We have seen, practically. In Calcutta, Mr. C.R. Das. he was earning, say, about fifty years ago, fifty thousand, sixty thousand rupees per month. But on Congress resolution, he gave up his practice and practically he had no income. In one meeting, he was asked by somebody... Everyone thought that he's very big, rich man. Somebody asked him to give him, them some subscription. So C.R. Das admitted that "Now I have no income, by my party, Congress Party, they gave me five hundred rupees per month for my expenditures. So I give you everything." So... Because that was his habit. If anyone would approach him, ask him something, the day's income he'll give him, immediately. But he could not live more than one year. He could not tolerate so much renouncement. Because that was material. But these Gosvāmīs, they gave us their ministerial posts, opulent posts and became mendicants. How they lived? Go... That is stated. Gopī-bhāva-rasāmṛtābdhi-laharī-kallola-magnau-sada. They were merged in the ocean of the love affairs of the gopīs with Kṛṣṇa. Therefore this mendicantism, it was external. They were enjoying better things. So unless you enjoy better thing, you cannot give up inferior thing.
Admit (Lectures, Other)
Lectures
Nectar of Devotion Lectures
Therefore we have to invoke our love for Kṛṣṇa. Then our loving propensities will be actually satisfied. Otherwise we'll be frustrated. Otherwise, we'll be frustrate... That is going on. We may admit or not admit, but this frustration of love affair is going on. So if we... That same thing we repose in Kṛṣṇa. If I want to love my son, if I accept Kṛṣṇa as my son... Just like Yaśodāmayī accepted. Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, but by devotional service, He agrees to become a son. Just like Yaśodāmayī and Nanda Mahārāja, in their previous lives they underwent severe austerities, and their aim was that "We shall have a son like God, like Kṛṣṇa."
So tri... Prabodhananda Sarasvatī Mahārāja says that durdānta indriya-kāla-sarpa-paṭalī-protkhāta-daṁṣṭrāyate. The senses are our enemies. That's all right. We also admit. The yogis try to control the senses and mind because they think of the senses just like serpent. Serpent, little touch by the lip, I mean, the tongue, immediately it causes death. So it is very dangerous. But Prabodhananda Sarasvatī says that "We are not afraid of these serpents because protkhāta daṁṣṭrāyate, the serpent is so long dangerous as long as it has got the poison teeth." Poison teeth.
So although Arjuna did not manifest any yogic power, but, by Kṛṣṇa's grace everything was so wonderfully performed in the Battle of Kurukṣetra. Otherwise Arjuna was a, an insignificant warrior in front of Bhīṣma, Karṇa, Dronācārya. This is admitted by Mahārāja Parīkṣit, that it is simply by the grace of Kṛṣṇa that his grandfather came out victorious in front of Bhīṣma, Karṇa, Dronācārya and similar great heroes.
Otherwise Arjuna was a, an insignificant warrior in front of Bhīṣma, Karṇa, Dronācārya. This is admitted by Mahārāja Parīkṣit, that it is simply by the grace of Kṛṣṇa that his grandfather came out victorious in front of Bhīṣma, Karṇa, Dronācārya and similar great heroes.
Sri Caitanya-caritamrta Lectures
Otherwise, it is not possible. And because the living being takes the superior position for explosion of matter or reaction of matter, therefore in the Bhagavad-gītā it is admitted that the matter is handled by the living being; it is inferior energy. Both of them are energies of the Supreme Lord, but one is superior energy, another is inferior energy. That is the statement in the Bhagavad-gītā. Bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ (BG 7.4), this material things, earth, water, air, fire, they are inferior energy.
This is creation. That Brahmā means not an uncivilized human being; the most intelligent person, first creation. We cannot accept the rubbish theory of Darwin that there was no human being. That is his theory. That is not fact. He admits also that "I have made this by speculation." He has admitted. Our Dr. Svarūpa Dāmodara has quoted from his letter to a friend that he admits that he simply speculated. He has no factual knowledge. So you cannot understand the method of creation by your tiny brain's speculation. You give up this idea. This is not possible at all. You take knowledge from the śāstra, from the person who is perfect in knowledge.
So the Kaṁsa or the asura's plan is how to kill Kṛṣṇa, or God. That is going on. Everyone, "God is dead. God is dead." When I first went to your country the philosophy was that "God is dead." But they admitted, "No, God is living. Swamijī has brought in saṅkīrtana." That also they admit. Yes. So God cannot be dead. If we are not ever dead—na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20)—how God can be dead? That is another foolishness. God cannot be dead. Nitya. Then there is no meaning of nitya. So this is the position of Kṛṣṇa; He is the Supreme Person, supreme ruler without any competitor. Advitīya, no competition.
So we should be always prepared to admit our imperfection. But such imperfection is not in, on the īśvara. Īśvara means "controller." If the controller is imperfect... Suppose a man is in charge, director of such and such a department, education department, and if he's a fool, then what is the use of keeping such man? Therefore īśvara, those who are controllers, they have no such flaw. That is to be admitted first. They are flawless. And what to speak of the Parameśvara. There are two kinds of īśvara. Īśvara, you can, you are also īśvara, but you are now in imperfect stage. When you become perfect, you become īśvara, controller. For example, just like, at the present conditioned stage, we are all controlled by the senses.
So Caitanya Mahāprabhu first of all establishes that in the Vedānta-sūtra you cannot find any flaw; therefore you have no right to interpret. Because you are nonsense rascal, so how you can touch and comment on the sūtras which is compiled by God, the Supreme Perfect? But we do not admit that "I am rascal." I think that I am very much learned, I have no flaw, I am perfect. So these are foolishness. Caitanya Mahāprabhu's point is this, that why the foolish persons go to interpret and comment on Vedānta, which is perfect itself? Do you require to see the sun with this light? How it is possible? The sun is itself illuminated so nicely that you don't require any other light to see sun. If I say, "My dear boy, please come with me and take this light. I'll show you sun in the sky," oh, you'll think, "Oh, Swamijī is a nonsense. What is the use of this light? What is the use of this light?" Similarly, what knowledge you have got that you have to..., you want to comment on the Vedānta-sūtra? It is already illuminated. In the beginning: athāto brahma jijñāsā.
So Brahmā is admitting that this Kṛṣṇa is parabrahman sanātanam. So we have to take evidence from the authorities. There are twelve authorities according to śāstra. Brahmā is one of the authorities. Twelve authorities means,
- svayambhūr nāradaḥ śambhuḥ
- kapilaḥ kumāro manuḥ
- prahlādo janako bhīṣmo
- (balir) vaiyāsakir vayam
- (SB 6.3.20)
Now, here the Brahmā, the first authority, he is admitting Kṛṣṇa as Brahman, pūrṇa-brahma sanātanam, pūrṇa-brahma, bhagavān. Brahman realization, there are stages, three stages of Brahman realization: first, impersonal Brahman, then localized Brahman, then full Brahman. Localized Brahman is Paramātmā, who is situated in everyone's heart. The example is given: just like the sun. The sun is one and the sun is the abode of the sun-god, Vaivasvata. In the Bhagavad-gītā you have to admit,
- imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ
- proktavān aham avyayam
- vivasvān manave prāha
- manu ikṣvākave 'bravīt
- (BG 4.1)
So this Vivasvān, the sun-god, he heard from Kṛṣṇa for the first time about the yoga system stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. Therefore Kṛṣṇa spoke and the sun-god heard; therefore he is a person. And the sun-god's abode is the sun planet.
Just like in our ordinary educational system, there is some prohibition that unless one is graduate, he cannot be admitted in the law college. That is not a prohibition; that is the necessary qualification to understand. Similarly, to understand the Vedas, the necessary qualification is that one must be a qualified brāhmaṇa. Not that Mr. Max Muller, he has got little knowledge of Sanskrit and he translates.
So it is very unfortunate that the Supreme Personality of Godhead, accepted by all the ācāryas, not only at the present age, previously also... Vyāsadeva, Nārada, Asita, Devala, they are all great ācāryas. And in the recent years, Śaṅkarācārya, he also admitted. Rāmānujācārya, Madhvācārya, Viṣṇu Svāmī, Lord Caitanya—all these authorities, they are accepting Kṛṣṇa as the Supreme Personality of Godhead.
In the history you won't find another second person like Kṛṣṇa in the whole history of the world. Apart from other points of view, Bhagavad-gītā, that is admitted, spoken by Kṛṣṇa, such deep, profound knowledge—there is no second imitation or second copy like Bhagavad-gītā in the whole world. That is admitted by all scholars, all religionists. Therefore He is pūrṇa-jñāna, pūrṇa-brahma. Bhagavad-gītā is pūrṇa-jñāna. The Bhagavān's one qualification—He is fully wise. Nobody is wiser than Him.
So Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, admitted by all ācāryas. And on the basis of that authority, we are preaching all over the world that "You are searching after God? Here is God." Kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam. Kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam. In the Bhāgavata has given different list of different incarnation of God but ultimately concludes that ete cāṁśa-kalāḥ puṁsaḥ kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam: (SB 1.3.28) "All the incarnations, they are parts or parts of the parts." Aṁśa means part, and kalāḥ means part of the part. "But svayaṁ pūrṇa-bhagavān, ṣoḍaśa-kala pūrṇa, ṣaḍ-aiśvarya-pūrṇa-bhagavān is Kṛṣṇa."
There is no such thing within your experience which is automatically managed. We must appreciate there is some brain behind it. Professor Einstein, the greatest scientist, he admitted that "As we are advancing in scientific research, we are coming to the conclusion that there is a very big brain behind all this." How you can deny that?
I do not know the goal of my life. I simply wasted my time in sense gratification. I do not know. And still, people say, 'You are paṇḍita,' and I accept it. Just see my position." This is blank slate, admitting that "I am fool number one, but people say I am learned, and I accept it." This is our nature. This is called illusion. He will never think that "I am fool number one." He will always think, "Oh, who can be greater than me? I can think myself. Why? What is the necessity of a spiritual master? I can become a religious leader, I can become such and such, or..." This is our mentality.
Mr. Deyani: Well, I just have one thing here, you stated about Gandhi, and we respect that he was really a great leader of us, but stated one point in your lecture, this thing, that Gandhi, mostly, was a servant of the country, but in India, during that period, I didn't see other religious people or the great leaders of India fighting for the country, and they..., he's the one...
Prabhupāda: That is admitted. Why you are bringing that question? I mean to say that Gandhi gave the best service to you, but your country is so ungrateful that he killed him. That is my point. So the point is that the best service you can give, but you cannot satisfy everyone. That is material.
Mr. Deyani: No, but my question, sir, was that at some point you have to be the servant of the God, you will have to be a servant of your family or the country or something to serve.
The sun, the most powerful planet within this universe, the eyes of the universe... Yac-cakṣur eṣa savitā sakala-grahānām. Without sunrise, however expert you may be in science, you cannot see even. Therefore real eye—the sun. Any sane man will admit. Now it is darkness at night. Have any scientists any instrument to show that everything is visible? No. That is not possible. The real eyes.
We are, in the material world, we are also busy loving somebody. That is our whole business. Unless one has got family affection, love for wife, children, he cannot work. That is the impetus for economic development. It is admitted by big, big economists. A family man is responsible. Because he has got responsibility to maintain the wife, children, therefore he works hard. That is impetus. So love is there. Unless there is love, you cannot work. That is not possible.
We have got a slight idea of Brahman, generally, but Kṛṣṇa is Parambrahman. There are many millions of Brahmans, and above them, the Supreme Brahman is Kṛṣṇa. Paraṁ brahma paraṁ dhāma pavitraṁ paramaṁ bhavān (BG 10.12). Arjuna admitted.
All right, God has come here. See, here is God. "No, this is idol worship." In the Bengali there is a word, ei gule nipamsa pechlo belo gelo (?). So this is our position. This position will not help us. We must admit our position that in the God's creation everything is inconceivable by us. We cannot calculate within our limitation. That is not possible.
The God has His representation in three letters, a, u, m, which is sounded vibrated om. There is no difference between oṁkāra and Kṛṣṇa. It is admitted in the Bhagavad-gītā that oṁkāra 'smi. Akṣaram oṁkāro 'smi: "Of all the letters I am the oṁkāra." So Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare/ Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare and oṁkāra, there is no difference, so far the transcendental sound vibration is concerned. But the objective is different.
So Brahmā admitted that "If anybody says that 'I know Kṛṣṇa. I know the Supreme Personality of Godhead in detail,' so maybe he may know, but so far I am concerned, I do not know." The purport is that Brahmā is the first creature in this universe. He is the first living entity. He accepts his inability to understand about Kṛṣṇa, and what to speak of others? What to speak of the commentator who says that "This is not Kṛṣṇa; this is something else."
Brahmā admitted that "Your activities, Your pastimes, everything of You, it is not possible even to taste or to understand even a particle of it."
So the Paṇḍita, Kāśmīrī Paṇḍita, became surprised. The Kāśmīrī Paṇḍita became surprised: "How is that? This boy understood? He was a student of grammar, and He is pointing out literary defects?" Oh, he became very much, much surprised. Then he admitted. He was learned scholar. He admitted his fault and he said, "How is that? I have heard that You are student of grammar, and You are pointing out defects in literary construction?" "No. Yes. Yes, sir. I am a student of grammar. But I have heard it from great scholars like you. Of course, I do not know, but I have heard it." He very submissively replied that "I am not scholar, but I have heard it from scholars that this is the technique (?)." He could understand that "He is a very clever student."
So here Lord Caitanya says that kṛṣṇa-bhakti haya abhidheya-pradhāna. For self-realization, if you want to realize yourself or if you want to get out of these material clutches, then the main function is to become in Kṛṣṇa consciousness and be engaged in the service of the Lord directly. And bhakti-mukha-nirīkṣaka karma-yoga-jñāna. And other processes, they're also admitted, but they are dependent on this process. That means if by karma-yoga, when you acquire knowledge, then that is another step forward. Then by jñāna-yoga, when you are able to meditate, by jñāna-yoga you can understand the Supersoul and your soul.
There is the important point of Māyāvādī philosophers. Every one of them, they say that "I am God," but actually he thinks within himself that "What kind of God I am?" That is the position. But for argument's sake they will play so many things in support of their views, but actually, any sane man will think that "What kind of God I am? I cannot defend myself from the slightest attack of this material nature, and still I claim..." But they cannot admit frankly. They think like that. That is being admitted here by the chief disciple of Prakāśānanda Sarasvatī, that "Although we say, 'Yes, this is...,' but it does not appeal to our mind." He is frankly saying.
So that sir, he was honest man to admit, "It is God's grace that so many patients are being cured in my hand, but I say I have no credit." This is really. So we should not take any credit. Everything is under the laws of the Supreme Lord, through the agency of this material external energy. Just like a government is working under different departments, similarly, God is working under His different energies. That's all. He's sitting with you, He's seeing everything, He knows everything.
Now the disciple of Prakāśānanda Sarasvatī is admitting that "God is person, His body is spiritual, but we do not accept it." It is the greatest offense. It is the greatest offense. How it is offense? Suppose you are my friend, and if I say, "Oh, you have no eyes. You have no hand. You have no leg. You have no tongue..." "You have no leg" means you are lame man. "You have no eyes" means you are blind man. "You have no hand" means... That means I am calling you by all ill names.
So that disciple of Prakāśānanda Sarasvatī admitted that godlessness in Vedānta-sūtra is not the purpose. Actually, by misinterpreting the Vedānta-sūtra they want to establish that "There is no God; we are God." So after explanation of Caitanya Mahāprabhu, at least there was one convert amongst all the sannyāsīs, and he was glorifying Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Eta sei kare kṛṣṇa-saṅkīrtana.
Śuni' prakāśānanda kichu kahena vacana. When his disciple was glorifying Lord Caitanya and His process of teaching, his spiritual master, Prakāśānanda, said like this: ācāryera āgraha-advaita-vāda sthāpite. He admitted... Ācārya means Śaṅkarācārya. He means here Śaṅkarācārya. Śaṅkarācārya wanted that there is only one Brahman and we are also Brahman, but he wanted his philosophy of monism. Dualism, God and living entity separate, they do not admit. They admit that God and living entity the same. It is simply for the time being covered, which is called māyā. Māyāvāda philosophy. So the Prakāśānanda Sarasvatī also admitted that because Śaṅkarācārya wanted to establish his philosophy of monism, therefore he had to cover the real meaning of Vedānta-sūtra.
If a scholar likes to present something in a different way... Just like an expert lawyer, he can get out of the entanglement of law by jugglery of words and interpretation, he is called a big lawyer, similarly, there are philosophers who can put different theories and not admit the existence of God. So Śaṅkarācārya's real purpose was no existence of God, because he had a very thankless task. He was dealing with the persons who are Buddhists. They did not believe anything except matter. So for them, to establish that there is God, it is very difficult.
So you make a dismantlement of the matter, nirvāṇa—there will be no more miseries. And Śaṅkara's philosophy says that brahma satyaṁ jagan mithyā. It is little, little farther advanced, admitting the spirit, but he says that spirit is impersonal. "There is no God. It is impersonal." So practically the same thing: ultimately, it is void or there is no God.
So, yei grantha-kartā cāhe sva-mata... If anyone wants to establish his own foolish theory, he takes advantage of popular book and tries to explain in his own way. So in other words it is clear that Śaṅkarācārya, he wanted to establish this theory of monism, and therefore he has explained Vedānta-sūtra in his own way, but that is not the actual explanation. What Lord Caitanya said, that is real explanation. All of them admitted. And this Prakāśānanda Sarasvatī, he also admitted. Bhagavattā mānile advaita nā yāya sthāpana. Now, they wanted to establish the theory of monism, no difference between living entity and God, one; there is no separate God. Then, if admit, if it is admitted that God is the source of everything, then you have to accept duality. Because the source of everything and the everything emanated—duality.
Out of them, only the Vedānta philosophy is compiled by Vyāsadeva. So it is considered that Vedānta philosophy only establishes the existence of God. All other philosophies, they do not admit the existence of God. They are atheistic philosophies. Mīmāṁsaka. Mīmāṁsaka means they have decided that "There is no necessity of worshiping God. If there is any God, all right, you do your duty nicely, and He will be obliged to award you the required result.
Sri Isopanisad Lectures
Caitanya Mahāprabhu's, this philosophy, that jīvera svarūpa haya nitya kṛṣṇa dāsa (Cc. Madhya 20.108-109). A living entity's eternally servant of Kṛṣṇa, either he admits or not admits. That doesn't matter. He's a servant. Just like any citizen is law abider or subservient to the state. He may say that "I don't care for the state," but by the police, by the military, he'll be forced to accept. So one is being forced to accept Kṛṣṇa as the master, and the other is voluntarily offering service. That is the difference. But nobody's free from the service of Kṛṣṇa. That is not possible. Therefore Caitanya Mahāprabhu's philosophy that eternal servant. Either you accept or not accept, you are servant. You are never equal or greater than God.
Sri Brahma-samhita Lectures
In higher planetary system there are many thousand times better facilities. You can go there. The living entities are therefore called sarva-gataḥ. A living entity can go anywhere he likes, but he requires qualification. Any country, when one is admitted, he must have visa, he must have passport, he must have required money to stay in a foreign country. So many rules and regulations are there. Similarly, in the higher planetary system also, where you get ten thousand years of duration of life, and their one year is far, far greater than ours. That is scientific.
He wrote hundred verses about Caitanya Mahāprabhu, out of two verses are available in the Caitanya-caritāmṛta. He composed—he was a very learned scholar—he composed one hundred verses about Caitanya Mahāprabhu, and handed it over. But in all those verses he admitted that "You are Kṛṣṇa." So Caitanya Mahāprabhu, of course He was very much pleased that Sārvabhauma Bhaṭṭācārya understood, but because He was playing the part of an ācārya, He, externally He became, "What you have written all these things?" He immediately torn out and throw it away. But the devotees saved only two. That two verses are there.
Festival Lectures
Pressman: Do you know how many followers there are in the United States now?
Prabhupāda: Unlimited. (devotees roar) Some of them admit and some of them do not admit. That's all. (laughter) Everyone is eternally servant of God, but some of them admit and some of them do not admit. That is the difficulty. But anyone who does not admit, he is servant of somebody. That is a fact. He cannot be master. Everyone is servant. But one who knows that "I am servant of Kṛṣṇa," his life is perfect. That's all. Please try to understand this point that everyone is servant. Even your president is servant of the nation. So nobody can say that "I am no one's servant." He is servant, but he does not know that actually he is the servant of the Supreme Lord. That is his ignorance. We are just eradicating this ignorance, that "You are servant, but you admit that you are servant of God. That will make your life successful." That's all. Therefore I say that there are unlimited followers. Some of them admit and some of them do not admit. That is the difficulty. But if anyone comes to me, I shall make him to admit.
Yes. (devotees roar) Hare Kṛṣṇa. That's all, anyone? Finish?
Madhudviṣa: Yes.
Perhaps you've heard his name, Nehru. He came to your country I think during President Eisenhower's time, and in some meeting some American gentlemen or boys, I do not know, they asked him to explain some of the verses from Bhagavad-gītā. And he, I mean to say, admitted that he was not a scholar in Bhagavad-gītā. So, but his title was there, paṇḍita. Generally, the brāhmaṇas are given this title paṇḍita on account of their scholarship in Vedic literature. So Nimāi Paṇḍita, Nimāi Paṇḍita. Yes. So complaint was lodged against Him, and He disobeyed the order of the Kazi, civil disobedience, and there was a great incident. Then the Kazi became His admirer, follower. That is a long story.
Arrival Addresses and Talks
Woman Guest: I wondered, are you sending them, or do you advocate sending them to secular schools, or have you made arrangements...?
Prabhupāda: No, no. We admit without application. There is no need of application. You'll please come and stay with us, that's all. Our door is open. We are rather appealing to the person, "Please come." In ordinary institution you have to put your application. When it is sanctioned, then you are admitted. We are canvassing, "Please come, please come, please come." Still they are not coming.
Woman Guest: That isn't exactly what I meant. I just wondered if you made arrangements with the government to...
Prabhupāda: Yes, we're trying for that.
So there is very great opportunity. You cannot compete with the Western countries by your technology, however you may make some sewing machine or cycle or Ambassador car. They are hundred years ahead. You cannot make any competition by machine. If you can give them anything and glorify your country, then this is this movement, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Then they will admit that you have something. Wherever I go, they inquire, "Oh, India is poverty-stricken. Oh, you have come that part." India is advertised as poverty. Yes, in comparison to Western country it is simply poverty-stricken. We have not enough food, nor enough, I mean to say, house, and above all you have no milk. India, the land where we hear from Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam that, that the, by the cows' milk in Vṛndāvana there was muddy ground. And in that India now there is powdered milk.
Then Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement will automatically increase. Now the educated learned scholars, they are appreciating our movement by reading books, by taking practical result. Dr. Stillson Judah, he has written one book, perhaps you know, Hare Kṛṣṇa and Counterculture, a very nice book about our movement, and he is giving importance. He has admitted that "Swamijī, you have done wonderful thing because you have turned the drug-addicted hippies into devotees of Kṛṣṇa, and they are prepared for the service of humanity."
Kṛṣṇa is not Indian or Hindu. Kṛṣṇa is everything. Everyone is Kṛṣṇa's sons, in any form. Sarva-yoniṣu. Yoni means species. There are 8,400,000 species. So all of them are living entities, and they are part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa. Therefore Kṛṣṇa is very much anxious to see His sons become very happy, just like father wants to see his son very happy. So Kṛṣṇa has admitted that He is bīja-pradaḥ pitā, He is the supreme father. I think in Christianity also God is accepted as supreme father. So actually that is the fact. God is the supreme father. So as the father wants to see his sons very happy, similarly, Kṛṣṇa wants to see all of us very happy. That is Kṛṣṇa. But we are persistently avoiding Kṛṣṇa and suffering. This is our business.
Initiation Lectures
Jadurāṇī: I shall render my service to you throughout my life.
Prabhupāda: And there is no separation. It is... There is no question of divorce or separation. In any condition of life, happiness or distress, you shall continue as husband and wife, because our main business is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. This marriage is not material marriage for sense gratification. But because there are girls and boys and we require also Kṛṣṇa conscious population, therefore we encourage this marriage. It is not for sense gratification. So in this way there is no question of separation or divorce. You admit this? Yes. You also admit this? Then you change your garland.
Devotees: Haribol. Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: Now you come this side; you come this side. Yes. And there is red, red sindhu? No? Red sindhu? No?
Brahmānanda: There is a ring.
Devotees: No.
Prabhupāda: (laughter) No difficulty. And people will write, "the bright-faced." Yes. They have to admit it. Because it is purifying. There is no impurity. Without being pure, how can you expect to reach God? This is all rascaldom. To keep oneself dirty, impure in mind, in body, in feeling, in character, and you want to go to God? Rascal. (laughter) Forget! There is no entrance for you to God.
Prabhupāda: So there are ten kinds of offenses. That is described. And the most important point is the committing sin on the strength of chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra. This is a fact that as soon you chant Kṛṣṇa, all your resultant action of sinful activities immediately nullified. But if we again commit that sins, that is up to you. So we should not make it a business that "Let me go on committing sins, and it will be counteracted by chanting." No. This is not good. This is the greatest offense. Sometimes in Christian Church there is confession, and again they go and commit the same sin, and next time, again confession. Not like that. That is not good. One confession admitting, excused. But not that you commit sins over and over again and it will be excused. Similarly, you cannot commit sins on the strength of chanting. That is the greatest offense.
Duplicity may be very good qualification for this material world, but duplicity in spiritual life is no qualification. So these boys, although they are very young—they're not even thirty; within twenty-five, twenty-six years, all the boys and girls—but they have made some impressions. Many Indians, they have openly admitted, "Swamijī, you have made wonderful. These boys and girls are very nice." So that is my pride, that these boys and girls following my instruction, and... I am not giving you, them any money or any bribe. No. (laughter) They are simply sincerely following my instruction. I am a mendicant. I have no money, I'm a beggar. But Kṛṣṇa is helping them. So you follow these principles. Then surely, success will be there.
General Lectures
When he came to your country, your president, late Mr. Kennedy, oh, he welcomed him as his own teacher, because when Mr. Kennedy was a student in the Oxford University, Dr. Radhakrishnan was a visiting professor. In the open meeting Mr. Kennedy admitted that "Now Dr. Radhakrishnan has come as the president, but he is always my teacher. He is still my teacher." It was very kind of him that he received him as a teacher, not as contemporary.
He is giving example, just as a soul comes from the womb of his mother with a small body, and that small body changes—it becomes the body of a boy, it becomes the body of a youth, then it becomes the body of an old man, then it vanquishes... That we have to admit. We may say that the body is growing, but actually, the fact is, body is changing. It is medically admitted that we are changing our body every second. We are changing our blood corpuscles, and therefore a change of the body is taking place, and that is being manifested in a different shape only. Actually, we are changing every moment our body.
Kṛṣṇa consciousness means to know perfectly well five things. What are those? God, living entity, and this material nature, the time factor, and the activities. God, the supreme controller. However you may declare there is no God, there is a supreme controller. That we have to admit. There are so many things that which does not depend on our so-called scientific advancement of knowledge. It depends completely something else. Supreme controller. So that is God. They may call it nature, but they do not know nature, what is nature.
For instance, sometimes we suffer from serious cold weather, sometimes we suffer from the thunderbolt, sometimes from earthquake, tornadoes, droughts, and other natural disasters. So we are always suffering one or another of three kinds of miseries. Sanātana's inquiry was 'What is the position of the living entities? Why are they always undergoing these three kinds of miseries?' Sanātana has admitted his weakness. Although he was known by the mass of people as a greatly learned man, and actually he was a highly learned Sanskrit scholar, and although he accepted the designation of a very learned man given him by the mass of people, yet he did not actually know what his constitutional position was and why he was subjected to the threefold miseries.
One devotee is praying to Kṛṣṇa that "So long, in my life, I have served my senses," kāmādīnām. Kāma means senses, lust. "So even what I should not have done, still, by the dictation of my lust I have done it." One has to do. When one is a slave or servant, then he's forced to act something which he does not like to act. He's forced. So here, a devotee's admitting that "I have done, dictated by my lust, something which I should not have done, but I have done it." All right, you have done, you are serving your senses. That's all right. "But the difficulty is that teṣāṁ karuṇā na jātā na trapā nopaśāntiḥ. I have served so much, but I find that they are not satisfied.
So proṣita bhartṛkā. So we are not going to discuss about the social. We are discussing about love affairs of Kṛṣṇa. So gopīs... Kṛṣṇa and gopīs, the relationship was so intimate and so unalloyed that Kṛṣṇa Himself admitted, "My dear gopīs, it is not in My power to repay you about your loving affairs." Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality of Godhead. He became bankrupt, that "My dear gopīs, it is not possible for Me to repay your debts which you have created by loving Me." So that is the highest perfection of love. Ramyā kācid upāsanā vrajavadhū.
From the Vedic Upaniṣads we can understand that both the Supreme Person, or God, and the individual person are eternal and living entities. The difference is that the supreme living entity, or Supreme Person, maintains all the innumerable living entities. In the Christian way of understanding, the same principle is admitted because in the Bible it is taught that the individual entities should pray to the supreme father for supplying means of maintenance and giving pardon for their sinful activities.
Your country is economically very well equipped. You are very good looking. Your education is very nice. You have got hundreds of universities in your country. Practically there is no man or woman illiterate. So your situation, comparatively with other nations or other country, is very good. That is admitted by everyone. So you should utilize this opportunity. That is my request. Your well situation, your material prosperity, your intelligence, your education should be properly utilized. It should not be misused." What is misused and what is proper utilization? That is also explained by Ṛṣabhadeva in this instruction. He says that nāyaṁ deho deha-bhājāṁ nṛloke.
So Lord Kṛṣṇa is accepted as the Supreme Personality of Godhead at least by the great ācāryas of India. Even, as I was speaking of Śaṅkarācārya, he was impersonalist, but he has admitted in his commentary on Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam that sa kṛṣṇa bhagavān svayam. He has accepted. In the beginning of his commentary he said, nārāyaṇaḥ para avyaktāt: "Nārāyaṇa, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is beyond this material creation." And in next page he has admitted, "That Supreme Personality of Godhead Nārāyaṇa is Kṛṣṇa, who is born as the son of Devakī and Vasudeva." So, so far Indian scholars... I don't speak of modern scholars. Those who are authorized scholars of bygone ages, admitted by the Vedic society—Śaṅkarācārya, Rāmānujācārya, and Viṣṇu Svāmī, Nimbārka—and they are stalwarts.
And actually, scientifically, it is true that due to the heat of the sun planet all other planets are rotating; otherwise they'll fall down. But they're floating in the air, in the sky, due to this sunlight. Anyone who knows science, he'll admit, "Yes, that's a fact." And sun is the source of all energy in this material world. All this vegetation, all living condition, minerals—there are so many things—this is due to the sun. So sun in the king of all planets, as it is stated in the Vedic literatures. That's a fact. Aśeṣa-tejāḥ. Aśeṣa-tejāḥ means unlimited tejāḥ.
Indian man (1): And distill it.
Prabhupāda: Distill it. (laughter) Then your science will be all right. And where is that, your...? Then what is the value of your science? If you cannot explain which is within your experience and you set aside, "Oh, it is all legend," it is all foolishness. You have no knowledge about that. You admit that. How it is done, you cannot do it, or you have not attained to that standard of knowledge. You say that. Don't say it is legend. That is foolishness. You admit your weakness. If you are as equal, equal in intelligence, then explain how this water is being...
Indian man (1): I had one discussion. So I was given to understand that the pressure in the earth sends.
It is explained by Kṛṣṇa himself, api cet sudurācāro bhajate mām ananya-bhāk, sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ (BG 9.30). He is sādhu. Even if you find some defects in him due to his former habits, but he is simply engaged in Kṛṣṇa's service, unflinching devotion, he is sādhu. He is sādhu. In spite of some defects. We must admit, even in fire there are some defects. Fire is so pure that anything impure you put into the fire, it becomes pure. Perhaps you know in our Hindu system if a one utensil becomes impure some time, you put it in the fire and it becomes pure. Is it not? Is it not?
That is the difference. Similarly, the activities of this material world which is going on, we do not say like the Māyāvāda philosophers, that brahma satya jagan mithyā. According to the leader of Māyāvāda philosophers, Śrīpāda Śaṅkarācārya, his perfection of life begins when one takes to sannyāsa. The Śaṅkarācārya philosophers, they do not admit anyone as realized soul unless he has accepted sannyāsa. But Vaiṣṇava philosophy is not like that. Vaiṣṇava philosophy is that you may remain in any condition of life—it doesn't matter—but you become Kṛṣṇa conscious. That's all.
So we are not going to preach amongst the tigers that "You become vegetarian" or "You become Kṛṣṇa conscious." That is not our business. Our business is that we are inducing, we are entreating, we are requesting people that "You take Kṛṣṇa prasāda." That is our business. To become vegetarian or nonvegetarian is not very big business. We do not admit that vegetarians are very much pious and nonvegetarians are not pious. No. Not like that. We say that everyone is impious who is not taking foodstuff offered to Kṛṣṇa. That is our view. Anyone.
Then again one month, thirty days and nights. Similarly, one year, twelve months. Similarly, one hundred years. So his duration of life is also one hundred years, but because it is a different person, that truth is relative according to that person. That is scientifically admitted: everything is relative truth, nothing absolute truth.
The doctors, they make a medical club. Similarly, if you have to learn Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then you have to admit yourself with the society for Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is necessary. Satāṁ prasaṅgāt mama vīrya-saṁvido bhavanti hṛt-karṇa-rasāyanāḥ kathāḥ. Unless you associate with practical devotees, you cannot understand or you cannot relish the transcendental nature of Lord Kṛṣṇa.
Similarly, we living entities, being part and parcel of God, it is our duty to serve Him. Actually our position is that we are rendering service to somebody else. Every one of us who are sitting in this meeting must admit that he is giving service to somebody else. Somebody is rendering service to his family, somebody is rendering service to his country or to his society, or if one has nobody to serve, sometimes he keeps a pet like cats and dog and renders service unto it.
Prahlāda Mahārāja, he could not get to cultivate Kṛṣṇa consciousness because he was born in atheist family, guarded, well guarded, and father was always alert that "My son may not chant Hare Kṛṣṇa." But he was taking opportunity in the school. So he was five-years-old boy, and his class fellows also of the same age. So he used to induce them, "My dear friends, chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, chant Hare Kṛṣṇa." We have got a little girl, perhaps you have all seen, Sarasvatī, she was admitted in a school in Bombay. And because there was no Hare Kṛṣṇa chanting, she began to cry, "No, I shall not be in this school." Practical. There was (indistinct), she was organizing all the children to chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. But they began something else, so she said, "No, I am not going to this school." So śucīnāṁ śrīmatāṁ gehe yoga-bhraṣṭo sañjāyate (BG 6.41).
We have got authority from Bhagavad-gītā. We have got authority by the ācāryas, Rāmānujācārya, Madhvācārya, all of them, even Śaṅkarācārya, although we differ in some points with Śaṅkarācārya. Śaṅkarācārya has admitted Kṛṣṇa, bhagavān sa svayam kṛṣṇa, he has stated. Devakīnandana, he has specifically mentioned Kṛṣṇa, the son of Devakī and Vasudeva, is the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Nārāyaṇa paraḥ avyaktāt. I think those who have read Śaṅkara's comment on Bhagavad-gītā, they know all these things. So Kṛṣṇa is admitted as the Supreme Personality of Godhead by all the bona fide ācāryas. And all scholars up to date, everyone, and confirmed by Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu. And Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam (SB 1.3.28).
So next day there was a big publicity in a paper with my picture and all this crowd that they say that "We thought God is dead, but here we see the Swamiji has brought God again in his kīrtana, in his chanting." They admitted. The New York published in all their papers. So God cannot be dead. Not that everyone can be God. God is one, and that is Kṛṣṇa.
Not very much different—so far the procedure is concerned, the regulative principles are concerned, they are all the same. The only difference is that Śaṅkarācārya's sampradāya, they take the ultimate Absolute Truth as impersonal, and we Vaiṣṇavas, we take the Absolute Truth as person. But Śaṅkarācārya, in his later stage, he also admitted in a different way.
So our becoming the representative of Kṛṣṇa is not very difficult job because we do not misinterpret the readings of Bhagavad-gītā. We accept them as it is. If there is some doubt... There cannot be any doubt. It may be due to my poor fund of knowledge I cannot understand it—that we should admit. The lines, as stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, they are as perfect as anything.
Govinda, the sun is described as the eye, one of the eyes of God. He's seeing everything. You cannot hide yourself from the seeing of God, as you cannot hide yourself from the sunshine So, in this way, Kṛṣṇa. If God's name, there can be any name... And it is admitted in the Vedic literature that God has got many names, but this Kṛṣṇa name is the chief name. Mukhya. Mukhya means principal. And it is very nicely explained: "all-attractive." In so many ways He's all-attractive. So God's name... The Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is propagating God's name, God's glory, God's activities, God's beauty, God's love. Everything.
If you have unflinching faith in the Supreme Personality of Godhead, then all the good qualities of demigods will develop unto you. It is not story. It is fact. Just like these European and American students. They, in their previous life, before becoming Kṛṣṇa consciousness, according to our standard, they were all immoral. Our, in India, illicit sex life still, it is admitted, if it is not followed, to have sex relation with other's wife or other woman except one's wife, that is called immoral or sinful.
Even Christian priests, they are surprised. They are surprised. One of the priest in Boston, he issued pamphlet that "These boys, they're our boys, from Christian and Jews. Before this movement, they did not care to come to the churches even. Now they are mad after God." They are admitting. The Christian priestly class, they are not against us. Those who are saner class, they're admitting that "Swamijī's giving something tangible." Their fathers and forefathers come to me. They bow down. They say, "Swamijī, it is a great fortune for us that you have come to our country." So I am alone working, and the movement is being appreciated.
Prabhupāda: Eh? Tell him, that man.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Doctor Bigelow.
Prabhupāda: So I had some correspondence with him, and he admitted: "Swamijī, your people know much about these things than we know." So there is no question of you and me. It is simply education. Just like these boys. Four or fives year, ago, they did not know anything about this Kṛṣṇa consciousness. But because they have been educated with this Bhagavad-gītā, they are also following me.
The sun is distributing the light, that is by the order of God, not independently. Anything you find, they are abiding by the laws of, or by the order of God. The whole total cosmic manifestation which is called material energy, that is also acting by the order of God. Many śāstras, we have to take knowledge from the śāstras. And if you judge from good sense and intelligence, you'll have to admit what is said in the śāstra. Now just like in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said that mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ sūyate sa-carācaram (BG 9.10). We are very much astonished to see the activities of the material nature wonderfully working. But we do not know that behind the material nature there is God.
If you want to stay there, then yānti deva-vratā devān. You have to prepare yourself by worshiping that particular deva or deity, demigod; then you will be admitted. Just like if you want to go to a foreign country you have to take the permission of the immigration department, visa, then you can go. If that law is there in this planet, why not for other planet? How you can go abruptly, by force? That is not possible. Yānti deva-vratā devān.
This saṅkīrtana movement means vibration of the transcendental sound. In the beginning of creation, sound is the origin of all creation. That is admitted in the Bible also. (aside:) Where is that paper? Yes. Read it. We are reading a passage from your Bible.
Prabhupāda: What is that? Hm?
Madhudviṣa: She's asking how can we explain that Jesus said he is the only way?
Prabhupāda: Yes, he is the only way. We also admit. Because he is the representative of God, so if you want to approach God, you must approach through His representative. That is His version. "I am the only representative of God," then you have to reach God through him, that is fact.
Madhudviṣa: Another question? Yes, sir?
We have got hundreds of centers. We are strictly following. And you have taken our prasādam feast. How delicious they are. So why they should kill? The argument is sometimes offered: "The vegetable has got life." Yes, we admit also. But our process is to take the prasādam. Prasādam means we offer foodstuff to Kṛṣṇa and after eating, whatever He left, we take that. This is our principle. We don't take directly. What is the meaning of this temple? We don't use anything directly unless it is offered to Kṛṣṇa.
Woman: In the Christian Bible it says that Jesus Christ is the son of God, and you can only get to God through him.
Prabhupāda: That's all right.
Woman: No. What is...? Do...?
Prabhupāda: Yes. We admit that. He is the perfect son, and if you take shelter of the lotus feet of the perfect son, you go to back to home, back to Godhead. That's a fact.
Woman: Is that true of Christ or...
Prabhupāda: Yes. As he advises. Just like he says, "Thou shalt not kill." But if you kill, at the same time take shelter of Christ, what is the meaning? First of all you try to follow him; then you can go through him. But you don't care for him—what is the meaning of go through him?
Woman: Believe in him.
Prabhupāda: ...down to the Sutala planet. And by accepting the order of the Supreme Personality of Godhead... The Lord questioned Śukrācārya, "What was the discrepancy in the performance of yajña arranged by Bali Mahārāja that you cursed him?" Of course, he did not ask that "you cursed him," but it was understood. Śukrācārya admitted that there was no fault. This is the verse. When the Supreme Personality of Godhead is worshiped, there is no discrepancy.
Just like a student is admitted in the school for learning ABCD, and if he follows the rules and regulations and continues his studies regularly, then one day he would be able to pass M.A. examination, so from the very beginning we have to execute these processes because our life is impure at the present moment, and we have to purify this life.
The Parīkṣit Mahārāja, when he was hearing Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, he said that nivṛtta-tarṣair upagīyamānād bhavauṣadhāc chrotra-mano-'bhirāmāt (SB 10.1.4). He admitted that "This kṛṣṇa-katha, narrations about Kṛṣṇa, about Kṛṣṇa's activities, it is relished, it is discussed, by nivṛtta-tarṣaiḥ (CC Madhya 19.170). Nivṛtta-tarṣaiḥ means liberated person. Nivṛtti means finished, and tṛṣṇa, tṛṣṇa, hankering.
You can see that before me many Indians came in this Western world. They also preached about this Kṛṣṇa message or Bhagavad-gītā. Great scholars came. But you have to admit that before this, the Westerners never accepted this principle of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, because they could not deliver as it is. Now they are accepting. And there is immense potency. I have studied.
Philosophy Discussions
Prabhupāda: It is ultimately depending on God's will. That is the explanation.
Śyāmasundara: He says that these monads are spiritual in nature; therefore they are immortal.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That we admit, because Kṛṣṇa and Kṛṣṇa's will, both of them are spiritual.
Śyāmasundara: So even the particle of matter is eternal?
Prabhupāda: Ultimately everything is spiritual, because the matter is Kṛṣṇa's energy and spirit is also Kṛṣṇa's energy. If Kṛṣṇa is the original cause, therefore the matter can be changed into spirit, spirit can be changed into matter.
Śyāmasundara: In fact, he calls the soul a bundle of perceptions, that it is nothing but a set or sequence of ideas.
Prabhupāda: But as soon as he says "ideas," there must be some concrete things.
Śyāmasundara: Yes. He admits that the external world is full of concrete things, but he thinks that we are also one of those things because we are only a bundle of perceptions. Our consciousness is only made up of our observations of material nature.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So far direct perception is concerned, it is like that. But indirect perception, taken from authorities, that is different.
Śyāmasundara: He distrusts any kind of authority and says that the only kind of things that we can know for sure are mathematical proofs and immediate sense perceptions. Like we can perceive that there is time and there is space, like that. That is the only knowledge he will admit.
Prabhupāda: And beyond the time and space?
Śyāmasundara: We can't know anything.
Prabhupāda: Relativity... He does not believe that there are other things. But as soon as one says relative, the opposite word is absolute; otherwise wherefrom we take this word relative?
Śyāmasundara: Well, his idea is that things only exist in relation with each other.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Then what is the supreme relative?
Śyāmasundara: He doesn't admit any supreme.
Prabhupāda: His knowledge is imperfect.
Śyāmasundara: He says just like a cherry, say a fruit...
Prabhupāda: In logic there is relative study, and at the end of all relative truth there is absolute truth, the summum bonum. So he has no idea of the summum bonum, or the substance.
Prabhupāda: That is already discussed: why it is so, probability, who takes it, who makes it not possible, how it happens. Sun is rising, and sun may not rise, stop. How it is? Accidentally or by somebody's will?
Śyāmasundara: He would say that it's accidental.
Prabhupāda: That is nonsense. Nothing is accidental. Everything is symmetrical. Therefore, we have to admit that supreme direction, and that is Kṛṣṇa, as stated in the Bhagavad-gītā: "Under My direction everything is going on." The sun is rising on His direction, and when He orders, the sun will not rise. But it is not accidental.
Śyāmasundara: He says that there is no such thing as a cause-and-effect relationship. Just like, for example, we associate friction with heat, but he says that it's a mistake to assume that friction causes heat or possesses any power which must inevitably produce heat. He says that it is a mere repetition of two incidents, so that the effect habitually attends the cause, but it is not necessarily a consequence of it. So the fact that I rub my hands together and there is heat produced, I am used to assuming that the friction causes heat, but he says that it is not necessarily so. Whenever there is friction, there is heat, but that is only because they are associated with each other, not that one causes the other.
Hayagrīva: These are notations on David Hume. Abstract objects, relations, space, matter and time are all considered by Hume to be mind-dependent perceptions. In other words, perceptions are all there is. He rejects revealed religion, that is, the religion of the śāstras, and embraces natural religion, that is, a religion wherein the existence of God can be proved or even shown to be probable by argument and reason. According to Hume we really know nothing of God, for at the most we can only know are peoples' ideas of God, and these are but perceptions. It would thus seem that it is impossible to know God according to Hume's natural religion because the senses are admittedly imperfect, and these are the only instruments of certainty Hume admits in his natural religion.
Prabhupāda: What is that natural religion?
Hayagrīva: Well, he says the self is nothing but a bundle or collection of different perceptions which succeed each other with inconceivable rapidity and are in perpetual flux and movement. So he says there's nothing but perception. He rejects revealed scriptures as such, but he says, "The heavens and the earth join in the same testimony. The whole course of nature raises one hymn to the praises of its creator. I have found a Deity and here I stop my inquiry. Let those go further who are wiser or more enterprising."
Prabhupāda: First point is that our senses are imperfect. That is admitted. And God is perception. But whether he believes actually in the existence of God?
Hayagrīva: He believes in the existence of God.
Prabhupāda: Anyway, if he believes in God, a fact, then instead of so-called perception, why not understand from God what He is?
Hayagrīva: Well, he, um...
Prabhupāda: Our senses are imperfect. We, we admit that there is God. Now, if our senses are imperfect, how we can imagine "God is like this," "God is like that"? That actually if God explains Himself, why should we not accept that?
Hayagrīva: In his, uh... Hume appears opposed to the search for God in the ideal world. He writes, "Why not stop at the material world? How can we satisfy ourselves without going on ad infinitum, forever. If the material world rests upon a similar ideal world, this ideal world must rest upon some other and so on, without end. It were better, therefore, never to look beyond the present material world.
Prabhupāda: Anything cannot be known more than that by his personal attempt. But they can be known through a process which is called paramparā.
Śyāmasundara: He says they cannot be known through pure reason alone. Later he admits they can be known in other ways. But purely through the exercise of reason, we cannot know that there is anything about God or anything about soul, even though we may know they exist.
Prabhupāda: When God speaks, then it is possible. That is our process. We hear from God—what, where, how He is—therefore our knowledge is perfect. According to Kant, one cannot reach by reason and senses. Avāṅ-manasā gocaraḥ. That's a fact. That is admitted in Vedas: avāṅ-manasā gocaraḥ. Vana means words, mana means mind. Neither by words, neither by the mind one can reach. But it is a fact that he is convinced there is God, so if God speaks, God descends by His causeless mercy and speaks, then you can understand about God.
Prabhupāda: No. Faith, that is a compromise, you see. That is not fact. But this is good that he admits that we cannot approach the final God by our senses or reason. To have faith, that is also not perfect. Therefore the Western philosophers, they have created different faiths, and religion means faith. Somebody may believe in some faith, others may believe in another faith. But that is not factual. The factual is this: if we are actually convinced that there is God, and God is omnipotent, so by His omnipotency He descends.
Prabhupāda: That is very nice idea. We agree to that. Therefore we have to see what is the duty of the state. It is accepted that the state is the representative of God. Therefore the state's first business is to make citizens God-conscious. That is the state's first business. Any state who is neglecting this duty, he immediately becomes unqualified to hold the state office, either he may be president or the king. Because if it is admitted, the king... We say that the king's name is naradeva, God in human form, and king is offered that respect. There are... King is respected, why? Because he is to be considered God's representative.
Śyāmasundara: No, he says that whatever is, is right, and that this good and this reason in its most concrete form is God. God governs the world.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That also we admit because in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, yad yad vibhūtimat sattvam, mama tejo 'ṁśa-sambhavam, whenever there is some extraordinary power, it should be understood that it is derived partially from God's power. That we accept. So the dominance of American nation is God's favor.
Śyāmasundara: (indistinct) in question.
Prabhupāda: That is not perfect knowledge.
Śyāmasundara: You must admit, though, being a scientist, that supposing you go down to the bottom of the Grand Canyon, you see so many layers of earth going up thousands of feet, that the layers at the bottom are very, very old. You must admit, because the earth takes so many years to deposit soil. Even if it's only one million years, it's still very old. And in that lowest layer we find only evidences of simple...
Prabhupāda: So where is the lowest layer, he has gone? Where is it? Wherefrom it begins?
Śyāmasundara: The Grand Canyon is an example. That's a very deep canyon in the ground in Arizona.
Prabhupāda: That missing link, let them learn from us. We can give him the missing link.
Karandhara: But ultimately they'll say it'll come down to we propose that Kṛṣṇa is the creator or that God is the creator, then they'll say "That must be proved to me." In other words, they want to fit God within their own empiric gaze. That will be their only satisfaction when they actually become able to circumvent God's existence and create a power by their own intelligence.
Prabhupāda: He has to admit that the theory of uncertainty is bogus, but everything is there, and that masking behind all these things there must be big brain. That one has to accept. Simply uncertainty, that is not a science. The certainty is that behind all these things there is a big brain. I do not know Him—that is a different thing—but there is a big brain.
Prabhupāda: Evolution we accept. There is no quarrel about that point. But we say there are 8,400,000 species of life, evolution is coming through that. But you cannot give us any list that so many... We give real evolution, that there are 8,400,000 species of life, and the living entity coming through that. (break) ...evolution is taking from here to here, and how many there are? You cannot say. You simply say "missing," "something missing," "something is added," all vague.
Śyāmasundara: That admitted, but...
Prabhupāda: If you admit that you are imperfect in knowledge, then it is no use citing scripture. There will...
Śyāmasundara: But what I want to know is that...
Prabhupāda: ...evolution we admit. But your evolution theory is not perfect. Our evolutionary theory is perfect.
Śyāmasundara: But it appears that the evolution is from simple to complex.
Prabhupāda: That we admit, simple. That we admit. There is no difference. But you cannot say what is the simple and what is the complex, and what are the... You say something missing. That is evasive. Why you should be missing if you are in knowledge? You must say this thing is missing, that you have no knowledge.
Hayagrīva: Concerning remembering and forgetting, Bergson writes, "The cerebral mechanism is arranged just so as to drive back into the unconscious"—by unconscious they mean the subconscious—"almost the whole of his past, and to admit beyond the threshold only that which can cast light on the present situation or further the action now being prepared. In short, only that which can give useful work." So that, in other words, man utilizes only those memories or that knowledge which is immediately useful, and in this way man can function in the world. What is the role of Kṛṣṇa in this, as the arranger of this cerebral mechanism?
Prabhupāda: Cerebral mechanism, that is a machine. Just like this microphone is a machine. It helps speaking loudly. It has nothing..., machine has nothing to do with the voice, but it helps the voice louder so we can listen, so far the machine is concerned. Actually the voice is different.
Śyāmasundara: So he says that everything should be utilized to extract the most pleasure from life.
Prabhupāda: That is our theory, to make the best use of a bad bargain. We are already cheated, "Now all right, let me utilize it." That's all. You don't admit that "I have been cheated, now I am utilizing it."
Śyāmasundara: He says that utility is that property in any object whereby it tends to produce benefit, advantage, pleasure, good or happiness.
Prabhupāda: That is nice, this definition also, but if we put to test all our so-called happiness, it will not be possible to come out successful.
Śyāmasundara: He says that we cannot achieve absolute certainty or perfection. So we must rest content...
Prabhupāda: That means he has got a poor fund of knowledge. He does not admit that. But we can say that because his knowledge is not perfect, he's saying like that.
Śyāmasundara: So he says that we must rest content with a faith and a commitment which helps us to face the future resolutely, reconstructing our environment to obtain more satisfactory adjustments. This is the Western philosophy in a nutshell.
Prabhupāda: Why not take directly the words of God? (Hindi with guest)
Hayagrīva: He writes, "According to the religious and philosophic tradition of Europe, the valid status of all the highest values, the good, true and beautiful, was bound up with their being properties of ultimate and supreme being, namely God. All went well as long as what passed for natural science gave no offense to this conception. Trouble began when science ceased to disclose in the objects of knowledge the possession of any such properties. Then some roundabout method had to be devised for substantiating them." In other words, science began to investigate the phenomenal universe without admitting the proprietorship of anyone, of God, and this brings a breakdown in morality and value. So Dewey attempts to reassemble these shattered values in a philosophical way, but he, like science, attempts to do so without recognizing the proprietorship of an ultimate and supreme being.
Prabhupāda: That is another lunacy, because everything has a proprietor. So why this big cosmic manifestation will not have a proprietor? To accept the proprietor is natural, and that is logical. And not to accept a proprietor, that is lunacy. How it can be possible? Just like we give this example: We are standing on the land. We know that there is government, there is proprietor. And a few yards after, when this ocean begins, how we can think of that the ocean has no proprietor, no government? How any philosopher and man having logic can believe it? What is the answer?
Prabhupāda: Yes, that is required. Because in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam it is also accepted that except a Vedic religion, all others are cheating religion because they have no perfect knowledge. It is clearly stated that cheating type of religion is rejected from the Bhāgavata religion. Bhāgavata... The sum and substance of Bhāgavata religion is accepting God as the supreme controller. Satyaṁ paraṁ dhīmahi. This is beginning. And what is that Absolute Truth? Janmādy asya yataḥ, itarataś ca artheṣu abhijñaḥ svarāṭ: (SB 1.1.1) that there is a principal, Brahman, from whom everything has come. So unless you find out what is the ultimate source of emanation, the knowledge is perfect, hum, imperfect. But you must have to admit, from your experience, that everything has a source of emanation. Anything has. You cannot go beyond your experience. You see this table. This table has got a history. Somebody has collected the wood and he has made into a shape. So everything that you see, it has got a history. So similarly the whole creation, it has got a history, and to know who has created, janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1), that is perfect knowledge. If you do not know, if you cannot reach, that is your inability. Don't think that it is imaginary, mythological. That is your imperfect of knowledge. You cannot reach, and you make a conclusion like a crazy man. That is not philosophical at all.
Śyāmasundara: So he says that this is the stepping-stone, or the first stage toward self-realization, that from this despair that one can find his authentic selfhood.
Prabhupāda: This we will admit. That is, therefore the Vedānta-sūtra is there. When fickle people become disgusted, that "We have worked so hard, but still we could not attain the goal of life, peace and prosperity," despair, then they begin to think, "Actually, what is the purpose of life?" That is called brahma-jijñāsā, inquiring into the Absolute Truth or the ultimate truth of life. That is natural in human life. That sort of inquiry is necessary for further development.
Prabhupāda: That idea is illusion.
Śyāmasundara: Yes. But he says that will is the ultimate reality. Something is...
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, will is ultimate reality, we also admit. Because we desire, we will like this. We will that we shall be enjoyer of the material world. Idea was that "I shall become like Kṛṣṇa." This was the idea, and therefore I will. And Kṛṣṇa gave us chance, "All right, you come here and fulfill your desire." So they are implicated in so many karma, and becoming more and more involved. So according to karma he is getting different types of body, and there is no end. It is going on.
Śyāmasundara: Yes, he says that the will is eternal, and it is always incarnated in one body after another. But he describes it as a force...
Prabhupāda: Yes, it is a force.
Prabhupāda: Mm.
Śyāmasundara: They transcend the lower levels of consciousness, and for a few moments they become will-less or desireless.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that we admit. We agree also. So we do not want to keep them for a few moments, but we want to keep them continually in that consciousness. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Śyāmasundara: This aesthetic salvation...
Prabhupāda: (aside:) Where is Rūpānuga? Inform them that we will come.
Śyāmasundara: But everything you say, you are also showing, you are also giving examples that we can perceive. Just like the body, you say the soul has left the body so the body does not move. So even though it cannot be seen, the soul is leaving the body.
Prabhupāda: "It cannot be seen" means you have no seeing power. You cannot see beyond this wall, but that does not mean that because it cannot be seen, that is not fact. That is another foolishness. You have no seeing power. You admit your imperfection. Why you are proposing like that, "Because it cannot be seen"?
Śyāmasundara: No. Because it cannot be shown, he says. But it can be shown.
Prabhupāda: It can be shown, but you have no eyes to see. That is my proposal. Your eyes are just as blind man. If he says that "Show me this," how he can see? He is blind man. So you are blind, you cannot see, but those who have eyes, they can see. Therefore they say, śāstra cakṣuṣa: don't believe those eyes. Śāstra cakṣuṣa. Make the śāstra your cakṣuṣa. That is Vedic position. Don't see with these naked eyes. What is the value of your eyes? Why are you so much proud of your eyes? You cannot see. You see under certain conditions. Therefore adhaksi(?) Adhaksi means those who believe only the eyes. And what is the value of the eyes? That you won't admit, that "I am blind." He won't say. He will say simply, "I cannot see." How you can see? You're blind. That he won't admit, that he's blind. He will simply say that "I cannot see; therefore I don't agree." But you are blind!
Prabhupāda: Our process is not repression. We don't repress. Therefore we give facility, that "You have got sex impulse. All right, you have it, but with your wife, legalized wife."
Śyāmasundara: He thinks more in terms from the very beginning of birth there is sex impulse.
Prabhupāda: That is admitted. We say that as soon as there is an embodied living being, he must have hunger, he must have sex impulse. (indistinct), we find in the animals these impulses are there, so why so much philosophy? They are already there. What is the use of philosophizing?
Śyāmasundara: He analyzes that besides the id, or these sex impulses, there is the ego, which is the moral self, which tries to adjust these impulses, these sexual impulses, and tries to...
Prabhupāda: There are so many (indistinct), we established some of them. There are so many problems. But our program is that threefold miseries, everyone who has accepted this body has to undergo the threefold miseries. You may describe in...
Śyāmasundara: (break) ...psychoanalysis that by releasing these emotions, which have been built up due to tension, frustration, then the original shock can be released through admitting, confessing, remembering, like that.
Prabhupāda: What is the guarantee that he will not get another shock? He is getting shock after shock. You (indistinct) one and another is present.
Śyāmasundara: He attributes all of our personality conflicts to this...
Hayagrīva: He writes, "As it is a delicate task to decide what God has Himself ordained and what derives rather from the authority of an all-powerful parliament or a supreme judicial decision, it would be an indubitable advantage to leave God out of the question altogether and to admit honestly the purely human origin of all cultural laws and instructions." In other words, man is the law-giver...
Prabhupāda: That, that means he has no clear conception of God, because God has to take power from some parliament. God does not take power from anyone. He is God. That is described in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, that janmādy asya yataḥ anvayād itarataḥ ca artheṣu abhijñaḥ svarāṭ (SB 1.1.1), that the Supreme, God, or Supreme Truth, Brahman, He knows everything.
Prabhupāda: Yes. He was under the leadership of sexuality. That's a fact. Everyone is under the leadership. Just like sometimes we say, "The material scientists say like this, they say like this." He accepts the leadership. So we have to accept the leadership, but if we accept the leadership of Kṛṣṇa, then our life is perfect. Other leadership is māyā, māyā's leadership. But we have to accept leadership. There is no doubt of it. So he accepted the leadership of sex, but he did not admit it, but going on speaking on sex. And those who have taken the leadership of God, they will speak only of God, nothing else. Jīvera svarūpa haya nitya kṛṣṇa dāsa (Cc. Madhya 20.108-109), that is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's philosophy, that we are eternal servant of God. So as soon as we give up the service of Lord, then we have to accept the service of māyā. So all these different atheists, scientists, they are all servants of māyā instead of becoming servant of God. He is servant, but he is servant of māyā. That is the difference between devotee and the materialistic person.
Prabhupāda: So that we say—the one is matter, another is spirit.
Śyāmasundara: Yes. He says "being in itself" and "being for itself." "Being for itself" means the living entity, because by choosing things he does things for himself; he makes decisions and creates things for himself.
Prabhupāda: That we admit. Therefore, the living being who decides to change or to accept something, he is important. Actually, he is existing, whereas the bodily changes or circumstantial changes, that is temporary. But the person who is changing, he is eternal.
Śyāmasundara: His idea is that because a man or a living entity has no "thingness," no solid mass, he is always changing one thing to another.
Prabhupāda: That is nonsense. By accident somebody is condemned and somebody is blessed. This is all nonsense. By accident somebody is put into jail and by accident somebody is hanged? Is there any experience like that? That is a judgment. When a man is condemned, that means it is done by some living judgment. So how is this accident? These are all imperfect knowledge, misleading. There is nothing an accident.
Śyāmasundara: He says that all living entities are condemned to be free, everything.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That we can admit. Anyone who is in this material world, he is condemned. But the next question will be, if one is condemned, then he can be blessed also. The other side of condemnation is blessing. So what is the blessing side? Has he got any knowledge of the blessing side? Then he is imperfect. As soon as you say condemned, there must be blessing. So he does not know what is the blessing side. That he takes as nothing. That is nonsense.
Prabhupāda: No. Change, but that changing is taking place under certain regulations, not that by accident. Just like if I become educated, then I get a change in my position, a very nice post, but this is not accident. Because I am educated, I am getting a nice post. And because I am not educated, so I am getting another post.
Śyāmasundara: Just like moods. For instance, today I may be happy, tomorrow I may be unhappy. So I'm not definite. There is no definite nature that I have.
Prabhupāda: That can be admitted to some extent, that it has not cause. Just like if you are put into the sea, so there you have no control and you are moving according to the waves. That means you have controlling power, but you are put in a certain condition where you lose your controlling power. So it is to be admitted that you are in an awkward position; therefore you cannot ascertain what change is going to take place next. That means you are not in a good situation. Just like a man, when he is on the land, he has got control. If a car is coming, he can take care. He can save from the accident. But when he is put into the ocean, the waves are floating him. So it is circumstantial, not accidental.
Śyāmasundara: Oh, circumstantial but not accidental.
Prabhupāda: It is out of despair. So that is not intelligence. That is not intelligence.
Śyāmasundara: Intelligence doesn't come from despair.
Prabhupāda: No.
Śyāmasundara: He says that a man chooses himself. He creates his own nature.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That's a fact. That we admit. He creates his nature. So now you have created your nature as nothing, but you can create your nature as something. But a poor fund of knowledge cannot do that. Therefore he has to take lessons from a higher personality. Before philosophizing, he should have taken some lessons from persons who are in the knowledge. That is the Vedic injunction: tad vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum eva abhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). In order to learn that transcendental science one must approach a bona fide spiritual master.
Śyāmasundara: His claim is that we are tossed into the world and we are abandoned by God; that God is dead.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Abandoned by God does not mean God is dead. You are condemned, that we have admitted, so your condemnation does not mean God is also condemned. God is always, who has condemned you, He is always safe. So He cannot be dead.
Śyāmasundara: He says because we have been abandoned by God, therefore we must rely on ourselves alone.
Prabhupāda: So he, at last he accept there is God. (laughter) Otherwise what is the meaning of going to God? Yes, he is trying to deny God when there is God. Unless there is God, where is the question of accepting or denying? He is denying in the other way; that means there is God.
Devotee: As soon as he mentions God he's proved there is God.
Prabhupāda: No, as soon as he denies God, there is God.
Devotee: Or denies, because he has admitted God...
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Devotee: ...one way or another.
Devotee: He isn't saying how we should control people. He is simply putting forth the idea that people should be controlled. He doesn't say... In fact, he admits that he doesn't know what the aim or goal is, or how exactly we should control it. He is simply putting forth that according to the Vedic system, the correct thesis that man can be controlled.
Prabhupāda: Man is already controlled, already controlled. Just like Kṛṣṇa says in the Bhagavad-gītā that you are already under the dangerous laws, under the control of the stringent laws of material nature. And you are feeling inconvenienced, just like the threefold miserable condition. (indistinct-greeting guests) So there is no doubt about it. We are controlled. Nobody can say "I am free." We are controlled. When we are being controlled, we are feeling some inconvenience. So we are advising that you be under the control of Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: Why (indistinct) that he is perfect man?
Śyāmasundara: He says that we can design a culture that will survive due to its being moral, set, upright, honest, hard-working, all-typical American.
Devotee: What about the standard? Someone has to be God in order to set the standard.
Śyāmasundara: He said, "Between God and I, I must admit that God is (indistinct)." (indistinct) quote. He says that "Between myself...," between himself... He says there is a curious similarity between himself and God, adding, however, that "Perhaps I must yield to God in point of seniority." He wants to play God.
Prabhupāda: He wants to play God.
Prabhupāda: He doesn't know anything. He is a fool. What does he know? He has to learn.
Devotee: He more or less admits that he is not a perfect personality.
Prabhupāda: So who he accepts as perfect?
Devotee: He says "I am not happy."
Prabhupāda: Nobody is happy. How you can be happy? No one in this material world can be happy. How you can be, you are also one of them. Why you are claiming a better position? Nobody can be happy. We say nobody can be happy. Duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam (BG 8.15). Anyone who is living in this material world cannot be happy.
Śyāmasundara: He stresses two aspects (in the) theory of dialectical materialism. The one on which he placed the most emphasis is the aspect of the pragmatic element of philosophy, that philosophy must have practical effect. And the other aspect is the contradiction between capitalism and communism, and this contradiction involves conflicts and eventual revolution. He agrees with Hegel that without conflict, there can be no progress. Do we accept this? Without conflict, there is no progress?
Prabhupāda: Our Kurukṣetra battle is a conflict between Kurus and Pāṇḍavas. So after the conflict, the Pāṇḍavas became the kings. So that is admitted; without conflict, you cannot make progress.
Śyāmasundara: Is that true on every level of...?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Śyāmasundara: No. I would admit that I am controlled. Everyone in my Communist state is controlled because we work under the...
Prabhupāda: Apart from Communist state, by nature's law... You have spoken about nature's law. So we are controlled by the nature's law. Who can deny it? When there is severe cold, I am controlled. When there is severe heat, I am controlled. When there is epidemic, I am controlled. When there is famine, I am controlled. When there is flood, I am controlled. So how you can say that you are not controlled? You are not independent. The basic principle is that you are not independent.
Devotee: Why are you discussing them?
Prabhupāda: Discussing to defeat their philosophy. Because their philosophy is accepted in the world, so we are giving the weak points of that philosophy.
Devotee: When I (indistinct) they simply say I'm dogmatic, but when I defeat them in terms of their own premises, that they have to admit.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That we are doing. We are defeating on their own principles. On principles. Just like we are speaking that Mao thinks that he is not controlled. He should be controller. But he is controlled by heart attack. Then how he can be controller? The same example. If you are blind, how you can lead other blind men? First of all, he has to know that "I am so powerful, why I am being controlled by heart attack?" Let them philosophize on this point. You must admit that "I am controlled." So if I am controller, then how I can be supreme controller?
Revatīnandana: Or if I am perfect, then why do I have to submit to imperfection?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Śyāmasundara: He says that after the secondary sense perceptions are developed, then life develops and then mind develops.
Prabhupāda: Mind is also created. That we admit.
Śyāmasundara: So he says that in this way there are...
Prabhupāda: Mind, ego, intelligence, everything is created of elements.
Śyāmasundara: His definition of God is that God is the source in nature to support and produce values. What is good, what is true, values, this is God, the source of these values.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So this is value. Kṛṣṇa says, "You surrender unto Me and all questions solved." So it has value. That we also admit. But it is up to me to accept that value or not. That independence God has given me. Otherwise, everyone would have been Kṛṣṇa conscious and surrendered to Kṛṣṇa. Why they are not doing that? Even God is value, to accept that value depends on me.
Śyāmasundara: He said that God is the whole universe and that we are parts and parcels, that man is part and parcel of God.
Prabhupāda: So that means he wants to listen somebody's dictation. That is, as soon as you say "listen," then somebody is speaking, you listen. So that is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā, īśvaraḥ sarva-bhūtānāṁ hṛd-deśe arjuna tiṣṭhati (BG 18.61). God is situated in everyone's heart, and He is dictating. Even He is dictating to the thief that "You are going to steal. It is not good. If you are arrested you will be punished." That dictation is there, but he disobeys the dictation and he steals, commits sin. That is sin. So the dictator is there, we admit that. Kṛṣṇa, or God, is there within the heart, and He is giving dictation, but you disobey. But if we accept that dictation, then you become devotee. Dictation is already there; otherwise this thief is going to steal at night? Dictation is there that "You don't go at the daytime. You will be captured and be punished." "All right, I shall go at night, when everyone is sleep." So dictation is there. Dictation is there in two ways—from the heart and from the representative. God's representative, saintly person, spiritual master, is dictating, "My dear boy, do not do this; you do this." Outside dictation. And inside dictation. But he is disobeying. Regularly he is disobeying. Then how he can be happy?
Prabhupāda: And one who has fallen, he is in the..., if he is crying that "I am fallen," so it is said that the man outside, he drops a rope, that "You catch this rope and I shall take it out." But he does not catch up. Just like we are presenting that you, everyone in the material world, you are suffering, you take, catch up this Kṛṣṇa consciousness. They are refusing, or they do not admit; that is going on. But if one is fortunate, he can catch up the rope, and the man wants to help him, he can get him out. But he has to catch up. It is Kṛṣṇa's advice also, that "You are crying, you are suffering, you are finding, trying to find out how your suffering will be ended." That materialist, they are doing their own way, and the impersonalists, they are doing in their own way; the yogis, they are doing in their own way.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Hayagrīva: So his, his...
Prabhupāda: It may be that you know something about God. Then you have to admit that you do not know everything about God. So their knowledge is imperfect. Our point is that we know everything of God from God. So that knowledge is perfect. As Kṛṣṇa said in the Seventh Chapter, that mayy āsakta-manāḥ pārtha yogaṁ yuñjan mad-āśrayaḥ. "If you concentrate your mind on your attachment to Me, and if you execute yoga meditation, always thinking of Kṛṣṇa, that is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Then you understand Me fully and without any doubt." So instead of speculating in God, if we simply think of God, that will help us. To escape from darkness, if you speculate about the sun by some suggestion, by some concoction, this is one kind of knowledge. But if you actually come out of the darkness and see the sun, then it is complete (indistinct).
Hayagrīva: Now...
Prabhupāda: So this figurative description is there in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. The body is considered as like city, and the soul is described as the king of the city, and he goes out from different gates. The body has got nine gates. In this way a figurative description in the..., is in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. But that city is figuratively taken as this body, and the king of the city is the soul. (break)
Hayagrīva: This is the continuation of Augustine. Augustine writes, "God is not the soul of all things but the maker of all souls." So this doctrine seems to admit of the transcendence of God but not of the eminence of God, at least not as the Paramātmā accompanying the individual soul.
Prabhupāda: He does not accept Paramātmā?
Hayagrīva: It doesn't seem to be. It seems that...
Hayagrīva: He says, uh... (break) He says..., this is, this is Augustine writing. He said, "Some people try to stretch the prohibition 'Thou shalt not kill' to cover beasts and cattle and make it unlawful to kill any such animal, but then why not include plants and anything rooted in and feeding on the soil? After all, things like this, though devoid of feeling, are said to have life and therefore can die and so be killed by violent treatment."
Prabhupāda: No, that is not Vedic philosophy. Vedic philosophy admits that one living entity is the food for another living entity. That is natural.
Hayagrīva: Well, the first cause, as in Brahma-saṁhitā.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Sarva-kāraṇa-kāraṇam (Bs. 5.1). Yes, that is also admitted by us, that everything has got cause, and when you reach to the ultimate cause, that is God.
Hayagrīva: Because we have an idea of perfection in the world, or we see relative perfection...
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Prabhupāda: He is a British or Frenchman?
Hayagrīva: Huxley, no, he was English, Englishman.
Prabhupāda: Oh.
Hayagrīva: He says, "By the Ganges ethical man admits that the cosmos is too strong for him..."
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Hayagrīva: "...and destroying every bond which ties him to it by ascetic discipline he seeks salvation in absolute renunciation."
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Hayagrīva: Well, at any rate he's dead now, so...
Prabhupāda: So therefore he is..., he is not surviving. He was...
Hayagrīva: He admits, he says, "This seems..."
Prabhupāda: Either you be Englishman or Frenchman or this man, you cannot survive. You have to succumb under the dictation of the superior nature.
| Page Title: | Admit (Lectures, Other) |
| Compiler: | Visnu Murti, JayaNitaiGaura |
| Created: | 25 of Jun, 2011 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=135, Con=0, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 135 |