Prabhupāda: Seaweeds, yes. So they... All over the body there was some seaweeds. Not exactly... He was very unclean and odd-looking, and beard and ugly. So he thought that "He's a great yogi. If I refuse, 'No, I'm not going to hand over my daughter to you,' then he may be angry and create some catastrophe." So he said, just to avoid him, that "I have got eight daughters, and it is the desire of my daughters that they should be given over to one husband." No, that "they should be married all at once. So unless I find other husbands for my daughters you have to wait." So immediately, "Yes, I shall myself become eight then." And he expanded himself, eight expansions. So at that time what could he say? He said, "You know, my dear sir, that they are princesses after all. They may not like such ugly husband." Oh, he at once became very youthful and beautiful. Then he married. So in the history you can find that a perfect yogi can expand himself. So similarly, Kardama Muni also expanded into nine. He married Devahūti on condition that unless his wife has got sufficient children, he'll not leave her, and he must leave her. So he expanded himself nine and begotten nine daughters. So we can find from history, the Purāṇas... Purāṇas all means history, Purāṇas. Old history. Purāṇa means old. So even a perfect yogi can expand, what to speak of Kṛṣṇa. He is called Yogeśvara, the supreme yogi. In the Bhagavad-gītā you'll find this word about Kṛṣṇa, yatra yogeśvaraḥ hariḥ. Yogeśvara. He's perfect in all practices of mystic power. So these five expansions, śrī-kṛṣṇa-caitanya prabhu nityānanda-śrī-advaita gadādhara śrīvāsādi-gaura... Kṛṣṇa appeared in five expansions. Sri Kṛṣṇa Caitanya, Lord Caitanya, is Kṛṣṇa Himself. And Prabhu Nityānanda, His immediate expansion. Just like Balarāma. Kṛṣṇa and Balarāma. And Advaita is incarnation. And Gadādhara is internal potency. And Śrīvāsa, marginal potency. And there is another potency, external potency. The external potency is not there. External potency means by which this material world is manifested.
What to speak of... (Conversations 1968 - 1973)
Conversations and Morning Walks
1968 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: There are descriptions. There are descriptions of these things. There is description of another nature which is called spiritual nature. This is material nature. The sky, as far as you can see, this is one universe. Similarly, there are millions of universes. And all these together, that is material sky. And beyond that, there is spiritual sky, which is far, far greater than this. And there are spiritual planets. So this information we have got from Bhagavad-gītā, what to speak of other Vedic literatures. Bhagavad-gītā, it is daily read by practically all over the world, but they do not understand it. Simply they become student of Bhagavad-gītā, or simply just to think falsely that "I am God." That's all. But they don't take any particular information. There is a verse in the Eighth Chapter, paras tasmāt tu bhāvo 'nyo 'vyakto 'vyaktāt sanātanaḥ (BG 8.20). There is another nature beyond this material nature which is eternal. This nature is coming into existence, again dissolution. But that nature is eternal. These things are there. Similarly, there, planets are also eternal. There, living entities, they are also eternal. That is called sanātana. Sanātana means eternal, without any end, without any beginning. But this nature, as we have, this body has got a beginning and it has end, similarly anything, this cosmic nature has a beginning and it has an end. So our this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is how to transfer our self to that nature, eternal nature.
1969 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: He asked me, "Swamiji, how is that God has become a cowherd boy?" Yes. Because ordinary people, they are thinking God must be so great, so great, great, that they cannot conceive. And that great personality, how He becomes a cowherd boy playing with cowherd boys? Yes. Brahmā also became astonished, and therefore he came to check "Whether He is my Lord or not?" (laughter) Yes. Bewildered. Muhyanti yatra sūrayaḥ. The Bhāgavata says therefore, even the great personalities like Brahmā, they are also bewildered to understand the personality. He, Brahmā also heard that at Vṛndāvana Kṛṣṇa has appeared and He is acting as a cowherd boy. He was also astonished. "Oh, my Lord? He has become a cowherd boy?" So he came to check. He, I mean to say, took away all the cowherd boys and cows and everything. And after a few seconds he came, he said Kṛṣṇa is playing in the same way. And although the, I mean, stolen cowherd boys and cows they, by the, I mean to say, energy of māyā, by influence of Brahmā, they were kept in a secret cave. They were sleeping. But Kṛṣṇa is playing. That means He has manifested again with the cowherd boys and cows. Then he was convinced, "Yes, He is my Lord." Then Brahma-stava is there. Ānanda cinmaya rasa pratibhāvitābhis tābhirya eva nija-rūpatayā kalābhiḥ (Bs. 5.37). So Kṛṣṇa can expand in many, many thousand times. What Brahmā will do by stealing His... No, that is not possible. So Brahmā was also convinced. These things you'll find in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Brahma-vimohana. Even Brahmā is bewildered, what to speak of ordinary men like us. So Kṛṣṇa-līlā, to understand... There is no need of understanding. Simply you love Kṛṣṇa, then the whole business finished. Just like if you touch fire, if you understand it or not understand it, the warmness is there. Similarly, either you understand Kṛṣṇa or do not understand Kṛṣṇa, it doesn't matter. Simply if you love Kṛṣṇa, then your life is perfect. That's all.
Devotees: Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: You can take this. Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: So therefore attraction for any flower is not the solution of the question. That is also stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, ye yathā māṁ prapadyante tāṁs tathaiva bhajāmy aham (BG 4.11). Kṛṣṇa is Supreme Absolute. Anyone wants Him in any way, He also presents Himself in that way. Just like the same example. If you want a yellow flower, never mind whether there is any scent or any flavor or not, so that flower is there. It is for you. That's all. But if anyone wants rose flower, Kṛṣṇa gives him rose flower. But when you make a comparative study which one is better, then rose will be considered better. (chuckling) So ye yathā māṁ prapadyante. That means the Absolute is realized... Of course, varieties there are, but the original division of the Absolute is three: Brahman, Paramātmā, and Bhagavān. Now, Brahman, Paramātmā, and Bhagavān is the same Absolute. Different names. The jñānis, or the empiric philosophers, they reach or they aim at Brahman, impersonal Brahman. The yogis, they, I mean to say, focus on the Supersoul, Paramātmā. And the devotees, they aim at Kṛṣṇa, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Now, this Kṛṣṇa and the Supersoul and the impersonal Brahman, they are not different. They are light. They are not darkness. But in the light also, there is difference The example is given: just like sunlight, sun globe and the sun-god. Everywhere you find light. In the sunshine there is light. In sun globe there is light. And what to speak of the predominating deity in the sun-globe? He also must be light; otherwise wherefrom this light comes? So so far light is concerned, everywhere there. But you cannot say because sunshine has come through your window in your room, you cannot say the sun has come. That will be mistake. Sun is many, many miles away. But so far light is concerned, now there is question of degrees of light, intensity of light. So the degrees of spiritual realization in Brahman, degrees of spiritual realization in Paramātmā, and degrees of spiritual realization in the Supreme Personality of Godhead, they are different.
Prabhupāda: He said, brahma-sūtra-padaiś caiva hetumadbhir viniścitaiḥ (BG 13.5). He refers that "This scientific knowledge, the Absolute Truth, is explained very nicely in Brahma-sūtra, Vedānta-sūtra." He refers to the book. Another place Kṛṣṇa says,
- yaḥ śāstra-vidhim utsṛjya
- vartate kāma-kārataḥ
- na sa siddhim avāpnoti
- na sukhaṁ na parāṁ gatim
- (BG 16.23)
"Anyone who does not follow the scriptural injunction, his attempt will be failure. He'll never be happy. And what to speak of being promoted to the spiritual world.?" These things are there. How you can say Kṛṣṇa has not recommended to read books?
Yoko Ono: Then, in that sense, you see, for instance... I see the same pattern in what you have said. For instance, you said that Hare Kṛṣṇa is the most superpowerful word, and if that is true, then why do you bother to utter any other words? I mean, is it necessary? And why do you encourage us, saying that we're songwriters and all,...
Prabhupāda: No...
Yoko Ono: ...to write any song but Hare Kṛṣṇa?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra is cleansing process.
Yoko Ono: Yes.
Prabhupāda: ...same place. By nature's law you'll have to quit.
Guest (1): Quit.
Prabhupāda: Just like... What to speak of ordinary man. President Kennedy. Oh, how much labor he had to undergo to occupy that post, how much money he spent to become president. But he had to quit his family, his wife, his state, his post. So this is going on. Bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19). For sometimes we are engaged in this way; then again we are annihilated. Again begin another life, enter into another mother's womb, construct another body, then come out, then again begin work, again the same thing, digging and piling, digging and piling, again going away. Is that very good business? This is the karmīs. Karmīs means worker, fruitive worker. They want some result for their work. They are called karmīs. So the karmīs are engaged in this way. (Doorbell rings) In Bhagavad-gītā these karmīs have been described as rascals, mūḍha. Mūḍha. Because they do not know why they are digging, why they are piling and why they are leaving again everything. You can sit here, in the corner. I, I... Ask these boys, yes. This is the problem. The whole world is engaged very busy. Any city you go, they're very busy. The motor car is going this way, that way, and everywhere is constructing and so many things are going on. But if you put this question, "Why you are doing this business, digging somewhere and piling somewhere, again leaving the whole thing?"... (Aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. They have no answer.
Guest (1): They might say it's a rotation. They just have to do it.
1970 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: My Guru Mahārāja ordered me that "You go and preach this cult amongst the English speaking public and specially in the western countries." So first of all I thought of London, where is London, but I had no money. So I got the opportunity for going U.S.A. free on the, on a trade ship by the Scindia Steam Navigation. They gave me their first-class cabinet, the proprietor's cabinet. I was well carried. But first of all I went free on a steamship. I had no money, what to speak of aeroplane. So... What was your question?
Guest (1): My question was that how you selected America to be your...
Prabhupāda: Yes. So I got the opportunity to go to America because their ship goes to New York. So I accepted, "All right, we can see, either go to London or New York." New York is better place than London.
Guest (1): There are number of Indians in New York. In New York, Indians are...
Prabhupāda: No. In London there are many Indians.
Guest (1): In London, they say, there are about twelve lakhs of Indians in London.
Prabhupāda: Yes. There are many Indians. In the street you will find it is just like ordinary Indian city. (Hindi)
Guest (3): He's my old friend.
Guest (4): We both are coming from Horir(?), leaving Delhi after... We are interested in this Gītā-jayantī Mahotsava, and we shall be more interested in you also. You are coming...
1971 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Maybe, but we do not know.
Guest (1): Therefore beyond that, you see, I came...
Prabhupāda: Just like Kṛṣṇa. We accept Kṛṣṇa the supreme authority. Kṛṣṇa says, mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja. Who is accepting this? We have accepted. Some others may have accepted but you have not accepted. So therefore even Kṛṣṇa's injunction is not accepted by everyone, what to speak of others? So therefore you cannot find out within this material world anything which can satisfy everyone. That is not possible.
Guest (1): We have not found that.
Prabhupāda: You may think, but we have concluded that there is nothing, such thing, which can satisfy everyone. It is not possible.
Guest (1): Until we hear all, we may do that...
Prabhupāda: That may be an ideal, but we take Kṛṣṇa as the highest authority. Even Kṛṣṇa's words are not accepted. That's a fact. Kṛṣṇa says, "You surrender unto Me." So a few persons might have surrendered to Him. Even Kṛṣṇa was present, only the Pāṇḍavas and the inhabitants of the Vṛndāvana and Dvārakā, some of them understood that Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme. But many did not accept Him. Many insulted Him. Just like Śiśupāla insulted Him. So even Kṛṣṇa could not be accepted.
Guest (1): Accept, I accept everyone. That is no question of accepting or...
Prabhupāda: No, no. You quoted from Bhagavad-gītā; I am replying from Bhagavad-gītā. You quoted from Bhagavad-gītā, so your answer should be given from the Bhagavad-gītā. You told me that Kṛṣṇa or God comes when there is such and such adharma, so what is adharma, what is dharma, who is sādhu—these things should be understood. But generally, this movement is to create sādhus. So you have to give time. You have to cooperate. This incarnation of Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa and nāma, Kṛṣṇa's name, is the same. Abhinnatvaṁ nāma-naminoḥ: "There is no difference between Kṛṣṇa's name and Kṛṣṇa." So you encourage this movement. You will see that there will be no more fighting. Kṛṣṇa has come. Welcome Kṛṣṇa. But if you noncooperate with Kṛṣṇa, then how you'll get happiness? Kṛṣṇa has already come by this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. You receive Him. Yad yad ācarati śreṣṭha (BG 3.21). You are all respectable gentlemen. You accept it. Then others will follow. Tat tad evetaro janaḥ. And if leading personalities of the society, they reject it, then how Kṛṣṇa is welcome? How can you expect? (Hindi) Everyone should welcome this movement, Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. Then actually there will be dharma-saṁsthāpanārthāya, paritrāṇāya sādhūnām. Everything will be done. Just like when Kṛṣṇa was personally present, how many received Him? Only the Pāṇḍavas and the gopīs and the Vṛndāvana-līlā is there. Nobody knew Him as Kṛṣṇa. In the Battlefield of Kurukṣetra, how many knew Him that He was Kṛṣṇa? But everyone benefited. Everyone benefited. Everyone who died in the battlefield of Kurukṣetra, they got salvation. That is stated in Bhīṣma's teachings. So they got the benefit, but not that everyone understood Kṛṣṇa. Avajānanti māṁ mūḍhā mānuṣīṁ tanum... (BG 9.11). Many... Even nowadays there are so many scholars... They want swamis. They do not accept Kṛṣṇa as the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Even nowadays, what to speak of then? Even at the present moment. They are reading Bhagavad-gītā, and they are trying to kill Bhagavān, Kṛṣṇa. That's all. That is their business, killing... Kaṁsa's business. Kaṁsa was trying killing Kṛṣṇa, always thinking, "how to kill Kṛṣṇa?" So so many Bhagavad-gītā commentators, scholars, their only business is how to drive away Kṛṣṇa from Bhagavad-gītā. That is their... They do not give on the personality of Kṛṣṇa as the Supreme Personality of Godhead. I have several times told you. Even scholars like Dr. Rādhā-Krishnan, he says like that, "It is not to Kṛṣṇa, person." Why? Why this demonic attitude? How you can get help from Kṛṣṇa? That is... We are discussing now, daivī-sampāt and āsuri-sampāt. Āsuri-sampāt means to kill Kṛṣṇa. That's all, to wipe out Kṛṣṇa from Bhagavad-gītā and bring something else. Six hundred and sixty-four editions of Bhagavad-gītā. This is going on. Prasāda. (end)
Prabhupāda: Modern sociology is targeting the state or the people as the owner of a certain state, but our Vedic conception is īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvaṁ: (ISO 1) "Everything is owned by Īśa, the Supreme Controller." Tena tyaktena bhuñjīthā: "What is given by Him, allotted to you, you enjoy that." Mā gṛdhaḥ kasya svid dhanam: "But we not encroach upon others' property." This is Īśopaniṣad, Vedas. And the same idea is explained in different Purāṇas. So the Vedas can give you... The other day I was reading in the, that paper, Moscow News, there was a congress, Communist congress, and the president declared that "We are ready to get others' experience to improve." So I think the Vedic concept of socialism or communism will much improve the idea of communism. Just like we are thinking in terms of human beings, the commu..., socialistic state, that "Nobody should starve. Everyone must have his food." And in the Vedic conception of gṛhastha, householder, it is recommended there that a householder shall see that even a lizard living in the room or even a snake living in that house should not starve. They should be also given food. And what to speak of others? The gṛhastha, before taking his lunch, he is recommended to stand on the road and declare that "If anybody is still hungry, please come. Food is ready." Then, if there is no response, then the proprietor of the household life, he takes his lunch. In this way there are so many good concept about this socialistic idea of communism. So I thought that these ideas might have been distributed to some of your thoughtful men. Therefore I was anxious to speak with you.
Prabhupāda: Yes. His behavior, he's a perfect gentleman. That's all. You cannot find any fault in him. That is perfect Kṛṣṇa consciousness. They are prohibited not to eat meat.
Interviewer: Not to eat meat?
Prabhupāda: No. They are prohibited from illicit sex life. They are prohibited to intoxication. They do not smoke even, what to speak of other intoxications. And they are prohibited not to indulge in gambling. So if they can observe these four rules and regulations, they become perfect men. Simply.
Interviewer: Or women I presume.
Prabhupāda: Woman or man. Anyone.
Interviewer: Men or women. There is place for women in the religion too isn't...?
Prabhupāda: Woman and man have got the same right. Just like we are getting married boys and girls. They're following the same principles. The same principles. So these are the four pillars of perfect life. And if we indulge in these things, illicit sex life, meat-eating, and intoxication, and gambling, then they become the four pillars of sinful life. And If we take them away, then they become, the prohibited portion becomes the pillars of perfect life.
Interviewer: Now I would like to ask you one more question and I would like to ask you to end the program by chanting your mantra of Hare Kṛṣṇa. One more question, though. In the six years that you have been in this country, in the United States, have you been encouraged or discouraged? (end)
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. He will be a very perfect gentleman. That's all. You cannot find any fault in him. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness, perfect Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Therefore prohibited not to eat meat.
Interviewer: Not to eat meat?
Prabhupāda: No. Therefore prohibited for illicit sex life. Therefore prohibited to intoxication. They do not smoke even, what to speak of other intoxication. And therefore prohibited not to indulge in gambling. So if they can observe these four rules and regulations, they will become perfect men. Simple.
Interviewer: Or women, I presume.
Prabhupāda: Oh, men or women.
Interviewer: Men or women?
Prabhupāda: Anyone.
Interviewer: There is place for women in the religion too, isn't there?
Prabhupāda: No, man and woman has got, have got the same right. Just like we are getting married boys and girls. They are following the same principles, the same principles. So these are the four pillars of perfect life. If we indulge in these things—illicit sex life, meat-eating, intoxication and gambling—then they become the four pillars of sinful life. And if we take them away, then they become, the prohibitive portion, becomes the pillars of perfect life.
Revatīnandana: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Therefore acintya. Therefore acintya, inconceivable. (pause) Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Don't try to understand Kṛṣṇa. Simply try to love Him. That is perfection. That's all. You cannot understand Kṛṣṇa. Nobody can understand. Kṛṣṇa Himself cannot understand Himself. Yes. (laughter) He's so acintya. And what to speak of us. Therefore our only business: how to love Kṛṣṇa, how to serve Kṛṣṇa. That's all. That is perfection. You cannot understand Kṛṣṇa. Nobody can. Kṛṣṇa Himself cannot understand.
Revatīnandana: The more we understand, the more we can convince others.
Prabhupāda: No. Better you understand this, that you cannot understand. This understanding is better.
Revatīnandana: No, but what I said is that...
Prabhupāda: That "I cannot understand," this understanding.
Haṁsadūta: Then you have to give up. Then just simply love Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: Yes. This is real understanding, that "Kṛṣṇa cannot be understood. Simply let me love as far as possible, as I can, whatever is my, in my capacity." That is perfection.
Revatīnandana: Yes. But still, we deal with this philosophy for...
Prabhupāda: He is now in politics. He has got a political party, Rama-Rajya Party, and nobody cares for him. He is insulted so many place, but still, but he's so learned, if, if anyone, anybody goes and reads scriptures and Vedas, he can give very good reference and very nicely explain, but the conclusion is dull. Conclusion is dull means again he has come to this philanthropy work. So therefore Bhāgavata says, āruhya kṛcchreṇa: "Although they have undergone great austerities, penances," āruhya kṛcchreṇa paraṁ padam (SB 10.2.32), "realized to some extent the Supreme Absolute Truth," but patanty adhaḥ, "falls down."
The same example: just like so-called scientists, Russian and American, for so many years they're trying to go to the moon planet, nearest planet. But here is no shelter. Actually, I do not know whether they have gone, but why they are coming back? Let them remain there, construct house there, there is everything. If there is no such possibility, why these rascals are going there? Practically, if it is full of dust only, why these rascals are going to see the dust every time? (laughter) Ask these rascals that "What benefit? You're spending so much money and going to the moon planet and touching, 'Now my flag is on the dust,' (laughter) and go back with little pebbles, 'Oh, we have gone.' " No. Moon-reaching day, holiday. Nixon, another rascal. Great rascal. Holiday. And what do you want there? Patanty adhaḥ. After so much endeavor, trying to go to the moon planet, they are failing. And what to speak of other planets? What to speak of the Brahmaloka, Tapaloka, Jana...? They are there. We are seeing every day, at night, there are so many. Who is going there? The nearest planet, which is about 200,000 miles, I think it is so, from here, the moon planet, and they cannot go. And what to speak of other planets? There are many. They do not..., cannot calculate how far they are, but we see every night there. So how imperfect knowledge they are. That is my point. And still they are going as scientists. Lokasya ajānataḥ. They are so fools and rascal, still they are passing on as scientists, big men, learned men. No. None of them. This is our challenge. None of them. And who is learned? Learned is Vyāsadeva. Learned is Kṛṣṇa.
1972 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: They're getting money. So there is possibility, we are opening temples, public is contributing. But if we become easy-goer, "Now money is coming, let us eat sumptuously and eat, eat and sleep, and if possible drink also." But, of course, we are restricting. But naturally when one man becomes idle, idle brain is the devil's workshop. So if he can get... Just like rich man's son, they become. Everyone has got experience in every country. When he has no difficulty to get money, then what he will do? He will simply drink or invent some means of intoxication, naked dance. So they became very much perturbed. Venasyāvekṣya durvṛttasya viceṣṭitam, vimṛśya loka-vyasanaṁ kṛpaya ucuḥ sma... Kṛpāya, they were very much compassionate. They cannot see. Para-duḥkha-duḥkhī. Therefore, Vaiṣṇava is always unhappy by seeing other's unhappiness. They know how they are going to hell. Just like any gentleman will be aggrieved when they pass on the Bowery Street, seeing their fallen condition. So if any gentleman can become unhappy by seeing such condition of people, what to speak of saintly persons who are supposed to be responsible for spiritual up...
Devotee: Ahhhh!
Prabhupāda: What is that?
Devotee: A monkey. No one is guarding.
Prabhupāda: Somebody must be there. So monkeys, they are now taking advantage, that these people have got some eatables. Therefore, Darwin's theory is from monkey. That's a fact. From the monkey, cow, and lion, the next birth is human life. So vimṛśya loka-vyasanaṁ kṛpaya ucuḥ sma satriṇaḥ, they began to discuss how to mitigate the troubles of the people. They began to discuss that aho ubhayataḥ prāptaṁ lokasya vyasanaṁ mahat. People, they are now disturbed both ways. One way, the king is a rascal. Another way is that taking advantage of the bad king, the thieves and rogues, they are also very powerful. So just see how the saintly persons became compassionate to the people that they are both ways. Actually at the present moment, people are disturbed by unnecessary taxes, at the same time bad elements. So without proper king, without nice state, everyone is unhappy. And that is going on nowadays. In the Kali-yuga, it will go on continual, and more and more people will be unhappy.
Prabhupāda: No. So good karma means performance of the yajñas as they are prescribed in the Vedic literature. And this purpose of this yajña is to satisfy the Supreme Lord. Just like good citizen means one who satisfies the government. Law-abiding. Good citizen. Similarly, good karma means who satisfies Lord Viṣṇu, the Supreme Lord. Unfortunately, the modern civilization, they do not know what is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and what to speak of satisfying Him. They do not know. They are simply busy in material activities. Therefore, all of them are doing only bad karma, and therefore they are suffering. They are blind men and leading some other blind men. And both of them are expanding the path to hell by bad karma. Bad karma, you suffer. That is very easy to understand. If you do something criminal, you'll suffer. If you do something benevolent for the state, for the people, then you are rewarded, you are recognized, you are given title. Sometimes shot. This is good and bad karma. So... (microphone noise) ...some material happiness, and bad karma means you suffer from material distress. By good karma you get birth in good family, janma. You get riches, good money. Then you become learned scholar, you become beautiful also. Sit down. There is some trouble with your leg? What is that?
Devotee: There is an infection in this ankle.
Prabhupāda: Ankle? Oh, there was some... (break)
Bob: ...who is not very aware of God, but...
Prabhupāda: Why? There are so many books. They are advocating that "You can have sex life. It doesn't matter whether it is mother or sister or daughter. Why should be restriction there? It is bodily necessity. That's all." They are advocating. There are so many books. You do not know? Huh?
Sudāmā: Yes, there are.
Prabhupāda: Yes, there are books. In India, what to speak of other, in India some European or American book was written on the theme that a man fell in love with his daughter. And that book is the greatest, highest selling book. What is that book? You know?
Śyāmasundara: Lolita? There was one, Lolita it was called, about...
Sudāmā: The same theme.
Śyāmasundara: The same theme.
Sudāmā: It was also very popular in America.
Śyāmasundara: One of the most popular books of all. Some man and a twelve year old niece, nephew, daughter?
Pradyumna: Adopted daughter. Step-daughter.
Prabhupāda: Because it is the thing required. Therefore it is recommended in the śāstra. Because it is recommended that... What is recommended in the śāstra, spoken in the śāstra, that is perfect. There is no mistake. Therefore it is being accepted. Anywhere we are going, beginning from old man to child, everyone chants Hare Kṛṣṇa. Therefore it is recommended. Our intelligence should be applied there, that what is recommended in the Vedas, that is perfect. There are so many instances. Just like cow dung. You know cow dung? Stool of the cow? So according to Vedic principle, if you touch stool of an animal you become impure. Even my stool, I pass in the WC, and immediately I wash and become purified. Oh, this is my stool, personal, and what to speak of other stool? So stool is impure. But the Vedas say that the stool of cow is pure. So if you argue that "Cow is an animal. So animal stool is impure. How the cow stool can become pure?" that is puzzling, but because it is said by the..., ordered by the Vedas, it is fact. You analyze cow stool; you find all antiseptic matter. So therefore we accept the Vedic injunction as truth. We haven't got to make research. We save time. So according to Vedic civilization, whatever is stated in the Vedas, we take it-fact. That's all. Śruti. Śruti-pramāṇam. Śruti means Vedas. Pramāṇam means evidence. According to Indian system... There are two persons talking, arguing, but the person who can give Vedic evidence, he is victorious. That's all. That is the system. Just like in law court two lawyers are fighting, but the lawyer who is giving evidences from the lawbook, he is accepted by the judge. And therefore, generally you will find, whenever we speak something, we give evidence from the śāstra in Sanskrit, in all our books.
Prabhupāda: There is possibility. Otherwise why these young men are coming? That I can say. There is good possibility, but we have no facility. Just like government is spending to stop the LSD intoxication, millions of dollars. But our students, as soon as they come, they become my students, I simply order them, "No intoxication." So what to speak of LSD, they do not take tea, they do not take coffee, they do not smoke. But government will not help us. That is the difficulty.
Guest (2): Do you seek government help?
Prabhupāda: Yes. If I get government help, I can give protection to these confused, frustrated youths. I have no proper house to accommodate them, to feed them. With great difficulty I am pushing on this movement. So if the government comes forward, this means a little facility, I can turn the face of your country, immediately. There will be no problem.
Guest (2): What can you cure? What can you make better?
Prabhupāda: This is the cure: I am making good character. Don't you see their face? Some of them were hippies, frustrated, wretched condition. Now they are known as bright faces, serious character. They don't have any illicit sex. They don't eat meat. They don't have any intoxication. They don't engage in gambling. These are the four pillars of sinful life. If you allow people to indulge in sinful life, how you can expect good citizen? That is not possible. Their character must reform. So we have taken from the root. We are making men of character, knowledge, sincerity, God conscious. Don't you appreciate it?
Guest (2): Will they be able to function in a society as working individuals?
Prabhupāda: Rāmādi-mūrtiṣu. He has got different forms, Rāma, Nṛsiṁha, Varāha, many other forms, Govinda, Viṣṇu, Nārāyaṇa. So rāmādi-mūrtiṣu kalā niyamena tiṣṭhan nānāvatāram akarod bhuvaneṣu kintu, kṛṣṇaḥ svayam (Bs. 5.39). Kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam. Ete cāṁśa-kalāḥ puṁsaḥ kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam (SB 1.3.28). Īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ sac-cid-ānanda-vigrahaḥ (Bs. 5.1). These are the Vedic statements. And Kṛṣṇa also said, mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat kiñcid asti dhanañjaya (BG 7.7). mayā tatam idaṁ sarvaṁ jagad avyakta-mūrtinā, mat-sthāni sarva-bhūtāni na cāhaṁ teṣv avasthitaḥ (BG 9.4). Everything is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā. Therefore to become wise after many, many births of struggling or cultivating knowledge, when one comes to perfection of knowledge he surrenders to Kṛṣṇa. So therefore one who surrenders to Kṛṣṇa, he is the most perfect man, even without knowing Kṛṣṇa. Just like gopīs. They did not know Kṛṣṇa, whether He is God or some... Simply loved Kṛṣṇa: "Kṛṣṇa is very beautiful." That's all. So their perfection is the highest. They did not try to understand what Kṛṣṇa, what is Vedānta, what is Bhagavad-gītā. At that time Bhagavad-gītā was not spoken even. Kṛṣṇa was at that time a boy. But they loved Kṛṣṇa with their heart and soul. Kṛṣṇa was their everything. And therefore their position is the topmost. So somehow or other, we have to surrender to Kṛṣṇa. Then our life is successful. Otherwise not. So we do it knowingly or unknowingly; the effect is the same. Fire you touch knowingly or unknowingly; it will act. It is not that if a child touches fire without knowing, knowledge, it is not that fire will not burn. And similarly... That is stated in the Bhāgavata. Kāmāt krodhād bhayāt. Some way or other, come to Kṛṣṇa. Just like gopīs came to Kṛṣṇa-kāmāt. Kṛṣṇa was very beautiful, so they wanted to associate with Kṛṣṇa. Bhayāt, Kaṁsa and Śiśupāla, they were afraid of Kṛṣṇa, but still, they became Kṛṣṇa conscious, always thinking of Kṛṣṇa. Bhayāt. Krodhāt. Śiśupāla, krodhāt. He was very much envious of Kṛṣṇa. Pūtanā-rākṣasī, she wanted to kill Kṛṣṇa. So if kamāt-krodhād-bhayāt coming to Kṛṣṇa, they get perfection, what to speak of loving Kṛṣṇa? What is their position? So some way or other, you come to Kṛṣṇa. That is our mission. Yena tena prakāreṇa manaḥ kṛṣṇa niveśayet. Somehow or other, just attach your mind to Kṛṣṇa; your life is perfect.
Prabhupāda: What is that?
Jayatīrtha: Have left the Catholic church, priests.
Prabhupāda: Left.
Jayatīrtha: Ordained priests, they have left and gone off to marry or whatever. Especially they are concerned that they can't marry. Catholic priests are not allowed to marry.
Prabhupāda: Marrying? They are marrying man to man ,what to speak of marrying. Sodomy.
Jayatīrtha: So that's the alternative. Either they're leaving or they're marrying man to man.
Prabhupāda: Homosex. They are supporting homosex. So degraded, and still they say, "What we have done?" They do not know what is degradation, and they are priest. They are teaching others. They do not know what is the meaning of degradation.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: So if the leader is degraded, how can the followers...
Prabhupāda: Similarly, scientists, they do not know what is imperfection, and they are scientists.
Devotee (2): The thing about the blind leading the blind.
Prabhupāda: This is going on.
Jayatīrtha: Also, they aren't able to attract any new priests. In their seminaries, the enrollment has gone down to ten to fifteen percent of what it was previously.
1973 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Yes. He, he discovered this wireless, Marconi's. Marconi took advantage from him. They were talking together and when Marconi got the hint from him, he immediately published. it was his invention, Sir Jagadish. Therefore he invented this pulsation of the trees. and started the Sir Jagadish Institution in Calcutta. So there is painful feeling even of the trees, what to speak of others.
Brahmānanda: Even a small insect...
Prabhupāda: Anyone.
Brahmānanda: He'll run away so quickly. You try to go to him.
Prabhupāda: As soon you try to kill or attack, then he protests. And there is feeling also. Why? Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa...
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Because they want to enjoy the material world.
Prabhupāda: If you say so, then material enjoyment or enjoyment, material or spiritual, it doesn't matter...
Someone: Good morning.
Prabhupāda: Good morning. Thank you. (indistinct) Then every living entity wants to enjoy. And that is the Vedānta-sūtra. Ānandamayo 'bhyāsāt (Vedānta-sūtra 1.1.12). Why they want to enjoy?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Because that is the eternal position of the living being.
Prabhupāda: No information, no research. That kūpa-maṇḍūka, this frog in the well. That's all. They have no information of the Pacific Ocean. They are researching within the well. That's all. They have no information even of this material world. What do they know about the so many planets, so many, huge outer space? What do they know?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Almost nothing.
Prabhupāda: Nothing. Not even of this planet, what to speak of other planets. And still, they are proud. "Nobel Prize."
Svarūpa Dāmodara: If they know that there is definitely a blissful world, spiritual world, they would not work this hard.
Prabhupāda: Yes, why? Just like Lomaśa Muni. Lomaśa Muni, his duration of life is that when one Brahmā dies, one hair from the body falls. So in this way, when all the hairs of his body will fall down, he will die. He has such a great length of... So he was standing on the side of a sea and chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. So Nārada Muni approached him, "Why don't you make a small cottage here?" He said, "How long I shall live? (laughter) Ah, standing will do. Let me finish my bead...(?)" Just see. And here they'll live for twenty years and making skyscraper building, (makes sound:) "Doc, dong, doc, dong, doc, dong." (laughter) Does not calculate that "I shall live for twenty or thirty years."
Svarūpa Dāmodara: That is not guaranteed also.
Prabhupāda: No, how he could claim? He's a devotee of God, he's servant of God. How he can claim? Of course, there is no difference between God and His servant. Yes. That we say. Sākṣād-dharitvena samasta-śāstrair uktas tathā bhāvyata... **. Because a devotee, like Lord Jesus Christ, means confidential servant of God, there is no difference between God and himself. Just like any political representative or business representative, he's, if he's a confidential representative, there is no difference between the king or the proprietor of the firm, so long he represents rightly. Similarly, anyone who represents God or the cause of God, he's not different from God. We should offer respect to such person exactly like God. That is our instruction of the ācāryas. Sākṣād-dharitvena samasta-śāstrair uktaḥ **. In every śāstra the spiritual master is recognized as personally the Supreme Lord. But in... Why he is recognized? Kintu prabhor yaḥ priya eva tasya. Because he's the most dear servant of the Lord. And that is natural. Suppose some representative of some firm comes, and if I know that he is the most confidential representative, I must respect him very nicely so that he may be impressed and he may report, "These people are very nice." (laughter) Oh. So this is the ordinary etiquette, what to speak of the actual representative of God. Sākṣād-dharitvena samasta-śāstrair uktaḥ **. Uktaḥ means "it is already said." Tathā bhāvyata eva sadbhiḥ. Those who are advanced in devotional service, they accept this principle. But why? Kintu prabhor yaḥ priya eva tasya. Because he is the most confidential servant, representative. Vande guroḥ śrī-caraṇāravindam. This is, we pray, offer our prayers to our spiritual master. So it is very nice. You are attempting. I am very glad. So you can inquire from me anything. The first thing I shall request you, the first principle of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or the first ABCD of spiritual education, is to understand the constitutional position of the living entity. He is, he is spirit soul. He's not this body. The spirit soul is living within this body, but the, the body's not the spirit soul. This thing must be understood very clearly.
Prabhupāda: Simply by becoming Sanskrit scholar or Latin scholar, it is not sufficient. He must be God-realized, purified. Then it is possible. Ataḥ śrī-kṛṣṇa-nāmādi na bhaved grāhyam indriyaiḥ: (Brs. 1.2.234) "By your these blunt senses it is not possible to understand what is God, what is His form, what is His name, what is His quality, what is His kingdom, what is His paraphernalia." These things are to be understood. God means... Just like when we speak of "king." King does not mean alone. King means he has got his queen, he has got his kingdom, he has got his secretary, he has got his minister, he has got his palace, he has... so many things, king, royal. When we speak of Queen, we immediately remember the Buckingham Palace, his (her) bodyguards and so many, so many other things. Similarly, God means He has got His entourage also, everything. He's not alone. To understand God means to understand everything of God—His name, His fame, His līlā, His pastimes. So nāmādi. With all these blunt senses, how can we... We cannot understand even the Personality of Godhead, what to speak of other things? "God is a person:"—it is a very difficult subject matter for ordinary man to take it, very difficult subject. That is stated in the... Even the demigods they cannot understand. That is... Because he's thinking materially that "This cosmic manifestation, then creation, is so big, and it is created by a person. How it is possible?" But... Because they do not know what is that person. Simply by the word "person," he is afraid: "Oh, oh, oh, oh."
Revatīnandana: "He's like me. I can't do it. Therefore not a person."
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Revatīnandana: "No person except He's like me."
Prabhupāda: And ignorance. If we give service in ignorance, without knowing what is what, that kind of service may lead us to become punished. So we must know what kind of service we shall give. So real suffering of the society, human society, or any society you take, real suffering is, because the living entity has forgotten God, so he is being punished in different way by the material nature. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). So many ways. But everyone is being punished. At least, the three kinds... Why three kinds? That is stated in Bhagavad-gītā, that this is also punishment, repetition of birth and death. This is also punishment. Because we are eternal. Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). We are spirit soul, we are eternal. So our, this constant change of body, birth and death, that is also punishment. Because nobody wants to die. Because he is eternal. How he'll like to die? He wants to keep his eternal position, but he, because he's criminal... Just like one man is condemned to die, murderer. So he has to die. But he wants to protect himself, placing himself in the court, "How to save? How to save?" So that is our natural tendency, that we do not want to die. Why? Because we are eternal. We have got the prerogative. So if... Anyone does not want to die. Anyone does not want to take birth even. Now we have forgotten. Otherwise, in the womb of the mother, everyone knows that we are kept in such a way, in a packed, compact water bag, without any facility to move, not only for one day, two day, but ten months. Medical science knows, everyone knows. And at that time there are worms in the womb of the mother. They're taking the advantage, delicate skin. They also bite. And he cannot make any protest. He moves sometimes. The child moves. These are the sufferings. But we do not take care. If I have to take birth again, then I have to go, again enter into the womb of the mother, and, to develop my body and in such precarious condition, the body will develop. So there is suffering. There is suffering of birth, and at the time of death there is suffering. And between birth and death, there is duration of life, there is disease, there is old age, and what to speak of other sufferings. That we may not mention. But at least these four sufferings are there. Therefore the best service is to save him from this suffering. That is the service.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Lower than śūdra. Why śūdra? Kirāta-hūṇāndhra-pulinda-pulkaśā ābhīra-śumbhā yavanāḥ khasādayaḥ (SB 2.4.18). They become purified if they accept the real representative of Kṛṣṇa. Prabhaviṣṇave namaḥ. Yad-apāśrayāśrayāḥ. Everything is there in the śāstras. If you take advantage of the benefit of the śāstras, everything can be remodeled, everything can be good. There is no cause for disappointment. But unfortunately they'll not agree. Yaḥ śāstra-vidhim utsṛjya. Na siddhiṁ sa avāpnoti. One who is acting whimsically, without any reference of the authoritative śāstra, he'll never get success, na siddhim avāpnoti. Na sukham: neither happiness. And what to speak of going to the spiritual world? It is impossible. So we have to take the advantage of the instruction in the śāstra. Now Kṛṣṇa is accepted the supreme authority by all the ācāryas. The molder of destiny of India's culture, all the ācāryas. Rāmānujācārya, Madhvācārya, Viṣṇu Svāmī, Nimbārka, Lord Caitanya...
Reporter: Śaṅkarācārya.
Prabhupāda: Śaṅkarācārya. They all accept Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam (SB 1.3.28). They accept it. So how can you defy all these ācāryas and you become better than them? That is nonsense.
Reporter: But all these ācāryas interpret in different, different ways.
Prabhupāda: No. No.
Reporter: No?
Prabhupāda: Yes, corruption will increase, sinful life increase, cheating. Mandāḥ sumanda-matayo manda-bhāgyāḥ (SB 1.1.10). Misfortune. These things will...
Guest (1): Adulteration of food.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Even government cannot give nice food to the people, what to speak of nice government. In the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam... You have got the copy?
Pradyumna: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Ādya. During Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira's reign everything was ample supply. Kāmaṁ vavarṣa parjanyaḥ (SB 1.10.4). You have got that verse.
Pradyumna: I just have the black one.
Prabhupāda: Oh yes. Kāmaṁ vavarṣa parjanyaḥ (SB 1.10.4). During Mahārāja Parīkṣit's time, one black man was attempting to kill a cow. Immediately the king wanted to kill him, immediately: "Oh, who are you?" It is the duty of the vaiśyas. Kṛṣi-go-rakṣya-vāṇijyam vaiśya-karma-svabhāva-jam (BG 18.44). It is the duty of the vaiśyas to protect the cows, to increase agricultural activities and trade. But they are now interested in producing electronic parts. No go-rakṣya, no vāṇijyam, no food production. Cheap profit, and for eating, let there be slaughterhouse and eat meat. And to digest meat, you drink wine. This is being taught. So you create the situation and when you suffer, then why should we lament? We have created this situation, godless civilization, do not follow the direction of the śāstras. When we follow, what is that kāmam?
Prabhupāda: Fishing?
Karandhara: Fly casting. (pause) (break)
Citraka: ...open a temple in Greece?
Prabhupāda: I would like to open temples in every village, every city, what to speak of Greece. But we haven't got sufficient men.
Karandhara: This boy is from Greece.
Citraka: I will translate the books later.
Prabhupāda: Oh, then you can open. But alone... You can be assisted with some of our men. That's nice proposal. We want to open in every city, every village, village to village. So go this way or around the...?
Karandhara: This isn't too bad. We can go this way. It's not too wet.
Citraka: Sometimes you have said that the Greek mythology comes from the Purāṇas.
Prabhupāda: Yes, certainly. In Greece I think some people know of our movement. Because in the airport as soon as some young men saw us, they chanted "Hare Kṛṣṇa!" Yes. Maybe they are Europeans, but I had practical experience. (break) which..., that Park Avenue?
Devotee: Is a seed conscious, Prabhupāda?
Prabhupāda: That is another thing. Everything is conscious. First of all, even gross manifestation we cannot understand, what to speak of consciousness. That is different thing. According to our philosophy, everything has got consciousness. Just like this tree has got consciousness.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: The scientists also say that they have consciousness.
Prabhupāda: But this tree's consciousness and my consciousness is different. My consciousness is developed. If you pinch on my body, my consciousness will be immediately protesting. But you cut, it will not protest. So consciousness is different. So there is nothing which has no consciousness, but it is a question of degree. It is a question of degree. The more the consciousness is covered, it is called material. The more the consciousness is developed, it is called spiritual. That is the difference between matter and spirit.
Hṛdayānanda: Prabhupāda, that verse in the Gītā, that nityaḥ sarva-gataḥ sthāṇuḥ. That verse in the Bhagavad-gītā that living beings are everywhere.
Prabhupāda: Yes, not ava... Yes, avaroha process. Yes, thank you. Here Kṛṣṇa says, mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat (BG 7.7). We have to accept that. Mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat kiñcid asti dhanañjaya (BG 7.7). So "There is no more superior authority than Me." Harer nāma harer nāma... (CC Adi 17.21).
Yaśomatīnandana: (loud waves drowns out voice)
Prabhupāda: Ah, na me viduḥ sura-gaṇāḥ... (Bg 10.2).
Yaśomatīnandana: What to speak of these teeny scientists, even the great sages can't know Him.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Aham ādir hi devānām...
Yaśomatīnandana: Maharṣīṇāṁ ca sarvaśaḥ.
Prabhupāda: Ah.
Yaśomatīnandana: Even Lord Brahmā, when he saw the innumerable Viṣṇu forms of the child Kṛṣṇa, then he himself said that "As far as I know, as far as I am concerned, I don't know anything about You."
Prabhupāda: No, he... Yes. That is the Brahmā's position, what to speak of others. Yasyāntaṁ na viduḥ surāsura-gaṇā devāya tasmai namaḥ. Yaṁ brahmā varuṇendra-rudra-marutaḥ stunvanti divyaiḥ stavaiḥ. Brahmā, Varuṇa, all demigods. Yaṁ brahmā varuṇendra-rudra. Rudra even, Śiva, Lord Śiva. Stunvanti divyaiḥ stavair vedaiḥ sāṅga-pada-kramopaniṣadair gāyanti yaṁ sāma-gāḥ, dhyānāvasthita-tad-gatena manasā paśyanti yaṁ yoginaḥ (SB 12.13.1). That Bhārati cited this verse. Yes.
Hṛdayānanda: The five gods?
Karandhara: Well, they may accept Kṛṣṇa as a person, but not as God.
Prabhupāda: Yes, Kṛṣṇa is person. Kṛṣṇa is person. God is person. That we accept. God is person. God is not person.
Bali Mardana: The demons at Kṛṣṇa's time could not even accept Him as God, what to speak of the demons now.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Karandhara: Therefore they say, What is the platform of objectivity in determining what's God?"
Prabhupāda: This is definition. God has show in himself, exhibited Himself. He married sixteen thousand wives. Where is that person who can marry sixteen thousand wife and expand himself in sixteen thousand bodies? Where is that person?
Karandhara: They say no such person exists.
Prabhupāda: Therefore He is there. He is God, the superexcellent.
Karandhara: But they say He never did that. That's impossible.
Prabhupāda: He did it. There is a mention in the history.
Karandhara: George Washington didn't do anything which was out out out of the conception of belief.
Prabhupāda: No, out of conception, he had no power to do it. He had no power to do it.
Hṛdayānanda: Who's conception?
Prabhupāda: That, they are hopeful of doing everything but never successful, never. That they'll never become. Unless they are hopeful, how... Just like a physician. The man is going to die, still, he's thinking, "Yes, I am hopeful." I have seen in Allahabad high-court. One man was condemned to death, and his lawyer solacing him. "Don't be sorry. I'll appeal, I'll appeal. I'll get you out." You see? This is their business.
Yaśomatīnandana: They do want something more exciting, Prabhupāda, but they don't know they want to go to the spiritual sky.
Prabhupāda: They do not know what is spiritual. They do not know what is this sky even, what to speak of spiritual sky.
Karandhara: Prabhupāda, many theologians will say privately that they believe in God or they want to believe in God but they cannot speak of God to the common people because the people are so agitated, they don't want to hear of God.
Prabhupāda: No, we are speaking. We are speaking to the common man. We do not hesitate. We say, "Here is Kṛṣṇa, God."
Prajāpati: The most active or the most powerful of the theologians, they are very, very conservative Christian, and they say, though, that if they believe in Jesus, they cannot hear of Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: Why? If they are actually theologians, why they should not hear? Jesus Christ says that he's the son of God. But why not of the father. And what is this?
Karandhara: They make reference to one... He supposedly said that he was the only way, that no man could come to God the father except through Jesus.
Prabhupāda: Yes, so we accept the only way. Take Bible, and we shall prove there is Kṛṣṇa. Take Bible, yes.
Prajāpati: But they will quote a reference in the Bible that says, "No other book."
Prabhupāda: This is God consciousness. So therefore, when one is God conscious, how he can kill another animal? He knows that "If I am killed, I feel pains and pleasure, pains, then why shall I kill him? And he's also son of God. I am also son of God. So God, how He can allow to kill another son?" Suppose a father has got ten sons. One is useless, cannot earn anything. If the earning son says, "Father, he is useless, let him... Let me kill him," the father will agree? No. Father is kind to everyone. So similarly, when one is God conscious, if he kills animal, that means he has no sense of God consciousness. He has no sense of God. That is the test. So our propaganda is that you make people God conscious. Then all good qualities will come. Instead of trying to qualify man in so many ways—"You don't become thief, you don't become murderer, you don't become this, don't become this, don't become intoxicant"—simply by becoming Kṛṣṇa conscious, he becomes everything, by one stroke. That is our propaganda, that if one becomes God conscious, then he is becoming perfect, not necessarily, materially and spiritually, both. And that is happening practically. Now these boys, these girls, they are Europeans, Americans. They were accustomed to so many bad habits and according to our standard, and now they have given up. They have no illicit sex, no gambling, no meat-eating, no intoxication, even up to smoking or drinking tea. Yes. We don't allow our students... Not allow. They become accustomed. Once I say, "Don't do this," they agree. They agree immediately. Intoxication. There were many students, they were habituated to this nowadays intoxican... Immediately gave up. And your government is making so much propaganda to give up this intoxication. They are failure. So a little God consciousness helps so much. And what to speak of when one is perfectly God conscious? Then he's perfect man. Therefore a devotee is not of this material world. He's in the spiritual world. He's above this material world. Sa guṇān samatītyaitān brahma-bhūyāya kalpate (BG 14.26). Find out this verse.
Prabhupāda: So preaching is always difficult. That I have repeatedly saying. You cannot take preaching very easy-going. Preaching must be fight. Do you mean to say fighting is easy thing? Fighting is not easy thing. Whenever there is fight, there is danger, there is responsibility. So preaching means... What is the preaching? Because people are ignorant, we have to enlighten them. That is preaching.
Nara-nārāyaṇa: When you came to the western world, no one anywhere believed that it would be successful I think. But actually, it has become very successful, by preaching.
Prabhupāda: I myself did not believe I shall be successful, what to speak of others, but because I did in the proper line, so it has become successful.
Yaśomatīnandana: Yes, Kṛṣṇa is so kind that we expect something and He gives us hundred times more.
Prabhupāda: Oh yes.
Yaśomatīnandana: So if we simply follow your instructions, then I am sure that it will come out glorious.
Nara-nārāyaṇa: So if we are in the proper line, then our political activities also can become successful?
Prabhupāda: Oh yes. Why not? Kṛṣṇa was in politics. So Kṛṣṇa consciousness means all-round: social, political, philosophical, religious, cultural, everything. It is not one-sided. They take it as... They do not know. Therefore they are thinking it is a religious movement. No, it is all-including, all-including, all-pervasive.
| Page Title: | What to speak of... (Conversations 1968 - 1973) |
| Compiler: | Visnu Murti, RupaManjari |
| Created: | 22 of Nov, 2012 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=36, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 36 |