So unless a human being is conscious and awakened to the fact that we are always in suffering but we do not want all these sufferings... This question... Such a person is required to approach a spiritual master, when he is conscious. You see? So long he is animal-like, that he does not know that he's always in suffering... He does not know, he does not care, or he does not want to make a solution. And here Arjuna is suffering, and he wants to make a solution, and therefore he accepts a spiritual master. So when we are conscious of our sufferings, we are awakened to the suffering situation... Suffering is there. Forgetfulness or ignorance of suffering is no meaning. Suffering is there. But when one is very serious to make a solution of his suffering, then a spiritual master required. Just like Arjuna requires now a spiritual master. Is it clear? Yes. So that suffering is there. It does not require any education, simply thinking that, a slight thinking, that "I do not want all these sufferings, but I am suffering. Why? Is there any solution? Is there...?" But there is solution. All these scriptures, all these Vedic knowledge, everything... And not only Vedic knowledge... Now... Oh, why you are going to school? Why you are going to college? Why you are taking scientific education? Why you are taking law education? Everything is meant for ending our sufferings. If there was no suffering, then nobody would have taken education. You see? But he thinks that "If I am educated, if I become a doctor or if I become a lawyer or if I become an engineer, I will be happy." Happy. That is the ultimate aim. "I will get a good job, government job. I'll be happy." So happiness is the end of every, I mean to say, pursuance. So... But these mitigation of sufferings, they are temporary. Real suffering, real suffering is due to our, this material existence, these three kinds of suffering. So when one is conscious about his suffering and he wants to make a solution of this suffering, then there is necessary of a spiritual master. Now, if you want to make a solution of your sufferings, and you want to consult a person, now what sort of person you must meet who can end your all sufferings? That selection must be there. If you want to purchase a jewel, diamond, and very valuable thing, and if you go to a grocer's shop... Such kind of ignorance—you must be cheated. You must be cheated. At least you must approach to a jewelry shop. Jewelry shop, you see? So much knowledge you must have.
Real suffering
Srimad-Bhagavatam
SB Canto 7
Therefore, unless one is protected by the mercy of the Lord, no remedial measure can act effectively. One should consequently depend fully on the causeless mercy of the Lord. Although as a matter of routine duty one must of course accept other remedial measures, no one can protect one who is neglected by the Supreme Personality of Godhead. In this material world, everyone is trying to counteract the onslaught of material nature, but everyone is ultimately fully controlled by material nature. Therefore even though so-called philosophers and scientists try to surmount the onslaught of material nature, they have not been able to do so. Kṛṣṇa says in Bhagavad-gītā (13.9) that the real sufferings of the material world are four—janma-mṛtyu jarā-vyādhi (birth, death, old age and disease). In the history of the world, no one has been successful in conquering these miseries imposed by material nature. prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). Nature (prakṛti) is so strong that no one can overcome her stringent laws. So-called scientists, philosophers, religionists and politicians should therefore conclude that they cannot offer facilities to the people in general. They should make vigorous propaganda to awaken the populace and raise them to the platform of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Our humble attempt to propagate the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement all over the world is the only remedy that can bring about a peaceful and happy life.
Lectures
Bhagavad-gita As It Is Lectures
Prabhupāda: Yes. The, the necessity of a spiritual master is for him who is conscious of his material suffering. If one is not conscious of his material suffering, then he is not even on the human being status. He's still in the animal status. Animal status, you see? Now, the modern civilization... The modern civilization is practically... They are evading, evading the real sufferings. They are engaged in temporary sufferings. But the Vedic system is Vedic knowledge. They are meant for ending the sufferings of.., for good, sufferings for good. You see? The human life is meant for that, ending all suffering. Of course, we are trying to end all kinds of suffering. Our business, our occupation, our education, our advancement of knowledge—everything is meant for ending suffering. But that suffering is temporary, temporary. But we have to end the sufferings for good. Suffering... That sort of knowledge is called transcendental knowledge, and if anyone is seeking after that transcendental... This Bhagavad-gītā is not an ordinary thing. It is transcendental knowledge. And now here the ground is prepared. Ground is prepared. Arjuna is conscious of his suffering, perplexity. Now he is seeking a spiritual master.
This material world is certified by the Supreme Lord, the creator, as duḥkhālayam. Duḥkhālayam means "the place of miseries." And how you can make it comfortable? Can you make it comfortable by your so-called advancement of science? No. It is not possible. But we do not know what is duḥkha, or what is suffering. Real duḥkha is, real suffering is, birth and death, old age and disease. But we have set aside. Because we cannot make solution of these things, we don't care for it. We are after sputnik and atomic bomb. That is our scientific advancement. Why don't you solve these important things, which is giving me always suffering? They have no power. So here is the solution, that Kṛṣṇa says, mām upetya punar janma: (BG 8.15) "If anyone attains into My platform, then he does not come back again," punar janma, "rebirth again." Where? Duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam: "This place, full of miseries, full of..."
Therefore Kṛṣṇa presents, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam (BG 13.9). Intelligent person, they should always keep before, the sufferings. We are making solution of our suffering for ten years or fifty years or hundred years because we cannot live here more than hundred years. So that is temporary. I am eternal; you are eternal. Our real suffering is to take birth and remain in the womb of the mother. And even coming out of the womb of the mother, the small children, they feel always uncomfortable. Therefore they cry. The mother cannot understand what is the suffering of the... He is hungry but the mother is thinking that he wants to sleep or misunderstanding the child is uncomfortable. In this way childhood is past. Then again we become boy, again go to a school, again examination, again this. In this way the whole life is suffering. But under the spell of māyā, we are thinking we are happy. Therefore it is said mṛtyu-saṁsāra-vartmani. If we want to get relief from this business of birth, death, old age and disease, let us take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or God consciousness, and take His instruction directly and apply it in life. Your life will be successful. This is the subject matter of this chapter.
So if you qualify yourself by the divine qualities, then what is the benefit? Daivī sampad vimokṣāya. Mokṣa. Mokṣa mean liberation. So if you cultivate divine qualities, then you are fit for being liberated. What is liberation? Liberation from repeating birth and death. That is our real suffering. The modern, rascal civilization, they do not know actually what is the end of suffering. They do not know. There is no education. There is no science. They are thinking that "Here this small span of life, say, fifty years, sixty years, hundred years, utmost, if we get a nice wife, a nice apartment and nice motor car, running with seventy miles speed, and a nice whiskey bottle..." That is his perfection. But that is not vimokṣāya. Real vimokṣa, liberation, means no more birth, death, old age and disease. That is vimokṣa. But they do not know even.
Srimad-Bhagavatam Lectures
But we do not know. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). Actually, prakṛti, nature, is pulling us according to our desire, or according to our... The desire is contamination, the mental contamination. And we are creating different types of body. So our real suffering is the transmigration from one body to another. That we do not know. There is no scientist... But it is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). You have to accept. And that is explained in other places, in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa jantur deha upapatti (SB 3.31.1). As you are creating the situation... In the Bhagava d-gītā it is also stated, yaṁ yaṁ vāpi smaran bhāvaṁ tyajaty ante kalevaram (BG 8.6). At the time of your death, the situation which you have created, it will carry you. Because mind is there. Mind is subtle. Intelligence is subtle. That mind, intelligence and ego. The subtle body is there. The gross body is lost. But the subtle body will take you to another gross body. It will take to the womb of another mother. And according to your karma, the mother's..., by the mother's help you will get a body, and duly you will come out and begin your work. This is nature's process. It is going on.
So the modern civilization, modern or past, foolish people, they do not want the solution. They think that "Things are going on like this. We cannot avoid it. Let us suffer." That is not intelligence. If you are suffering, then you must find out the remedy. And actually, we are doing that. But because we do not know what is the actual remedy, we are missing the point. But there is solution. And for this solution, one must go to the spiritual master. That is described. Saṁsāra-dāvānala-līḍha-loka-trāṇāya. They... This materialistic life is always like the blazing fire in the forest. So trāṇāya. How to get out of it. Trāṇāya it is called. Trāṇāya means to relieve from the suffering. Kāruṇya-ghanāghanatvam. So how these sufferings can be mitigated? So people have become so dull-headed, they cannot understand what is the real suffering, and neither they have any inquiries how to mitigate the sufferings. This is the position. Therefore they are called śūdras. Śūdras, they are like. A brāhmaṇa is intelligent. A brāhmaṇa... Therefore we are trying to make people brāhmaṇa so that he may become intelligent. Not śūdras. Others are trying to make them śūdras. Śūdras means to remain in ignorance, and brāhmaṇa means to remain in knowledge. That is the difference between brāhmaṇa and śūdra. And these two other classes, via media, kṣatriya and vaiśya. The brāhmaṇas are supposed to be the first-class men in the society. The kṣatriyas, the second class, the vaiśyas, the third class, and the remaining, all fourth class and fifth class.
Many times we have discussed. And coming, from the very moment the child is crying, there is inconveniences. So many things he cannot express. In this way, within the womb there is suffering, out of the womb there is suffering. Then growing, child or baby or boy, there are so many sufferings. Then young man—suppose he becomes family man—then earn for the family. That is also suffering. Then old man, disease, inability, many, many thoughts, that is also suffering. And again death is suffering. At the time of death nobody knows what will happen. Recently one of our Godbrothers has died. He was suffering that he... Some glucose food was being supplied through the nose, and with that, what is called? Taking out the...? That also another suffering. Forcibly taking out the urine, cannot speak anything. So this is suffering. This is called saṁsṛti. We are so foolish we do not know that this material existence is suffering. They are simply struggle for existence. Manaḥ ṣaṣṭhānīndriyāṇi prakṛti-sthāni karṣati (BG 15.7). Simply a struggle. There is no happiness. But these foolish persons, they do not know that there is suffering and how to stop this suffering. That is real problem. Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam (BG 13.9). Intelligent persons should always keep in view that "These are my real sufferings." Not that "Temporary I have got some misunderstanding with some friend, or temporary I do not get some nice food, and therefore suffering." These sufferings are extra, but real suffering is this-janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi.
So the problem is that within the heart we have got so many dirty things. So unless those dirty things are removed or cleansed, this kind of prāyaścitta or medicine or fine or going to the jail—he is not saved. He will commit the same thing. Again will suffer. Again he will suffer. Bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19). Real problem is that we should stop our suffering. But the karmīs, they are interested in the temporary cure, and they do not know how to cure completely. There will be no more suffering. That they do not know. But a Vaiṣṇava, because he is Kṛṣṇa conscious, he knows what is real suffering—because he understands from Kṛṣṇa. So Kṛṣṇa says that "Your real suffering is these four things, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi: (BG 13.9) repetition of birth, death, old age, and disease. Actually this is your problem." So without devotees, without hearing from Kṛṣṇa, these rascals, they do not know actually what is the problem nor what is suffering. They are simply concerned with temporary suffering and temporary cure. Therefore they have been explained, they have been described in the Bhagavad-gītā, as mūḍhas. Mūḍha means ass.
Festival Lectures
So Vaiṣṇava means para-duḥkha-duḥkhī. They are simple thinking...There are so many politicians and humanitarians and so many. But nobody knows how to do good to others. Nobody knows. They do not know. The real fact is, as Kṛṣṇa explains Himself, that
- aśraddadhānāḥ puruṣā
- dharmasyāsya parantapa
- mām aprāpya nivartante
- mṛtyu-saṁsāra-vartmani (sic:)
- (BG 9.3)
This is the real suffering of the humanity. I especially speak humanity because in the human form of life one can actually understand what is the position, what is the value of life. The value of life one should understand that we are in the cycle of birth and death. Bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19). Once we take birth and again we die. Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi duḥkha-doṣānu-darśanam (BG 13.9). So one should be intelligent to understand that I am eternal. I learn from Bhagavad-gītā and Vedic literature that ahaṁ brahmāsmi: "I am eternal." Why I am dying? This is intelligence. This is intelligence. Otherwise cats and dogs. A dog, a cat, does not know why he is dying. Neither he knows that he is eternal. But a human being can take information from the śāstra that he is eternal and he does not die on the destruction of the body. Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). Kṛṣṇa is giving this information. Tathā dehāntara. This is our real unhappiness. Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi. But if we are kept in darkness about this and simply we become busy with some superficial things, bahir-artha-māninaḥ. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇu, durāśayā. It is durāśayā.
So all these leaders, the political leaders, they do not know what is the value of life. The durāśayā, with some hope which will never be fulfilled, they are busy with that. Therefore a Vaiṣṇava is para-duḥkha-duḥkhī. He knows what is the real suffering of humanity and he tries to estab...Sad-dharma-saṁsthāpakau. Nānā-śāstra-vicāraṇaika-nipuṇau. Real dharma means occupation. Dharma does not mean that you believe in something. That is the description in the..., "a faith." Faith is different thing. But real dharma means the occupational duty. Just like government law. Government law. If you go on the street, you'll find "Keep to the left." There is no question of faith. You must keep on the left; otherwise you are criminal, you'll be punished. That is dharma. The real meaning is this, that dharmaṁ tu sākṣād bhagavat-praṇītam (SB 6.3.19), The laws given by God. That is the simple definition of dharma.
Conversations and Morning Walks
1973 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: And ignorance. If we give service in ignorance, without knowing what is what, that kind of service may lead us to become punished. So we must know what kind of service we shall give. So real suffering of the society, human society, or any society you take, real suffering is, because the living entity has forgotten God, so he is being punished in different way by the material nature. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). So many ways. But everyone is being punished. At least, the three kinds... Why three kinds? That is stated in Bhagavad-gītā, that this is also punishment, repetition of birth and death. This is also punishment. Because we are eternal. Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). We are spirit soul, we are eternal. So our, this constant change of body, birth and death, that is also punishment. Because nobody wants to die. Because he is eternal. How he'll like to die? He wants to keep his eternal position, but he, because he's criminal... Just like one man is condemned to die, murderer. So he has to die. But he wants to protect himself, placing himself in the court, "How to save? How to save?" So that is our natural tendency, that we do not want to die. Why? Because we are eternal.
1975 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. In Bhāgavata also—gurur na sa syāt. He should not be guru unless he is able to protect his disciple from the imminent danger of death. Na mocayed yaḥ samupeta-mṛtyum. This cycle of birth and death is going on. Guru's business is how to stop this cycle of birth and death. And it is not very difficult. Teach him to understand Kṛṣṇa, and Kṛṣṇa is assuring, "If anyone understands Me nicely, then after giving up this body he comes to Me." Where is the difficulty? Give him Kṛṣṇa consciousness, and he is saved from birth and death. There is nothing wonderful. There is no jugglery. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti (BG 4.9). (break) ...only institution for mitigating the sufferings of humanity. But they don't know what is the real suffering of humanity. Dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti. That is the real suffering, cycle of birth and death. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇum (SB 7.5.31). These rascals, they do not know what is the goal of life, svārtha, self-interest. Unless he comes to Viṣṇu, there is no question of svārtha-gati.
1976 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: India's business is para-upakāra. India's business is not exploitation. That is Indian. And para-upakāra means not that daridra-nārāyaṇa bhojana, no. Para-upakāra means to give him knowledge, for want of which he is suffering. That is real...
- mamaivāṁśo jīva-loke
- jīva-bhūtaḥ sanātanaḥ
- manaḥ ṣaṣṭhānīndriyāṇi
- prakṛti-sthāni karṣati
- (BG 15.7)
This is his real suffering. He's part and parcel of God. Qualitatively, he's as good as God, but he's suffering. Why he's suffering? Manaḥ ṣaṣṭhānīndriyāṇi prakṛti-sthāni karṣati (BG 15.7). He has come to this material world, prakṛti, and or mental concoction he's creating his plan and struggling for existence. This is real suffering. So Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement means to save him from real suffering. That Indians should take very seriously and join this movement, and para-upakāra, people need it all over the world. Otherwise, why these young boys, they have joined me? They are finding something, relief by this movement. Otherwise, what business he has got to join with an Indian, poor Indian. I went to their country with forty rupees, that's all. So they are finding something relief. And actually it is relief. So our Indians are not interested.
1977 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: If you get fresh vegetable, fresh milk, and food grain, what do you want more? And from milk you can prepare so many nice preparations, unlimited number, all very palatable, sweet. This civilization we want to introduce, not so-called rascal civilization and become implicated in this cycle of birth and death. This is not civilization. This is killing civilization. Human being got the opportunity to get out of these clutches of birth and death. They do not understand. They're so rascal, they do not understand how they are implicated in this cycle of birth and death, nor they do take it seriously, that this is the problem, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam (BG 13.9). They are so blind rascals, they do not see that this is real suffering. They do not know it. Simply theorizing, making plan, and they do not know what is the suffering. Such a rascal civilization. So we have to introduce real civilization. Therefore we are struggling so hard. So make in such a way. That's a very nice place, center of Europe and very nice place. What is the condition of rainfall?
Prabhupāda: We must know what is the suffering. Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha (BG 13.9). Duḥkha means suffering. And the real suffering is to take birth and then again die. And between birth and death there is old age and disease. Who can deny it? Where is the scientist. "Yes, we shall end all this nonsense." (chuckling) Nobody can end it. It is not possible. But they are trying. Durāśaya. Hoping something which will never be fulfilled. Is it not? Their material adventure for mitigating suffering, will it be possible? (aside:) Bring some sugar cane, er, sugar candy. The mode of ignorance is very, very bad. Little more advance, mode of passion. Further advanced, mode of knowledge. Further advanced is spiritual position. Just see. This Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is trying to give the human society the best knowledge and they have combined together to oppose it. How mode of ignorance is prominent. The simple method is to hear about Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: So what can be done? We have taken this daṇḍa, we have accepted service of Kṛṣṇa, and if He has ordered that "You preach this philosophy of Bhagavad-gītā. You'll become My very dearest servant," He'll show them. Na ca tasmād manuṣyeṣu kaścit. So we want to be very faithful to our master, so you may come against us. We don't mind. Jesus Christ was crucified. He didn't mind. So if you are unnecessarily prosecuting us, we don't mind. We must go on with our duty. We cannot give it up. That's all. It is not possible. What to..., you are prosecuting? If you kill us, we shall not. We have taken this daṇḍa. This is our determination. You cannot stop us. That's it. "Because we know this is the only welfare activity to the human society. You make talk, madmen. We don't care for it. To be imprisoned with this material body—the greatest suffering... You are trying to mitigate suffering, temporary, this way and that, but you do not know how." That you can show from the Bhagavad... Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānu... (BG 13.9). "This is real suffering. Why the eternal soul should be subjected to birth, death, old age and disease? We are seeing to this. You are thinking that 'If I can place myself in a very high skyscraper building and motorcar,' your business is finished. We are not so fool. We know that 'Any moment, I shall be kicked out of the skyscraper building and motorcar by the laws of nature.' " That's a fact. But fools cannot understand. They think, "This is my permanent..." That is not permanent, but you are permanent. "Where is my permanent situation?"—we are seeking after that. So we are not so fools. We are taking that "I am permanent. Why I should be encapped or entangled in this nonpermanent." This is our philosophy.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa:
- mām upetya punar janma
- duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam
- (BG 8.15)
Prabhupāda: Mām upetya punar janma duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam. So long you have to accept another body, you must suffer. Suffering means this body. That Kṛṣṇa says. Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam (BG 13.9). Real suffering is here, that you have to take your birth, you have to die, you have to suffer from disease and old age. But your position is na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). Na jāyate na mriyate vā kadācit. Your business is not to take birth and die. But why you are suffering? Nobody wants to die. You must die. Nobody wants to become old man. He must become. So you do not know what is suffering and how to mitigate it. And Kṛṣṇa points out, "This is suffering." Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam. This is knowledge. So temporary... Suppose if there is any boil, and if you... Is that mitigation of suffering, do you think? "Oh, you are suffering?" The surgeon must come and operate and get out this pus and then suffering. So here Kṛṣṇa recommends, "This is mitigation of suffering. Stop your birth, death, old age and disease." So we do not know what is suffering and how to get out. Therefore we have to consult Kṛṣṇa in every step. Then our life will be... This is our Kṛṣṇa consciousness. You take instruction from Kṛṣṇa and try to abide by it. Your suffering will go. Otherwise, simply dog barking will not help.
Prabhupāda: So take the perfect knowledge. Follow it. You become perfect. Perfection means... That is also stated in Bhagavad-gītā. Real misery is that I am eternal... As God is eternal, I am also eternal. So now I am subjected to birth, death, old age, and disease, due to the physical body. Therefore Kṛṣṇa says, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam: (BG 13.9) "You are trying to mitigate all kinds of sufferings. So why don't you see the real suffering is here, janma." How to stop this repetition of birth—that is your real problem. But they have made problems, so-called politics, philanthropy, altruism, humanitarianism, this, that, that, so many. But real problem remains, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi. This is the defect. They won't take what is the problem, how to solve it. Everything is in oblivion, ignorance. What can be done? Although there is knowledge, there is light, there is practical example, they won't take it. What can be done? So we shall request you all, please don't waste your time in this way, that way, and ultimately come to the conclusion, zero. Take instruction of Bhagavad-gītā in all regards and be happy. It is not difficult. Practical examples are there. Before me, ten years before, whole world, foreigners, there was not a single Kṛṣṇa conscious. Whole history. Now you'll find thousands. Why? I have not manufactured (indistinct), giving them. I have given them Kṛṣṇa. That's all.
| Page Title: | Real suffering |
| Compiler: | Haya, MadhuGopaldas |
| Created: | 05 of Dec, 2008 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=1, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=11, Con=8, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 20 |