Prabhupāda: Yes, opium is very good sometimes. He is right. Tincture opium. Yes. Yes. All the drugs are used. You know very well.
Dr. Patel: Yes, yes, sir. In heart attack we give that first.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So opium is poison undoubtedly, but if it is in the hand of physician, it is nectarine. It can save the life. Whatever God has created, it has got some use. One must know. Nirbandhaḥ kṛṣṇa-sambandhe yuktaṁ vairāgyam ucyate. That is wanted.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Marx's idea was that instead of trying to improve the condition of life, people would simply go to the church or like this and worship and accept their miserable condition of life without any material progress.
Prabhupāda: No, they do not know.
Dr. Patel: It is abstract materialism, sir.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Dr. Patel: Because the very theory of dialectical materialism is against the tenets of religious teachings of sanātana-dharma.
Prabhupāda: No, that...
Dr. Patel: The spirit is more important than material.
Prabhupāda: No, their teaching is to become some strong atheist, because religion has been exploited by the so-called religious leaders. That is the difficulty. So they have become atheist.
Dr. Patel: Unless they change their very principle on which they are working. That is why I say we must spread the spiritual communism, sir, or Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is the only way. The other day I talked about the dialectical materialism. That is the crux of the whole communism.
Prabhupāda: The communism will be immediately perfect as soon as it is connected with Kṛṣṇa.
Dr. Patel: But that is, sir... I mean, our sanātana-dharma is spiritual communism. That is what we actually try to preach them.
Prabhupāda: But you have lost it. You have lost it.
Dr. Patel: Yes, we have lost. That is right. And we are gaining it again. The heaven is lost; heaven may be regained. (laughs) What is that, Milton's?
Prabhupāda: "Paradise..."
Dr. Patel: "Paradise Lost and Gained."
Prabhupāda: If you have lost Kṛṣṇa, that is paradise lost.
Dr. Patel: Paradise lost, that is. My paradise, everything, is lost.
Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) And this night I have explained, chanting outside the temple and chanting in the temple, it increases the value thousand times. That I have explained, this evening, this last night.