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Rhetorical

Srimad-Bhagavatam

SB Preface and Introduction

Nimāi Paṇḍita at once memorized all Keśava Kāśmīrī's ślokas without an error. He quoted the sixty-fourth śloka and pointed out certain rhetorical and literary irregularities.
SB Introduction:

During this time a great Kashmir scholar named Keśava Kāśmīrī came to Navadvīpa to hold discussions on the śāstras. The Kashmir paṇḍita was a champion scholar, and he had traveled to all places of learning in India. Finally he came to Navadvīpa to contest the learned paṇḍitas there. The paṇḍitas of Navadvīpa decided to match Nimāi Paṇḍita (Lord Caitanya) with the Kashmir paṇḍita, thinking that if Nimāi Paṇḍita were defeated, they would have another chance to debate with the scholar, for Nimāi Paṇḍita was only a boy. And if the Kashmir paṇḍita were defeated, then they would even be more glorified because people would proclaim that a mere boy of Navadvīpa had defeated a champion scholar who was famous throughout India. It so happened that Nimāi Paṇḍita met Keśava Kāśmīrī while strolling on the banks of the Ganges. The Lord requested him to compose a Sanskrit verse in praise of the Ganges, and the paṇḍita within a short time composed a hundred ślokas, reciting the verses like a storm and showing the strength of his vast learning. Nimāi Paṇḍita at once memorized all the ślokas without an error. He quoted the sixty-fourth śloka and pointed out certain rhetorical and literary irregularities. He particularly questioned the paṇḍita's use of the word bhavānī-bhartuḥ. He pointed out that the use of this word was redundant. Bhavānī means the wife of Śiva, and who else can be her bhartā, or husband? He also pointed out several other discrepancies, and the Kashmir paṇḍita was struck with wonder. He was astonished that a mere student of grammar could point out the literary mistakes of an erudite scholar. Although this matter was ended prior to any public meeting, the news spread like wildfire all over Navadvīpa. But finally Keśava Kāśmīrī was ordered in a dream by Sarasvatī, the goddess of learning, to submit to the Lord, and thus the Kashmir paṇḍita became a follower of the Lord.

SB Canto 3

One may speak very nicely from the rhetorical or grammatical point of view, which may be very much appreciated by a materialistic audience, but if one's words are not offered to the service of the Lord, they are useless.
SB 3.15.49, Purport:

The transcendental loving service of the Lord is performed in three ways—with the body, with the mind and with words. Here the sages pray that their words may always be engaged in glorifying the Supreme Lord. One may speak very nicely with ornamental language or one may be expert at controlled grammatical presentation, but if one's words are not engaged in the service of the Lord, they have no flavor and no actual use. The example is given here of tulasī leaves. The tulasī leaf is very useful even from the medicinal or antiseptic point of view. It is considered sacred and is offered to the lotus feet of the Lord. The tulasī leaf has numerous good qualities, but if it were not offered to the lotus feet of the Lord, tulasī could not be of much value or importance. Similarly, one may speak very nicely from the rhetorical or grammatical point of view, which may be very much appreciated by a materialistic audience, but if one's words are not offered to the service of the Lord, they are useless. The holes of the ears are very small and can be filled with any insignificant sound, so how can they receive as great a vibration as the glorification of the Lord? The answer is that the holes of the ears are like the sky.

Sri Caitanya-caritamrta

CC Adi-lila

According to the rules of rhetorical arrangement for efficient composition in literature, a subject should be mentioned before its predicate.
CC Adi 2.9, Purport:

According to the rules of rhetorical arrangement for efficient composition in literature, a subject should be mentioned before its predicate. The Vedic literature frequently mentions Brahman, Paramātmā and Bhagavān, and therefore these three terms are widely known as the subjects of transcendental understanding. But it is not widely known that what is approached as the impersonal Brahman is the effulgence of Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu's transcendental body. Nor is it widely known that the Supersoul, or Paramātmā, is only a partial representation of Lord Caitanya, who is identical with Bhagavān Himself. Therefore the descriptions of Brahman as the effulgence of Lord Caitanya, the Paramātmā as His partial representation, and the Supreme Personality of Godhead Kṛṣṇa as identical with Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu must be verified by evidence from authoritative Vedic literatures.

The author wants to establish first that the essence of the Vedas is the viṣṇu-tattva, the Absolute Truth, Viṣṇu, the all-pervading Godhead. The viṣṇu-tattva has different categories, of which the highest is Lord Kṛṣṇa, the ultimate viṣṇu-tattva, as confirmed in the Bhagavad-gītā and throughout the Vedic literature.

This rhetorical rule appears in the Ekādaśī-tattva. "One should not state a predicate before its subject, for it cannot thus stand without proper support."
CC Adi 2.74, Translation and Purport:

"One should not state a predicate before its subject, for it cannot thus stand without proper support."

This rhetorical rule appears in the Ekādaśī-tattva, Thirteenth Canto, in connection with the metaphorical use of words. An unknown object should not be put before the known subject because the object has no meaning if the subject is not first given.

The Sanskrit statements of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam are all transcendental sounds. Śrīla Vyāsadeva revealed these statements after perfect realization, and therefore they are perfect, for liberated sages like Vyāsadeva never commit errors in their rhetorical arrangements. Unless one accepts this fact, there is no use in trying to obtain help from the revealed scriptures.
CC Adi 2.86, Translation and Purport:

"Mistakes, illusions, cheating and defective perception do not occur in the sayings of the authoritative sages.

Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam has listed the avatāras, the plenary expansions of the puruṣa, and Lord Kṛṣṇa appears among them. But the Bhāgavatam further explains Lord Kṛṣṇa's specific position as the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Since Lord Kṛṣṇa is the original Personality of Godhead, reason and argument establish that His position is always supreme.

Had Kṛṣṇa been a plenary expansion of Nārāyaṇa, the original verse would have been differently composed; indeed, its order would have been reversed. But there cannot be mistakes, illusion, cheating or imperfect perception in the words of liberated sages. Therefore there is no mistake in this statement that Lord Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality of Godhead. The Sanskrit statements of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam are all transcendental sounds. Śrīla Vyāsadeva revealed these statements after perfect realization, and therefore they are perfect, for liberated sages like Vyāsadeva never commit errors in their rhetorical arrangements. Unless one accepts this fact, there is no use in trying to obtain help from the revealed scriptures.

Bhrama refers to false knowledge or mistakes, such as accepting a rope as a snake or an oyster shell as gold. Pramāda refers to inattention or misunderstanding of reality, and vipralipsā is the cheating propensity. Karaṇāpāṭava refers to imperfectness of the material senses. There are many examples of such imperfection. The eyes cannot see that which is very distant or very small. One cannot even see his own eyelid, which is the closest thing to his eye, and if one is disturbed by a disease like jaundice, he sees everything to be yellow. Similarly, the ears cannot hear distant sounds. Since the Personality of Godhead and His plenary portions and self-realized devotees are all transcendentally situated, they cannot be misled by such deficiencies.

Other Books by Srila Prabhupada

Teachings of Lord Caitanya

After the tenth year of his age, Caitanya became a passable scholar in grammar, rhetoric, the smṛti and the nyāya.
Teachings of Lord Caitanya, Chapter Prologue:

In his eighth year, he was admitted into the tola of Gaṅgādāsa Paṇḍita in Gaṅgānagara close by the village of Māyāpur. In two years he became well read in Sanskrit grammar and rhetoric. His readings after that were of the nature of self-study in his own house, where he had found all-important books belonging to his father, who was a paṇḍita himself. It appears that he read the smṛti in his own study, and the nyāya also, in competition with his friends, who were then studying under the celebrated Paṇḍita Raghunātha Śiromaṇi.

Now, after the tenth year of his age, Caitanya became a passable scholar in grammar, rhetoric, the smṛti and the nyāya. It was after this that his elder brother Viśvarūpa left his house and accepted the āśrama (status) of a sannyāsī (ascetic). Caitanya, though a very young boy, consoled his parents, saying that he would serve them with a view to please God. Just after that, his father left this world. His mother was exceedingly sorry, and Mahāprabhu, with his usual contented appearance, consoled his widowed mother.

Upon his return to Nadia, Nimāi Paṇḍita turned religious preacher, and his religious nature became so strongly represented that Advaita Prabhu, Śrīvāsa and others who had before the birth of Caitanya already accepted the Vaiṣṇava faith were astonished at the change of the young man. He was then no more a contending naiyāyika, a wrangling smārta and a criticising rhetorican. He swooned at the name of Kṛṣṇa and behaved as an inspired man under the influence of his religious sentiment.
Teachings of Lord Caitanya, Chapter Prologue:

It was at the age of 16 or 17 that he traveled to Gayā with a host of his students and there took his spiritual initiation from Īśvara Purī, a Vaiṣṇava sannyāsī and a disciple of the renowned Madhavendra Purī. Upon his return to Nadia, Nimāi Paṇḍita turned religious preacher, and his religious nature became so strongly represented that Advaita Prabhu, Śrīvāsa and others who had before the birth of Caitanya already accepted the Vaiṣṇava faith were astonished at the change of the young man. He was then no more a contending naiyāyika, a wrangling smārta and a criticising rhetorican. He swooned at the name of Kṛṣṇa and behaved as an inspired man under the influence of his religious sentiment. It has been described by Murāri Gupta, an eyewitness, that he shewed his heavenly powers in the house of Śrīvāsa Paṇḍita in the presence of hundreds of his followers, who were mostly well-read scholars. It was at this time that he opened a nocturnal school of kīrtana in the compound of Śrīvāsa Paṇḍita with his sincere followers. There he preached, there he sang, there he danced, and there he expressed all sorts of religious feelings.

Nectar of Devotion

The the goddess of learning is appareled in six kinds of expert knowledge—namely Vedic evidence, grammar, astrology, rhetoric, vocabulary and logic.
Nectar of Devotion 21:

The Siddhas, the inhabitants of Siddhaloka (where all are born with fully developed mystic powers), and the Cāraṇas, the inhabitants of a similar planet, pray to Kṛṣṇa as follows: "My Lord Govinda, the goddess of learning is decorated with fourteen kinds of educational ornaments, her intelligence is all-pervading within the four departments of the Vedas, her attention is always on the lawbooks given by great sages like Manu, and she is appareled in six kinds of expert knowledge—namely Vedic evidence, grammar, astrology, rhetoric, vocabulary and logic. Her constant friends are the supplements of the Vedas, the Purāṇas, and she is decorated with the final conclusion of all education. And now she has acquired an opportunity to sit with You as a class friend in school, and she is now engaged in Your service."

Lectures

Srimad-Bhagavatam Lectures

The other day we discussed about literature which is very nicely composed from literary point of view, or poetic, or rhetoric. Maybe very nicely... But if there is no description of the Absolute Truth or the Supreme Personality of Godhead, that sort of literature is enjoyed by a class of men who are compared with the crows.
Lecture on SB 1.5.11 -- New Vrindaban, June 10, 1969:

The other day we discussed about literature which is very nicely composed from literary point of view, or poetic, or rhetoric. Maybe very nicely... But if there is no description of the Absolute Truth or the Supreme Personality of Godhead, that sort of literature is enjoyed by a class of men who are compared with the crows. That we have discussed. It is simply wasting time, valuable time in the human life, to divert our attention to such ordinary literature. They are called grāmya-kathā. In Sanskrit language it is called grāmya-kathā. Grāmya-kathā means any book, any poetry, or any novel, or any drama... There is some hero and heroine, a man or woman, about their loving affairs, tragedy, comic, like that. Actually, it is grāmya-kathā. The same thing as we are experiencing daily, āhāra-nidrā-bhaya-maithunam, this eating, sleeping, mating, that's all. What is the value of such literature? What do you gain by that? No. Simply mental agitation. And if it is sex literature, then it is very appealing. So that means it is something like haviṣya kṛta(?)... Just like if you offer fuel on the fire, the fire will go on and it will, I mean to say, consume as much as you go on giving fuel. But there is no śānti. The fire will never be extinguished. Actually, what we want? What is the mission of our life? What is the aim of our life? We are hankering after śānti, or peace. So that sort of literature will not give us any peace. It will simply agitate the mind.

Pada means composition. In every language there are rules and regulations for composing poetry or prose, grammatical, rhetorical. So even such knowledge, even without such knowledge, pada-cāturyaṁ bhagavad-yaśaḥ-pradhānam. Just like we chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. So we are not training our students any way about musical science, that "We have to chant in this way or that way, we have to dance in this way or that way.".
Lecture on SB 1.5.11 -- New Vrindaban, June 10, 1969:

We are hankering after śānti, or peace. So that sort of literature will not give us any peace. It will simply agitate the mind.

Therefore those who are paramahaṁsas, those who have understood the essence of this cosmic manifestation, they are not interested in such literature. On the other hand it is said that tad-vāg-visargo janatāgha-viplavaḥ. (commentary) Vināpi pada-cāturyaṁ bhagavad-yaśaḥ-pradhānaṁ vacaḥ.(?) Śrīdhara Svāmī gives note that there may not be any poetic, metaphorical, or analogical, ornamental language, but vināpi pada-cāturyam. Pada-cāturyam. Pada means composition. In every language there are rules and regulations for composing poetry or prose, grammatical, rhetorical. So even such knowledge, even without such knowledge, pada-cāturyaṁ bhagavad-yaśaḥ-pradhānam. Just like we chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. So we are not training our students any way about musical science, that "We have to chant in this way or that way, we have to dance in this way or that way." Without any musical knowledge, without any poetic understanding, even a child can take part in it, and he becomes immediately absorbed in ecstasy. Why? This is because we are chanting the glories of the Lord.

So it does not require any artificial musical knowledge or dancing knowledge. Out of your own ecstasy, you will dance, you'll chant. You don't require to study. Just like our playing of mṛdaṅga. Nobody has gone to an expert mṛdaṅga player to learn it. Whatever I play, I sing, I never studied under some expert teacher. But by practice, chanting, it may be melodious, it may be very nice or not. That doesn't matter. We are not concerned about that, whether it is appealing to the people or not. It will appeal; there is no doubt about it. But we don't require to divert our attention on these things. Simply because there is glorification of the Lord, it will be palatable.

This verse said that even though there is no any poetic, I mean to say, rhetorical arrangement or grammatical arrangement, or nice words arrangement, if simply there is glorification of the Lord.
Lecture on SB 1.5.11 -- New Vrindaban, June 10, 1969:

Parīkṣit Mahārāja said,

nivṛtta-tarṣair upagīyamānād
bhavauṣadhāc chrotra-mano-'bhirāmāt
ka uttama-śloka-guṇānuvādāt...
(SB 10.1.4)

Who will not take interest in the matter of understanding Kṛṣṇa consciousness, vinā paśughnāt, except persons who are animal killer, or committing suicide? Therefore this verse said that even though there is no any poetic, I mean to say, rhetorical arrangement or grammatical arrangement, or nice words arrangement, if simply there is glorification of the Lord, Hare Kṛṣṇa... So Hare Kṛṣṇa, these two words or sixteen words or three words, it will be appealed. It will appeal to the devotees, to the great souls. But if you organize a great political meeting, they'll not go there. Just like in our country we have seen the Mahatma Gandhi was given the title mahātmā. You can give your, any title. Nobody objects. Just like in Bengali we say kānā-locana nyāya padma-locana(?). Padma-locana means very beautiful, lotus-eyed. But one mother has got a child who is born blind. Out of her love she has given the name Padma-locana, "lotus-eyed." You see? So that she can give because she loves the child. Even he is blind, that's her whim. "My boy, my child is padma-locana." Similarly, this "mahātmā," this title you can give to any person you like, but it has a meaning, "mahātmā."

Now Vyāsadeva is discussing different kinds of literature. So he has explained that any literature, however nicely prepared from rhetorical point of view, or poetical, metaphorical, grammatical, but if there is no information of the Absolute Truth, such literatures are useless and no saintly person will take any interest in such literature.
Lecture on SB 1.5.12-13 -- New Vrindaban, June 11, 1969:

Now Vyāsadeva is discussing different kinds of literature. So he has explained that any literature, however nicely prepared from rhetorical point of view, or poetical, metaphorical, grammatical, but if there is no information of the Absolute Truth, such literatures are useless and no saintly person will take any interest in such literature. They give it up. Just like the swans, they do not take pleasure in a place where the crows can take pleasure. As there is distinction between the crows and the swans, even in the bird's kingdom, or even in the animal kingdom... You'll find always. The different kinds of varieties of birds and beasts, they live together. Similarly, those who are saintly persons, those who are Kṛṣṇa conscious persons, their taste is different from the persons who are just like crows. Crows are interested in things... Carvita-carvaṇānām. Prahlāda Mahārāja says, "chewing the chewed." Already it has been chewed, and if somebody wants to try it, "Let me see. What is the taste there?" it is useless labor only.

Mahābhārata was written by Vyāsadeva. But Nārada says that "This kind of literature will not appeal to the saintly devotees. So you write something for the satisfaction of the saintly devotees." And he is giving the instruction that "Even such literature is written in broken language, not in the proper way from grammatical point of view, from poetic point of view, from rhetorical, still, because such literature is full with glorification of the Supreme Lord, saintly persons, they accept it, they hear it, and they chant it.".
Lecture on SB 1.5.12-13 -- New Vrindaban, June 11, 1969:

So ordinary literature, they're full with all this, I mean to say, grāmya-kathā. The man and woman's behavior, that is good literature. There is a hero; there is a heroine. So those who are saintly persons, they do not take interest. So Nārada was advising Vyāsadeva that "You have written this Mahābhārata. That's all right. It is a great epic, history. But the, mostly... History means the ordinary dealings of the worldly men. So what benefit there is? That is nothing. No saintly person will take interest." Actually, this Mahābhārata was written by this, by Vyāsadeva for giving instruction, Vedic instruction to the less intelligent class of men. He has given introduction, strī-śūdra-dvija-bandhūnāṁ trayī na śruti-gocarā: (SB 1.4.25) "The Vedic knowledge is difficult to be understood by these classes of men and women: strī-śūdra-śūdra class, woman class, strī, śūdra—and dvija-bandhu." And dvija-bandhu means born in high family, brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, but their behavior is different, like śūdras. They cannot understand Vedas. Therefore there is restriction, that "The śūdras cannot read Vedas." They are restricted.

So therefore Mahābhārata was written by Vyāsadeva. But Nārada says that "This kind of literature will not appeal to the saintly devotees. So you write something for the satisfaction of the saintly devotees." And he is giving the instruction that "Even such literature is written in broken language, not in the proper way from grammatical point of view, from poetic point of view, from rhetorical, still, because such literature is full with glorification of the Supreme Lord, saintly persons, they accept it, they hear it, and they chant it."

The sādhus, they are not interested about rhetorical or grammatical adjustment. The sādhu wants to see who has spoken. If he's a Vaiṣṇava, then his word will be accepted.
Lecture on SB 1.7.44 -- Vrndavana, October 4, 1976:

A person who is trying to distribute the message of Kṛṣṇa, he is very, very dear dog of Kṛṣṇa. Na ca tasmān manuṣyeṣu kaścin me priya-kṛttamaḥ (BG 18.69). He is very... It doesn't matter how far he is advanced in education, how far he has learned grammar. These are not the things. The things is how far he is working to carry out the mission of Kṛṣṇa. Then one has to receive Kṛṣṇa's mercy through the bona fide servant. Kṛṣṇa cannot be bluffed by so-called education and grammar. Kṛṣṇa is not so... Bhaktyā mām abhijānāti (BG 18.55). He never says "By grammar or by education one can understand." Never says. Bhaktyā mām abhijānāti yāvān yaś cāsmi tattvataḥ. We should be educated, we should be very careful, but real thing is bhakti. Anyābhi... Bhajate mām ananya-bhāk, sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ (BG 9.30). Api cet su-durācāraḥ. Many places it is said. Tad-vāg-visargo janatāgha-viplavo yasmin prati-ślokam abaddhavaty api (SB 1.5.11). Even a bhakta writes something which is not very grammatically, rhetorically correct... Tad-vāg-visargo janatāgha-viplavaḥ, nāmāny anantasya yaśo 'ṅkitāni yat. But because he has tried to broadcast the glories of the Lord, even not in perfect language, that is his qualification.

tad-vāg-visargo janatāgha-viplavo
yasmin prati-ślokam abaddhavaty api
nāmāny anantasya yaśo 'ṅkitāni yat
śṛṇvanti gāyanti gṛṇanti sādhavaḥ
(SB 1.5.11)

The sādhus, they are not interested about rhetorical or grammatical adjustment. The sādhu wants to see who has spoken. If he's a Vaiṣṇava, then his word will be accepted. Caitanya Mahāprabhu strictly prohibits that is one is not a Vaiṣṇava, don't hear from him. Avaiṣṇava-mukhodgīrṇaṁ pūtaṁ hari-kathāmṛtam, śravaṇaṁ naiva kartavyam. "But he's such a learned man," or "He's writes so nicely, correctly." But because he's not Vaiṣṇava, one should not hear from him. "Why? It is so nicely written." No. Sarpocchiṣṭaṁ yathā payaḥ. Milk is very good food, everyone knows. But as soon as it is touched by the lips of a serpent, it is poison immediately. Therefore it is forbidden.

Kṛṣṇa's name is Uttama-śloka. He is prayed with first-class composition. All the ślokas, all the prayers we will find, they are not ordinary Sanskrit composition, as we have seen Bhīṣma's prayer to Kṛṣṇa, Kuntī's prayer to Kṛṣṇa in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. How philosophically they are elevated; how nicely they are composed. And because Kṛṣṇa is worshiped, God is worshiped by such kind of language and elevated poetical and rhetorical, all perfect, therefore His another name is Uttama-śloka.
Lecture on SB 6.2.24-25 -- Gorakhpur, February 13, 1971:

Now, just try to understand. By daily hearing... Because we are so much contaminated that it is very difficult to get us freed from the contamination, so nityam, regularly, there should be regularly class, hearing of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Naṣṭa-prāyeṣu abhadreṣu.

naṣṭa-prāyeṣu abhadreṣu
nityaṁ bhāgavata-sevayā
bhagavaty uttama-śloke
bhaktir bhavati naiṣṭikī
(SB 1.2.18)

By the process of cleansing our heart, our devotional temperament becomes fixed up on the Supreme Personality of Godhead who is called Uttama-śloka, who is glorified with first-class, I mean to say, Sanskrit stanzas, uttama-śloka. Just like we pray, we offer prayer to Kṛṣṇa, govindam adi-puruṣam, cintāmaṇi-prakara-sadmasu kalpa-vṛkṣa-lakṣāvṛteṣu surabhīr abhipālayantam (Bs. 5.29). These stanzas are not ordinary. It is very first-class composition, and written by, written or offered by the first living creature, Lord Brahmā. Therefore Kṛṣṇa's name is Uttama-śloka. He is prayed with first-class composition. All the ślokas, all the prayers we will find, they are not ordinary Sanskrit composition, as we have seen Bhīṣma's prayer to Kṛṣṇa, Kuntī's prayer to Kṛṣṇa in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. How philosophically they are elevated; how nicely they are composed. And because Kṛṣṇa is worshiped, God is worshiped by such kind of language and elevated poetical and rhetorical, all perfect, therefore His another name is Uttama-śloka.

You can offer your prayer from any standard of life. Not that you have to become a very learned man, very scholarly man, and you have to present your prayers in a very nicely selected words so that poetry, rhetoric, prosody, everything is there, metaphor. Nothing required. Simply you have to express your feelings.
Lecture on SB 7.9.12 -- Montreal, August 18, 1968:

For offering prayer to the Supreme Personality of Godhead, you do not require any high qualification. It doesn't matter. You can offer your prayer from any standard of life. Not that you have to become a very learned man, very scholarly man, and you have to present your prayers in a very nicely selected words so that poetry, rhetoric, prosody, everything is there, metaphor. Nothing required. Simply you have to express your feelings.

Suppose a great devotee, is writing some prayers for God, but he has no idea of the rhetorical or prosodic method, the system of poetry. He has no such idea, but he is simply expressing his feeling. But if that feeling is correct, even the language is broken. It is the feeling that is taken into consideration, not the language.
Lecture on SB 7.9.12 -- Montreal, August 19, 1968:

So Prahlāda Mahārāja is encouraged. Tasmād ahaṁ vigata-viklava īśvarasya sarvātmanā mahi gṛṇāmi yathā manīṣam: "Therefore I shall try to offer my prayers according to my capacity." It is not that because one does not know Sanskrit or a particular type of language and he cannot pray very nicely with poetic simile, metaphors... These things are not required. Simply you have to open your feelings of love of Godhead. Then He's pleased. It does not depend on the particular type of language or poetic ideas. No. There is one verse in the beginning of the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, that,

tad-vāg-visargo janatāgha-viplavo
yasmin prati-ślokam abaddhavaty api
nāmāny anantasya yaśo 'ṅkitāni yat
śṛṇvanti gāyanti gṛṇanti sādhavaḥ
(SB 1.5.11)

It is said that a verse written in broken language... Suppose a person, a great devotee, is writing some prayers for God, but he has no idea of the rhetorical or prosodic method, the system of poetry. He has no such idea, but he is simply expressing his feeling. But if that feeling is correct, even the language is broken... There are many examples. Just like a child, he prays mother, parents, simply by crying. It has no language, but the mother understands what is the feeling of the child. It is the feeling that is taken into consideration, not the language. So Prahlāda Mahārāja very much encouraged, that tasmād ahaṁ vigata-viklava.

Conversations and Morning Walks

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

The Sanskrit poetry writing is very difficult. They have got rhetoric system. So many words should be first, so many words, second. You cannot deviate.
Room Conversation with Allen Ginsberg -- May 14, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Allen Ginsberg: What are you reading?

Prabhupāda: Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. This is original Sanskrit. There are eight commentaries by big, big stalwart scholars.

Allen Ginsberg: These are the commentaries? And this is the text?

Prabhupāda: This is text.

Allen Ginsberg: What does the Sanskrit sound like? Is Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam to be chanted?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Just like... I will read some portion. (chants a few verses, "tasmai tubhyāṁ bhagavate vāsudevāya vedasi" to "vāsudevāya śantāya yadunām pataye namaḥ") Like this.

Allen Ginsberg: It's certainly beautiful prosody.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Oh, the Sanskrit poetry writing is very difficult. They have got rhetoric system. So many words should be first, so many words, second. You cannot deviate.

Allen Ginsberg: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Then the analogy and metaphor should be like that. Nothing should be twice repeated. So there is Sāhitya-ratna in Sanskrit, Sāhitya-ratna. Caitanya Mahāprabhu defeated one great scholar simply by little mistake. Yes. Keśava Kāśmīrī. Keśava Kāśmīrī was great scholar, and Sanskrit great scholar means he must fluently speak in Sanskrit verses everything.

Allen Ginsberg: Everything he says must be done in perfect Sanskrit verses?

Prabhupāda: Oh, that is... Yes. That is Sanskrit scholar. Not in prose. He'll go on composing verses. So Caitanya Mahāprabhu at that time was sixteen years old boy, but He was very learned logician. So the Keśava Kāśmīrī, he was traveling all over India by, I mean to say, competing other paṇḍitas, other learned scholars. So he, everywhere he was victorious.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Such revolutionary literature, even they are not properly composed, not according to the grammatical rules and other rhetorical rules, but, the thoughts and the effects of such revolutionary literature is required. If the thought is revolutionary for transcendental realization, because the attempt is there for glorifying the Supreme Lord, all devotees, all great sages, saintly persons, sādhavaḥ, gṛṇanti, they accept. Correctly or incorrectly, if it is spoken by realized soul, that is important.
Room Conversation Including Discussion on SB 1.5.11 -- January 19, 1972, Jaipur:

Prabhupāda: These people or this revolution is meant for killing the sinful resultant actions of the people. This revolution. Janatā agha, agha means resultant action of sinful life. Janatā agha viplavaḥ. Viplavaḥ means revolution, this very word is used. Tad-vāg-visargo janatāgha-viplavo yasmin prati-ślokam abaddhavaty api (SB 1.5.11). Such revolutionary literature, even they are not properly composed. Yasmin prati-ślokam abaddham. Not according to the grammatical rules and other rhetorical rules, but the, I mean to say, thoughts and the effects of such revolutionary literature is required. Not the grammatical. The so-called rascals, they are concerned with the grammatical. But those who are actually worker, they are concerned with the thoughts. What is the thought is there? Therefore, it is said that tad-vāg-visargo janatāgha-viplavo yasmin prati-ślokam abaddhavaty api, nāmāny anantasya yaśo 'nkitāni yat (SB 1.5.11). If there is simply the attempt is there how to glorify the Supreme Lord, that is a fact. It doesn't matter whether it is written in correct language or incorrect language, it doesn't matter. If the whole thought is targeted to glorify the Supreme Lord, then nāmāny anantasya yaśo 'nkitāni yat gṛṇanti gāyanti śṛṇvanti sādhavaḥ. Then those who are actually sādhu, even in spite of all these defects, because the only attempt is to glorify the Lord, then those who are sādhu, those who are devotee, they hear it. Śṛṇvanti gāyanti gṛṇanti. Not only hear, they chant also the same thing. And not only chant, but gṛṇanti, they apply in their actual life. This is the Bhāgavata śloka. Is it clear now? Yes. Tad-vāg-visargo janatāgha-viplavo (SB 1.5.11). If the thought is revolutionary for transcendental realization, even it is not properly composed from grammatical and literary point of view, because the attempt is there for glorifying the Supreme Lord, all devotees, all great sages, saintly persons, sādhavaḥ, gṛṇanti, they accept. Yes. Gṛṇanti śṛṇvanti, hear with attention, and gāyanti, and chant also. This is the principle. The only center is whether it is meant for awakening God consciousness. That is the central point, not the language(?). But it does not mean that it should not be correctly written. Correctly or incorrectly, if it is spoken by realized soul, that is important.

You can present a literature very perfect from literary point of view, from metaphor and poetical, rhetorical, very perfectly written, attractive by language, such kind of literature, if there is no description of the glories of the Lord, such literature is considered as the place of enjoyment of the crows.
Room Conversation Including Discussion on SB 1.5.11 -- January 19, 1972, Jaipur:

Prabhupāda: You can present a literature very perfect from literary point of view, from metaphor and poetical, rhetorical, very perfectly written, citra-padam, attractive by language. Na yad vacaś citra-padam, such kind of literature, if there is no description of the glories of the Lord, na tad vacaś citra-padam. Just like there are so many sex literatures, very attractive, it is selling like anything. But we are not interested in those rascal literatures. Tad vāyasaṁ tīrtham, such literature is considered as the place of enjoyment of the crows. Vāyasam means crow. The crow take enjoyment in the garbage, you have seen? They won't go in a nice place. They will come all together. Just like vultures, they come together to take pleasure in a corpse, dead body. But a white swan, rāja-haṁsa, he goes to a place where there is nice water, lilies and lotus and nice trees. You have seen that St. James Park? They will find out such nice place. They won't go to imitate the crows. The crows-like people will take pleasure in such nonsense literature, sex literature, or any such literature. So many nonsense literatures nowadays they are having good sale. Because people are becoming crows-like, they have no high idea, they have no sense of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, naturally they will take. Just like hippies, they have become all bad taste, crows-like. So we have to become swans, rāja-haṁsa, paramahaṁsa, paramahaṁsa. Paramo nirmatsarāṇām (SB 1.1.2). Then you can understand Kṛṣṇa consciousness. If you remain crows, then you cannot, that is not possible. By nature's example we have to see if crows-like and swans-like, pigeons-like, birds of the same feather. Birds of the same feather flock together, is it not? So you have to change your feather, then he will be pleased. If you keep your feather crows-like, then you cannot mix with the swans, that is not possible. This is the test.

Correspondence

1969 Correspondence

There is a verse in Srimad-Bhagavatam that a book or poetry in which the Holy Name of Krishna is depicted, such language is revolutionary in the matter of purifying the material atmosphere. Even though such literature is presented in broken language or grammatical inconsistency or rhetorical irregularity, still, those who are saintly persons adore such literature. They hear such literature, and chant it and adore it, simply because the Supreme Lord is being glorified in this literature.
Letter to Krsna dasa -- Los Angeles 13 February, 1969:

I am in due receipt of your letter dated 6 February, 1969, and I thank you very much for it. It is not surprising that it is taking a little time to begin your actual printing work. In the beginning of everything there is always some difficulty, but when you are accustomed to the process, there will be no difficulty. If no better grammarian is available, the translations of Uttama Sloka may be published. But I think that as many friends are coming to the temple, especially some Bengali Indians, they can help you in doing this translation work. When a person is willing to help with our mission, he is also a devotee, so there is no question of him being nondevotee. But they must translate as it is, they must not deviate. Anyway, our motto should be to somehow or other express the objectives of Krishna Consciousness to the German-speaking people. There is a verse in Srimad-Bhagavatam that a book or poetry in which the Holy Name of Krishna is depicted, such language is revolutionary in the matter of purifying the material atmosphere. Even though such literature is presented in broken language or grammatical inconsistency or rhetorical irregularity, still, those who are saintly persons adore such literature. They hear such literature, and chant it and adore it, simply because the Supreme Lord is being glorified in this literature. In other words, we are not meant for presenting any literary masterpieces, but we have to inform people that there is a fire of maya which is burning the very vitality of all living entities, and they should guard against the indefatigable onslaught of material existence. That should be our motto. So even if you do not get any assistance from friends, get it translated by Uttama Sloka, and publish. You can at least publish a 5-10 page edition of German Back To Godhead. That is my request.

Page Title:Rhetorical
Compiler:Labangalatika, Visnu Murti, MadhuGopaldas
Created:15 of Aug, 2009
Totals by Section:BG=0, SB=2, CC=3, OB=3, Lec=9, Con=3, Let=1
No. of Quotes:21