Divisions of human society (Conv and Letters)

Expressions researched:
"division of human society" |"division of society" |"divisions of human society" |"divisions of society"

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

According to Vedic culture there are four divisions of human society. Brahmacārī, student life; then householder, gṛhastha; and then vānaprastha, retired life; and then sannyāsa life, means preaching transcendental knowledge to the society from door to door.

Radio Interview -- March 12, 1968, San Francisco:

Interviewer: No, about the way your clothes, the way you're dressed today. Uh, the robes.

Prabhupāda: Oh, the robe? Yes, I am a sannyāsī. The sannyāsī is the highest status of human social division. According to Vedic culture there are four divisions of human society. Brahmacārī, student life; then householder, gṛhastha; and then vānaprastha, retired life; and then sannyāsa life, means preaching transcendental knowledge to the society from door to door. So this dress... In Vedic culture, there are different dresses for different persons. So this saffron colored dress means that he is admitted without any introduction anywhere because he's understood to be a man of transcendental knowledge. And the householders receive them and take knowledge from them. That is the system of Vedic culture.

There are four divisions of society. The brahmacārī is strictly forbidden for sex life. The vānaprastha, they are also forbidden for sex life, and the sannyāsī, they are also forbidden for sex life. So out of four divisions, three divisions are strictly forbidden for sex life. Only the householders they can have restricted sex life with married wife simply for begetting children.

Radio Interview -- March 12, 1968, San Francisco:

Interviewer: The swami... Now did I understand you to say the swami has no sex life?

Prabhupāda: No, certainly not.

Interviewer: Certainly not. All right, now when you...

Prabhupāda: Well, actually sex life is allowed only to the householders. According to Vedic culture, sex life is restricted. There are four divisions of society. The brahmacārī is strictly forbidden for sex life. The vānaprastha, they are also forbidden for sex life, and the sannyāsī, they are also forbidden for sex life. So out of four divisions, three divisions are strictly forbidden for sex life. Only the householders they can have restricted sex life with married wife simply for begetting children. That is the Vedic culture.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

We are trying, to define the natural division of human society. The intelligent class, the administrator class, the productive class, and the worker class. There is natural division.

Room Conversation with Dr. Karan Singh, -- November 25, 1971, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: So two sides we are trying, to define the natural division of human society. The intelligent class, the administrator class, the productive class, and the worker class. There is natural division. You cannot say that everywhere simply there are intelligent class of men. No. Because we are infected with the three kinds of the material modes. You cannot expect all men are on the same level. That is not possible. Someone is in the modes of goodness, someone is in the modes of passion, someone is in the modes of ignorance, and someone is in the modes of mixture. That is the natural division—brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaisya, śūdra. Those who are purely in goodness, they are brāhmaṇa. Next to that, passion, kṣatriya. And next to that, vaiśya, mixture. And next to that, śūdra. And next to that, caṇḍāla.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Just like by nature there are four division in the body—the brain, the arm, the belly, and..., all of them required... You cannot reject any one of them. Then it is not fullness. But the brain should be the, I mean to say, prime director, managing director.

Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Yogeśvara:

cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ

guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ

tasya kartāram api māṁ

viddhy akartāram avyayam

(BG 4.13)

"According to the three modes of material nature and the work ascribed to them, the four divisions of human society were created by Me." (translates)

Prabhupāda: Just like by nature there are four division in the body—the brain, the arm, the belly, and..., all of them required... You cannot reject any one of them. Then it is not fullness. But the brain should be the, I mean to say, prime director, managing director. So the qualification of brāhmaṇas are stated. Śamo damas titikṣā? Eh? So at the present moment the society has no brain because there is no person, no person who is qualified like that, samo damas titikṣā.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Yes, Kṛṣṇa created these four division, brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra, but He does not belong to any one of them. He is neither brāhmaṇa nor kṣatriya nor vaiśya nor śūdra. He is transcendental.

Room Conversation with Dr. John Mize -- June 23, 1975, Los Angeles:

Jayatīrtha: 4.13.

cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ

guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ

tasya kartāram api māṁ

viddhy akartāram avyayam

(BG 4.13)

"According to the three modes of material nature and the work ascribed to them, the four divisions of human society were created by Me. And, although I am the creator of this system, you should know that I am yet the non-doer, being unchangeable."

Prabhupāda: Yes, Kṛṣṇa created these four division, brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra, but He does not belong to any one of them. He is neither brāhmaṇa nor kṣatriya nor vaiśya nor śūdra. He is transcendental. Similarly, our philosophy—just to make the human society very peaceful and making progress we wish to establish this system. A first-class man, group of men, brāhmaṇas, they will guide the kṣatriyas, and the kṣatriyas, the administrators, they will guide the vaiśya. Vaiśya means agriculture and cow protection and trade. And śūdra means those who are neither brāhmaṇa nor kṣatriya nor vaiśyas. They are simply worker, assistant. So there must be division like this. The brāhmaṇas should guide the kṣatriyas, and the kṣatriyas will administer the state, and the vaiśyas will produce foodstuff, and śūdras will help. Cooperation for common benefit. But the aim is spiritual realization. That is perfect society.

This division of society, that the whole human society, it should be recruited and trained up... Then society will be all right. Otherwise not.

Morning Walk -- October 19, 1975, Johannesburg:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But we find śūdras even amongst the European class here, even though they are in the governing position.

Prabhupāda: No, we are not speaking "Europeans, Americans, Indians." We are speaking "human being." We never say... Bhagavad-gītā never says that the Europeans should be the first-class men and Indian should be the last... It never says. That is training. Just like engineering college. The European also can become engineer, and the Indian also can become engineer. There is no discrimination. Similarly, this division of society, that the whole human society, it should be recruited and trained up... Then society will be all right. Otherwise not.

This division of society is meant for the saṁsārī, to control division of labor. Everything is for the saṁsārī. It is not meant for the paramahaṁsa. Paramahaṁsa-saṁhitā is Bhāgavata. This is ABC. These people, they do not understand even the ABC. This is the difficulty. They cannot learn even the ABCD of spiritual knowledge.

Morning Walk -- December 18, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. So many gurus required. Āmāra ajñāya guru haya tāra ei deśa, wherever you are living, you just try to deliver your family, your neighborhood, your friends. Deliver, tāra. Tāra means deliver. "How can I do it? I am not a guru; I am a common..." "No. You have to become a guru." "How?" Yāre dekha tāre kaha 'kṛṣṇa-upadeśa': (CC Madhya 7.128) simply repeat the instruction given by Kṛṣṇa. Then you will become guru.

Dr. Patel: But for the saṁsārīs, sir...

Prabhupāda: Saṁsārīs, (indistinct) for the saṁsārīs. When Kṛṣṇa says, annād bhavanti bhūtāni (BG 3.14), this is for saṁsārīs. Saintly person doesn't require anna. It is meant for the saṁsārī. Annād bhavanti bhūtāni. Catur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭam: (BG 4.13) This division of society is meant for the saṁsārī, to control division of labor. Everything is for the saṁsārī. It is not meant for the paramahaṁsa. Paramahaṁsa-saṁhitā is Bhāgavata. This is ABC. These people, they do not understand even the ABC. This is the difficulty. They cannot learn even the ABCD of spiritual knowledge.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Bhagavad-gītā is there, the four divisions of human society, brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra. So each one's duty is prescribed. Brāhmaṇa's duty, kṣatriya's duty, vaiśya's duty, śūdra's duty, brahmacārī's duty, everything is there.

Evening Darsana -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Guest (3): Whether a man should be a shopkeeper or a teacher or a carpenter, the Bible won't tell me that, and the Bhagavad-gītā won't tell me that.

Prabhupāda: Bhagavad-gītā is there, the four divisions of human society, brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra. So each one's duty is prescribed. Brāhmaṇa's duty, kṣatriya's duty, vaiśya's duty, śūdra's duty, brahmacārī's duty, everything is there.

Guest (3): But then you said before that if I think I'm brahmacārī, then I should be a brahmacārī. If I become a śūdra, I act as a śūdra.

Prabhupāda: Yes, you act as a brahmacārī, do your brahmacārī work, you'll be successful.

Guest (3): But how do I know that I am thinking properly?

Prabhupāda: Therefore I say it is mentioned in the śāstra, brahmacārī guru-kule vasan dānto guror hitam (SB 7.12.1). If you want to be a lawyer, you must know the law. Without knowing the law, how you become a lawyer? Without knowing the engineering art, how you become engineer? So either you become a brahmacārī, gṛhastha or vānaprastha, sannyāsī, or anything, you must know what you are meant for. Without knowing, how you can become brahmacārī?

Guest (3): I must know what I am meant for.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest (3): But that's what my question is, how does one know.

Prabhupāda: Then you have to go to the... Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). Just like we were discussing Sanātana Gosvāmī, he has gone to Caitanya Mahāprabhu, he said, "Sir, You have brought me from the entanglement of family life. Now tell me what is my duty." So that discussion is going on. So you should approach guru and take instruction from him what is, how to act. If you want to act as a brahmacārī, he'll give you direction, "You do this." If you want to act as a gṛhastha, he'll give you direction, "You do like this." That is wanted. The guru, the parents, the government, they should guide.

The Vedic society was divided into different sections. That is called varṇāśrama-four varṇas, four āśramas. That is very scientific. Brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra and brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha and sannyāsa. So Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement includes this system of division of society.

Interview with Trans-India Magazine -- July 17, 1976, New York:

Interviewer: Yesterday in my talks with your disciples I gathered that you have at least three of the āśrama-dharmas in practice: brahmacarya, gṛhastha, and sannyāsa. Did you do this to suggest that your movement does not involve renunciation in the Western sense, in which they understand it, asceticism only, to retreat, to withdraw from society, to form a different, small spiritual community or fraternity, not interacting with the rest of society, not influencing society, not being influenced by society? In other words, was it your aim to suggest that the daily life of ordinary people can be built on the foundations of your philosophy?

Prabhupāda: The thing is that human life, the system of society should be divided... Just like you are journalist, so you are not motor mechanics. But there is necessity of motor mechanics also and the journalist also. Is it not?

Interviewer: Yes.

Prabhupāda: And you are journalist, you are not expected to become a motor mechanic or a medical man. But your function is also required in the society. Similarly, the Vedic society was divided into different sections. That is called varṇāśrama-four varṇas, four āśramas. That is very scientific. Brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra and brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha and sannyāsa. So Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement includes this system of division of society. It is perfect society. Therefore we are trying to introduce the varṇāśrama system, although it is very difficult nowadays. But if one becomes a devotee, which is above varṇāśrama-dharma, then the purpose is solved. In this age, although varṇāśrama-dharma is very scientific, and Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement includes this, but we are mostly trying to get to the topmost part of varṇāśrama, sannyāsa, or above that. That means Vaiṣṇava. In the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, sa guṇān samatītyaitān brahma-bhūyāya kalpate (BG 14.26). One can immediately transcend the jurisdiction of three modes of material nature if he engages himself in the devotional service of the Lord.

1947 to 1965 Correspondence

By the modes of nature different persons are imbued with different qualities and the scientific way of division of human society, from the qualitative aspect, by the caste system is quite natural. But the basic principle of such caste system is to serve the plan of Godhead and by doing so the four orders of caste system make a headway by the co-operative method.

Letter to Sardar Patel -- Calcutta 28 February, 1949:

4. The fourth item is to organize the much discussed caste system as a solution of natural division of the human beings all over the world. Nationalistic division of human races is artificial but scientific division of the caste system as envisaged in the Bhagavad-gita is natural. We shall have to pick up brahmanas and others not only from the Indian people but from the peoples of all over the world. The vitiated caste system of present India is never sanctioned by the scriptures. But the caste system is made by God according to quality and work of the subject and it was never designed for the benefit of accidental birth right. Thus whatever is made by God cannot be destroyed by man. Destruction of the caste system as contemplated by some exponents, is therefore out of question. By the modes of nature different persons are imbued with different qualities and the scientific way of division of human society, from the qualitative aspect, by the caste system is quite natural. But the basic principle of such caste system is to serve the plan of Godhead and by doing so the four orders of caste system make a headway by the co-operative method. When such spiritual progress is definitely made, the materialistic progress is automatically effected as a matter of course. That makes a real classless society.

1970 Correspondence

So Narada Muni says that men should be judged by his tendencies, not by his birth, and this is also confirmed in Bhagavad-gita by Lord Krishna that the four divisions of human society should be judged by the qualities in actual work.

Letter to Janardana -- Los Angeles 16 January, 1970:

So Narada Muni says that men should be judged by his tendencies, not by his birth, and this is also confirmed in Bhagavad-gita by Lord Krishna that the four divisions of human society should be judged by the qualities in actual work. Therefore with reference to all Vedic Scriptures our members are all Brahmanas and therefore we offer them the sacred thread although they are born, according to Vedic culture, in the families of other than Brahmanas or even than the Sudras. But that does not mean they cannot be purified. Actually they are being trained in such a way, their hearts are being purified by chanting the Mahamantra. And after some days when the Spiritual Master sees that one has followed the regulative principles faithfully and has abstained himself from the restricted items like illicit sex life, etc. and has chanted regularly 16 rounds then say after a year or six months when he appears to be purified in the judgment of the Spiritual Master he is offered the sacred thread, and he is given the chance of Deity worship in the Temple.

Actually Krsna does not say that caste is determined according to species, but according to the quality of work the divisions of society are made. Narada says one must be judged according to his qualification, even if he is in a different class or species, still he should be accepted according to the qualities which he exhibits i.e., brahmana, etc.

Letter to Acyutananda -- Bombay 14 November, 1970:

Actually one who takes to chanting Hare Krsna Mantra offenselessly immediately becomes situated transcendentally and therefore he has no need of being initiated with sacred thread, but Guru Maharaja introduced this sacred thread because a Vaisnava was being mistaken as belonging to the material caste. To accept a Vaisnava in material caste system is hellish consideration (naraki buddhi). Therefore, to save the general populace from being offender to a Vaisnava, He persistently introduced this sacred thread ceremony and we must follow His footsteps.

Regarding Dr. Sen's grandson's theory of species, if they are species—the species horse is a kind of species; it draws a cart. The ass is another kind of species; he carries load. So ass is never engaged for drawing a cart. If brahmanas are a species and vaisya and sudra are other species, why do we see that sometimes a "brahmana" does a sudra's work? We have got many negro disciples and they are worshiping the Deity; so why they should not worship the Deity? Krsna says He accepts the service even from the papayoni, those who have taken impious births.

Actually Krsna does not say that caste is determined according to species, but according to the quality of work the divisions of society are made. Narada says one must be judged according to his qualification, even if he is in a different class or species, still he should be accepted according to the qualities which he exhibits i.e., brahmana, etc. Sridhara Swami says birth is not so much important as quality. (You have very wrongly remembered something about Sridhara Swami's view.) In Srimad-Bhagavatam it is said that if one is Vaisnava, immediately he becomes qualified for executing Vedic rites. About this verse, Srila Jiva Goswami remarks that the brahmana awaits the sacred thread ceremony, but a Vaisnava is qualified to execute the Vedic rites without waiting for the sacred ceremony.

1974 Correspondence

There must be a division according to quality and work. At the present moment, so many so-called educated persons are unemployed because the division of work is neglected. If this division of society is maintained no one will be unemployed and there will be no unrest in society. It is a very scientific way of keeping peace in the world.

Letter to Tarun Kanti Ghosh Babu -- New Delhi 11 March, 1974:

So in the beginning if we start a varnasrama college to teach internationally students from all over the world to learn to be educated as brahmanas, as Ksatriyas, as vaisyas, as sudras, by quality and work, that will be the basic principle of Krishna Consciousness. It is the duty of the government to see that everyone is employed. This is only possible when varnasrama is established. At the present moment everyone is sudra. This is not very good for the human society. Everyone has a right to approach the Supreme Personality of Godhead but there must be a process for keeping the society in order. The intelligent class of men or the brahmanas, the martial class of men, the ksatriyas, the productive class of men, the vaisyas, and the working class of men, the sudras, all have the right to chant the Hare Krishna Mantra and by such devotional service everyone will be elevated to the transcendental platform. But there must be a division according to quality and work. At the present moment, so many so-called educated persons are unemployed because the division of work is neglected. If this division of society is maintained no one will be unemployed and there will be no unrest in society. It is a very scientific way of keeping peace in the world.

The brahmana class should be highly cultured in spiritual understanding; by their Vedic knowledge they will be able to educate the ksatriya and the vaisya in the value of life. It is the government's duty that according the division of human society everyone should be engaged in responsible duties.

Letter to Tarun Kanti Ghosh Babu -- New Delhi 11 March, 1974:

The brahmana class should be highly cultured in spiritual understanding; by their Vedic knowledge they will be able to educate the ksatriya and the vaisya in the value of life. It is the government's duty that according the division of human society everyone should be engaged in responsible duties. On the whole, at the present moment, there is not guidance from the authorized intellectual class. Therefore everyone is in darkness. The Krishna Consciousness movement is supposed to create actual intellectuals to guide society. The process if very simple.

If you kindly consider on this point and the varnasrama college is started, I am sure the chaotic condition of human society will be completely settled up. You think over this matter and we shall talk more when we meet again. Or if you like to discuss seriously by correspondence with me I shall be very glad to reply to you point by point on the basis of sastra.

Now that we are more and more trying to implement the varnasrama divisions of society, we should not think that everyone has to become a brahmana. For example you are developing a farm there; so those who work the farm do not necessarily have to be a brahmana if they are not inclined to the brahminical standards.

Letter to Sudama -- Rome 26 May, 1974:

Based on their declarations of sincerely following all the prescribed Vaisnava regulations for one year, and on your recommendation, I have accepted Jagat Prabhu das, Praghosa das, Kanva das and Nitai Gauracandra das for second initiation and I have enclosed sacred thread and gayatri. You were present in Hawaii when I was there and was particularly stressing that the presidents must be very careful on recommending gayatri initiation. After all, we are criticizing false cast brahmanas, if we ourselves are bogus brahmanas then our position is very bad. Now that we are more and more trying to implement the varnasrama divisions of society, we should not think that everyone has to become a brahmana. For example you are developing a farm there; so those who work the farm do not necessarily have to be a brahmana if they are not inclined to the brahminical standards. In this way, be careful about awarding the second initiation.

1977 Correspondence

Religion is not a kind of faith, but it is a prescribed form of duty to be discharged by the respective divisions of human society, ultimately rising to the platform of Krsna consciousness or God consciousness.

Letter to Inquirer -- Boston Unknown Date:

This process of elevating oneself from different platforms of understanding to the highest status of life is called religion. According to the Sanskrit language, religion is not a kind of faith, but it is a prescribed form of duty to be discharged by the respective divisions of human society, ultimately rising to the platform of Krsna consciousness or God consciousness. The first-class religion, therefore, is that which teaches love of God because religion means to understand one's position in relationship with God.