhupāda: Animal means you are living a very risky life.

Professor: A very...?

Prabhupāda: Risky life. The animal is always in danger. A dog is running, but at any moment he can be in danger. I have seen in my own eyes in New York. It is little in the off from New York. In I think in the month of December or January, a dog was jumping and he fell in the water pool and immediately died. It was so cold it collapsed immediately. So what is the use of this dog-like jumping? Besides that, in the animal society there is no question of culture, religion, philosophy, science. Animal, they do not require it. And why man requires it? That means human society is searching after the transcendence. But without knowing the way, how to understand, they are now engaged in different way. You find out this verse from Bhāgavatam, jīvasya tattva-jijñāsā na yaś ceha karmabhiḥ. Find out. Kamasya nendriya-pritiḥ.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- February 28, 1975, Atlanta:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They will say that somehow the chemical reactions are not going right in the body, in the dead body.

Prabhupāda: But you give the chemical. You rascal, you have got so many chemicals. Why don't you give it? What is the use of saying like that? Now the child is dead. Now you give some chemical injection and bring it into life. Why you cannot do that? If you cannot do that, then what is the nonsense, saying that some chemical is missing? If it is missing, you replace it. Why you cannot replace?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Because they haven't found out the chemical.

Prabhupāda: Therefore you are rascal. You do not know what is that chemical, and still you say that some chemical is missing. This is going on, bluffing, cheating. This should be stopped. You do not know what is that chemical missing; still, you say, "Some chemical missing. Why do you say like that?"

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Recently there were some journals that came out. The title is called "The Origin of Life." I will bring in school when we discuss... It started about from last year. And they have got an international association of scientists, and they discuss about the origin of life. And then... I wrote a letter to the editor of that journal, and they replied me that they're going to have another meeting, international meeting, in Japan in 1977. And there will be several meetings in Europe in the coming years. So their aim and object is to prove that life started from chemicals. It is a big group, all international scientists. So he asked me to become a member of a research group.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- February 28, 1975, Atlanta:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I also asked whether they...

Prabhupāda: Don't say, "Yes, it is all right." No, don't say. That will be your duty.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Right now we are planning to write that book all together, all the Godbrothers so that for the God we have some background and what we have learned from Prabhupāda, and then we can...

Prabhupāda: This kind of answer, that if I ask you that "You produce life from chemicals," and if you answer that "Yes, we shall do it in future," that is not very scientific answer. What do you think? Is that very scientific answer?

Mādhava: No. But that's what they think is scientific.

Prabhupāda: How it is scientific? Life is already there. Not that the life production is depending on your future scientific research. The life is already going there, hundreds and thousands and millions. You say that you do not know. Why you are claiming that "In future we shall know"? There is no need of your knowing, it is already going on. You do not know. That is your position. And still, you are declaring yourself as scientist. You are misleading. You can make a fool's paradise, that is another thing. But you do not know at the present moment, but the things are going on. Life is being produced without your knowledge. So you admit that you have no knowledge. And without having knowledge, you are declaring yourself as scientist—how much cheating it is. It is not that it is depending on your future knowledge. It is already going on. Life is being produced. So if you think that in future, by chemical combination you will produce life, so that chemical composition is already there, going on. So you have to find out who is that scientist, not that chemical composition. Who is that scientist who is producing so many lives and chemicals? That is real intelligence.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- February 28, 1975, Atlanta:

Prabhupāda: Origin of everything.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. Matter, crude matter, origin of the chemicals, the, this carbon, hydrogen, these elements, these also, there is a brain behind it who made these chemicals.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So we have to find out who is that brain, who is that scientist. That is real research. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. This is brahma-jijñāsā. Jijñāsā means enquiry, that "Who is that brain?" Because things are already going on. It is not depending on your so-called research. It is already going on nicely. So your business should be: "Who is that brain behind it?" That should be your research, not that how chemical combination can be... It is already being produced without your so-called scientific knowledge. It is already going on. So as you are taxing your brain that "How this chemical combination produces life?" So that brain is already there. Otherwise how life is coming? What do you think? So why you are trying to find out the chemicals? You find out the brain. As you are taxing your brain to find out the chemicals, the original brain has already done it. Now you find out who is that person who has got such a nice brain.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- February 28, 1975, Atlanta:

Prabhupāda: That is real research. You point out this, not that, your chemical combination. It is already done. And people are already taking advantage like that. If there is some discovery by some scientist, he praises the man who has discovered this.

Rūpānuga: He names the man, experiment for the man.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The man is important, who has done it. The person is important. So am I right or wrong? So find out the person, who is that person.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Suppose they say that it just came about by chance.

Prabhupāda: That is kick on your face with boots. Immediately: boom! (laughter) That's all. That is the answer, only answer. Rascaldom answer, "chance." The only answer is to kick his face with the boot, that's all, as soon as he says chance.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- February 28, 1975, Atlanta:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Another answer that we come across when we talk with these people...

Prabhupāda: There is nowadays the chance theory.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No, chance is not so much popular, but the answer that "chemicals were supplied by nature," that's a very...

Prabhupāda: No, what is nature? That you cannot explain.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: That is the answer, theirs. When we ask the scientists...

Prabhupāda: But what is this nature?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, the nature is not understood.

Prabhupāda: You see? That means you are rascal. You have not understood. You have no knowledge. As soon as you cannot explain, you prove your foolishness, that's all. That is not scientific answer, "chance," "nature." What is the nature? Who is conducting nature? How the nature is going on so nicely?

Rūpānuga: You said before they were acting as teachers, but actually they are still students.

Prabhupāda: No, they are cheater. They are cheater, not teacher, cheater. They have no full knowledge; still, they have become teacher. You cannot become teacher unless you have got full knowledge. That is cheater.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- February 28, 1975, Atlanta:

Rūpānuga: Kṛṣṇa says, "Take it from Me."

Prabhupāda: Yes. And if he wants to make research, that means he is a rascal number one. If you want to make research, then search out what is the original brain, not the process. Process is already going on. What is the use of your research, nonsense? Suppose by chemical combination, if you produce one life... You will never be able. But still, if you think that you will be able or you become able, then what is credit to you? Without your help there, millions and millions of life are being manufactured, without your help. Then what is your credit?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Imitating a barking dog.

Prabhupāda: That's it. So millions of dogs are barking, and one man has learned how to bark like dog, and people will go to see him by purchasing ticket. This is their foolishness. Suppose if you somehow or other become able to produce life from chemical, then what is your credit? It is like barking dog. Millions of dog are barking. Now you have learned how to bark like dog. So what is your credit? It may be for the rascal fools that you are scientist, but we are not so rascal.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- February 28, 1975, Atlanta:

Rūpānuga: They will clap. The fools will clap.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. "How nice barking. Oh, how he has learned to bark." Just see. We are not so fools. Kṛṣṇa yei bhaje sei baḍo catura: "The first-class intelligent man is he who is Kṛṣṇa conscious." Sei baḍo catura. All rascals. Kṛṣṇa said, na māṁ duṣkṛtinaḥ mūḍhāḥ. "Oh? Also very scientist?" māyayāpahṛta-jñānā: "They have no knowledge, all rascals." Kṛṣṇa says. māyayāpahṛta-jñānā, that he is not thinking, that "Suppose I can produce life by chemical combination, then what is my credit? The life is already there. It is going on very nicely." What do you think, Balavanta? If the things are going on nicely, then where is my credit? Either you say, "by chance," or "by God's arrangement," "by nature," but things are going on nicely. So it is same thing, to learn how to bark, that's all. Barking is going on, but he wants to take credit by learning how to bark. That's all.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- February 28, 1975, Atlanta:

Rūpānuga: The scientists are trying to be the hero. Kṛṣṇa is the hero. He has done everything first, and the scientist wants to be the hero.

Prabhupāda: So you have to present like this, that "What is the credit? Suppose by chemical composition you can manufacture one ant. That is not possible. Be assured you will never be able. That we are assured. But even if you are able, then what is your credit? The credit is the man has learned how to bark like a dog. That's all, this much credit."

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No, if they are able to make life, then they are going to say that there's no God.

Prabhupāda: Yes, but first of all you produce. Then say. Why you are anticipating that you will be able to...?

Rūpānuga: Still, who is the bigger God? If I make one ant, and there's already many, many ants made by a bigger God than me...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, so He is God. Whoever has made the most, He should be God.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- February 28, 1975, Atlanta:

Prabhupāda: There are life manifestation, according to Vedic literature, that some of the life, they are coming from eggs, some of the life, they are coming from perspiration, some of the lives come from a seed, and some of the life comes from embryo. This is all stated there. Sveda-ja, udbi-ja, aṇḍa-ja, jarayu-ja. They already there. Jarayu means embryo, and sveda means perspiration. Life is everywhere. When they take little advantage, they come out, manifest. You will find even on the pavement, footpath, as soon as there is crack, some grass is coming out. So life is everywhere, it is struggling, and as soon as there is favorable circumstances, they come in a form. That's it. Life is not created, na jāyate. Read Bhagavad-gītā. Na jāyate: "Life is never created." It is existing eternally. Therefore it is said, na jāyate. So unfortunate rascals, they do not take advantage of Bhagavad-gītā and making research. So we want to stop this rascaldom. They are trying to create life, and it is stated in the Bhagavad..., na jāyate: "It is never created." It is already there. Simply it is coming out, being manifest by different bodies, 8,400,000 forms. That I was explaining last night. According to his desire. The life is already there, and according to his desire, he is coming out in different forms. That is going on. This is a false theory, that chemical can create life. It is nonsense. Life is never created, life is already there. God is already there, and the part and particles, molecules, life, was already there. Na jāyate mriyate vā kadācit. This word is used, kadācit, "at any time." So we have got perfect knowledge. Why should we say, "Yes," with these rascals? We have got perfect knowledge.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- February 28, 1975, Atlanta:

Rūpānuga: They are like the cheating mechanics.

Prabhupāda: That's all. All these medical men, psychiatrists, they are simply painting the body of the car. That's all. What is that?

Vīra-lakṣmaṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, the scientists, they've reported in one journal of theirs that by taking some chemicals of methane, ammonia and carbon and injecting it with electricity, that equation or that formula equates them to an energy that is called amino acid in due course of time. That is, they say, the building blocks of life, of protein.

Prabhupāda: So why do they not do that?

Vīra-lakṣmaṇa: They've made an experiment...

Prabhupāda: That means they are not in knowledge. That I am speaking, the barking dog. First of all make experiment, produce life. Then come and say. Otherwise don't bark like a dog, imitation. Simply big, big words. Produce. Our theory is that... In the śāstra it is said harer nāma harer nāma harer nāmaiva kevalam, kalau nāsty eva nās... (CC Adi 17.21). That practical proof we are giving, that these Europeans, Americans, they are simply chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa and how they are coming out, this practical proof. They did not know five or six years ago what is Kṛṣṇa, what is Kṛṣṇa's name. But we are taking the conclusion of the śāstra: in this age, if one chants Hare Kṛṣṇa, he becomes spiritualized. That is becoming, practically. It is not theory. How so many devotees are in this Atlanta, here? Anywhere, wherever we have started, how they have become devotee? Caitanya Mahāprabhu said that "You follow this formula and you will become God conscious." That is being practically proved. It is not theory. So that is Vedic knowledge. You adopt Vedic knowledge and get the result, not that "This ammonia, this chemical, that chemical, but I cannot do anything." The rascal said, "That I cannot say."

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- February 28, 1975, Atlanta:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: He asked him, that rascal chemist, that "If I give you the chemicals, can you manufacture life?" That time he said, "No, that I cannot say." Why do you say like that? In the beginning, in New York, that store front, the Satsvarūpa is with..., and Hayagrīva and... And you chant simply. You were also there. So this chanting is proving efficient. That is Vedic knowledge. It is not theory. Our, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is not theory or mental speculation. It is a fact. So therefore it is said,

guru-mukha-padma-vākya, cittete koriyā aikya,

ār nā koriho mane āśā **

So whatever little success I have got, it is only for this reason. My Guru Mahārāja said that "You go and preach whatever you learned in English language." That's all. So I came here with this faith, that "My Guru Mahārāja said. I must be successful." I did not show any jugglery to you, gold-making jugglery. Where is my gold? I came with forty rupees first. (chuckles) So these are Vedic instruction, guru-mukha-padma-vākya **, and:

śrī-guru-caraṇe rati, ei se uttama-gati

That is real progress. So this is Vedic instruction. We have to follow the Vedic injunction. Then you will be successful. Not these rascals' theory. It is useless.

Morning Walk -- March 1, 1975, Atlanta:

Prabhupāda: "One who has received a little mercy of the lotus feet of the Lord, he can understand the truth. Others, even speculating for millions of years, they cannot understand anything." The speculation business is useless in spiritual advance. It may help Darwin to come to the conclusion that man is born from monkey. Because he is from monkey, he thinks others also from monkey. He has admitted that whatever he has given, it is simply a speculation. He has admitted. And all others also speculating. They are trying to manufacture life from chemicals, but they do not know that life is never manufactured. It is already there. Just like this grass is coming. The life is already there. In favorable circumstances it comes out. Udbhija. This is called udbhija. Similarly fermentation. Just like the cockroaches come out... (end)

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- March 1, 1975, Atlanta:

Rūpānuga: Māyayāpahṛta-jñānā.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Māyayāpahṛta-jñānā. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. They are so-called educated, doctors, but actually they have no knowledge. Simply they are bluffing, cheating. Where is the question of creation? So many millions and trillions of living entities are there, and they are making conference, "How to create from chemicals?" Just see this childish proposal. And wasting time and misleading person, and wasting hard-earned money of the state. And big, big foundation supplying them money. And if you ask, "Give us some money for Kṛṣṇa consciousness," "No, no, we are not interested in religion. We are interested in science, and this is the science." All fools and rascal, mūḍhā. That is our test. Anyone who is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he is a mūḍhā. Bas. We have got the test tube, this Bhagavad-gītā, na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ (BG 7.15). So as soon as we see here is a man, if he has not surrendered to Kṛṣṇa, "All right, you are mūḍhā." That's all. We haven't got to test him. Test tube is already there. So you tell these mūḍhas that "Why you are wasting so much time and money to find out how to manufacture life? Then what are these life? How they have come? That is not a problem, that without your creation of life the world will go to hell.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- March 1, 1975, Atlanta:

Rūpānuga: Simply copying what is there.

Prabhupāda: Just like a good cook is a good chemist. He knows how to mix up the maśālās and ghee and makes very tasteful thing. So you can call him a good cook. The chemistry is nothing but mixture of different chemicals. That's all. There is oil. There is alkaline. You mix it very proportionately, and soap comes out, very useful.

Mādhava: Prabhupāda, how can we explain to the scientists how gross matter is being produced from subtle matter and ultimately from life, from consciousness. Like if a scientist were looking at the creation occurring...

Prabhupāda: Every scientist knows that originally the sky, the sound, and from the sound, then, what is? Air? What is the process of creation from subtle to gross?

Rūpānuga: First the ether produces sound.

Prabhupāda: Yes. From sound there is air, from air there is fire; from fire there is water; from water there is earth. This is earth, water, air, fire. And the sound, transcendental sound... As it is said in the Bible, "Let there be creation." And in the Vedas also, it is said, sa aikṣata: "He glanced over." That is to be found out, how from sound, from ether, sound is coming... I think that is already in the science. Is it not?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: It's not known, natural sciences.

Morning Walk -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No, I mean in the sense, farmers, that they produce the grains and vegetables. I was thinking in that line.

Prabhupāda: Oh. That is somewhere in India still. But here they keep cows not for protection, for eating. (break) ...chemical. Life is already there.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No, what they are saying is this, that the..., when they examine this body in the minute details—they call the molecular levels—they find only molecules. They don't see anything. For example, when they analyze the hand, they saw it—this is proteins, protein molecules, some fats, some carbohydrates, and they don't see anything else except molecules. And at the same time, when they study—they are called the biochemical pathways in the living cells—they find only these DNA molecules and the different molecules that carry out different activities. That is why they say that there is..., what we call life is just nothing but arrangement of these molecules in different ways. So that's why they say that "Yes, life started actually from these molecules."

Prabhupāda: So why they cannot produce life from the molecules?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They'd say that when science started or knowledge started, it takes some time. It cannot come all in a sudden.

Prabhupāda: So what is this knowledge? The molecules are already there.

Room Conversation -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta:

Devotee: They also say that the car created itself somehow or other, the metal and everything.

Prabhupāda: That is not the fact. Car requires the help of the driver.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I have interest for these journals, say life, origin of life, that started from last year. So here the international scientists from all over the world, they have combined together and then they formed this, this is all chemicals, this. And they're a big group.

Prabhupāda: So why don't you protest?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, that's what we're starting the background.

Prabhupāda: Refute their arguments, then it will be nice. Aiye (Hindi—Prabhupāda greets guests and asks which province of India they come from and they reply Punjab). How long you are here?

Guest (1) (Indian man): (Hindi) Emory University.

Devotee: Oh, Emory.

Room Conversation -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta:

Prabhupāda: So you are also believing that life comes from matter? (laughter)

Guest (1): No, I don't think we think in those directions at all. We simply just conduct experiments, not knowing what they will lead to and try to describe whatever we see under the microscope. (indistinct) chemical matters that we use.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But I think you have assumed that Darwin's theory or theory of evolution is already there and even to study something intermediate, higher levels, evolution is all right but...

Prabhupāda: Basic means evolution.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But they want to study more some of the intermediate stages like this metabolism in some...

Prabhupāda: Mother's, mother's body? No?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Any system, mother's body or any living systems.

Guest (1): What I can do is to study the growth and differentiation of the nervous system, different parts of the nervous system and how it is affected by lack of protein in the diet of the mother.

Prabhupāda: That is medical science.

Room Conversation with Press Representative -- March 21, 1975, Calcutta:

Prabhupāda: Scientists' role, not only scientists, scientists, philosopher, politician—everyone should endeavor that "Wherefrom we got these propensities? Where is the origin?" That is described in the Vedānta-sūtra: athāto brahma jijñāsā. I am a scientist. I am thinking of myself very great man, but I do not think that "Who is that great scientist under whose order the sun, moon, the sea, ocean, everything is working very properly?" I am thinking of that water is created by hydrogen, oxygen, but I do not inquire, "Wherefrom such hugh quantity of hydrogen, oxygen came, so that there is big oceans and seas, water?" That I don't enquire. So I am so foolish scientist. I am theorizing. I am theorizing that life has come from matter, chemical composition, but as soon as I ask that "I give you the chemical. You create," he says, "That I cannot do." This is going on. But our business is, we Kṛṣṇa conscious, that we see that you scientists, you are trying to create a living being, but I glorify the Supreme who has already created millions and millions of living beings. I give you credit that... I cannot give you credit unless you create. But still, as you are thinking that you will be able in future, that's good... But what credit you will have? If I have got millions of rupees, and if you create ten rupees, then what is your credit? Even if you create? You cannot do it. You will never be able to create life. That's a fact. That we know. But even if you are able to create, then what credit you, do you get. This is... Already there are millions and trillions of life. Why you are so proud that "We are going to create in the laboratory, life." Why this false prestige?

Guest: So what is the idea behind the movement?

Prabhupāda: Behind the movement, that... This is the idea, that you try to understand the Supreme Being behind all, everything. That is perfection.

Morning Walk -- April 2, 1975, Mayapur:

Pañcadraviḍa: ...take the chemicals and combine them together in a test tube so that a soul can enter into that and...

Prabhupāda: God is not your father's servant, that He will arrange to bring the soul. You are God's servant.

Pañcadraviḍa: So you're... Cannot be done, then?

Prabhupāda: No. If you bring, you can bring soul by some arrangement, then we shall think that you are better than God. But you are rascal. You are thinking like that. You cannot do that. God will not agree to send a soul to your arrangement. You should always remember that you are servant of God. God is not your servant. That is knowledge. (Break)

Gurudāsa: Jaya.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Pañcadraviḍa: I just wanted to ask that question.

Prabhupāda: Thank you. Don't try to make God your servant. That is foolishness. You must always agree that "I am servant of God."

Morning Walk -- April 2, 1975, Mayapur:

Pañcadraviḍa: Because in the class that... I asked that question because we're saying, well, there's no question of creating life. We're agreeing that the soul already exists. But can the scientists... If a scientist claims he'll create the conditions in which a soul will enter, do we accept that premise, and I thought, "No, because that's giving them much too much ground," that if we say that, then by their definition, they can say, "I am creating life. I don't want to argue over the existence or not of the soul, but I'll arrange all the chemicals for you."

Prabhupāda: Where is that chemist? Where is that chemical combination that, I mean to say, grows a soul, generate a soul? Even if you have got the chemicals, you cannot do it.

Pañcadraviḍa: Whether it's true or not, somebody was claiming to me that the scientists are creating primitive forms of life like enzymes and things like this because enzymes show... Enzymes are produced by life. They show certain living tendencies. The scientists claim they are able to create enzymes.

Prabhupāda: So what is the credit? The enzymes are being naturally created, and the soul is there. So what is his credit? The arrangement is already there automatically, the secretion between the man and the woman, and they mix together, emulsified, and the situation is created, and the soul comes there. The soul is injected through the semina of the man. It is already arranged. So what is your credit?

Morning Walk -- April 2, 1975, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: Four sources of life: aṇḍa-ja, udbhi-ja, jarāyu-ja and sveda-ja. Sveda-ja. The sveda-ja means just like these bugs. Wherefrom the bugs in the bed come? Is there any laboratory arrangement?

Pañcadraviḍa: No.

Prabhupāda: So why these rascals do not understand? The bugs come from the perspiration. So in the perspiration, there is all chemicals, and the bug is coming. Now, where is their chemical? Who has put here chemical? This grass is coming. How it is coming? It is so...

Pañcadraviḍa: The chemicals are coming from the perspiration.

Prabhupāda: No, no. That is another.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Seed.

Prabhupāda: There, that the, this grass is coming out of the earth. Wherefrom it is coming? Who has put the chemicals? And the eggs of the birds, they are produced in the womb of the birds, and from there the life is coming, the bird is coming. Where is the chemical?

Pañcadraviḍa: Well, that's just a complex chemical reaction. We can't explain it yet...

Prabhupāda: But "Can't explain"—that means you are fool. You remain fool. Don't try to expose yourself, nonsense. You are a rascal number one; you remain rascal number one. When the neck is caught up, he says, "Yes, it is complex. We shall see in the future." Why "future?" What about now?

Conversation with Devotees -- April 14, 1975, Hyderabad:

Brahmānanda: They have never seen God. They can see chemicals, but they cannot...

Prabhupāda: You are trying. How you can see? You rascal, you are blind. You, how can you see? You have to treat your eyes, then you will see. We are seeing. We are not blind like you. You are blind. You require treatment. You come to the treatment. You cannot see.

Yaśodānandana: They don't have faith in the doctor.

Prabhupāda: Ha?

Yaśodānandana: They don't have faith in the doctor.

Prabhupāda: Then how he claims to..., claims others' faith upon him? He's more than a doctor? Doctor is also as good as scientist as you are. If you do not have faith in the doctor why do you claim people should have faith in you? Where is the proof that you'll be able? Why you are asking us blindly to follow you? What is your answer?

Nitāi: Sometimes they say that if we can control, if we can produce...

Prabhupāda: But I'm protesting that you cannot control. You are rascal. You are thinking like that. That is our charge against you, that you cannot control. In the history there is not a single instance that man has controlled nature. But nature has controlled man. That is the history. Where is the proof that you shall control? You are controlled. Nature is forcing you to become an old man. You are becoming. You control like that, that you remain a young man. Nature is controlling you to die. You control nature that death will not be forced upon me. So where is the history that man has controlled nature?

Morning Walk -- May 10, 1975, Perth:

Amogha: But they say with science they can prove so many things.

Prabhupāda: We can also prove. You cannot prove. Just like you say the life is made of chemicals. You prove it. Take chemicals and make a life, then it is true. Otherwise it is a humbug. Why do you say like that, that life is made of chemicals? You cannot prove it.

Amogha: I do not say that life is made of chemicals.

Prabhupāda: They say.

Amogha: They say. Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes, these rascals say.

Amogha: But they say they can prove that there are chemicals...

Prabhupāda: You prove it. You take the chemicals and prove-produce life. Why do you talk nonsense? First of all prove. You did not produce a life, even an ant, in the laboratory, and still you say life is a combination of chemicals. Why do you say like that? Challenge them.

Morning Walk -- May 10, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: You cannot see, but you can perceive. If life comes from matter, then when there is a dead body, put matter and make it alive. Or put chemicals. Chemical is also matter. Make him alive.

Paramahaṁsa: We made some, um, um...

Prabhupāda: No, no, first of all this is my challenge: that here is a dead body, so bring some chemicals. Just like a motorcar stopped for want of chemical, petrol. So you bring petrol and it will be started. Similarly, you bring some chemical and start it again.

Paramahaṁsa: Well, that will require some time to find the chemicals.

Prabhupāda: That means you fool. You are talking nonsenses. You do not know what is that chemical. You prove yourself a rascal.

Paramahaṁsa: Well, we accept that we don't know, but we are trying to learn.

Prabhupāda: Then if you don't know, why do you talk nonsense? First of all you know, then talk. That is science.

Morning Walk -- May 17, 1975, Perth:

Paramahaṁsa: I was reading in the Bhagavad-gītā last night. In Chapter Two there was a verse where it says, "Of the existent, there is no cessation, and the nonexistent, there is no continuation," something like that. But in the purport it says that one can understand the Supreme by studying himself. What does that mean? By analytical study of oneself one can understand the Supreme.

Prabhupāda: So you could not understand? You have got all propensities, different, the similar propensities are there in God. Because you are part and parcel of God, the chemical composition in drop of water from the sea is the same. In the sea it is in bigger quantity, and in the drop in smaller quantity. And therefore your composition you can study, and the same things are there. Therefore He is a person. He is person.

Śrutakīrti: That is sāṅkhya-yoga?

Prabhupāda: No. This is my interpretation. He is also creating; you are also creating. You can create a motorcar and He can create a huge, gigantic sun globe. The same process. As you are controlling the aeroplane by air condition or by controlling the air, similarly all these planets are there. It is by His plan it is moving with the air. Big, big planets, there is no question of gravitation. That is nonsense. It is by His arrangement it is moving in the air. Just like big, big cloud containing millions of tons of water floating in the air. How it is being done? Eh? Millions of tons of water are floating in the air. That we see daily. So similarly, all these planets are floating by His arrangement. Not only floating. Making center that polestar, all the planets are moving around it, even the sun. So it is by His arrangement.

Room Conversation with Jesuit -- May 19, 1975, Melbourne:

Jesuit: We are finite, God is infinite, therefore we cannot, added together, make up God.

Prabhupāda: No. I don't say that. I don't say that. That finite and infinite, they... Finite is there, only "in" is not there. That is lacking. They, individual soul, (indistinct) we are not infinite.

Jesuit: No, of course.

Prabhupāda: But God is infinite, and I am finite. So the finite portion is common. The "in" is more in God, infinite. So similarly I am giving the example, just like a drop of ocean water, it contains the same chemical, you find salty, and the whole ocean also salty, but the ocean is big salt and this drop is a small particle. The salt is there.

Jesuit: But I can't accept the example because the little drops of water which have salt and so on, all together coalesce to form the huge ocean but the ocean is still finite. It is not infinite. But you and I are finite...

Prabhupāda: That is already explained.

Jesuit: If we coalesce together, then that how many of us that there are...

Prabhupāda: No, I'm not comparing that combined together that we shall be equal to God. I don't say that.

Jesuit: I didn't follow you then.

Prabhupāda: I don't (indistinct) some men here, or the whole universal souls combined together, still they are finite. They're not infinite. Yes, multi-billions of zeroes cannot make one. So I don't say that, but the quality is there very minutely.

Room Conversation with Two Lawyers and Guest -- May 22, 1975, Melbourne:

Guest 1: But you can't say that scientists are working in a way that is opposite to God's will.

Prabhupāda: Yes, they say. They say, oh yes. I have met many scientists. They say that "We shall solve everything by scientific advancement. We have done already." They say like that.

Guest 1: But just because they...

Prabhupāda: Just like there is a big theory, chemical theory. One big scientist... Big or small, whatever he may be, he has got a Nobel Prize.

Guest 1: He's medium sized. (laughing)

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Guest 1: He's medium sized.

Prabhupāda: Yes. He is making the theory that life has come from chemicals by chemical combination, chemical evolution. Darwin's theory is also of that. This is their... Big, big scientists, they are so fool that life has come from matter. Where is the proof? He was lecturing in California University, and there was one student. He is my disciple. He challenged him that "If you get the chemicals, whether you can manufacture life?" That answer was, "That I cannot say." Why? You are putting this theory, that life has come from chemicals. So science means observation and experiment. Now experimentally prove that the chemicals have produced a life.

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1975, Honolulu:

Bali-mardana: Some big, big scientists, they had a convention about evolution and geology, but they made a rule at the beginning that during the convention no one could bring up the subject of divine creation or God. And then they will discuss.

Prabhupāda: Now they are going to, I mean to say, hold a convention that life is from chemicals. Our Svarūpa Dāmodara told. Japan it is going to be held. And by their resolution, it will be accepted. But they cannot create.

Bali-mardana: But I had one question. Is it possible to create a suitable environment for life to enter?

Prabhupāda: Life enters into the matter. Then it comes out with a particular type of body. The soul enters in the womb of the mother and the mother gives the body. The soul comes through the semina of the father, and then the mother's ovum and father's semina mix together, creates a situation for developing a body. This is the science. Without that living entity there is no question of pregnant. Simply a mixture of matter. No, that is not possible.

Morning Walk -- June 2, 1975, Honolulu:

Devotee (1): In either direction, you know, they're all different plants. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...say "This contains this chemical, that chemical, this chemical," but he will never think who has put this chemical. That is his dullness. They will analyze and say, "It contains this chemical, that chemical, that..." And who has put this chemical? That they cannot say.

Śrutakīrti: Very large trees.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Devotee (1): This big one?

Prabhupāda: Maybe thousand years old.

Devotee (2): It's from Africa.

Prabhupāda: African trees are like tall like this.

Devotee (1): One hundred years, it's more than hundred years.

Indian man: This is that same one. They give red, different flowers.

Prabhupāda: This is also African?

Indian man: No, they have in India this tree also. That gives red flowers?

Prabhupāda: And it was in a small seed. Prepare such seed, you chemist. How strong!

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Paramahaṁsa: Will they actually be able to prove anything by scientific presentation or...?

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is science. If you can prove it by experiment. Otherwise, it is not science, theory.

Paramahaṁsa: But how can they prove the existence of the soul through experiment?

Prabhupāda: No, first of all let them prove by chemical composition they can produce life. Then we shall talk of soul. First of all let them, in the laboratory, let the chemicals be mixed up and produce a small ant. Then we shall understand.

Siddha-svarūpa: We don't need to make experiments.

Harikeśa: They can make these little amoebas but they can't make ants.

Prabhupāda: Amoebas, that is automatically... By perspiration it comes out. There are four sources of life: udbija, jarayuja, svedaja, and, what is other? Andaja. Andaja means life comes from the egg. That is called andaja. And life comes from, under certain circumstances... Just like trees, grass. It is called udbija. And then jarayaja, just like we human beings or animals, they come from the embryo. And svedaja. And some living entities come out from perspiration.

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Well, they no spiritual information. That is the... Therefore the first education is to understand what is spirit. Then spiritual knowledge is... They do not know what is spirit. (break) ...imāni bhūtāni bhavanti. That is spirit, the original source of everything. This body, original source is the spirit. As soon as the spirit is not there, the body will not grow. They are seeing actually. Therefore the original source is the spirit. Why the dead child does not grow? Or dead young man does not grow? They have not studied still, what is the cause? If it is chemical, then inject some chemical, if you know it, and make it grow. Is there any... Why they cannot do it? Why do they say it is chemical? Chemical you have got in your possession. So inject the dead child and it will grow, then it is correct. And where is that? Simply bogus propaganda. And we have to accept it? Either they must say that "Yes, it is chemical, but we did not find that chemical."

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Siddha-svarūpa: So that means they're not sure it's a chemical.

Prabhupāda: Then?

Siddha-svarūpa: If they say they haven't found it, they have to admit that they're not sure.

Prabhupāda: Why do they not inject chemical in the dead body? Harikeśa? What is their answer, these rascals' answers? If they know it is out of chemical, then inject that chemical in the dead body and let him come back again in life. What do they say?

Harikeśa: They're a little puzzled about that one.

Prabhupāda: Puzzled means they are rascals. Why a scientist should be puzzled? Then you are rascal, admit it. If I know my business correct, why shall I be puzzled? That means rascal. You are rascal, and you are theorizing only. What is the value of your statement?

Siddha-svarūpa: Actually, the chemicals are already there in a body which has just, someone has just left the body, the soul has just left, all the chemicals are there. There's nothing missing.

Harikeśa: Well, they will say there's a slight difference and that slight difference is enough.

Prabhupāda: But you do not know what is that slight difference.

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1975, Honolulu:

Siddha-svarūpa: It is a slight difference. The soul is missing. (laughs)

Prabhupāda: If the chemical is missing you can replace the chemical.

Siddha-svarūpa:. Right. Do they say it's a slight difference in chemical composition?

Harikeśa: Yes, there's just a slight difference with some of the chemicals...

Prabhupāda: What is that difference? That also you cannot explain.

Siddha-svarūpa: What is the difference? Do they know? Or do they say they know?

Harikeśa: Well they haven't found it yet.

Prabhupāda: Well, that's it still they are talking of chemical... They did not find what is the original cause; still, they are suggesting this is the cause.

Harikeśa: Because they are finding so many cures to diseases, they are trying now...

Prabhupāda: What the disease? What they have...? Have they found any cure for the cancer?

Siddha-svarūpa: Cancer?

Harikeśa: For certain diseases they are...

Prabhupāda: Certain diseases. Then we are calling of disease.

Morning Walk -- June 16, 1975, Honolulu:

Bali-mardana: All they do is create smog. Kṛṣṇa creates fragrant flowers.

Prabhupāda: No, smog is also created by Kṛṣṇa. That's all right. I mean to say in the ground everything is there, the flavor.

Siddha-svarūpa: So why they can't put it together?

Prabhupāda: No, why they cannot, by scientific, chemical or physical way, they cannot take the flavor from the earth?

Bali-mardana: They do make synthetic scents.

Prabhupāda: No.

Siddha-svarūpa: They come out synthetic, though, they do not smell the same.

Bali-mardana: Not as good.

Ambarīṣa: Actually they make perfumes from flowers.

Prabhupāda: Flowers, yes. That is... But not you take some dirt and extract the flavor. Then I will know that you are scientist. (laughter) (break) ...the vast water, but they cannot make it sweet. That you will have to depend on God. The water is, actually is taken, and it is made sweet. So how they can deny the hand of God?

Harikeśa: They have some water distillation plants now.

Prabhupāda: That is nonsense. He may distill one pound of water. That does not mean that... Why they are unnecessarily proud and denying the authority of God? How foolish they are. Therefore I don't like them, the most heinous type of atheist, not gentlemen. (break) Whenever they hold some conference they say, "Don't talk of God. Then you cannot come to the conference." Do they not? What is that principle?

Garden Conversation with Dr. Gerson and devotees -- June 22, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Research. So by searching, searching, searching, if you do not come to Kṛṣṇa, then your searching is incomplete. That is the defect. And when you come to Kṛṣṇa understanding, then it is perfect. Then your research work is complete. That is... Kṛṣṇa says in the Bhagavad-gītā, vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyam (BG 15.15). Research work means... Actually, that is science, to find out the original source. Just like they are claiming, "The original source of life is chemical." That is not knowledge, imperfect knowledge. The perfect knowledge is as Kṛṣṇa says. What is that? Ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavaḥ (BG 10.8). "I am the origin of everything." So when they come to Kṛṣṇa, then he finds out the original source. So that is possible by this research worker after many, many births, not many, many years, but many, many births. And bahūnāṁ janmanām ante: (BG 7.19) "After many, many births," bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān, "one who is actually advanced in knowledge, he surrenders unto Me." Why? Vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti (BG 7.19), that "Kṛṣṇa is the original cause of everything." Sa mahātmā su-durlabhaḥ: "Such research scholar, mahātmā, is very rare." And then He describes in the next verse that what is the symptom of these mahātmās, perfect soul. Mahātmānas tu māṁ pārtha daivīṁ prakṛtim āśritāḥ: (BG 9.13) "They are no more under the control of this material nature, they are fully under the control of spiritual nature." So what is the symptom that he is under spiritual nature, not...? Bhajanty ananya-manaso: "He is simply engaged in Kṛṣṇa." Bhajanti, "engaged in service." Bhajanty ananya-manaso: "He has no other business than to serve Kṛṣṇa." That is the symptom of a mahātmā. The Bhagavad-gītā does not say, "One who has got political business, he is mahātmā," no. Mahātmā means bhajanty ananya-manaso: "Without any diversion, simply engaged in Kṛṣṇa's business. That is mahātmā." So everything is there.

Room Conversation with Dr. John Mize -- June 23, 1975, Los Angeles:

Jayatīrtha: Because Kṛṣṇa is independent, therefore the part and parcels...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Part and parcel must have a little portion of independence. Qualitatively, part and parcel means... Just like you take a drop of water from the sea. The, all the chemical composition is there in the drop. So Kṛṣṇa is fully independent. So we living entities we are drop. Still, the independence quality is there in minute quantity.

Dr. John Mize: But Kṛṣṇa has no tendency to fall, whereas we do.

Prabhupāda: No. Because Kṛṣṇa is God. Therefore He is all good. Even He falls down, to our estimation, it is not fall down. (break) ...cannot judge God. If we are devotee, in all circumstances we shall glorify God, "You are all-good." That is devotee. You cannot criticize God, "Oh, You are doing such thing," no.

Dr. John Mize: I'm still puzzled about the relationship of the soul to God. If the soul is eternal, as God is, and yet some souls have the tendency to fall and others don't have that tendency...

Prabhupāda: No, no, eternal does not mean not fall. Suppose you are now professor. So you can fall down from your position. But that does not mean you are not eternal. If you are fall down from your position, you do not lose your eternity. You simply fall down. You can become a professor; you can become an ordinary man. But you are eternal in all circumstance. Eternal... Fall down does not mean that he loses his eternal. That is stated that na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). Find out. Ajo nityaḥ śāśvato 'yaṁ na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). Na jāyate na mriyate vā kadācit. The living entity is never born or it never dies. This is eternity. You change your body, but you eternal.

Morning Walk -- July 14, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prabhupāda: It looks like. That is another thing. Asaṅgo 'yaṁ puruṣaḥ. The Vedic injunction is" "The puruṣa, the soul, is never complicated or mixed up with this." Because just like oil and water, it never mixes. The oil keeps its separate identity in water.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. But if you put in a body, though they cannot be mixed, but they can stay together. Like in a chemical laboratory we take a test tube. In the test tube I can mix two solutions like, for example, mercury and water and oil. They will not mix, but they will stay in the same test tube. But a man who knows about the art of separating those three mixtures can do it very nicely.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Similarly, soul does not mix with the matter and by this art, transcendental knowledge, you can become out of it.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So that's why we need a process and someone who knows the process of.

Prabhupāda: The process is bhakti-yoga. Sa guṇān samatītyaitān: (BG 14.26) "Anyone who has taken to this bhakti-yoga," māṁ ca vyabhicariṇi bhakti-yogena yaḥ sevate, "he immediately becomes free from the mixture of these three guṇas." Sa guṇān samatītyaitān brahma-bhūyāya kalpate (BG 14.26). "He again revives his Brahman nature." Ahaṁ brahmāsmi. Brahma-bhūtāḥ prasannātmā: (BG 18.54) Then he understands that 'I have no connection with these all nonsense things. I am brahma-bhūtāḥ.'

Morning Walk -- July 20, 1975, San Francisco:

Brahmānanda: You have to demonstrate knowledge.

Prabhupāda: Yes, demonstrate. You make in the laboratory that things are moving by this combination. Otherwise it is useless. Therefore two things must be there: observation and experiment, practical and theoretical. Theoretical—something is there who is moving. Now you make it practical to see that this combination... Just like they say chemical combination. Now take the chemicals and make experiment.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, the thing is that they are now in the test tube they are making experiment, and they are putting a certain set of chemicals together and maybe some soul takes shelter of those chemicals. But the scientists say that they get the credit for it. They don't say that the soul has entered. They say, "No, we have put different elements together, and now some..."

Prabhupāda: No.

Bahulāśva: They have never done that successfully.

Prabhupāda: And even they are successful, what is credit? So many living entities are coming every minute, and if after thousand years, they can create one ant, so what is the credit? (laughter)

Morning Walk -- July 21, 1975, San Francisco:

Paramahaṁsa: It becomes food for other living... It becomes food.

Prabhupāda: Food or whatever it may be, but the body, the ingredients of the body are complete to get life. You cannot say some chemical is missing. If it is missing, then how so many living entities are coming? There is nothing missing; everything is there. You cannot say, "missing." What is that "missing"? You do not know. That is soul.

Paramahaṁsa: When I first joined the movement, Śrīla Prabhupāda, I used to listen to your lectures and then go talk with my father. And he would argue with me, and I would find a question and come back and ask you and find the answer and go back and argue with him. But the thing I always came up against is that if he assumes that there's life on other planets or that there is a supreme source, a supreme energy or God, then it destroys his entire life's work, his study.

Prabhupāda: Then they are fools. They should stop all this education. This university should be broken. (laughter) Because they are producing only fools. That's all. They should stop this education.

Morning Walk -- July 25, 1975, Los Angeles:

Rādhā-vallabha: Their claim is that species are not constant like our claim. They say that species constantly change till the original species is gone and a new species is created.

Prabhupāda: What is that original species?

Rādhā-vallabha: Well, they say originally chemicals. Originally very complex chemicals, acids...

Prabhupāda: Very complex again. So they cannot understand. So complex that they cannot understand. So what is the use of such theory?

Rādhā-vallabha: Well, they say these complex chemicals came from the simplest chemicals.

Prabhupāda: Wherefrom?

Rādhā-vallabha: Well, they say in space there are many, many particles.

Prabhupāda: How the space came?

Rāmeśvara: That's eternal. They say it's eternal. They say the space and the dust...

Prabhupāda: Then why do you bother? Stop speculating. Everything is eternal. Why do you bother yourself to find out something new?

Rāmeśvara: To control. To gain control.

Prabhupāda: No, you cannot control because you are controlled. That is eternally you are controlled. You are controlled.

Morning Walk -- July 25, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: So where..? Our position is: "Wherefrom it came?"

Rādhā-vallabha: Well, we have to test this out scientifically. We can't just accept.

Prabhupāda: No. You say that the water is composition of hydrogen and oxygen. Wherefrom you got this so much hydrogen, oxygen, the Pacific Ocean? There is so much water needed in so many places. Why don't you take chemical and pour water? Why you talk nonsense?

Brahmānanda: They can make a little water in a test tube.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) That's all. (laughter) That we can produce while I pass urine. (laughter) So you can create little urine, but that we do automatically. At least I do. Every hour I pass urine. So your credit is urine-maker. (laughter)

Rādhā-vallabha: We have developed a method of seeding clouds. We send airplanes into the clouds and spread chemicals, and then rain comes. So what need is there for...

Brahmānanda: Sometimes, not all the time.

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Brahmānanda: Sometimes they're able to...

Rāmeśvara: Agitate the cloud to produce rain.

Hṛdayānanda: And but now they find out it's causing worse effects, so they have to stop that also.

Prabhupāda: So why don't you create...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The clouds.

Prabhupāda: Clouds and sufficient rain in the desert where there is.., so much water is needed. Why don't you do that? If you say, "Yes, I have passed urine in the desert." (laughs) what is the..? "I have passed urine on the desert." That desert is fulfilled?

Morning Walk -- July 25, 1975, Los Angeles:

Brahmānanda: The hospitals here have better facilities than in countries in India.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that's all right. It is simply proportion, five upon ten and five millions upon ten million. The proportion is the same. Because the figure is five million over ten million, that does not mean that the proportion is not the same. Put five upon ten or five million for ten mill..., the result is the same. (break)

Rādhā-vallabha: ...also create food grains like this with their chemicals. They could do it too.

Prabhupāda: So why don't you produce more and give to India?

Rādhā-vallabha: Well, it belongs to us.

Prabhupāda: Why other parts, they will suffer for gain. That's nice. You have made scientific improvement. You produce more and distribute to the poor country. (break) we become advanced in Kṛṣṇa consciousness and become advance in science and cooperate. That is our proposition. Andha-kañja-nyāya. One is blind; one is lame. So let the lame man be taken by the blind man. He can walk and they... Both their work will be nicely done. That I put this argument always. Andha-kañja-nyāya. You are blind by material advancement, and India has got spiritual advancement, but for want of money they cannot Move. So you take this lame man, you blind, on your shoulder, and cooperation will be good for the whole world. (end)

Morning Walk -- August 4, 1975, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Then?

Satsvarūpa: Ambarīṣa? Is there another way we can go? It's wet.

Ambarīṣa: We can go back around in the road and then walk along that road over there. (Devotees chanting japa) (break)

Prabhupāda: Grass is coming out. Where is the chemical? How the grass is coming out from the stone side? Harer nāma harer nāma (CC Adi 17.21). (break) ...he will go?

Śrī Govinda: Around the island. Right around the island.

Prabhupāda: Very fast going, but where he will go? (break) ...tory?

Brahmānanda: Admiral Perry.

Satsvarūpa: He defeated the British in 1812.

Brahmānanda: Oh, he's an American.

Prabhupāda: Admiral Perry.

Morning Walk -- October 2, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: You are a scientist. How you can deny God? Then what kind of scientist you are? The Bible has done wrong. Throw it away. I have no objection. But you are scientist. How you can deny God? And that is our point. Come to this logic, that "How we can deny God?" You are speaking that from chemical combination life is formed. Do it in the laboratory. You cannot do it. Why you are propagating false propaganda? What kind of scientist? Then you are also to be kicked out. If Bible is to be kicked out you are also to be kicked out. Why you are claiming your position? You prove first of all. You combine chemical and produce a life. And you are making false propaganda, so you are to be kicked out. They say, "We shall do in future." And what is the future? Then why you are at present making false propaganda. Wait for the future. Post-dated check. "In future I shall pay." Who will accept this check? Any nonsense will accept.

Room Conversation -- October 4, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: Do it. Again foolishness. These rascals... (laughs) Then, if you can create life, then where is the question of dead body? You create again. Give life again. If you are so competent that you can give life, combination, then this dead body is there. You bring chemicals and inject.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: The same chemicals are there, too. The same chemicals, living body, dead body—five minutes before, five after—is the same chemicals. But they can't explain why there is such a drastic difference.

Prabhupāda: What is that same chemical?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: In the living body, two minutes before death and two minutes after...

Prabhupāda: So what is that? Name that, what is that chemical. Then bring it.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Let him try and make life. Not possible.

Prabhupāda: If you know the chemical, then you bring it. Chemical is available. Why this is dead? What they will answer? What this chemical is wanting, that it is dead?

Brahmānanda: Well, we may not know...

Prabhupāda: Then, you rascal, why you are talking? You do not know. (laughter)

Room Conversation -- October 4, 1975, Mauritius:

Brahmānanda: You can say soul, but you don't...

Prabhupāda: No. But you cannot answer my question; therefore you are more rascal than me. You cannot answer. Your... You are...

Harikeśa: You have the position. He's in a position. He cannot answer.

Prabhupāda: Yes. You say that chemical is missing. I say what is that chemical?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: No, but the chemical is not missing.

Prabhupāda: Then?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: The same chemical is there. Two minutes before death and two minutes after death, the body chemistry has not changed so much.

Prabhupāda: No. What is that missing that it is dead?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They can't answer.

Prabhupāda: Therefore they are fool. You cannot answer.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Because it's not a question of chemical. Actually they don't know what life is.

Prabhupāda: Therefore they are foolish. Therefore he has to take knowledge from Kṛṣṇa: dehino 'smin yathā... "Within this body there is soul."

Room Conversation -- October 4, 1975, Mauritius:

Cyavana: We can see in some of our boys in Kenya. Practically they have no education and very little intelligence, but still, they are doing everything. They're falling down. They are offering all the prayers. They are taking prasādam. They are chanting. They are doing everything, even they don't have the intelligence to understand why.

Prabhupāda: You said that no chemical is missing.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: No chemical difference.

Prabhupāda: But why it is dead?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: The body is dead? Well, they haven't been able to determine that yet.

Prabhupāda: Then they are rascals. There is no argument because you do not know.

Cyavana: They say "fate." They say "There is fate."

Prabhupāda: Faith we have got, but you have no faith.

Morning Walk -- October 5, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: You know something of science?

Indian boy (2): Some.

Prabhupāda: It is melted in fire and glass is made.

Cyavana: It becomes clear.

Prabhupāda: No, that you have to add chemicals.

Cyavana: Oh. (break)

Prabhupāda: Hawaii, on the beach side, there are many, many coconut, eh?

Harikeśa: Hm.

Cyavana: Many of them have been ripped up by the cyclone, pine trees and coconut trees.

Prabhupāda: In Hawaii there is no cyclone, I think. Hm?

Harikeśa: No.

Prabhupāda: Why?

Harikeśa: They have a volcano on one island. There is one volcano that goes every twelve years.

Prabhupāda: Here there is any volcano, on this island?

Cyavana: Nothing left.

Room Conversation with Bill Faill (reporter) -- October 8, 1975, Durban:

Prabhupāda: That is also bogus. That is also bogus.

Faill: I didn't like the idea of that. The book was very impressive, but I just thought, "This isn't right." You shouldn't have to lean on drugs.

Prabhupāda: No. That is... Anything... If drugs can help God realization, the drug is better, I mean to say, more powerful than God.

Faill: Which isn't...

Prabhupāda: Then how we can accept that? Drug is a material thing, chemical composition, and how it can help one, God realization? That is not possible. This is a kind of intoxication and hallucination, but it is not God realization.

Faill: Do you think that the great mystics down the ages have actually seen this spark? This is what...

Prabhupāda: What do you mean by mystic?

Faill: Well, there seem to be chaps who've had some very odd experience and always remembered it and found it very difficult to put it down in words.

Prabhupāda: Mystic means something jugglery? What do you mean by mystic?

Faill: Well, it's just the name they seem to give people who've had an experience of another level of reality.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So yes, that... We don't say mystic. Our reality is God realization. There are different stages. I mean to say, direct perception, then receiving knowledge from authority, then personal experience between the two, then above that transcendental, and then, I mean to say, spiritual. In this way we have to go, step by step. We have to come to the point, to the spiritual platform. So, so long we are on the bodily concept of life, our understanding is sense gratification because body means the senses. And then, if we go still up, then we can see that mind is the center of sense activities. We take the mind as the final, and that is mental platform. Then, from mental platform, we come to the intellectual platform. Then, from intellectual platform, we come to the transcendental platform.

Morning Walk -- Durban, October 13, 1975 :

Prabhupāda: Everyone is against this movement. So who is coming to save us? Nobody is coming. Kṛṣṇa is saving. Otherwise it would have been stopped long, long ago. I was thinking that “As soon as I shall propose all these things, immediately these American people will ask me to go back home. Instead of go back to Godhead, "You go back to India." (laughter) So it is Kṛṣṇa's kindness that you, a few boys and girls, have accepted this principle. Otherwise who likes this? Nobody likes. Nobody likes. Lord Zetland flatly said, "Oh, it is impossible." This is the life and soul of the modem civilization. just see the advertisement-sex. You see, illicit sex. Who would like our movement? Nobody likes. What is this picture means? Sex, that's all. So many advertise…, wine advertisement, meat-eating, gambling—everything. The modern life is going on the basis of these four principles of sinful life, and we want to stop it. Nobody likes it. Still, we are selling so many books and people are hearing us… (break) (out of car) Why the scientist does not make chemical composition egg?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Morning Walk -- Durban, October 13, 1975 :

Harikeśa: "Just like in the fourteen or fifteen hundreds people only lived to be about forty or fifty years old, and now they are living so long."

Prabhupāda: They are living now twenty-five years. In India the average is thirty-five or twenty-five. After all, you are going to die. That you cannot check. (aside:) You have come. Namaskar (Hindi) (break) … very big scientist. They say that life is made out of chemicals. Now you just try to make life by combination of chemicals and fertilize it. Why they cannot do it? So many things. Simply people are being bluffed, and they are kept in ignorance, and they are flourishing at the expense of these rascals.

Indian man (1): That is right.

Prabhupāda: Yes. There is no real knowledge.

Morning Walk -- Durban, October 13, 1975 :

Prabhupāda: That is not very difficult thing. If you make some vegetable, if you add more sugar it becomes sweet. If you add more salt it becomes salty. That you can do. That is not very difficult. Our question is wherefrom the life comes? That is our… So they do not give any answer to this. That is their foolishness. What is that life? They say life developed from chemical. Now do it. By chemical combination make in one egg and give it to the fomenting machine. What is that? Fomenting machine? They have got heating machine?

Harikeśa: Incubator.

Prabhupāda: Incubator. Put it there. Then we shall accept your science. Why don’t you do that? Then your all theories are useless. This is practical.

Morning Walk -- Durban, October 13, 1975 :

Prabhupāda: Huh? Well, then kick on their face, on their nose, rascal. We are crazy or you are crazy?

Harikeśa: But who wants to make eggs?

Prabhupāda: Huh? No, no, it is an experiment. You say life comes from chemical. So by chemical combination make an egg and do it. Begin from this. Then we shall see others. This is very easy. If you have already analyzed the yellow portion of the egg, the white portion of the egg and that outer plastering can be done. Nowadays there is… What is called?

Harikeśa: Plastic.

Prabhupāda: Plastic. It can be done. Do it.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Make a chicken.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Make a chicken or so many birds. If not chicken, make a sparrow. Do something. Do something. Why you should be misled by them, these rascals? Challenge him. Challenge them publicly that “These rascals are misleading. Don’t accept them. They’re simply misleading.”

Morning Walk -- October 21, 1975, Johannesburg:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: We challenge them like that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Then why you are talking nonsense that there is no life? Why you are depending on other life for giving you the egg? So this theory that life comes from chemical, so where it is true? Life is coming from the ... a life.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: That's a fact.

Prabhupāda: That's a fact.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But they say that life is simply a combination of chemicals.

Prabhupāda: So do it now. It is not difficult. You can see the egg's chemical, and just combine little chemicals and put it in the incubator. Let life come. Hm? What is your answer? The advocate speaks.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: "Yes, we are working on it." (laughter)

Prabhupāda: Working on it. Eh? What is the answer? How long you will work? Is there any time limit? Eh? What is that work? What is the answer? Hm? How long you will work?

Harikeśa: I don't think anybody is trying to make an egg.

Morning Walk -- October 21, 1975, Johannesburg:

Prabhupāda: Then why do they talk nonsense, what the nonsense says? This is a very good suggestion, that egg is chemical composition. Make a chemical composition like that. That yellow, what is called?

Devotee (1): Yolk.

Prabhupāda: Yolk. You color it. Some chemical and color it. What is difficulty? Sometimes they say a man is dead because the color of the blood has changed. From red to..., it has become white. So where is the difficulty to make it red again? Do it. Change the color again. Make it red. And if you say, "No, that natural redness is required," so there are so many flowers, natural red. Why there is no life? If redness, natural redness, is the cause of life, so there are so many flowers, red flowers. Why they do not walk? If you say that the... "Besides that, the life substance is missing," that is also not correct. Life substance is there in the dead body; otherwise how worms are coming out? Life is coming out. Not one, but hundreds are coming out. How you can say the life substance is missing? The worms are coming automatically, but you take the portion of the dead body and produce worm. That you cannot do. So which way you are going to take credit as scientist? Now which way?

Morning Walk -- October 25, 1975, Mauritius:

Harikeśa: By chemically changing the genes in the living being we can, before conception, make a superior...

Prabhupāda: You can... First of all you be beaten with shoes. That's all. Then you can.

Harikeśa: No, we've actually done it. We've changed some genes and made some people better. By experimentation we can make people...

Prabhupāda: And your big, big cities are full with hippies. You cannot induce them to give up their LSD, and you are making better men. Better men is going to become worse. Just see how cheating.

Harikeśa: Oh, you mean once we make the better men they'll just degrade again.

Prabhupāda: Simply bogus propaganda. (break)

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: ...that their educational system has failed. Therefore they...

Prabhupāda: Yes. They should close the universities and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Morning Walk -- October 25, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: There also there is everything. Therefore I say they did not go there.

Indian man: In the moon it may be. But where they went, there. There could have not been there. They say there no life there. It may be in Rahuloka, as you have said that.

Prabhupāda: No, there is life in Rahu.

Cyavana: In the ocean they have air? In the ocean is there air? What is the chemical combination of water?

Prabhupāda: You cannot live within the water. Why do you think that others cannot live?

Indian man: No, no, I don't mean... Please, Swamijī... I want to say that they have said there is no air and water there.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. Where is water within the water? Where the air?

Indian man: Not as you call because...

Cyavana: How do they live, then?

Indian man: Live where?

Cyavana: How do they live, then? The same example.

Prabhupāda: How they live? So this is all misconception.

Morning Walk -- October 25, 1975, Mauritius:

Harikeśa: They've done so many good things in the past, you can understand that...

Prabhupāda: No good things. All bluffs. What good things they have done which has benefited the human society or saved the human society from birth, death, old age and disease? What they have done? Our main problem is this. And when there is no food, what the scientists can do? If there is no rice, no wheat? That will come. The scientists will be taught very nicely. Time is coming when there will be no food. Let them produce. Therefore they are trying chemical food, one, one tablet. This is another cheating. Why tablet? Why not actually produce rice by chemical composition? Why tablet? This is their bluff. The Western people, they take dozen of tablets every day. Still, they are the same condition.

Morning Walk -- October 26, 1975, Mauritius:

Brahmānanda: That means he's a rascal.

Prabhupāda: Rascal. That is rascal. Obstinate. Which is fact, he is obstinate—that is rascal. Dog's obstinacy. (break)...manufacture life with chemical, still obstinate. "Yes."

Brahmānanda: "We shall do it."

Prabhupāda: "Yes. We shall do it, future." That's all. This is dog's obstinacy. We say, "Take one egg. Analyze what chemicals are there. Put together." "No." "Yes, it will be..." And we have to accept this obstinacy as science? It is open. If you are really scientist, you take the egg; analyze what chemicals are there.

Brahmānanda: Yeah, they are able to analyze, and they also have the chemicals.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Brahmānanda: So what is the problem?

Prabhupāda: What is the problem? But still, these rascals will say that he is right. You see? He cannot even analyze properly, and still he is obstinate; he is right. This rascaldom is going on. And if we say "rascal," they are angry. Murkhayopadeṣo hi prakopaya na śanti...: "To a rascal, if you give the right instruction, they will be simply angry." That's all. Not pacification, they will be angry. Payaḥ-pānaṁ bhujanganam kevalaṁ visa-vardhanam: "Just like the serpent, rascal. If you give him milk, he'll drink it and increase his poison." That's it. The result will be he will increase his poison. Better to keep them starvation. Therefore everyone, as soon as one sees the serpent, immediately kills. No consideration. "Here is a serpent. Kill him."

Morning Walk -- October 26, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: This is fair proposal. You take one egg, analyze. If you are scientist, you find out what are the chemicals. You have got all the chemicals. And mix it up, the color yellow, and dip into what is called, celluloid ? Or...?

Brahmānanda: Cellulose?

Prabhupāda: Cellulose, covering? It is just like cellulose. And put underneath the incubator and get. Then we shall accept you. Why not ask all these rascals all over the world?

Brahmānanda: One thing the egg has, the egg has... It's red because there is blood there for nourishment. And they cannot even produce blood.

Prabhupāda: Take blood from the slaughterhouse and put it. If blood is necessary, the tons of blood available. You take it and put it here. That is also another chemical. That's all. Why don't you do that? Little blood required, there is no question of manufacturing. You can get it from slaughterhouse, tons. Take little drops and put it. It is blood. Where is your science, nonsense? It is practical suggestion. Challenge then in big, big meeting. (break) ...past it was coming this side, and fifteen minutes, it has gone down. How many tons of water has gone down on this beach within fifteen minutes? Is there any scientist who can...?

Morning Walk -- October 28, 1975, Nairobi:

Cyavana: That's the beginning. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...come gradually. But this particular body belongs to a particular living entity.

Jñāna: Actually, my doubt was about the cells, whether they were living entities or... (break)

Prabhupāda: Living entity quits this body, no other living entity will be able to...

Cyavana: Maintain.

Prabhupāda: It belongs to the particular. That is the rascal philosophy of the rascal scientists. They say some chemical is missing. Why chemical missing? There are so many other living entities, how they are living? If the chemical is missing, how they are living? This is rascaldom. If you say when the body is dead, the chemical is missing, then why so many hundreds and thousands of microbes are coming? Huh? (Hindi) Therefore I say rascals. (end)

Morning Walk -- November 1, 1975, Nairobi:

Jñāna: The materialistic scientists, they are saying that matter is energy. So we understand if it's energy there must be an energetic.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So how the energetic is producing, this is common. Gas is forming. Just like you perspire, there is water. So one ounce of water may come from your body. So water is coming from your body, so why not from the gigantic body of Kṛṣṇa, the oceans, millions of oceans, come out? This should be the understanding. We see practically that water is coming out from my body. So it may be one ounce or less than that because my body is very small, but Kṛṣṇa's body is unlimited, so why not unlimited supply of water? This should be the common sense. And this body, this body, what it is? It is earth. When the body will be dead it will be earth. So I am spirit soul, a small particle, so much earth is coming from me, why not Kṛṣṇa, the supreme spirit? This is the explanation. God is great, I am small. From me a small quantity of earth is coming, water is coming. Why not from the gigantic body of Kṛṣṇa, so huge, I mean to say, volume of water, gas, and everything as we see it is coming? So therefore Kṛṣṇa is correct. He's correct, but for our understanding we can understand like this, chemicals, the chemicals coming from our body. There are so many salt. And you test the blood or the perspiration. You'll find so many chemicals.

Morning Walk -- November 1, 1975, Nairobi:

Prabhupāda: Now, just to understand that I am part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa, so the chemical and the water and the earth is coming from my body, so why not Kṛṣṇa's body, gigantic, the greatest, the chemicals, water, earth, water...? When Kṛṣṇa says, bhūmir āpo 'nalo, "It is My energy," that's fact. Where is the difficulty to understand? We can... We are little sample of God, a small God. So if we can produce, this body... The spirit soul as I have described yesterday, one ten-thousandth part of the tip of the hair, it is very, very minute. From that minute spirit so much earth, water, fire is coming. So why not the supreme spirit, huge quantity of water, earth, will not come? How one can deny it?

Harikeśa: Well, but verbal analogies don't prove the scientific a fact.

Prabhupāda: Then you are a rascal. Verbal analogy is proof. A small quantity, a small quantity producing; large quantity, large quantity producing. Where is the verbal? This is practical.

Morning Walk -- November 1, 1975, Nairobi:

The sweat, that's coming from water we took before. It's already existing.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Jñāna: We're not making water or making chemicals out of nothing. The living entity's body, that comes from...

Brahmānanda: We drink water, then comes the sweat.

Jñāna: It's not produced out of nothing.

Prabhupāda: Not without drinking? No. That's not fact.

Brahmānanda: Actually they say the body is made out of water.

Prabhupāda: "They say. They say." You don't drink water, and when you give me massage why do you perspire? You did not drink water. This is practical.

Morning Walk -- November 1, 1975, Nairobi:

Prabhupāda: Will is given to you. Living being means there is will—thinking, feeling and willing. Don't question if you do not know. Everything comes from God. What is the use of "Where will comes?" Janmādya asya yataḥ. Ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavo mattaḥ sarvam... (BG 10.8). Everything is coming from Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa has got will; you have got will. Why do you ask? This is foolishness. Kṛṣṇa has got independence; you have got independence. You are a small Kṛṣṇa. A particle of gold is also gold. Everything is there. All chemical composition is there. It has come from Kṛṣṇa. Why you are asking wherefrom it comes?

Jñāna: All living beings are independent, but some choose to serve and some choose to disbelieve.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is use of independence. Otherwise what is the meaning of independence? The meaning of independence is: "If I like, I can do. If I do not like, I do not do." That is independence. That means independence. If you are stereotyped, forced to do, that is not independence. Independence means if you like, you can do it, if not—you don't like-don't do it. That is independence. So misused independence means ignorance. He does not know that "If I infect this virus of this disease I'll suffer." But he does not know, ignorance. So he infects and he suffers.

Morning Walk -- November 13, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So many rascals. One scientist came to talk with me in California. And he: "God? What is God? We have now solved everything." And you are rascal, demon.

Dr. Patel: He should be asked to "Make a single living cell yourself. We'll give you all the ingredients, all the chemicals, and make us a living cell. If you can make it?" That should be the answer to that.

Prabhupāda: They are so foolish. I very strongly talk with them. Still, stubborn, doggish. That scientist, I told him in his..., that "You are a demon." I told him, "You are a demon." So he tolerated. (laughs)

Dr. Patel: They are serving the Mammon and not God.

Prabhupāda: So, so many psychologists, psychiatrists, scientists, they come there in Los Angeles.

Dr. Patel: I mean, the psychologists are the real science which can lead a man to the higher understanding of life, psychologists. The abstract sciences of biology and psychics, chemistry, are little lower sciences. The psychology is much higher.

Prabhupāda: No science is perfect. Asato dhavato bahiḥ.

Morning Walk -- November 19, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...is taken from the earth. There is no doubt about it. Why the scientists cannot take? This is a fact, that there is aroma, and the flower has taken the aroma from the earth. But why the scientists cannot take?

Brahmānanda: They can make chemicals, the flavors. They can make flavors, aromas, from chemicals.

Prabhupāda: As good?

Brahmānanda: No. (laughter)

Yaśomatī-nandana: They make a flavor and then say it's a rose flavor.

Prabhupāda: That is also not all kinds of flavors.

Indian man: (Hindi)

Yaśomatī-nandana: I think if they want to produce rose flavor they must use the roses somehow or other. I don't think they can just produce.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: They use a little bit.

Yaśomatī-nandana: Yes. They must use.

Morning Walk -- November 19, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: They are taking chemicals, making flavor, and the flower is coming out without any chemical. So who is more artist, better artist?

Brahmānanda: (break) ...because they will wilt and die.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Brahmānanda: These flowers, they will wilt and die, but they can make flowers that will not die, will not wilt. (laughter) Of course, they have no smell.

Prabhupāda: Therefore they make without smell. (break) ...earth is this side and moon is this side, then which is first? Both of them are both sides.

Brahmānanda: Yes. The sun is larger in the sky, so that means it is nearer to the earth?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Should be. Because you calculate about the stars, very, very far away. Is it not?

Brahmānanda: Oh, yes.

Morning Walk -- November 29, 1975, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) ...apaśyatām. They cannot see. They see only that the tongue is vibrating, the ear is hearing. And the dead man, the same ear is there, the tongue is there. Why there is no music? What they will answer?

Tejās: They say it's a chemical interaction.

Prabhupāda: What is that chemical? Eh? Why talk nonsense? Chemical reaction? Bring that chemical and let him hear again. What is the answer? Why do they say nonsense which he does not know? Chemical reaction, if it is chemical reaction, bring chemical and inject it. What is the answer?

Harikeśa: That chemical is very complicated. They haven't found...

Prabhupāda: Then you do not know. First of all admit you are talking nonsense. The chemical you do not know. Still you are talking nonsense. Therefore you are rascal. Why do you talk nonsense if you do not know? What is the answer? If you do not know, why do you talk just like wise man? Then you are a nonsense. Aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ prajñā-vādāṁś... (BG 2.11). You are talking like a very learned scientist, but you are a rascal, fool. Challenge them like that.

Morning Walk -- November 29, 1975, Delhi:

Harikeśa: They should have their salaries paid by postdated check.

Prabhupāda: No, they will not accept that. That they will not accept.

Harikeśa: "In the future we will pay you."

Tejās: When you find the chemicals.

Prabhupāda: "Now you starve. In future I shall pay." "How shall I eat?" "Now you starve. In future you'll get payment." You do not know what is the chemical, how it is acting, and depending on your future knowledge, and still, you are talking like a very great scientist. This rascaldom should be stopped by kicking on their face. Huh? So? Ambarīṣa Mahārāja, do you agree?

Ambarīṣa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Thank you. (break) ...if they know the chemicals, why they open deaf and dumb school? Let the chemical be injected and they will be cured from dumbness and deafness. And where is that chemical? Hm?

Harikeśa: I mean, after all, isn't it just a matter of time, because we've already invented new skin now.

Prabhupāda: Again rascaldom. Again rascaldom.

Morning Walk -- December 7, 1975, Vrndavana:

Aksayānanda: The one you heard last night?

Prabhupāda: No. When I was in South America I saw that...

Harikesa: South Africa.

Prabhupāda: South Africa. There are many factories for chicken killing. So I suggested that the egg, you can analyze, find out the chemicals and...

Aksayānanda: Create one.

Prabhupāda: Create one egg. That was my proposal. So he is going to create. (laughter) He'll explain how to create egg from...

Aksayānanda: From chemicals.

Jnana: And make chicken.

Harikesa: Calcium phosphate and a little sulphur for the yellow, make some color, and cover it in plastic and put it in an incubator and let a chicken grow.

Prabhupāda: And you eat.

Morning Walk -- December 7, 1975, Vrndavana:

Aksayānanda: Well, that's another thing. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...ly regret is that these rascals are going as scientists and big men. Simply talk. They cannot create. It is very simple thing. Put some chemicals together and if you know the chemicals, then why don't you put it? And incubator put, then you don't require to kill so many chicken. (break)

Alanath: In Sweden when you go on the street and you preach, "Everybody must suffer here," they don't believe because everybody got an apartment. They have never seen a poor man or a starving cow.

Prahupada: But he is himself a poor man.

Alanath: In Sweden...

Prabhupāda: But he has no knowledge to understand it. Why he is falling down from the skyscraper and killing himself? Why? A poor man commits suicide. So if he is committing suicide he is a poor man. He is a poor man. He falsely thinking that he is rich man.

Morning Walk -- December 11, 1975, Vrndavana:

Harikeśa: Well it's better than some mythological book!

Prabhupāda: No, book also, you write book and you want to believe, others your book. That is also book. Why do you write scientific book?

Harikeśa: Well they're proven, those other books...

Prabhupāda: What is proven? You cannot say what is the chemical there, wherefrom came. Is that proof? "We cannot say." Is that proof?

Harikeśa: Well we know how they interact. We may not know how they got here but we know what they do once they are here.

Prabhupāda: No... Knowledge means to find out the source. That is knowledge. Where from it comes. There is a good example we studied in our childhood. A child was very intelligent so he was beating on a drum, so he was very much inquisitive, "Where from the sound is coming?" Then he cut the surface... (laughing) That is intelligence. Inquisitive... where from the sound is coming? Although it was childish but that is innate intelligence.

Morning Walk -- December 11, 1975, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Then why don't you make an imitation sun here? At night so that you may save so many expenses. So much expenses for electric. The rascal. If you know the chemicals then you make it. Ha? What do they say?

Smarahari: They say there are many suns... but...

Prabhupāda: That's alright. Make you one sun, if you know! Many suns but you have not made anyone of them. You just try to make one, then I shall see your intelligence. Huh? What do you say? Anybody?

Akṣayānanda Swami: They cannot do.

Devotee (1) (woman): They don't have enough power.

Prabhupāda: Huh? Then why do you say nonsense! If you have not enough power there must be somebody powerful than you—you have to admit that—who has made all these things. But you are rascal you have not... You are simply, ahh, what is called? Speculating. That in future we shall be powerful. But the powerful is already there. What is your credit? More powerful-) you cannot conceive even how powerful He a scientist. Huh? Is that alright? What is your value? The already powerful is there, who has manufactured these things. And you are expecting in future you'll be powerful; therefore you are more powerful. Just see their folly. If you are powerful then make it, another imitation sun.

Conversation on Roof -- December 26, 1975, Sanand:

Harikeśa: The unknown chemical.

Prabhupāda: Not unknown. It is unknown to you. But known to us. If it is unknown to you, you take, you know it from me. That is real knowledge. Why you persist that "It is unknown"? It should remain ever unknown? Why shall I take from anyone else? That's a fact. Either you answer what is that element which is missing so that the body is now dead. Simply your denial is obstinacy. That is dog's obstinacy. Then you are like a dog. You answer that: "This is the reason." Make experiment; prove it. Then you are right. So long you cannot do it, simply denying, that is dog's obstinacy. If you, as you say, there is no soul, it is chemical combination, so bring the chemicals and put him into life. Then your statement is right. You cannot do it and simply persist. This is doggish. You are calling a lump of matter your father, your child, your relative, and when the soul is gone, you say, "Oh, my father is gone." Why your father is gone? He's lying there on the bed. The same coat, pant, face, ear, eyes. Why do you say, "My father has gone"? What is this nonsense? So that chemical combination is your father? Bring your father again, chemical combination. Hmm? What is the answer? Some foolish, rubbish thing, presentation, will it be accepted as knowledge?

Conversation on Roof -- December 26, 1975, Sanand:

Harikeśa: Another point.... I just thought of. They say it's some chemical which is missing that's making life, yet, if the same chemical is there that's making life, what accounts for so many different varieties of life? If it's the same chemical, how is there so many different varieties from that same chemical?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Harikeśa: And if it's a different chemical, that means there's so many thousands and billions of chemicals. Yet they can't even find one of them.

Prabhupāda: They do not know even one of them.

Harikeśa: They don't even know one of them.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) And still you are proud. What is this nonsense? And supposing the chemical combination is there and is being administered in different way for different life, then who is making this arrangement? Somebody's there who is making arrangement. You cannot do that. Therefore we are inferior, He is superior. You have to accept. It is not that it is not existing. It is existing. So as you are trying to do something, somebody has already done it. Then what is your credit?

Haṁsadūta: On the one hand, they say that the creation was a chance, accident, and on the other hand, they're trying to find the law of nature. So this is a contradiction.