Rāmeśvara: You have said many times that if a small percentage of the Americans become Kṛṣṇa conscious, then the whole country can gradually become Kṛṣṇa conscious.
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.
Rāmeśvara: So that means that in the beginning we may be very powerful in government, but still, the masses of people will be karmīs still.
Prabhupāda: No. You can introduce in such a way that they will become devotees. Suppose in big, big factories we shall introduce this prasāda distribution and chanting. They'll immediately be popular. Everything will be... Ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12).
Jagadīśa: In order for us to get power, by that time the illumination and knowledge of Kṛṣṇa consciousness will be widespread.
Rāmeśvara: That's what I'm wondering. I was thinking that it wouldn't be. There would be...
Jagadīśa: Otherwise how can we get through? What is the use of having one politician?
Rāmeśvara: Many revolutions have been victorious with a very small minority of people behind them because they're so well organized. Russia, Germany, all these revolutions.
Prabhupāda: That's a fact.
Rāmeśvara: In history there is examples of small groups of people taking over a government because they are very intelligent and very well organized.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Rāmeśvara: And the mass of people did not believe in them, but still, they took over the government. Like in Russia.
Jagadīśa: But Kṛṣṇa consciousness knowledge...
Prabhupāda: In Russia, the mass of people aloof from this rascal theory.
Hari-śauri: They are not Communists, the mass of people. The Communist party itself is very small.
Prabhupāda: Yes, very small. By terrorism there will be, by terrorism.
Rāmeśvara: So when the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement becomes so powerful that it is in charge of the government, is it because of a small group of people or because of a mass?
Prabhupāda: It is due to quality of the leaders.
Rāmeśvara: But will it be like Russia where there is only a small group of people who are Kṛṣṇa conscious?
Prabhupāda: No, it is not that. The quality of the people will be changed.
Rāmeśvara: So that means the whole mass population...
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Rāmeśvara: Only then will Kṛṣṇa conscious government...
Prabhupāda: No, no. You can have government when you are in even minority. But the mass of people, on account of this quality, will have to see.
Hari-śauri: The idea is to convince them that what they need is good quality leaders, that not necessarily that they already have to become to that stage themselves.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Jagadīśa: Kṛṣṇa consciousness can be appreciated by any man because it's very simple.
Prabhupāda: Simple and it is natural also.
Hari-śauri: The desire for good leadership is there, so if we present good leaders, then they'll naturally take.
Prabhupāda: Our leaders must be very good.
Hari-śauri: That means we have to move into political circles (train starts moving) and do a lot of preaching on there.
Prabhupāda: If you work strictly on your principles, then everyone...
Rāmeśvara: In America there is a rule that there is separation of church and government.
Prabhupāda: It is not church.
Rāmeśvara: But they think of us...
Prabhupāda: Not stereotyped church.
Rāmeśvara: But they think of us as a religion.
Prabhupāda: They may think. It is not the fact. It is a culture.
Rāmeśvara: For example, this group, this new record, Golden Avatar record...
Prabhupāda: That may be for a certain class.
Rāmeśvara: It can become very popular, but if they find out it is Hare Kṛṣṇa, they will think it is religion and they will not buy it. But if we do not mention that it is Hare Kṛṣṇa right at the beginning...
Prabhupāda: Either you mention or not mention, unless they realize that it is good...
Rāmeśvara: Well, that they'll realize when they hear it. Just like our book distributors. They're not dressing as Hare Kṛṣṇa devotees; therefore they are successful. As soon as the people see that they are Hare Kṛṣṇa devotees, they do not want religion.
Prabhupāda: No... Suppose a military dress... Then there are different dresses. When it is understood properly, dress is immaterial. The military dress... Everyone knows that their business is to kill. That does not mean they are hated. Similarly, people see, and when they understand, then it comes.