Prabhupāda: Yasyāsti bhaktir bhagavaty akiñcanā (SB 5.18.12). Anyone who has unflinching devotional faith in God, he has all the good qualities. I've several times narrated the story of that hunter. He was animal killer and he used to enjoy by killing the animal half. But when he became a devotee, he was not prepared to kill even an ant. Who taught him? Nobody taught him but he was simply chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. That's all. So if you actually making progress in devotional service, you are constantly in touch with the purest. Kṛṣṇa is the purest. Bhagavad-gītā, it is said, paraṁ brahma paraṁ dhama pavitraṁ paramaṁ bhavān (BG 10.12). "You are the paraṁ brahma, Supreme Brahman." Brahman, every living entity is Brahman but He is paraṁ brahma, the leader of the Brahman.
Hunter (Conversations)
Conversations and Morning Walks
1969 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Hm. So engage all yourselves in the service of Kṛṣṇa. It is very pleasing, and what is called encouraging, enlivening. After too much material enjoyment, the next stage is frustration. That stage is coming to your country. Therefore the boys are becoming hippies. After too much material enjoyment, the next stage is—that is natural-frustration. There is a good example in our country, one Mr. C.R. Das. He was a great leader, next to Gandhi, important political leader. So he was on the topmost of... He was lawyer, barrister. He was earning fifty thousand dollars monthly, very rich man. And he was making charity, and he was spending like thing (anything). He was drunkard number one, woman-hunter number one, and everything. Because he had money he could enjoy everything.
Prabhupāda: Bilvamaṅgala Ṭhākura, in his previous life, he elevated himself to the loving stage of Kṛṣṇa. Not exactly, just previous, bhāva. It is called bhāva, ecstasy. But some way or other, he could not finish, so according to the instruction of Bhagavad-gītā, he was given birth to a nice brāhmaṇa family. (aside:) You can call that Bengali lady. She can hear. So very rich. Śucīnāṁ śrīmatāṁ gehe (BG 6.41), in that way. Rich family, at the same time, brāhmaṇa family. But richness, generally, sometimes glide down to wine, women, and intoxication. So by bad company he became woman-hunter, prostitute-hunter. So he was too much addicted to one woman, Cintāmaṇi. So his father died, and he was... He did not marry. In your country it is called girlfriend, and in our country it is called prostitute. So he was that about that prostitute, Cintāmaṇi.
1972 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is a woman-hunter. That is the highest pastimes of Kṛṣṇa, rāsa-līlā. But here if a man becomes woman-hunter, he will be most abominable person. That is the mistake of the people: they consider Kṛṣṇa as ordinary man. Avajānanti māṁ mūḍhā (BG 9.11). They are rascals, fools, mānuṣīṁ tanum āśritam. This sense has to be learned-Kṛṣṇa, how He is Absolute in all circumstance. Kṛṣṇa is teaching, "Just go and tell little lie to Droṇācārya." People will be surprised, how God is teaching somebody that "You go and tell this lie"? So they become bewildered. So one has to understand actually what is Kṛṣṇa's position in all circumstances. That requires intelligence. (aside:) What is this?
1974 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Same thing here even. Majority wants to be godless. So government is following that. Therefore they are against our movement. (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa, Jaya. Namaskāra. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Now the vox populi. Majority wants to become drunkards. "All right, it is legalized." Majority wants prostitute hunters. "All right. It is legalized." This is government. No consideration of morality or religion. Majority wants, it must be given.
Dr. Patel: No, but, I mean, it is all... It must fall. There is no culture. This is a total degeneration of the humanity at large.
Prabhupāda: Yes. They must suffer. And they're suffering. Still, they're blind.
Prabhupāda: All the leaders.
- piśācī paile yena mati-cchana haya
- māyār grasta jīvera se dāsa upajaya
(break) ...must have undergone severe austerities and penances and developed his spiritual consciousness. Then he can be priest. Not any man with a sacred thread and ganta, belling, becomes a priest. (break) ...priestly class, all rotten class. In Christian world also—drunkards, nonsense, woman-hunters, and they are priests. So also in India. Any man with a two paisa worth sacred thread, he becomes a brāhmaṇa and priest. How the people will be guided? The priest... The exact Sanskrit name is purohita, who can actually...
Prabhupāda: From the very beginning, stealing, and robbing. What is this picture? One horse without any...
Yogeśvara: I think it is the horse of the hunter.
Prabhupāda: Oh. Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Devotee: They're the knights that live in the mountains here. It's called Alpina, live in the Alps.
Prabhupāda: Ah. (break) ...spoken by Kṛṣṇa,
- annād bhavanti bhūtāni
- parjanyād anna-sambhavaḥ
- yajñād bhavati parjanyo
- yajñaḥ karma-samudbhavaḥ
- (BG 3.14)
Satsvarūpa: Prabhupāda, in the Kṛṣṇa Book, Kṛṣṇa Himself argues that you don't need... He argues at the time of the Indra sacrifice that you don't need yajña. The rain will come anyway. That's what they say nowadays.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So this is going on. That is condemned. One who is not God-conscious, one who does not know that he is not body, he is animal. That's all. Maybe in different dress, in different... So you have to set up real human society in a small scale so people will see, "Yes." Because man has got intelligence. Just like, although I am condemning the western mode of life, still, so many western young boys, they have come. I never came to speak to flatter you, that "Your western civilization is very nice." I never said that. Why you are coming? I never came to flatter you, neither I never came to say, "Yes, there is no God." I am speaking just opposite, everything opposite. "You are drunkard; no drink. You are illicit sex hunters; no illicit sex."
Prabhupāda: The animals... the snake also can enjoy music. Do you know that? You play very nice music. A snake will be charmed. He will stand. It will not attack you. Similarly the deers... The hunters, they play very nice music, and they assemble here, and they fight and kill them.
Nitāi: The birds are also making their music.
Prabhupāda: No. That is another thing. But these deer and the snakes, many animals, they are very much fond of music. They enjoy.
Prabhupāda: Although he did not mean Rāma, he condemned the boar as haram, condemned. But the...
Priest: Same story is said in the bhakti tradition of Maharastra of the hunter.
Prabhupāda: Yes, may be the same story.
Priest: Untouchable hunter who was chased by a boar and went to a tree, and then... It is a common story.
Prabhupāda: Anyway, we are recommending "Chant the holy name of God."
Prabhupāda: Yes. The mother becomes child and child becomes mother. That's all. Have you got transcription of the vyādha story?
Nitāi: The...?
Prabhupāda: Vyādha. The hunter, hunter story, recited by Caitanya Mahāprabhu?
Nitāi: Which...?
Prabhupāda: This twenty-fourth chapter, Madhya-līlā.
Nitāi: No, I don't think it's typed yet.
Prabhupāda: What you have typed? Bring. That is Nārada's instruction, how by killing, one becomes killed. That is there.
Yogeśvara: Oh, Mṛgāri, the hunter.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Yogeśvara: Mṛgāri.
Prabhupāda: Yes. If you... Mām... This meaning, the flesh, is Sanskrit word is māṁsa. Mām. Mām means "me." And sa means "he." "I am killing this animal. I am eating. And he'll kill me and eat." This word is reminding that "You are killing this animal, and eating. So this animal will kill you and eat you." This is the meaning of māṁ sa. Māṁ sa khādati iti māṁsa. "He'll be given the opportunity to kill you." And when the animal is sacrificed before the goddess Kālī, this mantra is cited to the ear of the animal that "You are giving your life before goddess Kālī. So next life you are getting the chance of human being."
Prabhupāda: No, that is very good remark, appreciated. Caitanya Mahāprabhu, He is known as patita-pāvana, the deliverer of the most fallen. Patita-pāvana-hetu tava avatāra: "My Lord, Your incarnation is for the reason to deliver all the fallen souls." So He gave one example by delivering Jagāi and Mādhāi, but by His grace, now thousands of Jagāi-Mādhāis are being delivered. He gave the example that here is the typical patita, fallen. So this movement will deliver this kind of people. That is His prediction. Or it... factually by this movement, so many Jagāi-Mādhāis are being delivered. Jagāi... What was their fault? The fault was they were number one woman hunter and all other good qualifications: (laughing) drunkard, meat-eaters and thieves, rogues. That is their qualification. And immediately Caitanya Mahāprabhu turned them to become Vaiṣṇava.
Prabhupāda: That is false. That I am saying. This is false responsibility. Actually you cannot become responsible. You have no power. Everyone is under the laws of nature. Just like some birds flying in the sky. The father, mother, and children, but nobody is responsible for anyone. When there is danger in the sky, you cannot give protection. Suppose one bird is hit, he is falling. The father, mother, and others, they cannot give any protection. He has to become responsible for himself. Just like the aeroplane. When the one plane is in danger, no other plane come and help it. Even if you see that the other plane is flying a few yards and if it is in fire, you cannot help. There is one nice story that one hunter was hunting birds and he spread his network. So when the children of the parent birds, they become victimized by the network. So when the parents came, they saw, "Oh, my children have been caught up by the net of the hunter."
Prabhupāda: Their center is sex—this sex or that sex or that sex, even ordinarily. In Paris, Paris you know it is a city of prostitutes. On the roads there are prostitutes. Where we have got our temple, so many prostitutes are standing. And those who are prostitute-hunter, they go to Paris. From our childhood I know about one family physician. We are at that time boy, 8 or 10 years old. He was talking with his another Muhammadan friend how he toured many countries and how many different types of prostitutes he tasted. This was his talk. So he was talking of Paris, "Though you are boy...," this we could understand." This is the talk. Old men, retired men, they will also talk of the sex (indistinct), and they will enjoy.
1975 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Do you see the result? Within four, five years how they have advanced. Not that they're Vedantists or they have studied all the Vedas, not that. Simple thing. Have you ever come here in the evening when they perform ārati, kīrtana? Just see how ecstatic it is. Simple thing. Don't commit sinful activities and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, bas. You'll become elevated. Jagāi, Mādhāi, they were—in those days, because they were drunkards, women hunters, meat-eaters—they were considered most sinful. So Caitanya Mahāprabhu delivered them by this process. There were two Jagāi and Mādhāi and now hundreds and thousands of Jagāis and Mādhāis are becoming purified. Pāpī-tāpī jata chilo, hari-nāme uddhārilo, tāra sākṣī jagāi mādhāi. Everyone wants evidence. Huh? Pāpī-tāpī, all sinful men were delivered simply by chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: (laughing lightly) You cannot say that I have introduced it. It is already there. As it is there in India, it is also everywhere. It may be under different names. The four classes are already there, everywhere. The... Even in Muslim, they have also got the (indistinct), what is called, mohallas, priestly class. They have got. We are introducing the systematic caste system, but caste system is already there, everywhere. Maybe under different names. And it is necessary. The caste system is there as a matter of necessity. You cannot abolish it. But it is now existing in a deformed manner. People should be systematic and organized. That we are trying to. Not that a new thing we are trying to introduce. It is already there. Our proposition is that "You priestly class, you must act exactly as a priest-ideal priest. You are a drunkard, you are woman-hunter, you are doing everything nonsense, and at the same time you are passing on as priest—this should be stopped."
Prabhupāda: We are helping. We are making them God conscious. Yes. That is best help. Instead of making them drunkard, woman-hunter, meat-eaters, we are making them Kṛṣṇa conscious. That is the best help.
Jesuit: And do they go out and make other disciples?
Śrutakīrti: He said do we go out and make other disciples.
Prabhupāda: No, we don't accept as disciple anyone who does not follow the rules and regulations.
Jesuit: Is it by prayer to God that you help the world?
Prabhupāda: No. It will not depend on opinion. Opinion... What is the value of opinion if the people are all asses? There is no opinion. One should take as it is enjoined in the śāstra. No opinion. What is the use of taking opinion of an ass? So the people are trained up just like dogs and asses, then what is the use of their opinion? If you are to enforce, you must do like this. Just like when we introduced this "No illicit sex." I never cared for their opinion. The opinion... immediately there will be discussion. And what is the use of taking their opinion? It must be done. That is the defect of Western civilization. Vox populi, taking opinion of the public. But what is the value of this public? Drunkards, smokers, meat-eaters, woman-hunters. What is the... they are not first-class men. So what is the use of such third-class, fourth-class men's opinion? We do not advocate such opinion. What Kṛṣṇa said, that is standard, that's all.
Director: Yes, but that is not what our function is. Everybody's in trouble. (laughter)
Prabhupāda: Physician, heal thyself. You see? They are also drunkards, they are also woman-hunters, meat-eaters, and gambling, that's all. They require to be rectified.
Director: But you can't help that. You have to go and change society, then society tells us to act differently.
Prabhupāda: No, no. Unless you change the society, how you can make social welfare? If you keep them as it is, then where is the question of welfare?
Director: Give it a different interpretation to the word.
Prabhupāda: Inter... how the? I don't...
Prabhupāda: Yes. Kṛṣṇa wants to enjoy to kill the demons. In the Kṛṣṇaloka there is no demons. He doesn't get that opportunity. Therefore He comes down to enjoy killing. Just like hunter, by killing, enjoys, so Kṛṣṇa enjoys by killing the demons. (break) Water?
Brahmānanda: Water core. (break)
Prabhupāda: ...no rose here? We don't see any rose.
Kuruśreṣṭha: They don't like to grow nice things for fear someone will take them.
Bahulavana: There's a big rose garden by the museum.
Prabhupāda: No, you can... Just like they are reforming. Their forefathers were drunkards, woman-hunters, (laughter) and they are reformed, the great-grandchildren. And we old men, we cannot do that.
Dr. Patel: I talk of MacCauley...
Prabhupāda: MacCauley may mislead you. Why you should believe?
Dr. Patel: He misled our forefathers.
Prabhupāda: No, why you should be misled?
Dr. Patel: Now we are going to lead them. Are you not leading them?
Prabhupāda: Srnghadi?
Devotee (1): Śrīnati.
Prabhupāda: Śrīnati.(?) From his face it appears that he's woman hunter. Did he talk with you?
Devotee (1): Yes.
Prabhupāda: So in every center they must rise early in the morning. They must follow the regulative principles. They must attend class. Otherwise let them go out. We don't want. And if anyone wants to marry, first of all he must show that he has some earning capacity. Not that "Because there are so many girls, and I marry one to satisfy my senses..." I thought that boy was nice, and I heard all these stories.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That disease... Brahma... Lord Śiva also, he was attracted to the Mohinī. So they are īśvara. They are controllers. So the instruction is that even such personalities may be sexually attracted, so how much we shall remain careful. This is the instruction. (break) ...like the other rascal. Who was saying that "Kṛṣṇa was killed by a hunter; therefore hunter is greater than Kṛṣṇa"?
Indian man: Raja Gopalācārya, he has written in Mahābhārata that Kṛṣṇa was killed by a hunter.
Prabhupāda: Therefore the hunter is...
1976 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Hm ?
Jayapatākā: So gṛhastha life is Kṛṣṇa allowing us to steal kṣīrā?
Prabhupāda: Hm? Yes, kṣīrā-cora. The prostitute-hunter is hīrā-cora, and he's a kṣīrā-cora. That's all.
Hari-śauri: (break) ...sense gratification that comes from renouncing like that, that's like the Māyāvādīs.
Prabhupāda: Eh? Eh?
Hari-śauri: By artificial renouncing everything, they're actually simply another form of sense gratification.
Prabhupāda: That is recommended everywhere. Illicit or legal.... Mahāprabhu has said, asat eka strī-saṅgī: "Anyone who is attached to woman, he is asat." Bas. This is the whole process, how to become detached from the attraction of woman, dhīra. (break) Give up the connection with woman is recommended. So in our society it will be a good test. We are mixed up with men and women. If you in spite of this allurement, if you do not become attracted by woman, then you should know you are paramahaṁsa. Yes. You are worshipable. And this Bhāgavata-dharma is meant for the paramahaṁsas. Paramo nirmatsarāṇām (SB 1.1.2). It is especially. Dharmaḥ projjhita. The other different types of regulated system, to become very religious man or to become very expert money-hunter or accumulation of money, dharma, artha, and enjoying sense enjoyment—the whole world is appreciating these men, who is a religious man, who is very much able to satisfy his senses, dozens of cars and three dozen women, naked dance.
Prabhupāda: So why don't you, if you are actually serious, why don't you make propaganda in the country that "Please do not give vote to the rogues." Don't mention any party. "If you want to be happy, then don't give vote to the rogues." And who is a rogue? The illicit sex hunters, the intoxicants, and the meat-eaters, and the gamblers. These are rogues.
Dr. Patel: They are all there in Delhi.
Prabhupāda: No, no, you don't mention any. (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. Thank you very much. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Hare Kṛṣṇa. So it is impartial. And actually, if they test that "Whether this man I am voting, he is free from all these sinful activities?" Then, you see, the whole face of the Indian government will change.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Because your..., you cannot... Just like our Alfred Ford, he never saw Henry Ford. Then why he says that "I'm the great-grandson of Mr. Ford"? Ford is not there. But why he's claiming Ford's property? Where is Ford? The great-grandson is not expected to see the original establisher of the family. But if there is no philosophy, how they can, any philosophers, all meat-eaters, drunkards, (laughs) woman hunters, and they can be philosophers. (laughs) They're dogs, simply barking. That's all. Simply dogs.
Devotee (1): They say that our philosophy is nice if we can get everyone to follow it, but we will never...
Prabhupāda: Guṇa. You are most qualified man. You may be a drunkard, you may be a prostitute hunter, whatever you may be, but because of money you are a qualified man. Then?
Pradyumna: Janmācāra-guṇodayaḥ.
Prabhupāda: Go on.
Pradyumna: Dharma-nyāya-vyavasthāyāṁ kāraṇaṁ balam eva hi.
Prabhupāda: Modern yogic society. "Transcendental Meditation." Whatever nonsense they like, they do. In the Bhagavad-gītā it is stated that yogis should sit down in a secluded, sacred place, and they are seeking after America's big, big cities. Hmm? They find out yogic class in America's big, big cities, hotels. This is their program. The prescription is that one should sit down in a solitary sacred place, alone, and these rascals are holding class. All smokers, drunkard, woman-hunters, (laughs) they are yogis. Hmm? What do you think? Is it all right? This is going on. And they are accepted, "Yogi this," "Yogi that." This is going on. In India they cannot find out because people are not so fool as yet that in big, big cities, in a big, big hotel, "yoga practice." India, although so fallen, they will not accept.
Prabhupāda: Another Godbrother used to say Muragī Mission, Chicken Mission. (laughter) He was so much against this Ramakrishna Mission and Vivekananda, so much. He knew all history of Ramakrishna. He became impotent. He was woman-hunter and therefore uneducated. In the village he was simply hunting after this low-class woman. Therefore his brother got him married. When he was married he was impotent. So therefore he planned, "Oh, I see everyone mother. You are my mother." And people said, "Oh, he's so realized that even his wife is his mother." Rascal. Where is that another person in the Vedic culture, Vyāsadeva, or, they are also married, who has called his wife mother?
Hari-śauri: Memorial of Theodore Roosevelt.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: This man Theodore Roosevelt, he was one of the presidents. He was a big hunter, he used to kill animals. And in front it says that he was famous for being a natural conservationist, protecting nature.
Prabhupāda: By killing.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There's a big planetarium here also at this museum.
Rāmeśvara: Biggest in the world, I think.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, this planetarium is the most famous one, Heydn Planetarium.
Prabhupāda: So see how the planetarium is done.
Prabhupāda: Don't say "no." But give a taste for the good, then it will be automatically "no." And if you say "no" then he'll, they will rebel. The four "no's," that is very difficult. Still they are breaking. No illicit sex, they are breaking. But if they develop Kṛṣṇa consciousness, this will be automatically "no." So don't bring many "no's," but give them positive life. Then it will be automatically "no." And if you say "no," that will be a struggle. This is the psychology. Positive engagement is devotional service. So if they are attracted by devotional service, other things will be automatically "no." Paraṁ dṛṣṭvā nivartate. Just like Ekādaśī day. Ekādaśī day, we observe fasting. And there are many patients in the hospital, they are also fasting. But they'll "No, no." They'll, within heart, "If I get, I shall eat, I shall eat." But those who are devotee, they voluntarily "no." The same fasting is going on for the devotees and the hospital patient. And that "no" and this "no," there is difference. Paraṁ dṛṣṭvā nivartate (BG 2.59). It is not meant for the mass of people, but at least if we keep a section of people ideal to the human society, they will be guided. At the present moment, there is no ideal section. Everyone is rascal, demons, rogues, everything. There is no ideal character. All politicians, scientists, leaders, they are all drunkards and woman-hunters.
Prabhupāda: But not that willfully do something wrong. There is punishment. If one unconsciously, without any knowledge, does something wrong, that is excused. But they do willfully. They know it is wrong, still they do it. That is punished. Knowingly. Caitanya Mahāprabhu personally said, asat eka strī-saṅgī. Those who are habituated to illicit sex are punishable. Asat. It is very, very bad. And still if somebody does like that, he is punished. This is going on. "All right." Here illicit sex... The bābājīs, I heard, they say, "What is the wrong there? It is love." They say like that. They take it as love. "Gopī's love," they say. "Gopī's used to do that, used to have illicit mixing, intermingling with Kṛṣṇa. What is wrong?" They'll say. They get support from Kṛṣṇa līlā. Such rogues they are. Sahajiyās. There are many so-called gentlemen, they write books on Kṛṣṇa līlā, paint picture." This is very nice. Kṛṣṇa is advocating illicit intermingling." They take it as support of their sinful activities. I have seen personally. Anyone who is a woman-hunter, he's being addressed by his friend, "Oh, you are like Kṛṣṇa."
Prabhupāda: Where is that President? They're all drunkards, woman-hunters, meat-eaters. Exactly according to prediction, he became a young man and he was entrusted the kingdom, "Now you rule." (chants verse)
- tataḥ parīkṣid dvija-varya-śikṣayā
- mahīṁ mahā-bhāgavataḥ śaśāsa ha
- yathā hi sūtyām abhijāta-kovidāḥ
- samādiśan vipra mahad-guṇas tathā
- Each verse is a song. I wanted our students should do that.
Hari-śauri: To learn how to sing them nicely. To learn how to sing them?
Prabhupāda: Yes. I can give them the tune. (chants first line of another verse) (break) ...ghnantaṁ go-mithunaṁ padā. This is Kali-yuga's king. Nṛpa-liṅga. Dressed like king. Nṛpa-liṅga-dharam, but śūdra. Nṛpa-liṅga-dharaṁ śūdraṁ ghnantaṁ go-mithunaṁ padā. Very expert in cow-killing.
Prabhupāda: ...devotion, activities. Who can take more care than the father and the mother? So you combine together, make a batch of good character, ideal character in the whole world. There is no ideal character. Everyone is drunkard and meat-eater or woman-hunter. What is the civilization? Hog civilization. (break) ...civilization. Work hard, get some money, and spend it for intoxication, illicit sex. This is civilization. Is it not? They have no idea how to make civilized.
Devotee (1): I was hearing that before I left England there was some trouble in Scotland over the rules about the bars and drinking. And now they want to make a rule, a law, that the children can be allowed into the bars under their parents... They make it a big social...
1977 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Yes. "Why it is happening? Why we have given everything. Our father, mother, our home, our comforts, our ideas, stereotyped, our religion, culture—everything we have given up. So don't you see the power of chanting? You may think it is bad, but see the power. Similarly, these diseased person, if they chant, it has got power to bring him in the normal condition. The power is there. It is already proved. You say it is brainwash, but the power is there. Reaction is there. That's a fact. You are admitting. So now, whether this reaction is good or bad, that you cannot judge because you are bad. But impersonally, if you judge, you see how the power is, that we were drunkards, we were woman-hunter, we were meat-eaters—we have given up. You cannot give up even smoking cigarette.
Prabhupāda: Somebody asked him?
Rāmeśvara: That's a question I meant to ask, because that question will start coming up in America. They will say, "Kṛṣṇa is an ordinary man. He was killed by some hunter."
Prabhupāda: So what do you answer?
Rāmeśvara: We haven't been asked yet. The answer is very difficult to explain to them.
Prabhupāda: Yesterday I was answering. You were not present?
Rāmeśvara: No. (aside:) Were you here?
Prabhupāda: Yes. That will guide the whole nation. The rascals, anyway, the naked and prostitute-hunter, what they can do? These third-class, fourth-class, tenth-class men are being elected. There is no happiness. There is no solution of problems. All tenth-class men. I directly challenged one gentleman that "You are all tenth-class men." Pāpa... Pāpa...
Hari-śauri: That man in Perth.
Prabhupāda: "There is no first-class man now governing the situation. All fourth class, fifth class, tenth class. There is no first-class man." I challenged him.
Prabhupāda: People misunderstand this Kṛṣṇa's behavior with Rādhārāṇī and the gopīs as ordinary woman-hunters.
Guest (2): No, no.
Prabhupāda: You say no, but they take it like that. Even a person like Vivekananda, he said long ago that "This Vaiṣṇavism is sex religion." They misunderstand. So just try to understand. This līlā is kept in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam in the Tenth Canto, and middle of Tenth Canto, Thirty-fourth, Thirty-fifth Chapter. So one has to understand Kṛṣṇa first of all. So it is not for ordinary men. So we discourage these things to be discussed or presented even for ordinary men. This is our preaching. It cannot be taken as ordinary film show.
Prabhupāda: Take prasāda. Generally... Of course, I do not know what you have done. Generally they present rasa-līlā. They describe rasa-līlā. These professional Bhāgavata means they immediately begin to recite rasa-līlā. Bhāgavata reading dissertation means rasa-līlā. And people take in a different way, that "Kṛṣṇa was woman-hunter. He married sixteen thousand wives, and He had three hundred thousand gopīs, and He was enjoying with woman. Just see." I saw one doctor. He was a debauch. He was Muhammadan. So his friend came. So... In Calcutta. So he was addressing, kibava Kṛṣṇa.(?) Just see. Kṛṣṇa means debauch.
Prabhupāda: No, no, you don't mean, but people have taken like that. Anyone who is woman-hunter, he is Kṛṣṇa. This is going on.
Guest (2): Therefore, Guruji, we have started...
Guest (1): This is the spiritual way we have started.
Guest (2): Spiritual way, we started from that Vṛndāvana, with this Kṛṣṇa... Ātmā, Paramātmā (Oriya) Here to start. Then we'll go to that...
Prabhupāda: No, no. Why you start from this? Why not start Kṛṣṇa's birth, Kṛṣṇa's playing with cowherd boys, Kṛṣṇa's...?
Prabhupāda: ...in a different style. (break) ...money. These rascals are also after woman and money, in a different style. Asat eka strī-saṅgī. Caitanya Mahāprabhu immediately rejects him, that "He's a rascal. He's after women." Immediately. Asat strī-saṅgī. Two kinds of rascals—nondevotee of Kṛṣṇa and woman-hunter—reject immediately. That is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's... The sannyāsa life is... What is that? Cent percent, no connection with woman. That is sannyāsa. What we have renounced? We have renounced... We are using the motorcar, we are using this machine, we are eating, we are sleeping in nice room—what is the renouncement? Only renouncement is no connection with woman. That is the real platform of renouncement. If one can renounce woman's connection, then he's liberated man. That is very, very difficult. (break) Except myself, they go for woman and money, that's all, in foreign countries. This is the position.
Prabhupāda: No, you are advertising, "Ramakrishna Avatara." "Bhagavan Ramakrishna." "Bhagavan Ramakrishna." Everyone is God—then why you are after God? You remain. You are servant of your wife, your prostitute. Then you are also devotee because everyone is God. A prostitute-hunter is also devotee because he's devoted to the prostitute and prostitute is God. Then why you search out another God? Hm? Everyone is God. Why you search out another God? Why you bring Ramakrishna God? Better remain satisfied with your prostitute, your dog. (pause-talking in background) That Dr. Sharma has given very good (indistinct)?
Prabhupāda: (laughs) No, it is not blaming, it is fact. It is the real understanding. Without evidence, without proof, how law can be established? That's a good method. So he is speaking like lawyer, that "You want evidence, you want witness: see here." Tāra sākṣī jagāi mādhāi. So that is five hundred years ago. Now in our Hare Kṛṣṇa movement you see practically. Drunkards, illicit sex-hunters, and so on, so on, they have become saintly persons. This is the effect of it. So... And Kṛṣṇa also says, māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ (BG 9.32). It doesn't matter. Pāpa-yoni. According to our Vedic system, low-class, those who are born in low-grade family, they are called pāpa-yoni. Brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra, lower than that—śūdrādhaḥ. Kirāta-hūṇāndhra-pulinda-pulkaśā ābhīra-śumbhā yavanāḥ khasādayaḥ (SB 2.4.18). They are called pāpa-yoni, untouchables. Of course, nowadays these things cannot go on. But these are there.
Prabhupāda: You must be drunkard, you must be woman-hunter, and you must be intoxicated. And that is not... A meat-eater. That is the whole world, going on. Not only in this planet, in upper planets. I have discussed this point in Bhāgavata. The modern economics, earning money very cheaply, has forced men to become drunkard, woman-hunters and meat-eater. But what he'll do with the money? He has no higher idea. You must utilize the money which you have got so cheaply. And in the Western countries, if you have a little business plan, you can sell any damn nonsense things and get money. Is it not? Huh?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He converted that hunter, Mṛgāri. He was killing, but then he would not trample even on one ant.
Prabhupāda: So that is being done now. So he has to judge from this intelligence. We do not maintain any political view, what American government or Indian government... We want the whole people of the world, let them become human being. That is our movement. What is this? Simply killing business is going on. All governments should cooperate, pushing on this movement for humanity's sake.
| Page Title: | Hunter (Conversations) |
| Compiler: | Visnu Murti, RupaManjari |
| Created: | 27 of Mar, 2012 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=47, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 47 |