Intelligent class of men (Conversations)

Expressions researched:
"intelligent class of man" |"intelligent class of men" |"intelligent class of people"

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk at Stow Lake -- March 27, 1968, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: Svanuṣṭhitasya dharmasya, everyone has got a specific duty. So one has to see that by his specific duty, entrusted with or discharging that duty, whether Kṛṣṇa is being satisfied. That's all. Therefore one has to accept a bona fide spiritual master to know whether Kṛṣṇa is being satisfied by his work. Who will certify? You cannot concoct, "Oh, I am doing for satisfaction of Kṛṣṇa." No, that is not possible. It must be accepted by the representative of Kṛṣṇa, "Yes, by your work, Kṛṣṇa is satisfied." Then it is all right. So... (break) Svanuṣṭhitasya dharmasya. In everything, Bhagavad-gītā and Śrīmad-Bhāgavata, just stick to these two books very nicely. Svanuṣṭhitasya dharmasya, saṁsiddhir hari-toṣaṇam (SB 1.2.13). It is a great science and very intricate also. But one has to learn also very diligently. Kṛṣṇa consciousness is not for the fools. It is not for the fools. Highly intelligent class of man, he can understand the philosophical aspect of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. But the thing is so attractive that even a child, even a fool is attracted. Yes. That is the beauty. Although it is very difficult to understand this philosophy, Caitanya Mahāprabhu has introduced the system that anyone can take it. Hare Kṛṣṇa.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Conversation with Prof. Kotovsky -- June 22, 1971, Moscow:

Prabhupāda: Varṇa, varṇāśrama. And in the Bhagavad-gītā—perhaps you have read Bhagavad-gītā—there is also the statement, cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ (BG 4.13). It is... This system is created originally by Viṣṇu. So as everything is creation of the Supreme, they cannot be changed. That is a prevalent everywhere, that a... Sun. Sun is creation of the Supreme. So sunshine is here in America, in Russia, in India—everywhere. Similarly, this varṇāśrama system is prevalent everywhere in some form or other. Just like the brāhmaṇas. The brāhmaṇas means the most intelligent class of men, brain, brain of the society. Then the kṣatriyas, the administrator class. Then the vaiśyas, the productive class, and the śūdras, the worker class. These four classes of men are everywhere present in different names. And because it is creation by the original creator, so it is prevalent everywhere, varṇāśrama-dharma. (break) So have you seen this little, how we are translating this? You can see little. Original śloka, its transliteration, then its English equivalent, then translation, then purport, each and every verse is being done like that, whole Bhāgavatam Purāṇa.

Conversation with Prof. Kotovsky -- June 22, 1971, Moscow:

Prof. Kotovsky: According to so many... You have just told that in any society there are four divisions, but the case is not so easy to distinguish. For instance, one can group, one can group, group together, different social classes and professional groups into four divisions in any society. There's no difficulty. Only difficulty, for instance, in socialist society of our country and a socialist society how can you distinguish productive group and workers?

Prabhupāda: Just like you belong to the intelligent class of men.

Prof. Kotovsky: Intelligent, yes, so...

Prabhupāda: So this is a division.

Prof. Kotovsky: Yes, intelligent class, for instance, brāhmaṇas, if you can put together also with intelligentsia under the brāhmaṇas...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Prof. Kotovsky: Then administrative staff...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Prof. Kotovsky: ...everywhere.

Prabhupāda: Kṣatriya.

Room Conversation with Dr. Karan Singh, -- November 25, 1971, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Caturthaḥ(?) platform. And that is possible by this Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Kṛṣṇa says,

māṁ ca (yo) 'vyabhicāreṇa

bhakti-yogena yaḥ sevate

sa guṇān samatītya etān

brahma-bhūyāya kalpate

(BG 14.26)

So two sides we are trying, to define the natural division of human society. The intelligent class, the administrator class, the productive class, and the worker class. There is natural division. You cannot say that everywhere simply there are intelligent class of men. No. Because we are infected with the three kinds of the material modes. You cannot expect all men are on the same level. That is not possible. Someone is in the modes of goodness, someone is in the modes of passion, someone is in the modes of ignorance, and someone is in the modes of mixture. That is the natural division—brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaisya, śūdra. Those who are purely in goodness, they are brāhmaṇa. Next to that, passion, kṣatriya. And next to that, vaiśya, mixture. And next to that, śūdra. And next to that, caṇḍāla.

Room Conversation with Dr. Karan Singh, -- November 25, 1971, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is purifying everyone. This bodily concept of life, "I am Indian," "I am American," "I am Hindu," "I am Muslim," they are forgetting. Just like in our society there are devotees from many religious sects, many countries, but they are nobody in that concept of life. They are purely thinking, "I am servant of Kṛṣṇa." This is bhakti. This is spiritual platform. So far the material platform is concerned, there is already division. An intelligent class of men, the administrator class. Just like not all everyone is interested taking part in administration. Just like we, at least myself, if you invite me to come to the administration, I will not be interested. We are interested in different thing. So similarly, naturally there is a division. The intelligent class of men, they like to study philosophy, they like to understand what is the ultimate goal of life, so many things. So intelligent class of men should be engaged in that business. They should not be dragged in other platform. And those who are inclined to take part in politics, administration, that class also should be trained how to rule over the country, how to make satisfied the citizens. They should be trained up, as in business people are trained up.

Room Conversation with Dr. Karan Singh, -- November 25, 1971, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: What do you mean by this first priority? That I want to know from you.

Dr. Singh: No, you were talking, Swamiji, about the unification of the world.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The world is going on. We simply say that you take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness and you will be happy. Happy in this life, happy in the next life. So you are going on in this way. "In this way" means either out of the four classes. You may name in a different way. I say brāhmaṇa class, you say intelligent class. Do you agree that in the world there is an intelligent class of men?

Dr. Singh: Yes, but they can also work.

Prabhupāda: Everyone is working.

Room Conversation with Dr. Karan Singh, -- November 25, 1971, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: But just like the brain says that "Here is an enemy," so hand immediately strikes. Brain gives direction that "Here is an enemy coming," and he strikes with his hand. This is kṣatriya. And the belly supplies food, vaiśya. And the legs, śūdra, carries. So there must be systematic division of the work. Everyone should work. The brain will work, the hand will work, the belly will work, the leg will work, but the direction should be from the brain. Therefore, first of all duty is there must be an intelligent class of men directing. Then the other direction will follow. If the duty of the intelligent class of men is taken by the foolish rascals, then how this work will go on? That is first reformation, that we should pick up the intelligent class of men of the world and they will direct. And next the administrator class. And next the productive class. So intelligent class means one who is Kṛṣṇa conscious, he is intelligent, actual. Just like in Bhagavad-gītā it is said, bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate (BG 7.19).

Room Conversation with Dr. Karan Singh, -- November 25, 1971, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: So this one stroke will clear everything. So my appeal to all intelligent class of men is come here, talk about this Kṛṣṇa consciousness philosophy and accept it and execute it. That is my appeal. All right, have some (indistinct). I think in 1925 I went to Kashmir.

Dr. Singh: Really. Before I was born, Swamiji.

Prabhupāda: What is your birthday?

Dr. Singh: '31, 1931.

Prabhupāda: And your father's?

Dr. Singh: My father must have been born in 1895. He passed away. My parents have passed away.

Prabhupāda: I was born in 1896.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Conversation with Author -- April 1, 1972, Sydney:

Author: Sir, when somebody joins your movement, when they first come to see your movement, what presents itself to them-men with shaven heads and saffron-colored robes who dance in the street and who sing songs, strange songs—these are strange aspects. And in themselves they are not especially significant to an understanding of the philosophy, are they?

Prabhupāda: No, this is... This chanting and dancing is for mass of people, but when you want to discuss philosophy, we have got volumes of books. Yes. Both things we have got. We are attracting both the intelligent class of men and the mass of people, even the children.

Author: Now, sir, I think you agree that when... If you agree that this is the first thing that people generally see of your movement, then surely, if I am to write a book in which I am to describe the movement, it is necessary for me to describe some of the...

Prabhupāda: But if he is actually, anyone wants to see, so he should see our books also, magazines also. Why does he not see? We, our, send our boys in the streets with books. If you are not liking this saffron dress and dancing, why don't you read the books?

Conversation with Author -- April 1, 1972, Sydney:

Devotee: Śrīla Prabhupāda? The temple is calling on the phone. They want to know if you are coming to that...

Prabhupāda: No. No. It is too late. Just like there is higher studies in science, in so many departments of knowledge. It is not that mass of people is interested in Ph.D. degree. But if one is interested in Ph.D. degree, therefore government provides him: "Yes, in university, you come." That is the real facility. So if anyone is interested to understand Kṛṣṇa consciousness, why it should be denied? Why this should be obstructed because I do not like it? In big, big universities, maybe in higher studies, there may be one student, and for that one student they are maintaining four professors. Each professor is paid two thousand dollars. Is it not a fact? What do you think, you professor. Is it not a fact? Some department of knowledge is maintained, even it is not paying. Is it not? There are so many departments simply for research work because the government knows it is important thing. It may not be for the mass of people, but at least one, two intelligent class of men, he pays, qualified: "Let them have this opportunity." So this is like that. Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is not for ordinary man, but it is very important movement. Those who are interested, why they should be denied? It should be maintained. We cannot expect everyone can give up all these bad habits, illicit sex, illicit meat-eating, or drink, or intoxication, gambling. That is not expected.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Garden Conversation with Mahadeva's Mother and Jesuit Priest -- July 25, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Just like naturally we have got division. The whole object is to keep the body fit, but there is division: the head division, the arm division, the stomach division, and the leg division. So similarly, there must be four classes of men in the society: the intelligent class of men, the administrator class of men, the productive class of men, and the laborer class of men. Everything is required. But not that the intelligent class of man has to learn the business of the laborer class of men. That is not required. Just try to understand. The laborer class of men, they are required. But one who is intelligent class, he, he cannot be trained up as laborer, ordinary laborer in the factory. That is mistake. He must work according to his capacity. If he's intelligent, he must be preacher, he must be God conscious. He would educate people that "This eating, sleeping is not all. There is God. You should understand. You have got a relationship with Him. If you want to have better life next, then you must become God conscious, you must be sinless." These things are required in the society.

Room Conversation with French Journalist and UNESCO Worker -- August 10, 1973, Paris:

Yogeśvara: How should society be organized in order to achieve these goals?

Prabhupāda: Yes. You organize that there should be division of different classes of men. The first class men, the second class men, the third class men, fourth class men. The first-class men means the most intelligent class of men. Second-class men means those who are dealing in politics. Third-class men means those who are dealing in economics, industry, trade. And fourth-class men means they have no intelligence to take up all these things, but they work only. But all of them should cooperate. For the general benefit of the whole human society. We have got engagement for the first-class men, second-class men, third-class men, fourth-class men. Just like we have got in our body the brain, the arms, the belly, and the legs. But all of them are cooperating for keeping the body fit. Similarly, the first-class, second-class, third-class, fourth-class men should cooperate for achieving the end, Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Room Conversation with French Journalist and UNESCO Worker -- August 10, 1973, Paris:

Yogeśvara: In that case, in which of these four divisions are we?

Prabhupāda: First-class. That is the beginning. But we go above the first-class. (break) Similarly, socially also, you must have four divisions. The reason is the material nature is working under three divisions, goodness, passion and ignorance. In our body also, the brain is working under goodness quality. The arm is working under the influence of passion. The belly is working in between passion and ignorance. And the leg is working under ignorance. Leg cannot work unless there is direction by the brain. At the present moment, the society's working under the influence of passion and ignorance. The brain is lacking now. Therefore we are creating Kṛṣṇa conscious men who has got real brain. Intelligent class of men. So other classes of men who are acting under influence of passion and ignorance, they should take direction from us. And for our directing business, we don't charge anything. And if they follow our direction, they have no loss.

Morning Walk -- December 4, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: ...one should come to the senses...

Prabhupāda: That is required.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: ...that they are suffering.

Prabhupāda: Not to speak like mad man. That you are scientists, you are, "We shall solve all the questions." This nonsense thing should stop. They should come to God and understand what God says. Then their life is successful. God Himself is speaking in the Bhagavad-gītā. Just try to understand. This is not meant for the dogs and cats; this is meant for persons like Arjuna. Because Bhagavad-gītā was taught to Arjuna—for enlightened, ah, topmost class of men. They'll understand. Imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ. Evaṁ paramparā prāptam (BG 4.2). So be yourself amongst the topmost intelligent class of men and try to understand Bhagavad-gītā. Then you'll be happy.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 3, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: ...is that nṛpa-liṅga-dharaṁ śūdram. The śūdras, fourth-class men, they are on the government executive. This is one defect. And another defect is ghnantaṁ go-mithunaṁ padā, maintaining large-scale slaughterhouse. These are the two defects of modern civilization. They..., on the top of government there are śūdras, not kṣatriyas. Neither they are guided by intelligent class, brāhmaṇas. Parīkṣit Mahārāja's first beginning is dvija-varya-śikṣayā. The guidance was first-class brāhmaṇas, and he was a kṣatriya, first-class. And there was no animal slaughterhouse. They are also suffering. They are bringing every day some problem. "What is the solution of this problem, what is this solution...?" But why the problems are coming? Because the defect is there that the, on the head of the government there are śūdras and they are busy in cow-killing, maintaining slaughterhouse. This is the defect. And they are not guided by the first-class, intelligent class of men.

Morning Walk -- March 12, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Everywhere you'll find this division, natural. One class of men, very intelligent. One class of men, very strong, good brain for management, administration. (aside) Jaya. One class of men, fit for tilling the ground, field, and produce food, take care of the cows. And the balance, śūdra. That's all. So in our society, this division should be there. The most intelligent class of men, they should be engaged in preaching, reading books and instructing, taking care of Deity worship, temple, and another class should be strong managers, that things are going on nicely. Everyone is engaged, not that eating and sleeping. Everyone must be engaged, employed.

Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: So according to our Vedic conception, the labor class man is supposed to be the fourth-class man. First-class man, intelligentsia, very intelligent, learned. Or intelligent—one who can understand up to God. To understand God requires great intelligence. So first intelligent class of men, up to, so they are called brāhmaṇa. The next intelligent class man, those who give protection to the society, kṣatriya. And the third class, those who produce food and distribute. They are third class. And other, all others, they are fourth class.

Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

C. Hennis: So it's the whole bovine race that's protected, and not just the cows themselves, not just the female cows?

Prabhupāda: No, both the male and female. The bullocks are used for so many other purposes. They can till the field. They can be used for transportation, so many other purposes. Or even we are spreading Kṛṣṇa consciousness. During Kṛṣṇa's time... Kṛṣṇa was born of a very well-to-do father, but at that time the bullocks were engaged for transportation from one village to another, one village to another. Or for carrying goods. Actually the United Nations should now think how the whole human society can live peacefully for a purpose of life, not whimsically, without any purpose of life. Now, anywhere... We are preaching. We are going everywhere. If I ask any gentleman, any philosopher, any scientist , if I ask him that "What is the purpose of life?" he cannot explain. That means there is lack of intelligent class of men. Nobody knows what is the purpose of life.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Dr. P. J. Saher: Do you mean the Kali-yuga exists all the time?

Prabhupāda: No. This is the period when foolish men have developed so many. Instead of making solution the fighting increasing. Because they have no standard knowledge. Therefore this Brahma-sūtra says that you should be eager to inquire about the Absolute Truth. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. Now the answer, next quote, is that Brahman, or the Absolute Truth is that from which, or from Whom, everything has come. Athāto brahma jijñāsā, janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1). Now you find out where is the... Everyone is trying to find out what is the ultimate cause. That should be the aim. That if you follow these philosophical quotes then your fighting will stop. You'll be sober. This verse also athāto jijñāsā. Athāto jijñāsā means to inquire about the Absolute Truth. Sit down, because there should be a class of men, very intelligent class of men in the society who are discussing about the Absolute Truth and they will inform others, "This is Absolute Truth, my dear friends, my dear..." Should do it like this. That is one thing. But here everyone is absolute truth. That is fighting.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Vedavyāsa: She says that we cannot have heaven on earth.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Vedavyāsa: We cannot have heaven on earth simply by our desiring it.

Prabhupāda: No. Just like there are intelligent class of men, they sit together. They do not fight. Still you can men... because the example is there. But that requires qualification. Therefore what is that qualification?

Satsvarūpa:

śamo damas tapaḥ śaucaṁ

kṣāntir ārjavam eva ca

jñānaṁ vijñānam āstikyaṁ

brahma-karma svabhāva-jam

(BG 18.42)

"Translation: Peacefulness, self-control, austerity, purity, calmness, honesty, wisdom, knowledge and religiousness. These are the qualities by which the brāhmaṇas work."

Prabhupāda: That is the qualities of the highest intelligent class of men. So if you do not find such qualities, how his knowledge should be perfect? These are the qualities.

Room Conversation with Scientists -- July 2, 1974, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: According to Vedic understanding there are seven kinds of mother: ādau mātā, real mother. Ādau mātā, guru patnī, the wife of guru, spiritual master. Ādau mātā, guru patnī, brāhmaṇī, the wife of a brāhmaṇa. Brāhmaṇa means the most intelligent class of men in the society. Who are brāhmaṇa, that is also mentioned there in the śāstra. So his wife. Ādau mātā, guru patnī... In general the understanding is, except your wife all woman is your mother. That is the instruction of Canakya Paṇḍita. Mātṛvat para-dāreṣu: "All women should be treated as mother." Para-dāreṣu. Para-dāra means others' wife. So every woman was married. It is compulsory. This is the Vedic system, that every woman must be married. It is the duty of the father to see the daughter is married, must be married. It is called kanyā-dāya. You cannot evade this responsibility. You must. The father's duty is, as soon as the girl is grown-up, immediately some boy must be found out and handed over: "My dear boy, I give you this girl in charity. You take care and give her protection." This is marriage. And he agrees, "Yes, I take charge of this girl." In our society, we get married.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Two Lawyers and Guest -- May 22, 1975, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: There are different platform: bodily concept of life, general, "I am this body. Therefore my business is to satisfy the senses." This is bodily concept of life. And others, they are thinking, "I am not this body. I am mind." So they are going on mental speculation like philosophers, thoughtful men. And above that, there is intelligent class of men, practicing some yoga. And spiritual platform means above that. First bodily concept, gross, then mental, then intellectual, then spiritual. So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is on the spiritual platform, above body, mind and intelligence. But actually, we should come to that platform. Because we are spirit soul, we are neither this body nor this mind nor this intelligence. So one who is on the platform of spiritual consciousness, they have got everything, intelligence, proper use of mind, proper use of the body.

Room Conversation with writer, Sandy Nixon -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia:

Sandy Nixon: Well, I think there's always been castes. It's just that we don't recognize the fact that they're there.

Prabhupāda: No, recognize means if a man is qualified medical man we accept him as medical man. And if a man is qualified engineer, we accept him as engineer. Similarly, Bhagavad-gītā suggests—not suggest, it is there—there are four classes of men, the most intelligent class of men, the administrator class of men, the productive class of men and ordinary worker. That is already there. Bhagavad-gītā says how they should be classified, that "He belongs to this class, he belongs to that class." That is described in the Bhagavad-gītā, not that by birth, hereditarily, one becomes a caste. You don't try to misunderstand. The classification is already there: one class of men, very intelligent. Is he not there in the human society? Do you think all men are equally intelligent? Do you think? There must be one class, very highly intelligent class. So what are the symptoms of the intelligent class? That is described in the Bhagavad-gītā.

Room Conversation with writer, Sandy Nixon -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prabhupāda: All over the world this is going on. This so-called democracy... Unless people are very much trained up, the election by the mass is not very good. Rather, a first-class men, they should nominate that "This man should be president." That will be nice. Your question was "How to find out president, good"? So this is the process. So there is no intelligent class of man. That is the difficulty. Who is trying to control his mind, control his senses? This is the first condition to become a first-class man. As soon as a man sees a beautiful woman, immediately his mind is agitated. Where is the control? And as soon as the mind is agitated, the senses are agitated. And this is the first condition of the first-class man, that he should not be agitated in his mind, and agitated by senses. This is the first condition. So where is that school who is training to, how to control the mind, how to control the senses, how to become truthful, how to become cleansed, internally, externally. These are the signs of first-class men. So we are trying our little bit to make some men as first class. This is our teeny effort.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Reporter -- June 3, 1976, Los Angeles:

Ambarīṣa: I just came from Vancouver from the Habitat Conference. The U.N. is having a Habitat Conference in Vancouver, and they (indistinct) is not united, their discussions and arguments. Sometimes there are walkouts, so many things, and they're not able to reach any conclusions, they can't agree with each other.

Prabhupāda: How they can? Do you mean to say dogs simply barking, they will come to a conclusion? (chuckles) It is not possible. There is no aim, what is the actual aim of life. So this is very important movement. At least the intelligent class of men, they must understand it thoroughly. Just like there is body. There are different parts, different sections of the body, but the most important section is the brain. Similarly, the important section of society means one who is fully in God consciousness.

Room Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Just like this university, they are serious for education, and they are ordering our books. Others may not order; they are not reading. That means they are not serious.

Richard: Only the people who are...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Knowledge is for the intelligent class of men.

Richard: But there are many types of knowledge, and there are many ranges, depths of knowledge.

Prabhupāda: So many types, this is also one type of knowledge.

Garden Conversation -- June 14, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Unless there is division of activity, nothing can be done perfectly well. The natural division is there in the body—the head, the arms, the belly and the legs. Similarly, in the social body also there must be the heads, the intelligent class of men, brāhmaṇa. Then everything will go on smoothly. And, at the present moment, there is no intelligent class of men. All laborer, worker class of men, fourth class. No first class, second class. Therefore society is in chaotic condition. There is no brain.

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: This would be the prescription for all people?

Prabhupāda: Everyone, for all people. There must be on the head the intelligent class of men who will give advice. Then next class, the... That is all given in the Bhagavad-gītā. Brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra. But when you become Kṛṣṇa conscious you can give up all these regulative principles directly. Therefore Kṛṣṇa, sarva-dharmān parityajya (BG 18.66). A brāhmaṇa-dharma, kṣatriya-dharma, or this dharma, that dharma, Hindu dharma, Mussulman dharma. If you have everything, simply... Because the ultimate aim of dharma is to come to Kṛṣṇa. "You directly come to Me; then everything is all right."

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So Kṛṣṇa says that, cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā, guṇa-karma... You pick up the quality of men and put them in the brahminical class, and then next, kṣatriya class, then vaiśya class, then śūdra class. But you cannot abolish that system. That is a false attempt. Because more or less, there will be a class of men who are truthful. You cannot abolish. More or less, there will be a class of men who are sinful. So as soon as you want to pick up from a family, then it is mistake, miscalculated. That caste system should be abolished. But real classification... Not caste. It is classification. Intelligent class of men, or truthful class of men, the fighter class of men, that will continue all over the world. You cannot abolish it. Even if you abolish caste system in India, you cannot abolish the class of truthful men. That is not possible. In spite of so much degradation, a class of men will remain truthful, a class of men will remain sinful. More or less. You cannot abolish this. So this is false attempt. And this caste system is also false. It is not based on the right description of caste system.

Evening Darsana -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: I'm very glad to see you.

Mrs. Furman: We saw you on television today. Did you see? Was it Channel Four? The news has been on, it's on again at eleven. Very nice.

Mr. Furman: It was a very good representation.

Prabhupāda: So it is not a sectarian religious sentimental movement. It is a movement for giving real education, knowledge, to the people all over the world without any discrimination. So at least those who are intelligent class of men, they should join and study this movement and try to broadcast for the good of the human society. The basic principles I have already explained.

Interview with Newsweek -- July 14, 1976, New York:

Interviewer: Do you think that some day the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement will spread to all the people in the world?

Prabhupāda: That is not possible. It is more for the most intelligent class of men. So it, this movement, is for the most intelligent class of men.

Interviewer: But amongst the most intelligent classes.

Prabhupāda: Unless one is intelligent class, belonging to the in..., he cannot understand. So we don't expect that everyone is intelligent. Kṛṣṇa ye bhaja se baḍa catura. Unless one is very intelligent, he cannot become Kṛṣṇa conscious, because it is a different subject matter. People are engrossed with the bodily concept of life. It is beyond that. So dull brain cannot understand what is beyond this body. So you cannot expect that everyone will understand Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is not possible.

Room Conversation with Dr. Theodore Kneupper -- November 6, 1976, Vrndavana:

Dr. Kneupper: Do you see as a... When you're describing that if the world were going to be God conscious, it would...

Prabhupāda: Everything will be solved.

Dr. Kneupper: But you were describing the caste system or the...

Prabhupāda: This is not caste system. It is natural. There is always an intelligent class of men in the society. So they should be, what is called, listed. They should be trained up properly.

Dr. Kneupper: How do you envision...? Would you envision...?

Prabhupāda: Just like you are a philosopher. So you should not make only theories, "perhaps." But actually, by your philosophy, you establish the existence of God. Then you are philosopher. Idaṁ hi puṁsas tapasaḥ śrutasya vā sviṣṭasya sūktasya... (SB 1.5.22). Find out this verse in the Bhāgavata. Avicyuto 'rthaḥ kavibhir nirūpito yad-uttamaśloka. If by your philosophical knowledge you prove, "Yes, there is God," then your philosophy study is perfect. And if you philosophize, "There is no God," that is useless waste of time.