Expressions researched:
"Churchill"
Lectures
Bhagavad-gita As It Is Lectures
Just like Mr. Churchill or your President Roosevelt, they said "No. The sense gratification should not be like that. The sense gratification should be like this." (laughter) So it is the war of sense gratification, that's all. One leader is presenting a program of sense gratification, another leader is presenting another program of sense gratification, and there is clash. This is going on. This is the history of the world.
Lecture on BG 3.6-10 -- Los Angeles, December 23, 1968: Generally, in the material world, adānta-adānta means uncontrolled, go—go means senses. Adānta-gobhir viśatāṁ tamisraṁ punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). Simply repeating, chewing the chewed. The whole history of the world, you just study, is a history of sense gratification. Just take, for example, some twenty years ago one Mr. Adolf Hitler came in the scene, and there was great upheaval as war in Europe and America. From 1933 to 1947 or something like that, the whole world was in trouble. But he is gone, finished. And what did he do? Sense gratification, that's all. He wanted that this way government should be, according to his own sense. Another person, just like Mr. Churchill or your President Roosevelt, they said "No. The sense gratification should not be like that. The sense gratification should be like this." (laughter) So it is the war of sense gratification, that's all. One leader is presenting a program of sense gratification, another leader is presenting another program of sense gratification, and there is clash. This is going on. This is the history of the world.
And another class, they are thinking "Oh, there are so much trouble simply for sense gratification. Let us control our senses." Brahma satyaṁ jagan mithyā, just like Māyāvādī philosophers, Śaṅkarācārya. They say this world is useless. This world is useless. Only Brahman, the Supreme Brahman, impersonal Brahman, that is truth. That is also another sense gratification. That is bigger sense gratification. Why? These Māyāvādī philosophers, they want to merge into the existence of the Supreme One. That means by becoming Hitler, Churchill or Roosevelt, their senses were not very much satisfied. "Now," they say, "this world is false. Now let me become the Supreme." That is another sense gratification.
Kṛṣṇa says to Arjuna that "I am giving you perfect knowledge." This is our process. We receive knowledge from the perfect person. There is no use getting knowledge from imperfect person. That is useless waste of time.
Lecture on BG 7.2 -- Nairobi, October 28, 1975: Prabhupāda:
- jñānaṁ te 'haṁ sa-vijñānam
- idaṁ vakṣyāmy aśeṣataḥ
- yaj jñātvā neha bhūyo 'nyaj
- jñātavyam avaśiṣyate
- (BG 7.2)
Jñānam, knowledge. Kṛṣṇa says to Arjuna that "I am giving you perfect knowledge." This is our process. We receive knowledge from the perfect person. There is no use getting knowledge from imperfect person. That is useless waste of time. And who is perfect person? Who does not commit any mistake, who is never illusioned, whose senses are not imperfect, and who is not a cheater. These are the qualification. (aside:) The children... These are the symptoms of perfect person. First thing is he does not commit mistake. Throughout the whole world you study big, big men. They committed mistake. Hitler committed mistake. Gandhi committed mistake. Churchill committed mistake. Because "To err is human," however big you may be, you cannot avoid mistakes because you are not liberated.
So these are the signs of becoming perfect man, that he does not commit mistake, neither he is illusioned.
Srimad-Bhagavatam Lectures
And brahma-bhūtaḥ means to realize that "Why I am unnecessarily struggling with this material world? I do not belong to this material world. I am spirit soul. My business is spiritual." That is brahma-bhūtaḥ.
Lecture on SB 1.2.6 -- Mauritius, October 5, 1975: And brahma-bhūtaḥ means to realize that "Why I am unnecessarily struggling with this material world? I do not belong to this material world. I am spirit soul. My business is spiritual." That is brahma-bhūtaḥ. And as soon as one understands this position, then prasannātmā, he becomes immediately happy, joyful. Just like if you are doing something for which you have no necessity, and when you come to realize that "I am unnecessarily wasting my time in this way," naturally, if you become joyful that "Why I am wasting my time in this way?" that is brahma-bhūtaḥ stage. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā (BG 18.54). Prasannātmā means joyful stage, no more anxiety. We are full of anxiety on account of our material conception of life, unnecessarily. So many leaders came and gone. So long they were living, they were always concerned. In our country... Just like Mahātmā Gandhi, he came, big leader. Or in other countries, Churchill came or Hitler came. So long they were living, they were always anxiety, full of anxiety, fighting with one another. Now they are not existing. What is the loss there? But unnecessarily they were busy, that "Without me, my country will be finished, and this will be vanquished." Unnecessarily.
So all of them are searching about the... Devotees, they have finished their searching. They have found out the real truth. Īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ (Bs. 5.1), the Supreme. So it is a question of degrees of spiritual understanding.
Lecture on SB 1.5.11 -- New Vrindaban, June 10, 1969: So all of them are searching about the... Devotees, they have finished their searching. They have found out the real truth. Īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ (Bs. 5.1), the Supreme. So it is a question of degrees of spiritual understanding. So there are three million serious sādhus in India. None of them ever attended such Mahatma Gandhi's meeting, neither they invited Mahatma Gandhi. No. They never never recognized, recognized. Because what they have got to do with these political affairs? Just like... They know, this is the business of the crows. The crows will take interest in such meeting. Punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). What these politicians will do? They'll simply make plan. That's all. Hitler will make one plan, Mussolini will make one plan, Churchill will make another plan. Your Roosevelt will make another plan, Gandhi will make another. Simply planmaking business. They will never be able to bring any peace and prosperity in the world. That is not possible. Because it is under the grip of māyā. They do not know.
So anyone who has become devotee, for them, these senses, which are compared with the snakes, are not fearful. Just like Haridāsa Ṭhākura. He was young man, he has got all the senses, and the young girl, beautiful girl, came before him. But he was not fearful because the poison teeth is taken away of his senses. The senses, being engaged in Kṛṣṇa's service, it is no more controller of the sense proprietor. This is the system.
Lecture on SB 1.8.31 -- Mayapura, October 11, 1974: So anyone who has become devotee, for them, these senses, which are compared with the snakes, are not fearful. Just like Haridāsa Ṭhākura. He was young man, he has got all the senses, and the young girl, beautiful girl, came before him. But he was not fearful because the poison teeth is taken away of his senses. The senses, being engaged in Kṛṣṇa's service, it is no more controller of the sense proprietor. This is the system. Therefore Prabodhānanda Sarasvatī said that durdānta: "The senses are like the snakes; it is very difficult to control. But it can be controlled because the poison teeth is taken away." This is the position of devotee. Kaivalyaṁ narakāyate tri-daśa-pūrākāśa-puṣpāyate durdānta indriya-kāla-sarpa-paṭalī protkhāta-daṁṣṭrāyate.
And what is the other? Now, vidhi-mahendrādiś ca kīṭāyate. I was going to come to this point. Vidhi-mahendrādiś ca kīṭāyate. Vidhi means Brahmā, and mahendra means the king of heaven, Indradeva. Such, such, big, big men, what to speak of these Churchill or Subhash Bose or... These big, big, they're kīṭāyate. Kīṭāyate means a devotee thinks this Brahmā and Indra exactly like these insect. That is the conception. So that is actually the fact. Everyone... It is the relative world. Relatively, it looks very gorgeous, but the actually... Just like proportionate. You put five upon ten, and five millions upon ten millions. The ratio is the same, half. Similarly, these big, big men, these big, big politicians, they are struggling exactly like the insect. The whole life, they struggle.
So that is the fact. And there is a version of Tulasī Dāsa in Hindi. It is said sukse sabe hari bhaje, duhkhse saha hari bhaje, sukse bhaje khoya. Or sukhase ara hari bhaje, tu duḥkha hase hoya. It is very nice instruction. The instruction is that when one is distressed, everyone remembers God. Yes.
Lecture on SB 1.16.19 -- Los Angeles, July 9, 1974: Svarūpa Dāmodara: That there was an explosion in the (indistinct), and they could not go to the moon. So they were in danger in outer space. So they were requesting all the people so to "Pray to God so that I can come back safe and sound to this planet." (laughter)
Prabhupāda: When they are in danger they pray to God for safe and sound, but when they go to the moon planet: "We are scientist." (laughter) Just see how much foolish they are! When they go to the moon planet, at that time, "God give us permission, we may go"? No. "We are scientists. (laughter) We don't care for God." But when they are in danger, "God save us." (laughter) Just see what kind of scientists they are. This is practical. I am very glad that our Doctor Svarūpa Dāmodara has mentioned this in his book, Scientific Basis of Kṛṣṇa Consciousness.
So that is the fact. And there is a version of Tulasī Dāsa in Hindi. It is said sukse sabe hari bhaje, duhkhse saha hari bhaje, sukse bhaje khoya.(?) Or sukhase ara hari bhaje, tu duḥkha hase hoya(?). It is very nice instruction. The instruction is that when one is distressed, everyone remembers God. Yes. Duhkhse saba hari bhaje. Saba means "all." At that time... Just like in the last war, Second..., last war, when everything was in danger, Mr. Churchill started this movement B(?), and they were all going to churches—when the situation was very grave. And in Germany especially, because war was very, going on very seriously, so there was no men, so all the women, they went to the church and pray God, somebody... Woman means husband, son or father... Prayed, "Let my father come back" or "Let my husband come back" or "my son." But nobody came back. So they became atheist.
To realize Kṛṣṇa and go back to Him, that should be our main business. But these karmīs, they do not know what is the mission of this human form of life. They are busy working hard, day and night, for a morsel of grass. That's all.
Lecture on SB 2.3.19 -- Los Angeles, June 15, 1972: To realize Kṛṣṇa and go back to Him, that should be our main business. But these karmīs, they do not know what is the mission of this human form of life. They are busy working hard, day and night, for a morsel of grass. That's all. Yan maithunādi-gṛha... There are many other verses. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tuccham (SB 7.9.45). So śāstra, intelligence, knowledge, means one should study everything very critically, "What is my position? What is my duty?" We should not be like the animals. Śva-viḍ-varāhoṣṭra-khara. Now we have got our great personalities, leaders. They are praised, eulogized, our, these political leaders. "Our Hitler," "Our Gandhi," "Our Churchill," "Our Nixon." But śāstra says these leaders, those who are not spiritual leaders, those who cannot give our life, they are worshiped by these classes of animals, animals. These so-called leaders, politicians, they are eulogized very much by whom? By these class of men: dogs, camels, asses and...
What is the other one?
Devotees: Hogs.
The whole Vedic system is designed or planned how to know Kṛṣṇa. So if you follow Vedic system, then the ultimate objective should be to know Kṛṣṇa. That is the Vedic version and corroborated by Lord Kṛṣṇa Himself. He is the original compiler of Vedas; therefore His version should be accepted, that the objective of studying Vedas means to know Kṛṣṇa. That's all.
Lecture on SB 5.5.1 -- Tittenhurst, London, September 12, 1969: The whole Vedic system is designed or planned how to know Kṛṣṇa. So if you follow Vedic system, then the ultimate objective should be to know Kṛṣṇa. That is the Vedic version and corroborated by Lord Kṛṣṇa Himself. He is the original compiler of Vedas; therefore His version should be accepted, that the objective of studying Vedas means to know Kṛṣṇa. That's all. Vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyaḥ (BG 15.15).
Therefore the king, Ṛṣabhadeva, is advising, instructing His sons... He was retiring. Why He was retiring? He could enjoy His kingdom. Just like at the present moment, either a king or a family man does not retire. Even a poor man living in with family with great difficulties, but if you ask him to retire, he'll not be agreeable. We have asked many old men. He's suffering, he's not happy within his family members, but if I say, "Why you are taking so much trouble with the family? Why not come and live with us in Kṛṣṇa consciousness society?" he'll not agree. Because he has no Vedic training. Up to the end of this life he'll stick to the family life. Many, many politicians... In our country we have seen many old politicians, seventy-five years old, eighty years old. Not only in our country, in other countries also. In your country, Great Britain, Mr. Churchill, unless he was forced to death, he would not give up politics.
Everyone has experience what is the situation of this material world. Every day we have seen big, big leaders, ministers. Just like in the history of the world there were so many big, big men—Hitler, Napoleon, this Churchill, Gandhi, Nehru. But all their powers, position, in one minute it becomes vanquished. There is no question... They are so proud, they do not believe in God, but when the death comes, they cannot argue anything. The death orders, "Immediately vacate"—finished.
Lecture on SB 7.9.23 -- Mayapur, March 1, 1976: Dayānanda: "My dear Lord, people in general want to be elevated to the higher planetary system for long duration of life, opulence, enjoyment. I have seen all of them through the activities of my father. When my father was very angry and laughing sarcastically upon the demigods, immediately they fell down simply by seeing the movement of his eyebrows. Such my father is now finished within a moment."
Prabhupāda:
- dṛṣṭā mayā divi vibho 'khila-dhiṣṇya-pānām
- āyuḥ śriyo vibhava icchati yāñ jano 'yam
- ye 'smat pituḥ kupita-hāsa-vijṛmbhita-bhrū-
- visphūrjitena lulitāḥ sa tu te nirastaḥ
- (SB 7.9.23)
So this is experience, dṛṣṭā... Everyone has experience what is the situation of this material world. Every day we have seen big, big leaders, ministers. Just like in the history of the world there were so many big, big men—Hitler, Napoleon, this Churchill, Gandhi, Nehru. But all their powers, position, in one minute it becomes vanquished. There is no question... They are so proud, they do not believe in God, but when the death comes, they cannot argue anything. The death orders, "Immediately vacate"—finished. You have to vacate. At that time their power, opulence, position—nothing can help. So Kṛṣṇa says, therefore... The atheist class of men who do not believe in God, decry the authority of God, for them... Of course, everyone dies, but for them, mṛtyuḥ sarva-haraś cāham: (BG 10.34) Kṛṣṇa comes as death and takes away everything in their possession.
Sri Caitanya-caritamrta Lectures
Just like Churchill, he introduced that everyone should go and pray for victory. So England was also praying for victory, and Germany was also praying for victory. So (chuckles) God is perplexed. (laughter).
Lecture on CC Adi-lila 7.1 -- Atlanta, March 1, 1975: There are other necessities for those who are not devotees. Those necessities are dharma artha kāma mokṣa (SB 4.8.41, Cc. Ādi 1.90). Generally, in the material world everyone has necessity of gratifying his senses. So sometimes, under the cover of religiosity, they want to satisfy senses. The same thing... Just like one goes to church or temple to mitigate some material necessities. Just like the Christians go to the church for meeting the problems of bread; similarly, the Hindus or the Muslim, everyone goes to church, temple or mosque to pray something material: "God, I am very distressed. Kindly get me relief from this distressed condition." Or "God, I am in need of money, I am very poor. Kindly give me some money." Or any other, "I am now implicated in war." Just like Churchill, he introduced that everyone should go and pray for victory. So England was also praying for victory, and Germany was also praying for victory. So (chuckles) God is perplexed. (laughter) The thief is praying to God that "This night, I may steal without any hindrances." And the householder is praying, "My Lord, thief may not come here and steal my goods." And God has to adjust everything. So just imagine how much busy is God.
General Lectures
You cannot live without a leader or God. I cannot live without a leader or God. That's a fact. Then where is the difference? Now it is to be judged whether Lenin is good or Kṛṣṇa is good. That is another thing. But your position is that you have to accept one leader, either Lenin or Jawaharlal Nehru or Hitler or this or Lord (?) Churchill. You have to accept. You cannot work independently. Therefore you have got so many parties. So here is also one party, Kṛṣṇa party.
Lecture at Indo-American Society 'East and West' -- Calcutta, January 31, 1973: So I request all you ladies and gentlemen to take this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. It is not a sentimental movement. It is a very authorized, scientific movement. You are all educated, advanced ladies and gentlemen. I'll request you to understand this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. The American boys, it is already we are combining East and West socially, politically, religiously, philosophically, economically, everything. There is solution. But if you take it seriously. If you think this is a movement, sentimental move... It is not sentimental movement. It is a most scientific movement. Any scientist come to me. I can convince him that it is a scientific movement. I asked similarly to Professor Kotovsky in Moscow that "My dear Professor, what is the difference between your movement, communist movement, and my movement? You, you have selected Lenin as God. I have selected Kṛṣṇa as God. Where is the difference of principle? You cannot live without a leader or God. I cannot live without a leader or God. That's a fact. Then where is the difference? Now it is to be judged whether Lenin is good or Kṛṣṇa is good. That is another thing. But your position is that you have to accept one leader, either Lenin or Jawaharlal Nehru or Hitler or this or Lord (?) Churchill. You have to accept. You cannot work independently. Therefore you have got so many parties. So here is also one party, Kṛṣṇa party.
Conversations and Morning Walks
1973 Conversations and Morning Walks
How the Britishers could rule, unless there was obedience. But as soon as they saw now the obedience is going on, the soldiers are leaving our camp and joining the national camp," immediately they decided to leave peacefully. Otherwise, there would be some revolution. At that time, all good relationship will go. Better separate with good relation. This was Attlee's policy, to convince statesmen like Churchill that: "You cannot rule over India any more. Better separate in good relationship."
Morning Walk -- April 21, 1973, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. We respected our professors like our fathers. The relationship between the student and the professors was very good. I had one Scottish professor, Dr. W.S. Urquhart. He was my nice friend. He was professor of philosophy, psychology. Later on he became vice-chancellor.
Brahmānanda:Calcutta?
Prabhupāda: Calcutta, yes. A very perfect gentleman. Kind-hearted. Sometimes we joked. We were taking this, what is called, peanuts. So the professor was passing. So some of our friends remarked: (Bengali) So he thought that professor did not know Bengali. So immediately he turned: (Bengali). So we became very much ashamed. Yes. So all the professors from foreign countries, they were instructed to learn Bengali language, local language. That was the system. All officers, big officers, educate... (Aside) Good morning. ...big educationists, they were to learn the local language. And they used to learn Bengali. Especially in Calcutta. There was one professor, Mr. Scrimgeour. He was professor of literature, English literature. So while teaching one English literature, he was giving parallel passage from Bankim Candra Chatterjee. Yes. "Your Bankim babu says like this." He used to say like that.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Oh, I see.
Prabhupāda: That means he studied Bankim literature. Bankim Candra Chatterjee was compared with Sir Walter Scott, of English literary men. Sir Walter Scott. In those days, Charles Dickens.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Charles Dickens?
Prabhupāda: Yes. And Sir Walter Scott were known two very great English literary men.
Karandhara: Novelists.
Prabhupāda: After sixth year... Yes novelists. So the relationship was very nice. There were... Otherwise, how the Britishers could rule, unless there was obedience. But as soon as they saw now the obedience is going on, the soldiers are leaving our camp and joining the national camp," immediately they decided to leave peacefully. Otherwise, there would be some revolution. At that time, all good relationship will go. Better separate with good relation. This was Attlee's policy, to convince statesmen like Churchill that: "You cannot rule over India any more. Better separate in good relationship."
You have to worship somebody superior. Now it is up to you to select who is that superior. But the principle is there. Now so many political parties, they have selected one god. Somebody has selected Churchill. Somebody has selected Gandhi. Somebody has selected somebody, somebody. But they must have to select. Our proposition is: "If you are selecting somebody to worship, why not the perfect? Why you select the imperfect?" That is our Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Morning Walk -- April 29, 1973, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: Many visitors are waiting to see the tomb of Lenin. Yes. They were worshiping Lenin. As we are worshiping Kṛṣṇa, they are worshiping Lenin. So I, I asked Professor Kotovsky: "Where is the difference in principle? You are also worshiping somebody. So you, you have not been able to stop worshiping. How you can be Godless. You have made your God, that's all. Somebody false God." I did not say him also that: "This is your false God," but I said that: "You are worshiping Lenin. We are worshiping Kṛṣṇa." Where is the difference in philosophy? "You have to worship somebody." Now it is my selection whether I shall worship Lenin or Kṛṣṇa. That is different thing. But the principle of worshiping is there in you and in me." He could not answer. What he'll answer? Everywhere it is going on.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: That, that, that also shows that the, there is superior person than man to worship.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is my point. You have to worship somebody superior. Now it is up to you to select who is that superior. But the principle is there. Now so many political parties, they have selected one god. Somebody has selected Churchill. Somebody has selected Gandhi. Somebody has selected somebody, somebody. But they must have to select. Our proposition is: "If you are selecting somebody to worship, why not the perfect? Why you select the imperfect?" That is our Kṛṣṇa consciousness. You have to do it. You have to select somebody as your leader. You cannot do without it. So the answer is that if you are selecting somebody to worship, Kṛṣṇa says in the Bhagavad-gītā: mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat (BG 7.7). "There is nobody superior than Me." Then why not go to the best person? Why should we go to the inferior?
1974 Conversations and Morning Walks
Our philosophy is that the political head should be like Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira, Lord Rāmacandra, that is difference. Here Churchill or Hitler or similar man, crooked man... Without being crooked one cannot become politician. Lloyd George, the British Prime Minister, he said that "Consistency in politics is the qualification of an ass." Consistency. You must change.
Morning Walk -- April 24, 1974, Hyderabad: Prabhupāda: He studies our books?
Mahāṁśa: Oh, yes, he has taken our books and he especially asked that "I am reading these books and please give me." And he attended all the three days of the exhibition grounds.
Prabhupāda: Oh.
Mahāṁśa: You maybe remember, no?
Devotee: Yes.
Mahāṁśa: Channa Reddy. He's very nice. He'll be coming today at ten o'clock. (break)
Prabhupāda: ...the modern politicians. Here at the present moment their philosophy is that one must be very cunning diplomat, then he's successful politician. This is their philosophy. The most crooked man, like Cāṇakya. But our philosophy is that the political head should be like Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira, Lord Rāmacandra, that is difference. Here Churchill or Hitler or similar man, crooked man... Without being crooked one cannot become politician. Lloyd George, the British Prime Minister, he said that "Consistency in politics is the qualification of an ass." Consistency. You must change. (break)
In the Bhagavad-gītā we don't find any such sanction that you run on a factory, a slaughterhouse or the brothel and this business and brewery no such sanction. But you have done at your whims. Just like in the last war, Mr. Churchill sanctioned or requested everyone to go to the church. What is that "V"? Victory? Yes. And now... Before starting the war, Mr. Churchill and company did not take any sanction. And when they were in reverse condition, then, that time, they are going to the church for victory. So God cannot be made in such a way as order supplier.
Room Conversation with Richard Webster, chairman, Societa Filosofica Italiana -- May 24, 1974, Rome: Atreya Ṛṣi: Would God sanction activities in the factory, technological, scientific world?
Prabhupāda: No, there is no sanction. These are all sinful activities.
Richard Webster: These are material activities.
Prabhupāda: Yes. You have created all these things. God has not sanctioned. God has not sanctioned for running on a factory. Therefore as soon as you run on a factory, you simply commit sinful activities. In the Bhagavad-gītā we don't find any such sanction that you run on a factory, a slaughterhouse or the brothel and this business and brewery no such sanction. But you have done at your whims. Just like in the last war, Mr. Churchill sanctioned or requested everyone to go to the church. What is that "V"? Victory? Yes. And now... Before starting the war, Mr. Churchill and company did not take any sanction. And when they were in reverse condition, then, that time, they are going to the church for victory. So God cannot be made in such a way as order supplier. That is not possible. This is not prayer. You start war whimsically, and when you are in a precarious condition you go to the church and pray God, "Give us victory." What is this? This is commanding God. But you have to follow the commands of God. That is your position.
All these big, big political leaders, Napoleon, Hitler, Churchill, and in Europe , they fought with this consciousness, "I am Englishman," "I am German," "I am Frenchman." That's all. Even the big, big leaders, they are fools. And what to speak of common men?
Morning Walk -- June 11, 1974, Paris: Paramahaṁsa: So we should be able to see the quality of man we are preaching to.
Prabhupāda: Yes, you have to make him intelligent. Everyone is fool, mūḍha. Everyone within this material world is supposed to be a fool. Because everyone is thinking, "I am this body." So he's fool. "I am Indian," "I am American," "I am German," "I am Frenchman," "I am this," "I am that." What is the difference? A cat is thinking, "I'm cat." A dog is thinking, "I am dog." So if somebody thinks that, in relationship with the body, "I am Frenchman," "I am Englishman," "I am...", then where is the difference between the cat and the dog? He's thinking himself as this body. Therefore everyone is thinking, at least in this modern world, the so-called nationalism, everyone is thinking, "I am Englishman," "I am Frenchman," "I am Indian," "I am this," "black," "white." So everyone is fool. Is it not? Yes. He's thinking in a way what he is not. Therefore he's a fool. All these big, big political leaders, Napoleon, Hitler, Churchill, and in Europe , they fought with this consciousness, "I am Englishman," "I am German," "I am Frenchman." That's all. Even the big, big leaders, they are fools. And what to speak of common men?
1975 Conversations and Morning Walks
Yes, we are in trouble. Even last war, when the trouble was too much, they began to go to the church. Even Churchill. And one gentleman—he is my Godbrother in Germany—he told me, after this war many German men and women became atheist. Everyone went to the church and prayed. Especially women prayed for return of their husband, brother, father. And nobody returned. So they thought, "There is no God. So forget about all these things." People became atheist.
Room Conversation with Indian Guests -- March 13, 1975, Tehran: Prabhupāda: Yes. (Child talking and Prabhupāda says something in Hindi) Dr. Ghora (?), you can say. The aim should be saṁsiddhiḥ hari-toṣaṇam. But if we don't care for this proposition... They do not know what is God, neither we don't want to satisfy Him, "He may be satisfied or not satisfied. Let us go on with our business." (Hindu)
Indian man (1): A lot of dangers will be there. We'll be putting ourself into trouble.
Prabhupāda: Yes, we are in trouble. Even last war, when the trouble was too much, they began to go to the church. Even Churchill. And one gentleman—he is my Godbrother in Germany—he told me, after this war many German men and women became atheist. Everyone went to the church and prayed. Especially women prayed for return of their husband, brother, father. And nobody returned. So they thought, "There is no God. So forget about all these things." People became atheist. So this risky civilization is going on. They don't want to know what is God, neither they want to satisfy Him. And our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is just the opposite, that "Here is God. You satisfy Him." That's all. "Never mind what you are, but by your occupational duty you satisfy Him. That is perfection." This is our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement.
You are very busy doing good to others, but first of all make your life perfect. And otherwise, you rascal, fool, blind, what you will do? So where is the training? Where the politicians are going to take training how to become free from the wrapping, illusion? So they are in illusion, in darkness. What they can do? Futile attempt. Therefore all plans are failure. So many Hitler, so many Gandhi, so many Churchill, they came and...
Room Conversation with Press Representative -- March 21, 1975, Calcutta: Gargamuni: I gave him one copy of Back to Godhead and that BBT... You have it there? And the BBT catalogue which gives your history and everything.
Prabhupāda: And catalogue? Where is? This is BBT?
Gargamuni: Yes. This tells about your books.
Prabhupāda: (Bengali) ...movement, (Bengali) bogus religious, it is scientific. You can question; I will understand. (break) They do not know what is the meaning of life. Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānās te 'pīśa-tantryām uru-dāmni baddhāḥ (SB 7.5.31). Another blind leader, so-called leader, he is blind himself. He does not know how to lead people. And the followers, followers are also blind. So what will be the result? They are bound up... Suppose if I tightly wrap your eyes, and all of them are done so, then how you will lead them?
Guest: Blind leaders and blind followers?
Prabhupāda: Then they are controlled by the laws of material nature, and they want to be happy independently. This is rascaldom. If I am controlling you and you want to become happy independently, how it is possible? You must get out of the control first of all. Your eyes should be open. Then you can do something independently. But you are under my control fully, and I have wrapped up your eyes with very thick layer of cloth, and then how you can become independent, work. That they do not know. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā, daivī hy eṣā guṇa-mayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). This māyā, this energy, is very, very strong. You cannot get out of it. Then what is the way? Mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti te. Therefore Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is so important. If one becomes Kṛṣṇa conscious, then immediately he gets out of the control of māyā. That is the sign. Otherwise, if I remain a blind man, how can I lead others? Caitanya Mahāprabhu therefore said, janma sārthaka kari kāra para-upakāra (CC Adi 9.41). You are very busy doing good to others, but first of all make your life perfect. And otherwise, you rascal, fool, blind, what you will do? So where is the training? Where the politicians are going to take training how to become free from the wrapping, illusion? So they are in illusion, in darkness. What they can do? Futile attempt. Therefore all plans are failure. So many Hitler, so many Gandhi, so many Churchill, they came and...
When there is a war, Churchill will ask them to go, victory, "V": "Go and pray to God." God is order-supplier. And when they declare war, they do not consult God. When there is reverse condition they go to it. This is going on, that God means order-supplier. "Whatever I desire, if You are God then You supply me. Otherwise I reject You."
Morning Walk -- October 7, 1975, Durban: Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They have an Islamic propagation center here, and I went there. I was walking by one day. They invited me in. So they began to blaspheme this and that. So I asked them, "What is your conception of God?" He said, "God is beyond conception." So I told him that "Therefore you cannot say that Kṛṣṇa is God and you cannot say that Kṛṣṇa is not God, because you don't know what God is."
Prabhupāda: Then what did he say?
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: He couldn't reply.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Because you have no conception of God, how can you deny or accept? Remain fool, that's all. That is the difficulty. When you ask them, whole world, "What is the conception of God?" they'll not be able to answer. Still, they will say there is no God. This is the foolishness going on all over the world. Actually they are not concerned with God. They accept the idea of God or so-called God for their material facilities. "O God, give us our daily bread. That's all. If You supply daily bread, then I accept You. Otherwise I reject You." This is their... When there is a war, Churchill will ask them to go, victory, "V": "Go and pray to God." God is order-supplier. And when they declare war, they do not consult God. When there is reverse condition they go to it. This is going on, that God means order-supplier. "Whatever I desire, if You are God then You supply me. Otherwise I reject You."
Churchill also, when the war condition was very, very severe—they were going to be finished—then he asked everyone to go to church and pray. That "V"? "V"? Victory: "For victory, go and pray."
Morning Walk -- November 11, 1975, Bombay: Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: I think President Ford said, "Every American should pray to God."
Prabhupāda: Why?
Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: When that Apollo thing, it was burst, he said. He said we should all pray to God.
Prabhupāda: Why God? Why not scientist ? (laughter) Pray to scientist. Why the order was for God, not for the scientist? Churchill also, when the war condition was very, very severe—they were going to be finished—then he asked everyone to go to church and pray. That "V"? "V"? Victory: "For victory, go and pray."
Harikeśa: Well, they were thinking God was on their side.
Prabhupāda: Yes, but they are thinking of God but in a different way, that "God is my order supplier. God is not to be worshiped, but He has to supply as I order." That's all. (break)
This American government even, they never put any hindrance in my movement. They have, rather, appreciated. And many American old gentlemen came to congratulate me.
Morning Walk -- November 13, 1975, Bombay: Dr. Patel: You see? I may little digressing from this point. Before the India became freed we had an extremely high opinion about American race, American people.
Prabhupāda: Still I have got.
Dr. Patel: Because... No, not people like us.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is correct. Still I have got.
Dr. Patel: I have got also. Because then it was American president who supported the freedom movement of India. But unfortunately Dulles spoiled the speech.
Prabhupāda: No, I am not speaking from that point of view. I see that the Americans, they have helped me in Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Dr. Patel: You, but the whole India, they helped. It is only you.
Prabhupāda: Therefore I feel obliged to them. Nobody helped me. These boys helped me.
Dr. Patel: It was your President Roosevelt, by whose action, I mean, Mr. Churchill began to lose his grip on India.
Prabhupāda: And this American government even, they never put any hindrance in my movement. They have, rather, appreciated. And many American old gentlemen came to congratulate me.
"I am English dog," (laughter) and he is thinking, "I am..." And the man is also thinking like that. What is the difference?
Morning Walk -- November 24, 1975, Bombay: Indian man: (Hindi) (dogs barking) [break]
Dr. Patel: ...dog and the other. That is the bulldog and the Russian...
Prabhupāda: Who is defeated? He is Russian dog?
Brahmānanda: German.
Dr. Patel: They have crossed the dog with the, what you call, the bull.
Brahmānanda: German shepherd.
Dr. Patel: So Germany is defeated, no?
Prabhupāda: The bulldogs are English?
Dr. Patel: They are English. And Mr. Churchill is the representative of all the bulldogs. [break]
Prabhupāda: ...thinking, "I am English dog," (laughter) and he is thinking, "I am..." And the man is also thinking like that. What is the difference?
Dr. Patel: Both are animals.
Prabhupāda: Yasyātmā buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke SB 10.84.13 .
Dr. Patel: That's right. We have got a dvija, dvija-karma kriya. Dvijā-karma-kriya ? What do you call it?
Prabhupāda: Saṁskāra.
Dr. Patel: All are born as animal.
Prabhupāda: Saṁskārād bhaved dvijaḥ.
Dr. Patel: Saṁskāra, yes. Dvija-saṁskāra. Second birth.
Prabhupāda: That saṁskāra is now stopped; therefore all of them are animals. Yes. [break]
1976 Conversations and Morning Walks
That is the tendency everywhere. The Britishers.... You go to the Parliament and Westminster Abbey. They have kept all the statues of Sir Isaac Newton and this Churchill, this.... Mean, they want to show that "It is only our nation who has produced all these intelligent persons."
Morning Walk -- January 3, 1976, Nellore: Acyutānanda: Yes. Whenever some scientist does something, the whole nation of that scientist takes the credit. That is another idea. They say, "We made the pen," or something. Everyone in India takes the credit.
Prabhupāda: That is animalism. Dehātmā-buddhiḥ. "I belong to some particular body, and he belongs to the same body or same nation. Therefore we become..." Instead of "I," we become "we."
Acyutānanda: Recently there was an atomic scientist whose all major education was in America and Europe, and he won a Nobel Prize award...
Prabhupāda: That is the tendency everywhere. The Britishers.... You go to the Parliament and Westminster Abbey. They have kept all the statues of Sir Isaac Newton and this Churchill, this.... Mean, they want to show that "It is only our nation who has produced all these intelligent persons."
Keśavalāl Trivedi: Yes, yes. From "I-ness" to "we-ness."
Prabhupāda: (break) This is basis of Gītā. Tad viddhi praṇipātena paripraśnena sevayā (BG 4.34). Learn from the real person, tattva-darśinaḥ, who has seen, who has actual experience of the truth. Learn from him. The Gītā never recommends that you imagine and make your theories. Never said. That is the Vedic culture. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). Tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta jijñāsur śreya uttamam (SB 11.3.21). This is the way. Take lesson from Kṛṣṇa or Kṛṣṇa's representative. Then you will get experience. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. What is the use of imagining?
Yes. Yes.
Morning Walks -- January 22-23, 1976, Mayapura: Prabhupāda: This is the fact. Therefore Bhāgavata says, śva-viḍ-varāhoṣṭra-kharaiḥ saṁstutaḥ puruṣaḥ paśuḥ. They are very much proud: "I have got ninety-nine percent votes and I have become President." But what you are? You are another big pig only. Who has voted you? The voters are pigs and asses and camel and dogs. So if these animal vote for somebody, then what he is? Is there... Are... Their votes are calculable at all? Votes by the dogs, pigs, camels, and... śva-viḍ-varāha. Śva-viḍ-varāhoṣṭra-khara, and asses. So what is the value of these votes? And that is going on, democracy.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How can they vote for human beings?
Prabhupāda: There is no human being. A big... I gave that a big animal, lion, is fearful to the small animal. But because he is lion, very strong, does it mean that he's a human being? That is going on. Śva-viḍ-varāhoṣṭra-kharaiḥ saṁstutaḥ puruṣaḥ paśuḥ (SB 2.3.19). If one is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he's nothing but animal. So if other small animals praise him, "Oh, you are..." This Gandhi or Indira Gandhi or, and the Hitler and... What is the value? He's a big animal, that's all.
Harikeśa: You were saying in Vṛndāvana they tweak each other's ear.
Prabhupāda: Huh?
Harikeśa: Churchill was tweaking the ear of Hitler, and Hitler was tweaking... Like in school the two children?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes.
I am talking between 1925-30. So this same friend was coming to me and we were talking. I think at that time Afghanistan was under British influence? No... This Afghanistan, when they were Hindus, this Kandahar, the King of Kandahar, his daughter was married to the Pāṇḍavas. Gāndhārī.
Evening Darsana -- August 11, 1976, Tehran: Prabhupāda: In my young age I had one Afghani friend, he belonged to the royal family. What is the king? Some of their brothers were banished in India. Who was the king? So one..., the family were staying in Allahabad. His name was Sen, Sen Aband(?) like that. So he was my friend. He was coming to me and we were talking. Amar Lakhana(?), his brother, he belonged to the royal family.
Guest: That's right, that must be before 1936 though.
Prabhupāda: Yes, I am talking between 1925-30. So this same friend was coming to me and we were talking. I think at that time Afghanistan was under British influence? No.
Guest: No, we had only one war. That was about sixty, seventy years ago, and they entered and they captured Kabul, but the whole brigade was stopped. This was the time Churchill was the only one who escaped troops, and that was the end of it. They never... It was too risky for them.
Prabhupāda: This Afghanistan, when they were Hindus, this Kandahar, the King of Kandahar, his daughter was married to the Pāṇḍavas. Gāndhārī. Gāndhārī(?)...
Guest: That's right.
Prabhupāda: Gāndhārī was the daughter of Kandahar king. Kandahar is still there?
Guest: Yes, well, there are quite a number of Hindus in Kandahar.
When India was native state, they were cheaper. In India, this inflation was caused by Mr. Churchill. During the war he wanted men to join the fighting, so people were not coming. So artificially...
No, artificially increased the price. So they were obliged to join.
Prabhupāda: Yes. In the hotel also they were charging six rupees. Means third-class hotel, not first class for cooking dāl, vegetables. Rice was, first-class rice, six rupees per month. Dāl, twelve annas for kg, flour, five annas for two and a half kgs. And from 1942, all of a sudden the price increased, artificially. Milk, two annas per kg. Now three rupees, four rupees. Ghee, first-class ghee, one rupee per kg. First-class ghee. (break) ...paying for the clerks thirty rupees per month. And head clerk, sixty rupees. Officers, hundred to two hundred rupees. High-court judges, four thousand rupees. High-court judges were highly paid.
Ātreya Ṛṣi: Iran at that time was even cheaper, much cheaper. Because you had the British in India, you were...
Prabhupāda: Yes, when India was native state, they were cheaper. In India, this inflation was caused by Mr. Churchill. During the war he wanted men to join the fighting, so people were not coming. So artificially...
Ātreya Ṛṣi: Printed money?
Prabhupāda: No, artificially increased the price. So they were obliged to join.
Hari-śauri: He'd increase the price and then advertise free food in the army.
Prabhupāda: Yes. (passerby makes comment)
Hari-śauri: What does he say?
Ātreya Ṛṣi: He first said "Please pray for me." But then he's joking. He's saying also that he should take good care of us, we are guests here.
They do not give attention even to this. How he becomes... Second before he was Mr. Churchill or Mr. such and such, very important man. All men showing respect. And now he is useless. If somebody kicks on his face nobody will say. Out of sentiment they protest, but the man will not protest.
Room Conversation -- August 24, 1976, Hyderabad: Prabhupāda: Yes. The Western world is very busy manufacturing this machine. And they are thinking this is advancement of civilization.
Hari-śauri: Technology.
Prabhupāda: That is not advancement.
Hari-śauri: They can't see any use for philosophy and fine arts any more.
Prabhupāda: Because they do not know what is soul. They do not know what is missing. Why the body is useless. They do not cultivate... The most important thing they do not cultivate. This man was so important one second before. Now the whole body is useless. It has to be thrown away. They do not give attention even to this. How he becomes... Second before he was Mr. Churchill or Mr. such and such, very important man. All men showing respect. And now he is useless. If somebody kicks on his face nobody will say. Out of sentiment they protest, but the man will not protest.
Hari-śauri: They stick him in the ground. Put him in a box.
Prabhupāda: But why this happened, this why question does not come. They are so dull. For that thing missing. And these rascal scientists will theorize, the blood becomes white, this becomes that, that becomes that. And do it. If the blood has become white then make it red. Mix some color or chemical and bring him to life. "No, the life-giving substance is lost." Oh, life-giving substance is not lost. So many germs are coming. Why do you say the life-giving substance is lost? It is there. They do not consider all these things. If matter is life-giving substance, matter is there. Decomposed matter is also matter. Just like stool, a decomposed remnants of foodstuff. That is also matter. Stool is also matter. The same (indistinct) is there. The earth is there, the water is there, the heat is there. What is the loss there? And actually you see from this matter, from the stool so many worms are coming out. How do you say that the life-giving matter is missing? That you cannot explain.
1977 Conversations and Morning Walks
So they went to the church. They were going church. Even Churchill also recommended "Go to the church. Pray." Duḥkha se saba hari bhaje sukha se bhaje kaya. So, but nobody returned. So all of them became atheist: "Oh, it is useless to go to church. I prayed so much for my husband coming back, but he did not come. Useless." So this is the position. "I ordered God that 'My husband has gone to the war. Let him come back unharmed.'.
Room Conversation -- January 8, 1977, Bombay: Guest (1): That is why Indians are not joining then. Because they are not joining because of that; they cannot understand what is the reality. Because we try to comment upon the God's actions, "Somebody's poor, somebody's rich, somebody's this."
Prabhupāda: But actually you don't believe in God. That is the disease, godlessness. If we believe in God...
Guest (2): If we fully believe... But there are a large portion of...
Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. They don't believe in Him. They think that "God is my servant, or order-supplier"—"God, why you have not done this. If you don't do this, I don't want You." This is our position.
Guest (2): (Hindi)
Prabhupāda: Yes. That means "God is my servant order-supplier." Actually... This is European mentality. One, my Godbrother, German Godbrother, that Sadananda, he told me, in the last war, when the war was going on, generally women were left. All men were in the battlefield, somebody's husband, somebody's father, somebody's son. So they went to the church. They were going church. Even Churchill also recommended "Go to the church. Pray." Duḥkha se saba hari bhaje sukha se bhaje kaya. So, but nobody returned. So all of them became atheist: "Oh, it is useless to go to church. I prayed so much for my husband coming back, but he did not come. Useless." So this is the position. "I ordered God that 'My husband has gone to the war. Let him come back unharmed.' And God did not bring him back. He did not carry my order. I don't want this God." This is going on. When the war was declared, there was no consultation with God. (laughter) Rascal. That time there was no consultation.
It will never be fulfilled, but still, they will make plan. The Napoleon made a plan. Hitler made a plan. Churchill made a plan. Gandhi made a plan. Mussolini made a plan. But the plan and planmaker—all washed away. Things are going on as it is. Therefore Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya: "Don't make plan. Take to My plan. You'll be happy. I'll give you."
Room Conversation -- January 8, 1977, Bombay: Prabhupāda: Nobody is interested. That is the difficulty in this age. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ durāśayā ye bahir-artha-māninaḥ (SB 7.5.31). They do not know how one can become happy. They are simply hoping against hope. Durāśayā. Aśayā means hope, and dura means which will never be fulfilled. Durāśayā ye bahir-artha-māninaḥ.
Pradyumna: You wrote that essay one time, "Hope Against Hope."
Prabhupāda: Yes. Hope against hope is which is never fulfilled.
Mr. Asnani: Living in the fool's paradise.
Prabhupāda: Yes. "This plan has failed. Now let me this, make this plan. And then again fail? All right, let me this." This is hope against hope. He's thinking that "This plan has failed. Let me do this plan." Again failed? "Again another, again another."
Mr. Asnani: Foundation, as you said, is on the household.
Hari-śauri: Moghāṣā.
Prabhupāda: Moghāśā mogha-karmāṇo mogha-jñānā vicetasaḥ... (BG 9.12).
Hari-śauri: Baffled hope.
Prabhupāda: It will never be fulfilled, but still, they will make plan. The Napoleon made a plan. Hitler made a plan. Churchill made a plan. Gandhi made a plan. Mussolini made a plan. But the plan and planmaker—all washed away. Things are going on as it is. Therefore Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya: (BG 18.66) "Don't make plan. Take to My plan. You'll be happy. I'll give you." This planmaking... Our government has got planning commission. The planning commission has brought people in such a condition that they are dying of starvation. And they are taking salary, big, big, fat salary. This is going on.
Mr. Asnani: And taking share from the black market also.
Prabhupāda: How you can expect good wishes from such persons? Very precarious condition. Your son, you take care. Now, as soon as you make a committee to take care of your son, then everything is finished. Is it not? The committee members will finish the son and the son's maintenance and everything. But that is going on. Formerly there was one monarch. He was acting according to the Vedic instruction. So he was responsible. And if there are many votes, by vote a government, a combination of plunderers, what they will take care of the people? It is impossible. Otherwise why there was need of dragging down Nixon? He was elected, wrong elected. Wrong must be. The people are wrong. They do not know who is the right man. Any rascal makes some intrigue, and he gets vote. And then they detect, "Oh, he's the wrong man." Again another is taken. Punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). And what is the guarantee that another man is right? Because the process is wrong.
Who has done something wrong to you, you like to do some wrong, harm... At that time not Churchill. Attlee, Attlee was Prime Minister.
Evening Darsana -- February 15, 1977, Mayapura: Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What could England gain from the separation?
Prabhupāda: Gain means they are now finished. They have gained this. They have no prestige, no money.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What was their gain from dividing India and Pakistan?
Prabhupāda: Oh, that, that is enviousness.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Just spiteful enviousness.
Prabhupāda: Enviousness. Just like, you like..., who has done something wrong to you, you like to do some wrong, harm.
Hari-śauri: That was Churchill? Churchill's policy?
Prabhupāda: At that time not Churchill. Attlee, Attlee was Prime Minister.
Brahmānanda: In Africa, Nehru, he was instructing the African leaders also how to get...
Prabhupāda: Freedom.
Brahmānanda: Freedom. So they all allowed the Indian example. So the British, they were very resentful against the Indians.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Now British making "Drive away. Drive away the Indians."
Brahmānanda: They became the leaders of the independence.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Even now they are still resentful.
Otherwise, struggle for existence, survival of the fittest... Nature is fittest. You'll die; nature will be... You are not fit to fight with the nature. That is asura temperament. And that will never be successful. So many asuras came. Formerly there was Hiraṇyakaśipu, Rāvaṇa, Kaṁsa and others. In the recent years there was Hitler, there was Churchill, there was Lenin, and Gandhi and so on, so on.
Evening Darsana -- February 24, 1977, Mayapura: Prabhupāda: Let us try to give a substantial platform of civilization. Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Hari-śauri: Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break)
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. Yajñād bhavati parjanyaḥ (BG 3.14). (sound of thunder and rain) This time rainfall is very beneficial for crops. This is the way of living. You perform yajña, there will be rain. And as soon as the ground is moist, you can produce anything, whatever you want. Sarva-kāma-dughā mahī. From the field, you can get all your necessities of life. The first necessity is the food grain. So food grain you can eat, and the rejected grass portion, you give to the cows. So both the animal and the man get sufficient food. And the cows will give you nice milk, and from milk you can get butter, ghee, yogurt, so many nice sweetmeat. And there is ghee, and here is food grain, then you make kacuri, puri, samosā. Then sufficient foodstuff, nice, palatable, nutritious. First necessity is āhāra. You get sufficient āhāra. Then make little cottage for shelter. Just like there is rainfall. Now you require little... (thunder sounds) Āhāra, nidrā, bhaya, and sex. So marry. Then the whole problem is solved. And then, rest time you save and advance in Kṛṣṇa conscious... This is civilization. Why you create unnecessary necessities of life and become complicated and forget Kṛṣṇa? What is this civilization? Rascal civilization. Instead of giving protection to the cows, you are cutting the throat. Is that civilization? So this is a civilization of duṣkṛtina, means mischief monger. Therefore they must suffer, and suffering. And asuras are being created. And Kṛṣṇa's business is to kill the asuras. Paritrāṇāya sādhūnāṁ vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām (BG 4.8). This is going on. This is material nature. Asuras are being created, and the whole plan is to kill them. So struggle for existence. The asuras, they want to live. Mahiṣāsura he's struggling with the weapons of Māyā, Durgā. He'll be failure, but still-ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā kartāham (BG 3.27)—by false egotism he's thinking, "I shall conquer over the material..." That is scientist, so-called scientist. Asuras are... They are planning that "We shall do without nature's control." That is mūḍha. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā dura... (BG 7.14). They cannot conquer it. That is not possible. But you are struggling. You do not want the control of nature. And nature is so strong... Now it is raining. Within one hour they can vanquish the whole world. Doesn't take time. If there is one cyclone and heavy rain, then you are put into danger. So long it is mild, it is all right. And as soon as becomes ferocious, then finish you. What you'll control the nature? When there is no rain, you cannot bring in rain; and when there is heavy rain, you cannot stop it. Then where is your control? You rascal, you think like that, "We shall control over nature." This is your rascaldom. You cannot control over. So everything has its use, and how to use it properly, that is all described in the Bhagavad-gītā. And if you take instruction of Kṛṣṇa and ultimately surrender to Him, that is success of life. Otherwise, struggle for existence, survival of the fittest... Nature is fittest. You'll die; nature will be... You are not fit to fight with the nature. That is asura temperament. And that will never be successful. So many asuras came. Formerly there was Hiraṇyakaśipu, Rāvaṇa, Kaṁsa and others. In the recent years there was Hitler, there was Churchill, there was Lenin, and Gandhi and so on, so on.
In my old Back to Godhead I discussed Gandhi, Churchill, Jhinna, but with reference to the philosophy. I criticized them on the basis of our philosophy.
Room Conversation With Artists and About BTG -- February 25, 1977, Mayapura: Rāmeśvara: Now, there has been a tendency that I have observed among the writers to try to use what they call outside information sources, like quoting scientists...
Prabhupāda: That, one cannot do it unless he is very expert in transcendental knowledge. This is not possible for kaniṣṭha-adhikārī.
Rāmeśvara: It's difficult to do.
Prabhupāda: Yes. He must be very expert. Therefore I want...
Rāmeśvara: Satsvarūpa.
Prabhupāda: Guidance.
Rāmeśvara: But the principle is all right if it is done properly.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Rāmeśvara: Because I have found that when these so-called authorities...
Prabhupāda: In my old Back to Godhead I discussed Gandhi, Churchill, Jhinna, but with reference to the philosophy. I criticized them on the basis of our philosophy.
Rāmeśvara: For example, Rūpānuga just wrote one article which we published, and in this article he was describing some work of some scientists in Europe. They were trying to prove by their experiments that life comes from life. So he was quoting them. He was describing their work, but the whole purpose was to get people to accept the Vedas, to show that even the scientist's conclusion is the same as the Vedas. Therefore the Vedas are authorized.
Prabhupāda: Hm. That is nice.
Rāmeśvara: So that idea, if it's done expertly, can be used...
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Rāmeśvara: ...to convince people.
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.
No, no, we are not against, neither for. But these things will go on. This is going on since the creation, but that will not help. There have been, in other countries there has been Napoleon, there has been Hitler, there has been Mussolini, there has been Churchill.
Interview with Mr. Koshi (Asst. Editor of The Current Weekly) -- April 5, 1977, Bombay: Prabhupāda: India is not poverty-stricken. India can give him something which will glorify your life. It is meant... I do not say India is poverty-stricken. I say India is the richest. Believe it, take it. So we have no such concern as "India" or "America," no. We are concerned with the living entities. We have no such stagnant idea. Stagnation. We have no such thing. Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Bhārata-bhūmite haila manuṣya-janma. That bhārata-bhūmite manuṣya. Manuṣya means man. He is different from others. Therefore he should know what is his position. Make his life successful and distribute the knowledge because they are ignorant. This should be India's position, teacher to the whole world. Not beggar.
Mr. Koshi: This support that you want... People have not taken sufficient interest in this distribution.
Prabhupāda: Because they have been taught like that.
Mr. Koshi: Taught to receive, not to give.
Prabhupāda: Yes. They have been taught to become group of dogs and crows. That's all. These political party.
Mr. Koshi: You are against politicians.
Prabhupāda: No, no, we are not against, neither for. But these things will go on. This is going on since the creation, but that will not help. There have been, in other countries there has been Napoleon, there has been Hitler, there has been Mussolini, there has been Churchill. In India also we had many leaders like Gandhi and others. So what contribution they made? People are suffering.
Study the whole history of the world. What the big, big leaders have done? They are not new leaders. Before them, all over the world there were big, big leaders. Napoleon promised so many things. At last, he had to drink horse's urine and die. When he was captured by the Englishmen he wanted water and he was given horse urine. Envisioned, "I shall make my promise, the most important stage." The Britishers, so many, Gladstone, Churchill, Lloyd George(?), British Empire. Have they done any benefit? Indira made plan, Nehru family will be English terrorist. Now what is her position? So they studying history. Still, they are promising. Mūḍha.
Room Conversation -- April 5, 1977, Bombay: Prabhupāda: Jaya Prakash Narayan. Even in old days they were dealing with this politics. What they will do good to the people? But they do not know. This is disease. They do not study the whole history of the world. What Gandhi has done? What Hitler has done? What Napoleon has done? And what they will do? But they are applauded. "He is promising within one year poverty will be driven away." All false propaganda. Ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā kartāham iti manyate (BG 3.27). Vimūḍhātmā. Rascals. They are promising so many things. They will never be able to do anything. And they are applauded.
Guest (1): I think they should be invited here to see what is being done.
Prabhupāda: No, they know it. Study the whole history of the world. What the big, big leaders have done? They are not new leaders. Before them, all over the world there were big, big leaders. Napoleon promised so many things. At last, he had to drink horse's urine and die. When he was captured by the Englishmen he wanted water and he was given horse urine. Envisioned, "I shall make my promise, the most important stage." The Britishers, so many, Gladstone, Churchill, Lloyd George(?), British Empire. Have they done any benefit? Indira made plan, Nehru family will be English terrorist. Now what is her position? So they studying history. Still, they are promising. Mūḍha.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But the great saintly persons, their works have done good for generations in thousands of years.
Jaya Prakash Narayan. Morarji Desai, Indira Gandhi, and... What they'll do? Churchill and this and Napoleon, Hitler. Simply misguiding, whole history. Simply mis... They are rascals. They do not know what is what, and they lead. Gandhi... All rascals. Vivekananda and Sai Baba, this, that, so many... They should be stopped.
Room Conversation -- April 13, 1977, Bombay: Prabhupāda: Jaya Prakash Narayan. Morarji Desai, Indira Gandhi, and... What they'll do? Churchill and this and Napoleon, Hitler. Simply misguiding, whole history. Simply mis... They are rascals. They do not know what is what, and they lead. Gandhi... All rascals. Vivekananda and Sai Baba, this, that, so many... They should be stopped. That is real philanthropic activities. Where is...? Now we are going to show this planetarium. These rascal scientists: "All desert. All rocks and desert." Simply this planet, for his father's property. This is now happening. "The moon planet is a desert." And from the desert such brilliant light is coming that is illuminating at night the whole universe. And we have to believe it because they are spoken by scientists. You see? All rascals, fools, rogues, thieves, they are leading. And our determination is to stop these rascals. That is our... It is not that "Let the rascals go on with their... Let us make our salvation." Prahlāda Mahārāja said, "No, no, no, I don't want. I don't want. If there is salvation, I must take them also." This is Vaiṣṇava. "I don't want such salvation for my personal..." This is Vaiṣṇava, para-duḥkha-duḥkhī. Para-duḥkha-duḥkhī kṛpāmbudhir yas tam ahaṁ prapadye (CC Madhya 6.254). Naturally a Vaiṣṇava will be unhappy. Śoce tato vimukha-cetasa indriyārtha-māyā-sukhāya bharam udvahato vimūḍhān (SB 7.9.43). You know this verse? So we must know that these so-called leaders... Just see. He could not do it nicely.
By keeping one lion and fighting him and it is enjoyed. What is this? What they have gained? In this way, the privileged... Is it not subject perception? What Napoleon has done? Or Hitler has done? Or Churchill has done?
Room Conversation with Ratan Singh Rajda M.P. 'Nationalism and Cheating' -- April 15, 1977, Bombay: Prabhupāda: So? Now, this nationalism idea, so you have trace out the whole history. By introducing this nationalism, what improvement gave? Nationalism, the leader, it began in Europe, the Romans. They wanted to spread. Where are the Romans now? Carthagian, old history, Egyptian, Grecian, then, later on, Moguls or then British. So where are these groups? "Combined together, exploit others." That was, that means, a gang of rogues. Rogues and thieves, they... And by doing that, what they have actually done? The Romans, now their broken buildings are there. And people go to see the fun, how they used to enjoy. What is that called?
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Coliseum. That's the Greek Coliseum, they...
Prabhupāda: By keeping one lion and fighting him and it is enjoyed. What is this? What they have gained? In this way, the privileged... Is it not subject perception? What Napoleon has done? Or Hitler has done? Or Churchill has done?
So Hitler's grudge against the Englishmen, that is fruitful. Actually he owned the war... Because that was his determination. "I shall finish this British nation. Everywhere they have got flag, all over the world, I shall finish." That he did. And Britishers saved because the Americans joined. Otherwise... Churchill, he removed all valuables from London to Canada, all papers, all gold stock, everything. There is a book about this. Just like when there is danger you rush to save some valuables.
Morning Talk -- April 18, 1977, Bombay: Prabhupāda: Britain is... They are shopkeepers. Hitler gave them this title, "Shopkeepers' Nation." That was his determination: "The shopkeepers' nation, I shall turn them again to be shopkeepers, not the empire holder." That he did. Although he was finished-Germany was finished on account of this—but they executed their determination, British empire finished. That they did. After the second war, British...
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Finished.
Prabhupāda: Now they are poverty-stricken.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yes.
Prabhupāda: So Hitler's grudge against the Englishmen, that is fruitful. Actually he owned the war.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He won. He won the war.
Prabhupāda: Because that was his determination. "I shall finish this British nation. Everywhere they have got flag, all over the world, I shall finish." That he did. And Britishers saved because the Americans joined. Otherwise... Churchill, he removed all valuables from London to Canada, all papers, all gold stock, everything. There is a book about this. Just like when there is danger you rush to save some valuables. Is it not?
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, that's what you take first.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So British Empire, so many things in London, he all removed to Canada.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Then, after the war?
Prabhupāda: Then, after war they might have brought again.
He's disturbing all others—"Gow, gow! Gow, gow, gow!"—but he's thinking that "I am in charge." Is it not dog dancing, these politicians, politics? Who cares for you? Gandhi or there, he has gone. Does it mean the world activities stop? Churchill was there. He has gone. Hitler was there. They are coming and going like so many insects. Napoleon was there. Who cares for them?
Morning Conversation -- April 30, 1977, Bombay: Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Because they are identifying themselves with their bodies.
Prabhupāda: That means ignorance, rascals. They are busy with something which is not his business. Then next question will be: then what is his business? If they actually read Bhagavad-gītā, his business is that to find out: "If I am going to change my body, what I am going to be?" Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). The body, after being finished, this body, I am not dead. I am going to change another body. So is it not my duty? Just like if I go somewhere, you see how that place, how it will be suitable for me, how I shall live there. Is it not duty? Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). I am not going to die. That, if I leave this compartment, I'm not going to die. I'll accept another compartment. But shall I not see what kind of compartment will be, whether it is better than this or inferior than this? Is it not my duty? That is my real problem. Or the actual problem is that if I am eternal, why I shall change body now and then? This is my problem. And Kṛṣṇa says that "If anyone does not take up My instruction in the Bhagavad-gītā, then he does not get Me, and the result is that he'll again turn to this change of body, mṛtyu-saṁsāra-vartma..." So they are not careful about these things, so what do they understand about Bhagavad-gītā? The real problem they do not touch. And the body will change, and he'll live in India or in America, say, for fifty years. He's busy. That is cats, just like these cats and dogs at night. Nobody has given him charge, but he is thinking "I am in charge of the road. Why this put-put motorcar, you have come here? Go on. Go on. Gow! Gow! Gow! Gow!" But who has given him charge? But he's starving, and people are throwing stone upon him, but he's thinking "I am in charge of this business. Why at night this car has come?" Dog mentality. Is it not exactly like the dog? He's disturbing all others—"Gow, gow! Gow, gow, gow!"—but he's thinking that "I am in charge." Is it not dog dancing, these politicians, politics? Who cares for you? Gandhi or there, he has gone. Does it mean the world activities stop? Churchill was there. He has gone. Hitler was there. They are coming and going like so many insects. Napoleon was there. Who cares for them? We are licking up their so-called activities: "Oh, Napoleon was so great. Gandhi was so great." And what he has done? The dog dancing.
When they cannot manage, they declare war, because they are not human beings; they are animals, Churchill and Hitler and this... "Start some war and finish this population." Or it may be nature's law. "When there is unnecessary population let there be war, famine, pestilence." That is one theory, Malthus' theory.
Conversations -- June 28, 1977, Vrndavana: Prabhupāda: (tape very faint throughout) ...divorce, child-killing or making the children hippies, that all. Or find out some war to destroy them. When it is unmanageable, they declare war: "Engage these rascals." The politicians do that. When they cannot manage, they declare war, because they are not human beings; they are animals, Churchill and Hitler and this... "Start some war and finish this population." Or it may be nature's law. "When there is unnecessary population let there be war, famine, pestilence." That is one theory, Malthus' theory.
Śatadhanya: Whose?
Prabhupāda: Malthus.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Malthus.
Prabhupāda: So I don't speak I am authorized. I have studied both ways.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's what makes your books so unique, that others might have had some scholarly knowledge, but you have to so much experience and realization packed into those books that it's so appealing, the scholars delight in reading the purports.
Prabhupāda: Scholars, they theorize. I say practical. Scholars want to say, want to show how much their imaginative power is strong. That's all. And they all speak nonsense-Ramakrishna. And my point of view is how to give people practical hints so that they may be raised from this rotten condition.
Śatadhanya: You are compassionate.
Correspondence
1976 Correspondence
As far as your point that those who say movies about Hitler identified with him and followed him, Hitler was still finished despite so much propaganda. Napoleon, Mussolini, Churchill—they all made so much propaganda—but the French, Italian, British, and German empires are all lost now. Our real propaganda is to chant the Hare Krishna Maha-mantra, and let the mass of people chant and dance with us.
Letter to Jnanagamya -- Mayapur 27 January, 1976: Regarding making a movie to help people become Krishna Conscious. If we show such devotional activities as worshiping the Deity, the karmis will think it is some sentiment, people worshiping a statue. Unless they hear from devotees and then practically perform devotional service themselves, what benefit will there be? As far as your point that those who say movies about Hitler identified with him and followed him, Hitler was still finished despite so much propaganda. Napoleon, Mussolini, Churchill—they all made so much propaganda—but the French, Italian, British, and German empires are all lost now. Our real propaganda is to chant the Hare Krishna Maha-mantra, and let the mass of people chant and dance with us. If this movie induces people to chant and dance it is O.K. If it aids our cause then it is welcome. The best thing is for you to give this subject matter to your GBC for discussion at this year's GBC meeting in March.
The photos you have sent are very nice. Thank you. I hope this meets you well.
Napoleon and Hitler made big, big plans, where are they now? All failures. Churchill wanted to keep India under control. Gandhi wanted to drive away the Englishmen. Now, the Englishmen are driven away and things are going on by the laws of nature. Churchill and others have remained in comatose condition before dying due to excessive attachment to their plans. All failures.
Letter to Satsvarupa -- Krishna Balaram Mandir October 22, 1976: It will be a great achievement if you can write this book on the theme, "anything undertaken without Krsna fails." Here in India we have just seen how they have made a big, big plan for the city of Chandigargh. So much land is lying vacant, and in the meantime people are going hungry. Because they are not Krsna conscious, they do not know how to utilize anything properly. They are simply thinking of satisfying their own senses. So many big, big plans, but the result is that people are unhappy. Napoleon and Hitler made big, big plans, where are they now? All failures. Churchill wanted to keep India under control. Gandhi wanted to drive away the Englishmen. Now, the Englishmen are driven away and things are going on by the laws of nature. Churchill and others have remained in comatose condition before dying due to excessive attachment to their plans. All failures.
