Very hard (Conversations)

Expressions researched:
"very hard"

Notes from the compiler: VedaBase query: "very hard" not "work* very hard"

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Press Interview -- December 30, 1968, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: So try to help us.

Journalist: Pardon?

Prabhupāda: Try to help this movement. Your America, there are so many rich men. If somebody comes and helps this movement, one or two, we can make very steady progress. We have no money. We are struggling very hard. You see? This boy is a professor in the Ohio University. So whatever he's earning, he's spending for this. Similarly, all the boys whatever they earn, they spend. But that is not sufficient, you see? We require to make propaganda. We cannot sufficiently publish this magazine. We want to publish it at least fifty thousand per month, but there is no money. We are publishing at most five thousand. (conchshell blowing)

Journalist: Who's blowing the shofar?

Hayagrīva: Conchshell.

Journalist: I thought it was a shofar.

Prabhupāda: What is that? Chauffeur?

Journalist: The Jewish ram's horn.

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- April 12, 1969, New York:

Govinda dāsī: Oh, the guest? It's coming.

Prabhupāda: So śaśan ke adhikārī means they should be punished. (laughs) Punished means, just like dhol, when the, I mean to say, sound is not very hard, dag-dag, if you beat it on the border, then it comes to be nice tune. Similarly, paśu, animals, if you request, "My dear dog, please do not go there." Hut! (laughter) "No, my dear dog." Hut! This is the way.(?) Similarly, woman. If you become lenient, then she will be troublesome. So in India still, in villages, whenever there is some quarrel between husband wife, the husband beats and she is tamed. (laughs) In civilized society, "Oh, you have done this?" Immediately some criminal case. But in uncivilized society they don't care for court or civilized way of... Kicharī. (prasādam being served)

Rayarama: Swamiji, Janārdana told me that from Vedic sources, you drew some conclusion that there are different universes visible? The stars are different universes? What is that?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Conversation Before Lecture -- April 29, 1969, Brandeis University, Boston:

Miss Rose: Oh, yes! I told a lot of people. You know, Swamiji, the first time when I heard about 95 Glenville Avenue, the first time, a woman told me that, she says, "You know," she says, "gypsies, we have neighbors, gypsies on the street." "Gypsies! I haven't seen any gypsies." Well, I put my shoes. I went downstairs. I went to the door and I start reading. I says, "This is spiritual. This is beautiful. This is spiritual." I forgot right away. So she came to the door, Jadurani. She came to the door and she said, "Hare Kṛṣṇa," and she said, "Come in." I came in and she started talking to me and that's... I got started. So when I seen her, I said, "That's not gypsies. That's not gypsies." And I explained it to her. "Oh," she said, "I seen the curtains in the window," she said, "and I thought they were gypsies." "Oh, well," I explained it to her. "Oh," I says. I let her have it, there was no gypsies there. So she used to see me coming down to got to the temple. So nice, yeah? Do you like that place, Swamiji?

Prabhupāda: Which place?

Miss Rose: Where the disciples are now, on Glenville Avenue? Or do you think that you need another place?

Prabhupāda: No, sometimes the, some children disturb. They broke...

Miss Rose: No. Oh, I know they broke the windows. I know that. You know, Swamiji, it's very hard to find apartments, and, Swamiji, they're very expensive. $125, $135, $145 dollars a month, the apartments are. See. Yeah. And they're very, very hard to find. And sometimes I want to get out of there myself. Because, I mean, there is so many... It's really turning out to be kind of a bad, a lot of children there.

Prabhupāda: Let us see. As Kṛṣṇa desires. Begin kīrtana. Chant. (end)

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- December 10, 1971, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: The body is not barrier, we should always remember. Bodily concept of life is the consciousness of the animals, and spiritual concept of life is the consciousness of the perfect being. I am servant, eternal servant of Kṛṣṇa. This we should know. We should not cry for bodily problem. We should simply try to improve our Kṛṣṇa consciousness, how we can better serve Kṛṣṇa. That is our business. Bodily comforts, this comfort, that is already settled up with this body. But we should also know that anyone who is Kṛṣṇa conscious, if he has got any slight desire for bodily comfort, he'll get that. He'll get that. But without Kṛṣṇa consciousness, if he tries, that is not possible. If I have got slight desire for my material improvement, Kṛṣṇa will satisfy you, if you take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That means you are double way benefited. You get Kṛṣṇa consciousness as well as your desire for material benefit. That is also there. But without Kṛṣṇa consciousness, if you want to improve your material condition, that is not possible. Deha-yogena de... You may become rich, that's all right, but comfort does not depend on your richness. If you're not Kṛṣṇa conscious, it does not mean because you have got some money by struggling very hard you'll get. There are so many rich men you'll find, they are not comfortable. I have heard from our students, their parents, just like Śyāmasundara was telling, his father is taking... What is that pill?

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation Vaisnava Calendar Description -- March 11, 1972, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu took this opportunity that "Your father and uncle is in brotherly relation with my grandfather. Therefore, your father and uncle happens to be my grandfather. Generally, the grandfather and the grandson, they treat themselves joking, so I can joke your father and uncle, you do not be sorry." Raghunātha Dāsa Gosvāmī did not reply anything, he was very submissive. So in that connection He said that "Your father and uncle is a worms of the stool. They are very much fond of material enjoyment, and Kṛṣṇa has saved you from that hole of stool." So in this way he criticized his father and uncle. Raghunātha Dāsa Gosvāmī did not reply. Then he entrusted him to His secretary, Svarūpa Dāmodara, for his teaching, and in this way Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī was known as Svarūpa's Raghunātha. So, his father became very sorry that the boy has left home, and he has gone to Caitanya, they are mendicants, very hard life, how this boy will live? So immediately he sent some servants and 400 rupees. Four hundred rupees in those days was a hundred times valuable than at the present moment. So he was sending 400 rupees regularly per month and Ragunatha Dāsa Gosvāmī was accepting them, but he was spending the money by prasāda distribution to the saintly persons of Jagannātha Purī, and Caitanya Mahāprabhu was also invited, and He also used to go. But after some time, he stopped that invitation. So Caitanya Mahāprabhu inquired, "So why Raghunātha does not nowadays invite us? what is the matter? So Svarūpa Dāmodara informed Him, that "He is no more accepting the rupees sent by his father".

Room Conversation -- July 4, 1972, New York:

Bob Cohen: Prabhupāda, people that engage in religions, like these Jesus freaks and other people, they claim that Jesus is guiding them. Can this be so?

Prabhupāda: Yes. But they're not taking the guidance. Just like the Christians. Jesus guiding him, "Thou shalt not kill," but they're killing. Where is the Jesus guidance? Simply by saying, "I am guided by Jesus Christ," will do? "But I don't care for his words." Is that guidance? So nobody is being guided by Jesus Christ. They're falsely claiming. It is very hard to find out a man who is actually being guided by Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ's guidance is open there, but nobody is caring for him. They have taken Jesus Christ as contractor to take up their sins. That is their philosophy. They commit all kinds of sins, and poor Jesus Christ will be responsible. That is their religion. Therefore they say, "We have got very good religion. For all our sinful activities, Jesus Christ will die." Very good religion. They have no sympathy for Jesus Christ. "Once he has died for our sins, why should we commit again sins? Such a great life has been sacrificed for our sins." That is guided by Jesus Christ. But if you take it otherwise—"We shall go on committing all sins, and Jesus Christ has made contract that he'll nullify all my sins. Simply I go to the church and confess, and come back and again do all nonsense"—do you think it is very goodly intelligence?

Bob Cohen: No.

Room Conversation -- July 4, 1972, New York:

Prabhupāda: That you... Actually one is guided by Jesus Christ, he'll get liberation, certainly. But it is very hard to find out a man who is actually being guided by Jesus Christ.

Bob Cohen: What I think about is the Jesus freaks, the..., these people that, young people that have joined this Jesus movement, and they read the Bible very often, and they try to...

Prabhupāda: But to read the Bible, but violate the Bible injunction, injunction. How they can kill if they are following the Bible?

Bob Cohen: I asked one. They said..., he said he claimed that Jesus was also eating meat in the Bible. But I don't know.

Prabhupāda: But that's all right. He, he may eat anything. He's powerful. But he has ordered, "Thou shalt not kill." You must stop killing. He is powerful. He can eat the whole world. You cannot compare with Jesus Christ. You cannot imitate Jesus Christ. You shall have to abide by his order. That is your position. Then you are guided by Jesus Christ. That is actually obedience. You cannot imitate. That is explained in Bhāgavata, that those who are īśvara, those who are empowered, they will do anything, but we cannot imitate. We have to abide by his order. "What he says to me, that I will do." You cannot imitate. If you say that "Jesus Christ ate meat," admitting that, in what condition he ate meat, if you do not know, then Jesus Christ is contradicting his statement. He's eating himself meat, and he's advising others not to kill. Do you think Jesus Christ is contradicting?

Conversation with Bajaj and Bhusan -- September 11, 1972, Arlington, Texas, At Their Home:

Prabhupāda: What is that? Milk? So many nice preparations given by Kṛṣṇa. Why shall I eat meat? Where is the necessity? Human being must discriminate what he shall eat. If you say, "Everything is food," then stool is also food for the hog. But the food for the human being must be different from the hog.

Guest (2): Is it our duty to convince everybody and to argue with people and say, "Now..." Because most of the people would argue for, "Where is your protein?" "Needs his protein," and you know, when they talk in terms of body consciousness rather than Kṛṣṇa consciousness. It's very hard to argue with that.

Prabhupāda: Yes, I have argued. All these European boys, I had to argue with them. (laughter)

Lucille: (indistinct) in Bombay and the first thing he did was argue with me.

Prabhupāda: Big, big swamis, they are advocating, "Eat meat."

Guest (2): Is that right?

Prabhupāda: Oh yes. Ramakrishna Mission, they eat meat.

Guest (2): I don't think so.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Morning Walks -- October 1-3, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Jayatīrtha: She is a 40-years-old lady, her name is Lucille. She is very much actually convinced of our philosophy and is devoted to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, but the only thing is, because she comes conditioned from a previous life, can't give up, has a very hard time giving up smoking cigarettes and drinking coffee. She's been trying for about nine months to give up these things, (indistinct) but she can't do it. Still she is desirous of initiation. So I don't know what to (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: No. You must at least promise that he gives (break) And if we promise that (indistinct). But after initiation if she smokes, that's not good.

Jayatīrtha: Yes. (indistinct)

Svarūpa Dāmodara: (indistinct)

Jayatīrtha: So if someone is sincere, we want them to follow devotional principles. (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: No. If you have the determination, Kṛṣṇa will help. If she is determined that "Even if I die, I shall not smoke," then Kṛṣṇa will help her. And if she thinks, "So I'll not do it. If Kṛṣṇa likes, He will help me." (indistinct) Just like (indistinct). He has prepared some nice foodstuff. So he says, "If Kṛṣṇa comes, I will give Him; otherwise I shall eat." (laughter) "And if Kṛṣṇa is very hungry, He will come." So this alternative proposal is not accepted. "If Kṛṣṇa comes, I will offer Him this. Otherwise I shall eat."

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- February 28, 1973, Jakarta:

Prabhupāda: Rejected?

Devotee (1): Yes, because a few years ago his family left him and his wife and children deserted him, and he... The wife told many stories about him that he was very, doing degraded things, and so everyone rejects him. And when he speaks to Indian people they reject. He irritates them. And also sometimes he is, it can be changed, but he is, he makes them irritated a little too much pride, but he can be changed because he's chanting so much. But he tries very, very hard. Only we have to get him to agree to chant. And now he has another wife and a child.

Prabhupāda: A child?

Devotee (1): A child. One boy was born just before we came here in August and he seems to be a devotee, the baby, because he, whenever you say, "Hare Kṛṣṇa," he smiles.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct) Why he's not married man?

Devotee (1): Another wife, second. He says it was a grave mistake because if we had come sooner (indistinct) So we're trying to engage him. Also this girl which you're going to initiate, she can speak a fair amount of Indonesian already, and she can help translation work (indistinct). That girl has a sister who also chants sixteen rounds and follows the rules. Though sometimes in her past she failed and stopped and she is not as steady. So I didn't recommend. I don't know...

Prabhupāda: (indistinct)

Morning Walk -- May 1, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Man-made rubbish. Although they have got machine. (break) What other things they can produce there?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: From sand?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: There is a compound that is called silicon carbide. That is, I think, it is very hard, as hard as diamond They make silicon carbide. I'm not sure but silicon carbide or tungsten carbide. They are used for cutting diamond. They are harder than diamond. Very strong, very hard. They combine this with carbon. It requires tremendous amounts of force to do this, high temperature, high pressure. (pause)

Prabhupāda: Anything eatables?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: (Laughs) No, not so far.

Brahmānanda: Future.

Prabhupāda: "In future." But God creates so many eatables from sand. Do you know?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: The smaller birds, they are eating something from sand?

Prabhupāda: No, even for man. The cantaloupe, watermelon, they are produced in sand in large quantity. Kharmuja.

Morning Walk At Cheviot Hills Golf Course -- May 15, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: ...difficulty for the scientist to understand God? What is their difficulty? We understand God very easily.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They find it very hard to see the spirit, the soul in... It is very doubtful, they say.

Prabhupāda: No, no, spirit you see or don't see, that is dif...

Umāpati: He studies matter.

Prabhupāda: No, that's all right.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No, once they see the spirit soul, they can detect somehow, then they are definitely convinced.

Prabhupāda: So how you can see? It is... The measurement is given, 1/10,000th part of the tip of the hair. So where is your seeing power?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Still they want to sense it by some...

Prabhupāda: Sense, that is... Any rascal can sense that here is living energy. That is spirit soul. Just like if you inject one grain of poison and immediately he dies, does it require how he dies? That one, not one grain. Even one hundredth part of one grain, venomous poison, how it acts? So even nobody can see it, when the snake bites, nobody can see where is that... How he dies?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They will explain that by..., it blocks some of the metabolic paths...

Room Conversation with Krishna Tiwari -- May 22, 1973, New York:

Prabhupāda: No, there cannot be difference.

Krishna Tiwari: Yes. And the only difference is that where the scientist deals with the phenomena of nature and wants to show it to others. In a strict sense he can tell how he (indistinct) better; others can go and say it. Sometimes it is very hard, I think, for all these reasons, for the religious leaders to do that.

Prabhupāda: So as so far the differences, there is no difference, because just like this body: the body has got different parts—the fingers, the hands, the eyes, the legs, so many different—but the whole purpose is to serve the body. Either with the finger or eyes or hands or legs, the whole purpose is centered on the soul of the complete whole body. Similarly, Bhāgavata says that whatever you may—you may be scientist, you may be philosopher, you may be an engineer, you may be a poet, you may be sociologist, politician, whatever you may be-their purpose should be avicyutaḥ arthaḥ. Avicyutaḥ means infallible purpose. Avicyutaḥ arthaḥ kavibhih nirūpitaḥ. "It has been decided by great learned scholar," says "all of them should be engaged in glorifying the Supreme." Avicyuto 'rthaḥ kavibhir nirūpito yad-uttamaśloka-guṇānuvarṇanam. The scientists, from their angle of vision, should describe the glory of the Lord: how this biology is working by the manipulation of the Supreme Lord. Similarly chemists, physicists, engineers, politicians, there are different departments, but all of them should join together, congregation, and from their different scientific point, angle of vision, they should glorify the Supreme Lord.

Room Conversation with Krishna Tiwari -- May 22, 1973, New York:

Prabhupāda: No. Yes, yes. You said that we know artificially; we don't know philosophy.

Krishna Tiwari: I never said that we're not trying to find out.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: All right, then, and you have tried, and you...

Krishna Tiwari: Oh, we are still trying to... You have to try very hard to find out these things. My question is, when I say-wait a minute, let me talk something. When I say I do not know, that does not necessarily mean that others know. And you are taking this (indistinct) point. I am saying in my humbleness that I do not know, and you come up, "Well, I know that." Because I don't know, you are suppose to know. That's not true. I just say you don't know either. (laughs)

Prabhupāda: No, no, that... But you cannot say, also, because you do not know, others do not know. You cannot say.

Krishna Tiwari: No. I never said that. I don't..., I didn't say that.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: You did. You just did.

Krishna Tiwari: No, but you'll come back and tell me that "I know." Then I cannot believe you that because I said I don't know, you have to know.

Prabhupāda: "I, I know" means I know from the authority, who knows.

Room Conversation with Anna Conan Doyle, daughter-in-law of famous author, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle -- August 10, 1973, Paris:

Haṁsadūta: Repairing.

Prabhupāda: Mouse business. This repairing and working is done by the mouse also.

Bhagavān: At night, they also work at night.

Prabhupāda: Ugra-karma. They have invented working method, very, very hard, very, very... At night, in darkness, go down, ten stories down and work for a livelihood.

Guru-gaurāṅga: Pungent activities.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Guru-gaurāṅga: Pungent activities.

Prabhupāda: And lots of land is lying in our Letchmore Heath. They won't work for producing food. That land is kept for keeping cows for killing them. And for their food, they are working underneath the ground, and whatever money they get, they import grains. Just see the māyā's influence, that: "We are working, getting money, and importing grains." Why not work and grow grains? Now he's thinking that: "I'll get more money underground, than by cultivating on the surface." This is māyā. He's working very hard. Still, he's thinking it is better happiness. "I haven't to work on the surface. I am working underground. Therefore I am happy." This is māyā. He'll prefer that kind of work. But he won't agree to grow food on the surface of the country.

Room Conversation -- September 2, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: The kings and demigods, they have got body. Everyone has got body. But especially the body of... Nāyaṁ deho deha-bhājāṁ nṛloke. In the human society. This body is not meant for kaṣṭān kāmān, to satisfy sense gratification with very, very hard labor like the hogs and dogs. Then what it is meant for? Tapo divyaṁ putrakā yena sattvaṁ śuddhyed (SB 5.5.1). "My dear boys, this body is meant for tapasya." Why tapasya? Your question. Yena śuddhyed. Your existence will be purified. Yasmād brahma-saukhyaṁ tv anantam. Then you'll get perpetual, blissful life. So everyone is seeking after blissful life, but that is not possible in this materialistic way of life. That is not possible. One must seek blissful life in spiritual understanding, brahma-saukhyam, brahma-sukha. That is required. Transcendental pleasure. Ramante yogino 'nante satyānande cid-ātmani. Satyānande, real happiness, in the spiritual understanding, spiritual platform. Iti rāma-padenāsau paraṁ brahmābhidhīyate (CC Madhya 9.29). That kind of enjoyment is called rāma. Ramaṇa. From ramaṇa, rāma. That is wanted. So there is no education at the present moment. But people are hankering. Western people especially. They've have seen enough of this material enjoyment, now they are hankering after their spiritual life. Therefore they look forward towards the Vedic culture. This is the answer.

Morning Walk -- December 2, 1973, Los Angeles:

Bali Mardana: It was raining very hard yesterday. Perhaps that's why.

Hṛdayānanda: All raining?

Prabhupāda: It may be rain water.

Karandhara: Well, they fill it. Usually they fill it on Saturdays and Sundays.

Prabhupāda: Oh, that is it.

Bali Mardana: It's too much for rain water.

Karandhara: They practice fishing.

Prabhupāda: Fishing?

Karandhara: Fly casting. (pause) (break)

Citraka: ...open a temple in Greece?

Prabhupāda: I would like to open temples in every village, every city, what to speak of Greece. But we haven't got sufficient men.

Morning Walk -- December 3, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14).

Yaśomatīnandana: Duratyayā, very hard to overcome.

Prabhupāda: It is not possible.

Hṛdayānanda: They have a whole new department called gerontology to stop death. In one article they had about twenty different methods, and they said all of them, none of them have succeeded yet. But they were very confident.

Yaśomatīnandana: Even for them there is some medicine in the Vedas. If they go to heavenly planets they will be able to live longer. They are so stupid, śūdra class, that they can't.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Yaśomatīnandana: Even if they go to heavenly planets by following Vedas, still they will be able to live longer, but by their mundane efforts they will not be able to increase...

Prabhupāda: No, nobody... In the material world there is no question of living forever. That is not possible. That is in the spiritual world.

Morning Walk -- December 20, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That can be accepted. "One man's food, another man's poison." That is going on everywhere. But for that reason one cannot accept poison as food. Is it not? Just like stool is food for the pigs. But that does not mean stool is food. It may be food for a certain class of animals. (break) No.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I don't think so.

Prajāpati: Food for somebody.

Karandhara: It is very hard.

Prajāpati: Harder than a bullet? (break)

Prabhupāda: Oh, you have not covered?

Child: That's all right. (break)

Prajāpati: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Oh, so they are coming to consciousness. Why they are praying to God?

Prajāpati: Things get so bad, they have to turn to God.

Prabhupāda: Duḥkhe sab hari bhaje. When one is distressed, there is sense of God consciousness, but if they continue it even in their happiness, then it is all right.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- March 23, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: What Ramakrishna? Don't talk of these nonsense. Simply they have misled. That's all.

Dr. Patel: Simply you bhaja Kṛṣṇa and don't think anything else. And you get all your intelligence there.

Prabhupāda: Therefore Kṛṣṇa has said, mām ekam. "Don't go to these foolish rascals." Mām ekam. Otherwise you'll be misled. Because they are misleaders, rascals.

Dr. Patel: You are so very hard.

Prabhupāda: I must be hard!

Dr. Patel: Hard, harsh, and hard and harsh...

Prabhupāda: The whole world is spoiled for these Māyāvādīs. Therefore I am very much hard.

Dr. Patel: What... I don't say hard. Hard and harsh...

Prabhupāda: No, we must be harder and harder.

Dr. Patel: Hard and harsh! Doesn't matter...

Prabhupāda: I don't make any compromise with these rascals. No words. No, no. I never made that. Even if I don't get any disciples, I'll be satisfied. But I can't make any compromise like these rascals. I cannot make. Ekaś candras tamo hanti na ca tārā sahasrasaḥ. If I create one moon, that is sufficient. I don't want many stars. That was my Guru Mahārāja's principle, and that is my principle. What is the use of having number of fools and rascals? If one man understands rightly, he can deliver the whole world.

Room Conversation with Richard Webster, chairman, Societa Filosofica Italiana -- May 24, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: No, there have been so many charges against president Nixon. So no, whatever it may be, we are not concerned. But this is the Vedic principle, that the king or the executive head of the state, the brāhmaṇa and the public leader must be very clean. Otherwise society will be spoiled. That is the injunction.

Richard Webster: Yes, well, of course, I agree.

Prabhupāda: At the present moment there is all over the world... We are touring all over the world. It is very hard to find out ideal class of men. That is the defect. In the Vedic culture the ideal class of men were the brāhmaṇas. Their qualification was: truthful, self-controlled, mind and the senses, and then tolerant, very simple life, full of knowledge, practical application of knowledge in life and full faith in God. These are ideal character. But such men are not available at the present moment. So therefore the social idealism is defective. Just like in your body, there are four divisions. The head, the arm, the belly and the leg. If the head is spoiled then you are a madman. In spite of possessing hands and bellies and legs, you cannot work properly. So at the present moment the heads are spoiled. Therefore the whole world is in chaotic condition. People, advanced in education, still they are inimical, one man to another. If you are passing on in the street, the gentleman's house there is a signboard, "Beware of the dogs. Don't come in," because he cannot believe anyone. You go to the airport, any high-class standard man. They search out the pocket. So nobody is believable. So this is the result of modern education. You cannot find out an ideal character man.

Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

C. Hennis: Are you saying that they do more work?

Yogeśvara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: No. Do work intelligently. Not that to be very hard-working like ass, without any intelligence. Just like ass is the most hard-working animal, but it has no intelligence. You see? So we don't want that. We want working with intelligence. That is difference.

C. Hennis: Well, as I said, to that extent we do try to improve a man's understanding, a man's understanding of the world, and I agree it's the developed world, the industrialized world, and the...

Prabhupāda: But if he has no brain, if he is not guided by the brain, or if he has no brain, so what is the understanding? Understanding is "I have got money. Now let me drink," that's all. There must be...

C. Hennis: First of all, you can't force a man to be governed by his brain either. You can't force a man to use his brains.

Prabhupāda: Therefore brain is... The United Nation, how the world society should keep a class of men who act as brain and guide everyone so that everyone becomes happy.

Room Conversation with Robert Gouiran, Nuclear Physicist from European Center for Nuclear Research -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa:

mamaivāṁśo jīva-loke

jīva-bhūtaḥ sanātanaḥ

manaḥ ṣaṣṭhānīndriyāṇi

prakṛti-sthāni karṣati

(BG 15.7)

"The living entities in this conditioned world are My eternal, fragmental parts. Due to conditioned life, they are struggling very hard with the six senses, which include the mind."

Prabhupāda: Yes. So we are samples of God, small particles. Just like gold, big gold mine and a small particle of gold. Both of them are gold. Composition is the same. So we, the small particle of God, we are trying to create here so many things. The creating energy is there. Because we are a small particle of God, very small, so we have got so much energy, and we are planning so many things. Because on account of that creative energy. So you can just imagine how much creative energy has got the Supreme Lord, of whom we are little samples. We are little sample only, part and parcel, very small particle. So we are creating by our mind... Manaḥ ṣaṣṭhānīndriyāṇi. By our senses and mind, we are so many things planning. You are also working in the laboratory with that senses and mind. But you are the creative energy. So the struggle is that we are planning to become happy within this material world. That is described here: manaḥ ṣaṣṭhānīndriyāṇi prakṛti-sthāni karṣati (BG 15.7). Karṣati is simply struggling. That's all.

Room Conversation with M. Lallier, noted French Poet -- June 12, 1974, Paris:

Yogeśvara: He says he thinks that Indian philosophy is the highest in the world, but he finds it difficult to understand.

Prabhupāda: Hmm. You call Bhagavān. We are talking of philosophy. Then let them hear.

Pṛthu Putra: He said it is very hard to applicate this spiritual philosophy in our modern world.

Prabhupāda: Call Karandhara also. You also hear the philosophy. So what is that philosophy?

Nitāi: He's talking about the Vedānta philosophy, that he is studying, but... He thinks it's the highest, but he finds it very hard to understand and apply.

Prabhupāda: So which part he finds very, very hard to understand?

M. Lallier: I think the relation between the, the, the body, material body and the ātmā...

Yogeśvara: The soul?

M. Lallier: The soul, soul. The relation between the two parts...

Bhagavān: To apply the fact that the soul exists and the body exists? How to practically apply that difference between the body and the soul?

M. Lallier: Yes.

Bhagavān: Is that what you...?

M. Lallier: And the relation between the two parts, between body and soul.

Bhagavān: In other words, you recognize that there's difference between body and soul, and how to practically apply it?

M. Lallier: I think, perhaps, there is some peoples for whom there is no difference between the soul and body.

Prabhupāda: Who says?

M. Lallier: Oh, spiritual masters.

Prabhupāda: Who's that spiritual master, says soul and the...

M. Lallier: Oh, I don't know very... I think you are one of them. Or...?

Prabhupāda: No, we don't say. We say spirit soul is different from the body. Just like you are living, staying in this room. The room and you are two separate things. Because you are staying in the room, it does not mean you are room, or the room is your self. Does it mean?

M. Lallier: Yes.

Morning Walk -- June 13, 1974, Paris:

Yogeśvara: It's sometimes very hard to feel a compassion for others when we ourselves are still feeling so much contaminated.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Yogeśvara: We, in the neophyte stage, we're feeling ourselves so much attacked by māyā that sometimes it's very difficult...

Prabhupāda: Therefore those who do not take risk, they do not remain within this material world. They go to the Himalaya, go to the forest. They are afraid of being contaminated. But more liberal devotees, they take the risk and "Never mind, I shall go to hell. Let me do something for Kṛṣṇa. Let others may understand something of Kṛṣṇa." That is their, mean magnanimity, taking the risk of going to hell, still, giving the information, "Just try to understand Kṛṣṇa." So such persons are exalted. Because they are taking their own risk to serve Kṛṣṇa. That at least one man may understand Kṛṣṇa. And others, they are flying, flying away, fleeing away, "No, no. We are not going to take risk."

Room Conversation -- June 20, 1974, Germany:

Devotee: Mamaivāṁśo jīva-loke jīva-bhūtaḥ sanātanaḥ, manaḥ sasthanindriyani prakṛti-sthani karsati (BG 15.7). "The living entities in this conditioned world are My eternal, fragmental parts. Due to conditioned life, they are struggling very hard with the six senses, which include the mind."

Prabhupāda: That is the position of the conditioned souls that they are struggling for existence. Instead of finding out how to come to the original consciousness and that is struggle. Kṛṣṇa means love. So everyone is struggling hard how to reach the platform of love. So many institutions-philanthropic, international, United Nations. The only attempt, how to love each other. But they'll struggle, they'll not attain the platform, simply struggle. There have been so many attempts, even the favorite example, the United Nations. How much they are doing and people have got the idea of philanthropism, countryism, communism, communityism, this ism, that ism. The only thing is they are trying to come to the platform of love.

Morning Walk at Marina del Rey -- July 14, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Peacock. Peacock also.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They swallow the...

Prabhupāda: Peacock also, they can digest.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They can swallow the very hard peas.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: And they can digest very easily.

Prabhupāda: (loud waves) ...I have seen.

Bali Mardana: According to Vedic culture, is seaweed edible?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Bali Mardana: Seaweed? Is that edible?

Prabhupāda: I don't find. Why they should eat seaweed?

Bali Mardana: In Asia, many people eat seaweed. Certain types of plants that grow in the sea.

Prabhupāda: No, no.

Room Conversations -- September 10, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Youth.

Devotee (1): Yeah, that she was living very poorly, and her father had to work all day very hard as a goldsmith or tinsmith. And how she remembers her mother, that she was kept in such poor conditions that all her life she was very miserable. And she said that she was thinking that her mother might have been a great poet or a great scientist, but because of being oppressed by the higher class of Russia that she could not develop, she simply was forced to live a very poor life. So I was able to understand that actually they are thinking that being oppressed by the higher classes, the lower class cannot properly develop their qualities.

Prabhupāda: That is a fact. But this higher class and lower class will continue to exist. Even it is existing in communistic countries. That cannot..., you cannot stop in this material world. The tendency is that everyone is thinking that he shall be the best enjoyer, best enjoyer. So this is called struggle for existence. Naturally, this higher class and lower class will remain. You cannot stop it. Even in communistic country, this Khrushchev was driven away. He was taking all advantages for his family, for himself. As soon as he got the post, he misused it. He gave his son-in-law very big post, his family members. That was detected, and he was charged that "You are using your influence, nepotism." Therefore, he was driven away. So this natural tendency, as soon as one gets power, he will try to utilize it. This psychology you cannot stop in the material world. That is not possible. That sacrificing spirit, that "My life is dedicated to Kṛṣṇa," then it is possible. Otherwise, as soon as one will get some position and power, he will try to utilize it for his personal benefit. How you can stop it? It is like if you try to make the lion nonviolent. Is it possible? Why lion? Even an ant is violent.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Canadian Ambassador to Iran -- March 13, 1975, Iran:

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Nitai:

mamaivāṁśo jīva-loke

jīva-bhūtaḥ sanātanaḥ

manaḥ-ṣaṣṭhānīndriyāṇi

prakṛti-sthāni karṣati

(BG 15.7)

"The living entities in this conditioned world are My eternal, fragmental parts. Due to conditioned life they are struggling very hard with the six senses, which include the mind."

Prabhupāda: That is the position of the conditioned soul. They are struggling for existence. Existence means finding out how to come to the original consciousness, and that is struggle. Kṛṣṇa means "love," so everyone is struggling hard how to be in the platform of love. So many institution-philanthropy, international and the United Nation—the only attempt: how to love each other. But they are struggling. They have not attained the platform, simply struggling. There have been so many attempts to unite. The vivid example is the United Nation. Formerly that was League of Nation. And people are manufacturing ideas, philanthropism and altruism, Communism, communityism, this ism, that ism. The only thing is, they are trying to come to the platform of love. But they are manufacturing their own way. The Kṛṣṇa solves, that "Not in this way. Simply make Me center, and the whole thing will be done." But that they will not do. They will do in their own way, concocting some idea. And your idea will clash with me; my idea will clash with you. So same struggle continues, that's all. The Communist will not agree with the others, or capitalists, and capitalists will not agree with the Communists. But they are struggling to come to that point, the platform of love.

Meeting with GBC -- March 31, 1975, Mayapur:

Brahmānanda: You want to expand this point of moving temples, rather than permanent temples?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Moving temple means through bus, going from one place to another. That is better. From one temple, they go from village to village, town to town. That will be nice. Caitanya Mahāprabhu personally did not establish any temple. He was moving. Is it not? So that's all right. We should be very much cautious to establish a new center. And if one establishes, he cannot close it. This should be the principle. Yes. Don't whimsically open a temple and close next day. No. Don't do that. If once established, it must be maintained, at any cost.

Satsvarūpa: So the question that Mahendra asked was... (break)

Prabhupāda: ...He was converting all his sons to be sannyāsīs. So he cursed him that: "You cannot stay anywhere more than three minutes." That's it.

Brāhmaṇana: Prabhupāda, you also show that example.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Brahmānanda: You're also showing that example.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Although there is no restriction, still I do not stay more than three weeks even.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It's very hard to keep you in one place.

Satsvarūpa: I'll read on. The next day's...

Brahmānanda: There's a question over here... (end)

Conversation with Devotees on Theology -- April 1, 1975, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: It is said there?

Pañcadraviḍa: He said to that effect, yes. He said, "Your argument about a fisherman community is not completely valid."

Prajāpati: There's always a differentiation we must make between a Christian, who we might meet and engage in argument, and the theologian himself. The theologian is a very oily character, very hard to pin down. The Christian, he may have specific beliefs, dogmatic, tenaciously holding to dogma, but the theologian, he-

Acyutānanda: Well what does that...? What do they say?

Prajāpati: The theologians?

Acyutānanda: Yes.

Prajāpati: They are simply word-jugglers. They are not held nearly so tight to...

Acyutānanda: Well, then, what's some of the things they invent?

Prajāpati: Well, one we were bringing up is that theology is a means that faithful men are coming to understand themselves, not that are approaching God. One approaches God within a community and within...

Prabhupāda: That a faithful man understands God, that we say. Then what is the basic principle of theology? Why this separate science has been established as "theology"? Logy means science.

Morning Walk -- May 8, 1975, Perth:

Paramahaṁsa: Still, even after you went to America and brought back so many European and American disciples, still the Indians are so slow to come and join.

Prabhupāda: Because they have been... The disease is very chronic. They are not opulent. That diagnosis already given. They have become poverty-stricken. So daridra-doṣa guṇa naśe. Although they are born in India, they have got many qualification, due to this poverty-stricken position, they... Their first business is how to... Because they have got family attachment, so they cannot sacrifice. They will work very, very hard. You have seen how they are going to office, how..., because they have got the responsibility of family. That is Indians another feature. They take family responsibility. In your country there is no such thing. There is no family. There is no family responsibility. In India still that old tradition is going on. Therefore they cannot sacrifice the family responsibility, although they are willing. And the whole thing is it is due to poverty-stricken position. They have got family responsibilities. They think, "If I go, then whole family will starve. How can I go?" That is the exact position. And to come to that stage, that "Let my family starve, I don't mind," that is very higher stage. That is sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66), "Oh, no responsibility, simply I have got respons..." That is not ordinary stage. You cannot expect these things from ordinary man.

Room Coversation with Psychiatrist and Indian Boy -- May 12, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: So not getting job?

Indian boy: Jobs are very scarce in Perth. We've been trying very hard, but so far, it's no go.

Prabhupāda: So here we have no arrangement. Huh?

Śrutakīrti: No. Here there's no arrangement. In Sydney or Melbourne there would be some facility.

Prabhupāda: New Delhi you were born? How long you have come?

Indian boy: I was just nine months old when we left Delhi.

Prabhupāda: So Australia, they are inviting people to come here for working, but how is that? They do not get job?

Paramahaṁsa: They are not in control. There is a jobless rate, unemployment. They call it unemployment. It goes out of control. Sometimes people lose their jobs, and they can't find a job. But the government is not able to control the economy very well. All over the world this happens. So sometimes people try to get a job and they can't get the job.

Prabhupāda: There is enough jobs if the government arranges to engage them in growing food. But there is no such arrangement.

Room Conversation with Ganesa dasa's Mother and Sister -- May 14, 1975, Perth:

Mother: You've got a hard job ahead of you, then.

Prabhupāda: Ah, yes, very hard job. But everyone can become first class if he likes.

Mother: If they want to.

Sister: This is similar to many views of psychologists who believe in self-actualization.

Prabhupāda: Belief is different thing and fact is one thing.

Sister: Philosophi..., or, say, hypothesize that you can reach self-actualization.

Prabhupāda: Belief is no good. I believe. You may believe something wrong. That is not... You must know the fact. That is wanted.

Mother: But a person knows if they're doing wrong always.

Prabhupāda: If you are educated in a wrong way, then you will do wrong.

Mother: But I mean a person knows when they're doing wrong. They know when they're doing evil.

Prabhupāda: No, they cannot understand. They are sometimes doing wrong thing as right thing. So many wrong things they are doing. One has to suffer. Nature will not excuse. (Pause)

Gaṇeśa: You have some more questions to ask Śrīla Prabhupāda? I think they have finished, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Give them prasādam.

Room Conversation with Alcohol and Drug Hospital People -- May 16, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: The prakṛti, material nature. That is said here. Just like for begetting a child, both the father and mother requires. So the material nature is the mother, and God is the father. So so many forms of life are coming from the womb of material nature. This body is made of matter. This body is earth, water, air, fire, like that. This is made of... But I am the soul. That is from God. I am part and parcel of God, as soul. Mamaivāṁśo jīva-bhūtaḥ. Find out.

Paramahaṁsa:

mamaivāṁśo jīva-loke

jīva-bhūtaḥ sanātanaḥ

manaḥ ṣaṣṭhānīndriyāṇi

prakṛti-sthāni karṣati

(BG 15.7)

"Translation. The living entities in this conditional world are My eternal, fragmental parts. Due to conditioned life, they are struggling very hard with the six senses, which include the mind."

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest (2): Is there an animal soul, Swami?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Because it is already said, sarva-yoniṣu, "all forms of life." Even ant, tree, birds, plant, trees, everything. There are 8,400,000 forms of life. All of them, the soul is there. And they have got different... Just like you are differently dressed, I am differently dressed, but you are also soul, I am also soul.

Room Conversation with Two Lawyers and Guest -- May 22, 1975, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: No, what changing? They are preparing for war again. Where is changing? A slight provocation, there may be war.

Guest 1: Yes, but people are changing now. You're getting the young people who for the first time in years are becoming aware and are getting interested in things outside their own town, their own individual state or whatever it is they have. You have people, the young people now are getting interested in things like poverty, they're interested in Bangladesh and so on. This is good. But you nonetheless have a very large proportion of the people who have got that idea of, "I'm all right, and I'll look after mine without taking the overall picture into account." And I think that so long as you have different concepts, different beliefs, it's going to be very hard to get into what you're talking about.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is to be united first, that... First thing is that everyone should be convinced or understand clearly that everything belongs to God. But they have no conception of God even. That is the difficulty. The whole human society at the present moment, majority, they are Godless, especially the Communists. They don't acknowledge. The scientist, the philosopher, the scholars—all Godless. Scientists' special business is how to defy God. They say, "Science is everything. We can do everything by science." There is no need of God. Huh?

Room Conversation with Two Lawyers and Guest -- May 22, 1975, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Good night. Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Guest 1: I think you must be very happy to see what's happened in Melbourne.

Prabhupāda: Yes, I am very happy. This house is quite suitable for our purpose.

Guest 1: They looked very hard and for a long time.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest 1: And they had a lot of difficulty. This is one of the things that I imagine, you know, the story that the Catholic Church, Roman Catholic Church owned this property. And it was almost by devious means that it was acquired.

Prabhupāda: They did not want to give us?

Guest 1: He didn't want to sell direct, like that. Because that beautiful building across there, I think you saw photos...

Amogha: The convent. Śrīla Prabhupāda went through the convent.

Prabhupāda: Oh yes.

Room Conversation with Two Lawyers and Guest -- May 22, 1975, Melbourne:

Amogha: The convent. Śrīla Prabhupāda went through the convent.

Prabhupāda: Oh yes.

Guest 1: They, we found out or the suggestion was... Because there were little power groups in that church that possibly the senior people don't know about, but they objected for some reason, which is very hard to understand.

Prabhupāda: In London we wanted to purchase one church that was not working. In London. But when we approached that priest, the in-charge, not directly to me but one of my disciples, he informed him that "I shall better set fire in this church. Still, I shall not give to the Kṛṣṇa consciousness."

Guest 1: That's one reason that the main religion has possibly become bad in the eyes of non-religious people when they hear something like that. Because you could assume that whatever religion, if a person was religious...

Prabhupāda: Religion means God. God is one.

Morning Walk -- June 23, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: No, amongst the mass of people in India, still there is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. It is not vanished. Because by culture, by taking birth in India that is inherent. India is so great.

Indian guest: The one problem over there: it's very hard to find a pure devotee or real...

Prabhupāda: Because their leaders have gone dead. The leaders are Jawaharlal Nehru and company.

Indian guest: They have destroyed. The Nehru family has destroyed India. He was atheist.

Prabhupāda: Even Gandhi, even Gandhi.

Indian guest: Gandhi believed in God, but Nehru didn't believe in God.

Prabhupāda: No, no, he does not know that Kṛṣṇa is God. Everyone believes in God. That is another thing, but one must know who is God. That is advancement. Here also, the people say, "God, God is great." But as soon God comes, "Here I have come," they don't believe it.

Morning Walk -- June 26, 1975, Los Angeles:

Bahulāśva: Last night?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Bahulāśva: Dr. Mize.

Prabhupāda: Dr. Mize? So what does he say?

Bahulāśva: He said that he could give up the greed, but the lust was a very hard one for him to give up.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) Yes.

Dharmadhyaksa: He wanted to become more unselfish, but he didn't know how he could give up lust.

Prabhupāda: No, that can be done. If you increase your Kṛṣṇa consciousness, love for Kṛṣṇa, then you will forget this lust.

Dharmadyaksa: That's what we told him, that he must chant.

Prabhupāda: That is the only. That is the only. There is no other second way. (break) ...conquer over lust, one has to take shelter of Madana-mohana. Madana means lust, Cupid, and Kṛṣṇa is Madana-mohana. He can enchant the Cupid also. (break) ...Ṭhākura, young man. At dead of night the prostitute came. How he restrained? That is... One who has realized Madana-mohana, for him these things are nothing, no enchantment.

Morning Walk -- July 16, 1975, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: Now it is very peaceful, fall down and finish. That's all. Suicide.

Dharmādhyakṣa: The reason they say that people are committing suicide is there is not enough meaning in life, and there's not enough meaning in life because the capitalists are exploiting all the people and making people work very, very hard.

Prabhupāda: But they have meaning, life. You have no meaning, but they have meaning. Some section have meaning. They are accusing capitalist. So they have meaning. Why you say there is no meaning? You have no meaning. You have no money—you have no meaning. (laughter)

Dharmādhyakṣa: That is their feeling, that if everyone had equal...

Prabhupāda: No, therefore you cannot say life has no meaning. You have no meaning, but others may have. You cannot say, generalization, that life has no meaning.

Morning Walk -- July 18, 1975, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: No, war is going on. But they are so senseless that they will not come to this, so rascal. Therefore they are described as mūḍha, all rascals.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Very hard to preach to these fools, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: These people are so stupid, it is very difficult to preach to them.

Prabhupāda: (chuckles) No, chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. That will be...

Dhīra Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, we are hearing from you and your books that we will die, and we must learn to face these problems as you mentioned, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi (BG 13.9), but still, even as your disciples, we are not so convinced.

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Dhīra Kṛṣṇa: Because we've been brought up in a culture where we've been taught that we will never die. Particularly in America we never even see death here.

Prabhupāda: You think you will not die?

Dhīra Kṛṣṇa: I know I will, but how can we realize that, come to the platform of realizing?

Prabhupāda: Everyone is dying, your father is dying, your mother is dying, your friend is dying, and still if you cannot understand, then how it will be possible to make you understand? Every day you see so many people are dying.

Car Conversation -- August 3, 1975, Detroit:

Brahmānanda: America is now selling wheat to Russia again.

Prabhupāda: Oh. And what exchange they are getting?

Brahmānanda: I don't know how they pay for it. They pay for it in dollars.

Prabhupāda: Now they are no more enemies?

Brahmānanda: They are trying very hard to be friends.

Prabhupāda: Who is trying more? America?

Brahmānanda: I think so.

Ambarīṣa: Yes. They just had a big conference in Finland. They all signed... All the heads of state of the Western countries signed a document saying that they would respect each others' boundaries.

Prabhupāda: Russian boundary, American boundary meets there. What is that? The corner?

Jagadīśa: Alaska?

Prabhupāda: Alaska. That boundary? No.

Brahmānanda: No. This is in regards to Europe, isn't it?

Jagadīśa: Eastern Europe. America finally agreed to recognize that...

Prabhupāda: East Berlin.

Morning Walk -- October 16, 1975, Johannesburg:

Prabhupāda: Cheat?

Harikeśa: In a system of bartering it's very hard to cheat.

Prabhupāda: Yes. There is no cheating. Everyone is simply simple, honest. And here the government begins cheating. He is engaging you to hard work day and night and paying you a piece of paper, where it is written "one hundred dollars." That's all. This is your society, cheating and cheater. That's all.

Harikeśa: People have a hard time understanding that point, because with a hundred dollar note you can buy things.

Prabhupāda: Therefore I say you are all rascals. You do not know. If I say, the government may arrest me that I am infusing people in a different way. But that is the fact.

Harikeśa: So a government's duty would be to abolish this false standard of money, and then automatically...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Government's only duty is that government gives me land and I pay tax: "Whatever I produce, take one fourth." Finish. All taxes. If I don't produce, there is no tax. That's all. That is the business between the government and the public. That's all.

Morning Walk -- October 19, 1975, Johannesburg:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Rest means lazy; you don't work.

Indian man (1): If one works five days a week, you rest for two...

Prabhupāda: That is another thing. You have to work to become lazy. (laughter) That is another thing. But the goal is to become lazy. You work five days very hard just to become lazy for two days. That's all. So if you have got means to become seven days lazy, you'll prefer it.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But I think people would... Most people would go crazy if they didn't have any work.

Prabhupāda: No, that means their life is not properly conducted. And therefore the word laziness has come. Laziness is not actually the word. Laziness means minimizing the bodily labor and engaged in spiritual work. If you ask people, "Please come to our temple," who is coming? Because he says, "I have no time." But we are not working hard. So real aim of life is to... In German, I think, or somewhere there is classification: "Lazy intelligent, busy intelligent, lazy fool, and busy fool." So at the present moment (laughs) the whole world is full of busy fools. But the first-class man, he is lazy intelligent. Lazy and intelligent, that is first-class man. And second-class man, busy intelligent. And third class means lazy fool and fourth class means busy fool. When the fools are busy... Just like nowadays they are busy but they are fools. Like monkey, he is very busy. You see? And they prefer to be generation of monkey, busy fool. That's all. Fools, when he is busy, he is simply creating havoc. That's all. Better... Lazy fool is better than him because he will not create so much harm, but this busy fool will simply create harm. And first class-man is lazy intelligent. He knows the value of life, and soberly he is thinking. Just like all our great saintly persons. They were living in the forest, meditation, tapasya, and writing books. All, you will find, lazy intelligent. They are first-class men.

Morning Walk -- October 21, 1975, Johannesburg:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Mutual praising society. That's all. "I praise you and you praise me. I say you are very big; you say I am very big." That's all. And compromise. "I don't criticize you; you don't criticize me." That's all. (break) In the womb the child got life and when the... Sometimes some child comes, stunt. By process again he cries. So why the dead child is not brought into life by that? What do you call dead?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Stillborn. Still. When it's born dead.

Prabhupāda: So... No, no. How the life came? How it became dead? This is eucalyptus, very hard. Eucalyptus?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: It has smell.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Very hard. No need. (break) ...question, ask them that in the egg there is no life, and the life is coming by what is called? Fermenta... No?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Fertilization?

Prabhupāda: Fertilization or... No, giving the heat?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Incubation.

Prabhupāda: Incubation. So why don't you make such egg and put it into incubation?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: We challenge them like that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Then why you are talking nonsense that there is no life? Why you are depending on other life for giving you the egg? So this theory that life comes from chemical, so where it is true? Life is coming from the ... a life.

Morning Walk -- December 16, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Sa guṇān samatītyaitān brahma-bhūyāya kalpate (BG 14.26). We have to transcend all these guṇas, and that is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Now they are realizing even in Western countries...

Dr. Patel: But they will realize (Hindi). They will learn it by...

Prabhupāda: (Hindi, makes Patel laugh) Kṛṣṇa juta maro ha mam kavi ne jan...

Dr. Patel: (laughing heartily) ...you are very hard...

Prabhupāda: What is the meaning of vihāya? (Hindi)

Dr. Patel: We tolerate everything. (more Hindi) The whole civilization, the modern civilization, is wholly at fault. Unfortunate. And that is the schools we are sending our children to, and these are the public schools.

Prabhupāda: (Hindi about the Gurukula in Vṛndāvana)

Dr. Patel: They're getting (indistinct) of knowledge, after all they will (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: We are opening gurukula, but who will give? A gentleman will not give. Hare Kṛṣṇa! (man stops and Patel introduces him)

Conversation on Roof -- December 26, 1975, Sanand:

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Haṁsadūta: It would make a good article, what you've just spoken.

Prabhupāda: So write.

Harikeśa: You so completely destroy the opposition, it's very hard to say anything more.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That you have to prove. You can eulogize your Guru Mahārāja, but you have to learn it and face the public and be strong to defend yourself. That is success. Not by praising your Guru Mahārāja. You'll praise your Guru Mahārāja. That is not very difficult. But be victorious to the opposing elements. Then you will praise your Guru Mahārāja nicely. At home, you can praise your Guru Mahārāja, and Guru Mahārāja be satisfied, "Oh, my disciples are praising me." That is not very.... That is good. Respectful. That is the qualification. But you have to fight. Then your Guru Mahārāja will be glorified.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 13, 1976, Calcutta:

Prabhupāda: Which Śāstrījī?

Jayapatāka: That you preached to last year at the festival time. There were seven śāstrīs, four of which came to Māyāpur, three of which blooped. One is still left. He is very eager to become initiated. He is very hard working and sincere.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What does he do there?

Jayapatāka: He is teaching Sanskrit to the devotees.

Prabhupāda: Very nice.

Jayapatāka: He is teaching the meter, how to chant them, to all the Western devotees and to the...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Who's here?

Jayapatāka: I never had time to go. Bhāvananda knows. (break) ...the Bengali language also. We have one copy at Māyāpur. If we have a festival here in Calcutta with a Bengali film, many people can appreciate it. Of course, English they also.... That first paṇḍāl, we didn't have any movie then.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Jayapatāka: Those first paṇḍāls we never had a cinema.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Jayapatāka: Only kīrtana. (end)

Morning Walks -- January 22-23, 1976, Mayapura:

Harikeśa: On the earth.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Then in Tretā-yuga one-fourth diminished. And then Dvāpara-yuga, half diminished. And in Kali-yuga, three-fourth diminished. Seventy-five per cent are all rogues, and twenty-five per cent... That is expected, but that is now diminishing. They are all rogues with the advancement of Kali-yuga. Mandāḥ sumanda-matayo manda-bhāgyā hy upadrutāḥ (SB 1.1.10). Therefore there is no other method to save them. Harer nāmaiva kevalam. This is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's gift. Incorrigible. Everyone will be incorrigible. Only hope is Hare Kṛṣṇa. The whole Vedic system is to make human being correct. Being incorrect, they are suffering in this material world repetition of birth, death. Sometimes man, sometimes dog. So to correct him so that he comes to his original position, Kṛṣṇa conscious, and go back to home. This is the whole Vedic civilization, to correct him. Therefore it is called saṁskāra. Saṁskāra means correction. Saṁskārād bhaved dvijaḥ. Veda-pāṭhād bhaved vipro brahma jānātīti brāhmaṇaḥ.(?)To correct him and bring him to the brahminical stage. From pig stage to brahminical stage. This is Vedic civilization. Everyone is like pig in this material world. Therefore Ṛṣabhadeva says, "Now don't live like pig." Nāyaṁ deho deha-bhājāṁ nṛloke kaṣṭān kāmān arhate viḍ-bhujāṁ ye: (SB 5.5.1) "Now, you, My children... " He was advising, instructing His son that "Now this life is not to live like pig." This is the first instruction, because everyone is more or less pig, living like pig. Pig means he has no discrimination of eating and he has no discrimination of sex. That is pig. And everyone is like that. No discrimination of eating, especially in the Western. And no discrimination of sex. Pigs. Big pig or small pig, that's all. So Ṛṣabhadeva says, "Now My dear sons, don't spoil your life living like pigs." Nāyaṁ deho deha-bhājāṁ nṛloke. Nṛloke means "In the human society you should not live like pig and very hard labor." So the whole civilization at the present moment they want to live like pig, and to live like pig they are working like an ass. And that is civilization, working like ass to become a pig. You tell them!

Morning Walk -- February 19, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: That is independence. That is independence. In spite of all these things, because you have got little independence, you can violate.

Sudāmā: It is very hard thing to understand.

Prabhupāda: No, it is not difficult. It is not difficult.

Acyutānanda: It is not difficult. They don't want to understand.

Prabhupāda: Because you are part and parcel of God, God has got full independence, but you have got little independence, proportionately, because you are part and parcel.

Acyutānanda: No, their idea is that they want to blame God for their predicament, like a bad child, you know, says, "Well you made me do it."

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- March 15, 1976, Mayapura:

Siddha-svarūpa: If their main leader, Mao Tse Tung.... He's more of that school, but there are.... They call them revisionists. They say they're like the Russians, and that they're just.... They're always attacking them for wanting to copy the West. It's their same attack. They attack the Russians for becoming capitalists. They're puritan. They're trying to have pure communism. They have very great ideals, and the other school wants.... They think that they want to get in on the action of the trade and industrialization. But they are actually about equal in power. It's interesting. Right now, actually, it's very hard to get into China because there's a new feud that has come to the surface. There's top leaders that have been taken through the streets, denounced as being materialists, and they've taken their clothes from their wives' closets with mink coats and fancy clothes...

Prabhupāda: No, first of all.... We shall first of all try to sell our books without any discussion. "As trade..., as trade representative, we have come. See our book." Go to the professors, go to the.... "We have got this support," like that.

Siddha-svarūpa: As Vedic culture.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Only for selling book.

Room Conversation -- April 4, 1976, Vrndavana:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Some of our brahmacārīs, they've been drafted into the army. We've lost several devotees like that, because it's very hard for them to maintain their Kṛṣṇa consciousness in the army.

Prabhupāda: Conscription.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes, conscription. But the Indians are not drafted. There's no army for them. So we're hoping that in Durban, where you first preached at the City Hall, the young people there, if we can get them sufficiently enthused, that they'll also join, and then we'll be able to have a very big movement amongst Indian community as well. We won't lose any devotees like that from the draft.

Prabhupāda: I think our students who are going to be ministers, they are excused from draft.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: No, even in South Africa the ministers.... No excuse. It's a very strict situation. If you don't go into the army, you go to jail. Even if you're a minister, they don't care. There is no religious grounds for objecting. But only the Europeans are in the army, no one else. They're afraid that if the Indians had guns, they might use them against the Europeans.

Devotee: So we're going to try and make more devotees this year, more Indian devotees especially. We've never really tried before.

Jagat-guru: Also, Śrīla Prabhupāda, you have seen on our altar, Gaura-Nitāi? We have large Gaura-Nitāi and two small, three actually, three small sets of Gaura-Nitāi Deities. The ones on the far left, just under Lord Nityānanda's feet, They are going also to South Africa. They came originally from East Africa. I mentioned it when I first came to Māyāpur(?). So we will be taking them. We have a very nice siṁhāsana built for Them, finished tomorrow, and we'll be displaying Them at all our programs, preaching programs.

Prabhupāda: Do the needful. That's all.

Room Conversation -- April 23, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: And you should not kill. But all the Christians are killing.

Guest (3): Well...

Prabhupāda: And it is very hard to find out a woman chaste.

Guest (3): That's true.

Prabhupāda: Then where is Christian?

Guest (3): Well, see, this is the great thing of the atonement. See, when Christ suffered the sins of the world on Gethsemane...

Prabhupāda: So why for your sin Christ should suffer?

Guest (3): Christ suffered for my sins.

Prabhupāda: Yes, why?

Guest (3): Well, because he loved us and he was the only begotten son of God.

Prabhupāda: That means you'll go on committing sins and Christ will suffer?

Room Conversation -- April 23, 1976, Melbourne:

Guest (2): Of glory and perfection.

Prabhupāda: No, no, how do you glorify the flesh and bone? It is very hard? It is very nice to eat? Is that glorification?

Guest (2): It's not difficult, I don't.... My feeling.... God...

Prabhupāda: You don't bring your feeling. I mean to say, you must bring scriptural order. How do you glorify flesh and bone?

Guest (2): Well, Christ brought that about in the resurrection, when he was resurrected.

Prabhupāda: How do you say? Practically say that how you glorify a lump of flesh and piece of bone? That is my question. What is the glorification of a lump of flesh and a piece of bone?

Guest (2): God can do it. That's all I can say.

Prabhupāda: You cannot do it. Can?

Guest (2): I cannot.

Prabhupāda: Then?

Guest (2): But God can.

Prabhupāda: Then we do not...

Devotee (4): The question is, "How can we glorify God if He's made of flesh and bone?"

Room Conversation -- May 1, 1976, Fiji:

Prabhupāda: ...The Lord then said, (Hindi:) ...bhagavān diya(?). This.... (break)

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Mamaivāṁśo jīva-loke (BG 15.7). 15.7.

Guru-kṛpā: "The living entities in this conditional world are My eternal, fragmental parts. Due to conditioned life, they are struggling very hard with the six senses, which include the mind."

Prabhupāda: So with this instrument he's manipulating this machine, as exactly the pilot, with so many electronics, machine, he's working the flying of the plane. Where is the difficulty to understand? And this is, body is a machine. Bhrāmayan sarva-bhū.... Bhrāmayan, wandering. The aeroplane is wandering. This machine is wandering. It is also going. Ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti sattva-sthāḥ. Sometimes up, sometimes down. Huh? Find out this. (devotees look for verse) Same aeroplane, going up and down. Two wings, this hand, like this.

Morning Walk -- May 3, 1976, Fiji:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: ...circumstance there for someone who's endeavoring very hard for material necessities?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Someone who is endeavoring very hard for material necessities, is his position the same—faithless?

Prabhupāda: I do not follow.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: One who is going to...

Prabhupāda: Everyone is working hard for material benefit. So why someone? Everyone. Who is not working for material necessities? Āhāra-nidrā-bhaya-maithunaṁ ca saman... If the cats, dogs, human being, everybody is working very hard.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Say, for example, one who is engaged simply in preaching.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: One who is engaged simply in preaching.

Prabhupāda: He's serving Kṛṣṇa. He's not material necessities.

Room Conversation -- May 4, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: That means the little children's policy. Children, just like imagining so many things, "I shall do that. I shall do." The potter's imagination. You know that? Potter's imagination? You do not know the story? One potter is selling earthen pots, and he is saying that "Now, these two paisā, it has cost me one paisā. I shall make one paisā profit. Then I can make such profit. I shall invest again. I shall make another profit, another profit. In this way I shall become millionaire. Then I shall marry, and my wife shall be very obedient. And if (s)he does not become obedient, I shall give him a kick like this." And he, what was.... One pot was there. He kicked that pot and broke. (laughter) It broke. "Oh, again I am poor man." So this is going on, imagination. Imagination.... "I shall become so great that I shall kick Kṛṣṇa's law," and whatever pot he had-broken. That's all. Rascals, simply rascals. If anyone thinks like that, that "I shall surpass the laws of nature," then he's madman. He's madman. So what is the use of dealing with madmen? And as soon as you challenge them that "Show us that you have surpassed the laws of nature," "Yes, we are trying. In future we shall do." That's all. This is their reply. So it is better to avoid such men. But if you peacefully you can introduce, "All right, you will do. You are wonderful men, so kindly if you read some pages of this, it is not very costly. You can keep. At leisure hour you can read," in this way, imploring, then they will be benefited. That much we can do to any rascal. He sādhavaḥ sakalam eva vihāya dūrāt caitanya-candra-caraṇe: "Oh, you are so nice. Therefore I am flattering you. I humbly obeisance. Kindly hear one thing. Keep some books. It is not very costly." Bas. This much you can do. And let them become puffed up by their false notions. But if they keep some books, sometimes they will read or their sons will read. That's all. Therefore I am stressing so much on books, that if the puffed-up rascals take some book and sometimes, if they read, he'll be benefited, perfectly benefited. So distribute these books anywhere possible. It doesn't matter where it is. The same process. Dante nidhāya tṛṇakaṁ padayor nipatya. The books will sell, that "You rascal number one, you set aside whatever learned. Read this." He sādhavaḥ sakalam eva vihāya: "You are very learned, but forget what you have learned, all rascaldom. Try to read this book." Tāvac ca śobhate mūrkho yāvat kiñcin na bhāṣate: "A rascal fool is very beautifully dressed, very nice sitting. But his rascaldom will be disclosed as soon as he will speak." So these rascals, as soon as they speak, "We shall surpass the laws of nature," then we can understand what kind of rascals. Tāvac ca śobhate mūrkhaḥ. By their, these words we can take, "Oh, rascaldom," at once. "I shall break the wall. I shall push the mountain with my head." It is like that. If somebody is thinking that "I shall push the Himalayan mountains by knocking with my head," then we can understand. So where it is? A rascal, the innocent, he is also rascal. But innocent is eager to become intelligent, so there we shall deal. And the stubborn atheists, they are dviṣat. They cannot be corrected immediately, unless they become ruined. (break) ...their standard of life. Try for that. Concentrate in your country. There is no need of going.... I was written, asking you that, that "If it is very hard job, don't try for that, useless waste of time."

Garden Conversation -- June 8, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Next verse.

Hṛdayānanda:

mamaivāṁśo jīva-loke

jīva-bhūtaḥ sanātanaḥ

manaḥ ṣaṣṭhānīndriyāṇi

prakṛti-sthāni karṣati

(BG 15.7)

"The living entities in this conditioned world are My eternal, fragmental parts. Due to conditioned life, they are struggling very hard with the six senses, which include the mind." Purport. "In this verse the identity of the living being is clearly given. The living entity is a fragmental part and parcel of the Supreme Lord-eternally. It is not that he assumes individuality in his conditional life and in his liberated state becomes one with the Supreme Lord. He is eternally fragmented. It is clearly said, sanātana. According to the Vedic version, the Supreme Lord manifests and expands Himself in innumerable expansions, of which the primary expansions are called Viṣṇu-tattva, and the secondary expansions are called the living entities. In other words, the Viṣṇu-tattva is the personal expansion, and the living entities are separated expansions. By His personal expansion, He is manifested in various forms like Lord Rāma, Nṛsiṁha-deva, Viṣṇumūrti and all the predominating Deities in the Vaikuṇṭha planets. The separated expansions, the living entities, are eternally servitors. The personal expansions of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, the individual identities of the Godhead, are always present. Similarly, the separated expansions of living entities have their identities. As fragmental parts and parcels of the Supreme Lord, the living entities have also fragmental qualities, of which independence is one. Every living entity has an individual soul, his personal individuality and a minute form of independence. By misuse of that independence, one becomes a conditioned soul, and by proper use of independence he is always liberated. In either case, he is qualitatively eternal, as the Supreme Lord is. In his liberated state he is freed from this material condition, and he is under the engagement of transcendental service unto the Lord; in his conditioned life he is dominated by the material modes of nature, and he forgets the transcendental loving service of the Lord. As a result, he has to struggle very hard to maintain his existence in the material world. The living entities, not only the human beings and the cats and dogs, but even the greater controllers of the material world—Brahmā, Lord Śiva, and even Viṣṇu—are all parts and parcels of the Supreme Lord. They are all eternal, not temporary manifestations. The word karṣati (struggling or gappling hard) is very significant. The conditioned soul is bound up, as though shackled by iron chains. He is bound up by the false ego, and the mind is the chief agent which is driving him in this material existence. When the mind is in the mode of goodness, his activities are good."

Prabhupāda: Manaḥ ṣaṣṭhānīndriyāṇi prakṛti-sthāni karṣati (BG 15.7). The struggle for existence—this word is used also among the philosophers. This is struggle. He is creating something by the mind, manaḥ, and the senses are engaged according to the dictation of the mind. Manaḥ ṣaṣṭhānīndriyāṇi. In this way, prakṛti-sthāni, within this material world, he's living a life of struggle for existence. Prakṛti-sthāni karṣati. Karṣati means with hardship he's pulling on. Just like an animal yoked with cart, bull, with hardship he's pulling on, but he cannot get out of it. And if he slacks, immediately there is whip, he has to go. Therefore this word is used, karṣati. He doesn't like this, but he has to do it. Struggle for existence, survival of the fittest. (someone enters) Hare Kṛṣṇa. The man may come.

Garden Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: So sleeping is waste of time. Therefore spiritual advancement means minimizing sleeping. Nidrāhāra-vihārakādi-vijitau **. About the Gosvāmīs' life it is said they conquered over nidrā-āhāra. If you eat extraordinarily, then you will sleep also extraordinarily. If you eat frugally, as much minimum required, then you can conquer over sleep. Eating, sleeping. Sleeping depends on eating. Atyāhāra. Atyāhāraḥ prayāsaś ca prajalpo niyamāgrahaḥ (NOI 2). The people in the material world.... Atyāhāra means collecting more than necessity. One, somebody has got millions of dollars; still, he is working hard day and night to increase the bank balance. Why? You have got sufficient money; now you engage your life for spiritual advancement and take little food. God has given you enough. Why you are wasting your time in collecting money and eating more? That is misuse. Therefore Rūpa Gosvāmī says, atyāhāraḥ prayāsaś ca prajalpo niyamāgrahaḥ. Āhāra means eating, and āhāra means collecting. So these are against bhakti principles. Collecting more than necessity or eating more than necessity. Atyāhāraḥ prayāsaś ca prajalpo niyamāgrahaḥ. Prayāsa, things which are not done very easily, I have to endeavor very, very hard, that kind of work should be avoided. Atyāhāraḥ prayāsaś ca prajalpaḥ, and talking nonsense. No use, you are talking together for hours, what is the use? Prajalpa, it is called prajalpa.

Garden Conversation -- June 22, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: You can get it from Māyāpur?

Kīrtanānanda: We got seed, but it won't sprout.

Prabhupāda: Oh, due to the climate.

Kīrtanānanda: We don't know. It is a very hard seed.

Devotee (4): Śrīla Prabhupāda, perhaps the material scientists could help us make the seed sprout.

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Devotee (4): I was thinking earlier how a farmer can put the seed in the ground, but he cannot actually make the seed grow if it is not the will of Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The situation is not favorable. That is the proof that everything is a living entity. If you put the seed... The seed is not the tree, but when you put the seed on the ground, if the situation is favorable, the particular living entity who has to take the form of that tree, he comes, and then it grows. That is the proof. Just like sex. It is not the secretion of the man and the woman. It creates a situation so that the soul may come and live there, and then there is pregnancy. It is not the matter. This is the proof.

Garden Conversation -- June 23, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: That is already explained. But you must be determined how to execute devotional service. Without determined devotional service, how we can attain that position? So what is the use of talking utopian? First business is anartha-nivṛttiḥ syāt. Ādau śraddhā tathaḥ sādhu-saṅgo 'tha bhajana-kriyā tato anartha-nivṛttiḥ syāt. You adopt this means that you have got full faith that "Kṛṣṇa consciousness will save me." Then you live with devotees who are similarly determined. Then you execute devotional service. Then anartha-nivṛttiḥ syāt, you'll be free from all these.... These are the stages. There is.... Up to anartha-nivṛtti, you have to struggle very hard with determination, and then automatically everything will come. Tato niṣṭhā tato rucis tataḥ, athāsaktis tato bhāvaḥ. So before svarūpa, anartha-nivṛtti, don't expect all these.

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Hari-śauri:

mamaivāṁśo jīva-loke

jīva-bhūtaḥ sanātanaḥ

manaḥ sasthanindriyani

prakṛti-sthani karsati

(BG 15.7)

"The living entities in this conditioned world are My eternal, fragmental parts. Due to conditioned life they are struggling very hard with the six senses, which include the mind."

Prabhupāda: So if he's eternal fragmental parts, how he can become one with the whole? The part is never equal to the whole. That is axiomatic truth. This is wrong conception, to become like God. The Māyāvādīs, they are trying to become God. That is impossible. They... Let them remain godly. Godly means servant of God. That will make him perfection, his life perfect. Vaiṣṇava philosophy is to remain, to act as servant of God. That is perfect. And if the servant tries to become like the master, that is artificial. Although in the spiritual world there is no difference between the master and the servant... Just like the boys, Kṛṣṇa's cowherd boy friends, they do not know Kṛṣṇa is God. They are playing with Him on equal terms. When Kṛṣṇa is defeated in the play He has to take His friend on His shoulder and he rides on the shoulder. So there is no such distinction who is God and who is not God. So that is spiritual conception. But the difference is always there. God and the part and parcel. Kṛta-puṇya-puñjāḥ. We can attain that position after many, many lives' pious activities. That is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.

'Life Comes From Life' Slideshow Discussions -- July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Sadāpūta: This slide shows..., these are the laws of nature according to physicists. And the point we make is that this is their understanding of the final cause of things, and it's very limited. Actually, on this one page, these equations describe everything that goes into all the actions and interactions of chemistry according to their present understanding. And, so there are two main points to make about this. Number one, these are very..., these laws describe very simple forces, pushes and pulls between atoms and things like that. And so intuitively it is very hard to imagine why such simple forces should cause anything complex to organize itself together. Now the scientists customarily make the assertion that laws like this are universal, but one thing we can notice is they have no proof of that. These laws which they say are universal are only studied in certain limited experimental situations with inanimate matter, and then they extrapolate and they say that they apply to everything. But actually the equations are so hard to solve even for reasonably simple molecules that they can't actually test out their assertion. So it's actually just a bluffing statement. So in this slide we wanted to point out how limited these laws are, how limited their concept of the laws of nature is. The next slide, according to the scientist's idea, there are two things going on—these laws and also chance. So this is a calculation showing what happens if you just have chance acting to form one of these proteins that Svarūpa Dāmodara was talking about, and you can calculate... Actually here you calculate, suppose you threw a protein together at chance—and here we even allow a ten percent error, you're allowing to get it wrong among ten percent of the proteins—but still chance comes out to ten minus two-hundred-and forty-fourth-power. Now the scientists are always saying if you wait for a long enough time, even something very unlikely can happen; but here we have a calculation of how long you'd have to wait, according to mathematics and the probability theory, and even if you assume an unrealistically high rate of forming proteins at random, still you'd have to wait, according to this, ten to the hundred-and-sixty-seventh-power billion years. And that's a little bit too long. (laughter)

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. That is mathematics.

'Life Comes From Life' Slideshow Discussions -- July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: So that's actually basic in quantum mechanics. So we wanted to present that. Now this slide... There's another line of evidence here. It's the inspiration, and Śrīla Prabhupāda has said that intelligence is the form direction of Supersoul. So it's interesting, it's really striking to observe how various people create things in mathematics and science and art, like that. It's very striking. So we made two examples here. This one is a mathematician names Gauss. He lived in the nineteenth century, and his concern was to solve mathematical problems. The interesting thing is that in a very difficult mathematical problem, the person never solves it by figuring it out consciously, step by step. But what happens is that he tries very hard to figure it out for a long time, and nothing happens, and then all of a sudden the answer comes to him. So it's hard to read that quote. This is a quotation by this Gauss describing how that happened to him.

Evening Darsana -- July 7, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Dr. Sharma: That's why you cannot... An electric bulbs, when they are turned on and off, the light is there, but it is very hard to say where the electrons are flowing into, which...

Bill Sauer: Well in our case, our electrons are flowing from one place, the sun, and the imagery in your magazine is just beautiful. It shows the imagery of the man and the sun, and what we are, scientifically, as you know, (devotees laugh) we are images of sun energy, and this is where electrons come from. And when the sun goes out, we go out, unless we go to another star where there is another sun.

Vipina: Bill, could you explain to Śrīla Prabhupāda how you think life is created?

Bill Sauer: How it is created?

Vipina: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Who is the creator?

Bill Sauer: Well, there is a creative force. The power of life is light, and you say (laughs) Godhead is light, nescience is darkness. I believe it, it's trite and very true, in my understanding.

Vipina: He thinks everything comes from light, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Bill Sauer: Now all the religions refer to God as light. Most of the religions, and science agrees. Light is that very fugitive bit of energy that allows life to be possible.

Prabhupāda: Unless there is fire, wherefrom the light comes?

Bill Sauer: From the fire in the sun.

Prabhupāda: Yes, therefore the fire is the source of light.

Evening Darsana -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Demigod means just like you or me, ordinary living being, but they are very pious. On account of their piety they have got very good post. Just like janma... There are four: to get birth in very high, aristocratic family; to become very learned scholar; to become beautiful in bodily feature. Janmaiśvarya-śruta-śrī (SB 1.8.26): high parentage, birth, to take birth in aristocratic family, in brāhmaṇa family, or very exalted royal family. This is janma. And śruta, to become very learned scholar. Janma, aiśvarya, to become very rich. Janmaiśvarya-śruta, śruta means education, and śrī, bodily beauty. These things are obtained on account of piety, pious activities. And just the opposite, low-class family, lowborn, no money, always poverty-stricken, no education, no bodily beauty, these are the results of impious activities. So the demigods means on account of their pious activities they get the situation in higher planet where the duration of life is ten thousands of years, and their one day is equal to our six months. Such ten thousands of years. Very beautiful body, facilities. There... The other day I was reading about the bodily construction of woman there. They are ever-young, the chest is very hard. (laughs) It is stated, yes. So such class of women is there, and aiśvarya, nandana-kānana, so many things. The roads are paved with pearls and jewels, not these pebbles. In the higher planetary system there is facility for higher standard of material comforts. So they get there birth and enjoy for ten thousand of years. But it is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, kṣīṇe puṇye punar martya-lokaṁ viśanti. As soon as they spend up their resultant action of pious activities, then again drop down, kṣīṇe puṇye punar martya-lokaṁ viśanti. And again begins life from the grass. They fall down with rains, and then they grow as grass. Then evolutional life begins, from plant life to insect life, to insect life to bird's life.

Room Conversation -- July 10, 1976, New York:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, Prabhupāda said the sun is too much. Toṣaṇa Kṛṣṇa, he's been doing all of our, he's practically done the whole arrangement for the Ratha-yātrā. Jayānanda is building, and he has done all of the permits, advertising, publicity, the poster, working at least fifteen hours a day for the last month very hard, to make it a very successful festival. I was thinking, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that Haṁsadūta was telling me that he is planning to make...

Prabhupāda: I think this article was dictated by Haṁsadūta.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Ah.

Prabhupāda: Our interviewer came.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He was telling me that he was planning to make thousands of men, convert thousands of Indians. I was wondering, if thousands of Indians join us, how will the government feel?

Prabhupāda: They cannot check.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Really, they won't stop us.

Prabhupāda: If they want to stop it, it will increase.

Interview with Newsday Newspaper -- July 14, 1976, New York:

Rāmeśvara: No, we're very industrious.

Prabhupāda: We don't sit down idly.

Bali-mardana: God helps those who help themselves.

Prabhupāda: We are not idle preachers, we are working. All, very hard, more than the karmīs.

Rāmeśvara: These men, they go out to engage people in taking our books maybe twelve hours a day sometimes, ten hours a day, without any salary.

Prabhupāda: I am now eighty years old, I am working twenty-four hours. I think I work more than my young disciples (laughter).

Bali-mardana: Oh yes, definitely.

Prabhupāda: I work at night.

Rāmeśvara: It is hard to keep up with Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Hari-śauri: Very difficult.

Prabhupāda: We are not idle creatures.

Conversation After Interview with Religious Editor, Associated Press -- July 16, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is there. Why they think Eastern, Western, Jewish, and...? We are talking of the human being. That is the misunderstanding going on, that this is Hindu religion, Eastern religion. Kṛṣṇa begins from the word dehino 'smin yathā dehe (BG 2.13). Find out this. The rascals are taking Hindu, Muslim, Christian. Dehe, the body, and the inner force of the body, He's beginning His teaching. Where is the question of Hindu, Muslim, Christian and Jewish? Still they are misunderstanding, "This is Hindu."

Bali-mardana: It is very hard for them to understand.

Prabhupāda: This is science. Read that.

Hari-śauri:

dehino 'smin yathā dehe

kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā

tathā dehāntara-prāptir

dhīras tatra na muhyati

(BG 2.13)

Prabhupāda: Now, kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā, boyhood, childhood, youthhood, old age, is it for the Hindus? The Christians do not become child, do not become youth? Ayi. (Hindi)

Hari-śauri: This is Dr. Bhagat.

Prabhupāda: Bhagat. You are from Gujarat?

Dr. Bhagat: Gujarat, yes.

Room Conversation -- July 18, 1976, New York:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He got. I'm sure he must have gotten. Everybody was given free feast. Feast was very good. I tasted it, nicely prepared.

Prabhupāda: How many preparations were there?

Bali-mardana: Very hard to estimate.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How many preparations in the feast? There was halavā, sabji, very good sabji by Ṛṣi Kumāra, rice, sweet, lemonade, popper-six preps. And puri, seven preps.

Prabhupāda: Very nice. Very good preps, sumptuous.

Bali-mardana: Oh, yes. Besides that, we had booths with watermelon, lassi and burfi.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Lassi was selling very big. We could not supply it fast enough.

Bali-mardana: We could not... All the time, those booths, there was a line.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Because this was our first year, we were not expecting such a big turnout, so we did not have sufficient stands to meet everybody's needs.

Prabhupāda: And the police officer has approved.

Room Conversation -- August 4, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Prabhupāda: Or there is a branch in India.

Hari-śauri: That is where they have your original Back to Godhead.

Prabhupāda: Maybe.

Hari-śauri: The first copy, they have it in Washington there.

Prabhupāda: American government is good organizations. (pause) From 1954 to '66 I struggled very hard. Alone.

Hari-śauri: Twelve years.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Twelve years means one yuga.

Hari-śauri: One...

Prabhupāda: One yuga. And big yuga, another.

Hari-śauri: One yuga?

Prabhupāda: Yes. In the ordinary.

Meeting with Italian Printer -- August 5, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Prabhupāda: Very nice. Hare Kṛṣṇa, thank you.

Bhagavān: He has worked very... He's been trying very hard to get the Kṛṣṇa book out, but he left a little too early.

Prabhupāda: Never mind.

Bhagavān: He told me that Prabhupāda was remarking how nice the Dutch Bhagavad-gītā was. He says that the next books he will print will be even nicer.

Translator: He's very happy to meet you, he says. He wasn't expecting it. He had many questions to ask you, a few questions, but he saw that you were tired today, so...

Prabhupāda: No, no, I'm not tired

Translator: He says he has very much appreciation for all that we're doing here, for all of our activities, but he's wondering what is the actual freedom we're getting from all these activities, what is the actual goal, and what is the freedom we derive from doing these activities?

Prabhupāda: So, explain what is the goal.

Translator: What is our definition of liberty, freedom, spiritual?

Prabhupāda: Liberty means whatever you like, you can do. That is liberty. But at the present moment, you cannot do that. Just like you want to go to the moon planet, you cannot do that. But when you are spiritually liberated, you can go anywhere you like. Still, in this material world there is a planet which is called Siddhaloka. The inhabitants of that planet, they go from any planet to any planet. But still, they can not go to the spiritual world. But Nārada Muni, he can travel anywhere. He travels over all the spiritual world and material world. There is no restriction.

Evening Darsana -- August 12, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Not convenient, foolishness. A rabbit, when there is some big animals, he closes his eyes. He thinks, "There is no danger." That does not mean he's out of danger. He'll be eaten up. So simply by concocting that there is no life after death, you'll not be escaped. In Bhagavad-gītā informs, tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ. There is no need of studying any literature, Vedic literature. Dehāntara-prāptiḥ, Kṛṣṇa is giving evidence. Dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā (BG 2.13). This dehāntara-prāptiḥ, I was not this body in the beginning, I was a very jubilant child like this. Where is that body? That body is not existing. It is different body, dehāntara-prāptiḥ. So why they do not believe dehāntara-prāptiḥ? I am the same soul who possessed a child's body, young man's body, boy's body. Now I have got the old man's body. So dehāntara is there, and I am still. I remember, I was a child, I was lying down on the lap of my elder sister. I remember still. But where is that body? It is different body. This is dehāntara-prāptiḥ. I am the same man who was lying down on the lap of my elder sister, and now I am differently situated. The body has changed. This is the proof, Kṛṣṇa is giving you this proof. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). So if we accept authority of Kṛṣṇa and His statement, so reasonable and so scientific, then our life is successful. And if we don't care for them, let us do our business. But nature will not excuse. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā (BG 3.27). Simply our false ahaṅkāra, egotism: "Ah, I don't care." You may do that, but prakṛti will take action. Because you are under the control of the nature's law. Uru-dāmni baddhāḥ. Uru means very hard, tight. Or uru means the thigh. And dāmni (means) by ropes, baddha. We cannot transgress the laws of nature. If we willfully transgress, we can do that, but we will have to suffer. If you touch fire, it will burn. It will not excuse that "Here is a child, he did not know." No excuse. Either a child or elderly, you have touched fire, then you must be burned. This is nature's law. Very strict. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya sad-asad-yoni-janmasu (BG 13.22). Why you have got different bodies? Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya. As we have associated with the modes of material nature, we have got different types of bodies. Otherwise, why there are so many varieties of forms? The forms are different, but within the form, the soul is one.

Room Conversation -- August 21, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Governor, Mr. Chandra Reddy. "Why, wherefrom they are getting money, where, why?" That is my very, very hard labor, that's all. Is it wrong if a man works hard and gets money in foreign country and bring in India?

Gargamuni: I think they cannot believe that a sādhu could have so much money from selling books.

Prabhupāda: That may be beyond their dream, but I am not so-called sādhu. I am trying to execute the orders of my Guru Mahārāja, predecessor. I am not a so-called sādhu, taking a saffron robe, begging for fulfilling the belly.

Gargamuni: They have to accept you as an international leader.

Prabhupāda: I must be international leader. Yes, they are surprised how... This is unique in the history, that a single person's books are sold in so many large quantities. I don't think any author has sold so many books. Huh?

Gargamuni: In some of the American magazines they publish a best-seller list of books, and the number of books we sell goes beyond the best-seller list.

Prabhupāda: And especially philosophical and religious books. These people do not touch. (laughs) Untouchable. Has even Vivekananda has presented so many books? A small book, "Thus spake..." And what he will write? What does he know? Simply bluffers. Chaliots.(?) Our Bon Mahārāja is also one of the chaliots. What is the English for chaliot?

Room Conversation -- August 24, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Oh, there is no Kṛṣṇa...

Mahāṁsa: There is no Kṛṣṇa temple. What to speak of Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa. And their Deity is Kṛṣṇa, most of the Marwaris. So they will now slowly all of them will come. We had a very hard time. This Inani who was wearing the turban. He's the chief of the Marwaris. If he gives five thousand rupees, then all the Marwaris will give five thousand rupees in that Ganj area. Whatever he gives, the others will have to.

Prabhupāda: He is the head.

Mahāṁsa: He's the head. He himself never gave. And we went a hundred times to him.

Prabhupāda: And now he saw the film...

Mahāṁsa: Yes. And today also he was there in the morning. Now he will definitely give. You had also previously said that they are very conservative. But once they take it up, then they will take it up very nicely.

Prabhupāda: And I also explained, "Nā rūpya, nā rūpya." (laughs)

Room Conversation -- September 6, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So he was preaching in the South India, so why he came here? There was no resting place?

Harikeśa: He came here... Actually they're going north soon. They're going to be in Chandigarh when we're in Chandigarh.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: That is six weeks from now.

Harikeśa: That's all right. They're also going north and preaching and he's having a very hard time getting his financial position down. He has no men. Two, three, four men. He's having...

Prabhupāda: How he'll return my fifteen thousand?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: That Mahāṁsa has taken.

Prabhupāda: I do not know Mahāṁsa's taken. He has to return it.

Room Conversation -- December 12, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Not willing. They are not willing.

Mahāṁśa: They're not willing to help in the kitchen because it is very hot, very hard, the eyes get burned, things like that. So this one Bengali boy, he's a very good cook. He can do it very nicely but he wants help. And if no one helps, then he refuses to cook. And if you press him, then he runs away. Yesterday he tried to run away four times because we were trying to press him.

Prabhupāda: No, no, cooking alone, it is not possible. So that you have to do. Find out some men. Cooperate. Otherwise how it is possible?

Haṁsadūta: Yes, therefore I'm asking you about hired people, whether hired people are good. In my experience...

Prabhupāda: So if they are, if our men not available, then you must hire, hire people. But not these carpenters or like that.

Room Conversation -- December 12, 1976, Hyderabad:

Tejas: Last night it was very hard. Again no one was coming to the kīrtana.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Tejas: These persons who are staying here in the garb of devotees, if they don't come...

Mahāṁśa: Devotees.

Tejas: No one would come. It was a great struggle. Again Jagadīśa and I and Mūrti, we were alone there and we had to go and get people and again they wouldn't come.

Prabhupāda: So what is the use?

Tejas: This Kṛṣṇan wouldn't come, and this other never comes. They should be made to leave. Otherwise they must follow the program. Kīrtana is so nice. All day we may be doing something. The only relief we get...

Prabhupāda: No, without kīrtana, it is...

Mahāṁśa: Refreshes you completely.

Prabhupāda: If you stop kīrtana, then it is ordinary.

Mahāṁśa: Work.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Letter to Russian -- January 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: You can reprint this for distribution here, Russian ships.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. The only danger to this will be that if the Russian government finds out that we are translating Russian literature, because hearing "propaganda,"—this is what the Christians do—then they will crack down very hard on our disciples there.

Prabhupāda: Where is my disciple there?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, only a few you have, Ananta-śānti. And they won't let us go there at all in the future.

Prabhupāda: That doesn't mean we shall not do that.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Then they will think...

Prabhupāda: They'll think. It is. Why shall I not do it? All thinking actually. We must do it. So where is that card? Bring it. I shall dictate.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: That card?

Prabhupāda: Your card is...

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, that's on my side. You don't want the card, do you?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- January 6, 1976, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: After the scattering of these Aryans, they have come different place. How is it that we brought all the cultural heritage in north, east and western countries? They must have also taken. But because they have to live very hard life, they are in cold countries...

Prabhupāda: And what do you mean by "we"? We are not...

Dr. Patel: "We" means our forefathers.

Prabhupāda: Forefathers may be saintly person, but we are not. Why do you say "we"?

Dr. Patel: "We" means the descendants of our forefathers.

Prabhupāda: My father might have been very rich man, but I am a poverty-stricken man, loitering in the street. Why say "we"?

Dr. Patel: "We" means these Aryans in India, they brought all the Vedas and Vedic culture with them. They must have taken it in.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. One who is speaking, he is not in Vedic culture. That is the difficulty.

Arrival of BBT Manager -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: What is the material?

Rāmeśvara: The original doll will be straw and clay. But then for mass production it will be fiberglass.

Prabhupāda: Fiberglass.

Rāmeśvara: Very hard and light. Not so heavy.

Prabhupāda: It is not... What is called? Burn? Fire? Inflammable?

Rāmeśvara: No, it is fireproof.

Prabhupāda: Oh. That's all right. Then it is all right.

Rāmeśvara: It will be permanent. Even if you brush into it, it will not break. Very durable.

Prabhupāda: All right. You take rest. We shall go a little... (everyone leaves room) (break)

Hari-śauri: They've actually legalized it. There's one group, they're claiming that by deprogramming people they give him freedom of thought.

Prabhupāda: But you are... By deprogramming... They are thinking of Kṛṣṇa. You are checking. Where is the freedom of thought? Then you are illegal. They want to think of Kṛṣṇa, and you are checking. Then who is illegal? We have to put in that way, in their word, that "Then you have no right to check him about thinking of Kṛṣṇa." This will be our argument. Yes. How you can check? Let him think of Kṛṣṇa freely, because Kṛṣṇa wants. Then you have to take Bhagavad-gītā as illegal.

Room Conversation on 1976 Book Scores -- January 16, 1977, Calcutta:

Prabhupāda: (Bengali) Bhagavad-gītā gives basic knowledge.

Rāmeśvara: Number two was Los Angeles with $87,000. Number three was Berkeley with $85,000. Number four was San Diego, $62,000. Caracas, 60,000, Brazil and England tied-$48,000. Germany 33,000; Denver 32,000; and Pittsburgh 30,000. And the medium temples weren't so outstanding, but the small temple, Houston, little Houston, $25,000. They only have about twelve men. I cannot understand how hard they worked to do this, very hard. Plus it shows Gurukṛpa's donation, ISKCON food relief donation. Then the outstanding zones for the month. Number one is Tamāla Kṛṣṇa, with $200,000. Number two was my zone. Actually it's your zone, but you've made me manage it a little. $182,000, very close to beating him. (Prabhupāda chuckles) Actually I have noticed that if the West Coast was not divided this year into two zones... Formerly it was just one zone. All Berkeley, it was one zone. Now it is two zones. So I noticed that if it had not been divided, then every month the West Coast would have been number one.

Prabhupāda: Combined together.

Rāmeśvara: Yes. Then Hṛdayānanda was number three with $155,000. That is very good for Latin America.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: (laughs) So this artificial way of banking, that will be also collapsed.

Hari-śauri: This is revolutionary.

Rāmeśvara: It's very hard for the mind to...

Prabhupāda: No, simply do this.

Rāmeśvara: Such a dramatic transformation of society.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Whatever it may be... We should be satisfied locally by our food, by our cloth, by our milk. That's all. Let the whole world go to hell. We don't care. If you want to save yourself also, you do this. Here is an example. If you want artificial life, city life, and hellish life, you do. But we shall live like this. This is the ideal life.

Room Conversation Varnasrama System Must Be Introduced -- February 14, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Nobody is interested with higher study. They want some technological understanding so that they can earn money. That's all. This is only interest.

Satsvarūpa: In our ISKCON, one becomes a brāhmaṇa after a year. It's not very hard. Everyone becomes a brāhmaṇa.

Prabhupāda: That is due to chanting. That lift very easily.

Hari-śauri: Where will we introduce the varṇāśrama system, then?

Prabhupāda: In our society, amongst our members.

Hari-śauri: But then if everybody's being raised to the brahminical platform...

Prabhupāda: Not everybody. Why you are misunderstanding? Varṇāśrama, not everybody brāhmaṇa.

Hari-śauri: No, but in our society practically everyone is being raised to that platform. So then one might ask what is...

Prabhupāda: That is... Everybody is being raised, but they're falling down.

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda? Sometimes we find a dilemma in preaching, in the sense that if we preach very vigorously we invoke the attention of the authorities. That is to say, if we were to preach a little less vigorously, there might be less objection, but then again there would be the less benefit because we would not be preaching as vigorously. It's very hard to know sometimes just how forcefully to preach.

Prabhupāda: No, we are not to satisfy the authorities. We have to satisfy Kṛṣṇa. Just like Arjuna. He wanted to satisfy his family members, but Kṛṣṇa did not like that. Then He preached him Bhagavad-gītā, and then Arjuna agreed, "Yes." Kariṣye vacanaṁ tava (BG 18.73). So it is the duty of the devotee to satisfy Kṛṣṇa, not the public.

Evening Darsana -- February 25, 1977, Mayapura:

Lokanātha: Śrīla Prabhupāda, our experience with installment members is not very good in India. Very rarely have they raised the installment. It's very hard.

Pañcadraviḍa: It doesn't matter, because before the program was always never give them any more books than they paid for, so you'd never lose that even if they don't continue the installments. There's still no loss.

Prabhupāda: (chucking) Yes. You are giving only five books.

Pañcadraviḍa: Yes. You pay more than that...

Hari-śauri: Initial payment should be more than one, or how many books they get.

Prabhupāda: No... So actually, even if we give them free, there is no life membership(?) Let them read it. But if you give free, they will not read.

Room Conversation about Harijanas -- April 10, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Now explain it nicely.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: All right.

Prabhupāda: We can actually help them. Not by imagination, but practical application. And are doing all over the world. (break) In '68 I was alone. And I had to struggle very, very hard, alone. Therefore I got heart attack in 1967. Then that heart attack and regress continued for two years. Whatever is done, it is done from 1969. Before that, I was simply alone struggling to start this mission. (pause) Before that, I came to Bombay.

Indian: In '69?

Prabhupāda: No, no.

Indian: '70?

Prabhupāda: '64. I stayed at Morarji's Andheri...

Indian: Andheri House.

Prabhupāda: ...Colony for his employees.

Morning Conversation -- April 23, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Because we get lots of that dahi. You drink it cool with a little sugar in it. I think it's good for digestion, dahi. How are you feeling today, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Not feel so... That jhuri was very heavy for me. Jhuri, jhuri. What is called?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Heavy. Yeah, I ate some and I couldn't digest it. Even now they're sitting. Very hard to digest. I tried to take some jirā water this morning to help to digest it. Then I took some dahi milk, and I think that helped. I drank a lot of dahi.

Prabhupāda: So you can give me little jirā water.

Upendra: What time, do you happen to know?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Eleven... I mean, I won't say it's correct. I have eleven minutes after.

Upendra: Yeah, that's...

Prabhupāda: And the idea was to prove that Americans are better advanced in science than China and Russia. That was the only aim. Only for this purpose they spent three billions...?

Conversation, 'Rascal Editors,' and Morning Talk -- June 22, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Kāmasya nendriya-prītir lābho jīveta... (SB 1.2.10).

Prabhupāda: Yes. Kāmasya, sense gratification, required, but not for sense gratification's sake. It requires only for living comfortably. You try to make the economic development, that is all right. But they have taken simply for sense gratification. "I have got one car, and there must be another three cars for my children and wife." This is going on, kāma, increasing. Economic development... You require some occupational duty for earning your livelihood... That is allowed. But why more and more, more, more, more? For that, they are making scientific research how to satisfy senses. So kāmasya na indriya-prītiḥ. You require some sense gratification not for the senses, but because you have got a bad bargain, this body, just to maintain it, not more than. That is varṇāśrama-dharma. So there are so many problems we have created. They do not understand. And this civilization are simply gratifying senses, so dangerous. And dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). And they create a position by very, very hard labor, and the body is changed. Then śrama eva hi kevalam (SB 1.2.8). What benefit you get? This life, you make a skyscraper building, three dozen cars, and next life, you become a dog. Then what is your profit? What do you gain? They do not gain anything. So that change of body is in nature's hand. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa (SB 3.31.1). That is not in your hand. When the body will change, you cannot say, "No, no, I'll not change," because that is not under your dictation. So is not simply waste of time?

Talk About Varnasrama, S.B. 2.1.1-5 -- June 28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Frugal, yes. And when there is enough money, they construct their own house. Then they live very luxuriously. In the beginning, no.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Right. And they'll work sixteen hours sometimes.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. As much as possible. Very hard-working.

Śatadhanya: And their sons also work with them.

Prabhupāda: And whatever money saved, they purchase ornament. They don't deposit in the bank.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh. That's one of their things.

Prabhupāda: Hm. That is Indian style. To save money means purchase ornament.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Purchasing one ornament.

Prabhupāda: Ornament for the wife.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That could be...

Prabhupāda: Because she likes ornament, gold, and they have got molten(?) in the jewelry.

Room Conversation With Son (Vrindavan De) -- July 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Why more? Live very comfortably and be advanced in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is required.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How much can you eat more than your share?

Prabhupāda: We have seen many persons... The other day, he was our member. One Mr. Agarwal? Very rich man. He committed suicide falling down from the bridge to the Ganges. What is that? Very rich man. The happiness cannot be attained in that way. Happiness is in Kṛṣṇa. It is so sublime that... Dhruva Mahārāja went for kingdom, and he performed austerities. When he saw Kṛṣṇa he said, "I don't want anything." Svāmin kṛtārtho 'smi varaṁ na yāce: (CC Madhya 22.42) "I came to ask You something, but I am now fully satisfied." That is happiness. Sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmo yato bhaktir... yayātmā supra... (SB 1.2.6). You want to satisfy your ātmā. So that can be satisfied when you are fully devoted to Kṛṣṇa. Otherwise simply by material wealth, increasing your economic position, that is not... They do not know it. The European civilization, they are struggling very hard-colonization, industrialization, this... (end)

Room Conversation -- August 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Do it first. In Hawaii the Deities are made of paper combination?

Gurukṛpā: Now Bharadvāja is making like this.

Prabhupāda: Oh, very good.

Gurukṛpā: He's already... He will be finished in two or three weeks.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: These are very hard, aren't they? It seems very...

Prabhupāda: Yes. It is as good as marble.

Gurukṛpā: He's already started.

Prabhupāda: That's good. The old Deities, when the new Deities come, old Deities should be thrown in the ocean. That's it. And new Deities should be replaced with ceremony. There is no difficulty.

Gurukṛpā: I got now an Australian passport, so I want to stay in India for some time.

Prabhupāda: Oh. That's good.

Room Conversation -- October 9, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Anyone can scratch very hard?

Kīrtanānanda: I'm afraid you won't have any back left.

Prabhupāda: Oh, Kīrtanānanda, you are doing. (devotees laugh)

Jayatīrtha: He is your original masseur. He wants his old job back now.

Prabhupāda: Not so hard. (laughs)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Too hard.

Rāmeśvara: Actually the princess is very eager to come to India to meet you. She's been planning to do this with her husband. Her husband is the most powerful prince in the country. He's involved with the oil exporting and buying weapons and so many matters. And they're both very eager to have your darśana.

Prabhupāda: They have got money. Now if they follow little our instruction, it will be an ideal country.

Room Conversation -- October 14, 1977, Vrndavana:

Hari-śauri: That's Mādhava dāsa.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's not what they're doing right now.

Gurukṛpā: No. Right now they're doing Darwin's theory and the past history of life, Dr. Cohen.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. That's Bob Cohen, Śrīla Prabhupāda. That Peace Corps...

Hari-śauri: Brahmavati.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Brahma-tīrtha. When I was sitting there just now... I I mean, I suggested a lot of things which can improve the presentation. One of the big problems is the microphone system they have is very cheap. They rented some. So I suggested that they take the temple microphone system for the next few days, which is a very good one, and use that, because it's very hard to hear clearly.

Prabhupāda: Why not immediately?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, right in the middle of the conference... They can do it for the evening one.

Room Conversation -- October 18, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, first of all a conveyance is drawn up according to the sales agreement. So without seeing the sales agreement, it's very hard to know if everything is accurate. The sales agreement is kept with the Central Bank of India in Calcutta. So we're...

Prabhupāda: Do not copy?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, we had never made a copy. So I think the easiest thing would be to give Jayapatākā Mahārāja a letter of authority. He'll get the agreement, and even right in the bank or else at the temple in Calcutta he can make a copy and send us a copy and redeposit the original with the bank. And that's one point. Then another point is that the land on which the building was erected doesn't actually belong to Mr. Patodiya. It belonged to a Bengali gentleman, and in fact it's not owned by Mr. Patodiya. It's leased for ninety-nine years, of which eighty-five years still remain. So this conveyance more or less... It appears that every guarantee is only given for the duration of that lease—another eighty-five years. So the obvious question is what happens after that eighty-five years? Of course, a lawyer, a solicitor, can tell us this very easily, but I'm thinking that it might be helpful that when Jayapatākā is sending us the copy of the sale agreement he may also get a copy for Mr. Patodiya of that lease agreement which Mr. Patodiya has with the Bengali gentleman, so that we can see what the position is after eighty-five years. Girirāja and I were studying it pretty closely. So what we're going to probably do is we'll give the copy of the conveyance draft to one of our life member lawyers, friends in Delhi, and in the meantime, while he's looking at it, we'll get the necessary documents from Calcutta. Then we'll settle it up. Not difficult.

Prabhupāda: There are other? Other occupants?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There are other occupants? I don't follow your question, Prabhupāda.

Room Conversation -- October 22, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So let me go. Enough place. You can have two rooms. (laughter) Yes. In new building.

Bhavānanda: Yes. There is no dearth of rooms.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, you're so attractive that it's very hard for everyone to remain in their services around the world. They simply want to come and be with you.

Prabhupāda: And as I will remain in Māyāpur or Vṛndāvana—the same. Yes. Gauḍa-maṇḍala-bhūmi, jebā jāne cintāmaṇi, tāra hoy braja-bhūmi bās. There is no difference. Gauḍa-maṇḍala-bhūmi. And if there is any danger, Bhavānanda has got his gun. (laughter—Tamāla Kṛṣṇa repeats to others—laughter)

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Every moment with you, Śrīla Prabhupāda, is so wonderful.

Prabhupāda: So I shall prefer.

Devotees: What?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "So I shall prefer." Maybe Svarūpa Dāmodara Prabhu can arrange some conferences for himself in Calcutta. Then he can visit you regularly in Māyāpur.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- October 28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: And people are bluffing him, and he says...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He's bluffing us. (laughs) He seems very sincere, though. It's hard not to believe him.

Prabhupāda: That was my impression. But how is that? If you take leave, something.(?)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It is a big mystery, this makara-dhvaja. It is like the immortal elixir, very hard to grasp. I think you described the flowers in the sky? There's that Bengali...

Bhakti-caru: Ākāśa-puṣpa?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Well, one thing we could say in favor of the kavirāja delay in coming is that if he had come, then he might have given some medicine right away. But this way, your body has been given a chance to rest from that other thing that you had taken. By not taking medicine for two days now, it's good. It's made... The body will become a little more regular. If he had come, naturally he would have wanted to immediately prescribe some medicine. This is not bad, to give the body a rest after such strong medicine. How much did Prabhupāda drink today? The stool-passing has stopped?

Bhakti-caru: Yes.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, the real factor is Your Divine Grace's desire. I mean it seems like... As your disciples, our duty is to help you fulfill your desire. It seems like your desire is to die in Vṛndāvana. But it's very hard for us to execute that service. It's very hard—because we love you—to assist you in dying. It's a paradox. You want to die in Vṛndāvana, and we want you to live, and yet we have to do whatever you want. I mean, the kavirāja, he is giving some... He feels a little confident. Probably from medical point of view, there's no doubt, he has far superior knowledge than many of us.

Prabhupāda: Viśvambhara has not yet...?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No. Viśvambhara has not come yet, Śrīla Prabhupāda. I mean for the past few days you've been saying that you want to live. Now suddenly you say that you want to die. Maybe that's simply to discourage us from... Because you feel too weak now.

Room Conversation -- November 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Now when we construct the other building, further down, it will be (indistinct).

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Godown will be on the ground floor, and residences and Gurukula on the other floors. The only problem is that it's such a good place that now we can't get the residents to move out of those other buildings. They say, "Why should we move? Now we have a temple. There'll be a Gurukula. There's a bank." It's very hard to get them out. Of course, we don't care if they stay, if they're nice.

Prabhupāda: Gradually they'll be devotee.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Either they'll be devotees or they'll be driven out by the mahā-mantra. The upper floor of each of those buildings has also increased the utilization of those buildings. That was also your scheme, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: That was my scheme, but we have not given full freedom to the tenant, or controllment(?).

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We're always on their heads.

Prabhupāda: You take four brāhmaṇas from South India, four from Vṛndāvana, and four from...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Bombay.