No beginning (Conversations)

Expressions researched:
"no beginning" |"no such beginning"

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Interviews with Macmillan and various English Reporters -- September 12, 1973, London:

Reporter (3): You know, with Christianity and other religions, the world has...

Prabhupāda: The Christianity, if you...

Reporter (3): ...a beginning and an end.

Prabhupāda: Yes. We also believe that, that the world has a beginning, and it has an end. Anything material. Just like my body, your body. It has got a beginning from the father, mother, and again it will end. So anything material, it has beginning and end. But the, within the body, the spirit soul, the spirit soul has no beginning, no end.

Reporter (3): So how long has Kṛṣṇa consciousness been in India, or were you...?

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa consciousness is in India from Vedic age, since a very, very long time. But especially since five thousand years ago when...

Reporter (3): So you, you didn't start everything off?

Prabhupāda: No, no, no. I'm simply presenting in English language. That's all.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- March 30, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...its another meaning is "beginning."

Dr. Patel: Beginning. That's right. Beginning of work.

Prabhupāda: So there is no beginning. Just like it is already taken to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, so why should he take something else, begin here. That should continue.

Dr. Patel: Ārambha-patavat. Ārambha is a rudanta.

Prabhupāda: And another, ārambhara. That is, that is, that is humbug, humbugism, ārambhara.

Dr. Patel: Ārambhar means this ārambha.

Prabhupāda: Ārambhar.

Morning Walk -- April 5, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Still, although he saw aneka in Kṛṣṇa, still, he is seeing Kṛṣṇa there. That is real vision.

Girirāja: "O Lord of the universe, I see in Your universal body many, many forms-bellies, mouths, eyes-expanded without limit. There is no end, there is no beginning, and there is no middle to all this."

Prabhupāda: A crude example can be given. Just like a man may be director of this company and trust of that company and so many when he is working. But his wife is feeling that he is her husband. That's all. She does not see anything, although he is working in aneka-rūpam. This is the, a crude example. He has his eyes to see, "Here is my beloved husband." That's all. Just like Yasodamayi. Yasodamayi saw that all the universes within the mouth... She asked, ordered Kṛṣṇa, "I want to see whether you have eaten dirt. Open your mouth."

Room Conversation with Biochemist, Dr. Sallaz -- June 4, 1974, Geneva:

Dr. Sallaz: Destruction in our occidental language and practically, which is not yours.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Destruction in simple terms, just as we know something has a beginning and something has an end. That is destruction. So in Vedic terms that which has a beginning and has an end is called material, and that which has no beginning and no end, but is existing nonetheless, that is called spiritual or superior energy.

Dr. Sallaz: Of course. This cannot be destroyed.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That cannot be destroyed.

Dr. Sallaz: That cannot be destroyed. It can disappear from the living people, Christian or other of this world, but not at all.

Prabhupāda: Then what do you mean by spiritual revolution?

Room Conversation with Robert Gouiran, Nuclear Physicist from European Center for Nuclear Research -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Yogeśvara: ...but what was one ship or one relic, now there's a new one. Is that your point?

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: That there is no beginning or end to the energy.

Robert Gouiran: No, what I said before. I said that to say that the ship is now relic...

Prabhupāda: But you... That we admit. There is some temporary use. There is some temporary use.

Robert Gouiran: Yes, I agree.

Room Conversation with Russian Orthodox Church Representative -- June 13, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: No, it is characteristic. Definition means you mention the characteristic. That is definition. Definition, you mention the characteristic. So that can be mentioned directly, or if it is not perceivable, then you can define in opposite way. Just like we have got experience: everything in the material world, it is beginning. There is a beginning. Anything of this—your body, my body, everything—it has got a beginning, and it has got an end. So it is stated, na jāyate na mriyate vā: "It has no beginning, no end." And nityaḥ, eternal, śāśvataḥ, very old, purāṇaḥ. Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). "It is not destroyed, annihilated, after the destruction of the body." So if we accept this definition, then we can understand the soul is eternal. Our characteristic, if we accept these characteristics, na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20), after the destruction of body the soul is never destroyed, then you can understand the soul is eternal. And it is clearly stated, na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). "After the destruction of the body, it is not destroyed." So, it means it takes another body. (French)

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Professor Durckheim: But there is another one.

Prabhupāda: Eternity means, we say, no beginning no end. That is eternity.

Professor Durckheim: Isn't there also this other one, when, for instance, Christ says, "I am before Abraham was," this "I am." There is one kind of eternity which has nothing to do with past and future at all, which is beyond past and future.

Prabhupāda: Past and future is concerned with this body.

Professor Durckheim: Is concerned with this body. It is concerned, exactly, with this body and with this ego, with regard to which there is a before and an after, up and down. And if you take away this ego, what's there, what's left?

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: Time is there, but because I have got this temporary body, I am thinking past, present, future. The temporary body will vanish. I shall get another temporary body. Then again my begins past and present. So therefore this is called illusion. Time is eternal. It has no beginning, no end, but we transmigrate from one body to another. We are calculating, miscalculating, past, present, future.

Professor Durckheim: Yes, time has no beginning and no end. But time in this second sense has nothing to do with beginning and end.

Prabhupāda: It has no end, beginning, no end. The beginning and end is of this body. And in relationship with this body, we are calculating past, present, future.

Professor Durckheim: But without this body, you wouldn't become conscious of what is beyond body.

Room Conversation with Bhurijana dasa and Disciples -- July 1, 1974, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: If you still cannot understand what is my instruction, then how can I help you? New students may say like that. You are intelligent, educated, old student. If you say... (long, silent pause) Our movement is that beginning of spiritual life is to surrender. If there is no surrendering, then it is no advance. Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). This is the beginning. If that thing is lacking, there is no beginning even, what to speak of advancement. That is discussed already. Na siddhiṁ sa avāpnoti na sukhaṁ na paraṁ gatiḥ. This is the beginning of spiritual life. The word is called disciple. Disciple means who accept discipline. If there is no discipline, where is disciple? And "disciplic succession." We have used this word. Not that discipline is finished by one man, no. It will continue to go by succession. That is perfect.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with three Trappist Monks, Psychologists from the University of Georgia, and Atlanta Lawyer, Michael Green -- March 1, 1975, Atlanta:

Prabhupāda: That is our business. (laughter) This word, "creation," is applicable in this material world. In the spiritual world there is no creation, the father and the son existing eternally. When we come to this material world... Material world means it has got beginning, and it has got end. And spiritual world means there is no beginning, no end. That is sanātana, eternal.

Guest (1): That is the point of a steady state theory of the universe also, that it... Arthur Hubble, I think, in Oxford. He talks about a steady state theory of the universe. But the whole idea is that the whole universe has always been there, and it will always be there. It might change in shape, like on the expressway in the morning. Any one morning you may look at it, blue car is here and the red car is there and another day the green car might be in the same place. So there might be transitory change, but he maintains that it has always been there.

Room Conversation with three Trappist Monks, Psychologists from the University of Georgia, and Atlanta Lawyer, Michael Green -- March 1, 1975, Atlanta:

Guest (3): ...can tie in with the idea of the spirit being eternal in Christ, and I believe Christ himself said that we have all been with him from the beginning.

Guest (1): And there is no beginning. According to the ideas, one group of science data, there is no beginning, and therefore there is no end.

Guest (5): It's the alpha and the omega then. Swami, do you see a difference or a conflict between being a devotee of Jesus and a devotee of Kṛṣṇa? May one be both?

Prabhupāda: A devotee means, real devotee means, he has no purpose for material gain. That is real devotee. Now we have to see what kind of devotee he is. There are two kinds of devotees: with purpose and without purpose. The "without purpose" devotee is pure devotee, and "with purpose" devotee, they are material devotee. That is distinguished in Bhagavad-gītā,

Room Conversation with Alcohol and Drug Hospital People -- May 16, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: Nobody is His father. That is God. God is everyone's father, but He is without father. That is God. So long one has got father, he is not God. When you come to the point that here is the person who has no father—He is independent—that is God. The definition of God is given in the Vedic literature.

īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ

sac-cid-ānanda-vigrahaḥ

anādir ādir govindaḥ

sarva-kāraṇa-kāraṇam

(Bs. 5.1)

Anādi means He has no beginning. But He is the beginning of everything. This is simple definition of God. Anādi... Anādi means He has no beginning. But He is the beginning of everything. Anādir ādir govindaḥ sarva-kāraṇa-kāraṇam (Bs. 5.1), the cause of all causes.

Morning Walk -- July 11, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda: So God was there and God's word was there. That is the beginning, our beginning. Janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1). Aham evāsam agre. And Bhagavad-gītā, ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavaḥ mattaḥ sarvaṁ pravartate (BG 10.8). This is our philosophy, "Everything begins from God." Now you can say, "Wherefrom God came?" But that is God. God existing, He is not caused by any other cause, He is the original cause. Anādir ādiḥ: "He has no beginning, but He is the beginning of everything." This is conception of God. Anādir ādir govindaḥ (Bs. 5.1). That ādi is Govinda, person, Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa says, aham ādir hi devānām (Bg 10.2). We find from the history. Brahmā is the beginning. He is deva, one of the demigods. Kṛṣṇa says, aham ādir hi devānām. So He is the cause of Brahmā also. So this is our philosophy. We don't begin from zero or accident. This is not our philosophy.

Morning Walk -- October 16, 1975, Johannesburg:

Prabhupāda: Beginning Kṛṣṇa.

Harikeśa: No, no. Let's say you have a king, and he is deciding this person is worthy of...

Prabhupāda: No, no, beginning, Kṛṣṇa. Why don't you read Bhagavad-gītā? You do not know?

Harikeśa: No, no. Yes.

Prabhupāda: What is the social arrangement? What is that?

Harikeśa: That Kṛṣṇa created the four orders.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So you make that four orders, and then society will be in order. But you are not taking Kṛṣṇa's advice. You are manufacturing your hellish ideas.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- March 11, 1976, Mayapur:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, very nice.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Gopāla was saying that "You are asking Me to go to give witness. Do you think a statue can go?" So he is devotee. He said, "Yes, if statue can speak, he can go also." So he had firm faith. So Kṛṣṇa had pledged him, "Yes, I'll go."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I think you also have that firm faith, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: No, without firm faith there is no beginning of God worship.

Devotee: Niṣṭhā.

Morning Walk -- March 11, 1976, Mayapur:

Jayatīrtha: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Śraddhā, this faith, means so strong faith that one will know it perfectly well that simply by worshiping Kṛṣṇa, everything is there. That is the beginning of faith. Otherwise there is no faith. And without faith there is no beginning. Ādau śraddhā. Ādau śraddhā tataḥ sādhu-saṅgaḥ (Cc. Madhya 23.14-15). If you have got that firm faith, then next stage is to live with, to deal with devotees. Then the faith will increase because by seeing their behavior your faith will be increased. Then bhajana kriya. Wherefrom this shenai was...?

Sudāmā: Vaikuṇṭhanātha temple.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Room Conversation -- April 22, 1976, Melbourne:

Brian Singer: And in the beginning of time of the soul?

Prabhupāda: Why...? There is no beginning. Beginning of the body.

Brian Singer: No, I don't want to know about the beginning of the body. I can understand. I want to know about the beginning of the soul.

Prabhupāda: The soul is already there. Soul is already.... Just like this room was already there. Now I have entered. And again I give up this room; I go to another room. Like that. Not that this room becomes another room, room. If I have to go to another room, I have to give up this room. I have to go another room. So I am the same. I am changing different rooms, different body. Tathā dehāntara-prāptir dhīras tatra na muhyati (BG 2.13). Find out this verse.

Morning Walk -- May 15, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Ah.

Hayagrīva: Well, then, how is the individual soul eternal if it has a beginning?

Prabhupāda: No, we say there is no beginning. As God has no beginning, soul has no beginning.

Hayagrīva: No beginning, yes.

Prabhupāda: Na jāyate na mriyate vā. That is the distinction between matter and soul.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They counter that if God is all-powerful, He can do anything. So why not He can create a soul and that soul can then be eternal from that point?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

'Life Comes From Life' Slideshow Discussions -- July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Now we want to describe something about this Absolute Truth. His Divine Grace Śrīla Prabhupāda has explained that Absolute Truth is that from which everything comes: janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1). Now what is the Absolute Truth, and how the Absolute Truth is to be known? Now in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, Absolute Truth is described anādir ātmā puruṣo nirguṇaḥ prakṛteḥ paraḥ. The Absolute Truth or the Supreme Personality of Godhead is the Supreme Soul, and He has no beginning, anādi, He has no beginning. And He is also nirguṇa, He's transcendental to the material modes of nature. And prakṛteḥ para, beyond the existence of this material world.

Prabhupāda: The same thing is explained also in the Brahma-saṁhitā, anādir-ādi. He's anādi, He has no beginning, but He is the beginning of everything. Anādir-ādi, govindam ādi-puruṣaṁ tam ahaṁ bhajāmi. He is the beginning of everything, but He has no beginning.

Evening Darsana -- July 13, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Eternal life is described by Kṛṣṇa in the Bhagavad-gītā: ajo nityaḥ śāśvato 'yaṁ purāṇaḥ.

na jāyate mriyate vā kadācin

nāyaṁ bhūtvā bhavitā vā na bhūyaḥ

ajo nityaḥ śāśvato 'yaṁ purāṇo

na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre

(BG 2.20)

Eternal means without a beginning and without an end. So this body, this human form of life, or tree form of life, or animal form of life, aquatic form of life, it has a beginning and it has an end. But the person, the soul, has no beginning or end. This is described by Kṛṣṇa that: dehino 'smin yathā dehe, kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā (BG 2.13).

Conversation at House of Ksirodakasayi dasa -- July 25, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: This is the verdict of the Vedic literature. There may be many other gods. They are expansions of the original Personality of Godhead. If anyone is interested to study the science of God, you'll find it in the Vedic literature, how Kṛṣṇa expands by His plenary portion in different names of God. It is confirmed in the Brahma-saṁhitā, advaitam acyutam anādim ananta-rūpam (Bs. 5.33). That Absolute Truth is advaita, without any duality; acyuta, infallible. Advaita, acyuta, anādi. Everything has got it's beginning, anything you... That is our material conception because we have got the experience—anything we take, it has got a beginning. But Kṛṣṇa, He is described, advaita, acyuta, anādi: "He has no beginning."

Room Conversation -- July 26, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: May be true to some extent, but they do not know the ultimate truth. That they do not know. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān (BG 7.19). He understands, vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ (BG 7.19). That requires many, many births, to come to that conclusion. Vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyaḥ (BG 15.15). This Kṛṣṇa says. Mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat kiñcid asti dhanañjaya: (BG 7.7) "There is no more superior than Me." Ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavo mattaḥ sarvaṁ pravartate (BG 10.8). He explains to everyone, sarva-dharman parityajya mām ekam (BG 18.66). That is the.... There is the ultimate person. You call Him Kṛṣṇa or something, but you must know Him. Īśvaraḥ paramaḥ, there must be. Father's father's father's father's father's.... Who is the original father? There must be. Where is the wrong in this statement? So you find out the supreme father, but He has no father; He is the Absolute. Sarva-kāraṇa.... Anādir ādiḥ: "He has no beginning, but He is the beginning." Anādir ādir govindaḥ sarva-kāraṇa-kāraṇam (Bs. 5.1). So, Bhagavān may carry one letter that "I am very sorry. On account of my health failure, I could not go to see you, that professor and all devotees, and I am very, very sorry for this, but, I humbly invite you, come to India, and we shall be very glad to sit together," like that.