Therefore in this world the human being is not meant for quarreling like the cats and dogs. They must be intelligent enough to realize the importance of the human life and refuse to act like ordinary animal. He should... A human being should realize the aim of human life. This direction is given in all the Vedic literature, and the essence is given in the Bhagavad-gītā. Vedic literature are meant for the human being and not for the cats and dogs. The cats and dogs can kill their eatable animals, and for that there is no question of sin on their part. But if a man kills an animal for the satisfaction of his uncontrolled taste, he must be responsible for breaking the laws of nature. And in the Bhagavad-gītā it is clearly explained that there are three kinds of activities according to the different modes of nature: the activities of goodness, the activities of passion, the activities of ignorance. Similarly, there are three kinds of eatables also: eatables in goodness, eatables on passion, eatables on ignorance. They're all clearly described, and if we properly utilize the instructions of the Bhagavad-gītā, then our whole life will become purified and ultimately we shall (be) able to reach the destination. Yad gatvā na nivartante tad dhāma paramaṁ mama (BG 15.6).
There is no question (Lectures, BG ch 1 - 3)
Expressions researched:
"no question"
|"there can be no question"
|"there could be no question"
|"there is no question"
|"there was no question"
|"there will be no question"
|"without any question"
Lectures
Bhagavad-gita As It Is Lectures
Neither in that eternal sky there is need of moon. Na pāvakaḥ means neither there is necessity of electricity or fire for illuminating because the spiritual sky is already illuminated by the brahma-jyotir. Brahmajyoti, yasya prabhā (Bs. 5.40), the rays of the supreme abode. Now in these days when people are trying to reach other planets, it is not very difficult to understand the abode of the Supreme Lord. The abode of the Supreme Lord is in the spiritual sky, and it is named as Goloka. In the Brahmā-saṁhitā it is very nicely described, goloka eva nivasaty akhilātma-bhūtaḥ (Bs. 5.37). The Lord, although resides eternally in His abode, Goloka, still He is akhilātma-bhūtaḥ, He can be approached from here also. And the Lord therefore comes to manifest His real form, sac-cid-ānanda-vigraha (Bs. 5.1), so that we may not have to imagine. There is no question of imagination. The Lord's presence, by His causeless mercy He presents Himself in His Śyāmasundara-rūpa. Unfortunately, people with less intelligence deride at Him. Avajānanti māṁ mūḍhā (BG 9.11). Because the Lord comes as one of us and just like plays with us as a human being, therefore we need not consider that Lord is one of us. It is His omnipotency that He presents Himself with His real form before us and displays His pastimes, just the prototype of His abode. So that abode of Lord, there are innumerable planets also in that brahma-jyotir. Just like we have got innumerable planets floating on the sun rays, similarly, in the brahma-jyotir, which is emanating from the abode of the Supreme Lord, Kṛṣṇaloka, Goloka, ānanda-cinmaya-rasa-pratibhāvitābhis (Bs. 5.37), all those planets are spiritual planets. They are ānanda-cinmaya; they are not material planets.
"All these people, my sons, māmakāḥ..." Māmakāḥ. That means "my sons," and pāṇḍava, "my brother Pāṇḍu's sons." Samavetā, "they assembled." What is the purpose? The purpose is yuyutsavaḥ. This word yuyutsu is still used in Japan. Perhaps you know, yuyutsa, fighting. So yuyutsu, those who are desirous of fighting. Now, both the parties were desiring to fight, and they assembled. Why he is asking question, kim akurvata: "What did they do"? Because he was little doubtful that "These boys, after being assembled in dharma-kṣetra kuru-kṣe..., they might have changed their ideas. They might have settled up." Actually, the sons of Dhṛtarāṣṭra might have admitted, "Yes, Pāṇḍavas, you are actually the owner. What is the use of unnecessarily fighting?" So he was very much anxious whether they had changed their decision. Therefore he is asking. Otherwise there was no question of asking, kim akurvata. He... Just like if you are given food, if I ask somebody that "Such and such gentleman was served with nice dishes. Then what did he do?" This is foolish question. He would eat. That's all. (laughter) What is the question of "What did he do?" Similarly, when it is already settled up that they were to fight, there was no such question as kim akurvata, "What did they do?" But he asked this question because he was doubtful whether they had changed their opinion.
Kim akurvata sañjaya (BG 1.1). He was asking his secretary. He was blind man. He was always conducted by his secretary Sañjaya, a very faithful secretary. And he is explaining the Bhagavad-gītā by experiencing, by television within the heart. That art is not yet developed. You have got television through machine, but there is another television—you can see within your heart everything, what is going on outside. So that television was known to... That will be explained by Sañjaya, that by the grace of Vyāsadeva, he learned this televisioning, and he was sitting with his master within the room and he was actually seeing how the fighting is going on. And he was explaining. This is the basic principle of Bhagavad-gītā, I mean, the basic platform. So let us discuss gradually, one after an... Thank you very much. Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break)
We are utilizing this microphone. We are utilizing the dictaphone. Why it is false? There is sambandha. There is relationship with Kṛṣṇa. Anything material, made of earth, water, fire, air, they are Kṛṣṇa's energies. Therefore there is direct relationship with Kṛṣṇa. And if Kṛṣṇa is reality, why His energy should be false? No. We must know how to utilize it.
So similarly, in this battlefield, Kṛṣṇa is there, and all the living entities... Some of them are soldiers, some of them are commander-in-chiefs, some of them this, that. Or the chariot or the ground—everything Kṛṣṇa's energy. So if we remember that everything is manifestation of Kṛṣṇa's energy, there is no question of materialism. It is all spiritual energy. So nirbandhaḥ kṛṣṇa-sambandhe. So we have to use them for Kṛṣṇa. Here all of of them have gathered. This is another Kṛṣṇa's energy. Kṛṣṇa appears, paritrāṇāya sādhūnāṁ vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām (BG 4.8). He wanted to kill all the demons. That is another side of his business. As one side, paritrāṇāya sādhūnām, to give protection to the devotees, the other side is to vanquish all the demons. Just like if you want to grow paddy on the field, so first of all you have to destroy all the unwanted weeds. Then you grow the seeds; it will come out nicely. So these two things are required. Destruction and construction. Both the things are Kṛṣṇa's activities or different energies. So you cannot accept one thing, giving up the other side. We have to understand that both sides, they are working as different manifestation of Kṛṣṇa's energy. Parāsya śaktir vividhaiva śrūyate (Cc. Madhya 13.65, purport). In the Vedas it is said that the Absolute has got multi-energies. So one energy is working in one way, another energy is working in another way. Parāsya śaktir vividhaiva śrūyate, svā-bhāvikī jñāna-bala-kriyā ca. Just like here also, when we do something, we require varieties of energies to make that thing perfect. So everything, Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa's, this material world or spiritual world, everything is working in order, under different energies.
That is Vaiṣṇavism. It is not cowardism. It is not cowardism. When need be. Generally, a Vaiṣṇava is non-violent. Just like Arjuna. In the beginning he was non-violent, Vaiṣṇava. He said, "Kṛṣṇa, what is the use of this fighting? Let them enjoy." So by nature he was non-violent, but he was induced by Kṛṣṇa to become violent, that "Your non-violence will not help. You become violent. You kill them. I want." So if Kṛṣṇa wants we shall be prepared to become violent also. And Kṛṣṇa, that is open secret, that paritrāṇāya sādhūnāṁ vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām (BG 4.8). Two business of Kṛṣṇa, two side. So those who are devotees of Kṛṣṇa, they should be trained up both ways, they should be prepared. But generally, there is no question of becoming violent, unnecessarily. As the modern politicians, unnecessarily they declare war, a Vaiṣṇava does not do so. No, unnecessarily, there is no need of war. When it was completely impossible to settle up the things between the Pāṇḍavas and the Kauravas, then Kṛṣṇa said, "All right, then there must be fight." When Duryodhana declined to spare even a portion of land holding the sūcyagra, the point of a needle... he refused that "I cannot spare even so much land which can hold the point of a needle." Then the war was declared. There is no question of settlement. Otherwise, Kṛṣṇa requested that "These five Pāṇḍavas, they are kṣatriyas. They cannot become merchant or brāhmaṇa. Brāhmaṇa's profession is paṭhana pāṭhana yajana yājana dāna pratigrahaḥ. Brāhmaṇa can take charity from others. A sannyāsī can take charity from others. Not a kṣatriya or a gṛhastha. No. That is not allowed. "So they are kṣatriyas; they cannot take the professions of a brāhmaṇa, neither they can take the profession of a mercantile man, business man. They must have some land so that rule over, take taxation. And that is their living means.
That is higher intelligence, that "Why shall I ask food from God? God is supplying food to the cats, dogs, ants, elephants, and I want little food, he will not supply me? And especially when I engage myself in His service? Ordinary man pays to his servant, and I shall starve if I am engaged in the service of God?" This is intelligence. This is intelligence. "Why shall I bother God? If He likes, I will starve. That doesn't matter. But I must engage myself in the service of the Lord." This is intelligence. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate (BG 7.19). This intelligence comes after many, many births of endeavoring for self-realization. It is not easily comes.
So there is no question of scarcity for devotee. Just like this morning I was discussing with a gentleman. So a devotee is not in need of everything. Why he should be? He cannot be. Even one who is not devotee, if he is getting supplies from God, how is it that the devotee will not get? Just like the government. The government, although there is prisonhouse, the government supplies the food. Not that because they have gone to the prisonhouse, they are starving. Rather, those who are unemployed, they prefer prisonhouse, that without any service, they will get free food.
As soon as they will accept service. You know, the Tagore family of Calcutta, Rabindranatha Tagore, they are also brāhmaṇas. But we know, in our childhood, they were also excommunicated from the brāhmaṇa family because they also accepted service.
So these are Vedic principles. If we follow... The brāhmaṇa will not accept anyone's service. That is against. Similarly, kṣatriya. Kṣatriya... Why this fight between Arjuna? They made them bereft of the kingdom. So they appealed to Duryodhana, that "My dear Duryodhana, you are my brother, you have taken all our properties. So we are kṣatriya. We are not going to become vaiśya or brāhmaṇa. We must live. Give us at least five villages, five brothers. We shall be satisfied. There is no question of war." "No, sir, not even the land which can hold the point of needle. I cannot spare." There is no way. Therefore there was fight. There was fight.
So these are the some of the glorious points of this fight. But he depended on Kṛṣṇa, Arjuna. Therefore he was successful, victorious. You do, act as kṣatriya. Not that as kṣatriya he should become a brāhmaṇa beggar, no. A kṣatriya cannot be beggar, neither a brāhmaṇa cannot be vaiśya. This is real caste system. But you work as a cobbler, and at the same time you claim to become a brāhmaṇa, this is not allowed. Formerly the king used to see whether a brāhmaṇa is acting like a brāhmaṇa. Otherwise he will be stopped. Then he will be designated as he is working. This was the duty of the king to see that everyone is employed according to his profession. It was the duty of the king to see. Everyone must be employed. A brāhmaṇa must be working like a brāhmaṇa. A kṣatriya must be working like a kṣatriya.
Dhārtarāṣṭrasya durbuddher (BG 1.23). Durbuddhi, to usurp others' property is durbuddhi, mischievous. Why one should encroach upon others' property? That is not good. Tena tyaktena bhuñjīthā mā gṛdhaḥ kasya svid dhanam (ISO 1). This is the Vedic instruction, that "You accept only what is given to you. Don't encroach upon others' property." This is peaceful. Everything belongs to Kṛṣṇa. So whatever Kṛṣṇa gives you as prasādam, as His favor, you accept it and be satisfied. This is the basic principle of peace in the world. But because people are not educated in that way, everyone is wanting more and more and more and more. There is no satisfaction. So that is durbuddhi. The Vedic culture is that "You be satisfied with your position." There is no question of starving in any position of life. People are trying to make economic development, but according to śāstra, it is not possible to develop your economic position simply by endeavor. You are destined to have some portion mixed up with happiness and distress. That is the nature. Dharmārtha-kāma-mokṣa (SB 4.8.41). These are four principles of human activities. First beginning is dharma. Dharma means to abide by the orders of the Supreme. That is dharma. So people do not know who is the Supreme and what is His order. So what kind of religion? They accept dharma as religion, faith, a superfluous faith only. But that is not dharma, religion. Dharma means to abide by the orders of the Supreme. Dharmaṁ tu sākṣād bhagavat-praṇītam (SB 6.3.19). That is the meaning of dharma: obedience to God. There is no conception of God, and what to speak of obedience. But this is the simple meaning of religion: obedience to God. That's all, three words. God is the supreme proprietor, God is the maintainer... Bhoktāraṁ yajña-tapasāṁ sarva-loka-maheśvaram (BG 5.29). Therefore we are maintained, we are predominated, we are servant, we should remain obedient to God. This is religion. Where is the difficulty? Unfortunately, they do not know what is God, what is His command, what is religion. They do not know. They manufacture. And because they do not know the simple process, they are called durbuddhi, not very nicely intelligent. A rascal, in other words.
You can become immediately out of the scope of māyā if you always remain surrendered to Kṛṣṇa. Māyā will not touch you. Just like if you remain always in the sunshine, there is no question of night. Nowadays it is very easy. If you simply drive your plane on the western side, you'll never get night. You just round about. Yes. Just like it is materially possible. You drive your plane simply on the western side. Start your plane in the morning and go to the western side and don't stop it. You go on for three, four, as many days as you like. You'll never get night. This is practical. Similarly, if you keep always with Kṛṣṇa, you are guḍākeśa, you will never get darkness. Or māyā will not touch you. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So try to become Guḍākeśa.
The next verse. Kṛṣṇa Hṛṣīkeśa. So He knew the sarvasya cāhaṁ hṛdi sanniviṣṭaḥ (BG 15.15). Kṛṣṇa is there. Kṛṣṇa knows what is your purpose, what you want to do, what is your past, future. Everything Kṛṣṇa knows. Everything Kṛṣṇa knows. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā. Vedāhaṁ samatītāni; (BG 7.26) "I know everything." So Kṛṣṇa, sthāpayitvā, rathottamaṁ sthāpayitvā. As soon as Arjuna asked Him, senayor ubhayor madhye rathaṁ sthāpaya me 'cyuta (BG 1.21), immediately He carried out the order and He knew why he wants. He wanted to see, "With whom I have to fight, my friends and relatives." He's hesitating. So why this ignorance of Arjuna, the question may be. Arjuna is guḍākeśa. He is above this material world. How he is being affected by his so-called relatives and kinsmen? He was hesitating to fight on this principle, that "They are my relatives. They are my kinsmen. They are my family members." He was always thinking. Therefore Kṛṣṇa knew it. So he has become so family-wise infected. But he is guḍākeśa. How it is possible? He is above all these things.
The democracy is a farce. At least, I do not like it. Because so many rascals, simply by getting votes, go to the government, and what do they know how to rule over? Therefore, at the present moment, all over the world there is no good government. There is no good government. The America was considered to have very good government. Now we can see the behavior of Mr. Nixon. It is not possible. Formerly the kṣatriyas, they were trained up how to govern. They were trained up by military men, just like Droṇācārya trained Arjuna, Duryodhana. All the royal princes were trained up how to kill. Not only killing, also, according to śāstra, how to rule over. The king's business is to see that everyone in the country, they are properly employed and engaged in his own business. That is king's business. There was no question of unemployment. This is government's first business. Because if a person is unemployed, then the devil's workshop. Devil's, work... If he hasn't got to do anything... That is being done now. Rich man's son, he hasn't got to do anything, so his brain is devil's workshop. They are manufacturing so many "isms." But everyone should be engaged. This is government's first business to see. A brāhmaṇa is engaged as a brāhmaṇa, a kṣatriya is engaged as kṣatriya.
He was five years old, Kṛṣṇa conscious, from the womb of his mother. He heard instruction of Nārada. Nārada was instructing his mother. He was in the womb. Fortunately, by God's grace, he heard all the instruction of Nārada when he was in the womb of his mother. And the result was, from the beginning of his life, he is Kṛṣṇa conscious. From the beginning. As soon as he took birth, he was Kṛṣṇa conscious. So he was advising his class friends, preaching. Just see. He was five-years-old boy, but he was taking the opportunity of preaching. Because the teacher... He is born of demon family. So all those class friends, they were also sons of demons. So there is no question of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. But he learned Kṛṣṇa consciousness from the womb of his mother.
So he was trying to preach. Because he was king's son, there was no other opportunity for preaching, and he was a five-years-old boy. He took the opportunity in the classroom, as soon as the teacher is away, he would preach. He would preach. This is preaching spirit. As soon as you get some opportunity, preach. What is that preach? Preaching, Caitanya Mahāprabhu has advised us, yāre dekha tāre kaha kṛṣṇa-upadeśa (CC Madhya 7.128). This is preaching. "Whoever you meet, simply speak of the instruction of Kṛṣṇa." So if you are advanced, if you know what is the instruction of Kṛṣṇa by reading Bhagavad-gītā, you can preach to others. And if you have not read anything, suppose you do not know anything, then you can also preach. What is that? "Just become a devotee of Kṛṣṇa, my dear sir." That's all. This is also preaching. "Just surrender to Kṛṣṇa." You go door to door. If you cannot do anything, simply say, "My dear sir, you are very good man.
Just like Indra. He is devatā. There was fight between Hiraṇyakaśipu and the Indra's party. So when Hiraṇyakaśipu was defeated, naturally the... Afterward, if the other party is defeated, the victorious party makes some, so many aggression, especially aggression of women. That is still current. Innocent women, they are very much harassed after the war by the victorious party. You know, the soldiers are given freedom to rape the women. And plunder the property. So many things they have. So when Hiraṇyakaśipu was defeated, all the devatās, they did not make such aggression, but the wife of Hiraṇyakaśipu—Kāyadhu, I think—she was arrested by Indra and was taken. She was crying, just usual, woman. But she was being dragged by Indra. So Nārada was passing. Now, he said, "What are you doing this?" "No, there is no question of harassing this woman. But I am taking her in my custody because she is pregnant and the child is begotten by asura, Hiraṇyakaśipu. Therefore I shall wait for the birth of the child, and as soon as she gives birth, I will kill that child." Yes. So Nārada said, "No, no. That child is not asura child. He is coming, a great devotee, mahā-bhāgavata of Kṛṣṇa." Because Nārada knew that when... Not before. After all, he knew. But before also, he knew. Because they are saintly persons, they can understand that here is a child is coming who will be a great devotee of Kṛṣṇa. So mahā-bhāgavata. So "Don't try that. You don't take her to your custody. Better give her in my custody. I shall take care." So immediately he abided by the order of Nārada, immediately. He released. And not only released, circumambulated the woman.
There are three varieties of quality. Goodness, passion and ignorance. So we have to associate with either of these qualities. Unless we are Kṛṣṇa conscious. Unless one is engaged in devotional service, he must be influenced by these three kinds of qualities. Goodness... Somebody may be very good man, according to the estimation of the... Just like Arjuna, he is talking in the modes of goodness, considering, considering. "Although they are ātatāyinaḥ..." Pāpam eva āśrayed asmān hatvā etān ātatāyinaḥ. Ātatāyinaḥ means aggressor. According to law, if somebody comes to attack you, or if somebody comes to kidnap your wife, these are ātatāyinaḥ. Or somebody comes to set fire in your house, especially they are called aggressors. So these aggressors are to be immediately killed. There is no question of nonviolence. You must kill immediately. There is no sin. Ātatāyinaḥ. But here, although the other party is ātatāyinaḥ, aggressor, still, Arjuna is considering whether they should be killed or not. That is the difference between devatā. In every action, they are calculating. But he is considering that "This kind of aggressor, because they are my kinsmen, they are my family men, whether this kind of aggressor should be killed or not?" It is common sense. Suppose your son has done something mischievous. The same thing. Same thing means to attack the father. Still, the father will consider, "Whether I shall kill my son or not?" That is natural. "If my son sets fire in the house, whether I shall kill him or not?" So Arjuna's position is like that. "Although they are ātatāyinaḥ, aggressor, still, because they belong to the same family, whether I shall kill them?" He is considering, pāpam eva āśrayed:
So five thousand years. You just try to understand how the society was going on strictly on the Vedic principles. So now there is no such thing. Nobody is observing Vedic principles. And because the Vedic principles were strictly being followed, the whole world was one unit, controlled by these Pāṇḍavas. Even the grandson of Pāṇḍava, Mahārāja Parīkṣit,... This is on the Battlefield of Kurukṣetra. Then when the battle was over, the next king was Mahārāja Parīkṣit, grandson of Arjuna. Up to that time, everything was in order, Vedic principles. All over the world. There was no question of eating meat. The same principles were followed. No meat-eating, no illicit sex, no gambling, no intoxication. Because the king was very strong. Mahārāja Parīkṣit, when he saw that a black man was going to kill one cow, immediately he took his sword: "Who are you? I shall kill you immediately." That was king's stricture. So the Kali was ordered to get out of his kingdom. He begged of his life: "Sir, you are going to kill me. But it is my time. I have now come, and it is my business, cow-killing. So what can I do? This is my business." So Mahārāja Parīkṣit understood that now the Kali-yuga is coming. So it is his business. So "I am as king. How can I stop his business?" That is also another problem. One must be occupied, one must be engaged in his business. Therefore, he asked him to go to these places. Where? In the slaughterhouse, in the brothel for illicit sex, and slaughterhouse and in the drunkard den for intoxication, and gambling place. So Kali was in difficulty to find out a place like that in that time. He could not find. Therefore there was conspiracy to kill the king so that Kali can enter.
So these are the principles. This is called human society. Varnāśramācaravatā puruṣeṇa paraḥ pumān (CC Madhya 8.58). In human society, viṣṇur ārādhyate, the Lord is worshiped. But ne te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuḥ. At the present moment, these rascals, they do not know. Andhā yathāndair upanīyamānāḥ. And the so-called leaders, they are blind, themselves, and they are trying to lead other blind men. This is the social position. Therefore there is no more hope of reviving the Vedic culture. But by the grace of Caitanya Mahāprabhu, ceto darpanaṁ mārjanam... The Vedic culture means to cleanse the heart and make him perfect. Brahma-bhūtaḥ, perfectly spiritualized. That is Vedic culture. Vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyaḥ (BG 15.15). To know the Supreme Lord. That is Vedic culture. Now everything is topsy-turvied. Therefore, by the grace of Caitanya Mahāprabhu, He has simply recommended: harer nāma harer nāma harer nāma eva kevalam (CC Adi 17.21). Only chant. Then the result will be: ceto-darpana-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12). The same result as the Vedic culture introduced will purify the heart to understand one's position. By the chanting of Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, the same position will come. It is so nice. Kīrtanād eva kṛṣṇasya mukta-saṅgaḥ paraṁ vrajet (SB 12.3.51). Therefore there is no question of being depressed that: "We do not belong to this, do not belong to that." Never mind. Whatever it is. Simply chant and you'll become purified. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement.
Then you can control. Hṛṣīkeṇa hṛṣīkeśa-sevanaṁ bhaktir uttamā. Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktaṁ tat-paratvena... (CC Madhya 19.170). (break) You have to purify the senses. How? By engaging the senses in the ser... (break)... tat paratvena. (break) Then you will be able to purify the senses, and with purified senses, when you are engaged in the service of the Supreme, that is called bhakti.
So if we are actually human beings, manuṣyāṇāṁ... (break) Kula-dharma, this family tradition, is not meant for the cats and dogs. If you live like cats... (break) ...there is no question of family tradition. But if you live, want to live like human being, manuṣyāṇāṁ, then this system must be... (break) ...puruṣeṇa paraḥ pumān (CC Madhya 8.58). Catur-vārṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). Then society must be divided into four classes... As we have got four divisions in (break) ...brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra must be there. (break) And each one should serve according to his guṇa-karma, quality and capacity to work. Then the whole society is organized... (break) ...will be perfect, there will be peace... (break) ...no war, nothing of the sort, and gradually making progress back to home, back to Godhead. Otherwise it will be chaos... (break) ...become at the present moment.
That's all. So śāstra says, "If anyone thinks that he is this lump of bones, flesh, blood, urine and stool," yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke (SB 10.84.13), and sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu, "and the production of these bones and flesh, kalatrādiṣu..." Because we have got relationship here in this material world with wife. Kalatra means wife. Kalatra, kalatrādiṣu: "Beginning from wife." Wife produces so many children, and therefore ādi, the beginning is wife. So sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu. "The wife and my children, they are my kith and kin." Sva-dhīḥ kalatra, sva-dhīḥ. "They are my own." Everyone is working... Even a great economist, Mr. Marshall, he says that economic development begins from family affection. Family affection. So unless one thinks that he has to maintain his wife, children, family, there is no question of economic development. Impetus. So yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu and bhauma ijya-dhīḥ (SB 10.84.13). Bhauma, this earth, as worshipable. Bhauma ijya-dhīḥ yat-tīrtha-buddhiḥ salile: "And for pilgrimage, one who thinks that the water is tīrtha..." Tīrtha means where one can get transcendental knowledge. Sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu bhauma ijya-dhīḥ, yat-tīrtha-buddhiḥ salile na karhicij janeṣv abhijñeṣu. "...but has no interest to associate with persons who is expert in transcendental knowledge. Such, these persons, they are called go-khara." Go-khara means cows and asses. So Arjuna played the part of a go-khara. In the battlefield of Kurukṣetra, he played the part of an ordinary person, go-khara, who is identifying this body as self. Therefore he required instruction. Not only... He became so much overwhelmed that he gave up his arrows and bows and sat down, tightly: "My dear Kṛṣṇa, I am not, I cannot fight." And he was crying. Not only he gave up his duty, he was kṣatriya, and he was crying: "Oh, I'll have to kill my kinsmen. No, no, no. I cannot do it."
He was asking Sañjaya: "What did they do?" Kim akurvata sañjaya. That was the question. And first of all, Sañjaya described the arrangement in the battlefield, and then he's speaking. Now, sometimes Bhagavad-gītā is misinterpreted that this battle, I mean to say, dharma-kṣetra kuru-kṣetra means "this body." We do not misinterpret in that way. There is no question of misinterpretation. We are presenting Bhagavad-gītā as it is. We do not change by our whimsical imagination, concoction. We do not interpret the words of the Bhagavad-gītā according to our own desire. No. Actually, from literary point of view, interpretation is required when things are not understood very clearly. The interpretation required. In the law court, when the lawyers try to interpret before the judge, when the terms are not very clear... That is the same way, in, in, amongst the associates and society of learned scholars. Interpretation is not required when the things are very clear. Just like the sun, sunshine, sunlight. There is no need of a lamp to show the sun. The sun is self-effulgent. It is already there. Light is there. Why one should take a lamp to show the sun? This misinterpretation has killed the spirit, the real essence, of Bhagavad-gītā.
So there was so many editions and so many misinterpretation. Our, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, our proposition is that we are, I mean to say, presenting Bhagavad-gītā as it is. We do not misinterpret. So dharma-kṣetra kuru-kṣetra. Kurukṣetra is dharma-kṣetra, the place where religious ritualistic performances are done. Kuru-kṣetre dharmam ācaret. That is the Vedic version. So Kurukṣetra is always... Still people go for pilgrimage in Kurukṣetra, and the station is there, Kurukṣetra, and the place is there. People go there. Kurukṣetra. Why one should interpret that kuru-kṣetra means this body and Pāṇḍavas means these pañca-indriyas, so many things? There is no question of interpretation. And this Mahābhārata... Mahābhārata means "The History of Greater India." That is Mahābhārata. History, it is history. It is not a fiction. It is history. Mahābhārata. This planet was formerly known as Bhārata-varṣa. This planet. The whole planet. Not that the piece of land, as we are calling now, Bhārata-varṣa. No. Before that, this planet was known as Ilāvṛta-varṣa. And after the reign of Mahārāja Bharata, the son of Ṛṣabhadeva, this planet became Bhārata-varṣa. So Bhārata-varṣa means the whole planet. But we have lost... Just like we have lost portion of the present Bhārata-varṣa as Pakistan. Everyone knows, twenty years before there was no such thing as Pakistan. But circumstantially we have lost. So..., so the whole Bhārata-varṣa has been partitioned as this portion is called America, this portion is called Europe, this portion is called Asia. These are modern names. Actually, the whole planet was Bhārata-varṣa. And the whole planet was being controlled by Vedic culture. So as we have lost our Vedic culture, as we could not control the others, other people in other part of the world, by our culture, by our political maneuver, we have lost. Even up to the day of Battlefield of Kurukṣetra... Why Kurukṣetra? Up to the time of Mahārāja Parīkṣit, the whole world was being controlled by one king in New Delhi, Hastināpura. There was no other kingdom. And when the battlefield was..., the battle was there, all people from all parts of body, all parts of the world, they joined, either this party or that party. That was the battlefield.
"These Pāṇḍavas should be killed, and my sons," I mean to say "the Kauravas, they should come out victorious so that there will be no enemy." He was very much anxious to place his sons on the throne. Because he was blind, he could not acquire the throne. His younger brother was situated on the throne. Now, after the death of his younger brother, he thought that "I missed the opportunity of sitting on the throne. Why not my sons? They have got actual right." That is the background of this Kurukṣetra battle. He was always devising some means, how the sons of Pāṇḍu, his nephews, could be separated and his sons would sit on the throne. That was his idea. Therefore he inquired, kim akurvata. Otherwise, there was no question of inquiring kim akurvata. They went there to fight. They'll fight. But he was suspecting, "If they have made any compromise?" That he did not like. That he did not like. He wanted that "There must be fighting. And they are five brothers. My sons are one hundred in number. So they would be killed, and my sons will be without any rivalry."
This is the background of Kurukṣetra. But another thing is the dharma-kṣetra, effect of dharma-kṣetra was visible in Arjuna. Dharma-kṣetra. He, because he's devotee of Kṛṣṇa... Yasyāsti bhaktir bhagavaty akiñcanā sarvair guṇais tatra samāsate surāḥ (SB 5.18.12). Because he's devotee of Kṛṣṇa, therefore he felt: "What is this? Why shall I kill these, my brothers?" Because he was devotee. This sentiment came into the mind of Arjuna, not on the other side, Duryodhana. He never thought. Although they were placed, both of them placed at dharma-kṣetra. The effect of dharma-kṣetra was manifest in the body of Arjuna, not Duryodhana. This is the... If one is pure, then the effects of dharma becomes manifest very quickly.
"My dear friend, parantapa..." Parantapa means one who gives trouble to the enemies. This is the material world. A kṣatriya cannot behave like a brāhmaṇa, to excuse. Brāhmaṇa business is to excuse. Kṣamā-rūpa-tapasvinaḥ. Those who are tapasvī, they can excuse, but those who are in the governmental post, to make justice, there is no question of excuse. Life for life. "You have killed one man; you must be killed." This is justice. A brāhmaṇa, he may excuse, "All right, you have killed my man. Never mind. I excuse you." That is a brāhmaṇa's business. But a kṣatriya, the government, the ruling power, he cannot do so. It is his mercy. It is the government's mercy when a murderer is hanged. That is the injunction in the Manu-saṁhitā. "So parantapa, you are kṣatriya. Your business is to punish the unjust." Kṣudraṁ hṛdaya-daurbalyam: "For a kṣatriya this kind of poor-heartedness, that 'I shall not fight...' Give it up. Don't indulge in such thing."
We do not know what is the next step, "Whether I am going to live or to die." Everything in ignorance. Therefore this body is also not cit. It is full of ignorance. Then sat, cit and ānanda, that we have got experience... Where is ānanda? Ānanda means blissfulness, joyfulness. There cannot be any joyfulness in this body. There are three kinds of miserable condition of material life: adhyātmika, adhibhautika, adhidaivika. So either these three or one or two is always there. Adhyātmika means miserable condition on account of the body and mind. So wherever we go, the body is there. So even if I am very opulent materially with wealth, we are getting experience that even the most rich, richest man in the society, he is committing suicide. Why? He has got every resources to enjoy. Why he is committing suicide? That means there is also no ānanda, even you possess the material things. So there is no question of sac-cid-ānanda in this material condition of life. If you understand what is spiritual life and if you practice how to come to the spiritual life, spiritual platform, as Kṛṣṇa is, then we can become equal with Kṛṣṇa, sac-cid-ānanda (Bs. 5.1). Otherwise we are in ignorance. This body is not sac-cid-ānanda. (end)
War must be there." So at that time, I think, in your country the Prime Minister was Mr. Chamberlain. And he went to see Hitler to stop the war. But he would not. So similarly, in this fight, to the last point, Kṛṣṇa tried to avoid the war. He proposed to Duryodhana that "They are kṣatriyas, your cousin-brothers. You have usurped their kingdom. Never mind, you have taken some way or other. But they are kṣatriyas. They must have some means of livelihood. So give them, five brothers, five villages. Out of the whole world empire, you give them five villages." So he... "No, I am not going to part with even an inch of land without fight." Therefore, under such condition, the fight must be there.
So there is no question of Arjuna's considering whether he would fight or not. It is sanctioned by Kṛṣṇa; so fight must be there. Just like when we were walking, the question was raised that "Why war takes place?" That is not a very difficult subject to understand because everyone of us has got a fighting spirit. Even children fight, cats and dogs fight, birds fight, ants fight. We have seen it. So why not human beings? The fighting spirit is there. That is one of the symptoms of living condition. Fighting. So when that fighting should take place? Of course, at the present moment, by the ambitious politicians, they fight. But fighting, according to Vedic civilization, fighting means dharma-yuddha. On religious principles. Not by whims of political ideas, ism. Just like now fighting is going on on two political groups, the communist and the capitalist. They are trying to avoid only fight, but the fighting is going on. As soon as America is in some field, immediately Russia is also there. In the last fighting between India and Pakistan, as soon as President Nixon sent their Seventh Fleet on the India Ocean, Bay of Bengal, almost in front of India... This was illegal. But very puffed-up, America. So sent the Seventh Fleet, maybe to show sympathy to the Pakistan. But immediately our Russian friend also appeared there. And therefore, America had to come back. Otherwise, I think, America would have attacked on behalf of Pakistan.
He is preparing the background—how materialistic persons, they think in the terms of personal satisfaction. So that has to be given up. Not personal satisfaction, Kṛṣṇa's satisfaction. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Whatever you do, it doesn't matter. You have to test it, whether you are doing it for Kṛṣṇa. That is your perfection. Not only perfection, that is the perfection of your mission of human life. This human life is meant for that purpose. Because less than human form, the animal life, they are trained, perfection of sense gratification, personal satisfaction. They have no such feeling that "Other animals also..." When there is some eatable, one dog, he will think "How I can get it?" He will never think how other dogs also will be able to take it. This is not animal nature. Animal nature means their own satisfaction. There is no question of "My friend, my family members." Even, they do not share even with their own children. You might have seen. If there is some foodstuff, the dog and the dog's children, everyone is trying to take in his own side. This is animal. So when this thing is changed for Kṛṣṇa, that is human life. That is the distinction between animal life. So that is very difficult also. Therefore the whole education is there, Bhagavad-gītā, how to teach people, "Act for Kṛṣṇa, act for God, not for your personal interest. Then you'll be entangled." Yajñārthāt karmaṇaḥ anyatra loko 'yaṁ karma-bandhanaḥ (BG 3.9). Anything you do, it will produce some reaction, and you have to enjoy or suffer that reaction. Anything you do. But if you do for Kṛṣṇa, there is no more reaction. That is your freedom. Yogaḥ karmasu kauśalam (BG 2.50). That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. Yoga, when you are in contact with Kṛṣṇa, that is the secret of success in this material world, working. Otherwise whatever you are doing, whatever you are working, it will produce some reaction and you will have to enjoy or suffer.
Then touch Veda. Otherwise, what you'll understand Vedas? Nonsense. Therefore, Vedas says: tad vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum (MU 1.2.12). You must approach a guru to understand Veda. And what is that Veda? Vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyam (BG 15.15). The Vedas means, to study Vedas means to understand Kṛṣṇa. And surrender unto Him. This is Vedic knowledge. Where Arjuna says that: prapannam. "Now I am surrender unto You. I am now no more going to talk with You on equal level just as if I know so many things." He was right, but he was thinking on the material platform. He was thinking that praduṣyanti kula-striyaḥ (BG 1.40). If everyone... This is material point. But Vedic knowledge is spiritual, uttamam. Tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta jijñāsu śreya uttamam (SB 11.3.21). Uttamam. This śreya. Uttamam. Yac chreya syāt niścitaṁ. Fixed-up. There is, there is no question of changing. That instruction is now, will be given by Kṛṣṇa. Sarva-dharmān parityaja mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja. And this takes place—bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate (BG 7.19).
So therefore in order to achieve the highest, goal of life, one should fully surrender to Kṛṣṇa or His representative. Then his life is successful.
Just like if I say, "Mr. Green, what you have done, any intelligent man should not have done this." So this is indirectly saying that "You are not intelligent." It is in a gentleman's way, speaking that "Mr. Green, what you are doing, no intelligent man can do this." That means "You are not intelligent." So here He say that "You are lamenting over the bodies of your relatives because in the fight you are considering that 'My friends and my relatives will be killed,' so that means they are living bodies, and you are lamenting over the, over their killing. So this sort of lamentation is never done by a learned man. A learned man never does it." Gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ (BG 2.11). "Those who are learned, one who is learned, he does not lament over the body, either a living body or dead body. There is no question of..." Now, because one who knows the distinction between the body and the soul, firmly con... Just like you have heard the name of Socrates. Soc..., a great philosopher, Greek philosopher. He believed in the immortality of soul. So he was punished in the court. Hemlock. Hemlock was offered to him, that "All right, if you believe the immortality of soul, then you drink this hemlock poison." So he drunk because he was firmly convinced that "Even if I drink this poison... My body will be destroyed, but by destruction of my body, I am not going to be destroyed." He was convinced. So he did not lament. So a paṇḍita, learned man, must know that this body and soul, the distinction, the difference between body and soul... The body is not soul, and the soul is not body, and one who knows, he is learned man. This instruction is given first. So for spiritual advancement this first knowledge, that the body and the soul is different... This body cannot be identified with the soul. You see? The soul is there, but body is not soul. Body is not soul. So every learned man knows it, and we should be...
So this individuality continues. Similarly Kṛṣṇa, if He does not like you, He may refuse you Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Not that because you are following all the rules and regulations, Kṛṣṇa is obliged to accept you. No. If He thinks that "He's nonsense; I cannot accept him," He'll reject you.
So He has got individuality, you have got individuality, everyone has got individuality. Where is the question of impersonalism come? There is no possibility. And if you don't believe Kṛṣṇa, you don't believe Vedas, apart from anything else, Kṛṣṇa is accepted as the supreme authority, the Personality of Godhead. Then if we don't believe Him, then where is the possibility of advancing in knowledge? There is no possibility of it. So there is no question of individuality. This is the statement of authority. Now, apart from statement of authority, you have to apply your reason and arguments. Can you say anywhere there is agreement between two parties? No. You go, study. In the state, in the family, in the community, in the nation, there is no agreement. Even in the assembly, even in your country. Suppose there is Senate, everyone has got country's interest, but he's thinking in his individual way. One is thinking that "My country's welfare will be in this line." Otherwise, why there is competition during election of president. Everyone is saying that "America needs Nixon." And another person, he also says, "America needs me." So, but why two? If America you, and you are both... No. There is individuality. Mr. Nixon's opinion is something else. Mr. another candidate's opinion is something else. In the assembly, in the Senate, in the Congress, in the United Nations, everyone is fighting with his individual view. Otherwise why there are so many flags in the world? You cannot say anywhere impersonalism. Personality is predominating everywhere. Everywhere, the personality, individuality, is predominant. So we have to accept. We have to apply our reason, arguments, and accept the authority. Then the question is solved. Otherwise it is most difficult.
Similarly, because you are spirit soul, you cannot live peacefully in this material world. This is foreign. But as soon as you enter into the spiritual world, your life is eternal, blissful and full of knowledge, real peace. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9). Kṛṣṇa says, "After leaving this body, he does not come to this perplexities of material world." Mām eti, "He comes to Me." "Me" means His kingdom, His paraphernalia, His associates, everything. If some rich man or some king says, "All right, you come to me," that does not mean that he's impersonal. If a king says, "Come to..." means that he has got his palace, he has got his secretary, he has got his nice apartment, everything is there. How he can be imperson? But he says only, "Come to me." This "me" means everything. This "me" does not mean impersonal. And we get information from Brahma-saṁhitā, lakṣmī-sahasra-śata-sambhrama-sevyamānaṁ surabhīr abhipālayantam (Bs. 5.29). So He's not impersonal. He's raising cows, He's with hundreds and thousands of goddesses of fortune, His friends, His paraphernalia, His kingdom, His house, everything is there. So there is no question of impersonalism. Yes.
They become perfect in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Liberated soul means... We are just trying to be Kṛṣṇa conscious. We are not actually in full Kṛṣṇa consciousness. We are... Just like a diseased person is trying to recover. So one who is recovered, there is no question of his healthy life. We are trying to be healthy, our present position. So we are trying to be Kṛṣṇa conscious. So one who is liberated is nothing but Kṛṣṇa conscious. You follow? Yes. Kṛṣṇa consciousness is the perfection of life. So we are trying to reach that platform of perfection by regulative principle. But when we are actually on the platform, there is nothing but Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is the perfection of life. That is our actual, liberated stage. Jīvera svarūpa haya nitya-kṛṣṇa-dāsa (Cc. Madhya 20.108-109). That is our svarūpa. Svarūpa means actual constitutional position. And mukti, liberation, means to come to that real position. Just like healthy life means to come to the normal life from the diseased stage. That is healthy life and normal life. So Kṛṣṇa consciousness is our normal consciousness. This normal consciousness is now polluted. We have got so many other consciousness. So this is an attempt to get out of all, I mean to say, infected consciousness, come to the real stage of pure Kṛṣṇa consciousness. One question. No more. Next day. Yes?
The other day in Paris one press reporter came to me, the Socialist Press. So I informed him that "Our philosophy is that everything belongs to God." Kṛṣṇa says bhoktāraṁ yajña-tapasāṁ sarva-loka-maheśvaram (BG 5.29). "I am the enjoyer, bhoktā." Bhoktā means enjoyer. So bhoktāraṁ yajña-tapasāṁ. Just like this body is working. The whole body is working, everyone's, to enjoy life, but wherefrom the enjoyment begins? The enjoyment begins from the stomach. You have to give sufficient nice foodstuffs to the stomach. If there is sufficient energy, we can digest. If sufficient energy, then all other senses become strong. Then you can enjoy sense gratification. Otherwise it is not possible. If you cannot digest.... Just like we are now old man. We cannot digest. So there is no question of sense enjoyment. So sense enjoyment begins from the stomach. The luxuriant growth of the tree begins from the root, if there is sufficient water. Therefore the trees are called pada-pa. They drink water from the legs, the roots, not from the heads. Just like we eat from the head. So there are different arrangements. As we can eat from the mouth, the trees, they eat from their legs. But one must eat. Āhāra-nidrā-bhaya-maithuna. Eating is there, either you eat through your legs or your mouth or your hands. But so far Kṛṣṇa is concerned, He can eat from anywhere. He can eat from hands, from legs, from eyes, from ears, anywhere. Because He is complete spiritual. There is no difference between His heads and legs and ears and eyes.
Prabhupāda: I don't follow. That's not question. (?)
Devotee: Hm? This lady.
Śyāmasundara: Do we believe in reincarnation?
Prabhupāda: Where is the question of believing? It is a fact. It is not a question of belief. It is a fact.
Śyāmasundara (for woman): Unless you fully surrender to God, then there's no question of knowing that. (?)
Prabhupāda: Yes. To go back to Godhead means you don't get this material body. So long you get this material body, you have to change. That is the material nature. Anything which is material, it has got a date of birth and it has got a date of annihilation. And in the via media there is growth, their existence. So this body, not only this body, even this material world, it has got a date or creation, and it will be annihilated. This is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā. Bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19). It comes into manifestation once, and again it is destroyed. This is material existence. When you go back to home, back to Godhead, you haven't got to accept this material body. Your spiritual body is already there within this material body. And in that spiritual body you shall exist along with God. That is the highest perfection of life.
Revatīnandana: Are there any other questions? Yes?
Guest: (too faint)
Revatīnandana: Um... Well, it's an unusual question.
Those who are too much foolish, the spiritual master orders him, "Don't talk. Please remain silent." That's all. Because if you talk, you'll talk simply nonsense. Why should you spoil your energy by such nonsense talking? Better stop. The meditation is also like that also. Instead of talking or doing nonsense, if one is remaining silent for some time, it is little good for him. But this meditation and maunam, silence, is not meant for the devotees. They are meant for the lesser intelligent class of men. Devotees' business is always to talk about Kṛṣṇa. Why they should stop talking? Maunam? No. Kīrtanīyaḥ sadā hariḥ (CC Adi 17.31). Caitanya Mahāprabhu says that one has to chant and talk of Kṛṣṇa twenty-four hours. Where is the question of maunam, silence? There is no question of silence. Silence is for those who are nonsense. "Be silent, don't talk." For them. At least they practice silence means at least they stop talking nonsense. But those who are actually advanced, for them there is no such restriction. Vācāṁsi vaikuṇṭha-guṇānuvarṇane. We should use our talking power for describing the glories of the Lord. Vaikuṇṭha-guṇānuvarṇane. That is kīrtana. That is chanting. Abhavad naiyāsaki-kīrtane. Just like for seven days when Parīkṣit Mahārāja was going to die... He had only seven days left. So twenty-four hours without any eating or without any drinking a drop of water, he went on hearing from Śukadeva Gosvāmī. And similarly, Śukadeva Gosvāmī also went on speaking, speaking Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Śrī-viṣṇu-śravane parīkṣit. They got, both of them got salvation back to home, back to Godhead. How? One was hearing, and one was chanting. These two processes. Parīkṣit Mahārāja was hearing and Śukadeva Gosvāmī was chanting. And what was the subject matter? Kṛṣṇa. That's all.
Go means cow, and khara means ass. So anyone who accepts this body as self, he is animal, he is not human being. That is the beginning of knowledge. People are accepting knowledge from a school, college, university, but at the present moment at least, how many people know that he is not body? Unless we understand this first principle of knowledge, there is no question of spiritual advancement of life. So the beginning of Bhagavad-gītā is to give lesson that we are not this body. It will be later on explained that the spirit soul, or the real person, is within this body. Just like we are here. We are within this shirt and coat, but we are not the shirt and coat. So if the shirt and coat is stolen and if somebody becomes mad after it and lamenting, that is not very good sense. Therefore He is saying that aśocyān anvaśocas tvam: (BG 2.11) "You are lamenting on the subject matter which is never done by any learned man." So we shall go further on? Yes? Read, you, purport in Spanish. (break)
The punishment... Kṛṣṇa does not personally punish. He has got many agents. Just like in the government, the president does not punish directly, but there are many departments. Similarly, parāsya śaktir vividhaiva śrūyate (Cc. Madhya 13.65, purport). His potencies are manyfold. One of the potency is this material nature. It is called māyā. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). It is very difficult to surpass the jurisdiction of māyā, duratyayā. But punishment will not be excused. Ignorance of law is no excuse. Similarly, this māyā, this material nature, is very, very strong. If you eat little more... Your nature is to eat, say, two ounce. If you eat three ounce immediately you'll be punished. There will be indigestion. The nature is so strong. Therefore it is called daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā. So in this way you cannot surpass the stringent laws of māyā, but if you want to avoid punishment, then you take shelter of Kṛṣṇa. Mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti te (BG 7.14). Therefore Kṛṣṇa consciousness is essential. If we become Kṛṣṇa conscious, if we follow the instruction of Kṛṣṇa, then there is no question of being harassed by the stringent laws of māyā. This is the version.
They are bigger. That is also natural. You see. Just like in African people. They are taller. They are taller than the Āryan people, even in your, this black negroes, they are taller than American people. So there is little difference of course. That is all right. But on the primary facie, prima facie, there is no difference. Similarly, in the sun planet, in the moon planet, there are also human beings like us, and they are called devas because they are high, intellectual. They are all very powerful than ourself, and they have got different bodies with different power and everything. Otherwise, there is no question... Even great scientists like Dr. Meghanatha Sar(?) in India, he, he said that there is no reason to disbelieve that in other planets there is no life. How can you? Just like because you have not seen India you cannot say, "Oh, there, there is no living being. It is vacant." So these people are going to the moon planet. They are saying it is full of dust. It is full of clay, or something like that. All these foolishness. You see? That means they have not reached. Outside they take some photo and they come out.
Kṛṣṇa is giving more enlightenment on the living entity, soul. "Never was there a time when I did not exist, nor you, nor all these kings; nor in the future shall any of us cease to be." Now, Kṛṣṇa says that "In the past I existed. So also you. And so also all these soldiers and the kings who have assembled in this fighting. They existed in the past. For the present, there is no question of asking... We are existing. And in the future also, it is not that we shall not exist." That means, "We shall exist." So what is "I," "you," and "others"? I am individual person. You are individual person, and all others, they're also, each and every one of them, individual persons. So in the past we were all individuals; at present we are all individuals; and in the future also, we shall remain individuals. So where there is question of merging, become one? Here Kṛṣṇa says that "In the past we are individual persons, in the present we are all individual persons, and in future also, we shall remain individuals."
This soul... "Do not think that soul is born." No. As God is ever-existing, the soul is ever-existing. It is not... There is no question of birth. And when there is no question of birth, there is no question of death. Because we experience, anything, anybody, who has taken birth, he dies. Nobody will live here. So if the soul has no birth, there is no question of death. And as Kṛṣṇa, God, God is eternal, advaitam acyutam anādim ananta-rūpam ādyaṁ Purāṇa (Bs. 5.33). Purāṇa means old. Because Kṛṣṇa is the original person, therefore He must be Purāṇa, the oldest, older than Brahmā. Because Brahmā is given birth by Kṛṣṇa. Therefore Kṛṣṇa has been addressed in the Bhagavad-gītā as prapitāmaha (BG 11.39). Brahmā is called pitāmaha, the grandfather, and prapitāmaha means "the father of the grandfather." So Kṛṣṇa has been addressed as prapitāmaha, "father of Brahmā." Therefore He's ādi-puruṣa. Actually, within this creation, Lord Brahmā is the original person, because he was firstborn. There was no other person before him. But he's given birth by Nārāyaṇa, from the abdomen of Nārāyaṇa in the lotus flower. Therefore He's the father of Brahmā. Prapitāmaha (BG 11.39). So Kṛṣṇa here says, because that Māyāvādī philosophy's also nullified here. Because here it is said, na jāyate, na jāyate mriyate vā kadācin nāyaṁ bhūtvā bhavitā vā na bhūyaḥ. Māyāvāda philosophy says that the living entity has become separated on account of illusion. Not becomes separated. He is... There is no separation. But it is illusion; he's thinking, "I am different from God." But Kṛṣṇa says, mamaivāṁśo jīva-bhūtaḥ jīva-loke sanātanaḥ (BG 15.7). That aṁśa, part and parcel of God, he's sanātana. Not that, being covered by illusion, he's thinking "I am separated." He's separated always, sanātana.
Nityo nityānām. So every living entity is nitya. As Kṛṣṇa is nitya. He is singular number we are plural number. That is the difference. We are many; Kṛṣṇa is one. There cannot be many Kṛṣṇas. But there are many living entities. So what is the difference between the singular number? That is also stated here: eko bahūnāṁ yo vidadhāti kāmān. This one singular number is supplying all the necessities of this plural number. Is it not fact? We are very much disturbed over population. That is all nonsense. Kṛṣṇa is quite able, if there is overpopulation... There cannot be overpopulation, because there are already ananta living entities, what to speaking of overpopulation? It is already there, you cannot count. There is no question of... There are already overpopulation. And they can be provided by Kṛṣṇa. Eko bahūnāṁ yo vidadhāti kāmān. Kṛṣṇa is not limited; He is also unlimited. He can provide unlimited living entities. There is no scarcity of food. So this theory that overpopulation is nonsense. It is also nonsense. There cannot be overpopulation. But there is restriction, by nature. Nature will restrict production of food if there are demons. Nature will not provide the demons. You'll find in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, Fourth Canto, nature is quite prepared to supply all the foods, but as soon as there are number of demons, because the whole plan is to correct. Just like the criminals are sent to the prison house for being corrected so that they may not again commit criminals. That is the purpose of... Similarly, we are all criminals who are in this material world. The purpose is to be corrected. We wanted to imitate Kṛṣṇa, to become Kṛṣṇa, and therefore we violated the orders of Kṛṣṇa, and that criminality means material life.
Pebbles, big. Small. Sand, sand. Yes. So you can eat that. When there is no rain... That is also eatable. The peacocks, they eat. The pigeons, they eat. Yes, the, they can eat. You have seen? They're eating. So everything is there eatable. So there is no question of overpopulation. Overpopulation is already there, anantyāya kalpate. They why do you call overpopulation? When there is already fire, why do you say there will be fire? It is already there. So, but, the restriction, eko bahūnāṁ yo vidadhāti kāmān. That eka, that eka, Kṛṣṇa, He orders. He does not order actually. Just like, not every time the police has to be ordered by the superior authority to punish the criminal. They know how to punish. So the nature knows how to punish these criminals. Therefore, the scientists are finding now shortage of petrol, shortage of this, shortage... What to do? What to do? This is the position. Otherwise, there is no question of overpopulation. The supply is restricted. That is the problem. Eko yo bahūnām. Because He supplies all the necessities, the supply will be restricted. As we become more and more sinful and without Kṛṣṇa consciousness, they will be put into difficulties, they will be dying within the womb, they will be killed, within the womb, there will be war, there will be pestilence, there will be famine, there will be earthquake. In so many ways, we have to die. Bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19). Again, take birth, this business will go on. And ultimately, when the whole universe is annihilated, then again we take shelter in the body of Mahā-Viṣṇu and live for, in that way, without any body, for many millions of years. Again, there is creation, and then again given chance. "All right, take another chance. Be Kṛṣṇa conscious."
They create disturbance for want of this body. Those who have got experience of ghost in some house, the ghost is there, he is individual soul, but because he hasn't got this material covering, that is a punishment. For the most sinful person, that is a punishment, that he does not get this body, although he wants this body, because for enjoyment we want this body. Body is the combination of senses, instrument. If I want to touch you I require hand, and through hand I'll feel the pleasure of touching you. So the ghost wants to touch, but he hasn't got the instrument. That is ghost. But there are ghost. It is not fictitious. It is a fact. Ghost means without this material body.
So so long we are materially contaminated, we require this material body for enjoying senses. And the spiritual world, we get our spiritual body developed. So there is no question of becoming ghost or... Individual, there is. The person is always existing. That is the purport of this verse. Na caiva na bhaviṣyāmaḥ sarve vayam ataḥ param. Ataḥ param, "after this," means after this body is ended the individuality continues; simply we change our body. This is the version, and it is explained in the next verse, dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā, tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). We are individual always, but we are changing this body from one type of body to another body according to our karma. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa jantur deha-upapatti (SB 3.31.1). By superior examination we get a body, karmaṇā. So at the time of death it is decided what kind of body you are going to have next. That is decided by superior authority. You cannot dictate that "Give me this body," or "I don't want this body. I want a body..." No. That is not in your hand. You can do, you are given freedom. In the human form of life you are given freedom to act although there is direction that "You act like this." But if you don't like, you can act. Yathecchasi tathā kuru. (BG 18.63) You can act, but you become implicated with your karma because you have to act according to the modes of nature.
Because we are actually spirit in identity and we have been put into material conditions. We can very well experience. And we have, I got experience, and here is Captain Pandia. He has also experienced. He may be more than experienced than me. When we passed through the sea on the ship, although we are on the sea, quite safe, still, when there is some storm, when there is some disturbance on the ocean, we also become very much disturbed, because that situation is foreign to us. We are not so much disturbed in the land as we are disturbed in the ocean because we know that our position in the ocean is not our natural condition. So we should know that disturbance is due to our unnatural condition. Otherwise, there is no question of disturbance.
So whole disturbance of mind... It is described in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam,
- tat sādhu manye 'sura-varya dehināṁ
- sadā samudvigna-dhiyām asad-grahāt
- hitvātma-pātaṁ gṛham andha-kūpaṁ
- vanaṁ gato yad dharim āśrayeta
- (SB 7.5.5)
The... This is a verse in connection with talks between Mahārāja Prahlāda and his father, Hiraṇyakaśipu. His father was gross materialist, Hiraṇyakaśipu. Hiraṇya means gold, and kaśipu means soft bed. So materialists, they are concerned with gold and soft bed for enjoyment. You see? So his name was Hiraṇyakaśipu.
"He is respectable. He has brought me up since my father's death. And here is my teacher, Droṇācārya. He has taught me this military art. Whatever I am warrior, my expertness is due to him. And do you think, Kṛṣṇa, I shall kill them? No, I can fight with them. I can kill them, but it is not my duty." So Arjuna, and, says like that. But Kṛṣṇa says, "No. You must be dutiful. Never mind who is that, your grandfather or your teacher. No. When there is fight... You are a kṣatriya. A kṣatriya should not be..., has no other consideration in the fight. He must fight."
So here is the thing, you see, that Kṛṣṇa does not say that "You become a nonviolent." No. Never says that. When there is question of fighting for right cause, you must fight. There is no question of becoming nonviolent. You see? Now, now, he is saying that "Don't be aggrieved. Even your grandfather, Bhīṣmadeva, even your Droṇācārya..., it will be good for them because they are now old enough, and as soon as they are dead, they get a new body. So you should not be discouraged." Then one is that "Do you mean to say that therefore a man should be killed?" No. We cannot kill without reason. No. That will be a great sin. But this is a fight. This is a fight for a cause. They are not killers. It is said that a kṣatriya who lays down his life in the battlefield, he at once rises up to the higher planets. You see? Because for right cause, if one lays down his life... Just like so many people, they lay, lay down their life for the cause of the country. Do you mean to say they are sinful or they are going to hell? No, no, no. Those who are laying down for the good cause their life, their next life is very brilliant. But if you commit suicide without any reason and written or without any cause, then you'll be sinful. You'll be sinful. These are... Of course, we get knowledge from this...
Ether is a material thing. And the soul is spirit. We'll have, in later ślokas, that soul cannot be cut. Soul cannot be cut into pieces. And the spirit cannot be... acchedyo 'yam adāhyo 'yam. We'll get those ślokas. Soul never can be cut into pieces. You see? Just like here is a paper. I can, I can tore this paper into pieces, but it is not possible for the soul. Then it, then it loses its eternity or its stability. You see? So we cannot compare ether with soul because they are two different subject matters. You see? Analogy... Now, those who, those who are present here, those who have knowledge of logic, analogy... Analogy is possible when the two things are... When there are greatest number of similarities of two things, then there can be analogy. Otherwise there is no question of ana..., analogy. Just like if I say, "Oh, this lady's face is just like moon," now there must be some similarity in this face and the moon. As the moon is bright and a very beautiful looker, therefore this face must be very beautiful and very bright. But if the face is ugly, how can I compare with this moon? So whenever we make some analogy, there must be points, greater number of points of similarity. Now, here ether is a material thing, and soul is spiritual thing, so there is no similarity at all. At all. And besides that...
As the soul is within the body and the body is changing every moment, similarly, the last stage of change is called death. Death is nothing but the final change of this present body. That's all. And our death condition is for seven months only. As soon as I leave this body, at once I am injected into other's mother's body according to my karma. I may be injected to a queen's womb; I may be injected to a dog's mother. You see? That is due to my karma. You see? The father is present there. The dog father is present there. The king's father is present there. The devatā father is present there. There is no scarcity of father, but it will depend on my karma, which kind of father I shall take shelter. So these things are, have to be accepted from the authoritative scriptures like Śrīmad Bhagavad-gītā and Śrīmad-Bhāgavata. And then it will be possible for us to understand the things as they are. There is no question of sectarianism. There is no question of this "ism" or that "ism." It is a question of pure knowledge.
Dehinaḥ, of the living soul, the body is changing. Similarly, after death, after so-called death... Because there is no death. After stoppage of the function of this gross body, the soul is transferred to another gross body. This statement we get from Bhagavad-gītā. And if we accept this statement, "This is fact," then our spiritual life immediately begins. Without this understanding, there is no question of spiritual understanding. Everything vague, simply mental speculation, "maybe," "perhaps." These theories are being forwarded by so-called scientists and philosophers. But we don't accept such things as "perhaps," "maybe." No. We accept what is fact. It is not a question of belief; it is a question of fact. So this is the fact.
Now, how the soul is transmigrating? Suppose after this life, I get better life, that's nice. But if I get lower life, then what is the condition? Suppose next life I get the life of a cat or dog or cow. Suppose you get again birth in America. But if you change your body, then whole circumstances change. As human being, you are given all protection by the state, but as soon as you become another body, either tree or animals, the treatment is different. Animal is going to the slaughterhouse; trees are being cut out. There is no protest. So this is the condition of material life. Sometimes we are getting better condition of life, sometimes we are getting lower condition of life. There is no guarantee.
There are so many causes of agitation, but a person, in spite of being persuaded by the cause of agitation... Just like a young man and young woman, when they are present, naturally they become agitated. In the śāstras it is said just like fire and butter. If you put butter before the fire, automatically it melts. Similarly, a woman is considered as fire and the man is considered as butter. So this is natural. But a person who is not agitated, he is called dhīra.
So when a man dies, the man's relatives lament, "Oh, my father has gone," "My sister has gone," "My wife..." But if you become dhīra, then you are not bewildered. Just like your friend or your father moves from this apartment to another apartment, who is agitated? No, that's all right. He was in this apartment, now he has gone to another apartment, so there is no question of agitation or being perturbed. Similarly, one who knows the causes of transmigration of the soul from one body to another, he is not agitated at the death of his friend or relative. He knows everything, and he knows where his friend has gone with reference to the śāstra. Just like your friend has gone to India. How do you know? You know that he purchased a ticket for India and he has gone to India, so there is no need of agitation, "Oh, where he has gone? Where he has gone? Where he has gone?" Similarly, when a man dies, one who is dhīra... Here especially the word is used, dhīras tatra na muhyati. Muhyati means bewildered. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). Just like the parents. The child is changing body. The mother knows, "My child was six inches long within my womb. When he came out, he was twelve inches long, then thirteen inches, fourteen inches, in this way, now three feet, four feet." The mother is not agitated the child is changing body. Similarly, a dhīra, one who knows the laws of transmigration of the soul, he does not lament at the death of his father or friend. He knows that "My father has now gone to such and such place." That also he can know. How? With reference to the śāstra. Therefore, Vedānta-sūtra says that you should see everything through the śāstra, śāstra-cakṣuṣā.
Kurukṣetra is dharma-kṣetra. Samavetā yuyutsavaḥ: (BG 1.1) And the persons assembled there, namely, the Pāṇḍavas and the Kauravas, they wanted to fight. Yuyutsavaḥ. That's all right. Where is the interpretation? They wanted to fight. They selected a nice place, dharma-kṣetra, Kurukṣetra, and there they fought. So it is, meaning is clear. Why there should be interpretation that "The Pāṇḍava means the five senses and the Kurukṣetra means this body"? Why? Why? Where is the necessity of such interpretation? Interpretation is required where things are not clear. Actually, we do interpret. Just like in the law court, if some clause is not very clear, the lawyers interpret: "It may be like this, it may be like that." But when the things are clear, there is no question of interpretation. That is the system. Amongst the scholars, if things are clear, there should be no interpretation.
So Bhagavad-gītā, in each and every verse, the things are very, very clear, as clear as the sunshine. So there is no question of interpretation. Our, this publication of Bhagavad-gītā, we have therefore mentioned: Bhagavad-gītā As It Is. Because there are six hundred and forty different editions of Bhagavad-gītā, and almost every one of them has got a different interpretation. That is the system going on now. Therefore, before me, many persons, many swamis, went to Western countries and they presented Bhagavad-gītā in their own way, but not a single person became a devotee of Kṛṣṇa. Throughout the whole history. Now Bhagavad-gītā is being presented as it is, and thousands of them are becoming devotee of Kṛṣṇa. Practical. Thousands of them. The simple thing. I presented Kṛṣṇa as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and they accepted it, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and by following the principles, within the four years, so many devotees of Kṛṣṇa have come out. Because there was no adulteration. So our request is try to understand Bhagavad-gītā without adulteration. Try to understand Bhagavad-gītā as it is presented. Then you will get knowledge. Otherwise, you will remain in the same ignorance, before reading Bhagavad-gītā and after reading Bhagavad-gītā. This is our proposal.
No. In my childhood I did so many things. I do not remember. But my father (and) mother, who have seen my childhood, they remember. So forgetting does not mean that things did not take place. Similarly, death means I have forgotten what was I was in the past life. That is called death. Otherwise I, as spirit soul, I have no death. Suppose I change my dress. In my boyhood I was in a different dress. In my youthhood I was in a different dress. In my old age, or as a sannyāsī. I am in a different dress. So dress may change. That does not mean the owner of the dress is dead or gone. No.
This simple thing, transmigration of the soul, is explained. And individual. All of us individual. There is no question of mixing together. Everyone of us, individual. God is individual, we are also individual. That we have explained yesterday. Nityo nityānāṁ cetanaś cetanānām (Kaṭha Upaniṣad 2.2.13). Only difference is that God does not change His body; I change My body. That is also in this material world. When I shall go to the spiritual world, there is no more change of body. Eternal. As Kṛṣṇa has got His eternal body, sac-cid-ānanda-vigrahaḥ (Bs. 5.1), form, eternal blissful of knowledge, similarly, when we go back to home, back to Godhead, we get also similar body, sac-cid-ānanda-vigrahaḥ. Īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ sac-cid-ānanda-vigrahaḥ (Bs. 5.1). That is the difference. When Kṛṣṇa comes, He does not change His body. In this material world, Kṛṣṇa does not change. Therefore His name is Acyuta. He never changes. He never falls down, because He is the controller of māyā. And we are controlled by māyā. That is the difference. Material energy.... We are controlled by the material energy. But Kṛṣṇa is the controller of the material energy. Not only material energy, spiritual energy, all energies. Everything that we see, everything manifested, whatever we see, that is Kṛṣṇa's energy.
"You are eating a bull and cow. Cow is your mother. You are drinking milk; therefore she is your mother. And the bull is helping you, producing your food, maintaining. As the father maintains you and mother gives you milk. And do you think it is good to kill them?" So Kazi, he was also learned, "Oh, Your Vedic scripture also, there is cow sacrifice." Caitanya Mahāprabhu immediately said, "No, that is not killing. That was giving a new body to show the strength of the Vedic mantras." A cow was sacrificed in the fire and by mantra, by chanting of the mantra, the cow will come out with a new body, young body. That was not killing. So similarly, here also, Kṛṣṇa is giving the same argument, that "You are lamenting on your grandfather. He has got old body, but if he is killed in this battle, he'll have a new, fresh new body. So you should be joyful. Why are you lamenting?" So this argument was forwarded by Kṛṣṇa, that... Now, just like this child. This child can hope many things. He has got immense duration of life now beginning, and what hope I have got? I am now this old body, say five years or ten years more. So I cannot expect, hope anything more, than this child. So Kṛṣṇa is giving that "There is no question of lamentation for your grandfather. Your grandfather is going to have a new lease of life. Why should you be sorry?" So this argument He is forwarding, but nobody will agree to this argument. Yes. Go on.
Prabhupāda: Yes. A man is crying, "Oh, my father is dead," or "My friend is dead, my..." so on, so on, crying. But one who is dhīra he knows, "What is this death? He has changed his body, so there is no question of lamentation." So how much spiritual education required to come to this point? Yes, go on.
Madhudviṣa: "O son of Kuntī, the nonpermanent appearance of heat and cold, happiness and distress, and their disappearance in due course are like the appearance of winter and summer season. They arise from sense perception, O scion of Bharata, and one must learn to tolerate them without being disturbed."
Prabhupāda: Now the question is, "Yes, I understand that my grandfather is spirit soul and this body is material. Still, by nature I'll be unhappy if my grandfather is killed and my teacher is killed. I'll be unhappy." So Kṛṣṇa is instructing Arjuna that this kind of unhappiness, distress, is this world. You cannot avoid it. These are necessary distresses. The example He's giving that severe cold. In the winter season, in the month of January or some month, the winter is very severe, intolerable. Sometimes somewhere it is below 30 degrees zero. But what is to be done? The people in such part of the world who live... Just like in Canada it goes sometimes 30 degrees below zero. Does it mean that they'll close their offices and work and everything? No. Everything is going on as usual. One has to tolerate. That's all. In India also, in India and other parts of the eastern countries. Just like Arabia, Iraq or... During summertime, the temperature is 135. You cannot imagine 135. In India we have experienced temperature, I have experienced up to 118 degrees. Not always, unusually. But 110 degree is usual during summertime, 110 degree. Usual temperature. So does it mean... The scorching heat, you cannot get out on the street. But still, one has to go to office, one has to go to work. There are some cases of heat stroke. Still, nobody can stop his duty. "Similarly, even if you think that by discharging your duty as a warrior, as a kṣatriya, your grandfather will be killed or... Of course, there is no cause of lamentation. He'll get another new body. But even if you think, if your bodily concept is so strong, if you are sorry, so you have to, I mean to say, tolerate. Just one has to tolerate extreme heat and extreme cold." There is no cause of crying, "Oh, there is extreme heat, extreme heat."
Yes, the thing is we should be Kṛṣṇa conscious. Just like electrification. Touching electricity by one wire, another joining another, another wire, if the touch is there factual, then the electricity is everywhere. Similarly if our Kṛṣṇa consciousness is rightly connected, then there is no question of direct or indirect. Because absolute world there is no difference. As soon as it is touched with the direct connection... That is called disciplic succession. Because the connection is coming down one after another, so if we touch here, the spiritual master who is connected by the same way, then the electric connection is there. There is no question of direct or indirect. Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ (BG 4.2). Simply we have to see whether the connection is disconnected. If the connection is there, tight, then the electricity come without fail. So in our conditioned stage there will be so many doubts, so many implication. But the same thing as I gave you example, that don't be very much hasty to receive the result immediately. Simply we have to follow. We have to follow. Tat-tat-karma-pravartanāt. This is advised by Rūpa Gosvāmī. The six things we have to take particular care, and six things we have to avoid in order to be perfect in Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Yudhiṣṭhira was commissioned to speak this lie, that "You go and say that 'Your son is dead.' " And he says that "I never spoke lie. I cannot do that." Now here the order is coming from Kṛṣṇa, therefore he should have executed the order immediately. Although speaking lie for common man is sin, but because it is in relationship with Kṛṣṇa, it is not sin. So that telling lie should not be taken risk of at one's own discretion. It must be ordered by Kṛṣṇa or by His representative. Telling lie is always sinful. That's all right. But if Kṛṣṇa says "Tell lie," it is not sinful. That is the secret. You can violate the laws only on the direct order of Kṛṣṇa or His representative. That's all. That is common sense. Just like a political person is engaged to kill somebody under superior order. And if he can kill, he is rewarded, he is given high post. But the same man, if he kills by his own discretion, he'll be hanged. So serving greater purpose, supreme purpose, absolute purpose, there is no question of such piety or sinful. But in the ordinary field, there must be "This is pious, this is sinful." So that discretion should not be taken by oneself, but it should be consulted.
Just like this house is made of stone, brick and wood and so many. So you break it, and there is no more stone and no more brick. This is distributed to the earth. Throw it on the earth. Then there is no house. Similarly, if you become zero, no body, then you are free from pains and pleasure. This is their philosophy, nirvāṇa philosophy, śūnyavādi: "Make it zero." But that is not possible. That is not possible. You cannot... Because you are spirit soul... That will be explained. You are eternal. You cannot be zero. That will be explained, na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20), that we are giving up this body, but immediately I have to accept another body, immediately. Then where is your question of dismantling? By nature's way you will get another body. Because you want to enjoy, you have come here in this material world. There is no question of asking. Everyone knows that "I am in this material world. I must enjoy to the fullest extent." One who is unaware of the fact that "I am going to take another life," he is thinking, "This is a combination of this matter—earth, water, air, fire. So when it will be broken, then everything will be finished. So so long I have got this opportunity, let me enjoy to the fullest extent." This is called material mentality, atheist, atheist, who does not know that we are eternal soul, we are changing body only. The atheists think that after finishing...
So for a devotee who is trying to go back to home, back to Godhead, there will be no scarcity. Be rest assured. Kṛṣṇa says in the Bhagavad-gītā, teṣāṁ satata-yuktānāṁ yoga-kṣemaṁ vahāmy aham: (BG 10.10) "A devotee who is engaged always in My service, I look after, how his necessities of life will be fulfilled." A practical example is that in this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement we have got one hundred centers, and each temple, not less than twenty-five, up to 250 devotees live. So we have no fixed up means of income, and we are spending in all the branches eighty thousand dollars per month. But by grace of Kṛṣṇa we have no scarcity; everything is supplied. People are surprised sometimes that "These people do not work, do not take any profession, simply chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. How they live?" So that is no question. If cats and dogs can live at the mercy of God, the devotees can live very comfortably by the mercy of God. There is no such question, but if somebody thinks that "I have taken to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, but I am suffering for so many things," for them or for all of us the instruction is mātrā-sparśās tu kaunteya śītoṣṇa-sukha-duḥkha-dāḥ: (BG 2.14) "These pains and pleasure is just like winter and summer." In the winter the water is painful, and in the summer the water is pleasing. So what is the position of the water? It is pleasing or painful? It is neither painful, neither pleasing, but in certain season, by touching the skin it appears to be painful or pleasant. Such pains and pleasure is explained herein: "They are coming and going. They are not permanent." Āgama apāyinaḥ anityāḥ means "They are coming and going; therefore they are not permanent." Kṛṣṇa therefore advises, tāṁs titikṣasva bhārata: "Just tolerate." But you do not forget your real business, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Don't care for these material pains and pleasure. Of course, we shall try our best if there is pains and pleasure to counteract it, but even it is not done, don't be misled by these so-called pains and pleasure.
We are opening hundreds of centers to give training to the people to practice this and go back to home, back to Godhead. But you cannot go back to home, back to Godhead, so cheaply. You have to practice certain regulative principle; then you will be fit. That is not very difficult, and if you practice, that will be very easy, and the beginning should be chanting the Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra so that you'll be fit for practicing also. So therefore, take full advantage of this movement. Now it is one... We have got center in your city. I request you to take full advantage of this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement and be successful in your life. But rest assured. Do not be misled that (sic:) after finishing this body, every one of us will have to accept another body. If we neglecting the rules and regulation, if we have to accept the body of a dog, just imagine how much displeasing it will be. We have to take to this principle, as Kṛṣṇa says, mad-yājino 'pi yānti mām: (BG 9.25) "Anyone who is engaged in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, he comes to Me." So practice this Kṛṣṇa consciousness and go back to home, back to Godhead. Now any question? No question? Everything all right?
Hanumān (translates into Spanish throughout): (Spanish)
Prabhupāda: Actually spiritual consciousness keeps the body fit. Just like in the body the spirit soul is there and the consciousness is also there, maybe polluted, but as soon as the spirit soul gives up this body, the body immediately begins to decompose. So the decomposition of the body is checked by the spiritual presence. So if you become advanced in spiritual consciousness there is no question of suffering from bodily disease.
Girl devotee: (translates Spanish) (break) ...along with the spirit soul can be realized?
Prabhupāda: Yes, by your present position. You can simply take the information that the dimension of the spirit soul is one ten-thousandth part of the tip of your hair. Very small particle, that is spirit soul. The dimension is given. You have got your hair. You can just imagine only; you cannot measure. And you divide the top of your hair into ten thousand parts, and that one part is the measurement of the spirit soul. That small particle is so powerful. Just imagine what is spiritual power. It is less than the atom. Therefore it is described in the Vedic lit..., aṇor aṇīyān mahato mahīyān: "The spirit is greater than the greatest, and the smaller than the smallest."
Devotee: (Spanish)
Girl devotee: (translating from Spanish) He wants to know exactly what is the form of the body. If spirit soul is nonmaterial, what is the form?
Real renunciation. Real renunciation means you have to give up the andha-kūpa life and take shelter of Kṛṣṇa, harim āśrayeta. If you take shelter of Kṛṣṇa, then you can give up this, all this "ism" life. Otherwise, it is not possible; you'll be entrapped by this "ism" life. So hitvātma-pātaṁ gṛham andha-kūpaṁ vanaṁ gato yad dharim āśrayeta (SB 7.5.5). Not to give up... If you give up something, you must take up something. Otherwise, it will be disturbed. Take up. That is recommendation: paraṁ dṛṣṭvā nivartate (BG 2.59). You can give up your family life, social life, political life, this life, that life when you take Kṛṣṇa conscious life. Otherwise, it is not possible. Otherwise, you must have to take some of this life. There is no question of your freedom. There is no question of freedom from anxieties. This is the way.
So here the same thing, that tattva-darśibhiḥ, those who are actually seer of the Absolute Truth... athāto brahma jijñāsā, as it is said in the Vedānta-sūtra... Just yesterday, one boy was asking me: "What is the Vedānta? Vedānta, what is the meaning of Vedānta?" It is very nice, it is very easy. Veda means knowledge, and anta means ultimate. So Vedānta means ultimate knowledge. So ultimate knowledge is Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa says, vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyo vedānta-kṛd veda-vid ca aham. He is the maker of Vedānta and He is the knower of Vedānta. Unless He is knower of Vedānta, how He can write Vedānta? Actually, Vedānta philosophy is written by Vyāsadeva, incarnation of Kṛṣṇa. So He's vedānta-kṛt. And He's vedānta-vit also. So the question was whether Vedānta means advaita-vāda or dvaita-vāda. So it is very easy to understand. The first aphorism of Vedānta: athāto brahma jijñāsā, to inquire about Brahman, the Absolute Truth.
I don't believe in God? You believe in God? (break) Why I'll not believe? If you can believe, I can believe also. It is not believing; it is fact. We are explaining the fact, how the existence of God is there. There is no question of believe or not believe; the fact is fact. Just like if there is fire, you believe or not believe; the fire is there. That I have already explained. The fire is there, and the heat and light is expanded. If there is smoke, you can understand there is fire. This is knowledge. It is not that you have to see the fire, but because there is smoke, you can understand fully that there is fire. Similarly, the whole cosmic manifestation is working in order. That is explained as heat and light. Therefore there is fire or God. There must be. So it is not the question of believe or not believe. Fact is fact. (break)
Whatever we see... Parasya brahmaṇaḥ śaktis tathedam akhilaṁ jagat. Whatever little we are seeing, that is simply distribution of the energy of the Supreme. Exactly the same way: the sunshine and the sun globe, and the sun-god. Sun-god, from him... Not only sun-god, there are other living entities also. Their body is glowing. They have got fiery body. As we have got earthly body... Earth is prominent in this planet. Similarly, in the sun planet, the fire is prominent. As earth is one of the five elements, fire is also another one of the five elements. These things will be explained that the soul is never burned by the fire.
So there is no question of thinking that in the sun planet there is no living being. There are living beings, suitable for the planet. We learn from Brahma-saṁhitā that koṭiṣu vasudhādi-vibhūti-bhinnam. Vasudhā. Vasudhā means planet. There are innumerable planets in each and every universe. Yasya prabhā prabhavato jagad-aṇḍa-koṭi-koṭiṣv aśeṣa-vasudhādi-vibhūti-bhinnam (Bs. 5.40). This is only one universe. There are millions of universes also. When Caitanya Mahāprabhu was requested by one devotee of Lord Caitanya that "My dear Lord, You have come. Kindly You take away all these conditioned souls. And if You think that they are horribly sinful, they cannot be delivered, then You transfer all the sins upon me. I shall suffer. You better take them away." This is Vaiṣṇava philosophy. Vaiṣṇava philosophy means that para-duḥkha-duḥkhī. Actually, a Vaiṣṇava is unhappy by seeing others unhappy. Personally, he has no unhappiness. Because he's in contact with Kṛṣṇa, how he can be unhappy? Personally, he has no unhappiness.
Or a very nice mechanic. This means that in the last life he was mechanic, he was making some plan, and this life he gets chance, and he fulfills his desire. He discovers something and becomes very reputed, famous man. Because karmīs, they want three things: lābha-pūjā-pratiṣṭhā. They want some material profit and they want some material adoration, and lābha-pūjā-pratiṣṭhā, and stability. This is material life. So one after another, we are trying to have some material profit, some material adoration, material reputation. And therefore we are having different types of body. And it is going on. Actually this acceptance of body does not mean I die. I am there. In subtle form, I am there. Na jāyate na mriyate. Therefore there is no question of birth and death. It is simply transformation of the body. Vāsāṁsi jīrṇāni yathā vihāya (BG 2.22), as it will be explained in the next verse:
Simply you sit down, all family members. Where is the difficulty? Husband, wife, children, friends. Sit down together. There is no need of instrument. Simply clap and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Then you'll see the face of the world is changed. That is recommended... But we have no faith. We do not believe. Although there is no expenditure, there is no loss, still, we shall not do. We shall make plan by raising fund. So after raising fund, what is done, we know everything. So that will not relieve. Take this yajña process. Yajñād bhavati parjanyaḥ (BG 3.14). If you are in scarcity of rain, perform yajña, the saṅkīrtana-yajña. There will be regular rain, and if there is regular rain, there is ample food production. There is no question of overpopulation. God can supply you more than you want, provided you become God conscious, Kṛṣṇa conscious. That is the way.
So we have to accept this... vāsāṁsi jīrṇāni. You don't be misled by the proposition of the so-called blind leaders that you are this body. The leaders are misguiding us by identification with this body. There is fight always. "I am American." "I am Indian." "I am Russian." "I am Pakistani." "I am Hindustani." And there is fight. Advancement of civilization means advancement of fighting. That's all. When there was no Pakistan, there was some sporadic Hindu-Muslim fight. Now there is nation, Pakistan, and nation, Hindustan, and there is organized fight every year.
So unless you are prepared to surrender... That is a great difficult job for the materialistic person. Nobody wants to surrender. He wants to compete. Individually, person to person, family to family, nation to nation, everyone is trying to become the master. Where is the question of surrendering? There is no question of surrendering. So this is the disease. Therefore Kṛṣṇa demands that to cure this rascaldom, or most chronic disease, you surrender. Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). "Then? If I surrender, then whole thing will be failure? My business, my plans, my, so many things...?" No. "I take charge of you. I take charge of you." Ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣayiṣyāmi mā śucaḥ. "Don't be worried." So much assurance is there. Still, we are not prepared to surrender, This is our material disease. Therefore Kṛṣṇa came again as a devotee just to show how to surrender to Kṛṣṇa. Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Kṛṣṇa-varṇaṁ tviṣākṛṣṇaṁ sāṅgopāṅgāstra-pārṣadam (SB 11.5.32).
So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is very scientific and authorized. It is not a bogus thing, something manufactured by concoction of the mind. It is authorized, based on the Vedic instruction, as Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). So we teach only this philosophy, that you... Kṛṣṇa, here is Kṛṣṇa, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. You are searching after God. You cannot understand what is God. Here is God, Kṛṣṇa. His name, His activities, everything is there in the Bhagavad-gītā. You accept and surrender unto Him. And as Kṛṣṇa says, man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65). So we are speaking the same thing.
Devotees: Melrose.
Prabhupāda: Melrose Avenue upstairs. It is very nice. So you organize it and let us see what Kṛṣṇa does. There is no question of disappointment. Yes?
Madhudviṣa: Prabhupāda, what is a Manu, and how is Manu the father of mankind, as it is stated in Bhagavad-gītā?
Prabhupāda: Yes, Manu is the name, and because mankind is born, therefore they are called manuṣya. Manuṣya, "born of Manu." Manu is the name. Just like in some parts of England they are called Angels? In the past history during the Roman occupation of England, they are known as Angels? You don't know?
Woman devotee: Anglos?
Prabhupāda: Angles, yes.
Woman devotee: Anglo-Saxon.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So from Angles, they have become English. Similarly, Manu. Manu is the name of the son of Brahmā, Vaivasvata Manu. Just like Nārada is one of the sons. So there are so many sons. Brahmā was the original living being. So he created so many sons, and they created so many sons. In this way the population of the whole universe has increased. So Manu is one of the sons. There are fourteen Manus in one day of Brahmā. These things I have discussed many times. And the mankind, they come from Manu. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam, vivasvān manave prāha (BG 4.1). Manu, this Manu, there are different Manus, fourteen Manus in one day. This present Manu under whom we are now living within this universe, he's the son of sun-god, Vivasvān. So he has got his different planet, as the sun has got different planet. So his son Ikṣvāku was given this earthly planet to rule over and from that generation, Mahārāja Ikṣvāku, Lord Rāmacandra appeared. In this way the kṣatriyas, they spread all over the world. I have several times said that most of the Europeans, they belong to the original kṣatriyas.
They call veda-pramāṇa. "We cannot accept without it is not mentioned in the Vedas." That's a, that's nice. But there is another class who are described in the Bhagavad-gītā by Kṛṣṇa Himself: veda-vāda-ratāḥ. They are simply unnecessarily fight on the basis of so-called Vedic knowledge. Vedic knowledge must be understood from the guru. That is injunction. They defy that. They... The Vedic injunction is... Kaṭhopaniśad. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum eva abhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). You... To understand the Vedas, you must approach a guru. Otherwise, you cannot understand. Just like it is forbidden that without becoming a brāhmaṇa, nobody should read Vedas. Because he cannot understand. Unless one is qualified brāhmaṇa, unless one has approached another qualified brāhmaṇa who knows, there is no question of understanding Vedas. Just like Max Muller translated Veda. What does he know about Veda? Such kinds of translation, understanding, is useless. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum eva abhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). Abhigacchet means "He must!" There is not that "I may go or I may not." No, you must. If you really serious. In our vaiṣṇava-paramparā also... vaiṣṇava-paramparā is actually Vedic paramparā. That ādau gurvāśrayam... Ādau gurvāśrayam: "To enter into the spiritual life, first thing is first of all to accept a guru." That is... All big, big stalwarts... Even Vyāsadeva. Vyāsadeva, the wonderful literature. This reading. We are reading Bhagavad-gītā. It is Vyāsadeva's literature. He heard from Kṛṣṇa and wrote it. And not only this. The Mahābhārata, the Purāṇas, the Vedānta-sūtra, and the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Wonderful literatures. There is no possibility of producing such literature by any scholar of these days. It is not possible. But he accepted guru, Nārada, Nārada Muni. When, after compiling all the Vedas, and Purāṇas, even Vedānta-sūtra, Vyāsadeva was not satisfied himself, he was seeming very morose, at that time, his spiritual master, Nārada, came, and he asked that "Why you are morose?
My influence, what is My power."
So this Personality of Godhead... It is a fact. Brahmeti paramātmeti bhagavān iti śabdyate (SB 1.2.11). The last word is Bhagavān. From Bhagavān, the expansion is Paramātmā, localized aspect. Īśvaraḥ sarva-bhūtānāṁ hṛd-deśe arjuna tiṣṭhati (BG 18.61). That is expansion. Ekāṁśena sthito jagat (BG 10.42). That is one of the plenary portions. Viṣṭabhya aham. He enters within this universe, and therefore the universe becomes manifest. Just like I am soul, dehino 'smin yathā dehe (BG 2.13), I enter into this body. You enter into your body. Therefore the body expands. Similarly, the Supreme Personality of Godhead enters as Garbhodakaśāyī Viṣṇu within each and every universe. Then it becomes manifest. So there is no question of impersonal. The original source is person. Kṛṣṇa says,
- ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavo
- mattaḥ sarvaṁ pravartate
- iti matvā bhajante māṁ
- budhā bhāva-samanvitāḥ
- (BG 10.8)
Budha, not the abudha. Abudha means less intelligent. Those who are intelligent, budhā bhāva-samanvitāḥ, with a bhāva, with an ecstatic position, can understand that Kṛṣṇa is the original person. Ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavaḥ (BG 10.8). Sarvasya means including Brahmā, Viṣṇu, Maheśvara, all the devatās. Aham ādir hi devānām (BG 10.2). He is the original source of all the devas. The original devas within this... Brahmā is the first deva in the first creation. (aside:) What is that? So aham ādir hi devānām. The Brahmā, Viṣṇu, Maheśvara. So He's the origin of Brahmā, Viṣṇu, Maheśvara.
Tāmasa, they, those who are in the tāmasika-guṇa, they go adhaḥ. Madhye tiṣṭhanti rājasāḥ. And via media, those who are in touch with the rajo-guṇa. And ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti sattva-sthāḥ: (BG 14.18) those who are in the goodness, they go up, in the upper platform of the society or in the universe. But Kṛṣṇa says, ābrahma-bhuvanāl lokāḥ punar āvartino 'rjuna (BG 8.16). Either you go even to the Brahmaloka, one day you have come to the hellish loka. This is the way. So some, cakravat parivartante sukhāni ca duḥkhāni ca. Just like the wheel turns round, sometimes up, sometimes down, so this is the position of this material world. There is no question of lamenting. You cannot say, "These people are suffering and that people are enjoying." The man who is enjoying, he'll also suffer next moment. This is going on, suffering and enjoying. Unless we come to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, there is no way of coming out of this duality of this world. This is duality. Everything you'll find in dual. Unless there is happiness, you cannot understand what is distress. And unless there is distress, you cannot understand happiness. You cannot understand light unless there is darkness. So this is the world of darkness and light, so-called light. You have to transcend. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9). So we have to make arrangement. That facility is there to every human being, how he can get out of this world of duality and come to the transcendental platform which is called avyabhicāriṇī-bhakti-yoga.
So here fighting is a matter of duty. That is the kṣatriya spirit. Fighting is not killing. Because people have no idea what is the soul, therefore they think that stopping war will help us in peaceful condition of the society. There are so many troubles so long this body is there. War is one of the items. Even war is stopped, there is no question that people will live forever. No. That is not the law of nature. Duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam (BG 8.15). This life, the problem is how to stop our contact with this material body That is the problem. Not that these general people, they are thinking, "If war, there is no war, then we shall be very happy." How you'll stop your war with māyā? Māyā has declared war with you, or you have declared war with māyā. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). The māyā, the material nature is enforcing, "Why you are closing this door?" "Oh, because it is very cold outside." Who is forcing? Immediately there will be cold, immediately there will be fog, immediately there will be excessive heat, immediately there may be earthquake. How you can stop it? So they simply think... Just like innocent child, they are concerned with the immediate problem. But sane man is concerned with the ultimate problem. So our ultimate problem is not this war. The ultimate problem is repetition of birth and death. That is ultimate problem, how to stop this. That is the problem. So Kṛṣṇa says that "This is useless lamentation, that you do not wish to fight. It is the concluded fact that even your grandfather or relatives die, they will continue as soul. You have to execute your duty. You cannot deviate from your duty." Go on.
Prabhupāda: This is duty. One has to execute duty without any consideration of loss and gain. That is duty, observing duty. Just see. "You are kṣatriya. There is necessity of this fighting. So you should not consider whether you are gaining or losing. It is your duty to fight." Go on.
Devotee: "And by so doing you shall never incur sin."
Prabhupāda: Yes. If you execute your duty nicely, there is no question of sin. To execute duty is piety. Yes.
Devotee: Purport: "Lord Kṛṣṇa now directly says that Arjuna should fight for the sake of fighting because Kṛṣṇa desires the battle. There is no consideration of happiness or distress, profit or gain."
Prabhupāda: This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Kṛṣṇa says... Actually this happened... This is the Kṛṣṇa consciousness. One should not think of personal loss or gain. "Kṛṣṇa desires it, so I have to do it," that's all. There is no personal consideration. That is real Kṛṣṇa consciousness. "Kṛṣṇa, You are asking me to do this. I do not like to do this. You give me some other work." That is not Kṛṣṇa consciousness. There is no, I mean to say, yes or no. As Kṛṣṇa says. What Kṛṣṇa says? Kṛṣṇa says the essence of Bhagavad-gītā that "A person who preaches this sublime message of Bhagavad-gītā, he is My dearmost friend in the human society." This is the open order of Kṛṣṇa.
This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Kṛṣṇa says... Actually this happened... This is the Kṛṣṇa consciousness. One should not think of personal loss or gain. "Kṛṣṇa desires it, so I have to do it," that's all. There is no personal consideration. That is real Kṛṣṇa consciousness. "Kṛṣṇa, You are asking me to do this. I do not like to do this. You give me some other work." That is not Kṛṣṇa consciousness. There is no, I mean to say, yes or no. As Kṛṣṇa says. What Kṛṣṇa says? Kṛṣṇa says the essence of Bhagavad-gītā that "A person who preaches this sublime message of Bhagavad-gītā, he is My dearmost friend in the human society." This is the open order of Kṛṣṇa. Lord Caitanya says,
- āmāra ājñāya guru hañā tāra' ei deśa
- yāre dekha tāre kaha 'kṛṣṇa'-upadeśa
- (CC Madhya 7.128)
"Take My order and you become a spiritual master." How? "Simply speak Kṛṣṇa consciousness, that's all. Simply speak on Kṛṣṇa's message, kṛṣṇa-kathā." There are two kinds of kṛṣṇa-kathās. One is the Bhagavad-gītā, and the other is Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. So this is the propagation of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. We have to abide by the superior orders without consideration of our personal gain or loss. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. There is no question of personal gain or loss. Go on reading.
Arjuna was reputed as a great warrior. So he should remain a great warrior. A warrior's business is not to stop fighting on the plea of becoming kind. If you have gone to the warfield and if you practice nonviolence there, this is useless. Why should you go? There is a Bengali proverb that naste bose guṇṭhanam(?), that... In India, the girls, they cover their head. That is the system of married girl's shyness. So it is said that one girl is on the stage for dancing. Now while she is to dance, she's covering the head. What is the use of covering the head? You have come to dance, you dance. Similarly, in the warfield, you have gone there to fight. Where is the question of becoming nonviolent? So things should be done according to the time and atmosphere. In the warfield, there is no question of nonviolence. The war is arranged for committing violence. Where is the question of preaching there nonviolence?
No, first of all try to understand this, that piercing the knife in the body is not always bad. Similarly, war or fighting is not always bad, provided it is done for right cause. That should be understood. So when the director is Kṛṣṇa, the Supreme Personality of Godhead Himself, is directing, so there is no cause of stopping it. He has His plan, He knows. We cannot judge. So He's the Supreme. So that war is necessary because it is desired by the Supreme Lord. To maintain the laws of the world, as to maintain the laws and order of a state, there is violence department, the police department, the military department. Why? The government can stop it. "Oh, this is unnecessary expenditure." No. That is necessity for maintenance of the state. Similarly, war is sometimes necessary for maintenance of the order of the world. But people have misused. That is a different thing. But here, in this battlefield of Kurukṣetra, there is no question of misuse. Because it is under the direction of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, there is no such question of misusing. War is necessary, but that does not mean it should be misused. There are so many instances. Just like sex life is necessary for generating for progeny. But that is being misused for sense gratification. That is another thing. In Bhagavad-gītā it is said that "sex life in religious principle." Religious principle means, according to Vedic injunction, putra te kriyate bhāryā, putra piṇḍa prayojanam. There is necessity of a bona fide son in the family, and to beget a bona fide son, there is necessity of accepting wife. So acceptance of such wife and sex life in that connection is not abominable. But to keep some friend and enjoy sex life for sense gratification, that is abominable. But the function is the same. Somebody may say, "Oh, this is also sex life, that is also sex life." But there is much difference. Similarly, apparently, a thing may appear to be the same, but it has got great significance. That is to be judged by higher authorities. That higher authority, supreme authority, is there, Kṛṣṇa Himself.
So similarly on the strength of Bhagavad-gītā, if one wants to prove his foolish philosophy, that is a great offense. That's a great offense. Therefore Bhagavad-gītā cannot be interpreted by foolish commentators. It must be studied through the paramparā system, ācārya upāsanam. One must worship the ācārya and learn from him what is Bhagavad-gītā. Ācāryavān puruṣo veda. This is the Vedic injunction. Who knows things as they are. Ācāryaṁ māṁ puruṣa, one who is under the guidance of ācārya. So you won't find this foolish nonviolence theory from any ācārya. Many ācāryas have commented on Bhagavad-gītā. There is Rāmānujācārya, Madhvācārya, even Śaṅkarācārya. But never said that Bhagavad-gītā is proof of nonviolence. Nonviolence is good but when there is dharma-yuddha, righteous fighting, there is no question of nonviolence. Violence is approved.
Therefore Kṛṣṇa says that tataḥ sva-dharmaṁ kīrtiṁ ca: "You will, by neglecting your sva-dharma, your professional or occupational duty, and minimizing the importance of your recognition, kīrti..." Kīrtir yasya sa jīvati: "Anyone who is reputed for his good activities, he lives forever." Kīrtir yasya sa jīvati. Bhaja sādhu-samāgamam. Tyaja durjana-saṁsargaṁ bhaja sādhu-samāgamam. Cāṇakya Paṇḍita also says kīrtiḥ sa... Who lives forever? One who has got reputation for his, one who is famous for his good activities. "So don't try to lose your reputation. You are a great fighter, recognized by so many authorities, and if you don't fight, then people will say, 'Now Arjuna is finished. He cannot anymore fight.' So don't lose this reputation. Don't be deviated from your occupational duty as a kṣatriya. If you do all these things, then pāpam avāpsyasi. You don't think that it will be pious. You will, on the other hand you will become impious." Pāpam avāpsyasi. Next verse.
That is the point. Because your, this material condition is bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19), subjected to birth, death, old age, disease, and so many other material conditions. You have fallen in this condition because you have forgotten Kṛṣṇa. Just like last night so many people came to discuss with us, but they are not interested in talking of Kṛṣṇa. They are interested how their sense gratification will be disturbed by starting this temple. That is their concern. Here we have come to preach about Kṛṣṇa. They did not ask anything about Kṛṣṇa, "What is this philosophy? What is this Kṛṣṇa's philosophy?" No. They are simply interested in their own sense gratification. That's all. How their sense gratification will be disturbed—they are concerned in that way. This is the position of the material world. Everyone is simply interested in sense gratification. That's all. There is no question of asking "What is God? What I am? What is this world?" Actually, these should be the questions of human life. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. They should be engaged always in inquiring about the Supreme Being, the Absolute Truth. That is their only business. But you see the whole world. They are simply busy how to satisfy their senses. This is the cause of fall down.
Samādhi. The yoga process is to achieve the stage of samādhi. That means the mind being fixed upon the Supreme. But if our mind is... Nature of mind is always agitated, and if we artificially give impetus to the mind to be more agitated, then where is the question of samādhi? There is no question of samādhi. They'll never be able to concentrate the mind. That is not possible. So in this age no process will be successful. Simply this process, this chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. Anyone, it doesn't matter, in whatever condition he is, as soon as he'll hear Hare Kṛṣṇa, he'll immediately join. His mind will be attracted immediately. Simplest process. Vibration. There is no question of time to practice some breathing exercise, some sitting posture, because these things are not possible in this age. Simply we invite you to come here and simply join this chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, and very quickly you'll be spiritually advanced. This is a fact. Otherwise there is no second alternative. Go on.
God. God has expanded in many, and out of the many, we are. Out of the many, we are also. We are, you are, I am, you are, every one of us—we are all expansions of the Supreme Lord. Eko bahu syāt. The God willed that "I shall become many. I shall become many." Now, why He becomes many? God is one without second, but He, out of His own sweet will, He becomes many. Now, why He becomes many? He becomes many to enjoy, because without becoming many, nobody can enjoy. Just, for example, I am speaking here. Now, you are five gentleman and ladies present here. So we are enjoying these topics. But if there would have been five hundred here, people assembled, the enjoyment would have been more. And if there would have been no persons sitting here, simply myself speaking, there would have been no enjoyment. So enjoyment means variety. Without variety, without many things, there is no question of enjoyment. That is the original idea of enjoyment. So God became many. God became many for His enjoyment because He is the enjoyer. We are not enjoyer; we are enjoyed. So we must know our constitutional position, that we are not enjoyer; we are enjoyed. As soon as we are convinced to this particular...
So the intelligent class, they have got separate department of duty. The administrative class, they have also got separate department of duty. Similarly, the mercantile class, they have got separate activity. And the laborer class, they have only one activity, to serve others. That's all. Because they cannot do anything independently, therefore they have to offer the service to the higher class, to the administrative class or to the mercantile class or the intelligent class and take some payment for his livelihood. So these divisions, these divisions... So the Lord says, Lord Kṛṣṇa says, that "According to your quality, you have to do your duty." You just... Just you can... Hereditary or by your own choice, you can have your own duty. But there is no question of that one should be idle. No. If you are intelligent class, then you have to take to intelligent quality of work, just like you must become a scientist, you must become politician, not politician, philosopher. You must be a religionist or so many intelligent class of work. So you must engage in that way if you are actually intelligent, if you belong to the intelligent class. Now, if you are administrative class, then you must take to the politics or election, be elected the mayor, be elected the president or something like that, and work in that way. And if you belong to the mercantile community, then you must do business and produce agricultural grains and distribute them. That is your business. In the Bhagavad-gītā you will find that the mercantile class... Who are mercantile class? Kṛṣi-go-rakṣya-vāṇijyaṁ vaiśya-karma svabhāva-jam (BG 18.44). Vaiśya means the mercantile community. They are meant for giving protection to the animals, and produce grain, and distribute and make trade on them. That's all.
So the whole arrangement is like that. Now, if we work even in that arrangement, yoga-sthaḥ, being situated in my spiritual plane, then that will reach to the spiritual sky by enlargement of the circle, enlargement of the circle. I can do work here. You will find in the Bhagavad-gītā that the Lord says that patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati: (BG 9.26) "Anyone who offers in devotion patraṁ puṣpam, a little flower, a little, small leaf, a little water, I accept them. Because it is offered to Me in devotion, therefore I accept them. I take them in My hand." But people may ask question that "Where is the hand? Where is the hand of God?" He says that "I take." "I take" means "I take it in my hand." Without hand there is no question of taking. Therefore Vedic hymn says that apāṇi-pādo javano grahītā: "The Lord has no legs, no hands, but still, He can walk more than the speed of the air, more than the speed of the mind, and He can accept whatever we offer. But He has no hand; He has no leg." So this means that He has no hand, He has no leg, like our limited measured hand or leg. He can stretch His hand anywhere. And similarly, He can stretch, He can hear, from anywhere. That is the prerogative of the Supreme Lord.
And within jñāna-yoga there are many other yogas—dhyāna-yoga, haṭha-yoga, so many things. Now, here it is said that yoga-sthaḥ kuru karmāṇi: "You be situated in your yoga or in meditation." Generally yoga is understood as meditation. But yoga, real meaning of yoga—to keep in touch with the Supreme—that is called yoga, to keep in touch. So you have to work for, er, from the platform of spiritual consciousness. At the same time you have to work. The Lord never says that "You stop work," never says. Arjuna... Arjuna's friend was Lord Kṛṣṇa, but Kṛṣṇa never said... He is God Himself. He is the Supreme Personality of God Himself. He never said Arjuna that "I am your friend. I shall supply all your necessities. You don't require to work. You stop." No, He never said that. Rather, Arjuna was declining to fight, but Kṛṣṇa is inducing him to fight. So in spiritual platform there is no question of stopping work, no question of stopping work. But work for the Supreme. That's all, īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvam (ISO 1), with God consciousness.
Now, there are three processes of yoga: jñāna-yoga, and karma-yoga, and bhakti-yoga. Now, jñāna-yoga, take for example jñāna-yoga. Jñāna-yoga means to keep in touch with the Supreme by speculation of higher knowledge, that discriminating what is spirit and what is matter. So there are philosophers, they are discriminating that "This is matter..." Neti neti: "This is matter, and this is spirit."
Even by hearing instruction from learned, I mean to say, transcendentalists or by self-study. Parataḥ. Parataḥ means taking lessons or taking instruction from others. And svataḥ means by self-culture. Matir na kṛṣṇe parataḥ svato vā mitho vā. Mitho vā: "by assembly." By assembly. Na: "It will never be." Matir na kṛṣṇe parataḥ svato vā mitho 'bhipadyeta gṛha-vratānām. Gṛha-vratānām means... Gṛha means "house," and vrata means "vow." One who has made his vow that "This worldly live, eat, drink, be merry and enjoy, this is all in all," for them, there is no question of spiritual life. We have to decide it that spiritual life and material life, they are different angles of vision. If we give more stress to the material life, material way of life, then it is not possible to have any spiritual realization or spiritual emancipation. Those things... Because the whole idea is, as we are discussing for several weeks, that I am spirit, pure consciousness. I have been put to this material contact somehow or other. Without tracing the history and how I have put into it... (break) But the fact is that I am put into these material circumstances, and therefore, due to my material condition of life, I am undergoing miseries, so many miseries. So the whole idea is that I have to get out of this material contact and reinstate myself in the pure spiritual life so that I shall not, I shall be free from all miseries. Because spirit soul, as it is, in its pure form, it is sac-cid-ānanda. It is eternal, it is blissful, and it is full of knowledge.
Otherwise there is no secluded place. Māyā is everywhere. Māyā will dictate, "Oh, you are so tired. Why don't you come out and smoke a cigarette?" Yes. And he thinks he's advancing, the nonsense is advancing. No. Phalena paricīyate. By the result one has to be judged how far he has advanced. Similarly, there are so many persons, they are meditating. What meditating, nonsense? What is their character? If you challenge their character, nonsense. So these sort of things will not help. Come practically forward.
Just like our students, going door to door, chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. And people are taking advantage of it, they are hearing. So this process is beneficial to the public. Even a small child who joins here, he also claps, tries to clap. So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is not to remain in a secluded place to get cheap advertisement, "Oh, that man is meditating." No. Go, practically work.
Just like Lord Jesus Christ, he practically worked. So there is practical work. No question of going into a secluded place. We should remain in the congested city and preach this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement without being affected by this contamination of city life. That is perfection. They shall not be contaminated, touched by the contamination of the city life, but still, they will go on with Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is perfection. Yes. Go on.
Why? Yata, because, ātmanaḥ, the spirit soul, ātmano 'yam... Asann api kleśada āsa dehaḥ (SB 5.5.4). This body is temporary, but so long this body is there, you'll have to suffer. What is that suffering? The sum total of suffering is birth, death, old age and disease. This is due to this body. Therefore the problem is how to stop this material body, repetition. Today I have got this body, Indian, tomorrow I may get American, next birth... Tomorrow means next birth. Next birth another, next birth another, next birth another—it is going on. Going on. There is no stoppage, this transmigration of the soul.
But so long you do not stop it, there is no question of being freed from sufferings. They do not know it. They are thinking they are advancing. What advancement you have made? These sufferings are there—birth, death, old age and disease. You cannot stop it. Ābrahma-bhuvanāl lokāḥ, and even you go to this moon planet or to the highest planet, these four things will follow. So therefore sense gratification must be stopped. But if you want to stop it artificially it is impossible. Neither by this yoga process, neither by this jñāna process. Simply for the time being you can check.
Just like a naughty boy. By force, you can stop him acting mischievously. But as soon as he gets opportunity, again he will act so. Similarly, senses are very strong. You cannot stop them artificially. Therefore the only remedy is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. These boys in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, this is also sense gratification, eating nice prasāda, dancing, chanting, reading philosophy—but it is in connection with Kṛṣṇa. That is the significance. Nirbandhaḥ kṛṣṇa-sambandhe. It is the sense gratification of Kṛṣṇa. Not directly, but because I am part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa, my senses are automatically satisfied. This process should be adopted. Artificially...
There are recommendation in these Vedas, pañca-yajña. Pañca-yajña means that unknowingly we are killing many living entities. Suppose we are... When we are walking on the street there are many ants who are being killed on the pressure of our shoes. So that is also counted as sin. In God's kingdom, in God's, I mean to say, state. Just like here you have to pay by your life if you kill one man. If you commit a murder, you have to repay this murdering sin by your own life. That is, of course, imperfect law, man-made law. Similarly, in God's law also, if you kill any living entity, you have to suffer for that, because in the God's eye there is no question of man or animal or ant or fly or something like that. Every living entity is the son of God. Now, suppose your father has got five sons. One of them is worthless, is doing nothing. And if the other son says, "My dear father, this son, your youngest son, or this son, is worthless. He is doing nothing. Let us kill him," will your father agree? Because he is worthless, will your father agree? No, he will say, "No, no, no. You have nothing to do. He is not harming you. He is eating my, my subsistence. I am paying for his subsistence. Why you should kill him?" So similarly, in this material nature, all these living entities in different forms, they have come for material enjoyment and everything is being supplied by the Supreme Lord. We have no right to kill them. We have no right. According to God's law, if one is conscious... The same thing: Just like the father will never agree to kill a worthless child by the competent boy... No.
Prabhupāda: Why you are anxious about the animals being starvation? You take care of yourself. You don't be philanthropic, "Oh, they'll starve. Let me eat." What is this philanthropy? Kṛṣṇa is supplying food. If he dies out of starvation, it is Kṛṣṇa's responsibility. Nobody dies of starvation. That is a false theory. Have you seen any animal dying of starvation? Have you got any experience? Have you seen any bird died of starvation? There is no question of starvation in the kingdom of God. We are manufacturing these theories for our own satisfaction, sense satisfaction. There is no question of starvation in the law of God. Elephant eats hundred pounds at a time. Who is supplying foodstuff? There are millions of elephants in the African jungle, in Indian jungles. They require one hundred pounds at a time to eat. Who is supplying food? So there is no question of starvation in the kingdom of God. Starvation is for the so-called civilized men.
Yes?
Guest: If man wasn't meant to eat meat, why in nature do the other animals kill to eat?
Prabhupāda: Are you other animal?
Guest: Well, we're all animals.
Prabhupāda: You count amongst the animals? You classify yourself with the animals?
Guest: Well, we're all animals.
So yajña is not difficult. Now, if by doing that yajña, if we become free from all reactions, then why should we not do it? Why should we not do it? There is no difficulty. There is no question of difficulty. Rather, it is a thing of pleasure, ānanda. The whole thing is ānanda. Ānanda means pleasure. Enjoyment. Spiritual life does not mean that void of enjoyment, no. It is full of enjoyment. We are seeking after enjoyment, but that enjoyment is hampered by our material existence. We do not know. We are trying to squeezing out the senses and trying to have material pleasure. This is nonsense because we do not know what is spiritual life. Spiritual life means unlimited, unlimited pleasure.
There is a verse describing about Rāma. Hare Rāma Hare Rāma Rāma Rāma Hare Hare, we chant. Now, what is the meaning of Rāma? That is described.
- ramante yogino 'nante
- satyānande cid-ātmani
- iti rāma-padenāsau
- paraṁ brahmābhidhīyate
- (CC Madhya 9.29)
- Rāma means ramaṇa. Ramaṇa means enjoyment. So yoginaḥ.
Now, mind that, karma-yogī. Those who are yogis, those who are trying to get spiritual life, regain their spiritual vitality, they are called yogis. There are different kinds of yogis: karma-yogī, jñāna-yogī, dhyāna-yogī, rāja-yogī. The highest of all of them is the bhakti-yogī or the bhakta.
They go to the temple after taking bath and purifying. So many things are there, either Hinduism or Mohammedanism or Christianism, according to country and climate and people. Practically, the principles are the same. They may be... Formally, they may appear to be... But the thing is there.
But here, niyamitaḥ smaraṇe na kālaḥ. Here you don't require that you have to take your bath before chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa. No. Oh, because you are in the bathroom, therefore you cannot chant Hare Kṛṣṇa? No. You can chant even there. So such a thing. Because if actually Kṛṣṇa, that very name, is Kṛṣṇa, then how I can remain impure? The potency is there. It makes me at once pure. Just like as soon as there is light, there is no question of darkness. Darkness and light cannot stand together. Either it must be darkness or must be light. So as soon as there is light... So Kṛṣṇa is light. Kṛṣṇa name is light. Therefore there cannot be any impurities. Impurity is due to my, this material body. But I am, at that moment, I am in the spiritual platform. So this impurities cannot touch me.
These are the points of realization. As we make sincerely sincere effort to perform this yajña, particular yajña for this age, then we make our progress. It is most inexpensive and very easy and very powerful. Why don't you adopt it? That is my request to you. Thank you very much. Now, if there is any question you can put. (end)
Now, take a brāhmaṇa who has come from India and compare his character and the character of our student, how he has become more than a brāhmaṇa, the so-called brāhmaṇa. This is practical. The so-called brāhmaṇas, they have come here, they are doing all nonsense, not following any rules and regulation. But still, they are claiming that they are brāhmaṇas. Brāhmaṇa is not meant like that. Kṛṣṇa says cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). "The four castes, they are introduced by Me according to quality and work." There is no question of birth. Kṛṣṇa never said birth. Otherwise He would have said cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ janma-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ. No. He says guṇa-karma. Guṇa means quality, and karma...
Just like if you have achieved the quality of a medical practitioner, then your work shall be a medical practitioner. Similarly if one has achieved the quality of a brāhmaṇa or Vaiṣṇava, then his activities should be like that. If I become Kṛṣṇa conscious and if I work as a butcher, that will not be. You have to work just like a Vaiṣṇava. So guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ. You have to acquire the qualities and work like that. Then it is perfect.
So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is teaching people to work for Kṛṣṇa and to qualify himself for Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is the highest perfection. Without any consideration of His previous position or qualification or social standard. There is no such thing. Simply if he takes to Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra and prosecutes nicely according to direction, he becomes the, I mean to say, in transcendental position. Highest position. More than a brāhmaṇa. Yes. Chant. Jaya. (kīrtana) (end)
It is Kṛṣṇaism. (aside) What is this? Stopped? (break)
Hinduism means a type of faith, or Muslimism is type of faith. But... As it is described in the English dictionary, religion means a kind of faith. But it is not that type of religion. It is a compulsory fact. Just like sugar is, compulsorily must become, sweet. If sugar is not sweet, that is not real sugar. Chili is not hot; that is not real chili. Similarly, we are part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa. Our duty is to become Kṛṣṇa conscious. There is no question of faith. It is not the question of faith. You may have faith in Hinduism; tomorrow you may have faith in Christianism. Or you may have faith in Christianism, tomorrow in Mohammedan. This kind of faith is not Kṛṣṇa consciousness. It is a compulsory. Just like laws of the state. It is not that it is meant for the Hindus, or for the Muslims, for the Christian. It is meant for everyone.
Similarly, mamaivāṁśo jīva-bhūtaḥ (BG 15.7). We are part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa, so it is compulsory to revive our consciousness that we are part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa. It is not a question of faith. Faith you may accept or do not accept but here it is a question of "must." You must revive your Kṛṣṇa consciousness; otherwise you will suffer.
Indian (1): Any other question, please?
No. Regular life... Just like Arjuna. Arjuna understood Bhagavad-gītā. So before understanding Bhagavad-gītā, he was a soldier. After hearing Bhagavad-gītā, he remained a soldier. He did not give up the battlefield—"Now, Kṛṣṇa, I have understood. I give up everything. I am now going to be sannyāsī." No. That is not required. You have to understand what Kṛṣṇa wants you to do. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That you can do in any position. It doesn't require. Karma-phala-tyāga. That is advised by Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya (BG 18.66). We have manufactured different types of religious system. And they can be grouped. Some of them are within the group of tyāga, and some of them are within the group of bhoga. Bhoga and tyāga. The karmīs, they are after bhoga, and jñānīs, they are after tyāga. Kṛṣṇa says that "You have to give up both of them, this bhoga and tyāga, both of them. You have simply to surrender unto Me." There is no question of bhoga and tyāga.
Yes. Regulating, how can you regulate the senses? Not by artificial means. The yoga practice, of course, is meant for controlling the senses but nobody can practice in this age perfectly yoga, neither one can control the senses. But this is practically. Just like our sense, tongue. We want to taste very palatable dishes. Now you supply palatable Kṛṣṇa prasādam. You forget going to hotel immediately. This sort of process is in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. We don't simply prohibit that "You don't do this," but we supply something which is engaged by the senses and the mind, the intelligence, so that you do not require to be engaged otherwise.
Positive and negative. Simply negative is no good unless there is positive engagement. So there is no question of negative. Negative is already there. If you taking nice foodstuff, automatically you give up obnoxious and nonsense foodstuff. But if I say, "Don't take this foodstuff. This is not good," and if I don't supply you nice foodstuff, naturally you are hungry; you will have to take whatever is there.
Just like sometimes you have seen the dogs? They are eating stool, their own stool. So I was talking this. One of my students told me that in the last war in the concentrated camp, the human being, they also ate their stool out of hunger. You see? There was no food, so they ate their own stool. So when there is no opportunity of good occupation, one must be satisfied with nonsense occupation. So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness is so nice that one who is occupied with this movement, he cannot go any more to so-called lusty and other nonsense occupation. Go on.
So Kṛṣṇa consciousness is very simple and easy. Immediately you come to the spiritual platform, or transcendental platform.
That is explained in the Caitanya-caritāmṛta: lust and love, what is the difference between lust and love. In the material world there is no love. Because everyone is directed by lust. The so-called love... A young boy is trying to love a young girl, or young girl is trying to love a young..., but the background is lust. There is no love. It is simply a show of love. Therefore, after satisfying lust, there is divorce, there is separation. So in the material world there is no possibility of love. It is all lust. Love is only possible when you love God. There is no lust. There is no question of sense gratification. Simply for love: "Kṛṣṇa is my lover. Kṛṣṇa is my master. Kṛṣṇa is my friend."
Just like Arjuna. Arjuna is loving Kṛṣṇa as friend. So he is so great lover that in the beginning he hesitated to fight, "How shall I kill my kinsmen?" But when he understood, "Kṛṣṇa, my friend, desires. Oh, never mind." So there was no lust. Simply love of Kṛṣṇa. So lust and love, that means the same thing is there. Simply one has to change the account. That's all. Lusty people, they are working on account of sense gratification, and lover of Kṛṣṇa is working for Kṛṣṇa's satisfaction. The activity may appear superficially the same.
Just like these boys in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. People may say, "What they are doing? They are also eating, they are also cooking, and offering Kṛṣṇa, and they say it is Kṛṣṇa conscious. What is the difference between this foodstuff with the hotel foodstuff?" In this way they may think. "Oh, they are also typewriting, they are also using dictaphone and this tape recorder and all this material." But they do not know that everything is being used for Kṛṣṇa. Therefore there is far different. There is no lust. So you can utilize everything if it is in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, not for satisfaction of your lust. Then your life is sublime.
| Page Title: | There is no question (Lectures, BG ch 1 - 3) |
| Compiler: | Visnu Murti, RupaManjari |
| Created: | 17 of Nov, 2012 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=90, Con=0, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 90 |