Indirect (Conversations)

From Vaniquotes
Jump to: navigation, search

Conversations and Morning Walks

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk at Stow Lake -- March 27, 1968, San Francisco:

Devotee (2): What is the difference between an expansion and an incarnation?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Devotee (2): What is the difference between an expansion and an incarnation?

Prabhupāda: Expansion is direct, and incarnation is indirect. When expansion of expansion is accepted, that is called kalā, incarnation, avatāra, kalā. So Advaita is not direct. The example is given in Brahma-saṁhitā. Just like you get one candle kindled from the first candle, another from the second, another from the third. So similarly, either expansion or incarnation, they are all candles. The original candle is Kṛṣṇa. It is not that expansion of expansion is less powerful. The candle power is the same either origin or expansion or expansion of the expansion. It is not that Nityānanda is less powerful than Caitanya, or Advaita is less powerful than... No. Any incarnation or expansion has the same potency, Viṣṇu-tattva. The manifestation of potency is different.

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- April 11, 1969, New York:

Prabhupāda: Now if fountainhead of everything, then what the Absolute Truth's nature shall be like? That is explained in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. The first thing is that janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1). The factor, the Absolute Truth from which everything is emanating, so that emanation includes indirect and direct manifestation. What is that indirect and direct manifestation? The direct manifestation is the spiritual world and the indirect manifestation is this material world. Indirect manifestation means it is simply a shadow of the spiritual world. Just like in the Bible also it is said the man is made after God. So you have got two hands, one head, two leg. So the mental speculation is said that these devotees, they create God according to their own feature. Because I am two-handed, and therefore I create God with two hands, Kṛṣṇa. But actually, the fact is not that. Actually, because Kṛṣṇa has got two hands and we have got an imitation body of Kṛṣṇa, therefore we have got two hands. Because this is imitation.

Room Conversation -- May 10, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Prabhupāda: This is friendship. Then that friendship, when further developed, that is parenthood. Just like parents, they have no other consideration. They want to see, "How my child will be happy always?" And further development is conjugal love, just like man and woman, male and female, that love. That love includes everything—that appreciation of greatness, that servitude of service, the friendship, then maternal love, and further, offering everything for the lover. That is most perfectional stage of love. So in this way we have got five kinds of direct relationship, and there are seven kinds of indirect relationship. That is not on the platform of love. That is on the platform of enmity. Just like Kaṁsa. Kaṁsa was thinking of Kṛṣṇa as enemy, so he was also Kṛṣṇa conscious. He was thinking of how to kill Kṛṣṇa. So that is also Kṛṣṇa consciousness, but indirectly. So there are, indirect, seven rasas: ghastly, inimical, and sometimes seeing Kṛṣṇa, one laughs, derided... In so many ways there are many indirect...

Room Conversation -- May 10, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Prabhupāda: He was thinking of how to kill Kṛṣṇa. So that is also Kṛṣṇa consciousness, but indirectly. So there are, indirect, seven rasas: ghastly, inimical, and sometimes seeing Kṛṣṇa, one laughs, derided... In so many ways there are many indirect... Without relationship nobody can remain. The seven kinds of relationship are indirect. And five kinds of relationship is direct. So we want to be situated in the direct relationship.

Kīrtanānanda: All of the conditioned souls are in an indirect relationship.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Kīrtanānanda: Everyone is in a relationship.

Room Conversation -- May 10, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Prabhupāda: Yes. There must be some relation. Without relationship one cannot exist because he is part and parcel. Just like persons in the prison house. They are not out of government. There is relationship with the government, but that is indirect. The criminals, they do not appreciate the service of the government. Government is bothered about his existence. Some extra... Instead of receiving some service from him to the state, the state has got to spend unnecessarily for him. That is a botheration. So those who are in indirect relationship with Kṛṣṇa, they are botheration. They are simply giving trouble to Kṛṣṇa, but there is relationship.

Room Conversation -- May 10, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Hayagrīva: Is the humorous direct or indirect? One in humor?

Prabhupāda: Humor, humor is practically in every direct relationship. And indirect also, there is humor. "I am thinking of you as enemy"—that is also another type of humor. (Chuckles) Yes.

Pradyumna: Do the five direct rasas take place between jīva souls also when they are...

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- May 4, 1972, Mexico:

Prabhupāda: Yes, right. That's right. That is the fact. That is the fact. So despite my becoming a scientist, I am a subordinate scientist. Our, my scientific research is going on under the direction of Kṛṣṇa. Because the experiment which you are making in the laboratory, the ingredients, they are produced from Kṛṣṇa. The mind with which you are working, that is produced by Kṛṣṇa. The direction you are receiving from Kṛṣṇa. Therefore when you prepare something, that is Kṛṣṇa's production. Kṛṣṇa is indirect cause and you are direct cause. The other day while coming on the plane you told me that they are trying to make copy of the brain of...

Room Conversation -- May 4, 1972, Mexico:

Prabhupāda: You can know directly that "He is doing better than me." What is the difficulty? I can see... Just like all my disciples, they are following me. Why? Because they understand that "Our spiritual master explains about God better than us." Therefore they are surrendering. I am not bribing them. They are not fools. They have got very nice brain to act. So they accept me as the spiritual master brain because they understand it that "He can explain about God better than me." Where is the difficulty? These, all my disciples, surrenders unto me because they have found in me a better brain in explaining what is God. Direct perception. There is no question of indirect understanding. It is direct understanding. And the Vedas also advises that "Go to a better man," śrotriyaṁ brahma-niṣṭham (MU 1.2.12), "one who heard better and wise from the Vedic knowledge, and brahma, as a result of it he has become fully devoted to Kṛṣṇa,"

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with David Wynne, Sculptor -- July 9, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is also indirect praising. But you can praise Him directly.

Śyāmasundara: I think part of the trouble with our modern age is that no one has any information about God.

Prabhupāda: They do not know what is God.

Śyāmasundara: They can't praise Him directly because they don't know what He looks like or what He does. (Prabhupāda is still eating.)

Prabhupāda: What is this, behind the halavā?

Śrutakīrti: Behind it?

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- February 23, 1974, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Do you, do you mean to say that I was reading it indirectly?

Dr. Patel: No, no. Indirectly. It is indirect. The real Sanskrit is different. He will tell you. Any other language than Sanskrit...

Prabhupāda: No, no, no, there is no difference.

Dr. Patel: ...will not get that rasa.

Prabhupāda: There is no difference.

Dr. Patel: O rasa. Rasa nei hai

Prabhupāda: No, no, rasa... (Hindi)

Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: You haven't got to say. But because he hasn't got brain, because he is not guided by the brain, he will misspend and create disturbance in the society.

C. Hennis: Well, we try to look after that in an indirect way. We don't, as I said, we don't tell people how to spend their money. We don't tell them what to do in their free time. We do try to make sure that they have proper facilities for leisure, that they have proper opportunities, sportsgrounds, swimming pools and so forth, although that's not our primary concern. But what we do try to do, and this will interest you very much, we have a very big program concerned with worker's education. We endeavor to provide programs of education to the worker in teaching him how to understand the problems of modern industry, to understand the problems of management, the people on the other side of the table, of the bargaining table; to understand how to read a balance sheet, for example, in a company, or understand what are the problems that face the management as distinct from the workers in a firm; to understand of the basic rudiments of economics and finance and that kind of thing.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Two Lawyers and Guest -- May 22, 1975, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: No, not general people.

Guest 3: It's the indirect way because God wants people to be happy. Now, if you can help people, if you can help people as people, surely that means that you must be pleasing God.

Prabhupāda: No, first of all... Suppose you are a lawyer, and some man has committed murder, and he wants your help. And suppose by your legal tricks you save him. So that will not please God. (laughter)

Guest 3: You've got a different consideration here.

Guest 2: You've got a lot of places and names for that.

Room Conversation with writer, Sandy Nixon -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prabhupāda: That may not be māyā. That is my discretion. But that is also māyā in another way, indirect way. So one must be strong in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Then he is not a victim of māyā.

Devotee: Prabhupāda, on the news it's talking about the hook-up of the Soviets and Americans, in their (?) capsules. And a large hook-up of these space ships in outer space for planning their moon project. And we were wondering what your feelings are and your views are on all of this.

Prabhupāda: What is he wondering? You are making plans to go to back to home, back to Godhead, and if they go to the moon planet, so your plan is bigger or his plan is bigger? (laughter) Whose plan is bigger?

Morning Walk -- August 27, 1975, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes, it is.

Akṣayānanda: Indirect worship.

Prabhupāda: ...indirect worship, abiding. Just like you don't worship the government, revolt. But when you are put into jail you have to worship the government.

Akṣayānanda: We don't worship, yet we don't break the law.

Prabhupāda: You cannot break the law. Outside you break law. That you can do. But when you are put into jail, then you cannot. And jail means unless the government finds that you are now obedient to the government laws... (dog growling and barking)

Morning Walk -- September 3, 1975, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Then, immediately, he becomes friend. This is the way, going on. The whole arrangement is like that. So long we shall not surrender to Kṛṣṇa, we have to suffer so many ways, different species of life, different condition, different planets. This is going on. (break) ...indirectly forcing that "You be Kṛṣṇa conscious. Otherwise you'll be punished." Why police is so unkind? Because the indirect way is that "You become lawful; otherwise you'll continue to be suffering by us." So intelligent person thinks of it, and he becomes Kṛṣṇa conscious. And those who are rascals, fools, bewildered, they think, "We shall adjust it by manufacturing every year new type of motorcars."

Morning Walk -- October 19, 1975, Johannesburg:

Prabhupāda: The Indians are driven away.

Indian man (1): But there is a change at the moment. We are getting indirect representation in Parliament, and most probably in a matter of twenty, thirty years... (laughter) Promises.

Devotee (4): Sounds like the scientists.

Indian man (1): Live on a promise.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: If you're still alive then.

Indian man (1): Is that also effected through karma maybe, Swamiji?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 12, 1976, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: And then you become his śiṣya, that's all, indirect śiṣya. For the last two year I have been only reading all the great writings of Vaiṣṇava saints and Vaiṣṇava ācāryas because I read a lot of Śaṅkarācārya and others, and even, even post—what do you call—Buddhist philosophy, different lines, half a dozen of them. When I read the Vaiṣṇavas' teaching I think that.... Personally, you see, there are so many children, but your own son, you say, "This is my son." The personal relationship, when established, takes you far ahead psychologically. Am I right, sir? That is how personal God...

Prabhupāda: And if you take care of your own son, nobody will criticize you that "Why are you taking care of your own son, not others? Nobody will.... That is natural. That is explained in the Bhagavad.... Samo 'haṁ sarva-bhūteṣu

(BG 9.29). He is equal to everyone. But one who is a devotee, "I take special care."

Room Conversation -- January 16, 1976, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: That is.... A child can also do that. That is not expert. A child can advance in foolishness without any guidance. If the child touches fire and if somebody says, "This is advancement of knowledge," then imagine what is the position. Similarly, all these rascals, they are endeavoring. Just like Hiranyakasipu. He endeavored all through how to become immortal, which is impossible. But he advanced in that foolishness. Hiranyakasipu was such a big demon, his only idea was that "The devatās, they attack us sometimes. But now I shall attack them and plunder them. But because I am now practically immortal, what they will do? They cannot kill me. So I will go on with my demonic activities, and then they cannot do anything." This is his foolishness. He did not know that he's the greatest foolishness that he was trying to become immortal. When it was said by Brahmā that "No, no, it is not possible," still, he expected that "I shall become immortal." Brahmā flatly said, "No, no, this is not possible. I am not immortal. How can I give you immortality?" But he would not hear even Brahmā. He thought that, "In an indirect way I shall befool this man, Brahmā." "All right, sir, then give me this benediction."

Conversation with Clergymen -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:

Scheverman: So if I understand you correctly, you are saying utilize intelligence to correct the problem. Produce more food rather than worry about the fact.... So that the poor can have to eat and the animals can have. So your approach, then, is not one of direct assistance to the person who is starving or suffering, but rather indirect, utilizing intelligence to produce food.

Prabhupāda: Yes, and there will be no starvation.

Scheverman: It's an intellectual approach. I think our approach would be, we would be concerned with a person-to-person assistance. That is the way, our way, that Jesus has taught us. He said, "Feed the hungry and harbor the harborless and visit the imprisoned."

Room Conversation with U.N. Doctor -- September 29, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes, Upaniṣad is giving lesson, counter part of this material world. Because... Just like you are stressing on oṁkāra because you do not give much importance to Kṛṣṇa. In the material world, Kṛṣṇa, they think Kṛṣṇa is one of the historical persons. Avajānanti māṁ mūḍhā mānuṣīṁ tanum āśritam (BG 9.11). So Upaniṣad is teaching us in an indirect way about the importance of Kṛṣṇa. Upa-niṣat. To bring you nearby. Because you have got so many material conceptions, if we say that "Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality of Godhead," you may not like it. Therefore... Oṁkāra is Kṛṣṇa. So you are giving lesson on oṁkāra. Although Kṛṣṇa and oṁkāra is not different, but you'll not like Kṛṣṇa. In your present position you'll not like Kṛṣṇa's name.

Room Conversation with U.N. Doctor -- September 29, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: But because I do not like, therefore Upaniṣads give another chance, that "Chant oṁkāra." That is the way. Because unless one is completely purified, he cannot understand Kṛṣṇa.

yeṣāṁ tv anta-gataṁ pāpaṁ
janānāṁ puṇya-karmaṇām
te dvandva-moha-nirmuktā
bhajante māṁ dṛḍha-vratāḥ
(BG 7.28)

Kṛṣṇa bhajana is possible when one is completely free from all kinds of sinful activities. So not every one is freed from sinful activities. Therefore the indirect way. Otherwise, Upaniṣad is Veda.

Room Conversation with U.N. Doctor -- September 29, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Based. Kṛṣṇa says vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyam (BG 15.15). By studying Vedas, Upaniṣads, if you do not understand Kṛṣṇa, that means your study is not complete. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate (BG 7.19). After studying this indirect information of Kṛṣṇa, when one is actually a learned, wise man, he surrenders to Kṛṣṇa. Vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ (BG 7.19). That is very rarely found. This is fact. So if one is intelligent, that if only the most intelligent person, after many, many births one has to surrender to Kṛṣṇa, why not do it immediately? Why shall I wait for many, many births? That is intelligence.

Room Conversation with U.N. Doctor -- September 29, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the first instruction in the Bhagavad-gītā, that first of all, try to understand what is the person. So because we have no eyes to see, indirectly dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāram... (BG 2.13). Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). Antavanta ime dehā nityasyoktāḥ śarīriṇaḥ (BG 2.18). So many things. Nainaṁ dahati pāvakaḥ. So many indirect way because we cannot directly perceive.

Doctor: Nainaṁ chindanti śastrāṇi nainaṁ dahati pāvakaḥ (BG 2.23).

Prabhupāda: What is called? Definition by negation. Nainaṁ chindanti—negation. So that you can have some idea.

Room Conversation -- November 25, 1976, Vrndavana:

Hari-śauri: This style that they are doing now, they explain that they wanted that because then that way, they'll be able get them played on the radio. Otherwise they won't play bhajanas or anything on the radio. But there's a distinction between that kind of music and pure Kṛṣṇa consciousness music. Even though the words indicate Kṛṣṇa consciousness, most of the songs are written in such a way that it's indirect. It's not directly Kṛṣṇa.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: But you can't hear the words.

Prabhupāda: Yes, indirect.

Hari-śauri: They give this thing, "The caterpillar changed his mind," like that. It provokes some speculation.

Room Conversation -- November 25, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes, indirect.

Hari-śauri: They give this thing, "The caterpillar changed his mind," like that. It provokes some speculation.

Prabhupāda: No, indirect for gross outsiders, not for us. Therefore they should not be played in the temple. Gross outsider only.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: So, Prabhupāda, the New York temple has just produced a ballet on Rāmāyaṇa, and one boy, Vijayadeva, just came back and he brought a slideshow on that ballet.

Prabhupāda: Ballet?

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- February 14, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Yes. That will advertise us. Indirect profit.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah. So many people now are being forced to take our side and defend us. So many, all the intelligent people of the country, they are supporting us.

Prabhupāda: That is our profit.

Brahmānanda: Initially there was a big conference of all the lawyers and they were all indirectly supporting our position. They just wanted to advertise this big controversy. They say that this controversy is the most important issue of the 1970's. Just like in the 1960's, the Vietnam War was a big issue. So it's becoming very important.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa movement. So we have got very good certification by the psychiatrist of Calcutta University. You have seen it?

Room Conversation -- April 22, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: They did not accept. Therefore we see there is indirect indifference with our temple. Did you mark it? The high-class Hindus, they do not very much appreciate our...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Which one?

Prabhupāda: Our temples.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Our temples?

Prabhupāda: Because it is managed by the Americans. Yes.

Compiled byVisnu Murti + and RupaManjari +
Completed sectionsALL +
Date of first entryDecember 15, 0011 JL +
Date of last entryJanuary 15, 0012 JL +
Total quotes27 +
Total quotes by sectionBG: 0 +, SB: 0 +, CC: 0 +, OB: 0 +, Lec: 0 +, Conv: 27 + and Let: 0 +