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Transfer (Conversations 1968 - 1975)

Conversations and Morning Walks

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Interview -- March 9, 1968, San Francisco:
Prabhupāda: So there is life after this life. Just like progressive life, a child is progressing to youthhood, the youth is aspiring to become a big man, important man. As in this life there is progressive life, similarly, life after life, there is also progress. There are different grades of life. So we get information from authoritative books that there are 8,400,000's of different grades of life, and there are 900,000's of aquatic life, two million species of plants and trees, about eleven hundred thousand species of life of birds, three million types of species of beast, and 400,000 species of this human body. Out of that 400,000's, different kinds of human bodies, the civilized body is a great boon. At that time we can make further progress. Either we can transfer to other planets... The standard of living, comforts, are many, many thousands times better than this planet. But in this book, Bhagavad-gītā As It Is, we get information that within this material universe, wherever you go, either you remain in this planet or you go to the moon planet or to the sun planet, or there are millions and trillions of planets... The highest planetary system is called Brahmaloka.
Interview -- March 9, 1968, San Francisco:
Prabhupāda: So when we are freed from this illusory consciousness and if we are situated in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then we get attachment. Because we are attached to all these things, attached to this body, attached to this society, attached to the country, so many things in relationship with the body. Now, after negativating my identity with this false identification, when I come to the right point, then I understand that I am Kṛṣṇa's. I am Kṛṣṇa's. Then your attachment for Kṛṣṇa increases because you transfer the attachment. Just like a child. A child is attached to play. But when he grows up, his attachment is transferred to study. That does not mean he gives up the attachment for playing, that attachment is lost. No. Attachment must be there, but that is transferred or purified. So Kṛṣṇa consciousness means purified consciousness, real consciousness. And the next stage, after being freed from misgivings—attachment for the real identity, ruci. Then āsakti, greater attachment. Then an ecstasy. That means I am coming nearer to God. Because I am God's... In the beginning I told you that we have forgotten our relationship with God. So when we are out of misgivings, we come to the platform of increasing attachment for God. So this attachment, when it is perfectional stage, it is called love of God. Love is here also. Instead of loving God, we are now loving dog. Love is there, but when you are out of misgivings, you transfer your love from dog to God. These are the different stages to come to the... How do you attain Kṛṣṇa consciousness? These are the stages. So if we follow cautiously and sentiently these six stages of development, you come to Kṛṣṇa consciousness automatically. (break) ...study. This meditation and breathing exercise is not part of our study. Because we are following a method which is direct method. I will give you the example. Just like there is a skyscraper house, and there are staircases to go to the top floor, say, hundredth floor, and there is elevator also. So if you take advantage of the elevator, you reach immediately hundred floor within a minute, but if you go step by step, step by step, it will take hours.
Morning Walk at Stow Lake -- March 23, 1968, San Francisco:

Devotee (1): Sometimes, well, if you (we) slept less, we could do more for Kṛṣṇa, but at the same time you (we) would be very tired. I mean, you could be... Well, you could regulate that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Practically everything depends on practice. Abhyāsa-yoga-yuktena cetasā nānya-gāminā (BG 8.8). Abhyāsa-yoga. Abhyāsa-yoga means yoga practice... Practice it. So this whole Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is to practice transferring from one kind of consciousness to another. So we require practice. Just like one man can run few miles. I cannot run even one mile. He has practiced. We see some boys, they run, run on. They practice. Practice it. Strength of the heart increasing by practice. And if I run, my heart will be palpitating. Because I have no practice. So by practice, everything can be attained. Hare Rāma Hare Rāma Rāma Rāma Hare Hare. (break) ...determination. And this determination is increased by celibacy. Brahmacārya is recommended to keep oneself determined. A brahmacārī, if he determines something, he executes. He has got that strength of mind. Those who are too much addicted to sex life, they cannot be determined. They cannot be fixed-up. They are fluctuating, changing. People are, in modern day, they cannot sit down in a place for a long time. Therefore so much traveling. The traveling business is very prosperous. Everyone wants to travel. They cannot fix, fix up. So the processes recommended, they're very valuable, but it is not possible to follow them all in the present age because everything is reducing.

Press Interview -- December 30, 1968, Los Angeles:

Journalist: Yes. We have it at the office. I've seen it.

Prabhupāda: There are descriptions. There are descriptions of these things. There is description of another nature which is called spiritual nature. This is material nature. The sky, as far as you can see, this is one universe. Similarly, there are millions of universes. And all these together, that is material sky. And beyond that, there is spiritual sky, which is far, far greater than this. And there are spiritual planets. So this information we have got from Bhagavad-gītā, what to speak of other Vedic literatures. Bhagavad-gītā, it is daily read by practically all over the world, but they do not understand it. Simply they become student of Bhagavad-gītā, or simply just to think falsely that "I am God." That's all. But they don't take any particular information. There is a verse in the Eighth Chapter, paras tasmāt tu bhāvo 'nyo 'vyakto 'vyaktāt sanātanaḥ (BG 8.20). There is another nature beyond this material nature which is eternal. This nature is coming into existence, again dissolution. But that nature is eternal. These things are there. Similarly, there, planets are also eternal. There, living entities, they are also eternal. That is called sanātana. Sanātana means eternal, without any end, without any beginning. But this nature, as we have, this body has got a beginning and it has end, similarly anything, this cosmic nature has a beginning and it has an end. So our this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is how to transfer our self to that nature, eternal nature.

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Radio Interview -- February 12, 1969, Los Angeles:

Interviewer: And do they raise questions or is it a formalized ritual?

Prabhupāda: Yes. First of all we pray to God to help us in the, our, I mean to say, preaching or chanting process. Then we begin chanting this Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Hare Hare, Hare Rāma Hare Rāma, conjoinedly, congregationally. And it immediately transfers the atmosphere to a spiritual feeling, and if you sometimes attend our class, you can see practically how the boys and girls, they become ecstatic and chant and dance. So after chanting and dancing for a few minutes, say, fifteen to twenty minutes, then we speak something from Bhagavad-gītā and Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam about theology and philosophy, ethics, morality. Then again we chant and pray to God and then close our class.

Conversation Including Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.2.1-34 Recitation & Explanation -- April 1, 1969, San Francisco:

Gargamuni: Well, how can we begin to serve you so that you'll be pleased?

Prabhupāda: (laughs) That I shall tell you later on. (laughter) Do you think I am not pleased?

Gargamuni: I don't know.

Prabhupāda: Oh, you must know it. How can you say that I am not pleased? How you know it that I am not pleased?

Gargamuni: Well, we cause you so much anxiety and everything.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Gargamuni: We cause you so much anxiety due to our faults.

Prabhupāda: Therefore I am pleased with you. Why I have given up all my anxieties of the sons and daughters who is born from my body, and why I am taking and transferring... (end)

Prabhupada Listening to Recording of His Own Room Conversation with Students -- April 25, 1969, Boston:

Prabhupāda: As happens... As you enter the body, the happening is according to the body.

Student (4): But does this go on and on indefinitely or does it stop? Do you just keep changing bodies indefinitely or does it end?

Prabhupāda: Not indefinitely. If you become Kṛṣṇa conscious, then you haven't got to change this material body. You are transferred to the spiritual world. There is eternal body.

Student (4): Oh. Does everyone go there or only some?

Prabhupāda: It is accepted that everyone goes. But if somehow you are stubborn to remain here, how one can help? (laughter) Just like the university is open for everyone. But somebody is stubborn to go to the prison department. So how the government can help? Government does not say that "Some selected people come to the university, and others go to the prison department." It is open for everyone, but it is the particular mentality—one is going to the university; one is going to the prison house. That is your individual independence. That is your choice. Just like so many students, they have come here. Others have not come here. So everyone has got little independence. So everyone can go to the spiritual world if he likes. But if he does not like, he will remain here. That is his choice.

Room Conversation -- May 10, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Then you will feel relieved. So therefore the real thing is that everything belongs to Kṛṣṇa. We are artificially enjoying the stolen property. Therefore if you go on enjoying like that, then this frustration will come. But before coming to that frustration, if we return this property to Kṛṣṇa, then we become happy. So best thing is to return everything to Kṛṣṇa. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. And you will not be a loser. You will be gainer, just like Bali Mahārāja. Actually, if you think, everything belongs to Kṛṣṇa. Nothing belongs to you. This is māyā. Kṛṣṇa's property you are thinking, "mine." Is this land of American belongs to you actually? It is stolen property. You have stolen from the Red Indians or from Kṛṣṇa. Everyone is, not you, everyone. Somebody is claiming, "This much my property," somebody is claiming, "This much my property," but this much or that much, everything belongs to Kṛṣṇa. It is stolen property. There is another example in Indian words, that hira cauri kiya abhicaurya, khira caurī kiyā abhicaura. Hira means diamond, and khīra means... What is that called? Cucumber, a small? So if somebody has stolen a cucumber from other's tree, so he is captured. And another man has stolen some diamond. He is also arrested. So from the police, both are thieves. If the man says, "Oh, what I have stolen? I have stolen a little cucumber. It is nothing, worth not even two cent or one cent. Why you are arresting me? He is thief. He has stolen a big diamond," no, in the eyes of law, he is also thief; he is also thief. Everyone is thief. Anyone who is not in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, he is thief. He'll not be happy. The best thing is to return whatever he has possessed: "Kṛṣṇa, it is Yours. Take." Finish business. Mānasa deha geha, yo kichu mora. Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura's song... Now, everything we possess in mind. Actually we don't possess. Suppose I am possessing all this. As soon as I go from this body, all possession will remain here. I'll not take anything. So I don't possess. But in mind I am thinking, "Oh, this is mine. This is mine. Where is another box? Why it is not coming?" And possessing in mind. If I leave this body, either the box here or in the Chicago or anywhere else, what is the difference? There is no difference. But because I am possessing in the mind, "Oh, that box is mine," so I am asking, "Whether it is Chicago or it is here, it is there? Why it is not coming?" So possession in the mind. Actually you don't possess. Mānasa deha geha. So by that supposingly possessing, we have got our mind, we have got our body, then expansion of body, wife, children, family, society, country. In this way we possess so many things. Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura says, mānasa deha geha, yo kichu mora: "Now whatever I possess, either in the mind or in the family or in the society or in the body—whatever I have got, I surrender unto You, my dear Kṛṣṇa." Mānasa deha geha, yo kichu..., arpilun tuā pade nanda kiśora: "Nanda-kiśora, O the son of Nanda, I give unto You." Marobi rakhobi, yo icchā tohāra: "Now whatever You like, You can do, either you kill me or You protect me, as You like. You are the proprietor. You have right to do everything." This is surrender. This is full Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is not possible immediately. Therefore we have to practice. Sadā tad-bhāva-bhāvitaḥ (BG 8.6). And if we die in that Kṛṣṇa consciousness, yaṁ yaṁ vāpi smaran loke tyajaty ante kalevaram... In the particular type of consciousness, when one gives up this body, then he is transferred into that position next life. So in this way, Kṛṣṇa consciousness, if we are able, sadā tad-bhāva-bhāvitaḥ, by practicing always, constantly, that situation of consciousness, then next life, after giving up... Why next life? This life also. One person who is in always Kṛṣṇa's service this life or that life, he is with Kṛṣṇa. He is with Kṛṣṇa. Any person who is in Kṛṣṇa consciousness is always with Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa is everywhere. I may not understand, but Kṛṣṇa is everywhere. So you American boys and girls, you should take to this Kṛṣṇa consciousness. You'll be happy.

Meeting with Devotees -- June 9, 1969, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Yes. When he gives importance to Kṛṣṇa he can sacrifice everything for Kṛṣṇa. That is another state. That is not ordinary stage. That is transcendental state. Yes.

Hayagrīva: You mentioned with the payments...

Prabhupāda: Caitanya Mahāprabhu has said that veda mukha mane..., veda viruddha kārya kare, veda mukhe mane: "They do everything against Vedas, but they say that 'We are following. We are followers of the Vedic religion.' " What is that?

Hayagrīva: You said that with the payments, that the society can take up some of these? How would that be managed, and when would it be put into effect? Because there is a payment this August for five hundred dollars.

Prabhupāda: So, we'll have to manage. You are making that document transferred to the Society?

Hayagrīva: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So give that and we shall manage.

Devotee: It's twenty after six now. Shall we have kīrtanas?

Prabhupāda: All right. All right. Let us... (end)

Room Conversation With John Lennon, Yoko Ono, and George Harrison -- September 11, 1969, London, At Tittenhurst:

Prabhupāda: No. Just like in drug shop they sell all medicine for disease, curing disease. But still, you have to take doctor's prescription to take a particular type of medicine. They will not supply you. If you go to a drug shop and you say, "I am diseased. You give me any medicine," that is not... He'll ask you, "Where is your prescription?" So similarly, in this age, in Kali-yuga age, this mantra, Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, is recommended in the śāstras, and great stalwart—we consider Him the incarnation of Kṛṣṇa-Caitanya Mahāprabhu, He preached this. Therefore our principle is everyone should follow. Mahājano yena gataḥ sa panthāḥ (CC Madhya 17.186). We should follow the footprints of great authorities. That is our business. The Vedic mantra says, tarko 'pratiṣṭhaḥ. If you simply try to argue and try to approach the Absolute, it is very difficult, simply by argument and reasoning, because our arguments and reason are limited because our senses are imperfect. (break) So tarko 'pratiṣṭhaḥ śrutayo vibhinnāḥ. And scriptures, there are different kinds of scriptures. Nāsau munir yasya mataṁ na bhinnam. Philosophers, every philosopher has got a different opinion, and unless a philosopher defeats other philosopher, he cannot become a big philosopher. So therefore philosophical speculation also will not make a solution. Dharmasya tattvaṁ nihitaṁ guhāyām. So it is very secret. Then how to get that secret thing? Mahājano yena gataḥ sa panthāḥ (CC Madhya 17.186). You simply follow great personalities, how they have achieved success. So our, this Vaiṣṇava philosophy is to follow the great personality, just like Kṛṣṇa or Caitanya Mahāprabhu or ācāryas of His succession, to take shelter of authority and follow. That is recommended in Vedas, that you follow great authorities. That will take you to the ultimate goal. Mahājano yena gataḥ sa panthāḥ. So... Kṛṣṇa also recommends in the Bhagavad-gītā, Fourth Chapter, evaṁ paramparā-prāptam imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ (BG 4.2). This science of Kṛṣṇa consciousness was understood by disciplic succession. Paramparā-prāptam. Imaṁ vivasvavate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam: "My dear Arjuna, don't think that this Kṛṣṇa consciousness science I am speaking to you is something new. No." Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam: (BG 4.1) "It is eternal, and first I spoke to sun-god." Vivasvate. Vivasvān manave prāhuḥ: "And Vivasvān said to his son, Manu." Manur ikṣvākave 'bravīt: "And Manu also transferred this knowledge to his son, Ikṣvāku." Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam: (BG 4.2) "In this way, by disciplic succession, it is coming on."

1970 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- December 13, 1970, Indore:

Devotee (4): ...national, just like the national...

Prabhupāda: Yes. So we have to organize. First of all let us publish in one city, big city like New York, like London, yes, Bombay, Tokyo. Big cities, world's big cities. In India only two cities are big: Calcutta, and Bombay, important. If you publish simultaneously, Calcutta... Delhi is given importance due to capital; otherwise not important as big city, as Bombay and Calcutta. Delhi, without government offices it is a dead city. Just like Washington. What is the value of Washington? It is nothing. Simply because it is headquarters of the President, it has got importance. Similarly, Delhi is that. Otherwise it is not important. But Calcutta, Bombay, is really important city in India, big business, port, all rich men, every kind of, all cultural, everything—Calcutta, and Bombay. Originally only Calcutta, now Bombay also. Because the Britishers, they made Calcutta capital. And Calcutta was very, very important city. But these Calcutta men, they create sometimes situation, very complicated. So once in 1905 the same situation was there, politically. Sir Surendranath Bannerjee made, Surendranath Bannerjee's movement, partition of Bengal. Lord Collier, he wanted to divide Bengal, made it East Bengal and West Bengal. And Surendranath Bannerjee... He is the practically father of Indian politics. Gandhi's not. He was. He was. And in the beginning, in European circles he was famous. He was called "Surrender-not." The spelling of the name, s-u-r-e-n-d-e-r, Surendranath. In Parliament he was known as "Surrender-not." He was a very powerful politician. So there was trouble in Calcutta; so therefore they transferred, 1911, capital to Delhi. Otherwise, from the very beginning of British occupation Calcutta was the capital. You have seen the government viceroy's house near that Hamilton building where you were trying to purchase.

Room Conversation -- December 13, 1970, Indore:

Prabhupāda: What is the value of vote by asses? According to Vedic civilization, there was democracy but that democracy is selected committee. Just like in England there was Privy Council. So selected body of learned brāhmaṇas and sages, they were guiding the king, and the king himself was properly educated how to rule over, under religious principles. He was trained from the beginning of his life as prince. As the future heir of the throne, he was trained, and at the same time, he was guided by a council of learned sages and brāhmaṇas. They were looking over the activities of the king. As soon as there was some mistake they will see. And there are instances; whenever there was a bad king they were dethroned. Not for political purpose. He was dethroned but his son was on the... Just like Lord Rāmacandra did. Rāmacandra killed Rāvaṇa but He never occupied the kingdom. His brother Vibhīṣaṇa proved to be faithful. He was enthroned. From the same family. And that was the system. Even a king was wrong, he would be dethroned but from his family, either his son or brother, or somebody would occupy there. Not that "Because I have conquered you, therefore I shall sit down." No. There are many instances. And therefore India was ruling all over the world. The emperor was in India, and the kings of different states, their family was. So there was no rebellion. And in every state a king was trained in the same process, guided by committee of learned brāhmaṇa and sages. How perfect this monarchy is. Monarchy... That Lord Collier studied that the Indian people like monarchy. Even these states, the so-called states... Now the Congress government has killed them; otherwise the Britishers were maintaining, necessary, and they were developed. Now see. The Indore was far better before. You can see from the buildings, from the whole city. It was very prosperous city. Still it is going on. So every state, the native prince, the Britishers maintained so many native prince. And because they maintained them, they were friends to the Britishers. They knew the policy, if you create zamindar, landlord. They created this aristocratic class to support them. So when Gandhi and other leaders started this movement all the princes and zamindars, they were in favor of British. Therefore it took so much time to transfer. And as a retaliation, the common people have bereft them of their kingdom. "No more kingdom because you always supported Britishers." It is a great politics.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1971, Gorakhpur:

Prabhupāda: Liberated means at the present moment under this material, in this material world, he is accepting material body, and when he is bona fide servant of Kṛṣṇa, he'll be offered a spiritual body. Just like a soldier. A person, so long he's not a soldier, he does not, he is not awarded the uniform. But as soon as he accepts the service as a soldier, immediately he is given the uniform. So you are accepting different bodies in the material world, and that is bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19). You are accepting one type of body, it is becoming vāṇīshed, again you have to accept another. But as soon as you become perfectly Kṛṣṇa conscious, tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9), then, after leaving this body, he does not come to this material world. He is immediately... Mam eti, he transfers. Similarly, he accepts spiritual body. Is it clear or not? You are accepting material body now, birth after birth. Is it not? That is transmigration. Sometimes you are accepting human body, sometimes you are accepting dog's body, sometimes you are accepting king's body, sometimes you are accepting somebody else. Is it not? Is it clear?

Guest: But Kṛṣṇa has told Arjuna that...

Prabhupāda: First of all, try to clear this. Now, you are accepting different types of body. Is it not a fact?

Guest: Yes.

Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London:

Prabhupāda: Just like, somebody, there is a child, a child is active, but his frivolous activities, or mischievous, have to stop when he's active in taking education. You see. The same child, his energy for becoming active is transferred for taking education. He's no more acting mischievously breaking this, doing this, doing that. The activity is there. Now that is purified. Similarly, spiritual life means the spiritual activity, that is purified activity. These boys, they have given up drinking, meat-eating. That does not mean they stop eating. They're eating better things. Therefore they have given up the nonsense eating. So that is spiritual life. Spiritual life means activity purified.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- April 1, 1972, Sydney:

Pradyumna: You said in one place, "Man is the architect of his own happiness and distress."

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. That is an axiomatic truth even by the modern man. Yes, that "Man is the architect of his own fortune." So as soon as there is work to make your fortune, then there must be a person to decide to give you a fortunate position. Just like in an establishment, so many men are working, but there is a president. He is considering the work file, "How this man has worked?" And he is being promoted, his salary is being increased, and somebody is degraded, no promotion, rather, transferred in some other place. So natural conclusion is when there are so many varieties of life in our presence and they are, although in the same place, they haven't got the same facility, so there must be somebody who decides on this point. So how you can deny God? Our point is the Supreme Person, the president, who decides on this fact, He is God. What is the opposite answer?

Pradyumna: They would say that you are in your position and they are in their position just by chance, just like...

Room Conversation -- April 20, 1972, Tokyo:

Prabhupāda: No... What is that?

Devotee (1): Lugdu.

Prabhupāda: Oh. What is this? Some picture?

Trivikrama: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Ten thousand was transferred from my account. So that has been replaced or not?

Karandhara: I have it. I didn't put it in the account because I thought you wanted me to send it to Māyāpur. But I haven't sent it yet. I still have it in another account.

Śyāmasundara: You just informed Tamāla that from now on we would send only books, that we would prefer to send books from this side and let them sell them.

Prabhupāda: No. The thing is that you were collecting something for Māyāpur account?

Karandhara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So how much it has come?

Karandhara: Thirty thousand.

Prabhupāda: Thirty thousand.

Room Conversation -- April 20, 1972, Tokyo:

Śyāmasundara: Separate from books?

Karandhara: Yes.

Śyāmasundara: That's separate from books.

Prabhupāda: So this ten thousand was given from my account. So this has to be replaced. And then, whatever you have got for Māyāpur account, that is to be transferred. That was a trial business. So we took from bank ten thousand worth. So that is done. Now you transfer the ten thousand to my account, and balance you keep ready for transferring. That also I will advise you how to do. Besides that, out of the 33,000, you deposited eighteen thousand?

Karandhara: No. 18,600.

Prabhupāda: Six hundred.

Karandhara: I still owe fifteen thousand.

Prabhupāda: That money is not yet done.

Karandhara: By June.

Prabhupāda: Oh. By June. All right. We shall talk further. What is this? So Los Angeles is... Everything is all right?

Karandhara: Yes Prabhupāda. Those are all... All the different envelopes are from the different departments, Spiritual Sky, Mail Order, Iskcon Media.

Prabhupāda: So you keep it in this envelope. Then I shall see.

Room Conversation -- April 2, 1972, Sydney:

Śyāmasundara: So one who is mad after something else material, mad after this or that...

Prabhupāda: It is perverted.

Śyāmasundara: And he must transfer his love..., madness to Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: That madness should be for Kṛṣṇa.

Śyāmasundara: So how is that madness transferred?

Prabhupāda: By this devotional service. You practice it to love Kṛṣṇa. And then when you come to the actual stage, you will be mad after Kṛṣṇa. This is the process to bring to you..., bring you to the platform.

Śyāmasundara: No other way can replace...

Prabhupāda: Bhaktyā mām abhijānāti: (BG 18.55) by devotional service. Neither by jñāna, yoga, karma, no, that will not touch. You cannot become mad after Kṛṣṇa by any means except by this devotional service. Therefore, we are so much conservative. Because if we are actually after Kṛṣṇa, then we must accept the real method.

Room Conversation -- April 2, 1972, Sydney:
Prabhupāda: "Suppose one does not develop Kṛṣṇa consciousness in this human form of life. He will then be thrown into the cycle of birth and death, involving 8,400,000 species of life, and his spiritual identity will remain lost. One does not know whether he is going to be a plant, or a beast, or a bird, or something like that, because there are so many species of life. The recommendation of Rūpa Gosvāmī for reviving our original Kṛṣṇa consciousness is that somehow or other we should apply our minds to Kṛṣṇa very seriously and thus also become fearless of death. After death we do not know our destination, because we are completely under the control of the laws of nature. Only Kṛṣṇa, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is controller over the laws of nature. Therefore, if we take shelter of Kṛṣṇa seriously, there will be no fear of being thrown back into the cycle of so many species of life. A sincere devotee will surely be transferred to the abode of Kṛṣṇa, as affirmed in the Bhagavad-gītā.
Interview -- July 5, 1972, New York:

Prabhupāda: Your real dimension is mentioned there that you are a spiritual atom. The measurement is one ten-thousandth part of the tip of the hair. That is the seed, or basic principle. Now, on that small particle of spirit soul we have developed this body. We have got human bodies, other has got the elephant body, other has got the mountainous body, but this is external. The real seed is that one ten-thousandth part of the hair. Similarly, as you have developed this material body under different consciousness, similarly when we give up the material connection we shall develop our spiritual body, and in that spiritual body we shall be able to enter the kingdom of God, back to home, back to Godhead. This is the position. This body you have to give up, today or tomorrow or one hundred years after. You have to give it up. The Bhagavad-gītā says after giving up this body, tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9), after giving up this body he does not accept any more material body. Then what happens to him? Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti (BG 4.9), he comes to Me. So "He comes to Me" means just like in your country one who comes to you becomes citizen. He must have some particular qualities or conditions fulfilled, then he will be accepted as citizen or immigrant. Similarly, if we want to go back to home, back to Godhead, then we must develop our dormant spiritual qualities, and that is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. It is the training period for going back to home, back to Godhead. So that after giving up this body or after this time's death, others who are dying they do not know what next life they are getting. They, although they are proud of education, but they do not discuss what is the constitutional position of the soul, how he is transferring from one body to another, how it is to be done. This science is unknown to the modern education. Is it not? They do not know. They simply speculate. That is the defect of modern educational system, and actually everyone is seeking for spiritual emancipation. Therefore in your country, in spite of so many big, big universities, you are producing hippies, hopeless population. Am I saying right or not? Your are university teacher. I have seen in so many universities.

Room Conversation and Interview with Ian Polsen -- July 31, 1972, London:

Prabhupāda: Otherwise I would have asked you to live with us and work.

Devotee: We're trying to get another place with bigger facilities. Now they're sleeping in the hallways practically.

Prabhupāda: You have got your own apartment?

Ian Polsen: I've just transferred down from Edinburgh on Friday for the first time. So I have not found a place yet. I'm staying in a hotel for the time being.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Devotee (2) (Kulaśekhara?): Śrīla Prabhupāda, he used to be a shepherd in France.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Devotee (2) (Kulaśekhara?): He used to be a shepherd three years ago. He used to be a shepherd for some years. And, ah, he was with a Muslim man who was telling him about sac-cid-ānanda, explaining to him about the philosophy of sac-cid-ānanda, about the soul and the spirit. So in Spain—that's where I first met him—he said, "I may appear to you to be a businessman, but also I've been known as a shepherd."

Prabhupāda: So you can read our Teachings of Lord Caitanya. You have got?

Ian Polsen: Yes, I have got Caitanya's teachings. I have...

Prabhupāda: Nectar of Devotion, Teachings of Lord Caitanya, Bhagavad-gītā As It Is.

Room Conversation -- August 1, 1972, London:

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Devotee: There's not many from Hong Kong to America.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore she said send to India. Take information.

Devotee: Transfer to another boat. That will save them a thousand dollars a month.

Prabhupāda: That's nice. That's a thousand dollar contribution.

Devotee: Yeah. And as it grows, it will increase.

Prabhupāda: And send them a Gujarati paper, our magazine, distribution amongst their workers. That will satisfy (indistinct) sense.

Devotee: Hm. Tell that to Girirāja?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Devotee: Hundred, two hundred magazines.

Prabhupāda: Not hundred. Say fifty, for distribution amongst his officers.

Interview with the New York Times -- September 2, 1972, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: We are not preaching our own words; we are preaching God's words. Now it is up to you to make your choice. God says to give up all engagements and just surrender unto Him. God says:

man-manā bhava mad-bhakto
mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru
mām evaiṣyasi yuktvaivam
ātmānaṁ mat-parāyaṇaḥ
(BG 18.65)

"Engage your mind always in thinking of Me, offer obeisances and worship Me. Being completely absorbed in Me, surely you will come to Me." I am a member of the political party and am always thinking of Mr. Such and such, my leader. I become a staunch follower of that leader, worship him and offer obeisances to him. So many people are sacrificing their lives simply by following a political leader, and for party superiority they are doing so many things, always thinking of party's activities, always offering obeisances and worshiping the party's principles. If all these things are transferred to God, they become good. God says, "Think of Me, become My devotee, worship Me and offer obeisances unto Me." If we transfer these activities to God, we can become Kṛṣṇa conscious. That is what we are teaching. We advise that what you are doing for some nonsense, do it for God. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. It is not difficult. But if I want to love a dog and become a dog in my next life, instead of loving God and becoming like God in the next life, that is my choice. The prison and university are open to everyone, and by making our choice, we can make our future destiny. These boys and girls are worshiping God, and people criticize them, but when a man worships a dog, he is not criticized. In this way society has progressed. When one worships God, he is criticized, and when he worships dog, he is considered a gentleman. So it is folly to be wise where ignorance is bliss.

Conversation with Bajaj and Bhusan -- September 11, 1972, Arlington, Texas, At Their Home:

Prabhupāda: That's all. The finger, so long it is serving my body like this, like this, it is in real condition, real, healthy condition. And if it is painful—it cannot serve—then it is not in healthy condition. So therefore any living entity who is not serving Kṛṣṇa, he is not in healthy condition. He is in māyā. Anyone who is not in Kṛṣṇa's service, he is in māyā. That is, Kṛṣṇa says,

mamaivāṁśo jīva-loke
jīva-bhūtaḥ sanātanaḥ
manaḥ-ṣaṣṭhānīndriyāṇi
prakṛti-sthāni karṣati
(BG 15.7)

He is struggling hard within this material nature because he is not serving Kṛṣṇa. Therefore his punishment is to struggle hard in different species of life. There are 8,400,000 species of life, and he is transmigrating but becoming happy this way or that way, that way, that way. Just like you have come to America to become happy. Is it not? Otherwise why you left? Similarly, we are transmigrating from one country to another, one planet to another, one body to another, searching after happy, happiness. That is struggle for existence. So Kṛṣṇa says, "They are My part and parcel. Instead of serving Me, they are serving their mind and senses." Manaḥ-ṣaṣṭhānīndriyāṇi prakṛti-sthāni karṣati (BG 15.7). So long we serve our senses and mind we remain in this material world, prakṛti-sthāni. And as soon as we revive our real consciousness, Kṛṣṇa consciousness—we serve Kṛṣṇa—that is liberation. Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). That is the ultimate instruction. So instead of serving the senses, kāmādīnāṁ kati na katidhā, just like serving the country, serving the family, something, the wife, and serving the husband, serving the father—all the services are different phases of kāma. Kāmādīnāṁ kati na katidhā pālitā durnideśāḥ. So at the present moment we are serving our senses. When the sense service will be transferred to Kṛṣṇa, that is liberation. And this is bondage.

Introduction Speech By Dr. Kapoor and Conversation -- October 15, 1972, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So distribute. Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Everyone: Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) (some conversation in Hindi) tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti kaunteya (BG 4.9). Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti. (Hindi) Mām eti. Immediately. I have given them this idea that senses, finer than the senses is the mind, and finer than the mind is intelligence, and finer than the intelligence is the soul. So the speed of soul one can imagine by comparing the speed of the mind. The speed of the mind... You are sitting here. You can go immediately by the speed of mind, immediately twenty thousand miles or fifty thousand miles. But the soul is still finer. So how speedily we can go. That's a fact. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti. Because according to śāstra, we can understand that when it is settled up where the spirit soul is going to take birth... It is very shortly settled up, and then immediately he is transferred to the semina of the father. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa jantur dehopapattaye (SB 3.31.1). This is in the Bhāgavata. According to his karma and by the consideration of superior authority, the spirit soul is immediately transferred in the semina of the male, father. And he injects in the womb of the woman. And the two secretion emulsified, it becomes just like a pea, and that pea grows. And then nine holes are coming out, and they become eyes, ears, like that. But Kṛṣṇa says, tyaktvā deham. So after giving up this body, one is immediately transferred to another material body. But tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9). He does not take any more in the material body. Then immediately he comes, mām eti. So how speedily he can go. Because he has to go through the universe and the covering of the universe. The covering of the universe. There are also earth, water, air, fire, ten times. One element ten times more than the other element. That is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Arjuna, by the help of Kṛṣṇa, penetrated the walls of this universe, and he went to see Kāraṇodakśāyī Viṣṇu. And he returned. By the grace of Kṛṣṇa, he saw Kāraṇodakśāyī Viṣṇu. So penetrating this huge space and then covering, huge covering, and immediately he goes to Goloka Vṛndāvana, mām eti.

Dr. Kapoor: I think the journey is so, fast because it is not in time. Time is transcended.

Prabhupāda: Time has nothing to do. That is stated in the Second Canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam that time has no influence there.

Room Conversation -- October 25, 1972, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: What do they say?

Gurudāsa: They think. Then I say, "You can teach all the subjects and also teach the spiritual. "

Prabhupāda: If we organize our Bombay, then we shall regularly teach all the students from the very beginning. And in London also we shall. London, Dallas. So that these students will be transferred. Their parents will be very glad that our students have gone to foreign countries for study. We shall have very, very good sympathy(?). Our only policy will be the students should be taught very nice English for understanding our books.

Gurudāsa: In Bombay rather than Māyāpur?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Gurudāsa: In Bombay rather than...

Prabhupāda: Everywhere. Everywhere. But you make higher study, higher study, higher study.

Gurudāsa: Māyāpur can be the highest.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct), or everywhere this existence(?) should be lower class, higher class. But our all institutions should be for giving spiritual. We have got so many books. Simply he has to learn English and Sanskrit, that's all. (indistinct) So we are not going to follow the university curriculum, no. We have got our own.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- April 20, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: The living entities, when the soul is inside a body, they're much more flexible than the, the aeroplanes or cars that are made by the scientists?

Prabhupāda: Yes. The aeroplane wings, they're fixed up. But the bird wings, he can do like this. Even they can do like that, where is the credit? It is already there. Many millions and thousands. (pause)

Svarūpa Dāmodara: In physical sciences, there's a branch called thermodynamics that deals with the transfer of heat and energy in different forms. So their three laws is called first law, second law and the third law. First law deals with the conservation of energy in different forms. And the second law, it is stated that the energy of the universe is constant. Just like the, in the Śrī Īśopaniṣad, the Invocation, pūrṇa...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Pūrṇāt pūrṇam udacyate, pūrṇasya pūrṇam ādāya pūrṇam evāvaśiṣyate (Iso Invocation).

Svarūpa Dāmodara: On the other hand the second law says that the, the entropy, that means the randomness of the all natural, spontaneously occurring natural processes, always increase. The randomness...

Prabhupāda: But... Thing is that they are studying the laws very nicely. That's good. But they should appreciate that who has made this law? That is their defect. They are studying how the laws of nature is working. That's nice. But they should appreciate at the same time: Who made such subtle laws that they are working so nicely? That is our philosophy. We do not only study the laws and appreciate it, but we study the law-maker also. That is the difference between ourself and the so-called scientists. They are left, poor fund of knowledge. They cannot appreciate that there is a law-maker of these subtle laws. That is their defect. That is called poor fund of knowledge. And as soon as we accept law-maker, we have to accept that He's a person, He has got brain.

Morning Walk -- May 12, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: (break) Brahma-vaivarta Purāṇa? Asatiṁ caiva caturo lakṣam...(?)

Prabhupāda: Tān...

Svarūpa Dāmodara: jīva-jātiṣu.

Prabhupāda: Jīva-jātiṣu. Jīva-jātiṣu. That means the evolution means from one form to another. The forms are already... Jātiṣu. Their facilities, they are already there. The living entity is simply transferring himself. The same example: One man is transferring himself from one apartment to another. That apartment is first-class, second-class, third-class. Just a person has come from a lower class apartment to a first-class apartment. The person is the same. Now, according to his karma or according to his capacity of payment, he has got a good apartment. This is... Bhramadbhiḥ. Bhramat means wandering, wandering. Not that they... Evolution means developing. Is it not?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. I understand that part, but I also come across from Śrīla Prabhupāda's commentary on the Bhagavad-gītā that the living entities, all the living entities, 8,400,000 species, they are simultaneously created.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation With David Lawrence -- July 12, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Ah, na patiḥ. And one should not become husband also. Because husband is supposed to be instructor to the wife. Husband is the guardian of the wife. So he's responsible for her spiritual advancement. As much as the father is responsible for the spiritual advancement of his child, the spiritual master is responsible... Anyone who is claiming to be superior, he should be responsible for the inferior's spiritual advancement of life. So the conclusion is that they should not claim to become such and such unless they are able to save the subordinate from the imminent danger of death. Because death is there so long one is not spiritually advanced. As soon as one is spiritually advanced, he goes to the spiritual world, transferred. Mad-yājino 'pi yānti mām (BG 9.25). Spiritually advancement means to be transferred to the spiritual world. So this is the main business of the father, of the husband, of the spiritual master, of the king, of the guardian, of kinsmen. Everyone should be alert: "Whether I am helping my subordinate in the spiritual advancement of life." Because that will save him from the repetition of birth and death. And otherwise, what benefit you can do? If he's under the laws of karma, if he's going to become a cat or dog in next life, what help you have given to him? If he's under the laws of karma, then your help is no use. Your help is no use.

Room Conversation with Dr. Arnold Toynbee, Famous Historian, at his home or office -- July 22, 1973, London:

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: And you would believe that karma is continuous from...

Prabhupāda: Karma, yes.

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: ...one life to another.

Prabhupāda: Yes, transferred. Yes.

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Yes.

Prabhupāda: That is practical. If you become nice student...

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Karma can be...

Prabhupāda: ...then, in future, you become a nice professor. But if you do not study nicely, how you can become a professor?

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So karma you cannot deny.

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Similarly, in this life, my karma... That is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa. According to your karma and by the supervision of superior authority, you get a body. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa jantur deha upapattaye (SB 3.31.1). The living entity gets a certain type of body according to the karma. And this is allotted by superior authority.

Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London:

Lord Brockway: I wouldn't say it has convinced me one has to think...

Prabhupāda: No... Yes, one has to think, one has to consider. But this is the fact, that I have changed so many bodies, I remember them, but the bodies are not existing, I am existing. This is very simple philosophy. And it is stated, confirmed in Bhagavad-gītā, and it is accepted by all the ācāryas, learned scholars. So there is change of body or transferring from one body to another. That's a fact. Under the circumstances, we should consider what kind of body will be nice next. That is also stated in the Bhagavad-gītā.

yānti deva-vratā devān
pitṟn yānti pitṛ-vratāḥ
bhūtāni yānti bhūtejyā
yānti mad-yājino 'pi mām
(BG 9.25)

Just like people are trying to go to the moon planet. So if you prepare yourself, you haven't got to take a machine and go to the moon planet. You can go to the moon planet. That is stated in the śāstras. You can prepare yourself. That means transfer your, yourself to a body in the moon planet. You transfer yourself for a body in the sun planet. So there are innumerable planets. And there is a planet where Kṛṣṇa lives, or God lives, also. So if you like, you can transfer yourself to a body in Kṛṣṇa's planet. These are explained here. Simply you have to adopt the prescribed method. "By following this method, you transfer to such and such planet." "By following this method, you can transfer..." There is no need of taking this mechanical... That is not possible also. It is futile attempt. You cannot go by force. Because different planets, they have got different atmosphere. So you have to transfer yourself to a suitable body which is suitable in that planet. And for that, you have to prepare. You cannot go with this body into moon planet. Because atmosphere... Some scientists say... I read in the paper that the temperature in moon planet is two hundred degrees below zero. So how you can go and live there? It is not possible. But if you want to go there, you can go there after death by preparing yourself. You transfer yourself to a body there. That you can go. So in the Bhagavad-gītā we learn that you can transfer yourself, your soul, to any planet you like, but... Yad gatvā na nivartante tad dhāma paramaṁ mama (BG 15.6). "If you come to that planet from which you'll not have to come back again, that is My abode." So if I have to endeavor for getting another nice body in another planet, why not apply the same energy for going back to home, back to Godhead, unto Him? This is our conclusion.

Room Conversation with Graham Hill Former World Champion Race Car Driver -- London, August 26, 1973:

Śyāmasundara: Spiritual body.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is now covered by this material element. So emancipation or salvation means you no more get your material body. But your body is already there. Just like in this body, I have got my body. And because I have got a hand my dress has got a hand. Because I have got a leg, my pant has got a leg. So this superficial, external body is simply covering of your original body. The original body is spiritual. So go back to home back to Godhead means you remain in your original spiritual body. You get freedom from this covering of material body. Now that spiritual body you can transfer to so many ways.

Room Conversation with Graham Hill Former World Champion Race Car Driver -- London, August 26, 1973:

Prabhupāda: Higher planetary system of demigods, yes.

Pradyumna: "Those who worship ghosts and spirits will take birth amongst such beings. Those who worship ancestors go to the ancestors. And those who worship Me will live with Me."

Prabhupāda: Yes. So we can transfer to any form of body. Simply you have to prepare. But if we remain in our original body then you go back to home, back to Godhead.

Graham Hill: How do we attain our spiritual body?

Prabhupāda: You have got already spiritual body.

Graham Hill: I mean, how did I get my spiritual body?

Prabhupāda: Because you are part and parcel of God. God is all spirit. Just like materially, because you have got white body your son has got white body. Similarly, God is all spirit. Therefore you are son of God, part and parcel of God, then you are all spirit. But you have got this material covering because you wanted to come here and enjoy or lord it over the material nature. Everyone is trying to that. Everyone is trying to become a very prominent man in this material world. That is he can lord it over the material nature. So because you desire to lord it over the material nature you have to accept a material body.

Room Conversation with Dr. Christian Hauser, Psychiatrist -- September 10, 1973, Stockholm:

Prabhupāda: Just like you have got the desire to purchase another dress, garment, nicer, but if you have no money, then how you can purchase? You have to purchase something inferior. So these different species of life is the evolution of the living soul according to his karma. That is Vedic instruction. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa (SB 3.31.1). So I am a living entity. If I want to go to better condition of life, then I'll have to pay for it. Better condition is there already. Not this inferior condition changes into that better condition. That is another thing. Just like the condition in moon planet is different from the condition of this earthly planet. That is already there. You have to transfer yourself from this planet to that planet. So that point is missing in Darwin's theory. He says that body is evolving. That is nonsense. The body is evolving, then why the monkey body is not producing a human body at the present moment? Where is the evidence? The monkeys are already there. Where is the evidence in the zoo that a monkey has produced a human being? Do you think it is all right?

Room Conversation with Dr. Christian Hauser, Psychiatrist -- September 10, 1973, Stockholm:

Prabhupāda: The newspaper is glorification of this mundane world. You have to transfer your consciousness to understand the glorification of the Supreme. This is transcendental literature. So people have got the tendency to read but they're glorifying this rascal, mundane rascals. So that attitude should be transferred to understand the glorification of the Supreme Lord. That will be (indistinct). That we are presenting. We are presenting a literature exactly like the newspaper. They are glorifying some Nixon and Dixon. We are glorifying Kṛṣṇa. That is the difference. That is the difference. If Nixon has glorification, how much glorification is there in reserve of the Supreme Lord?

Dr. Hauser: But these Nixons and Dixons and Hitlers and... They have a rather...

Prabhupāda: That is illusion. We are attached to them.

Room Conversation with Banker -- September 21, 1973, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That is not other reason. There are many officers of your bank might be living there?

Banker: National and Grindlay's bank officers are there. Several British companies have officers there. I was the only American for awhile.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So you'll be moving out there again when you come back?

Banker: No, I've been transferred to New York. I'm in a hotel because my things are packed.

Prabhupāda: You are going to New York?

Banker: Next week. I brought Bhanu, so in the future if you need any help, you just see her in the bank. She's interested and aware.

Prabhupāda: She's going also with you?

Banker: She will be in Bombay. She's at our main branch.

Prabhupāda: You are working in the bank?

Lady: Yes.

Morning Walk -- December 2, 1973, Los Angeles:

Bali Mardana: No, most of them, they have lived, a very short times. But still is it a fact that the soul is transplanted from one body to another body?

Prabhupāda: That can be done, yes. Sometimes yogis, they can perform that better body, he transfers himself into that body. Just Śaṅkarācārya did, yes.

Karandhara: What they do, though, they wait till someone's dying or dead, and immediately after they die, they take the heart. From somebody who had the weak heart they transplant, change the heart.

Prabhupāda: So what...? There is no benefit.

Karandhara: But that does not mean that the soul from the old heart, or the new heart is being changed into the new body.

Bali Mardana: The soul has already left. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...the soul is individual. As I told yesterday that dead body has got the ingredients to produce life. But that the man who has left his body, you cannot produce him. That is the proof of individuality. That is the proof of individuality.

Morning Walk -- December 12, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes, then how you can think of it? Why do you question this?

Umāpati: Well, because God's inconceivable. I just...

Prabhupāda: No, that is not possible. He is eternal. Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). He is accepting the different types of bodies, but he is eternal. One body finished. That does not mean he is finished. He is transferred to another body according to his desire. He is never finished. Nityaḥ śāśvato 'yaṁ na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20).

Yaśomatīnandana: Avināśi tu tad viddhi.

Prabhupāda: Ah, avināśi tu tad viddhi yena sarvam idam. (break) ...is correct. We can face any so-called philosopher, any. Any so-called scientist. Any so-called politicians. You must be strong enough to have your firm conviction, that "We can face anyone rascal and defeat him." (break) ...and logic, argumentum vaculum. You know that? In logic there is a thesis or argumentum vaculum. Means no argument, but with stick and gun, you see. "If you don't believe, then here is stick and gun." That is called argumentum vaculum. So we have to make our position so strong that anyone who does not believe in God, he should be finished.

Morning Walk -- December 18, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prajāpati: It is a tiny structure of organic matter that can constantly reproduce...

Prabhupāda: That's all right. When reproduce, the last body is gone.

Prajāpati: They say that the chromosomes that are transferred from father to son...

Prabhupāda: Still, the father's body is not the son's body. It is different body.

Prajāpati: It has come from father's body.

Prabhupāda: That all right, but the father's body is different. The father's pains and pleasure and the son's pains and pleasure are not the same. It may be that the father has given the ingredient of the body, but that does not mean the father's body and the son's body the same. Neither the mind is same, neither intelligence is same. It is all different. Otherwise why a son becomes disobedient to the father, "I don't agree with you"? That means, "Your intelligence, your mind, is different from my mind. I cannot agree with you." Therefore everything is different.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 15, 1974, Hawaii:

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. Feeling all right? I think you joined when I first came here?

Jayaśrī: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Thank you. (break) ...savitā sakala-grahāṇām. Gāyatrī mantra is worshiping the sun. Yac cakṣur eṣa savitā sakala-grahāṇāṁ rājā samasta-sura-mūrtir aśeṣa-tejāḥ, unlimitedly powerful, unlimitedly heated. Aśeṣa, how much heat is there, your brain cannot accommodate. And therefore it is said, aśeṣa-tejāḥ: "without any limit." This is God's creation. Where is the scientist who can create a small sun? How this water is going there? Where is the pipe? You rascal, if you want to pump your water in the skyscraper building, you require pumping and pipe and so many things, but where is the pipe? And where is the pumping station or pumping machine? But you'll find so much water. How the water is transferred there? What is their explanation? They'll use simply some bogus jugglery of words. That's all. But produce it, without pipe, without pump. Let the water go up, up. "Yes, we are trying. In future we shall do it." And what about of the present? Who is that scientist?

Bali Mardana: They say it is an accident, that the world is going to the...

Prabhupāda: They are rascals. Therefore I always say, "Kick them on their face with your shoes, so-called scientists." "Accident." There is no question of accident. Mūḍha. Therefore they have been described in the Bhagavad-gītā as mūḍhāḥ, rascals, narādhama. Narādhama, the lowest of the mankind. Because they got this opportunity to appreciate the work of Kṛṣṇa, but they avoid it, they are narādhama. No, they are so big, big graduate, scientists, and..." māyayāpahṛta-jñānāḥ (BG 7.15). Their real knowledge is taken away, simply childish proposing something, so-called scientists. Real knowledge is to see everywhere Kṛṣṇa, mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ sūyate sa-carācaram (BG 9.10). The supervision of Kṛṣṇa. That is real knowledge. Not only to appreciate, but to explain it also. Kaniṣṭha-adhikārī will appreciate, but cannot explain how it is being done. Madhyama-adhikārī will explain. That is preacher. And uttama-adhikārī, he thinks that everyone knows, everyone knows. He does not see that somebody knows, somebody does not know. He sees everyone knows. That is uttama-adhikārī. He does not make any distinction.

Morning Walk -- March 15, 1974, Vrndavana:

Gupta: (Hindi for few sentences)

Prabhupāda: Rascal civilization, rascal government. And people are transferred into rascals. (Hindi) Annād bhavanti bhūtāni (BG 3.14). Without anna, how they can live? There is no arrangement for anna. They're simply passing resolution, legislative laws. And no anna. Just see what kind of wretched government it is. Everywhere. There is no anna. Annād bhavanti bhūtāni. The first duty of government is to see that everyone is happy, without any anxiety. These preliminary necessities of life, āhāra-nidra-bhaya-maithunam, there must be sufficient arrangement for these preliminary necessities of life. One must eat sumptuously. Not over-eating, indulgence. No. But he must have sufficient food to keep up the health. Similarly, he must have place to sleep. We, we are prepared to offer everything. And be Kṛṣṇa conscious. This is our mission. Not by eating and sleeping, become rogues and thieves and rascals. That we will not allow. That is varṇāśrama-dharma. (Hindi conversation for a few sentences) Why unemployment? There is no scarcity (of) water. Just have a big well. Electricity pump water. Oh, immediately, it will be all green. Immediately. (Hindi for a while) Jayo! Hare Kṛṣṇa! (break) ...all round, for the benefit of the human society. You'll be honored everywhere. Everywhere, any part of the world. And automatically these bogus avatāra, incarnations, God, and yogis and swamis will be all doomed. You see? These rascal society, avatāra, "Bhagavān," incarnations, yogis, these rascals will be doomed.

Morning Walk -- March 16, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: On the basis of Bhagavad-gītā, then nobody can supercede. (break) ...he turns back all our money invested, (indistinct) people. (break) ...if he's prepared to pay double the price, so why not pay the full price, fourteen lakhs? We have paid two lakhs, let him pay twelve lakhs and he'll immediately transfer, and we'll take double price from him, so that... (break) ...if he's so eager. These, these are practical. If he's prepared to pay double, why not pay us? (break—switches to room conversation) Sun is the same. The power observation, this is a morning sun, this is noon sun. The sun is the same. We sometimes say that because this noon sun, it is so strong. So sun is always powerful. It is our appreciation, relative appreciation, that we consider in the morning it is less scorching and in the noon it is very scorching. Kṛṣṇa is always Kṛṣṇa. ...tābhir ya eva nija-rūpatayā kalābhiḥ. Nija-rūpa kalā taya.

Morning Walk -- March 24, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So the position is constitutionally I am servant, but at the present moment, being conditioned by the material nature, I am giving service to my senses. Hare Kṛṣṇa. But if I give service to the master of the senses, Hṛṣīkeśa... Because senses, they are not independent. They are also dependent. Suppose I am now moving my hands, but if the master of my hand, Kṛṣṇa, paralyzes it, no more moving. Neither I can renovate the moving capacity of my hand. Therefore I am not master. Although I am claiming I am master of my hand, master of my leg, but actually I am not. The master is different. Therefore Kṛṣṇa's another name is Hṛṣīkeśa, master of the senses. Therefore the service should be transferred. Hṛṣīkeṇa hṛṣīkeśa-sevanaṁ bhaktir ucyate (CC Madhya 19.170). We have engaged our senses for different purposes, but when we engage our senses for the service of the master of the senses, that is called bhakti. Bhakti is also service, but it is not service to the senses, but it is service to the master of the senses. This is bhakti. So constitutionally I am servant. I cannot become master. I have to serve. So if I don't serve the master of the senses, then I will have to serve the senses. This is our position.

Morning Walk -- March 31, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: The cowherd boys, the girls, the elderly persons, the trees, the flowers, the land, the birds, the beasts, the cows-their center was Kṛṣṇa. So we have to follow their footprints, how to... We have got already attachment.

Mr. Sar: Yes. Yogaṁ yuñjan mad-āśrayaḥ.

Prabhupāda: No, attachment we have got for material things. That we have to transfer. This is yoga practice.

Mr. Sar: That is yoga practice. Correct.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yoga indriya-saṁyamaḥ. Yoga, the... I think it is Patañjali sūtra.

Guest (1): Yoga citta bhūti yoga. (?)

Prabhupāda: Yes. Citta bhūti...

Guest (1): Yoga citta bhūti nirodha.

Prabhupāda: Nirodha. So our activities are now materially centered—how to satisfy the senses. All these so-called improvements, material improvements, means how to satisfy the senses. So this aśaktiḥ, attachment, for material sense gratification...

Guest (2): Has to be transferred.

Prabhupāda: To Kṛṣṇa. Yes. Mayy āsakta-manaḥ partha. This is yoga. This is bhakti-yoga.

Morning Walk -- April 7, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes, Hare Kṛṣṇa. The maidservant, she changed her own son and kept the real royal family, defended him. Her child was killed.

Yaśomatīnandana: Is it a true story?

Prabhupāda: Yes, why not? (break) ...and maternal uncle of Rāvaṇa.

Yaśomatīnandana: Did Kaṁsa also achieve the grace? He was immediately transferred to the spiritual planets after he was killed?

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break)

Girirāja: ...being killed by Viṣṇu in his previous life he wasn't transferred?

Prabhupāda: No, three times he had to take birth. Hiraṇyākṣa.

Yaśomatīnandana: Is that Jaya and Vijaya?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Yaśomatīnandana: He was one of them?

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) ...becomes envious of others, they take birth as dogs, snake, sarpa krūra khala krūra. So much subtle laws are working. They do not know.

Morning Walk -- April 8, 1974, Bombay:

Yaśomatīnandana: Who says that?

Prabhupāda: Vivekananda. (break) ...physical strength. (break)

Yaśomatīnandana: ...Dvārakā.

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa was transferred to Vṛndāvana. Not other (indistinct).

Yaśomatīnandana: Kṛṣṇa had other brothers and sisters besides Balarāma and Subhadrā?

Prabhupāda: We hear only two. (break)

Devotee: Once I asked you that question in 1968, and you answered that Subhadrā sat on Kṛṣṇa's lap and smiled. That was her activity.

Prabhupāda: (break) ...maybe. Go on reading. (break) ...asac chāstram pracchanaṁ bauddham ucyate. The Māyāvāda is a very dangerous philosophy. It has made the whole world atheistic. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. Māyāvādam asac-chāstraṁ pracchanaṁ bauddham ucyate. They cannot understand that this is a dangerous philosophy.

Morning Walk Excerpts -- May 2, 1974, Bombay:

Satsvarūpa: Prabhupāda, we are only neophytes. How we can know if our anxiety is still material when we feel anxiety in devotional service?

Prabhupāda: No, no. If you feel anxiety for Kṛṣṇa, then it is not material. That anxiety is not... That is love. That is pure love, that... Why you become anxious for our children? Because there is love. So whole scheme is that you have to transfer your attachment to Kṛṣṇa.

Dr. Patel: All bhakti should be directed to the sacred feet of Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. Mayy āsakta-manāḥ pārtha yogaṁ yuñjan. This is called bhakti-yoga. Mayy āsakta. The aśakti, the attachment, is for so many things. Now we have to concentrate it on Kṛṣṇa. This is bhakti-yoga. Mayy āsakta manāḥ pārtha yogaṁ yuñjan mad-āśrayaḥ. Simply by this concentration of an attraction to Kṛṣṇa, you become liberated. This is the process.

Dr. Patel: First you must perfect your thinking of Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Yes. When you think of Kṛṣṇa, you are on the transcendental position. You are not in the material world. Māṁ ca vyabhicāriṇi bhakti-yogena yaḥ sevate, sa guṇān samatītya etān. He is immediately transcendental to all the qualities of material world.

Room Conversation with Irish Poet, Desmond O'Grady -- May 23, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: Purport.

Nitāi: This verse is a reply to Arjuna's third question: What is the means of attaining to the transcendental position? As explained before, the material world is acting under the spell of the modes of material nature. One should not be disturbed by the activities of the modes of nature; instead of putting his consciousness into such activities, he may transfer his consciousness to Kṛṣṇa activities. Kṛṣṇa activities are known as bhakti-yoga—always acting for Kṛṣṇa. This includes not only Kṛṣṇa, but His different plenary expansions such as Rāma and Nārāyaṇa. He has innumerable expansions. One who is engaged in the service of any of the forms of Kṛṣṇa, or of His plenary expansions, is considered to be transcendentally situated. One should also note that all the forms of Kṛṣṇa are fully transcendental, blissful, full of knowledge and eternal. Such personalities of Godhead are omnipotent and omniscient, and they possess all transcendental qualities. So, if one engages himself in the service of Kṛṣṇa or His plenary expansions with unfailing determination, although these modes of material nature are very difficult to overcome, he can overcome them easily. This is already explained in the Seventh Chapter. One who surrenders unto Kṛṣṇa at once surmounts the influence of the modes of material nature. To be in Kṛṣṇa consciousness or in devotional service means to acquire the equality of Kṛṣṇa. The Lord says that His nature is eternal, blissful and full of knowledge, and the living entities are part and parcel of the Supreme, as gold particles are part of a gold mine. Thus the living entity's spiritual position is as good as gold, as good as Kṛṣṇa in quality. The difference of individuality continues, otherwise there is no question of bhakti-yoga. Bhakti-yoga means that the Lord is there, the devotee is there and the activity of exchange of love between the Lord and the devotee is there. Therefore the individuality of two persons is present in the Supreme Personality of Godhead and the individual person, otherwise there is no meaning to bhakti-yoga. If one is not situated in the same transcendental position with the Lord, one cannot serve the Supreme Lord. To be a personal assistant to a king, one must acquire the qualifications. Thus the qualification is to become Brahman, or freed from all material contamination. It is said in the Vedic literature: brahmaiva san brahmāpyeti. One can attain the Supreme Brahman by becoming Brahman. This means that one must qualitatively become one with Brahman. By attainment of Brahman, one does not lose his eternal Brahman identity as individual soul.

Prabhupāda:

brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā
na śocati na kāṅkṣati
samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu
mad-bhaktiṁ labhate parām
(BG 18.54)

Find out this verse.

O'Grady: The best truth, and I think it's truth for most of us who take ourselves seriously...

Prabhupāda: Just like in our society, we have got Americans, we have got Africans, Canadians, Indians, Christians, Jews, Mohammedans. But they are no longer Mohammedan, American, Christian or African. They are all servants of Kṛṣṇa. And that is Brahmān realization.

Morning Walk at Villa Borghese -- May 26, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: That is the benefit they do not understand. Here the philosophy is to make nil material benefit. And that is sometimes havoc for others. Niṣkiñcanasya. Caitanya Mahāprabhu says... (aside:) Don't bring near. Niṣkiñcanasya. Niṣkiñcana means... Kiñcana means something and niṣkiñcana means even no something. Kiñcana means something, to possess something, and niṣkiñcana means to possess nothing. Niṣkiñcanasya bhagavad-bhajanonmukhasya. Bhagavad-bhajana... So go back to home back to Godhead, is meant for such persons who has nothing to possess here. That is very difficult. Niṣkiñcanasya bhagavad-bhajanonmukhasya pāraṁ paraṁ jigamiṣor bhava-sāgarasya. The real aim, real benefit, is how to be transferred to the other nature, spiritual nature. Pāraṁ param. They do not know that beyond the sky, there is spiritual sky, there is another nature. They have no information. Even they do not know what are there in higher planetary systems. They think, "Here everything is..." This is an insignificant planet in the whole creation, but their fund of knowledge so poor, they think this is the position. They are trying to maintain what was achieved.

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: No, heating. Heating we can do by wood. By nature.

Dhanañjaya: I remember, Śrīla Prabhupāda, you were saying that all we require is some oxen, and the oxen can carry.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The oxen will solve the problem of transport. That bullock cart. Just like Kṛṣṇa, when He was transferred from Gokula to Nandagrāma, so they took all the bullock carts, and within a few hours they transported them, the whole thing, their luggage, family member, everything.

Bhagavān: How far can a bullock cart travel in one day?

Prabhupāda: At least ten miles, very easily, very easily. And maximum he can travel fifteen miles, twenty miles. But when we are localized, we don't require to go beyond ten miles, five miles. Because we have created a rubbish civilization, therefore one is required to go fifty miles for earning bread, hundred miles, hanging.

Dhanañjaya: Like in Los Angeles.

Prabhupāda: Why Los Angeles? Everywhere. In New York they are coming from hundred miles. From the other side of the island. First ferry steamer, then bus, then so on, so on. Three hours, four hours, they spend for transport.

Room Conversation with Biochemist, Dr. Sallaz -- June 4, 1974, Geneva:

Yogeśvara: He says that at least on these points we are in agreement.

Prabhupāda: Therefore the real inconvenience is that I am eternal. I am now put into such condition that I have to change my body, and there is risk of getting degraded body. Therefore my problem is that—I am put into this condition, repetition of change of body—to get out of it—that is spiritual life—and transfer myself there. Paras tasmāt tu bhāvo 'nyaḥ (BG 8.20). Just like we are in this material nature. If we transfer to that spiritual nature, then there is no more this problem, getting this body, again annihilate, again get another body, again annihilate. This problem is solved. And that is spiritual life. (French)

Yogeśvara: So he says they completely accept that there is a superior energy which can be attained.

Prabhupāda: So therefore human activities should be dovetailed for going back to home, back to Godhead. That is spiritual movement. (French)

Yogeśvara: This is also their idea. This is their point.

Prabhupāda: We are giving this idea in practical form. Why not cooperate with us? (French)

Yogeśvara: He says first of all, so far as cooperation is concerned, he is just one man. He is the president, although he is the president, still, he is only one man, and he can only speak in terms of cooperating with the spiritual movement among the more enlightened members of his group.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is required, because if the enlightened men of the society does something, others will follow. It is not that the general mass of people has to be educated. They will be automatically educated. They will follow. If the enlightened man is living in such a way that he is going to be transferred to the spiritual world, then others will follow. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā, yad yad ācarati śreṣṭhaḥ (BG 3.21). At least, there must be a class of men, ideal men, that they are preparing themselves for transferring to the spiritual world. Then people will see that "Here is the ideal man," and they will try to follow. (French) But if people see that "He is also like us. He is also drinking, he is also eating meat, and he is also having illicit sex," then where is the ideal man? Everyone is implicated with these things, sinful life.

Morning Walk -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Mādhavānanda: Then as soon as one begins to understand who he is, the transmigration stops.

Prabhupāda: Yes. What is that understanding? His understanding is that "I am eternal servant of Kṛṣṇa. So let me surrender to Kṛṣṇa as He wants and serve Him." This is life. As soon as he is on this platform, then he is out of illusion. And if he is perfect, then just after giving up this body he goes to Kṛṣṇa. This is the process. If he does not fall from this transcendental service of Kṛṣṇa, then immediately after death he is transferred. Just like we are transferred from this gross body to subtle body, similarly, after death a devotee is transferred immediately to the Kṛṣṇa, where Kṛṣṇa is there, either within this material world or... They are first of all given chance to go to Kṛṣṇa. In any brahmāṇḍa there is Kṛṣṇa. Nitya-līlā is going on. So he is born there. Then actually plays with Kṛṣṇa, dance with Kṛṣṇa, talks with Kṛṣṇa. Apprenticeship. This is also apprenticeship here. So is there any difficulty of perception?

Satsvarūpa: No.

Prabhupāda: Why you said that "I have no perception?" There is perception, every day, every night. How you can say there is no perception? The perception is so strong, sometimes one dreaming some horrible position, he cannot more sleep. The sleep breaks. So why there is no perception? He is so much troubled that breaks. He immediately comes to the safe side of this gross body.

Room Conversation with Pater Emmanuel (A Benedictine Monk) -- June 22, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: So it doesn't matter, Kṛṣṇa or Christ. The name is there. And we are recommending according to Vedic scripture that in this age one should simply chant the holy name of God. We are chanting that,

Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Hare Hare
Hare Rāma Hare Rāma Rāma Rāma Hare Hare

Rāma and Kṛṣṇa, they are the name of God. And Harā is the energy of God. So we are chanting Kṛṣṇa, or God, along with His energy. He has got two energies, spiritual energy and material energy. So at the present moment we are under the jurisdiction of material energy. So we are praying to Kṛṣṇa, "Kindly transfer me from the service of material energy to the service of spiritual energy." This is our whole philosophy. Hare Kṛṣṇa movement means, "O the energy of God and O God, Kṛṣṇa, please engage me in your service." Because our constitutional position is to give service. Some way or other, we have been put in the service of the material energy. So this service can be transferred to the spiritual energy. Then our life is successful. That is our philosophy, bhakti-mārga, bhakti-yoga. Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktam (CC Madhya 19.170). Here we are giving service as Hindu, as Muslim, as Christian, as Jain, as this or that. These are designation. Designation. When we become free of the designation and then serve God, that is called bhakti or devotion. Just like we have manufactured Christian religion, Hindu religion, Muslim religion, this religion, that religion. But when the religion will be without designation—I am neither Hindu nor Muslim nor Christian, but I am servitor of God—that is pure religion.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- February 3, 1975, Hawaii:

Guru-kṛpa: So they say, "Then my chanting is useless? So I should stop?" That's what they say.

Prabhupāda: No, not useless. But just like if you kindle fire and at the same time pour water, it will take long time. To kindle fire, make it dry, keep it dry. Then it will be very quickly successful. So you are committing offenses, at the same time chanting, so by chanting effect, you will come to that stage, but it will take time. If you want to be transferred to the spiritual world quickly, just like if you want to ignite the fire very quickly, you must keep it dry. If you simply put on the wet wood, then the fire will not be very powerful. It will be... It will take time. The fire will be blazing fire. Then it will dry. It will take... Better put dry wood to make it successful. This is the process. The effect of chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa will not go in vain, but it will take time. Nāmnad balād yasya hi pāpa-buddhiḥ. Because he is thinking "By the strength of chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, I can do anything, all sinful activities, and it will be adjusted," that is the greatest offense, not only offense, the greatest offense. Nāmnad balād yasya hi pāpa-buddhiḥ.

Room Conversation with Woman Sanskrit Professor -- February 13, 1975, Mexico:

Prabhupāda: He could not finish. You see? There are so many things. We are thinking, "By finishing this, we shall be happy," but that is sometimes hampered. So ānanda is checked. So this is the position. So higher means where ānanda is not checked. That is higher position. The purpose is ānanda, but in this material world we are experiencing ānanda being checked. Just like nobody wants to die. That's a fact. Why you shall die? I already discussed that I know that I was a child, I was a boy, I was a young man, and now I have got this body, old man's body. It is now going to finish. So I am little anxious. Now, whatever ānanda I was drawing in my living condition, now it is going to be finished. But if we think properly that "I am eternal, so although the body will be finished, I'll not be finished..." This is very natural, that "I was not finished. Because my childhood body was finished, so I was not finished. My boyhood body was not finished; I was not finished. My youthhood was finished, but I was not finished." Similarly, the conclusion should be: "Even though this body will be finished, I'll not be finished." That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, tathā dehāntara prāptir dhīras tatra na muhyati (BG 2.13). Dhīra, one who is intelligent, he is not disturbed. Dhīras tatra na muhyati. So dhīra, one who is dhīra, sober, philosopher, he knows that "I am not going to be finished. I shall have to accept another body." Now, whether that body will be ānanda? That is the consideration. I'll get another body, just like I have got this body, after changing so many bodies. Moment after moment, we are changing body. That is the medical science, changing of blood corpuscles. So this body will be changed again. Then I will have to enter the mother's womb and packed up for at least ten months in suffocated condition. This is scientific, all. Then again I'll come out when the body is prepared nicely to come out and exist. So that period of formation of body is not ānanda. To remain compact in this way for ten months, it is not ānanda. It is not ānanda, just opposite ānanda. Then when we die... Die, death, means the miserable condition is so great that we cannot live. We have to go out. There is no ānanda. Then, when we have got this body, changing, there is no ānanda because we are sometimes diseased, and to become old man, that is also not ānanda. Therefore I am eternal. I am seeking after something which is eternal ānanda. Therefore next consideration should be that "Whether this condition of repetition of birth, death, old age and disease can be changed?" That is next question. And if there is possibility, then we shall try for it. But there is possibility here. The conclusion is: so long we get this material body... Because matter is not eternal. Anything you take, material—earth, water, fire, air, sky, mind, intelligence and false ego—these are all material things. So these material things, they are not eternal, none of them. This table is created; it is not eternal. It will be finished at a certain date, anything you take. But I am eternal. So if I transfer myself in another nature which is eternal, then my ānanda will be eternal. That is the purpose of life.

Room Conversation with Woman Sanskrit Professor -- February 13, 1975, Mexico:

Hṛdayānanda: If music is important to us?

Prabhupāda: No, first of all, our basic principle is pleasure. So whatever gives pleasure, we accept. That is natural. But in the material world, they take material pleasure, but we are for spiritual pleasure. So as soon as we speak of pleasure, there must be varieties. Without... Variety is the mother of enjoyment. So the only thing is that the material pleasure, that is temporary. It is finished after certain period, and spiritual means eternal. So our endeavor is to transfer ourself from this material pleasure to the spiritual pleasure. But the pleasure is the aim, either in this material world or in the spiritual world. This is... Ānandamayo 'bhyāsāt (Vedānta-sūtra 1.1.12). This is the Vedic... Our position is ānandamaya, to remain in pleasure. But here in this material world, the body is temporary, and everything is temporary. Therefore pleasure is temporary.

Room Conversation with Canadian Ambassador to Iran -- March 13, 1975, Iran:

Prabhupāda: Oh, Dutch. Dutch people, there were.

Ambassador: Germans especially. But now may I ask you while I have the chance? You have had so much to do with bringing the dharma to the West. What is your idea? What is your mission? It seems to me, in many ways there is a transfer of the essential spirit going West, because the interest is there.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Ambassador: And what is left in the East is so often just the materialism imitated from the West among many young people now.

Prabhupāda: Where, in the East? Yes.

Ambassador: In the East. So there's been a crossover taking place.

Prabhupāda: Hm, yes.

Ambassador: Do you see it like that?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. In Western countries they are now fed up with this materialistic way of life. And I think it will very soon collapse, the Western way of life. And naturally the next enquiry is spiritual.

Room Conversation with Yoga Student -- March 14, 1975, Iran:

Prabhupāda: A simple formula. Anyone can think of Kṛṣṇa always. Anyone can offer obeisances. Bhava mad-bhaktaḥ. Anyone can serve Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa is open to everyone. So four principle: man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru. Even a child can do that. And by doing these four things he becomes perfect. And the other verse,

māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya
ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ
striyo vaiśyās tathā śūdrās
te 'pi yānti parāṁ gatim
(BG 9.32)

It is open for everyone. Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ. Even born in low-grade family, it doesn't matter. If he accepts these four principles, te 'pi yānti parāṁ gatiḥ, they also become transferred to the supreme goal. And Kṛṣṇa is not meant for any particular type of men or nation or country. No. Kṛṣṇa says... Find out this verse, sarva-yoniṣu kaunteya sambhavanti mūrtayaḥ...

Nitāi:

sarva-yoniṣu kaunteya
mūrtayaḥ sambhavanti yāḥ
tāsāṁ brahma mahad yonir
ahaṁ bīja-pradaḥ pitā
(BG 14.4)

"It should be understood that all species of life, O son of Kuntī, are made possible by birth in this material nature, and that I am the seed-giving father."

Prabhupāda: So He is the father of all species of life, origin. Actually every one of us, we are part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa. So Kṛṣṇa is not for a particular person. For everyone.

Morning Walk -- April 7, 1975, Mayapur:

Yaśodānandana: ...which he is satisfied with, we also have a standard of happiness which we are satisfied with, as devotees. Could there be... Who is to say there is not a higher standard of happiness, higher than what we think is the ultimate happiness? See, we are thinking that to become liberated from this material body and go back to home is the highest happiness, and we are feeling this is our standard of happiness.

Prabhupāda: Hmm. Because the happiness which you are enjoying these are not actually satisfying. You are not actually satisfied, therefore you want transfer of happiness from this field to that field. That means you are not actually happy. Otherwise, why these rascals they are enjoining the same vagina at home and why they go to see vagina in the theater? The vagina is there, but they think that to see vagina at home is not so good, but to see vagina on the stage is better. That is all. Disappointment. You'll see the same vagina, here and there. You'll go there by purchasing ticket. That is your misfortune.

Morning Walk -- May 10, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: That means there are other sources of understanding—not only the eyes. The rascals do not know. They want to see.

Paramahaṁsa: Of course a person can never be completely sure...

Prabhupāda: Therefore, jñāna cakṣuṣa. You can see with knowledge how this man is being transferred to the eternal life. But you have no such knowledge! You are monkey. A monkey cannot see, a monkey cannot understand. Suppose there is a dog at my house. He does not understand how I have come here, because he has no knowledge. So seeing means knowledge. Seeing, not the eyes. He wants to see by the eyes. He's a monkey. That's all. He's a dog.

Paramahaṁsa: But first we have to believe it, and then we can see it?

Prabhupāda: It is not the question of belief. It is a fact. It is a fact in this way, that Kṛṣṇa says, tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9)—that's all. You have to see through Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa is perfect. Kṛṣṇa says that a such and such person devotee, after giving up this body, he does not accept. That is seeing. Kṛṣṇa says and you see. Just like you believe me. A child believes the father. Similarly, if the authority is there, then you see by his word, that's all. That is knowledge. Seeing by perfect knowledge—that is seeing. Not by endeavoring with these imperfect senses. That is not knowledge.

Room Coversation with Psychiatrist and Indian Boy -- May 12, 1975, Perth:

Śrutakīrti: I think Brahmānanda Mahārāja mentioned? Acyutānanda.

Prabhupāda: So, everyone is attracted with the woman's body. In your country I have seen the advertisement: "bottomless," "topless..." That is the material attraction. Everyone is in this material world on account of attachment. And similarly, for woman, the man's body is beautiful. So in this way both of them are attached to one another. That is the basic principle of material life. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tuccham kaṇḍūyanena karayor iva duḥkha-duḥkham (SB 7.9.45). They become attached. On account of sex life, they become more attached, and therefore both of them remain almost perpetually in this material world, and to satisfy different desires they transmigrate from one body to another. And on account of accepting this material body, there is always miserable condition. Therefore everyone requires the psychiatric treatment so that the mind may be transferred from matter to spirit soul. Then he will be cured. The disease is of the mind. Harāv abhaktasy kuto mahād-guṇa mano-rathena. Everyone is riding on the chariot of mind. And the mind is taking him here and there, here... And the yoga practice is also treatment. This is also yoga, bhakti-yoga, and this ordinary haṭha-yoga, that is also treatment of the mind. Treatment of mind means controlling the senses. Yoga indriya-samyamaḥ. Mind is the leader of the senses. So if the treatment of the mind is done properly, then the senses work properly. The example is the madman. Because the madman's mind is not controlled, he is acting in a way—people say, "Here is a madman."

Morning Walk -- May 14, 1975, Perth:

Amogha: So pure goodness actually means those eight qualities mentioned in the Gītā but without any contamination of the lower qualities.

Prabhupāda: Yes. In the material world, goodness is prone to be contaminated. In the spiritual world, the other two qualities, they are not existing. So there is no question of contamination. Here all men are covered by these two base qualities, all men and animal, everyone, passion and ignorance. Therefore, first of all, they have to be brought to the platform of goodness. And if they can keep goodness uncontaminated, they are transferred to the spiritual world.

Devotee (1): Just like you say. Some of the devotees, they fall down although they're striving to be in the mode of goodness. If they're sincere, they still fall down?

Prabhupāda: If they are sincere, how they can fall down? They are not sincere; therefore they fall down.

Amogha: Madhudviṣa Swami was telling us once that sincerity must be combined with spiritual strength.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Spiritual strength means sincerity and sincerity means spiritual strength. If I promise before the fire, before the Deity, before my spiritual master that "I shall observe the rules and regulation," and if I don't follow, then where is my sincerity?

Devotee (1): But the devotees, they're trying to be in the mode of goodness. In the Bhagavad-gītā...

Prabhupāda: Well, the trying... Then why do you take initiation and promise? You are trying. First of all, you be fixed up. Why do you cheat Kṛṣṇa, the spiritual master, the fire? If you are not fixed up, you should not take initiation.

Room Conversation with Ganesa dasa's Mother and Sister -- May 14, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: And if you take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, you understand Kṛṣṇa, then you become free.

Sister: But your body still suffers death, old age.

Prabhupāda: Yes, as soon as you get a material body, you have to suffer. Either this body, Australian body or American body or dog's body or cat's body or tree's body, any body, material world, you will have to suffer. First of all, this transfer of body, that is also suffering. In the material world it is only suffering, but because people are in ignorance, they take suffering as enjoyment.

Mother: Then why there is so much human suffering?

Prabhupāda: Because he has accepted this material body.

Mother: And this is why there's so much human suffering.

Prabhupāda: Yes, on account of accepting a material body. Therefore every one of us should try how to avoid this process of accepting a material body. That should be our only endeavor, not to make a temporary solution. That is not very good solution.

Room Conversation with Ganesa dasa's Mother and Sister -- May 14, 1975, Perth:

Sister: What about like euthanasia, say. Isn't that nonacceptance of a material body? If by some, for some reason the child isn't allowed to be born?

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is said here, that if you understand Kṛṣṇa, then after giving up this body—this is material body, you have to give up—so you are not coming again in the womb of another material mother. You are transferred to the spiritual world by nature's law. They do not know the subtle laws which is going on underneath. They are simply concerned superficially. Because they have no knowledge of the spirit soul—they think the body is everything—so therefore knowledge is imperfect. Body is only the covering. Real person is the spirit soul. So the modern education has no knowledge of this.

Mother: But most people are materialistically minded, aren't they? There's very few that aren't.

Gaṇeśa: Most people are materialistically minded. Not many people are spiritually inclined.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the defect of the modern civilization.

Mother: Yes.

Discussion -- May 15, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: So we are trying to make some first-class men. That's all. This is our aim. Even if he is fourth-class man, it doesn't matter. If he takes up the training, he becomes first class. And as soon as he becomes a first-class man, ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti, even if he is not liberated, he goes in higher planetary system amongst the demigods. Then there he gets more advanced. He goes to Brahmā. If he is not directly transferred to the spiritual world, then he gets these facilities. And with Brahmā, at the end of this creation, annihilation, they go to the spiritual world.

Devotee (1): Just by becoming first-class men.

Prabhupāda: That is described. Śamo damas titikṣā, that... You were not here, hearing? That is first class.

Devotee (1): So just by becoming first-class men you can go to the heavenly planets?

Prabhupāda: Yes. But that is meant for a first-class man. Ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti. Ūrdhvam means higher planetary system.

Room Conversation with Journalist -- May 19, 1975, Melbourne:

Journalist: What about other artifacts of civilization like television and motorcars...

Prabhupāda: Yes, it is very good, just like we also use motorcar, but not for fashion. Suppose if we go for preaching. If we can go by car quickly, we take advantage of the car. We have got many cars for preaching work. So everything is good, provided it is used for progressive goodness. (coughs) That our mistake is that when... Now listen, there is the mistake in Darwin's theory also. He has no information that the evolution is taking place, of the body, by the desire of the soul. That he does not know. Just like sometimes people were happy and living in a small cottage. Now they are making big, big skyscraper building. So what is the difference? The cottage and this... The cottage is not becoming the skyscraper building but the man who was living in the cottage, by his desire the skyscraper building is coming. Similarly the evolution means the soul within the body desires a certain type of body and he gets it. Not that the monkey body has developed into human body.

But the soul within the monkey's body desired a human body, and he has got it. This is the process of evolution. The Darwin's theory, this knowledge is lacking. If he is thinking that the cottage has become big skyscraper building, that is not the fact. The owner of the cottage desired to have a skyscraper building, therefore he, from the cottage he transferred to the skyscraper building. It is due to the owners.

Journalist: In that case, if we go on developing, we stay in the skyscraper, or the skyscraper gets bigger.

Room Conversation with Director of Research of the Dept. of Social Welfare -- May 21, 1975, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Indian society, the did not know how to drink tea even. In our childhood we have seen that Britishers started tea garden. There was no tea plants before Britishers. The Britishers saw the labor is very cheap, and they want to do business, they started. Just like they are doing in Africa. So many gardens, coffee and tea. So they started, and the tea was transferred to be sold in America. They were after business. So the... Now, so much tea, who will consume? The government started a tea sets committee. All the tea garden holders they would pay government. And road to road, street to street, their business was canvassing, preparing tea, very nice, palatable tea, and they advertising if you drink tea, then you will not feel very much hungry, and your malaria will go away and so on, so on. And people began to drink tea. Nice cup. I have seen it. Now they have got a taste. Now gradually now a sweeper also, early in the morning, is waiting in the tea shop to get a cup of tea.

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: ...be done by Darwin, that he will live for fifty years; he is giving account millions of years. "Some millions of years after, this evolution takes place like this." Huh? Will he live for millions of years? Why he's talking of millions of years? This is a waste of time. He will live for fifty years or, say, utmost, hundred years, and he's talking of millions of years.

Śrutakīrti: Just like that man who wrote the letter yesterday. He's prepared to spend the rest of his life understanding the transfer, the transmigration of the soul instead of just accepting it in the Gītā. He's going to spend his whole life.

Prabhupāda: No, no. His non-acceptance means he's a rascal. He's a rascal. He may waste his time in that way. What can be done? His non-acceptance means he's a rascal. It's evident. Anyone knows that "After this, I will get another body." You are all young men. You know that you will get after some years a body like me. So what is the difficulty to understand that we are changing body?

Paramahaṁsa: So actually it's useless to try to give any more proof other than that.

Prabhupāda: That is sufficient for an intelligent man. That is sufficient.

Paramahaṁsa: So if a scientist or someone who has some degree in science comes to our movement, should we encourage him to try to prove through science the Kṛṣṇa conscious principle of transmigration and eternal quality of the soul?

Morning Walk -- June 22, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: So it is worth taking?

Jayatīrtha: It seems to be. The price seems to be about the right price.

Prabhupāda: So down payment has been made?

Jayatīrtha: Yes, it's already... It's now in our name. It's been transferred.

Prabhupāda: And when they are moving?

Jayatīrtha: Some devotees have already moved.

Prabhupāda: Oh. It is vacant, vacant?

Jayatīrtha: It was vacant, yes. Well, the old owner, he is keeping one room in the building for the time being. The man who sold it to us, he's a very..., Sort of a pious gentleman. He's doing humanitarian work. He's a war hero.

Prabhupāda: War hero?

Jayatīrtha: Yes. In the last war. (Prabhupāda laughs) So he is also helping us. He has a big factory next to the land and he's letting us use it for the incense business. So he's doing some good service.

Prabhupāda: What is that factory?

Jayatīrtha: He employs these alcoholics and derelicts in different kinds of work, making things. And he was keeping these people living in this palace, but now he's built another place next door where he keeps them and he has them employed. It's sort of an Alcoholics Anonymous group.

Prabhupāda: Let them chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, and they will be rectified.

Room Conversation with Mr. & Mrs. Wax, Writer and Editing Manager of Playboy Magazine -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:

Nitāi: "This verse is very important for an understanding of how the living entities transmigrate from one body to another. It is explained in the Second Chapter that the living entity is transmigrating from one body to another just as one changes dress. This change of dress is due to his attachment to material existence. As long as he is captivated by this false manifestation, he has to continue transmigrating from one body to another. Due to his desire to lord it over material nature, he is put into such undesirable circumstances. Under the influence of material desire, the entity is born sometimes as a demigod, sometimes as a man, sometimes as a beast, as a bird, as a worm, as an aquatic, as a saintly man, as a bug. This is going on. And in all cases the living entity thinks himself to be the master of his circumstances, yet he is under the influence of material nature. How he is put into such different bodies is explained here. It is due to association with the different modes of nature. One has to rise, therefore, above the three material modes and become situated in the transcendental position. That is called Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Unless one is situated in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, his material consciousness will oblige him to transfer from one body to another because he has material desires since time immemorial. But he has to change that conception. That change can be effected only by hearing from authoritative sources. The best example is here: Arjuna is hearing the science of God from Kṛṣṇa. The living entity, if he submits to this hearing process, will lose his long-cherished desire to dominate the material nature, and gradually and proportionately, as he reduces his long desire to dominate, he comes to enjoy spiritual happiness."

Prabhupāda: They are trying to dominate the material nature, the so-called scientists. But they do not know that they are under the domination of material nature. They are forgetting that. If you are more powerful, if you are dominating me, how I can dominate you? That they do not know, that we are under the domination of material nature. Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi (BG 13.9). The domination is manifest by four things: birth, death, old age, and disease. I cannot dominate my birth, death, old age, and disease and I am trying to dominate over nature. Just foolishness. Big, big scientist, did he dominate over death, Professor Einstein? Did not he die? Why he could not find out any means that he will not die? What is the meaning of the science? If you are dominated by the laws of material nature, how you are thinking that you shall dominate over material nature? When death comes can you dominate? "No, no, I am scientist. Just wait." No, you must die immediately. So where is your domination? You are dominated by material nature. That is the mistake of the present society, that everyone is being dominated by the material nature and the so-called scientist is trying to dominate over material nature.

Room Conversation with Mr. & Mrs. Wax, Writer and Editing Manager of Playboy Magazine -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:

Devotee: So sometimes the attachment is beneficial, then?

Prabhupāda: Yes. What is this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement? We are trying to be attached with Kṛṣṇa. This is our movement. Instead of having attachment with this whole material world, we are turning to transfer the attachment to Kṛṣṇa. Find out this verse,

mayy āsakta-manāḥ pārtha
yogaṁ yuñjan mad-āśrayaḥ
asaṁśayaṁ samagraṁ māṁ
yathā jñāsyasi tac chṛṇu
(BG 7.1)

The whole movement is how to increase attachment for Kṛṣṇa. Yes, read.

Nitāi:

śrī-bhagavān uvāca
mayy āsakta-manāḥ pārtha
yogaṁ yuñjan mad-āśrayaḥ
asaṁśayaṁ samagraṁ māṁ
yathā jñāsyasi tac chṛṇu
(BG 7.1)

"Now hear, O son of Pṛthā, Arjuna, how by practicing yoga in full consciousness of Me, with mind attached to Me, you can know Me in full..."

Prabhupāda: "With mind attached to Me." This Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement means to keep the mind attached to Kṛṣṇa. That is success. That yoga we are practicing, how to keep the mind attached to Kṛṣṇa. Then it is successful. Our mind is attached to something. Without attachment, mind cannot be free even for a moment. So the bhakti-yoga means how to transfer the attachment of mind to Kṛṣṇa, that's all. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. You are working, you are rendering your service without any charges, without any profit—why? Because your mind has been attached to Kṛṣṇa. Otherwise what business you have got to work for Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement without any remuneration? You are all American boys. You are qualified. You can earn thousands of dollars. But why you have given up? Because you are attached to Kṛṣṇa. Paraṁ dṛṣṭvā nivartate (BG 2.59). You have found better attachment; therefore you given up. So that is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. We are attached to so many nonsense things. When we wind up all these attachments and concentrate on Kṛṣṇa, then life is perfect. That is wanted. We are not going to sacrifice attachment. But we are trying to transfer the attachment from matter to Kṛṣṇa. Then our life is successful. But that attachment is very rare.

Room Conversation with Mr. & Mrs. Wax, Writer and Editing Manager of Playboy Magazine -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:
Prabhupāda: So our business is, spiritual master's business is, how to help the disciple to transfer the attachment. It is not that we are creating an, it, artificially, no. The attachment quality is there. But it is being mixed up with material things. And if you purify this material contamination, then the attachment become pure, and that is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Just like the water falls from the sky. It is distilled water. And as soon as it is in touch with the ground it becomes muddy, dirty. Again that water, if you distill, again it becomes distilled water, as good as the rain water, original. Therefore bhakti means sarvopādhi-vinirmuktam (CC Madhya 19.170). All the dirty things of designation should be cleansed. Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktaṁ tat-paratvena nirmalam. When the mind is cleansed, nirmalam, without any dirty thing, then you can begin bhakti immediately, Kṛṣṇa conscious. Hṛṣīkeṇa hṛṣīkeśa-sevanaṁ bhaktir ucyate (CC Madhya 19.170). So bhakti means cleansing process. Originally, distilled water from the sky, in touch with the ground, it is muddy. You filter it or distill it; it becomes original. The consciousness is there, but it has become muddy. You cleanse it; it is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Therefore we say, "Don't do this. Don't do this." Don't mix again muddy things. It has already become muddy. Your business to cleanse it, and again if you make it muddy with addition of other nonsense things, then it will be delayed. When you ignite fire, you require dry wood. But if you ignite fire, at the same time pour water, then how it will burn? Don't pour water. Therefore we have so many "don'ts." "Don'ts" means that you are burning the fire. Go on. Don't add water. And that is "don't." If you ignite fire, at the same time add water, then how it will burn? Water is the counter-ingredient of fire. If you want to extinguish fire, then add water. But if you want to prolong the fire burning, then you should not add water. So this material enjoyment, illicit sex, intoxication, meat-eating, gambling, one should be free from these water-like things while you are in the fire of spiritual consciousness. Don't bring these things. You cannot go on burning the fire, at the same time adding water. Then it will be useless waste of time.
Press Conference -- July 9, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda:

oṁ ajñāna-timirāndhasya
jñānāñjana-śalākayā
cakṣur unmīlitaṁ yena
tasmai śrī-gurave namaḥ

(I offer my respectful obeisances unto my spiritual master, who with the torchlight of knowledge has opened my eyes, which were blinded by the darkness of ignorance.)

Ladies and gentlemen, regarding Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement... (about microphone:) It is working? We are talking about the spiritual existence of the living being. By evolutionary process we come to the human form of life, and here we have got developed consciousness. We can decide now which way to go forward. There are different planetary system. That we can experience. We can see innumerable planets, upwards and downwards. So the upper planetary system is called Svargaloka, or the heavenly planets, and the middle planetary system is called Martyaloka or Bhurloka, in which we are staying at the present moment, and the down planetary system is called Pātālaloka or downwards. Downwards means fall down, upwards means getting promotion, and middle means we remain where we are now. That is... Indication is given in the Bhagavad-gītā, ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti sattva-sthā: (BG 14.18) "Those who are cultivating the modes of goodness, they are promoted to the higher planetary system." And madhye tiṣṭhanti rājasāḥ. "Those who are passionate or under the modes of passion, they remain in the middle planetary system." And jaghanya-guṇa-vṛtti-sthā adho gacchanti tāmasāḥ: "And those (whose) character is very abominable, they go down." And beyond this, there is another nature. That is called spiritual nature, which is beyond this material universe. There, we understand, that is eternal. This material nature is not eternal. It is manifested or created, and again it is dissolved or annihilated. But beyond this material nature, there is another nature. There are also innumerable planets. They are known as Vaikuṇṭha planets or Vṛndāvana planets. That is the kingdom of God. If we transfer ourself to that eternal nature, then we won't have to come back to this material nature again.

Conversation with Professor Hopkins -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prabhupāda: More material gain means you become more implicated.

Prof. Hopkins: More what?

Prabhupāda: Implicated. Our problem is birth and death, old age and disease. (break) ...this birth, death, old age and disease. For them, liberation, the ultimate liberation is to transfer oneself to the spiritual world.

Prof. Hopkins: So you see... You see a clear difference there between those who follow the Vaiṣṇava tradition, which is less worldly, more spiritual...

Prabhupāda: That is the ultimate goal of life. That is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam: na te viduḥ svārtha gatiṁ hi viṣṇum (SB 7.5.31). People do not know what is his self-interest. The self-interest is to approach Viṣṇu.

Prof. Hopkins: What about Christian, Christian.

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is Viṣṇu.

Prof. Hopkins: What about Christians?

Prabhupāda: Christian also, that is nice, giving instruction to go back to God. It is not? What is the ultimate goal of Christianity? What do they desire?

Prof. Hopkins: Hard to answer. There's no clear single goal. (laughter)

Room Conversation -- August 21, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: 1890. (Bengali)

Lalitā: ...foreign exchange, for the development of India...(Bengali) ...that how it is... "Can you prove?" And yes. You can send immediately? Everything is in open.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: I have all the receipts with me from the bank transfers.

Prabhupāda: (Bengali) This is meant for the executive head of the state. It is meant for. In the Bhagavad-gītā, Fourth Chapter, it is stated,

imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ
proktavān aham avyayam
vivasvān manave prāhur
manur ikṣvākave 'bravīt
(BG 4.1)

Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ (BG 4.2). Rājarṣayo. It is meant for the rājarṣis. So Indira is in the position of rāja. If she becomes a ṛṣi, then it will be successful. Then it will be successful. (Bengali) ...that "You have got the position of royalty. You become a saintly lady. Then your scheme will be all successful." That is required. That I can help, how to make her a ṛṣi.

Lalitā: No, she is full of humility... (Bengali)

Prabhupāda: Then not only the people of India will be benefited but also the whole world will be benefited. And you have got that sampatti, Bhagavad-gītā guidance. I will not manufacture anything. That is not my business, concoction thing, hodgepodge, without any knowledge, without any experience. We are not that type of... (Bengali)

Lalitā: We have to set everything. When I phone we should be ready.

Prabhupāda: You make a file. Whatever she says, make a file and keep that.

Morning Walk -- September 25, 1975, Ahmedabad:

Prabhupāda: Hm. He's our good friend.

Kartikeya: You must have met last time?

Prabhupāda: No, before that.

Kartikeya: But he must be transferred, I think. Normally they are having the transfer.

Prabhupāda: You can inquire it.

Kartikeya: Chatterjee.

Prabhupāda: Chatterjee and Mukherjee. Maybe Chatterjee, Bengali. So if he is there, you can say that "Bhaktivedanta Swami wants to see you."

Kartikeya: Correct. But can they not come at the function? (Hindi to person they meet) (relating answer to Prabhupāda:) He says some friends are coming at some time, so can you meet them? We can just go back and if you want to walk or something?

Prabhupāda: No, no more.

Kartikeya: O.K. (Hindi to someone) Because we are coming every day morning. The park opens at six o'clock, I think. This park opens at six. (to Prabhupāda:) They form a club in the park when they come in the morning. They have morning party or talking. Otherwise they can't meet during the day. Somebody's a doctor, somebody's... (break)

Prabhupāda: We can meet if they give us time.

Morning Walk -- October 5, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Indian man (3): Lord Kṛṣṇa created Lord Viṣṇu, and Lord Viṣṇu in His turn created Lord Brahmā. So...

Prabhupāda: Not created, expanded. Just like one candle is burning, and you lit up another candle. So this candle is not created, it is simply power transfer. Expansion. You can call it expansion. Dīpārcir eva hi daśāntaram abhyupetya (Bs. 5.46). Expansion of the light. This is, contains iodine, this ship. Iodine. That ship is going or coming?

Cyavana: Going. But he's sitting.

Prabhupāda: Oh, it is standing.

Cyavana: It's sitting, yes.

Indian boy (2): Swamijī, do you think that Bible, about the Adam, Adam is Brahmā? It has been copied from the Indian philosophy to put it there in different name?

Prabhupāda: From historical point of view it is copied because Vedas are created by Brahmā long, long, many millions, millions of years, and Bible is created two thousand years. So we have to take the original. All religious system of the world, they are taken from Vedas, from different parts. Therefore they are not complete. The age of Bible is not more than two thousand years. The age of Veda you cannot calculate, millions and millions of years.

Morning Walk -- October 5, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: Hellish planet.

Indian: ...hemisphere or it take birth immediately afterwards?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Those who are sinful, they do not take immediately birth. They first of all trained up in the hellish planet how to suffer to become accustomed and then they are taken birth, then suffer. Just like you pass I.A.S. Then you become an assistant to the magistrate. You learn. Then you are posted as magistrate. Even if you are fit for going back to home, back to Godhead, you are first of all transferred to the universe where Kṛṣṇa is now present, and there you become accustomed. Then you go to real Vṛndāvana.

Indian man (4): Therefore, after our death...

Prabhupāda: Every arrangement by God is perfect. Pūrṇam. Pūrṇam adaḥ pūrṇam idaṁ pūrṇāt pūrṇam.. (Īśopaniṣad, Invocation). Whatever is created by God, that is perfect.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: All the associates of Lord Caitanya also were in the same position.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- October 25, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: Miami? (break) ...places were reserved for the sinful man in Kali-yuga. Formerly the Aryans never touched these places.

Harikeśa: Africa.

Prabhupāda: Africa or similar, other places. They were living in best places, like India. Now the number of sinful persons are increasing. Therefore they have been transferred here.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: America?

Prabhupāda: Anywhere.

Harikeśa: So in the warmer climates it seems like a better place for spreading Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Prabhupāda: In warmer climate you can live inexpensively, and freely. In winter climate, there is no freedom, neither it is inexpensive. Very expensive. (break) ...some Phunsie(?). Phunsie.

Harikeśa: Oh, those potato balls.

Prabhupāda: Hm. With banana.

Harikeśa: With banana.

Prabhupāda: (break) ...the government accept you as guide, then everything will be all right. Brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra. Tell them that "We are not going to take any salary. You simply take our advice, and govern." The modern legislative assembly, they should be composed of first-class brāhmaṇas, no salary. Then the government will be first-class. All of them are after money; therefore they are trying to capture the power. They have no idea, no desire for the well-being of the citizens. (break) ...this tree? Dates?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Called palmetto tree. Palmetto tree. Not fruit-bearing. Not fruit-bearing.

Prabhupāda: (Break)...beyond the sun.

Morning Walk -- November 3, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That is

māṁ cāvyabhicāriṇī
bhakti-yogena yaḥ sevate
sa guṇān samatītyaitān
brahma-bhūyāya kalpate
(BG 14.26)

If you engage him in devotional service, immediately he is transferred to the spiritual platform. That is wanted.

Dr. Patel: Kāmaḥ krodhas tadā lobhas tasmād evam... Tri-vidhaṁ narakasya-dvāram.

Prabhupāda: Ah! Yes. Yes. On the material platform, he... The human life is meant for spiritual culture. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. But they have rejected. They are simply busy. Athāto deha-jijñāsā. That's all. Dehātmā-buddhi.

Dr. Patel: I have got little point on this, that after all, the spirituality within you, namely ātmā, cannot remain independently without this body, so you have got to look after the body.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no. That is not the fact. If you are actually spiritually advanced, you don't care for it. Deha smṛti nāhi yār saṁsāra bandhana kāhān tānra. It is just like Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī. He had no spiritual... er, material con... He was eating every alternate day a little quantity of butter. That's all. How he was living in Vṛndāvana? So when one is perfectly on the spiritual platform, there is no bodily necessities. That is the sign. Therefore our civilization is to decrease the bodily necessities, not to increase. Control. Control, from the brahmacārī, control, control, control. Ultimately completely control. That is perfectional stage. Tyāgena.

Morning Walk -- November 21, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Organize.

Mahāṁsa: ...big program. Yes. And all the devotees who are there are very new, all new recruits.

Prabhupāda: Then how we are going to organize?

Mahāṁsa: Well, Haṁsadūta said as soon as the land is transferred he would send ten devotees for the farm. So then I think it will start.

Prabhupāda: So we have to import devotees. You cannot create devotees.

Mahāṁsa: We have got about eight devotees there who are new, but they are not experienced.

Prabhupāda: Train them, train them.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: To give a manager right way, Haṁsadūta said.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: He can give a manager for the farm.

Mahāṁsa: Yes. If we get a manager, then we can manage.

Prabhupāda: No. If you do not get a manager, then what is the use of taking the land? If you cannot manage, then what is the use of taking? Give them prasādam. They will come. So why you are not giving that prasādam? Every day there must be huge prasādam distribution.

Room Conversation -- December 14, 1975, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: "Why he is not silent?" Kṛṣṇa is not silent. Kṛṣṇa is speaking. Why you should be silent when I challenge you like this. He said, he could not answer. This is going on. So many things they are doing, if they are challenged, they cannot answer. You were present? I told him, "Why silent? Kṛṣṇa is not silent. He says continually, Bhagavān uvāca; page after page, and he's saying "Why he should silent?" He gave me the information that Brahman was silent and anyone who would go to him, he would remain silent and the message would be transferred.

Bhāgavata: Rajneesh says the same thing. He says that Kṛṣṇa and Arjuna did not speak, Kṛṣṇa simply looked at Arjuna and Arjuna understood. But in order for Dhṛtarāṣṭra to understand, because he was blind, Sañjaya is speaking and he is explaining everything and Vyāsa has written down what Sañjaya has explained. This is, that is what Rajneesh says like that. So why does Sañjaya say Bhagavān uvāca?

Prabhupāda: No, no. Sañjaya heard, then he said?

Bhāgavata: Yes.

Morning Walk -- December 17, 1975, Bombay:

Saurabha: Yes. And then we still have area for gurukula also. Another hundred rooms.

Dr. Patel: Most people (indistinct) (break)

Prabhupāda: Yesterday... Last night, I explained at the Birla house that you have to change only your care of. Now we are care of under material energy, and you have to transfer your under care of spiritual energy. They appreciated.

Dr. Patel: They are under the care of great māyā, mah-māyā.

Prabhupāda: Everyone...

Dr. Patel: ...is sitting in the building, of all the Birlas.

Prabhupāda: Not Birlas, everyone. (laughing)

Dr. Patel: (also laughing) I don't know, sir. But I... I am a rebellion against them. In 1958, sir, I told you, the Congress, when I was a member of Congress, that I can't be the member of such an institution which just simply lies, telling white lies.

Prabhupāda: No, no. You may say about congressman, and this one, Communist man; everyone is under...

Dr. Patel: Is a rascal.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is our verdict. Mūḍha. We understand from Bhagavad-gītā...

Dr. Patel: Why mūḍha, sir. Mudhatamaḥ!

Prabhupāda: Yes, vimūḍha. Therefore Prahlāda Mahārāja says not only mūḍha but vimūḍha; viśeṣa-mūḍha especifical. Prahlādah Mahārāja says the same thing: tato vimūkha-cetasā. Vimūkha cetasā means one who does not accept Kṛṣṇa as the Supreme. Tato vimukha-cetasa soce, and simply thinking of desires. Who are this? Those who are nondevotees, one who does not surrender to Kṛṣṇa. Tato vimukha-cetasa. So why you are searching? Māy-sukhāya: simply for so-called sense gratification for a few days, bhāram udvahato vimūḍhān, making big, big plans. I am thinking of these rascals. What for they are making big, big plans? They will stay here for a few days, and forgetting Kṛṣṇa consciousness they are busy in making plans. This is Prahlāda Mahārāja. And Kṛṣṇa says they are mūḍha, vimūḍha. As soon as you find one, not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he's immediately mūḍha, vimūḍha. Na mā duṣkṛtino mūḍh prapdyante narādhamāḥ.

Morning Walk -- December 17, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: The same principle, that "You are seeing. Now kill yourself: you don't see." That's all. The same philosophy. You are seeing and feeling disturbance—better kill yourself; you'll not see, then all problems solved. This is their advise. Kill yourself. So who will agree to that?

Dr. Patel: Yes, philosophically kill yourself, and get yourself transferred to a different life.

Prabhupāda: No, no...

Dr. Patel: I mean not physically, I mean as a philosophical point...

Prabhupāda: "Kill" means you finish yourself, no more seeing...

Dr. Patel: Finish your present ego...

Prabhupāda: That is your interpretation. Killing means finish everything. Killing does not mean that you will again see. There is not killing.

Harikesa: But you'll just go in another body...

Prabhupāda: That is curing. Killing and curing. If you kill yourself, then whole thing is finished. But if you cure yourself, then you see rightly. So we advise cure, not kill. That is our philosophy.

Page Title:Transfer (Conversations 1968 - 1975)
Compiler:Visnu Murti, Mayapur
Created:20 of Mar, 2012
Totals by Section:BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=84, Let=0
No. of Quotes:84