Alive (Conversations)

Expressions researched:
"alive"

1967 Conversations and Morning Walks

Discourse on Lord Caitanya Play Between Srila Prabhupada and Hayagriva -- April 5-6, 1967, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: Haridāsa's body. Caitanya...dead body. Haridāsa's dead body.

Hayagrīva: Oh, with his dead body?

Prabhupāda: Yes. His dead body.

Hayagrīva: After his death.

Prabhupāda: After his death.

Hayagrīva: Caitanya...

Prabhupāda: While, I mean to say, Haridāsa was alive, he was dancing. But after the death of Haridāsa, Caitanya Mahāprabhu Himself took the body and began to dance with kīrtana. That means his funeral ceremony was conducted by Caitanya Mahāprabhu Himself. He took the body to the seaside and in the graveyard He...

Hayagrīva: He conducted the...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Funeral ceremony, yes.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Television Interview -- July 29, 1971, Gainesville:

Prabhupāda: Yes. The disciplic succession is coming from Kṛṣṇa since 5,000 years.

Interviewer: Is your spiritual master still alive?

Prabhupāda: No. He has passed away in 1936.

Interviewer: So you are at this particular time then the head in the world of this movement? Would that be correct?

Prabhupāda: I have got many other Godbrothers, but I was particularly ordered to do this from the very beginning. So I am trying to please my spiritual master. That's all.

Interview -- July 29, 1971, Gainesville:

Prabhupāda: Yes. The disciplic succession is coming from Kṛṣṇa since five thousand years.

Interviewer: Is your spiritual master still alive?

Prabhupāda: No. He has passed away in 1936.

Interviewer: So you are, at this particular time then, sort of the head in world of this movement? Would that be correct?

Prabhupāda: I have got many other Godbrothers, but I was particularly ordered to do this, and from the very beginning, so I am trying to please my spiritual master, that's all.

Interviewer: Now, you were sent to this country, to the United States of America. This is your territory. Is that correct?

Prabhupāda: Hmm.

Room Conversation -- August 17, 1971, London:

Prabhupāda: At least, must be two, three men; otherwise don't open.

Haṁsadūta: Yes, there are two, three men, but I visit them regularly.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. Visit. Keep them alive. "Simply because we have opened a center, the business is finished." No. You must keep them alive. Alive means this morning class must go on, evening class must go on, there must be regular program for prasāda distribution. Busy. That is alive.

Revatīnandana: And they must also study your books.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Otherwise, so many Indian temples or churches, they think, "The church is there; everything is finished." No. Why people are losing interest in church? There is no preaching. Neither do they know what is preaching. They simply think that "This building will attract people." So they are now on sale.

Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London:

Dr. Weir: Well, may I say, let's go farther, that when you say biologically necessary, is it necessary for you to be alive? What scientific...

Śyāmasundara: Prabhupāda has told us that even in the spiritual world there is desire to have the senses enjoy. Isn't that so?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Weir: But I think you need, I agree, I would say you need both. I want spiritual life, material life.

Mensa Member: (indistinct) spiritual thing, I mean, isn't it (indistinct) we're talking about China or New York (indistinct) about it, in fact it might even be a little (indistinct)

Dr. Weir: Well, I think to each person his picture is different too.

Śyāmasundara: The idea there is that in spiritual activity everything is seen in relationship to God and if you serve God with your every activity...

Prabhupāda: Yes. The same example, just like this finger is part and parcel of body. So long it is attached with the body there's not activities. You cut it from my body, there's no activity.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- June 30, 1972, San Diego:

Prabhupāda: Yes. The scientists, they are trying to make a xerox copy of Professor Einstein. So why not the original? Hm? What is their answer?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: They cannot keep the original alive.

Prabhupāda: No, that's all right, but let them make one original.

Devotee (1): They can't even begin.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Devotee (1): They can't even make a cell.

Prabhupāda: Then what is their credit?

Devotee (1): They have made a computer.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Devotee (1): They have made a computer, but it takes a human being to program the computer.

Prabhupāda: So what is their credit? If you simply copy something, that is not credit. The credit should go to the original.

Room Conversation -- July 5, 1972, London:

Prabhupāda: Maybe over sixty.

Devotee: She's very much alive, so much alive.

Prabhupāda: Her father was one the richest men in Bombay, and her husband, her father-in-law also one of the richest men. There're coming from very rich family in Bombay. And she's so intelligent that Scindia Steam Navigation Company, very big company. It is a semi-government, and she's the managing director. All the big, big officers respecting as mother, carries out her order. And she's great devotee of Kṛṣṇa, but she does not take leave with her husband (laughter). Hm? The husband and wife, not very agreement. Yes.

Devotee: Her husband is alive?

Prabhupāda: Yes. They live separate building. That mean, that they live separate building, separate (indistinct), she looks one department of business, and he looks another department. That child, adopted. She has no, own child.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- April 19, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That means nonsense, that there is something else. Because the same tree, now it is growing, watering, but when it will be dead, you pour water... The medicine is the same. Why it is not doing now, and why it was doing formerly? Then what is the thing that is lacking in it?

Brahmānanda: Similarly, if there's a dead body and they just add some chemicals, that doesn't necessarily mean it will come alive again.

Prabhupāda: No. No. Chemicals are already there. If you say that the chemical is the cause of life, that chemicals are there. Because other lifes are coming. How do you say the chemical is wanting.

Brahmānanda: Don't they say that when death means chemicals are gone...

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No.

Brahmānanda: ...breakdown?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: The life, the life energy, the heart...

Prabhupāda: No, no. Life energy, what is the cause of that life energy? Chemicals.

Morning Walk -- April 26, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: They were still alive...

Devotee: ...in a human form.

Prabhupāda: Yes, for Kṛṣṇa, there is no such consideration, human form or plant form or... Everyone is part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa. Why you are anxious to know about the human form? Why? Eh? What is your answer? Question: Tulasī devī should be in human form. Why you are asking this question?

Devotee: I was wondering is she was alive in human form while Kṛṣṇa was on earth.

Prabhupāda: No, no. She may not be. But where is the wrong if she's not in human form? Eh? Everyone is alive, plants, beasts, everyone is alive. Why you are so much anxious for the human form of life?

Devotee: It wouldn't matter.

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa can talk with animals, with trees, with plants. That is Kṛṣṇa. Do you think that "I cannot talk with plants, therefore the plant should be in human form?" That is your conception. If I can talk with everyone, then where is the difference for me, a human being, or an insect or plant? So there is no such question that everyone should be in human form. Then one can talk with Kṛṣṇa and enjoy.

Morning Walk -- May 9, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: What merciful? Animal has mercifulness. They are animals only. This modern civilization is producing animals. That's it. Who was speaking that slaughterhouse they are giving some injection that the animal may not feel pain? Rascal, he is killing him, and he is humanitarian work, he may not feel killed. If I say, "I shall kill you, but you will not feel any pain. Come on." This is their philosophy. They are killing, and they are saying, "Oh, may not be feeling any pain." Such rascaldom is going on. I therefore do not talk with any rascal except my disciples. I know they are all rascals. Waste of time. All this rascaldom is coming out of that wrong notion that life is from matter, that wrong notion.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: That is why they say, "So long as I am alive, enjoy as much as you can."

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is their philosophy. Hedonism.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: If they know that there is life after death or life started from life, then they would not be doing like this.

Prabhupāda: So many things you will change. (pause) And that is mystic power for me.

Room Conversation with David Wynne, Sculptor -- July 9, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: You have to penetrate. You have to understand who has created this universe.

David Wynne: Yes. Yes. But if a great artist was no longer alive, people would still appreciate...

Prabhupāda: No, but the God is not like that, no longer alive.

David Wynne: No, but that's what I mean. The analogy falls down there, doesn't it.

Prabhupāda: God is not like that.

Śyāmasundara: But you're saying that it's better to first penetrate and understand God.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Garden Conversation with Mahadeva's Mother and Jesuit Priest -- July 25, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Potato is not animal. It is fruit.

Jesuit Priest: Is that tree alive?

Prabhupāda: It is a fruit.

Jesuit Priest: Is that tree alive?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Jesuit Priest: Has it got life?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation with Mister Popworth and E. F. Schumacher -- July 26, 1973, London:

Revatīnandana: The distinction between killing a cow and cutting off a cauliflower from a plant. He said, "Both are alive." Yes, both are alive. But what is the psychological state of a cow, and what is the psychological state of a cauliflower plant? Practically speaking, he has no psychology. No senses, no mind, no ability to feel elation or suffering. But a cow is a completely different condition. Cow is very nearly to human consciousness. Practically the next birth after a cow, according to the Vedas, is a human birth. So you're putting so much suffering unnecessarily. But he had no sense, not... An intelligent man who can sense that "If I suffer, I don't like it," then when he sees another living entity put into suffering, he thinks, "How I could avoid that suffering for that living entity, because I don't like to suffer." But this gentleman had no conception. He's...

Prabhupāda: There is one moral instruction by Cāṇakya Paṇḍita. Cāṇakya Paṇḍita was a great minister during the time of Mahārāja Candragupta. So he was honorary Prime Minister in the empire. So he has a book of moral instruction. So he says in that moral instruction, who is a learned man. So he gives the description of a learned man, that: mātṛvat para-dāreṣu. Mātṛvat. "Just treat all other women except your wife as your mother." Mātṛvat para-dāreṣu, para-dravyeṣu loṣṭravat. Loṣṭa means as there are so many pebbles lying on the street, you don't care for it, similarly, others' property, others' money you should treat just like these pebbles lying on the street or the garbage lying on the street.

Room Conversation with Rosicrucians -- August 13, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: So what is that? Nirvāṇa means zero. Everyone is trying for the zero?

Yogeśvara: (break) Nirvāṇa means something different for them?

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Yogeśvara: (break) He says it is an entering into something that is alive and real.

Prabhupāda: Nirvāṇa, this word is Sanskrit word. Nirvāṇa means finish. (break)

Yogeśvara: For them the word nirvāṇa means an end but an end to this material existence and an entrance into the silence of the Absolute, onto a level that is real, whereas this one is false. This one is rejected.

Prabhupāda: Why silence?

Yogeśvara: He says the term "entering into silence" is a mystic term that means...

Prabhupāda: He cannot explain. (break)

Room Conversation with Dr. Christian Hauser, Psychiatrist -- September 10, 1973, Stockholm:

Prabhupāda: But you should apply your reason, from practical life, whether life is produced from matter, or matter is produced from life. Our proposition is: matter is produced from life, not life is produced from matter. In the Vedānta-sūtra it is said: janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1). Absolute Truth is that from whom or from which everything emanates. Now that Absolute Truth, whether he's life or dead stone. So that is discussed: janmādy asya yato 'nvayād itarataś cārtheṣv abhijñaḥ (SB 1.1.1). That Absolute Truth must be cognizant. So as soon as you say cognizant, then He's alive. Abhijñaḥ. That, that means if I say: "I have produced all these things that is within the room," then means I must have brain. I must be experienced how to do it. How I can be dead, matter? Has the matter has got such thing? The origin of creation must be a living being.

Room Conversation -- November 3, 1973, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Therefore we forbid to take to the karmī's life. Because at the time of death, if he remains a karmī, then he'll have to take birth as a karmī. That is the risk. So this regulated life, holding class, chanting, that will not make us fall down. That is essential. It is essential, regulate, to follow the regulative principles, chanting sixteen rounds, holding class. You can do anything, but this will keep us alive to the Kṛṣṇa consciousness platform. If you neglect that, then that is very risky. Even if you get next life birth in a rich man's family, that is not guarantee. Because generally, rich man's sons, they go astray. They get money for nothing and they want to squander it. And material world, if you have got money, so many bad associates will come and help you to squander your money and spoil your life. Because you have got money, then so many friends will come. As soon as you have no money, nobody will come. Even your wife, children will not come. Therefore hariṣye tad dhanaṁ śanaiḥ. Kṛṣṇa, first of all, takes away the money, makes him poor so that everyone will neglect him, and because he's Kṛṣṇa conscious, he'll take Kṛṣṇa, "Sir, I have no other alternative. Please give me protection." That is also another Kṛṣṇa's policy, special favor, that "This man wanted Me. Now he's going astray. All right. That's all right. Take everything of his..."

Morning Walk -- December 17, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Need for God, yes. Scientist, you are also writing?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda, yes.

Prabhupāda: There is need. (break) ...not falling down. Why the law of gravitation is violated?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They say the cells are alive when the...

Prabhupāda: They say. They have got this cell theory. Therefore under condition, this law of gravitation works. It is not unconditional. Then the question is who will make the condition?

Karandhara: Well, they say that the green apple's not falling is just a case of an opposite factor being stronger than the pull of gravity. The strength of the twig holding the apple on is stronger than the pull of gravity.

Prabhupāda: That I say, that the law of gravitation acts under certain conditions. This is also conditional.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 7, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: No philosophy. Simply rascaldom. Simply rascaldom. And that is being preached by the priestly class. Priestly class. Just see the society! What third-class society! (pause) (break) ...the soul enters after the birth of the child. Eh? Is it not? Therefore killing or abortion is not bad.

Devotee: Oh, they say that abortion isn't bad because the child is not fully formed and therefore is not really a life. It's not really alive.

Prabhupāda: Just see. Therefore one man who is sleeping, he has no soul.

Bali Mardana: No one... They do not believe that generally.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Bali Mardana: They admit that they are killing.

Prabhupāda: They admit?

Bali Mardana: That they are killing the child. But they do not care. 'Cause they don't want to take the trouble to raise it.

Gurukṛpā: Just like the rabbit.

Prabhupāda: Rabbit philosophy. So therefore, considering from all points of view, our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is the best in the world. There is no doubt. You must be convinced about it. Otherwise, how you can preach?

Room Conversation -- February 13, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Oh yes, I was Dhawan's guest sometimes.

Dr. Kapoor: You were his guest, yes, yes. My son-in-law was telling me.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Kapoor: He was telling me.

Prabhupāda: I think that gentleman is no longer alive.

Dr. Kapoor: His father is no more.

Prabhupāda: No, yes, I am speaking of the old Dhawan.

Dr. Kapoor: Ah, I see.

Prabhupāda: Even though he was a young man.

Dr. Kapoor: Ah, he was a young man. When did you go to Kanpur?

Prabhupāda: I think I went to Kanpur sometimes in the year 1956.

Morning Walk -- April 10, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: (break) ...deliver each and every child to Kamsa, but in the case of Kṛṣṇa he did not do so. He did not deliver. He cheated him by changing. So to give protection to Kṛṣṇa, they had to do something, even it is not sanctioned. He violated because he promised before Kaṁsa that "I shall deliver all the children," and he did it. But when there was Kṛṣṇa, he broke the promise.

Śrīdhara: "Vasudeva continued, 'My dear friend it is very difficult...' "

Prabhupāda: Therefore Vasudeva is very jubilant that Kṛṣṇa is now alive and His birthday ceremony has been performed. Therefore he is so pleased.

Śrīdhara: "Vasudeva continued, 'My dear friend, it is very difficult for us to live together.' " (break)

Prabhupāda: ...cows were getting grass also. Water. But you will find there is no water, there is no grass in the field. And the government is sending the cows to the slaughterhouse. This is the condition of present India. In Europe, America, although they are selling the cows to the slaughterhouse, they have got enough grass and water. That I have seen. At least so long they live, the cows are comfortably maintained. But here there is no comfort for the cows. Now here the anxiety is whether the cows are getting sufficient grass and water.

Morning Walk -- April 22, 1974, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Yes. There they are captured.

Pañcadraviḍa: But everybody is killing.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break)

Pañcadraviḍa: ...vegetables are also alive.

Prabhupāda: No, everyone... We are not talking of everyone. We are talking of you. You love God. So why you are killing? No, killing... There is open declaration, "Thou shall not kill." So you are deliberately disobeying. Then where is the love?

Pañcadraviḍa: "But even if I become vegetarian, still, I will..."

Prabhupāda: No, no, that is not questioned. God says that you shall not kill. But you are killing. Where is your love? You cannot argue with God. Then you do not love. You cannot put your argument, logic, "What God has said I must do." That is not...

Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Yogeśvara: Is it South...

Nitāi: Andes, yes.

Yogeśvara: I think so. I'm not sure. I don't know for sure. But in the mountains a plane crashed and there were eighteen survivors. And to stay alive they ate the dead bodies of the passengers who died. So there were many articles. "What was it like?" Everyone wants to know, "What was it like to eat human flesh? Do you feel bad now that you have eaten human flesh?" "No."

Guru-gaurāṅga: Who's left a copy of Bhagavad-gītā here?

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Who's left this copy? That's his, this young boy.

Yogeśvara: There have already been books written about it, television reports, radio, everything.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: One thing on that report. I read that there were certain people...

Prabhupāda: There was no vegetable?

Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: There was no vegetable?

Yogeśvara: No, it was way up in the mountains.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Icy, cold.

Yogeśvara: It was very cold. There was no plants, no nothing. They had to stay inside the plane just to stay alive, to stay warm. So they could not go and get food anywhere.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: And the bodies were already dead. And there were certain people that they knew their bodies, his fiance or his sister. They agreed that if they were going to eat the bodies they would eat them last. It's true. It was in the story. One man, he had his prospective wife. One man had his sister or sister-in-law, cousin. They said, "If we're going to eat the bodies, then we'll eat them the last." So they had a sense that this body is more important than that body, like that.

Prabhupāda: No, in last war they ate stool also.

Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Yogeśvara: They made some... Afterwards they had to... There was some discussion, some philosophy. They were actually discussing. And there was one person there who was explaining to the others that "We must eat this flesh to stay alive but it's not so wrong since the soul has left the body." He said, "The spirit has left these bodies, so you shouldn't consider it to be quite so bad. We're obliged to do this."

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is not unreasonable. It was a question of selection. Otherwise, to subsist, to eat the dead bodies, flesh, that is not very abominable. That can be accepted. But it is the selection whether one will eat. That is another thing. Otherwise dead body's flesh is as good as anything else because it is matter.

Yogeśvara: So who is coming?

Guru-gaurāṅga: There is one more meeting today.

Prabhupāda: Where?

Guru-gaurāṅga: There is the European Center for Nuclear Research.

Prabhupāda: What can I do there? (laughter)

Room Conversation -- June 11, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: No, fast, fast. Fast means you have to eat the cow's flesh. So how you can make it fast? The cows' number are the same. So it will remain the same. Simply you wait for the natural death. Where is the restriction? You have got a limited number of cows. Either you wait for the death, or you kill it at once, the number of cows are the same. So we simply request you that you don't kill them. Wait for the natural death and take it. What is the wrong? The number of cows is the same. You cannot increase it. Increase or decrease, the number of cows is there. So we simply request you that so long they're alive, let us take it's milk, and give nice foodstuff to the human society.

Room Conversation with Mr. Deshimaru -- June 13, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: How you can change? Can you make the dead body alive? (French)

Karandhara: I can say that life is not present in a dead body, but you can't say that death is present in a live body. (French)

Prabhupāda: No, he says that the living force and the body is the same.

Devotees: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Does he not say? But why the body becomes dead, and the living force go on? Why? Why the body is no more moving? (French)

Pṛthu Putra: He says when the body is dead, everything is gone, but what is still existing is the karma.

Prabhupāda: Is the karma.

Morning Walk -- June 17, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: Everything is worst. Sinful is sinful. Disease is disease. This body, either it is living or it is dead, it is not very important thing. Now see. And the whole world is after this body. Kṛṣṇa says, "The body, either dead or alive, it is not a subject matter for serious consideration." Now see. And what the world is going on? Simply for bodily... Body means senses. It is very difficult to the, for the western people to understand that body is not important thing; the soul is important thing. First of all, they do not know what is soul and then consideration of importance. This is their position. And if one cannot understand what is soul, what he will understand about God? Soul is a minute particle of God. If one cannot understand about this minute particle, then what he'll understand of the Supreme? In the laboratory, if you can test a little sample, just like take a little sea water, analyze, you chemically test, then you can understand what is the composition of the sea water. But if you have no knowledge even a small drop of sea water, how you'll understand the sea, what... That is their position. They do not understand even the sample of spirit soul, as we are.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: We take this body—dead always. This body is actually dead. Just like this microphone is made of iron. It is iron. When it is working, responding, at that time also it is iron. And when it is out of order, does not work, it is also iron. Similarly, this body is working on account of the living force within. When the living force is out, it is called dead. But actually it is dead always. The living force is the important thing. That is making him alive. Actually alive or dead, it is dead matter. But the living force is the active principle. That is distinguishing this body as dead or alive. But factually it is dead always. That is the beginning of instruction, Bhagavad-gītā: "Arjuna, you are lamenting for this body, but the body is dead." Aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ prajñā-vādāṁś ca bhāṣase (BG 2.11). So unless we know that... (aside:) Don't make "cut-cut." The dead body is not the subject matter of study either it is in working order or it is in dead order. The subject matter of study is the active principle which makes the dead body moving. That is the beginning of Bhagavad-gītā. Read that portion.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: What is your opinion about this?

Professor Durckheim: May I ask a question? How do you teach your disciples to become aware of this force which is no matter that makes matter alive?

Prabhupāda: That active principle, life, or living soul.

Professor Durckheim: Yes, how do you teach them to become aware of it? You see, now I listen, and that is, if you like, first a philosophy which contains the truth. I don't doubt it. But how to make feel?

Prabhupāda: It is very simple thing. Just like a body is moving, and body is not moving. So there is an active principle which makes the body moving, and when it is absent, it is not moving. Now, the question will be: "What is that active principle?" Athāto brahma jijñāsā. First of all let him distinguish what is the difference between this dead body and living body.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Professor Durckheim: May I ask a question? It is quite clear for our rational mind, I can understand there is a dead body, and there must be something in him, enough to make it alive. Now, the conclusion, I say there are two things, that my question was how he becomes aware in himself as an experience, not as conclusion, because I realize that on the inner way it becomes important more and more to feel deeper and deeper and deeper and deeper realities. That's why in my little work I make a distinction between the body you have and the body you are. The English language says, talks about "somebody" and "something." "Somebody" means a person. So the body you are. It's the whole of the gestures wherein you express and you present and you miss or you realize your real self. So the body you are. Usually if you go to a doctor he sees only the body you have. He tackles it like a machine. If somebody with shoulders like this, he says, "Well, you must make exercises." If somebody comes to me with shoulders like this, I say, "The body you are, you have no confidence in life. So get an attitude of confidence." So he gets to know the body he is, not only the body he has, which doesn't at all touch at your wisdom.

Prabhupāda: No, as I say, the active principle, I am also the active principle. As I say, the dead body and the living body, difference is, when the active principle is not there, it is dead body. Similarly, I am also the active principle. So 'ham, so 'ham: "I am the same active principle." Ahaṁ brahmāsmi: "I am Brahman. I am not this material body." That is self-realization. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati: (BG 18.54) "When one is self-realized, then he is jolly." Prasannātmā. He is never morose. He is jolly. Na śocati na kāṅkṣati: "He has no lamentation, no hankering." Samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu: "He is equal to everyone, man, animal and everything." And mad-bhaktiṁ labhate parām: (BG 18.54) "Then devotional life begins."

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: So that different principle, for a devotee is already realized. Because a devotee never thinks of this body, that "I am this body." He thinks "I am...," ahaṁ brahmāsmi: "I am spirit soul." So without that realization, there is no question of devotional life. So that is first understood. That instruction is being given by Kṛṣṇa to Arjuna, that "You are considering very seriously on this body, but a learned man does not take this body very seriously, either dead or alive." That is the first realization. So everyone in this world, they are concerned with this body, dead or alive. When alive, they take care of the body in so many ways, and when dead they erect big statue upon it. So that realization is this body. When it is alive, very nicely dressed, nicely groomed, nicely everything on account of this body, and when dead, then again the statue, the tomb, that's all, but missing the active principle. He is taking care of this body even after death by erecting very nice memorial, but he has no knowledge where the active principle has lost. That is ignorance.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: The soul is different from the body.

Vedavyāsa: Yes, but at the same time, he says there must be a very intimate connection of, actually a oneness of body and soul. That is what is now.

Prabhupāda: No, no.

Dr. P. J. Saher: As long as we are alive.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is not oneness. Just like this room is important so long I am living. Otherwise it has no importance. (German) (break) ...soul is gone from the body, even the body is very dear, I throw it away. (German)

Vedavyāsa: He doesn't want to separate.

Prabhupāda: But you must separate. (laughter) As soon as your death comes, your body will be kicked out by your relatives.

Morning Walk -- June 21, 1974, Germany:

Professor Durckheim: Once when I was in Paris and walking the streets and nothing but stone and stone and iron and nothing alive, I suddenly heard a voice, coming from beneath, as if there were a big, big one. I heard the voice, if you like, of God and saying, "Well, isn't there not a little spot there where I could manifest myself?" The sadness of God. I heard the voice, "This is the sadness of God." Was very impressive to me. Really a real voice in myself. Because a town like this has no place, no channel, for His voice to come through.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Professor Durckheim: That was the feeling at that moment. (break) ...smell of the baked bread.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.

Professor Durckheim: Is it very agreeable?

Prabhupāda: What can be done? We have to be accustomed because we have to go all the western countries, the boiling meat. So let us go out now.

Room Conversation -- June 28, 1974, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: That's all right. Yes. Formality, you should be respectful. Suppose your enemy—that is etiquette-comes in your room. But when he has come to your room, you should offer him respect: "Come on, come on. Sit down." That is etiquette. You know that "He's my enemy." That... The etiquette according to Vedic civilization: gṛhe śatrum api prāptaṁ viśvastam akuto-bhayam. Even your enemy comes at your home, you should treat with him in such a nice way that he'll forget that you are his enemy. Gṛhe śatrum... That was... Just like Jarāsandha and Bhīma. They, they wanted that "We want to fight with you..." (Break) Unless one of the kings died... (Break) ...a strong flavor, and it is continually, continues. So long it is alive, the flavor is there. So where is that art, where is that science? When you have... Where is that scientist amongst the human society? They are very much proud of their scientific advancement. Everything see, the flowers and leaves, so artistically, beautifully manufactured that simply by seeing them you'll feel pleased.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Professors -- February 19, 1975, Caracas:

Prabhupāda: No, this is example. By receiving a knowledge, you must corroborate by your knowledge or by your experience, by the method. Just like in the Bhagavad-gītā, it is said that Arjuna was declining to fight in the war. So Kṛṣṇa said that "You are simply lamenting on this body, but you do not know what is the active principle of the body." So this you can understand very nicely, that everyone is working for this body, but nobody knows what the active principle of the body. Without the active principle of the body, this body, alive or dead, is the same thing, lump of matter. So Arjuna accepted Kṛṣṇa as teacher; therefore He is chastising him that "You are talking like a learned man, but you are lamenting on this body, but no learned man laments on this body, either dead or alive." Because without the knowledge of the active principle which is moving the body, what is the use of simply understanding the bodily construction? The medical science knows the construction of the body, anatomy, physiology, the bone, this muscle, the blood and everything, but he does not know what is the active principle.

Room Conversation with Psychiatrist -- February 22, 1975, Caracas:

Prabhupāda: So this verse says that "You are speaking like a learned man, Arjuna," He addressed Arjuna, "but you are not very learned man because you are considering of the body." Just like the proprietor of the car, the driver. While the car is going on nicely or car is stopped, no more working, he is disinterested that he knows very well that "I am not this car." Therefore it is said, gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ. "Anyone who is actually learned, he does not consider very seriously about the body, either it is dead or alive." So basically we are, all, every one of us, we are spirit soul. The body is just like a machine. We have got it. But we are taking of the machine very much, not for ourself. Whole world is taking care of the body but not of the driver of the body, the spirit soul. Everyone is thinking, "I am this body, and because this body is born in America, I am American, and because the body is white, therefore I am white, or black." In this way everyone is identifying with the body. Nobody is identifying with the spirit soul. That is the basic disease of the human society.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- March 1, 1975, Atlanta:

Prabhupāda: That's all. So where is the question of creation? But because we have got these material eyes, we want to see everything through this material manifestation. We are seeing that he is dead, he is alive, he is born, he is this, that...

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But that is the defect of the scientists. They only see the body.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is their defect. Therefore asses, go-kharaḥ. That is defined. Anyone who takes the body as the self, he is a go-kharaḥ, animal. And that is our protest, that "You are animal; you are passing as very learned scholar, scientist." That we want to protest. We want to expose them, that they are cheating people. They have no perfect knowledge; still, they are passing as scientist and big men and... That is our protest.

Room Conversation with Bernard Manischewitz -- March 5, 1975, New York:

Prabhupāda: Sacrifice means restriction. One meaning of sacrifice is: if you believe in the śāstra, the animal is going to get next life as a human being. Because he is being sacrificed under Vedic rituals, so he is given promotion immediately, to human life. So he is not loser. His body being sacrificed before the deity, he gets the opportunity of getting a human life immediately, for which he had to wait perhaps thousands and thousands of years, because the evolution will go. Of course, after animal life the next life is human life. So anyway, he is given the concession to get a human form of body immediately after this body is destroyed, and with the right that he has the right to kill the man who has killed him. That mantra is cited, that "He was sacrificing your life, so you get immediately human form of body, and you can kill this man." So this is the Vedic rituals. Another animal sacrifice is there just to make experiment of the Vedic mantra. An animal is sacrificed in the altar, and he is given again life, rejuvenated life. An old cow sacrificed, and he gets a youth, young (body). If the animal comes out alive, then it is to be considered that the Vedic mantras are being recited correctly. Not to kill and eat, no, no, that is not the purpose. Just like in laboratories, they make some experiment on the animal, similarly this is like that.

Room Conversation with Reporter -- March 9, 1975, London:

Prabhupāda: ...he did not like to kill his cousin-brother. He said that "Even they usurp my kingdom, I do not wish to kill them." So this affection, this bodily affection, was not very much approved by Kṛṣṇa. He said that "You are talking like a non-Āryan." Anārya-juṣṭam. Anārya. "The Āryan, they do not think like that." Another place He says that "You are giving consideration on the body, but any learned man does not refer to body, either dead or alive. They, learned man, will give stress on the moving force of the body." So Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement means basically on the moving force of the body.

Reporter: The moving force of...?

Prabhupāda: Of the body. Just like you are moving, I am moving. As soon as the moving force, whatever it is, is gone, then your body is a lump of matter, my body is a lump of matter.

Reporter: Have you had any difficulty in bringing this, which seems to have originated in India, into the West?

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Haṁsadūta: Have we found any problems or difficulty is bringing this teaching, which appears to have originated in India, to the West? Have we found any problem?

Prabhupāda: No, there cannot be any problem. Just like I am speaking to you. If you are sane man, you will have to admit this. The mistake you will have to admit, if you are a sane man. If you are something else, then you will not admit the mistake.

Room Conversation with Reporter -- March 9, 1975, London:

Prabhupāda: That's it. Very... Thank you. (laughter) That is intelligence. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. Mṛtyuḥ sarva-haraś cāham (BG 10.34). Those who are not accepting God in lifetime, they will meet God, death. Death is another form of God. That they cannot deny. Just like Hiraṇyakaśipu. He simply defied God, and Nṛsiṁha-deva came, finished everything within a second.

Reporter: Is this something where we can sort of experience death while we are still alive?

Prabhupāda: Alive, we have been given chance to understand God. But if you don't understand, then next life you become a dog.

Reporter: A dog?

Prabhupāda: Yes. (laughter)

Reporter: Why a dog?

Prabhupāda: Why not? (laughter) Suppose if God says that "You become a dog," can you check it?

Reporter: Is there any way I can prepare...?

Prabhupāda: Yes, that you can if you surrender.

Morning Walk -- March 11, 1975, London:

Prabhupāda: Ivory, yes. There is a current proverb, "Dead elephant, one lakh rupees." Mara hati lakṣa na:(?) "Elephant, alive or dead, one lakh of rupees." On account of ivory. When the elephant is dead, it is put into a hole and covered. And after sometimes you find all the ivory. The bones and the teeth are very, very valuable. Formerly big, big kings, they used to manufacture their furniture of ivory and gold and silk pad. This is luxury. And the rooms bedecked with jewel. No electricity, no lamp. This is description of Kṛṣṇa's sixteen thousand palace. Who has got now? Sixteen thousand wives and sixteen thousand palace of marble and furniture ivory and gold. Where is there now? Therefore Kṛṣṇa is the richest. Aiśvaryasya samāgrasya.

Room Conversation with Canadian Ambassador to Iran -- March 13, 1975, Iran:

Prabhupāda: In where?

Paramahaṁsa: Caracas.

Prabhupāda: Caracas, yes. So one of the crocodile was on the land, and two were in the water. So in the water they were very living, alive. But in the land it was like dead.

Ambassador: I had two crocodiles in my bath in Delhi for a month.

Prabhupāda: Oh, ācchā. You like them very much?

Ambassador: Given by the chief minister of Rajastan, and I had to get them to Canada.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Ambassador: I never managed to love them. I can love most things, but not crocodiles.

Prabhupāda: No, they are also God's creature, but covered by the body. Therefore in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, paṇḍitāḥ sama-darśinaḥ (BG 5.18). Those who are spiritually advanced, they see equally because they know that within the body the spirit soul is there. The spirit soul is part and parcel of God. He is encaged somehow or other in a particular type of body. So a devotee of God is very kind to everyone. Brahma-bhutaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na ka..., samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu (BG 18.54). Samaḥ sarveṣu..., mad-bhakti labhate param. That is the stage of making advance in devotional life—equality. That equality is possible when we are on the platform of spiritual understanding. Otherwise not possible. The United Nation will never be able to unite the nation. That is not possible.

Morning Walk -- May 10, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: You cannot see, but you can perceive. If life comes from matter, then when there is a dead body, put matter and make it alive. Or put chemicals. Chemical is also matter. Make him alive.

Paramahaṁsa: We made some, um, um...

Prabhupāda: No, no, first of all this is my challenge: that here is a dead body, so bring some chemicals. Just like a motorcar stopped for want of chemical, petrol. So you bring petrol and it will be started. Similarly, you bring some chemical and start it again.

Paramahaṁsa: Well, that will require some time to find the chemicals.

Prabhupāda: That means you fool. You are talking nonsenses. You do not know what is that chemical. You prove yourself a rascal.

Room Conversation with Alcohol and Drug Hospital People -- May 16, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: Yes, they have done. Sir Jagadish Candra Bose in Calcutta, Bose Institute, he has proved—he has got machine—that they feel pains and pleasure, which is recorded in the machine. If you pluck one leaf, they feel. Immediately it is recorded in the machine.

Guest (2): Could I come back to that eating of meat? Related to this alive, soul, matter. Aren't you in a sense eating another soul too if you're eating vegetables? Not only if you're eating meat?

Prabhupāda: No, the thing is, the material world... It is said, jīvo jīvasya jīvanam: "One living entity has to eat another living entity to keep himself alive." That is the natural law. But you should have discrimination. Because you have to eat some other living entity, it does not mean that you will eat your own son. You cannot support that "Because I have to live by eating another living entity, so what is the wrong if I eat my son?" Therefore the Vedic injunction is tena tyaktena bhuñjīthā (ISO 1). You are given some jurisdiction. You can eat. And actually you do so. Because I have to eat something, we do not eat anything and everything. We have got discrimination. So according to Bhagavad-gītā... Find out this verse, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati.

Morning Walk -- May 18, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: So, these classes of men are now predominant.

Amogha: They are what?

Śrutakīrti: Predominant.

Amogha: Predominant.

Prabhupāda: Yes. They are taking care only of this body which is—dead or alive—it is not subject matter of seriousness. I shall tell you later on.

Amogha: Excuse me.

Prabhupāda: I'll tell you later on.

Amogha: Okay.

Prabhupāda: (taking prasādam) (indistinct) But it has got some arrangement, it does not fall down.

Amogha: Yeah, well they accept that also. They say only if there is no such arrangement, then it will fall down.

Prabhupāda: That means conditional. And who makes that condition? That means ultimately you have to accept the existence of God.

Morning Walk -- May 23, 1975, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: No, it is not killing. If you take fruit, where is the killing? The tree is there. If you takes food grains, the food grains, after being produced, the tree dies automatically.

Śrutakīrti: Yeah. Wheat is harvested after it dies, not while it is alive.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Australian devotee 2: Śrīla Prabhupāda, in New Zealand we have a situation where the main industry is killing animals, the biggest industry, yet there is so much rain, so much nice atmosphere over there. Why is this? Why is there such a nice atmosphere but they are killing so many cows? Is that that they are innocent and they do not know and so Kṛṣṇa is not punishing them so much?

Prabhupāda: Yes, they will be punished. (pause) (break) ...so many motor accidents. And there will be war. Then wholesale punishment. Then killing, being killed within the womb of the mother. They are being punished. Nowadays these things have been introduced. Now this child which is being killed by the mother, they are all these sinful men. They cannot come out even, out of the womb of the mother. There they are killed. Nature's law is very strict.

Room Conversation with Mr. & Mrs. Wax, Writer and Editing Manager of Playboy Magazine -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Oh, yes. It is a wholesale reaction. All these crises are taking place. They are killing their own child. Own child means that child is criminal; therefore it is being killed within the womb. Nature will take action. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). You are not independent. So if you work independently, then you will have to suffer. The law of nature is there. You cannot avoid it. If you infect some disease, you must suffer from the disease. You cannot avoid it. This is the law of nature. Law of nature is working in such a way that as you are infecting... Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgaḥ asya sad-asad-janma-yoniṣu. Find out this verse. Why there are varieties of life. One is tree, one is cat, one is dog, one is human being, one is blind, one is lame, one is educated, one is foolish—why? Why the difference, varieties? And that is answered in the Bhagavad-gītā, kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya: "As you are infecting the modes of material nature, you are getting your birth." Otherwise, how you can explain by nature there are so many varieties of life, 8,400,000 species of life?

Jayatīrtha: You mentioned several times that those persons who are guilty of abortion, then they also enter a womb, but they never leave it alive. They're also killed within the womb.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That means... That child is killed means it must take another birth. Again in the womb it will be killed. Again another womb. This is going on. Mūḍha janmani janmani (BG 16.20). It is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, "Birth after birth they will be put into the darkness of life."

Morning Walk -- July 14, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prabhupāda: So concept of cell is the cell is just like bricks. Matter and spirit, two things are there. Either it must be matter or must be spirit.

Ravīndra-svarūpa: But it's seen that the scientists, they can take some skin from your body and by putting in different solutions can keep that skin itself alive for such a long time. They have taken the heart of a chicken out of the chicken's body and then kept it beating for so many hours even though that heart was away from the main chicken. Or they take some other tissue and keep it alive. So they say that each cell is an individual living being.

Prabhupāda: So we have no objection.

Ravīndra-svarūpa: That is all right. So there is a spirit soul in every...

Prabhupāda: No, no. All right or not all right I don't say. But if they say like that, we have no objection

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So the understanding to find out what life is is just to study what a cell is. That is their... They say that cells are composed of these molecules.

Prabhupāda: What is the position of the cells when the man dies?

Morning Walk -- July 14, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prabhupāda: Then an ant, an ant?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No.

Prabhupāda: Then what is this? (laughter)

Svarūpa Dāmodara: (laughing) But the cell is still alive.

Prabhupāda: But you said that as soon as the man dies, they also die.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: That is what my question arose, how these, the relationship between the jīvātmā in cells and the jīvātmā in the heart.

Prabhupāda: The jīvātmā... If the cells are living entities, then why do they not remain? Just like other living entities, they remain in the body and they come out. Even the man who has died, he is not there, but the other living entities are there.

Morning Walk -- July 17, 1975, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: What they will do by serving science? The birth, death is already there. So they are becoming saner, that "What is the use of wasting time in this way? We cannot solve any problem." That is sense. They cannot solve any... He is still alive or died?

Dharmādhyakṣa: He's alive.

Prabhupāda: So ask him that "Find out some bomb that you will not die. Why don't you do that?" (laughter) Yes. "People are dying, and you have invented something to die very soon. So why don't you invent something that you will never die? Can you do that? Therefore we are no more interested in science. It is a waste of time." Tell him. You go your professor. "You are regretting that young men are no more interested. So this is our reason because, after all, we have to die. Everything will be finished. Then what is the use of studying? You have not improved anything. The animals have also two legs, and two, four legs. We have got also four legs and where is the difference? You say, the Darwin's theory, from monkey, man has come, but you never shown us that a monkey has ever given birth to a man. So all this false propaganda, we are no more interested."

Room Conversation -- October 4, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: So this argument, how he can refute, that he has died twenty-two years?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Well, he can also say that he has lived twenty-two years, because he has no perception of any life before that time. He can't remember living before.

Brahmānanda: "Before, I was not alive. Now I am alive, so I have lived for twenty-two years. Before, I was dead; I was not alive. Now I am alive, so I've been alive for twenty-two years."

Prabhupāda: So before, you were not alive. Then how your life came?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: The combination of...

Prabhupāda: Do it. Again foolishness. These rascals... (laughs) Then, if you can create life, then where is the question of dead body? You create again. Give life again. If you are so competent that you can give life, combination, then this dead body is there. You bring chemicals and inject.

Room Conversation -- October 4, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: (laughs) Yes.

Brahmānanda: At the present moment, I was reading, there is one girl in America, New Jersey, teenage girl. And for some unknown reason she went to sleep one night, and in the morning she did not wake up. So they then rushed her to the hospital, and they have an artificial machine that is keeping her alive, and this has been going on for one month. All of her bodily functions are becoming more and more diminished, but still, by this machine, she is alive. Now this has gone on for one month. So now they don't know what to do with her. Should they keep her like this, just running on the machine, or should they stop the machine and then she will die? This is a big legal problem. They don't know what... If they stop the machine, they'll be accused of manslaughter.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Some Catholic priest said that better to let her die, because this is God's way.

Prabhupāda: Then he has to accept the God's way and give up the machine.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But in a situation like that, isn't it more valuable to preserve human life because there's the chance...

Prabhupāda: What is the use?

Morning Walk -- October 19, 1975, Johannesburg:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: If you're still alive then.

Indian man (1): Is that also effected through karma maybe, Swamiji?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Indian man (1): Is that also effected through karma maybe?

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) ...the whole, you are getting sufficient food to eat.

Indian man (1): Yes, that we are.

Prabhupāda: But Indians are not getting that. You are better than the Indians in India.

Indian man (1): That's what everybody says who comes from...

Prabhupāda: Oh, I see. Here I see you are prosperous than in India. You go to the ration shop; you simply find all rejected food grains.

Morning Walk -- October 26, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: So the news was there that Jesus Christ, after crucification, he was alive, and he went to... (aside:) Not so near. And he went to Kashmir. So by the yogic process, in samādhi one can remain alive although superficially he is seen that he is killed. That is possible. Hiraṇyakaśipu did that. He was undergoing tapasya for one hundred years of the demigods. Their duration of time is: our six months, their one day. So such a long time he was undergoing austerity, penance, and thus he became perfect. So his body was practically finished by the earthworm, what is called, moths and ants.

Brahmānanda: Because he was standing still?

Prabhupāda: Yes. For so many years everything was eaten. Only on the bones were there.

Brahmānanda: So he appeared to be dead, but he wasn't.

Prabhupāda: No, he was not dead. He was living on bones. Bones were there. Mean, life is not dependent on this material body. One can practice this by yoga. Without this body he can live. Just like ghost. That is possible.

Morning Walk -- November 11, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Again, "Might be. Maybe." (break)

Harikeśa: We were wondering, Śrīla Prabhupāda, about all these people they are keeping alive artificially in the boxes. They have so many people in boxes in the hospitals they are keeping alive. So the big battle is raging whether or not they should pull out the plug.

Prabhupāda: Keeping life?

Harikeśa: They have these artificial machines that pump blood and breathe and digest food, and they pump everything into the body and they keep it alive. So all the scientists are wondering if they should pull out the plugs because it wastes so much money.

Saurabha: There is some disease now that people enter in some coma, and with the machine they keep them alive for thirty years. There's some lady. She is already thirty and the machine since thirty years...

Prabhupāda: So it's still limited, thirty years, not permanently.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- February 6, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: What is that explanation?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So if you're sleeping and I kill you and you weren't conscious that I was killing you, then you're still alive?

Prabhupāda: You are not killed. Then it comes as a... You can go to the court: "It is not killed."

Hṛdayānanda: They will say that... No, I will say. I will take the part of the rascal.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Hṛdayānanda: I'll be the rascal. "No, actually I am killed, because even though I may not be conscious of it, someone is conscious of it. As long as someone must be... Just when something... It is necessary that someone be conscious of it."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, supposing in the woods. You're in the woods and I kill you during your sleep. There is no other human being there.

Hṛdayānanda: "But you were conscious of it. You were conscious of my death, so therefore my death is a fact."

Prabhupāda: Then in the forest there are no animals?

Hṛdayānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: They cannot... They are not conscious?

Morning Walk -- March 26, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: They said everything, but where is the proof?

Cyavana: Well, the scientists saw it.

Prabhupāda: Saw it? Now show us. They saw it at their home.

Cyavana: They put the chemicals, and then it moved. It became alive.

Prabhupāda: All rascals.

Yadubara: In so many years they haven't done anything else.

Prabhupāda: Just see.

Cyavana: No, that's as far as they got, but it really boosted their theory, at least so that they thought they would be able to create life.

Prabhupāda: All rascals.

Morning Walk -- June 5, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Mean.... Dead life organization, how long it will go on? Aprāṇasyeva dehasya maṇḍanaṁ loka-rañjanam... If this body is dead, how long keep it alive by simply painting? Is it possible?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No.

Prabhupāda: It will decompose.

Rāmeśvara: So then everything, the church, everything.

Prabhupāda: Artificially.... Gundan camas kapalethabada-masa. (?) By artificial means you can keep a thing alive for six months. But what is destiny, that will go on all the time. Baḍa māsa. Baḍa māsa: "all the year."

Magazine Interview -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Rāmeśvara: The knowledge that Śrīla Prabhupāda is giving us is actually giving us our real reason to be alive. Most of us didn't know what the goal of life was. We had some ideas about this profession or that, but most of us had no real, you know, aim in life. And this philosophy and this knowledge has now given us proper direction. It's cleared up a lot of bad qualities that we may have had.

Interviewer: Is this your last trip to America?

Rāmeśvara: He's asking if this is your last visit.

Prabhupāda: Not necessarily.

Interviewer: You feel that you can continue to make those serious travels?

Prabhupāda: Well, I began my traveling in foreign countries at very ripe old age, seventy years. Ten years I'm traveling. This is the fifteenth tour all over the world.

Room Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Now what kind of...? This is a fact, just like you have got already another body. Where is that child's body, where is that boy's body? That is finished. This is the proof.

Richard: But I'm still alive.

Prabhupāda: Alive, you are always alive.

Richard: Physically alive.

Prabhupāda: No, physically not. Spiritually, you are always alive. This point is to be understood. The death taking place only of the physical body. That you have to understand.

Richard: Right, but I have never been aware of any proof...

Prabhupāda: That is education. You are not aware because you are not educated.

Richard: Perhaps, but I have never read of anyone else actually proving that there is a spiritual afterlife.

Prabhupāda: Here is the proof, he is giving proof. Therefore I said it requires little brain. He's giving proof.

Room Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Here is the proof, he is giving proof. Therefore I said it requires little brain. He's giving proof.

Richard: I think it requires more than education; it requires faith.

Rāmeśvara: The first question Prabhupāda asked is what is the difference between a dead man and a living man. The body is the same, but something is missing in the dead man, in the dead body. So that is the proof that the body is not living at any time, but there is a living energy, and when that living energy is inside the body, it makes the body seem alive, and if that living energy is taken out of the body, then the body is seen as it really is, a lump of matter. The body is never alive; it is the presence of the soul within the body that animates the body.

Richard: Right, animate, that's the etymology of animation, anima, soul.

Rāmeśvara: So your body...

Richard: I agree with all that.

Rāmeśvara: And that living energy is eternal, and when this body becomes an old man's body, or rather when you get an old man's body, the body you have now will be finished, but you will still be alive because you are that eternal living energy.

Richard: Okay, and what I am saying is that I have, there has never been any empirical proof of that.

Rāmeśvara: But I have already explained that these senses are not the perfect instruments for experiencing reality. Just like sometimes there may be a cloud, and therefore you cannot see the sun with your senses, but that does not mean the sun is not there. It simply means your senses are not powerful enough to see. The senses are imperfect instruments for perceiving reality. The sun is always there, but sometimes you can see it and sometimes you can't.

Prabhupāda: Just like night, this is night, you don't see the sun. That does not mean there is no sun.

Room Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: We don't know anyone.

Richard: Okay, this is a, let me explain very briefly. Here is a girl in New Jersey, near New York, whose brain has died through a traffic accident. Her body is still alive. Her body is still alive, but her brain is dead, she cannot get up, speak, move.

Prabhupāda: This is already explained, the brain is an instrument. The instrument is not working, but that is not death.

Richard: Right, her soul is still alive, is that correct?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Richard: Her soul is still alive, and she is still functioning spiritually, even though her brain is dead. Is that what...?

Prabhupāda: That is possible because soul is there.

Rāmeśvara: The soul is always alive, but the fact that she's being maintained means the soul's still in that body, has not left the body yet.

Richard: Okay, now what...

Rāmeśvara: The soul is always living.

Richard: Okay, now what is.... Is the soul in a...

Prabhupāda: That is another proof. That instead of, in spite of the brain is not working, the soul is there.

Room Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That is another proof. That instead of, in spite of the brain is not working, the soul is there.

Richard: Okay, but just let me finish this, and then we'll leave it. The.... Okay, how am I going to say this? Is her spiritual, is her spirit in a less active state from when her brain was alive?

Prabhupāda: Spirit is always active.

Richard: It's always active at the same level?

Prabhupāda: Not same level, because you are understanding the spirit through the body. So body is changing. Just like the soul, when he's in the boy's body, it is talking so many nonsense things. But you don't take it seriously. But when you are grown up, if you talk such nonsense things, then you'll be taken as a nonsense, because the body has changed.

Richard: Okay, what I was leading up to was, her brain is dead, she has no...

Prabhupāda: Not dead, it is not working.

Richard: It's not working, okay. It's not working. She's getting no sensory input. She's not aware of the physical surroundings, and yet you maintain that her soul is still alive and still very active. Now would her state, her physical state, enhance the soul's activity or detract from...?

Prabhupāda: It has nothing to do with it.

Morning Walk -- June 22, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: So long the soul is there, the activities of the body are there. Otherwise not. That is explained—habit. Knowingly, unknowingly. Just like a child is passing urine. He does not know that he's passing, but the body's action is going on like that. But if the child is dead, there will be no more passing. Like that. So long the body is alive, things are happening automatically. Just like this tree, so long it is alive the leaves are coming out, the flowers are coming out, although the trees have no developed consciousness. (pause) In Bhāgavatam we see that when Nanda Mahārāja felt some disturbances from the demons, they decided to change the place. And they immediately, from Gokula, they immediately went to Vṛndāvana. But we don't find anything that they had to take permission. Hmm?

Kīrtanānanda: That's right.

Prabhupāda: So that means formerly this was the system. If there is any vacant land, one can go and live there. There's no question of permission. When you live there and you make your professional activities, then the king will come, take little tax.

Room Conversation -- June 28, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the only life, to think of publication and distribution.

Rādhāvallabha: This keeps me alive. If I didn't have this service, I think I would just die.

Prabhupāda: Even in this weak... I am very weak nowadays. Still, I am working.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Nicely.

Prabhupāda: I think I shall not be able to go for walks. This morning my heart was beating too much.

Hari-śauri: It's very strenuous.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Best would be, then, to rest, perhaps up until at least until Washington and see, because in Washington there may be a very suitable situation. It's hard to walk on these roads also. They are very rough, and the altitude is high.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That we will do. Yes.

Room Conversation -- June 29, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: So let them inspect. What is the wrong there? It should be open. If the inspection, there is nothing wrong, then they can do this business.

Hari-śauri: Generally, though, their inspection is when the animal is alive, they check to see that he has no disease. Then they can be killed. But if an animal dies naturally, then generally it is to be supposed that it dies from some malfunction within the body, that there may be some diseases or whatever. So then...

Prabhupāda: That is artificial.

Hari-śauri: But that is their rules and regulations they have.

Prabhupāda: They'll change. When they, by chemical analysis, they don't find any fault, then they can change. From economic point of view, why this body should be wasted? Let it be utilized. Those that are eating, let them eat. And economic point of view, we save the skin. We require it for our purpose. That is the agreement. After all, we require the skin for our khol making.

Room Conversation -- June 29, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Christians.

Hari-śauri: Even they're exporting beef from India.

Prabhupāda: Yes. They can do anything, take the dead cows. I do not know if there is any chemical composition change. They are eating so many dead animals. Take for fish. The fish is never killed alive, because as soon as you take it out from water, it is dead, after few minutes.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: And they don't consider whether it's a young fish or an old fish.

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: If that was the system, people will not get sick. They will not get sick from eating old animals.

Prabhupāda: No, no. This is all wrong conception.

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: They will say..., simply think the taste there is too tough, the skin may be older.

Prabhupāda: They are eating so many rotten things.

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: Yes. And they are burning it, cooking it.

Prabhupāda: Lobster, it is simply pus. They eat. I've seen it. From whiteness it has become yellow. Puslike. They eat it, what is called that soup? Lobster soup?

Room Conversation -- June 29, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: No, lobsters.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: With the big pinchers.

Hari-śauri: They get the lobsters sometimes alive, and they throw them in boiling water, and they can hear them screaming. But now they're speculating whether it's actually the lobsters screaming because it's being boiled alive or whether it's just air that's coming out from its body and making a squeaking noise.

Prabhupāda: No, that is, apart from that, they import lobster from India, Cochin. They are exporting lobster alive. I have seen. The same ship, they load it with lobster fat, and black creepers, and cashews, they exported. The big, big business firms are exporting. So these lobster, although they are kept in ice and so on, so on, they become decomposed. I've seen in the port, that Commonwealth Pier. There is store of lobster, and the lobster has become yellow and almost melted by decomposing. They are selling that.

Room Conversation -- June 29, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Snakes.

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: Yes, keep it in a jar in liquid.

Prabhupāda: They put in the jar alive?

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: No, they catch it, kill it, put it in the jar.

Hari-śauri: It's like a pickle, they pickle it. And when they want to eat it, they take.

Prabhupāda: So there is poison in the mouth, they cut it?

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: They cut off the head, flesh.

Prabhupāda: Snake they eat. Even in India there is a class, they eat snake. Chinese, they eat. They are Chinese?

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: Yes.

Prabhupāda: They eat anything.

Arrival Room Conversation -- July 2, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: But they are simply interested with the pots. External. Bahir-artha-māninaḥ. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ durāśayā ye... (SB 7.5.31). They are thinking by changing the pot the advancement of civilization will increase. And that is going on. Just like America. You have got very big, big roads, nice cars, everything. You are changing the pot, but the eatable is the same.

Vipina: I heard a nice example given the other day about how living entities are suffering. A black widow, male and female black widow spiders, have sex life. After the sex life the female spider consumes the male spider, eats him alive.

Prabhupāda: What's that? Spider.

Vipina: Black widow. She will eat him after sex, kill him.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) So we are also killing by and by, and she kills immediately. That is the difference.

'Life Comes From Life' Slideshow Discussions -- July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So that differentiates also the simple matter without life. For example, sometimes it has been asked whether a crystal is alive or not. This is confusing to the scientists. Sometimes they say that a crystal is behaving just like a living body, it grows and this and that, they say. But actually there is no flow of matter. That tells us that crystal is not life. There's a fundamental difference. The last point in this connection is that matter is impersonal and life has personality.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So that implies that matter is unconscious and the life is fully conscious.

Vṛṣākapi: It's been said sometimes, Prabhupāda, that you have said that some rocks have life. Some rocks, some stones, are actually souls in them?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Just like in the tree there is spirit soul. Everywhere there is spirit soul, but development of consciousness makes difference. The difference between the tree and man is that man is developed consciousness. Consciousness is developed. Tree is not developed. That is difference, but life is there both in the tree and in man.

'Life Comes From Life' Slideshow Discussions -- July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: That is also Vedic conception, that sex between man and woman is not the cause of life. Unless the living soul comes in the proper situation, the man's secretion, woman's secretion combined together emulsifies, and it creates a proper situation for the rest of the soul. So contraceptive method means that emulsification is disturbed. It does not create the proper situation; therefore pregnancy does not happen. Or imperfect discharge. The main point is that the two discharges, they create a situation wherein the living entity comes and rests. Then it will grow. Not that that is the cause of life. The mixture of two secretions is not the cause of life. That creates a proper situation, and the life comes. And if the situation is not favorable, the soul cannot stay. It has to go to somewhere else. So by the order of Kṛṣṇa, he was to come to take shelter there, but this man and woman checked it, therefore it is sinful; he is to be punished. Just like one apartment is fixed up for me, and if somebody checks, does not allow me to enter, that is criminal. That is criminal, he is to be punished. Unlawful detention. But they do not know the laws of nature, how it is working. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). The law of nature is working very silently, subtle. But they do not know. Ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā kartāham iti manyate (BG 3.27). Rascal is so fool that he thinks that "I can do everything, whatever I like." Similarly, killing of animal. "Life is eternal," one can argue, "then what is wrong? Even I kill, the soul is alive."

Arrival Comments in Car to Temple -- July 9, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: They think that we unnecessarily criticize. But we require everything. But just like a man. When he's alive his decoration, his nice dress, everything is very good. But if he's dead, then it is useless. Similarly, without spiritual consciousness we are dead. Because the body is dead. Because the spirit soul is there, therefore it is moving. The important point is the spirit soul. So if you are simply taking care of the body very nicely, that means you are decorating the dead body. What is the value of it? It is clear? The body is important because the soul is there. So long the life is there, if you decorate the body everyone will appreciate. But if you decorate the dead body, people will say "What a fool he is!" Aprāṇasya hi dehasya maṇḍanaṁ loka-rañjanam. That is simply a popular applause, "Ah, the dead body is decorated," but what is the value of it? Similarly, without spiritual knowledge, this dead civilization simply on the bodily concept of life, it is ludicrous. That we have to condemn. Take Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then everything is... Just like one, if there is zero, then it is ten. Another zero, hundred. But without one, simply zero; it is only useless.

Morning Walk -- July 11, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: You rascal, he's another rascal. And one who believes in it, he's also a rascal.

Hari-śauri: I was reading the other day that at one university they started a course where they take the students through a course of death. They study death and then they try to get them to...

Prabhupāda: If it was possible to keep them by medicine, then no rich men would have died. You have got sufficient means to pay for medicine, and he would have kept his relatives, son alive. Bālasya neha śaraṇaṁ pitarau nṛsiṁha nārtasya cāgadam udanvati majjato nauḥ. Prahlāda Mahārāja has said. It is not possible.

Rāmeśvara: They are very hopeful that modern medicine can keep them...

Prabhupāda: They are hopeful of everything. That is their foolishness. Hope against hope, that's all. The hope will never be fulfilled, still... Therefore they are called pramatta. Pramatta means mad, crazy. Their hopefulness means that is a proof that crazy, mad.

Morning Walk -- July 11, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: So in spite of these big, big names and research and everything, man will die. This is bakāṇḍo nyāya. He's thinking it will drop. It will never be possible, but they're thinking that by these big, big names we shall find out the way that man will not die. This is bakāṇḍo nyāya. Hope against hope. So by that method they want to live? No.

Bali-mardana: No. They want to decide when to turn off the machine that is keeping the heart beating, because sometimes the brain stops functioning. The person..., the body is still alive, but there's no consciousness.

Prabhupāda: The coma.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Also they cut out the hearts when they do these heart transplants. They've been accused of taking out the heart of a living person.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: The doctors have been accused of taking out the hearts of living persons.

Prabhupāda: Oh. So how to use it? What they'll use?

Morning Walk -- July 11, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: So it is not very deep.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No. It's a very colorful display. Hundreds of people come, especially on Sundays, sailing their boats.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Śrīla Prabhupāda? In this biomedical science, this ethics, there's a problem arising. The person, the family of the person who is suffering, says that "Please don't apply these machines. Let the person die." But the medical doctors say "No, we'll keep him alive as long as we can go on." So this is a problem. So who's right? Is the family right, or...

Prabhupāda: Family right. Family is intelligent, that "You are rascal, why you are trying? Let him die peacefully."

Bali-mardana: They say "Let him die in dignity. Why keep him in the machine?" The family says "Let him die in dignity."

Rāmeśvara: They keep him in coma.

Prabhupāda: After all, you cannot protect. Why you give trouble at the time of death? You cannot protect; your foolish attempt will not help him. This is the same philosophy, that the animal is suffering, to kill him. Mercy of killing, what is called?

Conversation with George Harrison -- July 26, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: Rādhārāṇī in separation was embracing that tree, tāmala tree. And they say that in Vṛndāvana, only there are four tāmala trees left.

Gurudāsa: Yes, they've said four or six. Very few.

George Harrison: Is this tree still living?

Devotees: Yes, it's alive.

George Harrison: My compliments to the chef. (laughter)

Prabhupāda: What is this water?

Hari-śauri: Lemonade.

Prabhupāda: Is there any more?

Hari-śauri: I just took it out. I can get some.

Prabhupāda: Bring little. So I am very much pleased that you take so much trouble to come here.

Press Interview at Muthilal Rao's House -- August 17, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: In the Bhagavad-gītā Kṛṣṇa says, the first beginning of the teachings of Bhagavad-gītā you have to take. (aside:) No children. Otherwise it will be disturbed. When Arjuna accepted Kṛṣṇa as the spiritual master, śiṣyas te 'haṁ śādhi māṁ prapannam (BG 2.7). First of all, he was talking like friends. When he saw "The friendly talking will not help us," so Arjuna accepted Kṛṣṇa as his spiritual master. Then as spiritual master He said, aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ prajñā-vādāṁś ca bhāṣase: (BG 2.11) "My dear Arjuna, you are lamenting on the subject matter which is not the subject matter of lamentation, and you are talking like a very learned man." Gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ. This body, either alive or dead, it is not a serious subject matter of study, neither a learned man laments over it. This is the subject matter of Bhagavad-gītā, or spiritual knowledge.

Room Conversation -- August 17, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: And this body is... Either dead or alive, Bhagavad-gītā condemns, gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ (BG 2.11). So these rascals are interested with this body, and they're proud of their advancement of education. Bhagavad-gītā says nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ. So they are passing as great scientists, philosophers, politicians, philanthropists, but all apaṇḍitāḥ. Nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ. That means apaṇḍita. (Bengali) The first thing of Bhagavad-gītā lesson is that aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ prajñā-vādān (BG 2.11). "Talking like a learned man, but you are rascal." Apaṇḍitaḥ. One who is not educated, he's a rascal. So He's indirectly saying, "This kind of lamentation is not for the paṇḍita. It is for the rascal." So whole world is interested with this body, and Bhagavad-gītā's teaching begins condemning the concept of body. Gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ. Dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). Nobody knows this. And they are very learned scholars in Bhagavad-gītā. All these rascals, they're claiming to be learned scholar of Bhagavad-gītā.

Room Conversation About Mayapura Construction -- August 19, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Gargamuni: Oxygen.

Jayapatākā: He can't breath. He is on a bed with oxygen. Life and death any moment. Injection, oxygen, barely staying alive. One day better, one day worse. Now they say better; then again they say worse. (Break) That is what we simply need, are people... I saw the program so nicely if people would simply come and work sincerely, they'll make spiritual advancement. They'll chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Very quickly they'll become Kṛṣṇa conscious. So now we're seeing that... We're demanding that sincere people come.

Prabhupāda: Yes, it may not be the association of lazy people. Free hotel. No.

Jayapatākā: Bhavānanda, he's strict on that.

Gargamuni: He's very strict. Without working, no one can eat.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Not only work. Attending the program. That is essential.

Room Conversation -- August 22, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: This is their utopian theory.

Prabhā Viṣṇu: They are thinking that man will conquer over nature. That's their ideal, that man will become God.

Maṇihāra: Just before I left England... They have so many cows in the south of England, they were grazing. But because it was so hot, the grass was not growing. It was becoming very dry, and no new grass was growing because there was no rain. So then they had to move all the cows to the north of England. Thousands upon thousands of cows, they have to move in big lorries to the north of England where there was some grass. And now in the north of England there is no grass, so they're going to have to move them to Scotland. It's costing so much money. And then the cows are going to become thin.

Prabhupāda: They are killing immaturely. Because they die, they cannot eat. They want to eat fresh, huh? The want to kill them alive. (pause) You want? So let us go down to the car. (end)

Evening Darsana -- September 1, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: That I do not know. I, actually, now it is little troublesome for me to travel all the year.

Indian man (3): You are just gone from (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: Rest, if I rest then there may be... Because I am dealing with all neophytes. If I don't keep them alive by personal presence... Still they are doing nice. I have appointed twenty secretaries all over the world. I am training them. They are managing. Managing nicely. I have been in New York and Los Angeles and Hawaii, all big, big centers. London, Paris.

Indian man (3): Oh, it's a very great. Your program for Kurukṣetra and etc. and the...

Prabhupāda: Program was that they promised to give me land.

Garden Conversation -- September 7, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Where they get this monkeys?

Caraṇāravindam: The monkey's alive and as you drink its brain it dies. They think this is also sport to them. Big horrible demons.

Devotee: In New York, I heard...

Hari-śauri: Andy Warhol. Now... Before I joined the movement I was working on a mining camp and they used to serve out sheep's brains every day. It was a big favorite with the Yugoslavs. Sheep's brains and...

Caraṇāravindam: Hearts.

Prabhupāda: Living sheep and cut?

Hari-śauri: No, no. They kill them first. It's like the Arabs. They eat sheep's eyeballs.

Prabhupāda: They eat?

Room Conversation (Bullock Cart SKP) -- September 12, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That he'll guide you. You do not know. He is from village, he knows. Village or no village, wherever you chant, people will come. That is a fact. Either you chant in Calcutta Maidan or in the village they will be... India is still alive in that sense. We have seen it. We have experience. Wherever we have chanted, people have come.

Lokanātha: When you went to some place in Gujarat, Sanand? It was reported that thousands of people will come. It was a small village...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Village, if you go out they will come like anything. Even in the city we have got experience. In Calcutta we did Maidan. Thirty thousand they were coming. They could not understand English, still they are coming, simply by kīrtana. This Haṁsadūta was performing kīrtana, and all the Bengali ladies coming from outside Calcutta by train, and they're praying, "take this." (indistinct) Still India is alive. And I was speaking in English mostly. Also in Delhi. Still ladies are sitting. (laughs) What they'll understand English? But that kīrtana was so attractive, they sat down only for kīrtana.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with C.I.D. Chief -- January 3, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So you expand it. A dog is thinking, "I am this body. I am bulldog," "I am greyhound." And man is also thinking, "I am American," "I am Indian." But they do not know their real identity, and they are fighting like dogs. And this is going on in the name of civilization. And when we put forward Bhagavad-gītā, the first lesson is that aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ prajñā-vādāṁś ca bhāṣase: (BG 2.11) "Arjuna, you are talking like a very learned man, but you are lamenting about the body. But actually..." Gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ: "So far the body is con..., this is lump of matter. So whether it is dead or alive, nobody seriously think of it, no learned, paṇḍita." Of course, those who are fools, rascal, they can take it. But those who are actually learned, they do not talk about this body. So upon this statement just see the world situation. Everyone is busy on the concept of body. So what is the position of the world? Apaṇḍita, ignorance. And such people are going on as learned scholars, as politicians and leaders and so on. So how there can be peace? If you bring different types of dogs, greyhound and bulldog and Indian dog and bring them—the "United Dog Association" (laughter)—so will there be peace? That is the position. I declared in Melbourne in a public meeting that this United Nation is the unity of barking dog. I told. It was published in the paper. They also criticized me, "The Swami has come to hound." (laughter) But that is actually the fact. If you become impartial judge, not on behalf of CID or anyone, then you see the actual.

Room Conversation -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Pradyumna: And it said, amyasya mati bayayam sakale dve bṛhad-rathāt ye mātra jarayā cāpi sundite. And they're joined by sundite, by Jara. Jīvo jīvete krīdāṁ kriyā jarāsandho 'bhavat sūta. So jīva jīva? Become...

Prabhupāda: Become alive. Jīva. Become alive.

Pradyumna: You had here, "O living entity, just be alive"?

Prabhupāda: Jīva, addressing jīvete. "Be alive."

Pradyumna: And kridantya. "Playing like that"?

Prabhupāda: Playing, joining. Get, be alive, be alive. Like that.

Hari-śauri: Is that Jarāsandha?

Pradyumna: Then translation, "In the womb of two other wives, two parts were begotten from Bṛhadratha. The mothers, seeing such parts, rejected them. Later on, one she-demon by the name Jara joined the parts." Then sounded like "engaged"?

Prabhupāda: Playfully.

Morning Walk -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Trivikrama: Since 1962.

Dr. Patel: I had no idea of it. I am reading his books thinking he is still alive.

Trivikrama: He's a Māyāvādī, anyway.

Prabhupāda: Who?

Trivikrama: Aldous Huxley.

Prabhupāda: Aldous Huxley. He is useless. Anyone connected with the Ramakrishna Mission is a useless. Immediately take it.

Room Conversation -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Doesn't like? Why? What is wrong there? Los Angeles is very nice. I like Los Angeles.

Rāmeśvara: Only the spring and summer. I think it's in her mind.

Prabhupāda: Los Angeles is very nice. What is this?

Rāmeśvara: This is going to be one of the demigods in one of the exhibits. The painting is very, very expert. I've seen some of the dolls that are painted. They look alive.

Prabhupāda: Very good.

Rāmeśvara: Even in the eyes there is a little moisture as if the eye is...

Prabhupāda: Very natural. So I see the dolls... Intelligent boys, they can do it, educated, intelligent. Very good, nice. So many students are engaged...

Rāmeśvara: This is like pottery. Spinning on the wheel, he is designing the ornaments for the crown. Each doll of the demigods has a different crown. That's how they make them, on a spinning wheel just like a potter.

Prabhupāda: They are devising their own way. Eh?

Rāmeśvara: Sometimes.

Prabhupāda: That's nice.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Prabhupāda: Mostly dog. So "Man is known by his company." Your constant company is dog, so what you are? These are the way. Actually, according to Vedic... Why they do not allow Europeans in the Jagannātha temple? Because they are untouchable. According to Vedic civilization, Europeans are untouchable. Muslims and..., untouchable. Not only foreigners, even in their own country, those who are not very cleansed, they are untouchable. Another's eatable things, they're untouchable. Just like hog. If you give him halavā, he will not take it. He will eat stool. Therefore hog is so abominable. Similarly, in your country there are so many nice foodstuffs. Milk is so abundant. You do not know how to utilize milk. You are cutting the poor animal and the rotten flesh you are... You do not know how to utilize the milk. Milk is nothing but blood. Those who are eating, drinking milk with different varieties of preparation, they are also utilizing the blood. But you are drinking blood and flesh directly. You do not know how to keep the animals alive and supply you constantly the blood and eat it.(?) (Utilize?) That you do not know. You are so uncivilized. The man in the jungle, they eat meat because they do not know—they are not civilized—how to utilize the by-products. So you're now in the same position. You do not know how to utilize the blood of cow scientifically. You are so uncivilized. You become... What is milk? The milk is nothing but blood.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Rāmeśvara: They say that because Kṛṣṇa displayed His activities when He was here...

Prabhupāda: Yes. God will play. That is God. God is not dead. Your God is dead. Our God is alive. That is the difference. God must be alive. Why God should be dead? (break) So you are under God's control. Then you say whether Jehovah is God or Kṛṣṇa is God. First of all you must know. You must let us know what do you mean by God. If you describe, "I mean God... by the word God, I mean this," then see whether it is applicable to Jehovah or to Kṛṣṇa. It is not the name. It is the person and the symptom. Just like water is liquid. So you say water, I say jal. But the liquidity of water is the same. So first of all you know what is the nature of God. Then you may say "Jehovah," I may say "Kṛṣṇa," another may say something else. It doesn't matter. Water is water. That is liquid. That's all. So first of all ascertain what is the symptom of God. Can we challenge them that "What is the symptom? How do you know that here is God?" Just like we understand here is water.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Rāmeśvara: But there is another way they can understand also. Just like in Christianity, they all believe Jesus was killed and then immediately he was alive again. So in the same way...

Hari-śauri: After three days.

Rāmeśvara: ...Kṛṣṇa...

Prabhupāda: Resurrection.

Rāmeśvara: Yes. So in the same way Kṛṣṇa also was appearing again during...?

Prabhupāda: No, no, Kṛṣṇa...

Rāmeśvara: Lord Caitanya's līlā is Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is never dead. Just like sun. Sun is never out of the sky. It is in my eyes I see that sun is gone. Formerly these rascals were believing sun is dead at night. The Christians believed like that. Is it not? Some of the Christians believed that at night, sun is dead. And the world is square, flat. This is their knowledge. Lord Buddha, he rejected Vedas. Nindasi yajña-vidher ahaha śruti-jātam. We were being taught that "You cannot deny the authority of Vedas," and Lord Buddha, he denied the authority of Vedas. But the devotees, they are worshiping: keśava dhṛta-buddha-śarīra jaya jagadīśa hare: "Lord Buddha, we can understand your pastime. Still, you are Lord. I offer my obeisances unto you." So the devotees can understand. You cannot understand why Lord Buddha denied the authority of Vedas—to keep you in darkness.

Morning Walk -- January 28, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: This is also arrangement by Kṛṣṇa. Vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām. "I will arrange soldiers. Russia will arrange for military power, America will arrange for military power, and they'll be engaged in fighting so that the overburdened earth will be released from these, all these demons. And it will pave the way for Kṛṣṇa consciousness." And so long they're alive, they'll protest against Kṛṣṇa consciousness: "This is brainwash." So Kṛṣṇa will arrange war between them. Then they'll be finished, and it will be easy for us to make progress. So paritrāṇāya sādhūnāṁ vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām (BG 4.8).

Satsvarūpa: Why will that be favorable for us? You said that will be...

Prabhupāda: Paritrāṇāya sādhūnām, that we are meeting so many obstacles for these rascal demons, and when they will be killed, then our path will be easier. And they will also understand that "This demonic way of life is not good. Let us take to Kṛṣṇa." (break) ...that unnecessarily they fight occasionally between themselves. There is no question of fight. There is a Malthus's theory in economics that when the population is increased, there is... (end)

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: "So whatever the cause, but you have no brain. Cause may be so many things. But you have no brain to understand the simple truth. Where is your brain? So this movement is not brainwashing. Brain-giving. You have no brain." Therefore śāstra says, sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13). Animal has no brain. They say animal has no soul, but that's not the fact. Animal has no brain. Otherwise, all anatomical, physical, physiological conditions are there. Āhāra-nidrā-bhaya-maithuna. But they have no brain. They cannot understand what is the difference between dead man and living man. That is the distinction between man and animal. But if you cannot understand, then where is your brain? On this point. Actually he has no brain. Sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13). That was the point Arjuna was chastised, that "You rascal, you have no brain. You are lamenting on this body and talking like very learned man." Aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ prajñā-vādāṁś ca... (BG 2.11). The whole world is going on like that. They're talking like very big scientist, big philosopher, very big, big, big, but real thing they do not know. "So where is your brain?" Challenge them like that. "You cannot answer. You are big, big scientist, putting forward, 'by combination of chemical...' So why don't you combine the chemical and give the dead man to become alive? Where is your brain? You simply say 'combination of chemical,' but you take the chemicals and combine, then we can understand you have got brain. That you cannot do, falsely taking prestigious position that you have got brain.

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Pradyumna: But ultimately our intelligence comes from scripture and Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: No, that... Apart from scripture, logic, argument come. Scripture we take. That is our business. But you answer on common ground. Where is the difference why there is dead man and alive? What is your answer? Set aside scripture.

Ādi-keśava: That, they say, is beyond our intelligence.

Prabhupāda: That means you are not intelligent. That is the proof. "Beyond your intelligence"—that means your intelligence is not yet perfect. You're lacking in brain. (aside:) I see so many workers simply loitering. They are doing nothing. What can be done? So many. Simply they are taking money. Doing nothing. I see. There is nobody to see. They take advantage. Seventy-five percent of the workers, they are doing nothing. But the Gītā explains that within this body there is something. Not body itself is moving, but dehinaḥ asmin dehe. Within this body there is the real power, dehī, who has got this body. That is there. And because he is there, the body is changing. They cannot understand. No brain, exactly like the dogs and cats. The dog cannot understand that "Within my body, I am." They cannot. Therefore you are no better than dogs. And actual fact is you are not this body. You are within this body. It is a dress. In so many ways Bhagavad-gītā teaches, but you have no brain. Then where is brainwashing? You have no brain to understand your real position.

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: What is that duplication?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In the test tube. We are beginning to make life.

Prabhupāda: That is nonsense. Therefore you have no brain. "In test tube..." Kick aside your test tube. This man is now not working; it is stopped. So bring your test tube and waste test tube. Get him alive, exactly like the motorcar. When there is no petrol, you replace petrol; it starts. So where is that material? Therefore you are comparing something which is not analogous. Therefore you have no brain.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Just because we cannot make the mind doesn't mean that the mind is not material. I may not make it, but still we say it's...

Prabhupāda: No, you say material; we say... We have full knowledge. We say material, but subtle material. But you have no knowledge; therefore you have no brain.

Evening Darsana -- February 19, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Jalaja. First jalajā nava-lakṣāṇi. Jalajā nava-lakṣāṇi. Not only one variety, but nine lakhs of varieties they come out from the water.

Acyutānanda: But where do they come? They're in the water, latent in the water.

Prabhupāda: They're alive. Sarva-ga. Therefore we say that "Why not in the fire?" If there is life in water, why not in the fire? You cannot see. You have no eyes. There is life, and Kṛṣṇa says, nainaṁ dahati pāvakaḥ. Fire does not burn the living being, so why they will be not in fire? And Kṛṣṇa said, imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham. He entered the sun planet.

Acyutānanda: So nothing material can divide the soul, but spiritual, when it enters the spiritual world, then it is dividing.

Prabhupāda: No, there is no question of dividing

Acyutānanda: Māyāvādī.

Prabhupāda: Sanātana. That is Māyāvāda. Kṛṣṇa says, mamaivāṁśo jīva-bhūtaḥ jīva-loke sanātanaḥ (BG 15.7). Sanātana means eternally they are divided. And Kṛṣṇa says further in the Second Chapter that...

Room Conversation with GBC members -- March 2-3, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: This is to give them chance. They are chanting. Some way or other, keep them alive.

Room Conversation -- March 27, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: He was a good soul, but he wanted a little material profit. That doesn't matter. So his father is there.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yeah, his father is actually still alive. Some day, if I get an opportunity, I will pay a visit.

Prabhupāda: Yes. He is very intelligent.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. I even asked him to join this writing of our book, to contribute some chapters, and he agreed to that.

Prabhupāda: Never mind. He has given some service. It will not go in vain. (coughing)

Room Conversation with Scientists, Svarupa Damodara, and Dr. Sharma -- March 31, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Artificial heart and this real heart the same thing—it is material. Where is the difference? There is no difference.

Dr. Sharma: Just like they are trying to produce babies in the test-tube. They are never going to be successful. But they can keep on trying. I recently went to Houston, and there I have read that they cannot keep somebody alive even more than five, six hours. So far away from such a thing.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What about this heart transplant?

Dr. Sharma: Well, the heart transplants actually have been given up everywhere except one place, that's in Stanford Medical Center. And they are doing it because they are the one who initially started it, so they are emotionally stable about it. But actually I have gone and seen there, and they do it... The people are, you know, the recipient patient is very unhappy after the heart transplant. He's very restless, and he has nightmares and he is extremely unhappy.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Has Dr. Barnard of South Africa stopped it now?

Dr. Sharma: Well, he has stopped after doing nine, but Stanford people, they have done about almost over a hundred, and they can keep somebody alive another six months or a year or at the most two years. But the man, the man's existence is very miserable. He has to take so many drugs, and he is bloated like a balloon, and he cannot even do the simple duties like taking walks or going to bathroom. He has to be very careful. If he just slips, it will develop the fracture of his ventricle, and that's all. It is very, very unnatural, and I don't think they can solve this problem at all. It is just man's struggle (for) life.(?) And I know they are saying they will do only in people with proper insurance because the hospital bill is $70,000 for a heart transplant.

Prabhupāda: All rascals, they...

Meeting with Mr. Dwivedi -- April 23, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: And that should be.

Mr. Dwivedi: ...he advised, "It has to be done this way," then no further discussion in the matter. Everybody would carry out what he said.

Prabhupāda: That is wanted.

Mr. Dwivedi: And that is what... So long, at least, I am alive, I want to carry on.

Prabhupāda: Thank you.

Mr. Dwivedi: And happily, in you I find a guru.

Prabhupāda: And my order means Bhagavad-gītā. We don't say anything extra. That is our principle. Caitanya Mahāprabhu says that "You become guru." Āmāra ājñāya guru hañā... You understand Bengali?

Mr. Dwivedi: Just smattering of it.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Āmāra ājñāya guru hañā tāra' ei deśa (CC Madhya 7.128). Suppose you are living in that village. Caitanya Mahāprabhu says, "You become a guru here." Here. You haven't got to go out. Ei deśa, "where you are living." Just see how nice it is. Āmāra ājñāya: "By My order, you become a guru and deliver the people of this place." This is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's... So "I am not educated, I do not know. How I shall become?" No, you haven't got to bother. Yāre dekha tāre kaha kṛṣṇa-upadeśa: (CC Madhya 7.128) "Simply you repeat what Kṛṣṇa has said. You become guru." That's all. Everyone can do that. Gītā is there. You sit down in your place and preach Bhagavad-gītā and try to induce them to take it. You become guru. But these rascals, they are becoming guru and showing magic and so many jugglery, not Gītā (Hindi), and spoil the whole country. Anyway, whatever is done is done. Now Kṛṣṇa has sent you. You have got all arrangement. I am prepared. I am asking my secretary to make arrangement. Let us cooperate. It will be very nice. Mr. Dwivedi is very nice man.

Evening Darsana -- May 13, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: Paper... Yes?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: When Prabhupāda first did the first public kīrtana, they said that "We thought God is dead, but now we see that Swami Bhaktivedanta has made God alive again."

Prabhupāda: This was the first remark. Then, gradually, these boys joined. They were after God, but they were given to understand that "God is dead. Now you take LSD." So the... God is speaking:

mayy āsakta-manāḥ pārtha

yogaṁ yuñjan mad-āśrayaḥ

asaṁśayaṁ samagraṁ māṁ

yathā jñāsyasi tac chṛṇu

(BG 7.1)

"Take perfect knowledge of God from Me." Why don't you do that? Boliye. What is the reason? Boliye, Swamiji. When God is speaking that "You take from Me perfect and complete knowledge of God," so why don't you take it?

Morning Conversation -- May 29, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We had thought about this previously. The difficulty, we felt, was just that no one will... Unless it was used as a temple now, simply to keep it as some room for a few people to see once every month or two when they pass through New York, that's not living. It should be alive.

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: If there's no life in it, then what's the use? That place is not especially a good place for a temple anymore.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: But fifty years...

Prabhupāda: No, so many houses, they are lying vacant. Nobody goes there.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But what to do with it? Prabhupāda's saying... You're going to have someone just sit there?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: For ten, twenty years we may keep it, and in future we may... It may be a great place of pilgrimage for the whole world.

Prabhupāda: That future hope (laughs) you cannot invest money in, waste. That's not good.

Morning Talk -- June 19, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: You say. We don't say. Because you cannot do, you say. We are cultivating Kṛṣṇa consciousness for this purpose. We are not wasting time. And we are wasting time doing so? We are fools? That is the first instruction, that soul is immortal and unchanging. This very instruction they cannot understand. That is first instruction. Dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā (BG 2.13). This simple... A child changes body. That is beginning. There is no... Same child. For a while it may be. Now he's grown up, young man. It is not change of body? Why these rascals cannot understand? What is that improvement of...? Therefore I have said, "You have no brain." It is a fact. My son, he's now young man. He took birth as a small child. Where is that body? Body has changed. Common thing. But these rascals, so fool, they cannot understand. I have become old man, but if some elderly persons, my guardians, were alive, he knew it, "He has become old man, but he was born a small child." That we have given in pictures, change of body. Change of body is going on. Why these rascals cannot understand? What is their intelligence? Therefore the real problem is the change of body should be stopped. And that is real scientific advancement. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā.

Talk with Svarupa Damodara -- June 20, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes. That we say, "matter." Absence of consciousness is matter, jaḍa.

Satadhanya: We say "covered consciousness."

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Bhakti-cāru: But, Śrīla Prabhupāda, the body is matter, but still it is conscious as long as I am alive. So that means the life is consciousness?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So the distinction that we are making is still proper, that matter is the inferior part of that Absolute Truth, and life is the superior part, and without being manipulated...

Prabhupāda: Superior feature.

Morning Talk -- June 27, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Of course, we have made such attempt.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: People write that now they have got your books they are feeling actually alive for the first time. People write like that. They get so many letters at the BBT, thanking them for giving these books. In all languages people are writing you like that. They feel grateful.

Prabhupāda: Yes, I received directly such congratulations in the airport many times. Many times.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: People would come up to you.

Prabhupāda: I think in Japan I have got. One European boy came. He came: "How you have got so much knowledge, sir?" His inquiry was that. In Dum Dum Airport some gentleman came, Indian. The thing is, knowledge was there. It was not presented. (pause) (aside:) He'll take one; you take. (break) Hm? Kṛṣṇa asked the gopīs that "You can take your cloth, one after another.

Room Conversation With Son (Vrindavan De) -- July 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: But in India, they take fresh, lobster.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They do that in America sometimes in the so-called high-class restaurants. You choose your lobster, and then you sit down and they boil it alive.

Prabhupāda: Fresh.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. They put them in live in the boiling water. The people who do that, they have to become a lobster and have the same fate? I think we'd better distribute a lot of your books to inform these people.

Prabhupāda: In India they make lobster and loki.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And loki?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation during lunchtime -- July 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That will counteract the bad news. (break)

Prabhupāda: Keeping alive.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Keeping alive this movement. All our temples are always crowded. In Los Angeles, in the morning class, it is very crowded. That colony has become very nice, Los Angeles. Ṭhik.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yes.

Upendra: The colony.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's what it is. Now you can walk there, and you don't even know you're in America. All you see are devotees, devotees' homes. And it's always growing. It's ever-increasing.

Prabhupāda: "Transcendental meditation." What meditation? Fifteen minutes—finished.

Room Conversation -- October 3, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So call him immediately.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: All right. He said you're living by the grace of Kṛṣṇa. That means it's a miracle that you're alive.

Prabhupāda: I tell him...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In Bombay you appeared to be very hopeless for living. Now that you're in Vṛndāvana, I think you will become more hopeful.

Prabhupāda: That kavirāja was also hopeless.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Which one?

Prabhupāda: Bombay.

Room Conversation -- November 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: There are two things, life or death. So if I die where is the wrong? And if there is death, that is natural.

Jayapatāka: For you Śrīla Prabhupāda, to be alive or to die is no different because you are in the transcendental position, but for us when you leave the body then we are bereft of your association. So for us it is very unfortunate.

Prabhupāda: Then live by my words, by my training. Mm. (pause) So you like this idea? Mm?

Haṁsadūta: I liked it.

Prabhupāda: Who is it?

Adri-dharaṇa: It's Haṁsadūta Mahārāja.

Prabhupāda: Oh. (pause) Most places you beg from the local place and subsist, otherwise purchase.