Correct (Conv. 1968 - 1975)

Prabhupāda: Why do you say karma-yoga? Where you get this?

Guest (1): "Whatever you do." "Whatever you do." It is not written that you should do the aṣṭāṅga-yoga.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no. We are discussing this verse. He said that "Anyone who is always think..." Karma-yogi also always thinks of Kṛṣṇa. That's all right. That is not denied. But the highest principle is always keeping Kṛṣṇa within his mind. Premāñjana-cchurita... That is confirmed in the Brahma-saṁhitā. Premāñjana-cchurita-bhakti-vilocanena santaḥ sadaiva hṛdayeṣu vilokayanti (Bs. 5.38). This kind of practice of yoga can be done by an unalloyed devotee. Premāñjana-cchurita, by developing the dormant love of God. That is... That is the highest perfection. And another thing is, you are accepting mind as ātmā, are you not? That's not correct. Mind is not ātmā.

Guest (1): No, no, mind is not ātmā. No. The ātmā and mind, they come together, each other come. When your mind does not go from here to there...

Prabhupāda: Yes, mind fixed up in ātmā. That's nice. But mind is not ātmā.

Guest (1): Very correct. To understand Him is a lot.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is liberation. Janma karma me divyam yo janati tattvataḥ (BG 4.9). To understand Kṛṣṇa... Nobody can understand Kṛṣṇa, but still, to such an extent, if one can understand Him, then he immediately becomes liberated. Immediately. And not to speak of developing his love of Kṛṣṇa, simply by knowledge, by real knowledge, if one understands Kṛṣṇa, that is sufficient to make him liberated. And those who are devotees, for them liberation is very insignificant. Muktir mukulitāñjaliḥ sevate 'sman.

Guest (1): On the first day of this inauguration, and there were definitions about karma-yoga.

Prabhupāda: Oh, the governor. (laughter) Just see. He is speaking of karma-yoga. Slaughtering ten thousand cows, that is karma-yoga. This nonsense speaking of karma-yoga.

Prabhupāda: Oh, the governor. (laughter) Just see. He is speaking of karma-yoga. Slaughtering ten thousand cows, that is karma-yoga. This nonsense speaking of karma-yoga.

Guest (1): So actually I shall present...

Prabhupāda: The governor became little perturbed. He wanted to go immediately. You were present? And when the other men began to speak all hodgepodge...

Guest (1): I like your one sentence that day. Whatever is according to the śāstras, that is correct. I agree to it. Nobody says that.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is a fact.

Guest (1): That's a fact.

Prabhupāda: Karma done does not mean that you manufacture something and it becomes a karma.

Guest (1): It is written, whatever, in śāstras.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- January 17, 1971, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: No, they automatically come back because he is hankering after varieties. So that variety is not there, so he is attracted again in the material world. Just like so many sannyāsīs. Take Vivekananda. He wanted to lecture on Vedānta, which is liberation. He came again back to the hospitalizing and philanthropic work because he could not find the variety of pleasure in Vedānta. Of course, he was not very much advanced. There are many. There is a... Sannyāsī is here. he's a Kārpātrī. He is very learned and other... He was formerly speaking on Vedānta and other... Now he is in politics and cow protection. You see? There are many.

Revatīnandana: I have a hazy memory that one time I heard that when a soul, when it finally does enter into brahma-jyotir, that he has to remain there for some long duration of time, a daytime of Brahmā or a lifetime of Brahmā. Is that correct? What is that duration?

Prabhupāda: Not that. That is not like that.

Revatīnandana: Not like that. Thank you.

Prabhupāda: But he feels inconvenience without varieties of life. The Bhāgavata says, tvayy asta-bhāvād aviśuddha-buddhayaḥ: "Their intelligence is not clean." Arūhya kṛcchreṇa paraṁ padaṁ tataḥ: (SB 10.2.32) "Although they rise up to the brahma-jyotir," patanty adho tataḥ, "they again come back."

Haṁsadūta: And the nirvāṇa conception of life is just before Brahman?

Prabhupāda: Nirvāṇa conception is marginal position between brahma-jyotir and this material world.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Prabhupāda: That is another thing, who is higher authority. That you have to search out. That you have to search out.

Guest (1): We must understand what is higher person and what is lower and whether Buddha is correct or not.

Prabhupāda: Now, higher authority... Suppose we accept Kṛṣṇa as the higher authority. Our, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, we accept Kṛṣṇa as the higher authority.

Guest (1): It is accepting.

Prabhupāda: Whatever it may be, we accept Kṛṣṇa as the higher authority. Do you accept that?

Guest (1): I mean, I am shown the form. You see...

Prabhupāda: There is no question of shown. Kṛṣṇa is accepted higher authority not only by us by big ācāryas like Śaṅkarācārya, Rāmānujācārya, Madhvācārya, those who are guiding our Vedic life in India, Caitanya. So Kṛṣṇa is accepted the highest authority. (break) Kṛṣṇa in the Bhagavad-gītā says, mattaḥ parataraṁ nāsti: "There is no more higher authority than Me." Then, if you don't accept Kṛṣṇa as the higher authority, that is your business, but we accept Kṛṣṇa as the higher authority.

Discussion with Indians -- January 18, 1971, Allahabad:

Guest (2): Swamiji, by declaring other interpretation as nonsense...

Prabhupāda: Yes! You cannot interpret! First of all if you cannot interpret. First of all my proposal, that you cannot interpret.

Guest (2): We'll come to that, that you are not interpreting correctly, does not make me correct. I must be correct also to...

Prabhupāda: I am correct so long I present the correct thing, so long I am... If I present Kṛṣṇa as it is, then I am correct.

Guest (2): My solution, Swamiji, most respectfully, is how do you judge that "I am correct"?

Prabhupāda: Because I am presenting what Kṛṣṇa says. First of all you answer this: what is correct, the standard of correctness? You cannot create correctness. When Kṛṣṇa says this, man-manā bhava mad-bhaktaḥ: "You just surrender unto Me; become My bhakta," how you can say, "It is not to Kṛṣṇa." This is not nonsense? If I say, "Give me a glass of..." Hear me. If I say, "Give me a glass of water," if you say, "It is not to Swamiji," is that interpretation?

Discussion with Indians -- January 18, 1971, Allahabad:

Guest (2): Ahaṅkāra

Guest (1): Now, that is one thing that is there in all scriptures. The Gītā also says that kāma, krodha, lobha, moha, ahaṅkāra must be checked. Now, if we move with that pride and arrogance that "We are the only correct calling. This is the only correct path," and that "You have to surrender from the beginning," now that only aggravates the pride in a person.

Prabhupāda: Then what can I do? Kṛṣṇa says... If you talk, two, I cannot answer. You talk with me, one.

Guest (2): No, we have talked with reasoning.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Don't talk, two. I cannot answer with all these reasons. Either you talk or then let him talk.

Guest (2): I am talking. I am talking now.

Prabhupāda: Then you talk. Let him talk.

Guest (2): So we have to tear all these vices that are connected with our body. That is our purpose of getting into either bhakti, or nāma, bhāgavata or whatever it may be.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Discussion with Indians -- January 18, 1971, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: Now, you are not authority.

Guest (2): I am not but my own...

Prabhupāda: I am following so many authorities. Then... Then there is no question.

Guest (2): I am only...

Prabhupāda: You are yourself authority. Now, if you say my views are not correct, I may be incorrect but I am following the predecessor. I am taking...

Guest (2): What is the difference there? Sir, I accept that.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest (2): Hundred per cent, you are very correct in saying what you have just said.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Discussion with Indians -- January 18, 1971, Allahabad:

Guest (3): That is the correct position.

Prabhupāda: That is correct position. But if you find that "Swamiji is not on the standard," that means you are not in the posit..., sama-darśinaḥ even.

Guest (3): You mean if a person commits a murder, a sinner...

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is very high stage. That is very high stage, sama-darśinaḥ.

Guest (3): No, no. If a person commits a murder, you are seeing...

Prabhupāda: So why you see, you are seeing, "Commits murder?" Why don't you see that it is Kṛṣṇa is acting there? Why you say that "commits murder?"

Guest (2): Kṛṣṇa is getting the sin committed.

Prabhupāda: Sama-darśinaḥ means you have no distinction what is sin and what is...

Guest (1): Sama-darśinaḥ means to treat everyone as equal.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no. Sama darśinaḥ means there is no distinction between sin and virtue. That is sama-darśinaḥ. As soon as you see, "This is virtue, and this is sin," it is not sama-darśinaḥ.

Discussion with Indians -- January 18, 1971, Allahabad:

Haṁsadūta: That is submission. That is inquiry and submission, that the master is there and you say, "All right, I accept you as my master and I want to follow your instruction." And then in the end, when you have done the work, then you can say, "Oh, this master, yes, he is correct," or "No, he's a fool."

Guest (6): You have caught up only one śloka.

Haṁsadūta: There is no other way. It is not possible. Every śloka in the Bhagavad-gītā is as good as any other śloka because it is absolute.

Guest (6): Let me say, tell you what submissive word means in relation of Gītā.

Haṁsadūta: Yes, the perfect example given by Arjuna, the perfect disciple, is "Now I am confused about duty..."

Guest (7): ...more than you or I.

Haṁsadūta: Arjuna says to Kṛṣṇa... Arjuna says to Kṛṣṇa... What does he say?

Prabhupāda: No, no, no. First let me know whether you want to submit or not?

Guest (8): I do!

Prabhupāda: First of all answer this question, whether you want to submit or not.

Conversation with Prof. Kotovsky -- June 22, 1971, Moscow:

Guest: Yes, one must try to realize it...

Prabhupāda: Yes, that... That... One Dr. Ghosh, professor of medical college, Lal Mohan Ghosh, he... I was medically connected in my previous life. So that Lal Mohan Ghosh analyzed it, and, it is his statement, it is full of, I mean to say, antiseptic properties. So Vedic statements, even sometimes you find it is contradictory, but if you analyze scrutinizingly, you find it is correct.

Prof. Kotovsky: But maybe...

Prabhupāda: There may be some exceptions, but, I mean to say, just like the cow dung is stool—this is an exception—but why this exception is accepted, that if you scientifically examine, analyze, you find it is correct?

Prof. Kotovsky: That is due to analyze. That's right. That's from common sense point of view.

Prabhupāda: Similarly, another, another instance is there. Just like conchshell. Conchshell is the bone of an animal. So according to Vedic instruction, if you touch the bone of an animal, you become impure. You have to take bath. You become impure. But this conchshell is kept in the deity room because it's accepted as pure by the Vedas. So my point is that we accept Vedic laws in such a way, without argument, accept because it is stated in the Vedas, and that is the principle followed by scholars. If you can substantiate your statement by quoting from the Vedas, then it is accepted. You do not require to substantiate in other ways if you prove by Vedic quotation. Śruti-pramāṇa. It is called śruti-pramāṇa. There are different kinds of pramāṇa, evidences. Just like in the legal court if you can give quotation from the law books, your statement is accepted, similarly, all statements which you give, if they are supported by śruti-pramāṇa... I think you know. The Vedas are known as Śrutis.

Conversation with Prof. Kotovsky -- June 22, 1971, Moscow:

Guest: But today, I think, the scientific knowledge people will not accept all this, what you are saying only. They would perhaps like to try it once more, and perhaps, after going through the process of examination of theirs, they accept it if it is true.

Prof. Kotovsky: Yes, well correct. As I have already said our approach, the approach of people today, new era of knowledge everywhere in the world...

Guest: Try once more.

Prof. Kotovsky: Try once more. You are right. And also nobody would believe in anything without argument.

Prabhupāda: No, arguments are allowed.

Prof. Kotovsky: Yes, arguments. Nobody would believe because it was written in this or other script. Evidence, evidence and evidence has to be given to believe. And may I put one question to you? Have you many branches of your society everywhere?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Conversation with Prof. Kotovsky -- June 22, 1971, Moscow:

Prof. Kotovsky: But if you would, will have many, even many followers, how far this adaption of Kṛṣṇa consciousness by many American boys would affect the politics of their attitude, for instance, to such a bearing problem of America as Vietnam War?

Guest: Correct. They'll never be the one who will ever advocate any war because they know this war itself is a wrong thing.

Prabhupāda: No, no. We don't say, "Avoid war." But unnecessary war is avoided. Just like Kṛṣṇa induced Arjuna to fight. It was necessary. It was necessary.

Guest: To get rid of extra evil.

Prabhupāda: It was necessary. So nothing is avoided, but everything is utilized for proper purpose. Nothing is rejected. Nirbandhe kṛṣṇa-sambandhe. This is fact, that Kṛṣṇa never advocated that "Let there be stop of war." No. When there is necessity, absolute necessity, there may be war but for their good purpose, not by the whims of the politicians, no.

Prof. Kotovsky: Hm hm. That's right. So...

Prabhupāda: So if you can arrange some program, it is all right. There are... It is all right.

Television Interview -- July 29, 1971, Gainesville:

Prabhupāda: Yes. The disciplic succession is coming from Kṛṣṇa since 5,000 years.

Interviewer: Is your spiritual master still alive?

Prabhupāda: No. He has passed away in 1936.

Interviewer: So you are at this particular time then the head in the world of this movement? Would that be correct?

Prabhupāda: I have got many other Godbrothers, but I was particularly ordered to do this from the very beginning. So I am trying to please my spiritual master. That's all.

Interviewer: Now you were sent to this country, to the United States of America. This is your territory. Is that correct?

Prabhupāda: Hm. No. My territory, what he said, that "You go and speak this philosophy to the English knowing public."

Interviewer: To the English speaking world.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And especially the Western world. Yes. He told me like that.

Television Interview -- July 29, 1971, Gainesville:

Prabhupāda: Not this part. Every part. Every part of the world, practically everyone... There is very little interest in God. They have more interest in dog.

Interviewer: You are in general, then, trying to increase the interest in God. Is that correct?

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the only interest we must have in human life.

Interviewer: And you are not particularly interested in what particular name this God has.

Prabhupāda: No. Our purpose, mission, is that people may become God conscious. And the process is in this age by chanting the holy name of God. If you have got any name for God which is actually name of God, then you'll be successful by chanting that name.

Interviewer: The chanting of Kṛṣṇa's name, the Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, seems to play a very important role in the profession of your religious belief. Right? In fact, I think I will ask you and some of your followers who are sitting here with us tonight a little bit later to chant the name of Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Television Interview -- July 29, 1971, Gainesville:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Interviewer: That probably would be a proper ending to this particular program. However, I'm still wondering, you know, about some of the aspects. In reading a little bit... I have not read much, of course, but in reading a little bit about your beliefs and your writings, your magazines, your publications...

Prabhupāda: I may correct here that it is not my belief.

Interviewer: Well, as you interpret it in your writings. Let me put it that way. It seems to me, sir, that there is a very high emphasis placed on the relationship between the individual and God.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.

Interviewer: Much more so than upon the...

Prabhupāda: That is for everyone.

Interviewer: Yes but more emphasis on that relationship than on the relationship between one individual and another individual. Am I right in that?

Prabhupāda: No. We have to establish first of all our lost relationship with God. You see? Then we can understand what is the relationship between one individual to another. If the central point is missing, then there is practically no relationship. Just like you are American. Another is American. Both of you, you feel American nationally because the center is America. So unless you understand God, you cannot understand what I am, neither I can understand what you are. So we have to first of all reestablish our lost relationship with God; then we can establish, talk of universal brotherhood. Otherwise there will be discrimination. Just like in your country, or any country, the national... National means a man born in that land. Is it not? But they do not take the animals as national. Why they have no right to become national? That is imperfect knowledge. There is no God consciousness. Therefore they think only the man born in this land is national, not others.

Room Conversation -- July 20, 1971, New York:

Pratyatoṣa: Yeah, unless you can maintain yourself. I don't think they're too difficult to maintain. Teletype terminals are very reliable.

Prabhupāda: No, no, that's all right. Maintenance is different. Either you maintain yourself or pay that.

Pratyatoṣa: Correct.

Devotee (4): The machine is like a typewriter. It's hooked up with a computer... By telephone cables?

Pratyatoṣa: Oh, yeah. You just dial over an ordinary telephone. You can use more than one time-sharing service on the same terminal just by dialing different numbers. In Washington, D.C., I was using four different computers through the same terminal, just by dialing different numbers. And they can be thousands of miles away, it doesn't matter. In Minneapolis, I'm using a computer that's located in..., near Baltimore, near Washington, D.C. And it's just like... It doesn't matter how far away it is.

Prabhupāda: You receive the phone call?

Pratyatoṣa: Yeah, just by a phone call. Just by calling a local number, too, because they have lines already set up.

Interview -- July 29, 1971, Gainesville:

Prabhupāda: Yes. The disciplic succession is coming from Kṛṣṇa since five thousand years.

Interviewer: Is your spiritual master still alive?

Prabhupāda: No. He has passed away in 1936.

Interviewer: So you are, at this particular time then, sort of the head in world of this movement? Would that be correct?

Prabhupāda: I have got many other Godbrothers, but I was particularly ordered to do this, and from the very beginning, so I am trying to please my spiritual master, that's all.

Interviewer: Now, you were sent to this country, to the United States of America. This is your territory. Is that correct?

Prabhupāda: Hmm.

Interviewer: And I...

Prabhupāda: My territory, what he said, that "You go and speak this philosophy to the English-knowing public."

Interviewer: To the English-speaking world?

Prabhupāda: Yes, and especially in the Western world. Yes. He told me like that.

Interview -- July 29, 1971, Gainesville:

Interviewer: There must have been an element, though, of dissatisfaction on your part with the way God was being..., God was being..., Godhead was being professed in this part of the world before you came. Otherwise there would have been no sense in you coming here.

Prabhupāda: Not this part, every part. Every part of the world, practically everyone, very little interest in God. There's more interest in dog.

Interviewer: You are (indistinct) and trying to increase the interest in God. Is that correct?

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the only interest we must have in human life.

Interviewer: And you were not particularly interested in what particular name this God has.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Our purport mission is that people may become God conscious. And the process is, in this age, by chanting the holy name of God. If you have got any name for God which is actually name of God, then you'll be successful by chanting that.

Interview -- July 29, 1971, Gainesville:

Interviewer: The chanting of Kṛṣṇa's name, the Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, seems to play a very important role in the profession of your religious belief. Right? In fact, I think I will ask you and some of your followers who are sitting here with us tonight, a little bit later, to, to chant the name of Kṛṣṇa. That probably would be a proper ending to this particular program. However, I'm still wondering, you know, about some of the aspects. In reading a little bit—and I have not read much of course—but in reading a little bit about your beliefs and your writings and, you know, your magazine or your publications...

Prabhupāda: I may correct here, that it is not my belief.

Interviewer: Well in the, as you interpret it your writings. Let me put it that way. It seems to me sir, that there is a very high emphasis placed on the relationship between the individual and God.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Interviewer: Much more so than upon the...

Prabhupāda: That is for everyone.

Room Conversation -- August 17, 1971, London:

Prabhupāda: In one sense it is right. They are spiritual molecules. Yes. Here also, spiritual molecules, but here it is called material because there is no sense of Kṛṣṇa.

Śyāmasundara: Forgetfulness. They are covered by ignorance.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Revatīnandana: The cowherd boy with Kṛṣṇa, he is also vibhinnāṁśa expansion. Correct?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Revatīnandana: But he's remembering. He is remembering, therefore he is...

Prabhupāda: He may not remember.

Revatīnandana: Well, he's with Kṛṣṇa, he loves Kṛṣṇa. Therefore...

Prabhupāda: Just like when cowherds boy were playing, they did not know Kṛṣṇa is God. They did not know. They did not care to know.

Revatīnandana: Yes, but they love Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: The love is there. When the love is there, that is spiritual.

Room Conversation -- August 21, 1971, London:

Prabhupāda: No, no. If you... you find out somebody else. He can also do.

Haṁsadūta: Because my opinion is that he's becoming overworked, it's becoming strained, so much so that we're not even able to bring it to the printer because he insists on making every time more and more corrections.

Prabhupāda: (chuckles) It never comes to perfection.

Haṁsadūta: It never comes to perfection. It can, you know. For instance, this little booklet, Easy Journey to Other Planets, one of the things that has been holding it up is because the diacritic marks, to get the diacritic marks in there perfectly... We took it to a professional composer. Of course, they're not experienced, so they didn't, at first they didn't want to do it and then... At any rate, my opinion was first let us print it without the diacritic marks, and then the second edition make it with diacritic marks. Improve it by editions rather than wait until it's completely perfect before we put it on the market because...

Prabhupāda: But if once it is made perfect, then it will be easier to print more and more.

Haṁsadūta: That's true, but see, what has happened is the entire sum has been lost...

Prabhupāda: He could not finish any one?

Haṁsadūta: No, not even the magazine was finished. The magazine before this recent one, I put it together myself from old magazines.

Prabhupāda: There are so many German students. They cannot do?

Room Conversation -- August 21, 1971, London:

Prabhupāda: Oh yes.

Haṁsadūta: A big sport festival in Munchen. (break) And so we have some girls and they have asked us, they want to be married. What is our position?

Prabhupāda: Be married legally first.

Haṁsadūta: Legally. And they will be living outside the temple for sure. Is that correct, Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Haṁsadūta: And with a job and like that.

Prabhupāda: No, they can live in the temple...

Haṁsadūta: But they will live separate .

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Haṁsadūta: Then what is the use of getting married? (end)

Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London:

Dr. Weir: There it differs from science. Because if science is actually correct it can only be one.

Prabhupāda: But philosophy is taken as the science of sciences.

Dr. Weir: Theology used to be that. Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Weir: It shows a misconception of the word science.

Prabhupāda: So far I remember, I was also a student of philosophy, Dr. Urquhart, he said the philosophy is science of sciences. The science, there, I mean theory, begins from philosophy. Philosophy is the science of sciences. But according to Vedic verses, a philosopher is not a philosopher if he has not a different opinion from another philosopher, nāsau munir yasya mataṁ na... Therefore, through the philosopher you cannot come to the right conclusion. Tarkeṇa aprāptaś ca. If you simply go on arguing that will also not help you. If you simply read scriptures that will also not help you. Because there are different scriptures. Bible is different from Vedas and Vedas is different from Koran. So tarka... by argument you cannot come to the conclusion, by simply reading scriptures you cannot come to the conclusion. By following the philosophers you cannot come to the conclusion. Therefore the truth is very confidential. Dharmasyārtha... guhyam. It is kept very confidential. Then how to have it? Mahājano yena gataḥ sa panthāḥ (CC Madhya 17.186). You have to follow the great personalities who have actually realized God. That is the conclusion.

Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London:

Dr. Weir: Some people, oddly enough, don't need it. Some very simple people can have a very truly spiritual life without ever needing to verbalize it usually because they had, this is where I think it's perfectly correct, they have followed some father figure or mother figure and you know, absorbed...

Śyāmasundara: Just like my child.

Dr. Weir: Yes.

Śyāmasundara: She's to that point without having any rational knowledge.

Mensa Member: There's some (indistinct) simple people also (indistinct) people like Blake, for example, or Buddha (indistinct) simple person. It's not this sort of faith, only child-like faith (indistinct) simple people.

Dr. Weir: It's is easier for them though. It's easier for the simple person because he doesn't have all these mental, complicated doubts and, you know, arguments with himself.

Mensa Member: Yes.

Śyāmasundara: It's said that as one progresses more in spiritual life he becomes simpler and more innocent, but in the beginning he may have had to comprehend it on some verbal level in order to (indistinct)

Dr. Weir: I often used say to my students that I've got to remember that if anything in life to realize the difference between simple and complicated, which is objective, and easy and difficult, which is subjective. In other words sometimes a simple thing may be terribly difficult for a person to get hold of. Whereas complicated things he may find quite easy.

Prabhupāda: So your student has to follow your instruction. That means accepts authority.

Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London:

Mensa Member: Oh, it is, is it? But when we reach a point when we don't know whether there are living things or not, you know, the amino acids, and things like that or...

Dr. Weir: Well, I would take up that straight away, fundamentally, that it's perfectly correct to say it's the same size in every (indistinct) has no size.

Prabhupāda: No. It has size. We cannot measure it.

Dr. Weir: That's what I mean. Therefore the word size is a misconception.

Prabhupāda: But that is not a scientific statement. Because you have no measuring instrument you cannot say it has no size.

Dr. Weir: Now what you say it has not got three dimension, but when we talk about size...

Prabhupāda: Yes, three dimension. It is said, it is estimated that ten... one ten-thousandth part of the tip of the hair.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation Including Discussion on SB 1.5.11 -- January 19, 1972, Jaipur:

Prabhupāda: These people or this revolution is meant for killing the sinful resultant actions of the people. This revolution. Janatā agha, agha means resultant action of sinful life. Janatā agha viplavaḥ. Viplavaḥ means revolution, this very word is used. Tad-vāg-visargo janatāgha-viplavo yasmin prati-ślokam abaddhavaty api (SB 1.5.11). Such revolutionary literature, even they are not properly composed. Yasmin prati-ślokam abaddham. Not according to the grammatical rules and other rhetorical rules, but the, I mean to say, thoughts and the effects of such revolutionary literature is required. Not the grammatical. The so-called rascals, they are concerned with the grammatical. But those who are actually worker, they are concerned with the thoughts. What is the thought is there? Therefore, it is said that tad-vāg-visargo janatāgha-viplavo yasmin prati-ślokam abaddhavaty api, nāmāny anantasya yaśo 'nkitāni yat (SB 1.5.11). If there is simply the attempt is there how to glorify the Supreme Lord, that is a fact. It doesn't matter whether it is written in correct language or incorrect language, it doesn't matter. If the whole thought is targeted to glorify the Supreme Lord, then nāmāny anantasya yaśo 'nkitāni yat gṛṇanti gāyanti śṛṇvanti sādhavaḥ. Then those who are actually sādhu, even in spite of all these defects, because the only attempt is to glorify the Lord, then those who are sādhu, those who are devotee, they hear it. Śṛṇvanti gāyanti gṛṇanti. Not only hear, they chant also the same thing. And not only chant, but gṛṇanti, they apply in their actual life.

Room Conversation Including Discussion on SB 1.5.11 -- January 19, 1972, Jaipur:

Prabhupāda: So that is wanted. And the Bhāgavata also says, sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmo yato bhaktir (SB 1.2.6), how one has increased his devotion and love for Kṛṣṇa, that is the test of it. Not these formalities. Another place Kṛṣṇa says, api cet su-durācāro bhajate mām ananya-bhāk. Even sudurācāraḥ, even not well behaved but unflinching faith in Kṛṣṇa, sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ (BG 9.30), he is sādhu. Don't consider about his misbehaviors. That is not consideration. That will be corrected. Because he has taken to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, gradually those things, those defects will be corrected. kṣipraṁ bhavati dharmātmā śaśvac-chāntiṁ nigacchati, he will become very soon a great religious soul because he has taken to Kṛṣṇa. So in the beginning if there is some defect, we should not consider that. We have to see how much his love for Kṛṣṇa has increased, that is the test. Not the formalities. That is the test, how much he has sacrificed for Kṛṣṇa, how much he is prepared to sacrifice for Kṛṣṇa. If one takes Kṛṣṇa for making business, that is different thing, that is not devotion. Śālagrāma, my Guru Maharaja used to say śālagrām bir badam hoy (?). Just like you have seen śālagrāma. So if somebody takes that and breaks peanuts, so there is no devotion. It is a show during, attracting the visitors, it is nicely decorated, but in their absence, take it and you will have stone. So all this mostly the temple show is going on like that. They have made it a show of business. The devotees will come and pay something and I may have devotion or not devotion, it doesn't matter. One should be baccha bankaram suci (?), inside and outside perfect.

Room Conversation -- February 12, 1972, Madras:

Guest: Very well. I was told you were seventy-six.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest: You don't look like that. I think that's not correct age. Surely you are fifty-six. (laughter) How many of you here...? How many are you here...? Will you sit nearer here?

Devotee: I... This is your good ear?

Guest: Yes. This is my good ear. Yes.

Girirāja: I'll sit on the white bench.

Prabhupāda: Then you can sit on...

Guest: How many are you here in Madras?

Girirāja: About fifteen are here in Madras now.

Guest: Fifteen or fifty?

Girirāja: Fifteen.

Prabhupāda: One-five.

Talk with Bob Cohen -- February 27-29, 1972, Mayapura:

Bob: Let me say what else you said this morning that was interesting. I asked him about miracles, and Prabhupāda said that only a fool would believe in miracles because... Let us say you are a child and an adult lifts this table. That's a miracle. Or you're a chemist, and you combine acid and base and make smoke, an explosion or whatever. To somebody ignorant, that's a miracle. And for everything there's a process. And so when you see a miracle, it's just ignorance of the process. So that only a fool would believe in miracles, and, you correct me if I say wrong...

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.

Bob: ...that when Jesus came, the people then were somewhat more ignorant and needed miracles as aid. Was that... I wasn't sure if that's quite what you said.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, yes. Miracle means ignorant.

Bob: I had asked this in relation to all the miracle men you hear about in India.

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is the highest miracle man.

Bob: Yes.

Prabhupāda: That is stated by Kuntī.

Talk with Bob Cohen -- February 27-29, 1972, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: You understand everything of God. How God is inside how God is outside, how God is working—everything will be revealed. Sevonmukhe hi jihvādau svayam eva sphuraty adaḥ (Brs. 1.2.234). By the service attitude God will reveal Himself. You cannot understand God by your endeavor. If God reveals. Just like when the sun is out of your sight you cannot see the sun by your torchlight or any light. Any amount of scientific method, you cannot see the sun at night. But in the morning you can see the sun automatically, without any torchlight. Similarly, you have to create a situation, you have to put yourself in a situation wherein God will reveal. Not that by your method you can ask God, "Please come. I will see." No, God is not your order carrier.

Bob: You must please God for Him to reveal, is that correct?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Sevonmukhe hi jihvādau.

Śyāmasundara: How do we know when God is pleased?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Śyāmasundara: How do we know when God is pleased, when we are pleasing God?

Prabhupāda: When you see Him. (pause) Then you'll understand. Just like when you eat you needn't require to ask anybody whether you are feeling strength or your hunger is satisfied. If you eat, you understand that you are satisfied, you are feeling strength, you're feeling energy. It doesn't require to inquire anyone. Similarly, if actually, if you serve God, then you'll understand that "God is dictating me. God is, I am seeing God."

Talk with Bob Cohen -- February 27-29, 1972, Mayapura:

Bob: This is... Being in these modes determines your karma, is that correct?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Bob: Determines your karma.

Prabhupāda: According to the association of the modes of nature your activities are being contaminated. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya sad-asad-yoni-janmasu (BG 13.22). A man gets higher birth or lower birth according to the association of the guṇa, or the modes of nature.

Bob: So cheating and like that, what mode is that?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Bob: Cheating.

Prabhupāda: Cheating is mixed up passion and ignorance. Just like one man cheats other. That means he wants to obtain something. He's passionate. But he commits some murder. He does not know that "I'll have to suffer for it." So it is a mixture of passion and ignorance.

Talk with Bob Cohen -- February 27-29, 1972, Mayapura:

Bob: So what is honesty?

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is my question. (laughter) Real honesty is that you should not encroach upon other's property. This is honesty. Just like this is my table. If you want to take it away while going, is that honesty? No. So therefore the simple definition of honesty is that you should not encroach upon other's right. That is honesty.

Bob: So somebody who is honest will be in the mode of goodness. Would that be correct?

Prabhupāda: Certainly. Certainly. Because mode of goodness means knowledge. So if you know, if you're well conversant that "This table does not belong to me; it belongs to Swamiji," so you'll not try to take it away. Therefore one must know, be thoroughly well conversant; then he can be honest.

Bob: So... Now, you had said the mode of goodness was knowledge of God, but somebody may be honest without having very much knowledge of God.

Prabhupāda: Hmm.

Talk with Bob Cohen -- February 27-29, 1972, Mayapura:

Bob: No.

Prabhupāda: Then? It is stealing. You have not created the river. You do not know who is the proprietor. Therefore it is not your property. So even if you drink a glass of water without the knowledge to whom it belongs you are a thief. So you think, "I'm honest." But factually you are thief. (Speaks to someone in Bengali) Raso 'ham apsu kaunteya (BG 7.8). You must remember Kṛṣṇa that "Kṛṣṇa, it is Your creation, so kindly allow me to drink it." This is honesty. This is honesty. Therefore a devotee always thinks of Kṛṣṇa in all activities. "Oh, it is Kṛṣṇa's." Sarvatra sphuraya tara iṣṭa-deva mūrti. This is honesty. (Speaks to someone in Bengali) So without Kṛṣṇa consciousness everyone is a rascal, is a thief, is a rogue, is a robber, these qualifications. Therefore our conclusion is anyone who does not understand Kṛṣṇa, he has no good qualification. Neither he's honest, neither he has knowledge. Therefore he's a third-class man. Is that correct? What do you think, Girirāja?

Girirāja: Yes.

Room Conversation -- July 4, 1972, New York:

Prabhupāda: Because we practically see, all the college students are hippies. Irresponsible vagabonds. If she wants her son to become like that, that is different thing. Irresponsible vagabonds, that is the present status of this country. The majority of the students, they are becoming irresponsible vagabonds. Is it not?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Yes, correct. We all have experience in that.

Prabhupāda: Yes, if she, if she wants son to become irresponsible, irresponsible vagabond, in the association... Of course, our Dallas also we should take very much care so that we may not also produce irresponsible vagabond. So don't cause irresponsible vagabonds.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Śrīla Prabhupāda, what are your instructions to the parent..., to the teachers as to how they treat parents? I have heard several parents sometimes complain that..., that they don't get enough news about their children from the teachers. Should teacher let the parents know about the children?

Prabhupāda: So our, the small children teaching...

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Yes.

Prabhupāda: ...means they should learn alphabet.

Room Conversation -- July 4, 1972, New York:

Prabhupāda: Where is Śyāmasundara.

Devotee (4): He's in his office I think. He was there just a minute ago. I'll just write him the chant or something.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Devotee (4): I'll just write him the chant maybe.

Prabhupāda: No, chant also is not correct.

Devotee (4): Oh.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: He's coming, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct)

Devotee (7): Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Would you like to see them? (break)

Yadurāṇī: ... do it effectively. And, Śrīla Prabhupāda, Muralīdhara just asked you that when Lord Brahmā, when he became angry at the four Kumāras he created Lord Śiva from between his eyebrows. So he is always situated on his lotus, but at that time should we paint him on his planet?

Prabhupāda: His planet is just like lotus flower.

Morning Walks -- October 1-3, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: And so they..., they're reversing that, these people who...

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. What is appearing as poison in the beginning, that will prove nectar at the end. (break) Even ordinary dealings. Just like I have given one watch to Śyāmasundara, that Omega. So I paid him... One hundred dollars has been spent to make it correct time, but it is not. Everyone, "Yes, I will make it repaired."

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Just repairing?

Prabhupāda: Repairing, four, five dollars, six dollars, and it is the same. And it is going on for the last one year.

Jayatīrtha: Like automobiles, automobiles are built to break down in four or five years at the most so that you'll have to go and buy a new one. That's the way they build them. They could make them stronger, stronger parts, stronger engines, but they don't, so that in four or five years they'll break down and you'll have to come back and buy a new one.

Prabhupāda: (Sanskrit) Even in ordinary dealings, people will cheat you. That is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. (Sanskrit) Everyone is cheating. Even in ordinary talking, they will tell so many lies. (break) They live nicely in fresh air, in open air, trees, and talking about their business and they are happy. They have no problems for eating, sleeping, mating, nothing. Everything is there. And we are claiming civilized. We are dealing with science to improve conditions, the rascals they are becoming more and more degraded. They have no science, they have no laboratory, they have no university. How they are living peacefully? So it is... If this life is better or this life of cheating and imperfectness, full of anxieties, this life is better. Which life is better?

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- February 26, 1973, Jakarta:

Prabhupāda: So I think your problems can be solved if you kindly cooperate with us.

Guest (2): Yes. That's why we are looking for... because...

Prabhupāda: We can give you correct idea of religious principles as well as our philosophy.

Guest (2): Yes.

Prabhupāda: Religious idea without philosophy is sentiment, and philosophy without religion is mental speculation. They should be combined. Religious idea supported by philosophy. Then it is correct. And philosophy without religious idea is simply mental speculation. They should be combined. That combination of religious idea and philosophy, you'll find in the Bhagavad-gītā, provided you accept Bhagavad-gītā as it is. If you interpret Bhagavad-gītā in your own way, then you'll miss the point. Just like in our country, in India, Bhagavad-gītā has been interpreted in so different ways that people are now bewildered. They do not know what is actually Bhagavad-gītā. Take, for example... Just like in the beginning of the Bhagavad-gītā, it is said, dharmakṣetre kurukṣetre samavetā yuyutsavaḥ (BG 1.1). I think you know Sanskrit. Samavetā yuyutsavaḥ māmakāḥ pāṇḍavāś caiva kim akurvata sañjaya (BG 1.1). Even a great leader, political leader, he has interpreted kurukṣetra as this body. So where is the dictionary where kurukṣetra means this body? But because he's a big political leader that gītā is going on. Kurukṣetra means this body. Pāṇḍava means the five senses. In this way (break) ...they cannot (indistinct) I may tell you frankly.

Room Conversation with Indonesian Scholar -- February 27, 1973, Jakarta:

Prabhupāda: The predominating deity in the sun planet, his name is Vivasvān.

Scholar: Vivasvān, yes. And he's supposed to be the originator of...

Prabhupāda: He's the original person for the... There are two kinds of kṣatriyas. One coming from the sun-god, and the other is coming from the moon god, candra-vaṁśa, sūrya-vaṁśa.

Scholar: That's a very good correction for us. (Indonesian)

Prabhupāda: Personification means he... From the explanation it appears that actually there is no person.

Scholar: Yes. Originally there was person.

Prabhupāda: Not was, is, is still.

Scholar: Is still.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Their life is long duration.

Room Conversations with Sannyasis -- March 15, 1974, Vrndavana:

Devotee: (softly) This was not a paltry reason.

Prabhupāda: When he is incorrigible. First of all you have to try to correct him and... That is preaching. Our preaching means that people are useless, we have to train them in such a way they may take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is our management. But if he is completely incorrigible, then he will be asked to leave. Otherwise it is not our business that as soon as we see something he is doing wrong..., that he must be trained, by our example, by our teaching, by our word, śānta yaṁ cinvanti kutiḥ (?). By word, by example, he should be corrected. If I cannot correct him by my words and example, that is also my (indistinct). Because they are, they are, you cannot expect that everyone has come here, sādhu. It is not that. We collect from ordinary men, but we have to make him sādhu. That is preaching. That is preaching. That you have to do tactfully. Not that because one is incorrigible... After trying all our ways, if he is still incorrigible, then you can ask. Not that for paltry reason he cannot be..., "Get out." That "get out," if you make, then everything has to be "get out." That is not the policy. Policy is first of all to correct him. That is preaching. As far as possible by example, by teaching, by everything.

Room Conversations with Sannyasis -- March 15, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: By engaging. That is our school. It is a school. If a student does not learn nicely, you cannot say, "Get out." As far as possible. But when it is absolutely impossible to correct him, then you have to ask. And if there is money, equal you have to manage some money, what can be done? But I don't think if we try our best to correct him, this ultimate punishment will be required. Human being, after all human being, and our business is to teach and become ideal ourself. Āpani ācari prabhu jīvere śikhāya. We have to teach by our personal behavior. If you rise early in the morning, if you take your bath, if you sit down regularly and keep them (indistinct), how he can deny? How one can deny? It is not possible. But if I smoke, I ask others not to smoke, that will never be possible. Āpani ācari prabhu jīvere, first of all you have to be. If one is not cleansing, you shall tell me (indistinct) this way. We have to do like that. Not that I (order), "Come on, you do this. Oh, you cannot do, get out." Not that. We show him. After all, our life is sacrificed for preaching and that preaching means one should behave himself, nicely. He cannot say that "You do not do this." Just like one day in London there was some talks with Nanda Kumāra, you. He was accusing you, you were accusing him. I heard from (indistinct). So you should do in such a way that he cannot accuse you. If you ask him to rise early in the morning, take your bath, and if you do not take. Supposing some special case. I was taking early bath. Now I do not take, because due to my health. That is because... Otherwise regularly I was taking. Not even hot water. Regularly.

Room Conversations with Sannyasis -- March 15, 1974, Vrndavana:

Pañcadraviḍa: In your lectures you emphasized two aspects must be there, jñāna and renunciation. So some knowledge is there, but that part of the difficulty is that with most of the devotees in every temple in India, is that they have not renounced these dirty things completely. They still are attached to sense gratification even on gross levels. So whether a sannyāsī or anybody interferes with their sense gratification, they tend to not oblige because they are attached to doing things the way they want. And they think because they are in a foreign country here, a long way from America where the standards are very rigid, that they can do any manner of nonsense and nobody will check them. And if you try to correct them, then they will only do it behind your back. We have seen this, with the sweet shops, with rising early, anything that interferes with them doing as, exactly as they please, they don't want to oblige. And this is in Calcutta, this is in Bombay, and it's happening here in Vṛndāvana. It's not something that's isolated here to the palace, but the devotees all over, they are just behaving on the level of sense gratification, and that's why there is so much rajas guṇa in the temples. So much rajas guṇa.

Prabhupāda: This is a fact. So how to correct it. If you do not correct yourself, how you can correct?

Room Conversations with Sannyasis -- March 15, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: This is a fact. So how to correct it. If you do not correct yourself, how you can correct?

Pañcadraviḍa: Well we, many of us have tried to correct ourself, and as a result we have been accused of being separatist, simply because we don't want to go along with the nonsense that everybody else is doing, but we want to maintain some standard for ourself, of reading and chanting. Because we don't want to sit down and talk nonsense or do nonsense, and if you try to stop them they will not stop. So why we should fall down to that level? So we behave as separatist. We go into our room and we'll read, or we'll go into our room and chant, or we'll try and keep ourself clean, or try and do these things, and that is separatism because it's not falling into the level of māyā that's going on everywhere else in the temple, engaging in party politics and all these other things. That is, that is what I feel about it. Most of the devotees, they seem out of place.

Room Conversations with Sannyasis -- March 15, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Whatever is done is done. Now, you try to correct others by behaving yourself. Otherwise, there is no need of keeping so many men. We have attempted in Vṛndāvana. A few men may remain here. That's all. Otherwise, it will be not very nice to attract when people are attracted by seeing your behavior. They are seeing that, "Oh, Europeans and Americans, they have got such nice Vaiṣṇavas." They are attracted on that point. But if we are not to the standard point, they will immediately accuse, "Oh, they are..." So that should be corrected. The same principle, āpani ācari prabhu jīvere, we should behave ourselves nicely, then teach others. Then it will be (indistinct). Another, this is general principle, now we have discussed, now we try to follow. Another thing that Keśi-ghāṭa affair. Shall we make further progress? I acquired that property (indistinct). What is your opinion? From the circumstances as that is now, because any temple, it must be nicely, very nicely managed, otherwise you cannot attract. Our Los Angeles temple we want to attract people. So it is so nicely managed, very nicely managed. You have seen. So unless, that means there must be sufficient bank balance. Such a big temple.

Morning Walk -- April 25, 1973, Los Angeles:

Brahmānanda: Harāv abhakta...

Prabhupāda: Yasyāsti bhaktir bhagavaty akiñcanā sarvair guṇais tatra samāsate surāḥ, harāv abhaktasya kuto mahad-guṇā manorathena... Manorathena (SB 5.18.12). These rascals, they are simply speculating on the mental platform. That's all. Manorathenāsati dhāvato bahiḥ (SB 5.18.12). They are entrapped by the external energy, by mental speculation. They have no value. All these scientists, philosophers, they're on the mental platform, speculating. I am certi... I say this. You say: "No, I say this." You see. Who is correct?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: It doesn't matter.

Morning Walk -- April 30, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: We have got our process. You do not know. You admit. That is Vedic knowledge. Everything is there. If you want to know, you have to spend so much money to study how many forms are there. But we believe in the Vedas. We get immediately the correct knowledge. Now you cannot challenge it because you do not know. Neither you can know by research work. (pause) Jalajā nava-lakṣāṇi sthāvarā lakṣa-viṁśati. The, actually the sea waves, bringing their food. The small fishes or...?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: When a wave comes, they run this way, and when the wave goes down, they run down.

Prabhupāda: When the waves bring the food, so immediately they capture. So there is no scarcity of food, even for the small birds. And we are in scarcity. The scientist is manufacturing tablet.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They're going to convert the wood, the big woods to food also, by treating with the enzymes. That is one of the...

Prabhupāda: Programs.

Room Conversation with Krishna Tiwari -- May 22, 1973, New York:

Krishna Tiwari: Wait a minute.

Prabhupāda: To be satisfied with imperfect knowledge is the qualification of an animal.

Krishna Tiwari: Correct. But this was your words. It were not mine. I didn't say that I was satisfied. You presumed I was satisfied.

Prabhupāda: No. Yes, yes. You said that we know artificially; we don't know philosophy.

Krishna Tiwari: I never said that we're not trying to find out.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: All right, then, and you have tried, and you...

Krishna Tiwari: Oh, we are still trying to... You have to try very hard to find out these things. My question is, when I say-wait a minute, let me talk something. When I say I do not know, that does not necessarily mean that others know. And you are taking this (indistinct) point. I am saying in my humbleness that I do not know, and you come up, "Well, I know that." Because I don't know, you are suppose to know. That's not true. I just say you don't know either. (laughs)

Prabhupāda: No, no, that... But you cannot say, also, because you do not know, others do not know. You cannot say.

Conversation with Mr. Wadell -- July 10, 1973, London:

Mr. Wadell: Can we go back to the physician. It is possible for a physician to be wrong.

Prabhupāda: Yes, we are always in wrong because we are born ignorant. Everything is wrong because ignorant, foolish. Madman's conception. This is all wrong, childish. Therefore we send our boys, children, to school, to correct the wrong ideas.

Mr. Wadell: But some of the teachers may not be correct.

Prabhupāda: No. The process is you have to go to the teacher. But if the teacher is a cheater, then the whole thing is spoiled. A teacher must be teacher, perfect teacher. But if he happens to be a cheater then the whole thing is spoiled.

Mr. Wadell: But the human situation is often a sort of mixture of the two. Sometimes...

Prabhupāda: No, mixture of two, that may be, but the process is that we have to approach the real teacher. Just like I approach the mother. Mother is supposed to be not cheater. But if the mother happens to be a cheater, then I am cheated. I am cheated. I don't get the information of my real father. But it is expected the mother should not cheat.

Conversation with Mr. Wadell -- July 10, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Yes, you come often. Yes, you are welcome. Yes.

Mr. Wadell: If you feel it is of any interest or value to you.

Prabhupāda: Oh yes, yes, After 4 o'clock you can come. You are welcome.

Śyāmasundara: You can come any night after 4 pm.

Mr. Wadell: Yes, well, we have a very busy week, because, as I say, we are correcting papers, we are ending our term.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes, you must be busy.

Mr. Wadell: But what we are talking about is something which doesn't change from today or tomorrow or yesterday. So when these things have been done, perhaps next week, I will come down.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes, you are welcome. I want that responsible persons like you should try to understand the scientific value of this movement. It is not a sentimental movement. It is based on philosophy, science, authority.

Room Conversation With Three College Students -- July 11, 1973, London:

Revatīnandana: Well, controlling, being in control of your mind and senses, means that whatever destination you fix up with your intelligence—you understand, you want a particular result—then if you are in control of your mind and senses, then it means that it won't disturb you.

Prabhupāda: First of all... First of all thing is the, what is the aim of practicing yoga? So to achieve that end, that purpose, you have to control the mind because mind is very flickering, going here, there, there, there. So first of all you must know what is the purpose of practicing yoga, why you should practice yoga. So in order to achieve that goal, you have to concentrate your mind, and therefore you have to control the mind going here and there. That is control. Mind business is acceptance and rejecting. This is mind's business. Immediately I accept, "It is very good;" again, next moment, "No, no it is not good. Reject it." This is called flickering mind. So by yoga practice you have to make your mind in such a way that whatever you decide, that is correct, not the state of rejecting and accepting. So first of all, you have to know why you are practicing yoga. As you asked the question, "Why control of mind?" Then the next question will be "Why you are practicing? What is your aim?" You are going to practice yoga. Why? What is the aim?

Student (1): Is it to realize God?

Room Conversation With Three College Students -- July 11, 1973, London:

Student (3): Your logic starts from the assumption that the book is correct.

Prabhupāda: Then why you are arguing? That is logic. Why you are arguing? Why don't you accept what I say? Why you are arguing? That is logic.

Student (3): Because so many people say different things which conflict.

Prabhupāda: Therefore you are taking the shelter of logic. You are taking the shelter.

Student (1): Logic... Logic is arguing, isn't it?

Prabhupāda: No, logic means argument, reasoning. Our logic is because Kṛṣṇa is accepted by all great persons, authorities, we accept. Our logic is simple.

Room Conversation with Father Tanner and other guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Mrs. Wells: I can see what Father Tanner means about the spiritual man on the outside not necessarily being pure on the inside.

Prabhupāda: No, he's not spiritual man. He's a hypocrite. He must be inside and outside correct. If one is outside correct, inside wrong, he's not spiritual man. We don't accept him.

Mrs. Wells: But you begin with the outside.

Prabhupāda: No. Inside and outside, both.

Mrs. Wells: But your principles pertain to the outside man.

Prabhupāda: Outside man?

Mrs. Wells: The actions...

Guest (1) (British young man): You said that the four pillars that you follow are outward manifestations. They belong to a material person.

Prabhupāda: Outward manifestation?

Guest 1: Hm.

Prabhupāda: So outward manifestation... Just like outwardly, iron rod, it is iron. Iron. Do you follow me?

Mrs. Wells: Yes, iron.

Prabhupāda: But you put the iron in the fire...

Mrs. Wells: Yes.

Room Conversation with Two Buddhist Monks -- July 12, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: So I told him that "You have created your own god, Lenin. And we have got our own God, Kṛṣṇa. Now, the principle of accepting somebody as God is there, in your philosophy and in my philosophy. So that you cannot avoid. Your communistic philosophy cannot avoid the conception of God, the leader." Just like in Buddha philosophy also, there is the conception of God, of Lord Buddha.

Buddhist Monk (1): No. That's not correct. Because we do not treat the Buddha... In fact, when the Buddha preached his atheistic philosophy... That's why he was termed a nāstika, a wasala. We do not believe in a god. We say panya, wisdom, and dharmuddha, is an incompatible...

Prabhupāda: At least, you follow the leadership of Buddha.

Buddhist Monk (1): Leadership, that's correct.

Prabhupāda: So that is, I am pointing out. Leadership,... God means "the leader." According to Vedic injunction, God means "the supreme leader." Nityo nityānāṁ cetanaś cetanānām (Kaṭha Upaniṣad 2.2.13). He is the chief living entity. Mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ sūyate sa-carācaram (BG 9.10). God means the Supreme Leader. So leader you have to accept. That is the conception of God. Either you select Buddha or Lenin or somebody else, you have to accept one leader and follow. That is your business. So our philosophy is that Kṛṣṇa, the Supreme Lord, He's the Supreme Leader. And we are to obey His orders. This is our philosophy. So if you do not obey the orders of Kṛṣṇa, if you obey the orders of Lord Buddha, or somebody obeys the orders of Lenin, the principle is there that you have to follow the orders of somebody. Now, you select Lenin, Kṛṣṇa or Buddha or Gandhi or anyone. That is a different thing.

Room Conversation with Dr. Arnold Toynbee, Famous Historian, at his home or office -- July 22, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: No, no. The thing is... That is natural. That is natural. Suppose if, after my death, I am going to become something lower than my present position, certainly I must be afraid of it.

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Yes, yes.

Prabhupāda: Suppose if somebody gives me... This is a fact. Recently one astrologer has said that one of the biggest politicians in India, he has now become a dog in Sweden. May be correct or not, but there is possibility. There is possibility.

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Yes, yes.

Prabhupāda: Because from the śāstra we understand, karmāṇa, by work, one has to... Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). By prakṛti, by nature, as we make... Just like if we eat little more, so by the laws of nature, immediately there is indigestion.

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Yes, yes.

Prabhupāda: So you cannot deny this adjustment. So why not...? I am sufferer of my karma. So according to my karma, I get a body,...

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Yes, yes, yes, yes.

Room Conversation with Reporter from Researchers Magazine -- July 24, 1973, London:

Reporter: (laughs) Nobody.

Prabhupāda: Therefore, kalau śūdra-sambhavaḥ. Correct? In this age of Kali, everyone is to be accepted as śūdra. No brāhmaṇa, no kṣatriya, no vaiśya. All śūdra, or less than śūdra.

Reporter: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Pañcavān.(?) This is the position. So at the present moment, to reform that, you cannot take them to the original position. It is not possible, it is Kali-yuga. Mandāḥ sumanda-matayo manda-bhāgyā hy upadrutāḥ (SB 1.1.10). They are very slow, they don't accept the right path... Just like God is here, Kṛṣṇa, kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam (SB 1.3.28). But they're creating their own God. Even big, big leaders they are saying, "Eh, Kṛṣṇa, why Kṛṣṇa should be accepted?" Even big, big leaders, they do not believe that Kṛṣṇa was there on this planet, there was Kurukṣetra battle. You know better than me.

Room Conversation -- August 11, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Oh, it is wrong.

Bhagavān: That's always questioned in Bhagavad-gītā.

Prabhupāda: It is not, has been mis-edited. If you identify with body, how you know it? Oh, it is a very great mistake.

Bhagavān: We can, we can write them, make that correction.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Write immediately. One must know that I am not this body. That is knowledge. That is knower. That is common sense. I say: "It is my body." I don't say: "I body." That I explained. One who does, one who knows that "I am not this body," he's real knower. And one who knows that: "I am this body," he does not know. He's in ignorance. Just like Danielou.

Yogeśvara: A Kṛṣṇa conscious person, he can maintain his position in family, government, business, anything.

Prabhupāda: Why not? All these Pāṇḍavas, they were government men. How they maintained Kṛṣṇa consciousness? Yudhiṣṭhira Mahārāja... They were fighting for political reasons. So they were Kṛṣṇa conscious, fully. (break) ...who identifies with this body, he's described as cow or ass. How he can be knower? It is wrongly edited. The word: "Not". It was edited by whom? Hayagrīva?

Haṁsadūta: Hayagrīva.

Room Conversation -- August 11, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Eh? Eh?

Haṁsadūta: Hayagrīva also...

Bhagavān: Hayagrīva and Jayādvaita.

Prabhupāda: This should be corrected immediately.

Bhagavān: (break) He asked you a question about transcendental knowledge, and actually you explained that knowledge is not one thing, but it's composed of three things, it is the object, the knower and the process. That is all knowledge.

Prabhupāda: Knower, knowledge and the object. The object is Kṛṣṇa and you are knower, or trying to know. And the process is bhakti. That's all. If you want to understand Kṛṣṇa, then you have to adopt the process of bhakti. No other process. It is clearly stated in the Bhagavad-gītā: bhaktyā mām abhijānāti (BG 18.55). No other process. No speculative philosophy or meditation. It is not possible. So bhakti is the process, you are the knower, and Kṛṣṇa is knowable. That's all. (break) ...vādī, impersonalists, they say ultimately the knower, knowable and the known becomes one. That is their philosophy. Monists. There is no more knower, no knowable, the knower... Simply knowledge. They say simply knowledge. Oneness.

Room Conversation with Officer Harry Edwards, the Village Policeman -- August 30, 1973, Bhaktivedanta Manor, London:

Revatīnandana: No. What he means is that if, whenever he hears of some incident, like the doctor's surgery, should he tell us or not? And I'm saying he should tell us so we'll know. And if it's nothing important, we can correct it easily.

Prabhupāda: No, we should generally know that we may take pleasure chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa loudly. Others may not.

Revatīnandana: Right.

Prabhupāda: That is generally. So when you go others' place, we may not chant loudly, simply chant in such a way you can hear. That's all.

Harry: Yeah, this'll do it. I mean, if you want to chant...

Prabhupāda: You don't stop chanting.

Room Conversation with Indian Ambassador -- September 5, 1973, Stockholm:

Ambassador: That's true.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Strictly in Rāmānuja sampradāya, or Śaiva sampradāya they have got... Strictly taking bath and tilaka. In New Delhi, you'll find so many Madrasi gentlemen, big, big, high officers, they're strictly following Hindu principles.

Ambassador: You'll be surpri...

Prabhupāda: And still, if I am correct, in Madras, they, there, there is not many Mohammedans. The Mohammedan culture could not enter...

Ambassador: That's very true.

Prabhupāda: ...into Madras, Southern India. And you'll find also in our Caitanya Caritāmṛta... Now I am translating. When Caitanya Mahāprabhu went to Southern India, practically whole Southern India became Vaiṣṇava by His preaching.

Ambassador: It is a great period of...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. And all the ācāryas, they came from South India. Śaṅkarācārya, Rāmānujācārya, Madhvācārya. I think Madhvācārya belonged to your province? Malaya?

Ambassador: No, Śaṅkarācārya came from...

Prabhupāda: Śaṅkarācārya.

Room Conversation -- September 18, 1973, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa and Śiva, just like dahi and dudha. Dahi is nothing but dudha, but still it is not dudha.

Guest (2): It's a a different form.

Prabhupāda: Not different form, different action also. If you want milk, if I give you dahi, and if I say, "Oh dahi and dudha, the same thing. Why you are not accepting this dahi?", will you accept?

Guest (2): Correct.

Prabhupāda: Although the same thing, but action is different. If you become devotee of Lord Śiva, you'll get opportunity of material opulences. Because Lord Śiva is the husband of Durgā, and Durgā is the superintendent of this material world. So Durgā is under control. If one becomes a devotee of Lord Śiva, then Durgā gives him, eh? Dhanaṁ dehi rūpaṁ dehi rūpavatī-bhāryāṁ dehi yaśo dehi. So you'll get all this, nice position, nice wife, nice power, famous... All this material, not spiritual. So to worship any other demigod than Kṛṣṇa is materialism. That is not spiritualism.

Room Conversation with Banker -- September 21, 1973, Bombay:

Banker: According to the scientific finds of Dr. Alexander Leaf of Harvard Medical School, it is impossible to lengthen life infinitely, physically, because the cell is not capable of regenerating itself more than fifty times.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that we admit. But we are not material. We are spiritual. That is...

Banker: Correct. You are not talking about the physical.

Prabhupāda: Ah. Physical is my outward dress. Just like your coat, if it becomes old enough, there is no more possibility to use it. You have to throw it away. You have to take another coat. Similarly, physically, I am spirit soul. When my physical body is old enough, useless, then I will have to give it up. I will have to accept another new body. But the question is that I am eternal; why I am forced to accept a body which will be useless after some time? That is the problem. I am eternal, as spirit soul. Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). I do not die after the annihilation of this body. But why I am forced to accept another body, which will be annihilated? This technology is unknown all over the world. And still they are proud of becoming very advanced in science. (Aside:) Open this. Let them come. Keep it open. Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānu... (BG 13.9). Come forward. (break) ...technology, although it is a problem. But we can supply this technology, to solve this problem. Jarā-maraṇa-mokṣāya mām... Jarā-maraṇa-mokṣāya. (break) ...modern technologist, scientists, they do not know what is the perfection of life.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1973, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Yes. If she comes, then we shall have to give a nice speech so that she may be convinced.

Śyāmasundara: Yes. Very flatter... I think, I think we should flatter her completely.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Śyāmasundara: No controversy. And this...

Prabhupāda: No, that, "If you become Kṛṣṇa conscious, naturally everything will be correct." Just like Yudhiṣṭhira Mahārāja was Kṛṣṇa conscious. And can, you can read the portion during the reign of Yudhiṣṭhira Mahārāja, how nature was helping. Kāmaṁ vavarṣa. You keep one set of books here. Kāmaṁ vavarṣa parjanyaḥ (SB 1.10.4). "Due to Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira's being Kṛṣṇa conscious, everything was going on nicely. So by the grace of Kṛṣṇa, you are on the post of Yudhiṣṭhira Mahārāja. So if you take standard, it will be good for everyone. And so far secular state is concerned, we are actually secular. In this movement, all classes of men are here."

Morning Walk -- December 2, 1973, Los Angeles:

Yaśomatīnandana: You said in the Bhāgavatam that the material world is like a correction house for the living entity.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So everybody should develop Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (Śrīla Prabhupāda gets into car) Kṛṣṇa consciousness is the only remedy. Harer nāma harer nāma harer nāma eva kevalam... (CC Adi 17.21). (break) And this advancement of material civilization means entrapping the entrapped. The living entity is already entrapped, and he is allured by farther entrapment. Jaḍa-vidyā jato māyāra vaibhava. Jaḍa-vidyā, material advancement of civilization, means expanding the influence of māyā. Why? Now anitya saṁsāra, cannot live here. You have to give up this place. But still, you are thinking to make it a permanent settlement. That is not possible. Everyone knows. He will not be allowed to stay. But still insisting, gorgeous arrangement, how we can be, how we can become immortal. The scientists bluffing, "Yes, you will become immortal. We are finding out the means." But he will die. That means he is ass. He is allured by these false words. Therefore he is ass. Jībake karaye gādhā. This is Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura's song.

Morning Walk -- December 9, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Gap of understanding because the basic principle is wrong, because everyone is fool. And they are trying to understand things with their foolish background. There is the wrong. They are trying to be advanced in knowledge on the foolish background. They do not accept that, that they are foolish rascals. And they are trying to advance in knowledge, active-foolish, fourth class men. Their background is wrong. No scientist, no politician, no philosophers, at the present moment, believe in this, that there is soul, and the soul is transmigrating from one body... Nobody believes it. So their whole background is foolish. So their so-called advancement must be all foolish. They're all fools, rascals, animals. An animal does not know that there is soul and the soul is transmigrating from one body to another. This is animal conception. You cannot teach these pigeons that "You are spirit soul. Your body's different from you." They will, they have no power to understand. So if a human being cannot understand, what is the difference between these pigeons and cats and dogs and him? Then basic principle is wrong. Just like in mathematical calculation, if at one point you have mistaken, then will that be correct ever? It will go on, mistaking, mistaking, mistaking, mistaking. If the, if one point, while adding, you have made two plus two equal to five, then after that, everything wrong, everything wrong. Everything wrong. So that is their position.

Morning Walk -- December 10, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prajāpati: But in our literature we find Kṛṣṇa has some transcendental pastimes of anger, but that He does not, it is man's own reaction activities, that bring upon destruction. How are these two...?

Prabhupāda: No. All the qualities that we find within this material world, all of them must have come from God. If there is wrath within this material world, it must have come from God because God is the origin of everything. That is the Vedānta-sūtra. Brahman, Absolute Truth, means the source of everything. Whatever we have got experience within this material world, everything is there in God. That is perfection of God. You cannot say, "This thing is not in God." So aiśvaryasya samagrasya. Everything is there. Just like Kṛṣṇa stealing as a child. But apparently sometimes He does something which is not very moral. So this immorality, the so-called immorality, it is there also. That is the full conception of God. He's not lacking in anything. Under the circumstances, God is in wrath, that is correct. But that is not His only characteristic. He has got mercifulness also. Everything is there. That is God. Therefore as theologician, you should understand the correct conception of God. They have no complete conception of God. Now, God is described in the dictionary as the Supreme Being. Is it not?

Hṛdayānanda: Yes. Everyone agrees on that.

Morning Walk -- December 10, 1973, Los Angeles:

Yaśomatīnandana: You don't think, Prabhupāda, they have reached the moon?

Prabhupāda: No. There are so many invisible planets. Not that all the stars and planets, you can see, just like Rāhu planet. That is not seen. And when the Rāhu planet passes through, that is eclipse, but they describe in a different way. Actually, it is the Rāhu planet which passes before the sun and moon and there is eclipse. There are so many questionable things of the theory that, the eclipse theory of the modern view. That is not correct according to Vedic theory.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: The eclipse?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But the science proves it.

Prabhupāda: Science proves everything. That is their nonsense. They, amongst their community, they have proved everything except what he is, he does not know. Except that thing, what he is, he does, he does not know. And why he dies. He does not know. That is his knowledge.

Morning Walk -- December 11, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prajāpati: That that's right, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So you must take this clue, that we Americans, we say "In God we trust." Now, every American should know what is God, what is trust. This is propaganda, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. The government must come forward to patronize this. This is my proposition. So you write articles, you are theologicians. The America must rise up to the occasion. They have pledged themselves, "In God we trust." Every human nation or every human being should be like that. In God they must trust. So America, especially taken up the slogan as part of Constitution. Now there should be regular educational program, that every child, every man, every woman will trust in God. And this is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So? Am I wrong in my arguments?

Devotee: No, correct.

Prabhupāda: So why don't you take it seriously, you American boys?

Prajāpati: Also in the Constitution, Śrīla Prabhupāda, there is a thing called separation of church and state, that they would have...

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is all right. We want to educate, we don't want to take part in administration. But the administration should be under our guidance; they should take advice from us, how to do it. That is required. We are not going to be president. We are satisfied in our humble temple.

Morning Walk -- December 12, 1973, Los Angeles:

Yaśomatīnandana: Avināśi tu tad viddhi.

Prabhupāda: Ah, avināśi tu tad viddhi yena sarvam idam. (break) ...is correct. We can face any so-called philosopher, any. Any so-called scientist. Any so-called politicians. You must be strong enough to have your firm conviction, that "We can face anyone rascal and defeat him." (break) ...and logic, argumentum vaculum. You know that? In logic there is a thesis or argumentum vaculum. Means no argument, but with stick and gun, you see. "If you don't believe, then here is stick and gun." That is called argumentum vaculum. So we have to make our position so strong that anyone who does not believe in God, he should be finished.

Umāpati: We had a president that used to believe in that. He is finished.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) No, but don't think like that. But there are two kinds of business: paritrāṇāya sādhūnāṁ vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām (BG 4.8). To give protection to the devotees and killing the unbeliever. These are stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. (break) Yes. Government has got two departments: law and order department, military department. Why? Two things must... (break) This is their business, śūdra business. Śūdra business. Śūdras, they have no knowledge. They commit mistake over and over. Therefore brāhmaṇa required to guide the kṣatriya, the vaiśya and the śūdra. Therefore they are guru. Otherwise, they will commit mistake, more or less. It is practical. Just in your country, you have all elected Mr. Nixon as president, and again you are protesting. Why you are protesting? You have already elected him. What is the reasons?

Karandhara: Well, he's a rascal.

Morning Walk -- December 12, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Well, something wrong was done; therefore everything is wrong. If somebody, he might have seen some counterfeit coin, does it mean the whole currency is counterfeit? You cannot say like that.

Nara-nārāyaṇa: The śūdra mentality does not know how to correct the situation. They try to make liberty for themselves without instituting real religion again. (break)

Prabhupāda: This idea also. Now there should be examination whether so-called brāhmaṇas, they are actually following the brāhmaṇa regulative principle and chanting the mantra regularly. Otherwise they should be converted again śūdra. If we become safe simply by having a thread and do not do properly, then what is this? This should be examined. Every individual should be asked, "Now chant this Gāyatrī-mantra." He must. Are they doing properly?

Karandhara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Then it is all right. Otherwise, simply by name, so-called sacred thread holder will not do. Then again the same brahminical class as in India. (break) ...Paraśurāma. You know Paraśurāma?

Karandhara: The incarnation?

Morning Walk -- December 21, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: No, no, no. Not necessarily. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. Catur-vidhā bhajante māṁ janāḥ sukṛtino 'rjuna, ārto arthārthī (BG 7.16). When one is distressed he remembers God, if he is pious. If he is not pious...

Guest (1): Then he won't remember. Then he will curse him. Then he will curse.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest (1): That is correct. But even a pious man in prosperity, he doesn't think of God so much.

Prabhupāda: If he is pious, then in his distress, he will remember God.

Guest (1): Yes, but a pious man in his prosperity sometimes forgets, as Sugrīva had the tendency to forget and he had to be reminded.

Prabhupāda: No, that is very rarely. Sugrīva forgot. Anyway, there is chance of such thing because the distressed man, although he is pious, as soon as his distress is moved, then he forgets. There is such chance. Therefore ārto arthārthī jñānī jijñāsuḥ. Four classes of men. So ārto arthārthī. They, after benefiting by the grace of God, they may forget. But those who are jñānī, they will not forget. That is the difference. So these theologicians, they are changing their opinion. What is that, Karandhara, you said?

Morning Walk -- December 30, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Another rascal is buying. We are not buying. Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam amalaṁ purāṇam, spotless knowledge, Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Amalam. Amalam means without any spot. (break) ...of God is given in the dictionary, "Supreme Being." That is very nice. Everywhere we see that on the top there is a supreme being, just like in your state, the president. So why not this big government, a Supreme Being? Where is the difficulty? Without something supreme, controller, things cannot go nicely. Otherwise why you select a president? Why you select a supreme being and give him all power that "Your order will be final"? Why you do that? Because you want the government must go on nicely. Otherwise there is no need of electing a president. So supreme being must be there, in every management. So this big huge management, there must be Supreme Being. And that is God. Clear, simple understanding. How can you deny? The difficulty is that with our poor fund of knowledge, we cannot understand that how a Supreme Being, person, can create the sky, this huge water, the sun, moon. Because I am thinking, "God must be like me." A Dr. Frog. He is thinking, "Atlantic Ocean must be like this well." That is our defect. He cannot conceive that beyond this well there can be a vast great mass of water. He cannot conceive. So comparing his intelligence, he is thinking that "How it is possible that a person can create such a big sky, such big, huge...?" Bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ (BG 7.4). This earth, so big, huge quantity of earthly planet. So not only one. Millions. And then water, then fire, then... He cannot conceive. He is thinking that "If there is God, He must be like me. So I cannot do this. Therefore there is no God." The same, "Yes. I close my eyes. Then there is no enemies." That's all. He should be intelligent. Just like we are here ten or twenty men. You accept that "He is our guru. He is most intelligent man." Similarly, somebody is more intelligent than me, somebody is more intelligent, more intelligent. Go on searching. Find out the final intelligent. That is comparative intelligence. That we know. But what is that final intelligence? That we must know. That is God. Just like the sun. If we think that beyond this sun there is no more planet, that is not correct. You cannot go beyond this sun. That is another thing. But all the planets are surrounding the sun. That everyone knows. So if there is a planet this down the sun, why not up the sun? It is common sense. This water is impersonal, but go down the water. You will find millions of persons, aquatics. Those who are seeing superficially on the surface, they have concluded, "Now finished, all personality finished. It is all vacant." That is poor fund of knowledge. Real knowledge is go deep into the water, you will find millions of creatures. They are living very nicely within the water. Aṇḍāntara-stha-paramāṇu-cayān... Even within the atom, you will find personality.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 5, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: You give me... (break)

Devotee (2): He's in the... Parking the car.

Prabhupāda: Oh. (break) ...plan for wasting time. (devotees laugh) So the material world means they have got different devices for wasting time, not for utilizing time. Is it correct?

Prajāpati: It is considered one of our major problems, leisure time. People are having more time on their hands and they do not know what to do with it. So the government, they're scratching their heads inventing things for people to waste their time.

Prabhupāda: This is the difficulty. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇum (SB 7.5.31). Because they are rascal, they do not know how to utilize time, what is the aim of life, where you have to go. These things they don't know. So they must waste time. So it is the... Just like child. He wastes time in so many ways. It is the duty of the parents, guardians, to cr..., synchronize his activities so that he may not waste his time. It is the duty of the guardians. Similarly these rascals, they're wasting time. You have to engage them in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Then their time will be utilized.

Morning Walk -- January 10, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa worship, everyone. Just like we worship also ordinary man if it gives us facility to worship Kṛṣṇa. We go to somebody and worship him, flatter him, because he will give some money, and it will be engaged in Kṛṣṇa's service. The man is not worshipable, but he will help us to worship Kṛṣṇa. Thereby he will be helped and we will be also helped, and Kṛṣṇa will be satisfied. Kṛṣṇa will be satisfied that "My devotee has brought some money from this rascal. All right." That is... (laughter) So Gaṇapati is also devotee. So Gaṇapati, it is not required, but sometimes we do. Just like gopīs, they worshiped Goddess Durgā, Kātyāyanī. They did not require, but the social system is that. But they asked that Mother Kātyāyanī, give us the opportunity to have Kṛṣṇa as our husband." The aim is Kṛṣṇa. Generally, they go to worship Devī Durgā for asking material benefit. Dhanaṁ dehi rūpaṁ dehi yaśo dehi, the things which we want in material... But the gopīs, they do not go for any material things. For Kṛṣṇa. Similarly, we can go to any demigod. Why Gaṇapati? Everyone. But our prayer should be, "Please give us Kṛṣṇa." Then it is correct.

Morning Walk -- January 10, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Insane? Then he cannot work. That's all. Even if I give you good machine... Just like I do not know how to work on it, so similarly, if one does not know how to work, then it is useless machine.

Karandhara: They are thinking that by certain types of chemicals they can correct things like depression and unhappiness. They say it's all just a chemical situation in the brain.

Prabhupāda: But that they propose so many nonsense things, but they cannot do anything.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They are making experiments on rats now.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. They will go on experimenting life after life. That is their foolishness.

Gurukṛpā: Next life they may have to experiment in a dog's body.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And some of our politicians, he has become a dog. Yes. Nehru. He has become a dog, in Stockholm. Yes.

Morning Walk -- January 19, 1974, Hawaii:

Devotee (3): ...Kṛṣṇa consciousness?

Prabhupāda: Oh yes, very, very effective. Just like the man is feeling benefited that "I become tired and I read this book, very nice." So he'll gradually become devotee. (break)

Devotee (2): ...this is on chanting hari-nāma in the streets, chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa in the streets with mṛdaṅgas and karatālas. It's a very important part of our program. Is that correct?

Prabhupāda: Both of them are kīrtana. When you chant, that is also kīrtana; when you distribute book, that is also kīrtana. When you read book, that is also kīrtana. (break) ...joking, if one meets one fat man, so the other man will ask him, "Will you kindly let me know wherefrom you purchase rice?" (laughter)

Sudāmā: They consume much rice?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Sudāmā: In India. Is much rice consumed?

Prabhupāda: No... In Bengal. In Bengal the staple food is rice. Like Japanese.

Room Conversation -- February 13, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So wherefrom the māyā comes?

Guest (1): From... I don't know, I can't answer that. It's, it's, it's God's nature, it's His līlā.

Guru dāsa: You stated that Kṛṣṇa makes us see impurity. Is this correct Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: (indistinct)

Guru dāsa: That Śrī Kṛṣṇa, Lord Kṛṣṇa makes us see impurity. He mentioned...

Guest (1): When a man is in ignorance.

Guru dāsa: Well which is first?

Guest (1): Which is first? Which, ignorance or what?

Guru dāsa: Does Kṛṣṇa make us in ignorance?

Guest (1): Well, He creates the whole universe and everything in it.

Guru dāsa: Yes. Śrīla Prabhupāda maybe you can explain that.

Morning Walk -- February 17, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: I think my understanding is not-

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: I want to be corrected by you.

Prabhupāda: I have already told you, you are śānta-rasa bhakta. (break) ...originally, as spirit soul, everyone is Vaiṣṇava. Everyone is Vaiṣṇava.

Dr. Patel: No, but by, by, by saṁskāras, birth. Our saṁskāra, Vaiṣṇava-saṁskāra. Whole community of us. (pause)

Prabhupāda: So why you are becoming ex-community?

Dr. Patel: I am... No. That is not... There is only one community and that is also many people. All of us one. The animal communities are there.

Prabhupāda: So that is also another community. If you take simply humanity, that is another community.

Morning Walk -- March 9, 1974, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Therefore we have to sometimes do that. Just like that woman, that chaste woman. She served a prostitute...

Guest (1): To make them correct.

Prabhupāda: No. Serve prostitute for serving her husband. That is a big story.

Guest (2): Big story, yes.

Prabhupāda: Lakṣa-hīra.

Guest (1): Lakṣa-hīra. Yes.

Prabhupāda: You know that, Lakṣa-hīra.

Guest (1): And husband was a...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- March 16, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That is not your business, judging.

Harikeśa: Then we simply wait for further instructions from you and keep....

Prabhupāda: No further instructions.

Harikeśa: Ah.

Prabhupāda: So long he is president you must follow him. If he is wrong, that will be corrected by the spiritual master.

Harikeśa: Right.

Prabhupāda: You cannot correct him. Otherwise obedience is the first discipline. If you do not obey the representative, authority, then there cannot be any discipline. Then everything will be topsy-turvy.

Harikeśa: You would rather have us follow the temple president...

Prabhupāda: Huh? Yes.

Harikeśa: ...than to...

Prabhupāda: If he is wrong, that cannot... He will come out.

Harikeśa: Ah.

Prabhupāda: Just like the king, and there are many tax collectors. So tax goes to the king.

Guest (3): Yes, king, yes.

Prabhupāda: It does not belong to the tax collectors.

Guest (3): Correct.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...nāhaṁ teṣv avasthitaḥ.

Guest (3): Correct. (break)

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest (3): So you transcend them.

Prabhupāda: "Everything, everything is connected with Me, but I am not that." That is...

Guest (3): Much more than that.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So there is varieties.

Dr. Patel: But in the second... That is...

Prabhupāda: So there is...

Dr. Patel: ...correction in the second śloka only.

Prabhupāda: No, no! It is not correction. It is correction because we fools, we cannot understand Him clearly. "So although everything is existing in Me, I am not everything."

Dr. Patel: "Still, everything existing in Me." But...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: What is that?

Guest (3): Ahaṁ yogam aiśvaram.

Dr. Patel: Yogam aiśvaram.

Prabhupāda: Just like in this hotel. There are so many furnitures, so many rooms. If you say, "Everything is hotel," what is this nonsense?

Prabhupāda: No, no. This is means less intelligent.

Dr. Patel: That is what I am...

Prabhupāda: Yes

Dr. Patel: I want to correct my intelligence.

Prabhupāda: If you say the furniture is hotel, that means less intelligent.

Dr. Patel: Ah, but then you take out the furniture, hotel will not be there.

Prabhupāda: That's all right, but you cannot say the furniture is the hotel.

Dr. Patel: I am arguing like a Buddha.

Prabhupāda: You cannot say that.

Dr. Patel: But then, that is also an argument.

Prabhupāda: That is nonsense argument. "Hotel is furniture."

Dr. Patel: Yes, it is.

Prabhupāda: No, no. I know that. I know that.

Dr. Patel: That is... Don't run away with that idea that I am disrespecting you.

Prabhupāda: And therefore I am pointing out your defects.

Dr. Patel: That's all right. I am prepared to correct it.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: But you, you keep mum. If I don't excite, you don't speak. So which way I shall excite you? (laughter throughout)

Prabhupāda: No. There is no question of excitement. When you put a question, I shall answer it from the śāstras. Just like it is, it is any child can understand. If I ask a child, "What is this?" "Hand." "What is this?" "Head." "What is this?" "Leg." Does he say, "Body"? So you are speaking less than a child. (laughter)

Dr. Patel: Hm. That is what I am. That is what I am. That is what I am.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Any child, if you ask him, "My dear child, what is this?" He'll say, "It is hand." "What is this?" "It is head." "What is this?" "Leg." Does he say, "All body"? You are speaking like that.

Prabhupāda: Just first of all try to understand.

Guest (1): Yes.

Prabhupāda: If you think that you are a shirt, that is ignorance, gross ignorance.

Guest (1): That's right, correct.

Prabhupāda: And if I have got this shawl, if I am thinking, "I am shawl," that is my ignorance. But either shawl or shirt, we are all individuals. That is (indistinct) This, this is ignorance. But ignorance or knowledge, we are all individual.

Guest (1): Body consciousness is not, I mean it is... Suppose somebody insults me.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Guest (1): Suppose somebody insults a God-minded person, and the God-minded person thinks, "Well, he's not insul..., he's insulting this body, and not the living entity in me." That means he has lost the body consciousness. Suppose if beats with a stick, and he goes...

Prabhupāda: No, no. That, that is ignorance. I have already explained.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Knowledge means knowledge of yourself. When you are actually in knowledge, then you will surrender to Kṛṣṇa... Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate (BG 7.19). That is knowledge. So long you do not surrender to Kṛṣṇa, you are in ignorance. Now, in ignorance, in ignorance I am surrendering to my wife, and in knowledge I'll have to surrender to Kṛṣṇa.

Guest (1): Correct.

Prabhupāda: That's all.

Guest (1): Both the times we are individuals. In both the times we are individuals. Correct.

Prabhupāda: Nityo nityānām.

Guest (1): Nityaḥ anityānām.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Dr. Patel: Some people say nityaḥ anityānām also.

Prabhupāda: No, no.

Prabhupāda: That, within the ghaṭa, that cannot be compared. The analogy's wrong. Within the ghaṭa the ākāśa, that is not individual.

Dr. Patel: That's what I say.

Prabhupāda: Yes, but we are individual.

Guest (1): That is individual, sir. As long as ghaṭa is there, you are individual ākāśa. That is correct.

Dr. Patel: These, all these analogies are nirdeśas. Nothing can explain or nothing can describe Brahman, beyond the reach of the mind and the tongue and the all the intelligence of a man.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Therefore tad viddhi praṇi... upadekṣyanti tad jñānaṁ jñāninas tattva-darśinaḥ. The tattva-darśī can.

Guest (1): Tattva-darśī can only do it.

Prabhupāda: One who is blind, one who is blind, one who is blind, he cannot.

Prabhupāda: "...better than me."

Guest (1): He has realized it.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Guru. Guru means he is heavier than you.

Guest (1): Heavier. Correct, correct.

Prabhupāda: So otherwise, where is the question of surrender? Nobody wants to surrender.

Dr. Patel: But the heavier, everyone...

Prabhupāda: Heavier means in knowledge.

Dr. Patel: According to the law of Newton also, heavy articles attract the light articles. You are heavier...

Prabhupāda: No, Newton was a rascal. You know Newton was a rascal?

Dr. Patel: I am also one. (laughter)

Prabhupāda: Newton was a rascal. He made two holes in the door. And one friend came, "Why you have made these two holes in your door?" He said, "There are two cats, bigger and the smaller. So let them go out." So he asked, "With the bigger hole the smaller cannot go?" "Yes, yes. You are right." (laughter) Any conditioned soul, he may be Newton or this or that, they are all rascals.

Prabhupāda: Is Kṛṣṇa partial?

Guest (1): No. As long as you're more conscious, then He gives you more knowledge.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no. Conscious is not. Because ye yathā māṁ prapadyante (BG 4.11). Because the surrender is not full, therefore he's also not fully realized.

Guest (1): He's not fully... Correct.

Prabhupāda: That is the point.

Guest (1): That's correct.

Prabhupāda: Ye yathā mām... That very word, prapadyante. Ye yathā māṁ prapadyante. So if your surrender is twenty-five percent, then Kṛṣṇa is realized twenty-five percent. If your surrender is cent percent, then Kṛṣṇa is realized cent percent.

Dr. Patel: Can I say the same yathā and tathā: "The way he surrenders, the way I give..."

Prabhupāda: That means proportionate.

Guest (1): Nanda-kiśora. Correct, correct.

Prabhupāda: "Nanda-kiśora, what I have got? I have got a restless mind and I have got my family, home, wife, children, and this body. This is my possessions. I am not the proprietor of the whole world or universe. But I am pro... I suppose, I think like that, that I have got a mind, think like nonsense and do like nonsense, and I have got this body, and I have got my family. So everything I surrender." This is surrender. Don't think anything else, what Kṛṣṇa does not like. That is first surrender. No reservation, that "So much I surrender to Kṛṣṇa, and I contemplate like this, like that, like that." That is not surrender.

Guest (1): That is not surrender.

Guest (2): And what about desires?

Prabhupāda: Desire, this is desire. This is desire, that you don't make your desire: "Kṛṣṇa, come. I'll see You." No, don't make that desire. If Kṛṣṇa likes, He will make His, I mean to say, audience before you. A devotee never says that "Kṛṣṇa, please come. I'll see You."

Ambarīṣa: ...was a... Did he have some particular pastimes?

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. (Hindi) (break) Another rascal you told.

Guest (1): Yes. Correct, correct.

Dr. Patel: Condemn. (break) ...convert these rascals:

Prabhupāda: That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement.

Dr. Patel: (Hindi) Nothing to do and no, no... (break) ...prāṇa, dharma...

Prabhupāda: He's no longer existing.

Dr. Patel: Government is not existing even by (indistinct). No, not by... (break) There is no...

Prabhupāda: They chant very (indistinct) Yes. Father, mother is sophisticated. (sound of children talking in Gujarati) Hare Kṛṣṇa!

Children: Hare Kṛṣṇa! Haribol!

Prabhupāda: Thank you very much. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Everywhere (indistinct) but their father will not say. Harer nāma (CC Adi 17.21). (break) We shall wait. (end)

Prabhupāda: Just like bodily action. Now you feel call of nature. So you have to pass urine.

Chandobhai: No, that is correct.

Prabhupāda: That's all

Dr. Patel: Does not attach.

Chandobhai: That action, you're not attached.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: At least, you are, you are...

Chandobhai: Udāsī, udāsīno... (break)

Prabhupāda: The sum total is how to become guṇātīta. That is bhakti-yoga.

Chandobhai: That is bhakti yoga. Last stage of bhakti, finally, is said like that, māṁ ca yo avyabhicāreṇa bhakti-yogena sevate.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the only guṇātīta position.

Chandobhai: Still moving, yeah.

Prabhupāda: That is not to be taken into account.

Chandobhai: That is not to be... Yes, correct. Because old, past actions.

Prabhupāda: Yes!

Chandobhai: Understood that the wheel has to move.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Chandobhai: And will stop soon.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. That... Because the switch is now off, it will stop. Śaśvad bhavati dharmātmā. Śaśvad bhavati dharmātmā. Because he has taken to the shelter of Kṛṣṇa, therefore his all past business is finished. Although, due to past habit, sometimes you find some mistake, it is not to be taken. Because this thing will go.

Prabhupāda: Now, why don't you hear?

Dr. Patel: I am hearing.

Prabhupāda: Why not... Just hear. It is very important point, that jyoti, it must come through some source.

Chandobhai: Jyoti has, jyoti has to come through source, correct.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And that is confirmed in the Brahmā-saṁhitā that yasya prabhā. Yasya prabhā prabhavato jagadaṇḍa-koṭi-koṭiṣv aśeṣa-vasudhādi vibhūti-bhinnam (Bs. 5.40). This creation, all the whole creation, even this material, that is depending on the brahma-jyotir. Therefore it is said, sarvaṁ khalv idaṁ brahma. Everything is depending on the brahma-jyotir. And that is confirmed also in the Bhagavad-gītā: mat-sthāni sarva-bhūtāni (BG 9.4). This mat-sthāni means...

Chandobhai: Within the Brahman.

Prabhupāda: Within the Brahman. And this Brahman is the effulgence of body of Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Amṛta. Brahman. That is confirmed in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam: brahmeti paramātmeti bhagavān iti śabdyate (SB 1.2.11). So the Brahman, Paramātmā and Bhagavān, they are, these, one and the same. But it is the person's realization. Now, common man, they can understand what is this sunshine, but they cannot know what is the sun globe, or what is within the sun globe.

Chandobhai: What is within... Yes, correct.

Prabhupāda: So those who are satisfied only brahma-jyotir, their knowledge is not yet perfect. They do not know wherefrom the brahma-jyotir comes, who is the source of brahma-jyotir.

Chandobhai: So He has stated here.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) ...as Paramātmā, He's kṣetra-jña of everybody.

Dr. Patel: So He knows the working of everybody.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Mr. Sar: Yes. Yogaṁ yuñjan mad-āśrayaḥ.

Prabhupāda: No, attachment we have got for material things. That we have to transfer. This is yoga practice.

Mr. Sar: That is yoga practice. Correct.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yoga indriya-saṁyamaḥ. Yoga, the... I think it is Patañjali sūtra.

Guest (1): Yoga citta bhūti yoga. (?)

Prabhupāda: Yes. Citta bhūti...

Guest (1): Yoga citta bhūti nirodha.

Prabhupāda: Nirodha. So our activities are now materially centered—how to satisfy the senses. All these so-called improvements, material improvements, means how to satisfy the senses. So this aśaktiḥ, attachment, for material sense gratification...

Guest (2): Has to be transferred.

Prabhupāda: To Kṛṣṇa. Yes. Mayy āsakta-manaḥ partha. This is yoga. This is bhakti-yoga.

Prabhupāda: To Kṛṣṇa. Yes. Mayy āsakta-manaḥ partha. This is yoga. This is bhakti-yoga.

Mr. Sar: It is said, jñānaṁ te sa-vijñānam.

Prabhupāda: But it can be done mad-āśrayaḥ. Āśrayaḥ, to take shelter. "Taking shelter of Kṛṣṇa," you can make this meaning or mad-āśrayaḥ means "one who has taken shelter of Kṛṣṇa."

Mr. Sar: Kṛṣṇa. Correct. Correct. That is correct.

Guest (1): Mad-āśrayaḥ means āśrayaḥ.

Prabhupāda: Either you... Directly it is not possible to take shelter of Kṛṣṇa. Therefore mad-āśrayaḥ means "one who has taken shelter of Me." That is paramparā system. You take shelter of Him. Then the result will be asaṁśayaḥ.

Passerby: Hello.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. Asaṁśayaḥ means at the present moment...

Guest (1): Without any doubts.

Prabhupāda: No... People are in doubt whether there is God, or "If there is God, He might have died by this time." So there are so many... (laughs) Yes. When I first went to U.S.A., the theory was "God is dead." But when I began to speak, they realized, "No, God is not dead. God is with Swamiji." They wrote. They wrote articles.

Dr. Patel: This... Please explain that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Dharma aviruddho. Dharma aviruddho means putrārthe kriyate bhāryā. Putrārthe bhāryā. Wife is accepted only for getting son, not for sexual intercourse. Putrārthe kriyate bhāryā. So when you have sex life simply for generating good son, that is Kṛṣṇa. And if you want to enjoy your senses, that is pāpa.

Mr. Sar: That's correct.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Mr. Sar: If you take that way, then the...

Prabhupāda: If you take contraceptive and enjoy sex life...

Mr. Sar: That is not allowed.

Prabhupāda: That is mahā-pāpa. That is killing. This is going on. This is going on. All over the world.

Dr. Patel: Ye caiva sāttvikā-bhāvā rājasās tāmasāś ca ye.

Mr. Sar: Matta eveti tān viddhi na tv ahaṁ teṣu te mayi.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Then you'll find, you'll find that he has surrendered. Vāsudevaḥ sarvam... He has no... "No, Vāsudeva, Kṛṣṇa, is everything."

Mr. Sar: Real jñānī is that who...

Prabhupāda: That is real jñānī.

Mr. Sar: ...who has surrendered himself. That is correct. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante (BG 7.19), jñānavān ..., vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti, sa mahātmā su-durlabhaḥ (BG 7.19).

Prabhupāda: Sa mahātmā su-durlabhaḥ.

Dr. Patel: Vāsudevaḥ sarvam etam...

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Mr. Sar: Sarvaṁ khalv idaṁ brahma.

Prabhupāda: Vāsudevaḥ sarvam idam means Vāsudeva is everything. Because... We already explained: There are two energies, prakṛti of Vāsudeva, one aparā and para. And whatever you see, this is combination of this aparā and para. Therefore Vāsudeva is everything.

Dr. Patel: No, no, no, no, no.

Prabhupāda: But my only ambition is that I don't speak anything else beyond Kṛṣṇa's speaking. That's all.

Mr. Sar: Correct sir. Just you are uncompromisingly speaking. That uncompromising you are speaking. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...places that "Swamiji, how you have done this wonderful thing?" And I do not know what is wonderful thing. But I know this that I do not adulterate. That's all. (break) That is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's mission. He says, yāre dekha, tāre kaha 'kṛṣṇa' upadeśa (CC Madhya 7.128). That's all. Āmāra ajñaya... Caitanya Mahāprabhu says... Dr. Patel, hear. Kṛṣṇa says, Caitanya Mahāprabhu says that āmāra ājñāya guru hañā tāra' ei deśa (CC Madhya 7.128). "You become a guru." Just see. "You become a guru by My order." Then one may say that "What qualification I have got that I can become guru?" That only qualification: yāre dekha, tāre kaha 'kṛṣṇa' upadeśa (CC Madhya 7.128). You don't require to manufacture any upadeśa. Whatever is there already spoken by Kṛṣṇa, you distribute it. You become guru. This is guru. Not that you are fool. Yes, I am fool. But I am not so fool like you that I adulterate.

Morning Walk -- April 1, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Etān samatītyaitān.

Dr. Patel: Brahma-bhūyāya kalpate (BG 14.26).

Prabhupāda: Brahma-bhūyāya... Yes. (break) ...only process to take to bhakti-yoga. (break) ...Hare Kṛṣṇa means always remain guṇātīta.

Mr. Sar: Yes, correct. Because you are always... (break)

Prabhupāda: ...Kṛṣṇa. Definitely. (break) ...not independently. (break)

Guest (5): ...why the Jesus says you offer the other cheek? Which is better? Is the choice of us to be violent or nonviolent?

Prabhupāda: Yes. The persons to whom Jesus Christ taught, they were already fighting. Therefore his first injunction is "Thou shalt not kill." They were already killers. You see? And Arjuna is a gentleman. He was thinking before killing. Therefore he has to be induced, "You kill like this." But they were already killers. Otherwise why Jesus Christ said, "Thou shalt not kill"? That means that society was accustomed to kill. (break) Yes, that (indistinct) circumstance.

Prabhupāda: That's all. (break) ...done not meant for Kṛṣṇa, that is for his own satisfaction. Just like Arjuna wanted to become nonviolent: "No, no, Kṛṣṇa. I cannot kill my kinsmen." That is a good proposal. But that was his satisfaction.

Guest (1): That is very correct.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That was his satisfaction. But Kṛṣṇa wanted that "You must fight." And when he agreed to that, that is his perfection. Before that, he was trying to satisfy he.

Guest (1): Yes. When he surrendered to Kṛṣṇa, that was his...

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the only purpose of life. Anything that is done, that is useless waste of time. Therefore Kṛṣṇa particularly said, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vra... (BG 18.66). That is ekam. You try to satisfy Kṛṣṇa only. That will give you perfection. Otherwise your own satisfaction, that's all.

Guest (1): Yes, very correct, very correct.

Prabhupāda: Whatever you do, that is your satisfaction. That is karma.

Morning Walk -- April 3, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Now, this is understanding of Bhagavad-gītā, that "Whatever you say, I accept as truth." Not that "This portion..." Interpretation: "This portion I don't like. This portion is nice." No. Everything is nice. Whatever Kṛṣṇa says, everything is correct. That is understanding.

Dr. Patel:

sarvam etad ṛtaṁ manye

yan māṁ vadasi keśava

na hi te bhagavān vyaktiṁ

vidur devā na dānavāḥ

(BG 10.14)

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: Vyaktim means?

Prabhupāda: Vyaktim means his personality, personality, vyaktim.

Dr. Patel: "Nobody knows Your personality in truth."

Prabhupāda: So foolish people cannot understand what is the Personality of Kṛṣṇa. Yes.

Morning Walk -- April 4, 1974, Bombay:

Indian man: Kṛṣṇa says that I am both personal, impersonal, and I am above that.

Prabhupāda: No, no. That imperson does not mean that He is not spiritually person. Impersonal means He does not become... That... This description of person, they are not these material persons.

Chandobhai: Ah, then it's all right. Spiritual personality, everyone believes. That's correct. Then there is no rift. Spiritual personality... (break)

Prabhupāda: Therefore it is said, avyaktaṁ vyaktim āpannaṁ manyante mām abuddhayaḥ (BG 7.24). They, these Māyāvādīs, they think, "Originally the Absolute Truth is avyakta. Now He has assumed, Kṛṣṇa, the form, accepting a body of māyā." This is called Māyāvāda. Abuddhayaḥ. They have no intelligence that spiritually the Lord is always vyakti, a person. Either Nārāyaṇa, Viṣṇu, Kṛṣṇa, any way, He is always person.

Girirāja: "He was garlanded gloriously and there were many scents smeared over His body."

Prabhupāda: It is all personal description: "Dress, ornaments, flowers, garlands, scents." This is offered to the person.

Prabhupāda: Therefore, if we are actually student of Bhagavad-gītā, we should accept it in total instead of deviating from that. That is my request. We are teaching that. Why one should deviate?

Indian man (2): Kṛṣṇa is one reality. He may have many forms. He may have many names. Kṛṣṇa is one reality. He is correct. But He can have many names. Eko sad-viprā bahudhā vadanti.

Prabhupāda: Bahudhā vadanti, but bahudhā are mentioned. Mentioned. Just like Viṣṇu-sahasra-nāma. That is in the śāstra. Therefore, if you take one of the names, then you have to refer to the śāstra, not that you manufacture one word. That you cannot do.

Indian man (2): The śāstras were also made by men, sages.

Prabhupāda: No, no, then which one you will accept?

Indian man (2): ...by the realized person.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Śāstra means...

Indian man (2): But you cannot say that in this age there are no realized persons.

Prabhupāda: No. It must corroborate.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Śāstra means...

Indian man (2): But you cannot say that in this age there are no realized persons.

Prabhupāda: No. It must corroborate.

Indian man (2): Corroborated by whom?

Prabhupāda: Corroborated by you. By you. If somebody says that "I am correct," then you have to refer to the śāstra whether he is correct or wrong. Just like a medical man. There is characteristic of certain chemicals. That is mentioned. So when accepting some chemical, the medical man tests in his laboratory whether it is correct. Not that somebody brings some chemical, some bunch of lime, and he says, "It is sodium chloride," or "Something, something." It must be tested. So the testing method is mentioned there, that the avatāra means, "This avatāra means his feature of body is this, his work is like this, he will come on such and such." Just like Kalki avatāra. Kalki avatāra, it is mentioned in the śāstra... Although He will come after four lakhs of years, it is stated in the śāstra that in Sambal... Sambal, in the house of Viṣṇu-josi, Kalki-avatāra will come.

Prabhupāda: Yeah, then we shall accept. Sādhu-śāstra-guru-vākya tinete karīyā aikya. Śāstra will say, and guru will say, "Yes, it is rightly said." Saintly person also will accept. Just like Kṛṣṇa is accepted by Arjuna. Paraṁ dhāma pavitraṁ paramaṁ bhavān. He immediately mentioned that "Such sage, authorities, accept. The śāstra says." Not that because Kṛṣṇa was His friend, he accepted blindly. No. That is corroboration. Whether it is mentioned in the śāstras, whether other saintly persons... Just like there are so many avatāras, but we have got our ācārya-sampradāya, Rāmānuja, Yamunācārya. Whether they are accepting? Not a third class man accepted, and it is accepted. The ācārya. Ācāryavān puruṣo veda. This is the way of accepting. (break) Everyone will create his authorities, and unlimited imitation of God will come into existence, and people will be diverted from the reality. (break) The same example, that "Here is an imitation medicine, very cheap, as good as the original one." Even taking it for acceptance that it is as good as the other one, but why in the presence of the original, I shall accept this imitation? What is your answer? Accepting this imitation is as good as the other, but if the other original is present, I can get it, why shall I go to the imitation? (break)

Indian man (2): No, no, that is my understanding. You correct me. According to me, Vedas are first.

Prabhupāda: Yes.