Prabhupāda: So you have to convince people like that, that it is not a sentimental institution. We are teaching the thing which is very absolutely needed for the human society. As soon as one becomes Kṛṣṇa conscious, his personal questions and problems are solved. And if others adopt the same principle, then social-political questions are also solved. So we have to teach. They will say it is not practical. Why not practical? No, anything is not, not practical. There are so many scientific... You discovered. Just like this tape recorder. This is advantageous to the human society. But it is not practical that everyone will have a nice tape recorder. That is not practical. But when you go to manufacture, say the discoverer, "Oh, that it is not practical; therefore it should not be manufactured." Similarly, Kṛṣṇa consciousness may not be practical for all, but that does not mean it should not be preached. The customer will take. Just like this tape recorder, one has got money, you have purchased, taking advantage. Similarly, there are many pious persons who can take Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Just like you have taken. You are not ordinary common men. There must have been some pious activities in your past lives. Therefore you have taken to this Kṛṣṇa consciousness seriously. Bhagavad-gītā says, yeṣāṁ tv anta-gataṁ pāpaṁ. (BG 7.28) A sinful person cannot understand Kṛṣṇa consciousness. It is said, yeṣāṁ tv anta-gataṁ pāpaṁ. One who has completely vanquished all sorts of sinful reactions. Now, the question may be that whether one can finish all sorts of sinful reactions within this material world. No, that is not possible. But it is possible also. What is that? That is also answered in the Bhagavad-gītā that "You give up everything. Surrender unto Me. I shall give you protection from all sinful reactions." So I may be sinful and there are so many reactions awaiting me for giving me trouble, but as soon as Kṛṣṇa takes charge of me, then everything is finished. How it can be finished? Because He is all-powerful, He's the supreme.
Common man (Conversations)
Conversations and Morning Walks
1968 Conversations and Morning Walks
1969 Conversations and Morning Walks
After many, many births. Jñānavān. Jñānavān means Vedāntist. Not... They have made it, that Vedāntist... Vedāntist, Vaiṣṇavas, they are also Vedāntist, but it has become a common sense, a common affair that the impersonalists, they are called Vedāntists. Because, due to Śaṅkarācārya's propaganda, they have made their position as Vedāntists. But common men, they do not know that the Vaiṣṇavas are the best Vedāntists. We shall discuss Vedānta here also. Vedānta... In Rāmānuja-bhāṣya there is... Perhaps you know, in your country. There is Rāmānuja-bhāṣya Vedānta. Madhvācārya, he has also written Vedānta-bhāṣya. Not only Śaṅkarācārya. But because the Vaiṣṇavas, they know bhāṣyam brahma-sūtrāṇām **. The Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam is the actual explanation of Vedānta. So therefore they take more interest in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam because that is the actual explanation of Vedānta.
1970 Conversations and Morning Walks
They knew the policy, if you create zamindar, landlord. They created this aristocratic class to support them. So when Gandhi and other leaders started this movement all the princes and zamindars, they were in favor of British. Therefore it took so much time to transfer. And as a retaliation, the common people have bereft them of their kingdom. "No more kingdom because you always supported Britishers." It is a great politics. Therfore they have taken... The zamindars, immediately after this attainment of independence, all the zamindars and kings were bereft of their possessions. You were in Calcutta? Oh, none of you were with me. We saw one house for purchasing. That was a big zamindar's house, Tagore Thakur(?) You saw? Yes. If you have saw... How nicely it was.
1971 Conversations and Morning Walks
Guest: Common person, a common man.
Prabhupāda: So Vedic authorities, authoritative statement, are accepted by the ācāryas. Just like India is governed by the ācāryas, Rāmānujācārya, Madhvācārya, and Śaṅkarācārya. They accept in that, and the followers accept them. The benefit is that whether cow dung is pure or impure, I do not waste my time, but because it is stated in the Vedas, I take it, so I save my time. Śruti-pramāṇa. In that way there are different statements in the Vedas for sociology and politics and anything because Vedas means knowledge. Vedas means knowledge. Vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyam (BG 15.15). Vetti veda vido jñāne.
Prabhupāda: Therefore, chaos. Daily everywhere, government is changing. Daily, weekly, this government, that government, that government. Why? Because they are not trained up how to administer. Therefore, that is required. Tejaḥ. First these administrators must be tejasī, īśvara bhava(?). (Sanskrit) Now there will be fight, and the administers will sit down on the nice couch and the common man will fight. Formerly kṣatriya came first of all. Like Arjuna, he is in the front. The other side, Duryodhana is in the front. So the fighter in that, "Oh, my master is there." But there is no kṣatriya. The administration is under the śūdra side. How they can manage? So they must be trained. As in business, we give training. Similarly, those who are going to take up the responsibility of administration, they should be trained. And who will train them? The brāhmaṇas, the śāstra, sādhu-śāstra-guru. And those who are common men, they will simply work under their direction. This division is already there, simply the training is not there.
1972 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: So was this material advancement less than this? And this is description of five thousand years ago. So here in Tokyo Kobe, in Japan there is so much industrials. We find the common man, 99% they are living on matchboxes. That's all. How many men are living in this nice apartment? The common man is living in matchbox. So this is not material advancement. A few people exploiting them in their factory. They are working and they are living in this nice building. But the common man is living in matchbox houses. We traveled these three hundred miles, or four hundred miles. We saw simply 99% matchboxes. What do you think, Bhānu? Is it not?
Prabhupāda: No. It is not Eastern. That is a wrong conception. God is for everybody. Eastern people, when I speak of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, they say, "What is this Kṛṣṇa? We know Kṛṣṇa. What we have to learn from Swamiji?" "Familiarity breeds contempt." But in the Western countries when we speak of Kṛṣṇa, they see the philosophy. They see the science and become attracted. We, in the very beginning, we neglect: "Oh, what is this Kṛṣṇa consciousness?" Otherwise there is no question of Western or Eastern. Kṛṣṇa is for everyone. Kṛṣṇa is neither Western, neither Eastern. But Eastern, our, especially Indians, they have learned to reject. That is their education: immediately reject it. This is their new culture, to reject everything. At least Jawaharlal Nehru began like that, "Anything Indian is bad. Everything London-made is good." That was his philosophy. And if one European would go to see him, immediately admission. And if an Indian goes to see him, three days he has to wait. So Jawaharlal made this impression, that "Everything Indian is bad, and anything made in London..." Because he was made in London. He was educated in London. So everything nice. Although in my household life I was doing some business in connection. I had to see Jawaharlal Nehru. So when he was common man, I went to his house.
1973 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Yes, exactly like Nārāyaṇa. Their bodily features... Just like here, you cannot distinguish by the bodily feature who is President Nixon, who is a common man. You cannot distinguish by the bodily feature. Similarly, there also, you cannot distinguish who is a common man and who is Personality of Godhead. They are like that.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: But still, there are plants and all the living entities in the Vaikuṇṭha...
Prabhupāda: Direction, yes. That is said, mayādhyakṣena prakṛtiḥ: (BG 9.10) "Under My direction." So if it is possible for a common man like me, how much it is possible for God? That we have to understand. Now I want to go to India, London. Now everything arrangement is made. I can go immediately. So similarly, if God wants to do something, why He has to do something? Everything, as soon as He desires, everything is there. He wants "Let there be material creation." There is, immediately. This is God. We are thinking in my terms. "Oh, such a huge universe! How a person can create? Where he got this tool? Where he's got the hammer? And how he constructed it?" I am thinking like that. Because I am limited, I am thinking in my limited way. So I am denying, "There is no God."
Krishna Tiwari: But the question is, on the left hand... Of course, in my opinion, and I think in the opinion of many scientists, there is no difference between a scientist or a common man or a religious man. Both..., all these people are trying to find out about their environment. So are the religious men. They want to find out more about themselves, about the nature they live in. They want to know more about it. They want to find out why they're here, how are they to live in this world, and so I do not think there is any difference between the two.
Prabhupāda: No, there cannot be difference.
Prabhupāda: Read the purport.
Pradyumna: "The Lord has spoken about the peculiarity of His birth. Although He may appear like an ordinary person, He remembers everything of His many, many past births, whereas a common man cannot remember what he has done even a few hours before. If someone is asked what he did exactly at the same time one day earlier, it would be very difficult for a common man to answer immediately. He would surely have to dredge his memory to recall what he was doing exactly at the same time one day before. And yet, men often dare claim to be God, or Kṛṣṇa. One should not be misled by such meaningless claims. Then again, the Lord explains His prakṛti, or His form.
Pradyumna: "Whatever action is performed by a great man, common men follow in his footsteps, and whatever standards he sets by exemplary acts, all the world pursues."
Prabhupāda: Yes. So therefore we are trying to make men like you interested. (Prabhupāda laughs)
Lord Brockway: Yes. Yes and no. I've lived in public life for sixty years. I've been in Parliament. I'm now in the House of Lords. But I don't regard myself as a great man in any sense at all.
Prabhupāda: So that is natu... That is good. Big, big man. Caitanya Mahāprabhu, He was lear... "I am fool number one." And the author of Caitanya-caritāmṛta, he says that "I am lower than the, a worm in the stool." So this is good attitude. Nobody... Sir Isaac Newton also used to say that "What knowledge I have got. I have simply collected..." They're... Every, every big man thinks like that. That is good attitude. But there is comparative study, that "Here is a big man, here is a common man." So our proposition is that it is a great science, great philosophy. So western countries, they are intelligent, especially the Britain, British people. They had very good opportunity. Still they have got opportunity. So my request is that let us study this philosophy and science and if possible introduce it in the human society. That is our proposal.
Prabhupāda: Rahasya means it is little difficult to understand. (break) Just like Kṛṣṇa says in the Bhagavad-gītā: rahasyam, rahasyam etad uttamam. Rahasyam etad uttamam. This Bhagavad-gītā is the first-class mystic. Rahasyam etad uttamaṁ bhakto 'si me priyo 'si me (BG 4.3). "Because you are My devotee, you are My dear friend, you'll understand." So mysticism is not understandable by common man. It requires a special qualification. Just like to understand. It is also mysticism. Understand, to understand God. This is also mystic. It is not understandable by ordinary man.
Prabhupāda: They do not know what is spiritual. They do not know what is this sky even, what to speak of spiritual sky.
Karandhara: Prabhupāda, many theologians will say privately that they believe in God or they want to believe in God but they cannot speak of God to the common people because the people are so agitated, they don't want to hear of God.
Prabhupāda: No, we are speaking. We are speaking to the common man. We do not hesitate. We say, "Here is Kṛṣṇa, God."
Prabhupāda: It is successful. If one man comes to hear, that is successful. But we have to see that, after spending so much money...
Devotee: Yes.
Prabhupāda: ...better to call a small meeting of the learned scholars and talk with them about our philosophy because even if you advertise common man is not interested. They think, "Oh, what is this?" Even the so-called higher circles. The best thing is to collect some... Just like ordinary meeting it is done. That is better. Why should you spend unnecessarily on advertising.
Prabhupāda: We are preaching God consciousness. So is it not for everyone? God consciousness is sectarian? Is it meant for certain sect? Or it is meant for human beings?
Hṛdayānanda: The difficulty is that nowadays every common man has his own God..., theory of God consciousness.
Prabhupāda: No, no, every common man he says "I got my mathematics." Will he be accepted?
Hṛdayānanda: No.
Prabhupāda: So why these things should be allowed? That is our proposition. Every man will say, "No, I've got my own mathematics." Will he be allowed? So we have to fight, otherwise what is the meaning of preaching?
Prabhupāda: Yes. They cannot say that they don't want authority. They cannot say. The authority is already there.
Karandhara: Well, the common people are crying for authority, leadership.
Prabhupāda: Therefore you have to teach them how to elect leader. These are the qualification of the leaders. He must not be sinful. Then he can be. (break) ...people will find in our camp. (break)
Prajāpati: ...one philosopher atheist by the name Bertrand Russell, he tries to prove that God does not exist by saying that people who say God exists, say that God is, everything has a cause and that the first cause is God, and Bertrand Russell says, "Well, if everything has a cause, then God also must have a cause. So that, there must be no God."
1974 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: They are so good Christian that at the time of danger, they're all going away to Canada. Just see-afraid of death, even though they are preaching themselves, priest, they are also the same common man, afraid of death. And if we people keep to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, we are not afraid of death. For going from one place to another, that's all. Going home, nobody becomes afraid going back to home. He becomes pleased. (break) You avoid death, there is no death. Viṣaya.(?) If we simply practice this, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare/ Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma... No more death. Finished death. This is a fact. (break) ...or do something for Kṛṣṇa. Don't waste time, single moment. Then your... No more death. Because this is deathless condition. And the changing of the body, that is momentary, that is all.
Prabhupāda: Yes. And in the Bhagavad-gītā also, the Lord says that "This, My form, is not understood by common men."
Mr. Sar: Divyaṁ dadāmi te cakṣuḥ.
Dr. Patel: Mama māyā duratyayā, mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti te (BG 7.14).
Prabhupāda: But actually, brahmeti paramātmeti bhagavān iti śabdyate (SB 1.2.11). So gradual process, go to the Absolute Truth—Brahman, Paramātmā, and last is Bhagavān. The Bhagavān realization is the real realization, not Brahman, not... This is partial. (looking at something on beach) It is already dead.
Dr. Patel: So they have taken to it. I don't...
Prabhupāda: That is another thing. That is another thing. Just like opium. Opium, for common man, it is bad. But you are a physician; you can use opium, tincture opium for some certain use.
Dr. Patel: Therefore I say.
Prabhupāda: That is another thing.
Dr. Patel: Same thing, I say. The same reasoning.
Prabhupāda: But they are not physicians. They are ordinary men.
Dr. Patel: So it is bad for them.
Prabhupāda: Amṛta. Brahman. That is confirmed in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam: brahmeti paramātmeti bhagavān iti śabdyate (SB 1.2.11). So the Brahman, Paramātmā and Bhagavān, they are, these, one and the same. But it is the person's realization. Now, common man, they can understand what is this sunshine, but they cannot know what is the sun globe, or what is within the sun globe.
Chandobhai: What is within... Yes, correct.
Prabhupāda: So those who are satisfied only brahma-jyotir, their knowledge is not yet perfect. They do not know wherefrom the brahma-jyotir comes, who is the source of brahma-jyotir.
Prabhupāda: That is unnecessary. Everyone will say, "What I am spending unnecessarily that is my relax." (break) ...government officer will have a big bungalow and now there is act that "Others, if he has got a big bungalow like this bungalow, this is unnecessary." Now it is prepared to act(?). And for minister, it is relax, and for common man it is unnecessary. This is then... "Smoking for me, it is relax, and for you it is unnecessary." These rascals are preaching like that. If smoking is unnecessary, it is unnecessary for me and for you also. "No. For me it is relax." (break) Is that their advertisement? Save money?
Prabhupāda: Is it not miracle?
Satsvarūpa: Yes. Some of those devotees like Tripurari, a hundred big Bhāgavatams. It's not a popular book.
Prabhupāda: It is not popular actually. For the common man it is dry subject. And I have heard that after reading one book, somebody comes to purchase. "What is this, Bhāgavata?" "We have got six." "All right, give me six volumes." He is not a devotee. Why he purchases all the six volumes of Bhāgavatam? In London our Bhagavad-gītā As It Is was sold in two months, thirty thousand copies. That is the report. Thirty thousand copies.
Prabhupāda: Common man may not follow or cannot, but those who are teachers or the priest or the leaders or the executive head, they must follow. Otherwise they cannot remain pure and they cannot take the position of teacher or head. Head must be clean. Other parts may be unclean, but the head must be clean; otherwise the whole business will be spoiled. Therefore, the strictures, rules and regulation, must be followed by four persons. One person is the executive head like the president or the king. And the other person is the religious preacher, priest. And the other person is the public leader. So at least these three, four heads of the men's human society, they must be of ideal character.
Prabhupāda: I would say "If he has no brain, what is the use of going to a meeting?" (laughter) Our only... Śva-viḍ-varāhoṣṭra-kharaiḥ saṁstutaḥ puruṣaḥ paśuḥ (SB 2.3.19). The men are like dogs, hogs, camels and asses. What they will do? Meeting of the dogs, hogs, camels and asses will be any beneficial to the society? We are very pessimistic, and our conclusion, that anyone who is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he is dogs, hogs, camels, asses, that's all. No brain, animal. Animal has got brain: how to eat, how to sleep, how to have sex life. So these people, they have got brain for that purposes only. That is animal life. Actually, they do not know what is the aim of life, why people should be educated, why human society should be organized. They do not know. Bahir-artha-māninaḥ. Enamored by these big, big buildings. That's all. "Oh, they are so advanced." And naturally, the common man comes to the European or American city, he says, "Oh, Americans are very rich." "Rich" means they have piled up stones and bricks, that's all. This is their richness. What is there in the richness here? But people are common men.
Prabhupāda: So it is confirmed by the greatest authority, and if we practice... This practice can be done in the association of devotees. And that is perfection of life. There are some conditions about self-control: no meat-eating, no fish, no eggs, no illicit sex life, and no intoxication, even smoking, drinking tea, and no gambling. And chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra and thinking of Kṛṣṇa. That's all. Very easy. And everyone can perform it without undergoing the bodily exercises, which is sometimes difficult for a common man. So one can adopt this bhakti-yoga process and become perfect. And this is confirmed in the Bhagavad-gītā. Yaṁ yaṁ vāpi smaran bhāvaṁ tyajaty ante kalevaram (BG 8.6). If one becomes accustomed to this habit and at the time of death, he thinks of Kṛṣṇa, then his life is perfect. Yaṁ yaṁ vāpi smaran?
Prabhupāda: "Why you are praying to God? You pray to us, the government. We shall give you enough bread." The Communist propaganda is like that. They send the people to the church, "So you pray." So they pray. "Have you got bread?" They say, "No, sir." "Now pray to us." "Give us, sir," and he gives hundreds of breads. In this way, they are making atheist. Because common man cannot argue, neither they know so much logic. But if there is some intelligent man, he will ask immediately that "Wherefrom you have got this bread? Who has given you the wheat? That you have not manufactured; that is given by God." So actually God gives, but the Communists take the credit that "I give." This is the misconception. If God does not supply you... Eko bahūnāṁ vidadhāti kāmān, He is supplying for everyone. So if He does not supply, then what your bakery machine will do? It is useless.
Prabhupāda: Yes, you have to make him intelligent. Everyone is fool, mūḍha. Everyone within this material world is supposed to be a fool. Because everyone is thinking, "I am this body." So he's fool. "I am Indian," "I am American," "I am German," "I am Frenchman," "I am this," "I am that." What is the difference? A cat is thinking, "I'm cat." A dog is thinking, "I am dog." So if somebody thinks that, in relationship with the body, "I am Frenchman," "I am Englishman," "I am...", then where is the difference between the cat and the dog? He's thinking himself as this body. Therefore everyone is thinking, at least in this modern world, the so-called nationalism, everyone is thinking, "I am Englishman," "I am Frenchman," "I am Indian," "I am this," "black," "white." So everyone is fool. Is it not? Yes. He's thinking in a way what he is not. Therefore he's a fool. All these big, big political leaders, Napoleon, Hitler, Churchill, and in Europe , they fought with this consciousness, "I am Englishman," "I am German," "I am Frenchman." That's all. Even the big, big leaders, they are fools. And what to speak of common men?
Yogeśvara: Śrīla Prabhupāda?
Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa:
- yad yad ācarati śreṣṭhas
- tat tad evetaro janaḥ
- sa yat pramāṇaṁ kurute
- lokas tad anuvartate
- (BG 3.21)
Translation, "Whatever action is performed by a great man, common men follow in his footsteps. And whatever standards he sets by exemplary acts, all the world pursues."
Pṛthu Putra: (French) (pause)
Yogeśvara: When we were at your meeting a few weeks ago, there was, we felt very encouraged because there was very nice interest in how it was that these young western boys and girls had been able to take to this form of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. (French)
Lady (1): (French)
Yogeśvara: Last night, at the conference hall, this lady heard your lecture about how the soul reincarnates in different kinds of bodies. So she wants to know how is this possible because in the West, our understanding is that the animal forms do not possess a soul.
Prabhupāda: How does..., she can prove that she does not, it does not possess a soul.
1975 Conversations and Morning Walks
Guest (1): Swamiji, my main question is although spiritualism is the Absolute Truth, can we not in some way make spiritualism in such a way, modify it in such a way, as to help the common people?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Guest (1): The masses.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that we are doing.
Guest (1): They have been steeped in ignorance for such a long time, it will take a long time to bring them into the fold of spiritualism.
Devotee (5): Just like Kṛṣṇa says. What the big men do, the common men follow.
Prabhupāda: He gave me first money for publishing Kṛṣṇa book, $19,000. He is a good boy. He is a good boy, and he has got good regard for me.
Devotee (3): He just recently went on a concert tour around the country, and he was having the young people chant Kṛṣṇa's names in the concert. And because of the concert tour, many, many, many books were distributed, unlimited.
Prabhupāda: Oh, his song, "Kṛṣṇa..." I have forgotten that. That record?
Prabhupāda: That's it. (says something in Hindi regarding daṇḍavat) (chuckles) That is very good. That is our process. Sāṅkhya-pūrvaka-nāma-gana-natibhiḥ. The Vaiṣṇavas, they chanted with a numerical strength, sāṅkhya-pūrvaka. Sāṅkhya-pūrvaka-nāma-gana-natibhiḥ. Nāma means chanting of the holy name. Gana means also prayer. And also daṇḍavat. Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī, he took vow that "So many times I will offer daṇḍavat." So these things are... If this child simply offers daṇḍavat to the Vaiṣṇava or Viṣṇu, so it will not go in vain. Even if he does not know any śāstra, simply offers obeisances, that will also be taken into credit. It is so nice thing. Sāṅkhya-pūrvaka-nāma-gana-natibhiḥ kālāvasāni-kṛtau. So therefore Deity worship is recommended. So if anyone does not know anything, if he simply comes and offers obeisances, that is also nice. Therefore Deity worship is important for the common man.
Prabhupāda: I do not bring in any guru. We are talking between ourselves. Don't bring any guru. Just talk as common men. So whether you agree to this point?
Haṁsadūta: Understand?
Girl: Yes.
Prabhupāda: There is no question of guru. It is a question of common sense.
Haṁsadūta: (German)
Girl: (German)
Prabhupāda: It is very simple thing, that "I am changing my body, and similarly, I'll change this body." This should be understood by my present circumstances of life, and it is confirmed by the greatest authority, Kṛṣṇa. Knowledge by authority and knowledge by experience, both things are there.
Prabhupāda: That is speculation. If you want to study me, so you can do so either by approaching me or through one of my confidential servant. How one can understand me from outside by speculating? Why do they come to see me? Let them remain far away and speculate. But that is not possible in ordinary common sense also. So how they speculate about God? If you cannot understand even a common man, maybe very big in the society, you cannot understand a common man by hearsay, by speculation...
Prabhupāda: No, Rādhā... There, Bhāgavata, there is. That is foolish proposition, "In the Bhāgavata there is no Rādhārāṇī." There is. But at least in the Bhagavad-gītā, Kṛṣṇa has never said about His Vṛndāvana-līlā. No. That is very confidential. That is not for common man. The common man, first of all let him understand what is Kṛṣṇa. That is Bhagavad-gītā. That they do not understand. Even big, big leaders, politicians, scholars, they do not understand. Because they do not take to Kṛṣṇa's instruction, therefore they fail to understand. And what they'll understand about Rādhārāṇī? You... If you are my confidential friend, then I can take to my family. And if you are outsider, why should you expect to come into my family life? This is common sense. You do not understand Kṛṣṇa, and you want to understand Kṛṣṇa's dealings with Rādhārāṇī. That is very confidential.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Somebody, they act... Just like illicit sex. They did not know that it is sinful. Now they are understanding. There was no good leader. Even the priests. In the Bible it is said, "Thou shalt not kill." The priests never said, because they are meat-eaters. They themselves are meat-eaters. How they can say? "It is our tradition to eat meat." But how the common man will be educated? (break) You can give me the general prasāda today. I will taste. (test?) (break) When one becomes rich, he becomes lazy. What is called? "Leads to poverty"? Luxury. "Luxury leads to poverty." So at one time one become very rich by hard work, and next generation gets the money for nothing, he spends it on luxuries, and the third generation, poor.
Prabhupāda: Government means they are full of rascals. Government by the people. So you are all rascals, the government is also rascal. Your democracy means government by the people for the people. So all the people are rascals, beginning from the Pope down to the common man. Therefore the government is rascal.
Paramahaṁsa: But not all of us are Christians. Some of us are Muslims, and in the Koran Mohammed says that eating meat is all right. In fact it is required to be a good Muslim, to eat meat.
Prabhupāda: They spoke in the desert. What will they eat? But you are not in the desert. Meat-eating is a crude form of eating when people are uncivilized. When there is no other food, you cannot produce. But when you are civilized, when you learn how to produce other foods, why would you eat meat? How are you civilized?
Prabhupāda: No, why? They knew. Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). "I am not going to die after the annihilation of this body." It was a common understanding. Not that such a man, big man, director, he says, "No, no, I don't believe in the soul." (chuckles) Therefore I said the fourth-class man. In India still, even a common man, uneducated farmer, he believes. He believes. He believes in God. He believes in transmigration. He believes in his karma. These things which will take thousands of years to be learned by the Westerners, even the common man knows still.
Devotee (1): And all Kṛṣṇa's soldiers were killed?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Because we are doing business, we are getting money from these rascal government, so if you expose me, then I will not get money, and if I expose you, you will not get money. Let us remain together and let them remain fools. That's all. This is it. If a common man like me can understand the whole policy, how the scientist will not understand? But they have made a compromise that "Don't expose me, I'll not expose you, and let us take money from the government." This is going on.
Prabhupāda: Mahā. Mahā means very great. So unless one has very big understanding, he cannot understand God. God is unlimited. So you have (to) come to that platform to understand. Those who are limited, they cannot understand God. That is not possible. Manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu kaścid yatati siddhaye, yatatām api siddhānām (BG 7.3). Siddha. Siddha means one who has become unlimited, Brahman, ahaṁ brahmāsmi, Brahman realization. So Kṛṣṇa says, manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu: "Out of many millions of person," kaścid yatati siddhaye, "somebody is trying to become unlimited." And yatatām api siddhānāṁ: (BG 7.3) "Those who have become unlimited, out of millions of them, one can understand Me, Kṛṣṇa." So Kṛṣṇa understanding, God understanding.... When I say Kṛṣṇa, God. God understanding is for the perfect unlimited, not for common man. Common man should accept the ācāryas. They must follow. Ācāryopāsanam. Just like in India the Sikhs, they follow Guru Nanak.
Prabhupāda: Small, one storied. They are aristocratic. They do not go to the skyscraper, common man.
Bali-mardana: They like the idea of one house.
Prabhupāda: That is good idea. That is Indian idea. (break)
Devotee (2): ...front of the hedges, all those hedges in the front? They produce this flower.
Prabhupāda: Very nice. Very good. Puṇyo gandhaḥ pṛthivyāṁ ca. As soon as such fragrance, one should remember Kṛṣṇa: "This is Kṛṣṇa." Puṇyo gandhaḥ pṛthivyāṁ ca. (break) Where is that scientist? Just like from the earth we are getting so many varieties of flavor and taste. The fruits are different taste, the flowers different fragrance, but wherefrom it is coming? From the earth. So why the scientists do not take all these things from the earth?
Prabhupāda: Therefore too much attachment for material enjoyment is disqualification for spiritual life. So the western world is trained up for being too much attached to material enjoyment. Therefore lagging behind in spiritual life. Vedic civilization is not to encourage too much for material enjoyment. Minimize. That is Indian civilization. They, if they had money they used to spend for constructing big temple, not for residential house. Maybe the king only had a big palace. Common men, they didn't care for big palace, the palatial building. Common man would be very glad to live in a cottage, and a small garden for growing vegetables, fruits, small lake, that's all. Not wasting time for big, big buildings, big, big... What is called, amenities?
Devotee: Śrīla Prabhupāda, because you are presenting this knowledge so purely, then it's possible for the common man to understand this knowledge without chanting and following the four regulative principles.
Prabhupāda: That is not possible. That is not possible. Ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12). You have to cleanse the mirror of your consciousness, then the reflection will be properly viewed. If you keep it dirty, then it is not possible. Therefore we require first-class men to understand this philosophy, not the fourth-class man. If you keep him fourth-class man, it is not possible.
Devotee (2): We are giving these books to so many common men. Then the books will attract them to perhaps chanting and following the regulative principles.
Prabhupāda: Yes, if they read. Even if they touch. That is the difference between this book and ordinary book. Even they touch and they read one line and says, "Oh, it is very nice," he makes a step forward. If he simply says this word, "Oh, it is very nice," that is sufficient to bring him. Therefore I am trying to push. He has paid some money. He will then say, "What these nonsense have written. Let me see." (laughter) And if he sees and says, "Oh, it is very nice," then the beginning is immediately. Therefore we are trying to push. At least let him say, "It is very nice."
Bahulāśva: Actually, the fact is that now the scientists are spending so much money on this research, but the research is only being used in their personal homes. The common people have never seen any of these great devices. This one devotee, Jayarama, his uncle is a big scientist. He has created this radio telescope. So I saw pictures of his personal home, and it must cost about $300,000. All these scientific devices he has. But the people never see those things. (break)
Paramahaṁsa: ...and for all the success of scientific advancement, they have not created any love for God or their fellow man.
Prabhupāda: That is the defect. They should scientifically explain what is Kṛṣṇa. Then their science is perfect. Idaṁ hi puṁsas tapasaḥ śrutasya vā (SB 1.5.22), education, tapasya, sviṣṭasya sūktasya ca buddha-dattayoḥ, charity and gentleness, all good qualities. So kavibhiḥ nirūpito. Kavibhiḥ, big personalities they have decided, yad-uttamaśloka-guṇanuvarṇanam.
Prabhupāda: Who is he ignorant of?
Bahulāśva: The common man.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Are the impersonalists better than the gross materialists?
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is Śaṅkara's philosophy. Brahma satyaṁ jagan mithyā. That is his philosophy. Brahman means that spirit soul, that is fact. And this material external, that is false. A little advanced than the Buddha philosophy.
Bahulāśva: Śrīla Prabhupāda, how is it that they describe the soul, the impersonalists?
Prabhupāda: Ah. Śraddhāvān, That is required. If he has no faith, then he remains in darkness.
Devotee (6): If we save the common people by giving them prasādam, how can we save the impersonalists?
Prabhupāda: That will come later on. (break) ...ists will not come. They will never come because they do not believe in the personal feature of God. Unless very hungry, he will not come because he does not believe in prasāda, does not believe in God.
Guest (3) (Indian man): Have you any program for the common people?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Common people have joined. Everyone. We are opening centers so that any common man from any caste, any creed, any nation, they can come and join.
Guest (2): My friend, perhaps you would like to do... I know you are doing some social work for...
Prabhupāda: This is the best social work. We are making animal into man. Already I have begun this, that because they are not educated how to become human being, so they remain animals. So this is the best social work, that we are bringing animals, two-legged animals, to real human being. If a human being is not properly educated, he remains an animal. So this is the proper education. Therefore we are bringing animals to human being.
Prabhupāda: Actually I want to speak only to the intelligent... (break) ...the common mass, they will not understand. But we can perform kīrtana for the common men, so that they may be purified.
Guest (1): Excuse me. I mean in your presence there must be some program like kīrtana or...
Prabhupāda: Anyway, this idea of society, of your culture, general mass of people, especially nowadays, it is very difficult. So if the leaders understand-yad yad ācarati śreṣṭhaḥ (BG 3.21)—then the common mass will follow.
Prabhupāda: Therefore I say the Indian, the leading Indians here, if they make a program, the common will follow. And everything is described in the Bhagavad-gītā, how society should be conducted.
Guest (3): But I think, Swamiji, common men follow only swamis, not the leaders or the priests.
Prabhupāda: The idea is: the common men, they expect something, especially Indians, that India has got some spiritual culture. So every human being is seeking after spiritual culture, but unfortunately, at the present moment they are doing something which is not very desirable, the so-called swamis and yogis. I do not wish to describe them.
Prabhupāda: Indian culture is given (Hindi), that to allow them to worship the demigods means at least to accept the authority, and then they gradually come to the supreme authority. Just like for the common man, to give respect to the police constable means giving respect to the government. But the police constable is not the president of the government. So one should know who is the president. That is advancement. If you remain, simply offering respect to the constable, that is not advancement.
Prabhupāda: You are a rascal. That is the proof you are a rascal. (laughter)
Devotee (1): We need defense so we have to work hard to keep defense, economy. The common man has to contribute to the state to keep its defense.
Prabhupāda: Defense, that means...
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: That's today... Unless there is very complex society...
Devotee (1): Otherwise we will be exploited.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Unless there is a very complex...
Prabhupāda: Pick out. And rest, who is neither brāhmaṇa nor kṣatriya nor vaiśya, then he is śūdra. That's all, very easy thing. If he cannot be trained up as engineer, then he remains as a common man. There is no force. This is the way of organizing society. There is no force. Śūdra is also required.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Now the incentive in modern society to become educated or to become engineer is money. What is the incentive in Vedic culture?
Devotee (3): We see Kṛṣṇa as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, but they see Him as a common man like themselves also.
Prabhupāda: Therefore they are mūḍhas. Avajānanti māṁ mūḍhāḥ. Only the mūḍhas can deride. Avajānanti māṁ mūḍhā mānuṣīṁ tanum āśritaḥ (BG 9.11). It is stated already.
Devotee (3): Then how is it that some people do finally come to accept Kṛṣṇa?
Prabhupāda: Yes. They come in the paramparā system, through guru. Tad-vijñānārtham sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). Therefore you have to go to guru to understand. You cannot understand personally. That is not possible. Therefore our system is to see through the guru and śāstra, not by these naked eyes. That is misleading.
Prabhupāda: Nobody is authority. That is our first assertion. Nobody is authority. Therefore we have placed Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Kṛṣṇa is only authority. All rascals. That is our first assertion-(aside:) Good morning—that except Kṛṣṇa there is no authority. And one who follows Kṛṣṇa, he is authority.
Devotee (3): Why are the so-called scientists trying to make the common people believe that...
Prabhupāda: Because they are so-called scientists. You have already explained. Why you are asking? (laughter) You have already explained, "so-called scientists." That's all. They are not scientists; they are so-called scientists.
1976 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: No, recently we have published very important book, Nectar of Instruction. For common man it is very nice. (break) Yesterday's lecture you liked?
Indian men: Yes. (Hindi) (break)
Dhṛṣṭadyumna: ...sleep on the streets. They've arranged this housing, it is very minimal. So what many of these slumdwellers do when people are living on the streets is they come here, and they go back and live on the streets, but they rent out the apartment that the government has given them and they keep the money. They go back and live on the streets.
Prabhupāda: Because it is spoken by Kṛṣṇa. Itihāsa also Vedic literature. Pañcama-veda, Mahābhārata, for understanding of the common man. Strī-śūdra-dvija-bandhūnāṁ trayi na śruti-gocarāḥ (SB 1.4.25). Woman, śūdra, and dvija-bandhu, they cannot understand directly the Vedas.
Acyutānanda: But even Bhisma, when he was on the battlefield, he said, "I have given up my bheda-jña," so he became one.
Prabhupāda: One you are already. Because you are foolish, you cannot understand. That is abheda. I am not different. Just like my finger is not different from me. If the finger thinks, "I am different from the body," that is ignorance.
Prabhupāda: "Perhaps." "Might be." "It was like this and that..." What is that explanation?
Guru-kṛpā: Well, the common man doesn't challenge that.
Prabhupāda: Mean common men are fool. But why we should accept?
Bhagavān: If they could really explain it, so many things would not be going wrong.
Prabhupāda: Hm?
Bhagavān: If they could actually explain it, so many things would not be going wrong. The thing is, their explanation causes more problems.
Prabhupāda: It is not their fault. The Western civilization is like that. Now you have to make a thorough change. The persons from the ecclesiastical order, they are also so polluted, they are sanctioning homosex, abortion. What can be done for the common man?
Madhudviṣa: I was reading in the paper the other day, how the Catholic church has drastically declined in the last ten years.
Prabhupāda: They must decline.
Madhudviṣa: They are losing one billion dollars a year in donations because they cannot...
Prabhupāda: We met station platform, means...(?) That is another thing(?).
Dr. Patel: Otherwise for common people, it is very difficult
Indian man (1): One man was waiting in a queue for four hours. Did not see. And he came back.
Dr. Patel: There is a fee. There is a fee for going.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: In some places, even if you have money, you cannot see, like Jagannātha.
Prabhupāda: It is to be spoken to the most confidential person. "You are My dear friend; I am talking." Other rascals will not understand. It is especially for Arjuna, not for the common man.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: "...I am speaking to you this most confidential part of knowledge. Hear this from Me, for it is for your benefit."
Prabhupāda: "That is especial friendship and especial love; so I give you this. Keep it confidential." This is real. Other rascals will not value this. They will protest, "Huh? Why shall I surrender to Kṛṣṇa?"
Prabhupāda: Not kill them with weapon, but kill them by saṅkīrtana. They are already dead, so physically killing is for very big, big, strong man like Mao, or this Lenin, like that. Not common people, they have to be shown mercy.
Hari-śauri: More a question of revival, for the common people, more a question of revival.
Prabhupāda: If they allow us to forward our movement, then we are satisfied. And when there is hindrance, the person who is hindering, finished. But don't do it now, (chuckles) then you will be finished.
Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa's representative means the representative says the same thing as Kṛṣṇa says. Kṛṣṇa says "Surrender unto Me," and the representative says "Surrender to Kṛṣṇa." And because he delivers the real knowledge, he's as good as Kṛṣṇa. Therefore sākṣād-dharitvena samasta-śāstrair uktas tathā bhāvyata eva sadbhiḥ **. The spiritual master may appear to be just like a common man, but he is to be respected as God, because he delivers the real message of God. That is the qualification of spiritual master. He does not manufacture anything. That is very easy. If I carry your message and educate people in that way, then there is no difficulty for me. Everything is there. Why shall I go to manufacture something imperfect? The perfect thing is already there. Simply I have to carry. A post peon—the money order is there, he has to simply carry and deliver to the person.
Nalinīkaṇṭha:
- sarva-guhyatamam bhūyaḥ
- śṛṇu me paramaṁ vacaḥ
- iṣṭo 'si me dṛḍham iti
- tato vakṣyāmi te hitam
"Because you are My very dear friend, I am speaking to you the most confidential part of knowledge. Hear this from Me, for it is for your benefit." Purport. "The Lord has given Arjuna confidential knowledge of the Supersoul within everyone's heart, and now He is giving the most confidential part of this knowledge: just surrender unto the Supreme Personality of Godhead. At the end of the Ninth Chapter He has said, 'Just always think of Me.' The same instruction is repeated here to stress the essence of the teachings of Bhagavad-gītā. This essence is not understood by a common man, but by one who is actually very dear to Kṛṣṇa, a pure devotee of Kṛṣṇa. This is the most important instruction in all Vedic literature. What Kṛṣṇa is saying in this connection is the most essential part of knowledge, and it should be carried out not only by Arjuna but by all living entities."
Prabhupāda: Then next verse.
Prabhupāda: No, India believes. India have no authority.
Hṛdayānanda: I think now there is.... People are becoming more interested in this theory. They say theory. I think there is more interest now. I'm talking to common people. They're...
Prabhupāda: So if there is next life—they believe—then what they are doing for the next life?
Rāmeśvara: The Christians only believe in one life, and after that one life you either go to heaven or to hell forever.
Prabhupāda: For a common man it is little difficult, but it is very easy. We are talking of the spiritual platform, but common man does not understand what is spiritual, although it is very easy. My body, your body, is moving on account of spiritual spark. That's a fact; everyone can see. As soon as the spiritual spark, soul, is off, the body, it is simply lump of matter. That is a fact; everyone can see. But still they are not serious to understand what is that spiritual spark. There is no education. Mostly they are thinking there is no spiritual spark, the body is moving.... How it is moving? What is their explanation?
Prabhupāda: There are two things. One is your body and the other, the living force which is moving your body. There is no question of decision; it is already decided. There are two things. But our point is that two things are there, the material body and the moving force. So what we are speaking, we are speaking of the living force, moving force, and people in general, they're interested with this body. Therefore our subject matter is little difficult for such common man. We are speaking simply on the subject matter of that living force, what is that living force. Our beginning is from that point, that body is different from the living force. And general people, they do not understand. Although they feel that there is living force something, they say it is chemical combination and so on, so on.
Prabhupāda: The lords are roaming on the street. I have seen many lords. They're ordinary.... Even they haven't got car. The Queen also, just like ordinary, common man. Royal family.
Rāmeśvara: One day America will be poor like that also.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Luxury leads to poverty. When the American becomes too much luxurious, they'll not be able to defend their country. Then it will be finished.
Rāmeśvara: That is the fear even now, that America has lost their fighting spirit against the Communists.
Hari-śauri:
- yad yad ācarati śreṣṭhas
- tat tad evetaro janaḥ
- sa yat pramāṇaṁ kurute
- lokas tad anuvartate
"Whatever action is performed by a great man, common men follow in his footsteps. And whatever standards he sets by exemplary acts, all the world pursues."
Prabhupāda: Purport?
Hari-śauri: Purport. "People in general always require a leader who can teach the public by practical behavior. A leader cannot teach the public to stop smoking if he himself smokes. Lord Caitanya said that a teacher should behave properly even before he begins teaching. One who teaches in that way is called ācārya, or the ideal teacher. Therefore, a teacher must follow the principles of śāstra, scripture, to reach the common man.
Jagadīśa: I've understood that communism is presented by the administrative class when there is a condition of scarcity. When there is opulence, then there is room for personal individual enterprise, but when there is scarcity, that cannot be encouraged, and the common people have to be subjugated. So capitalism and communism are both simply philosophies how to keep the common man satisfied. So it's simply another means of exploitation.
Prabhupāda: Yes, it is exploitation, and actually they have done it.
Hari-śauri: There is still one class of men living at the expense of another, whether it's Communist.... (end)
Prabhupāda: That is my question. Where is that full advantage? They are remaining in the darkness. Why do you trust, first of all. Why do you trust? So many questions there are. Why you are prepared to trust in God? If I ask, you must answer. If you cannot answer, then you are ass. It is good, even without knowing, but when the slogan comes from the government side, there must be full knowledge. Otherwise, the government is as good as common man. The government should be full of intelligent men. Why vote is there? You select an intelligent man. Otherwise, anyone can go. Cats and dogs, they also can go. Why the voting system? That you select some intelligent man. So if you cannot answer your slogan, then you are not intelligent, you are unfit.
Prabhupāda: Even in the stool, the worms in the stool, he's also thinking "I have got so much stool to eat." This same mastership. "I am the monarch of all I survey. I have got so much stool." And you just take the worm from the stool, put it here: "No, no, no, here is my enjoyment." This mastership mentality is there in Brahma, and the mastership mentality is there in the worm of the stool. This mentality you have to give up. Then you become liberated. That is liberation. The bondage is that mastership mentality. He's servant, but he's thinking falsely that he's master. Just like your President Nixon. He thought that "Now I have become master of America, I'm president." He forgot that he's servant. As soon as the people wanted, dragged him down. That he forgot, that "I'm servant of the people." So everyone is servant, but falsely thinking "I'm master." That is material disease. The best thing is that if I have to remain servant, why not become servant of Kṛṣṇa? That's all. That is perfection. That is perfect life. Even by becoming a false master of the whole American country, I was not happy, I am now dragged down as a common man, Mr. Nixon, then what is the use of becoming master?
Prabhupāda: Argument? Why do you bring such nonsense argument, waste time? Don't waste time. You are ignorant, you are accepting. Don't remain ignorant. It is common sense. Is it so easy that one can talk with God? If some common man says "Just now I went to Mr. Ford, and talked with him. I'm coming back from him." So any gentleman will believe that? So these are our insufficiency that we believe such things. We are not properly trained up. Simply waste time. That's not good. He may talk nonsense. Why I shall accept nonsense? The same example. If somebody comes, "Now I'm just coming from talking with Mr. Ford, the President." Shall I have to believe? He's a common man. How he can talk with President Ford? If I believe, then I am also nonsense. Where is that?
Prabhupāda: These are, will be declining. These are the, I mean to say, human assets which makes a human being distinct from the animals. But these things will decline. There will be no mercifulness, there will be no truthfulness, the memory will be shortened, duration life shortened. Similarly religion will vanish. So that means gradually they will come to the platform of animals. And especially when there is no religion, it is simply animals. That any common man can distinguish, that... a dog does not understand what is religion. He's also a living being. He's not interested what is going on here about Bhagavad-Gītā or Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. He is not interested. That is the distinction between dog and man.
Brahmatīrtha: Well I couldn't say. They've been there they say.
Prabhupāda: They say, you believe, but we are common man, lay man, we say that if you have gone there, why you do not live there?
Brahmatīrtha: Yes, they just bring back rocks to show us, we have rocks here.
Prabhupāda: If there is rock, if there is sand, then why don't you colonise there? What is their answer? If there is same sand, same rock there, then why not... (break) ...some money and can bring some sand and bluff people that you have gone to moon planet. And people are satisfied, they're paying for another excursion to the Mars. This is going on. If you have gone there, there is land.
Prabhupāda: That is not honesty. So dishonesty begins from the government. You cannot keep gold. If you have kept gold, there will be searching, and if it is found that you have gold, you'll be punished. In India it is now being done. There is no freedom even at your home, in your private life. Formerly, any common man could keep gold according to his desire. There was no such thing. Sometimes he would hide it even within the ground, because there was no bank. At least in India this was the practice. If you have got some gold, you keep it somewhere confidential within the ground so that it may not be stolen. So everyone should have right to keep his money as he likes. Why government should interfere? Therefore you see the Bhāgavatam, rājanya-dasyu-dharmaḥ.(?) The government men will be like rogues and thieves. By law they will take away. It is now going on in India. I think here it is also? You cannot keep gold.
Prabhupāda: They make a show of performing sacrifices and they worship the demigods, or manufacture their own God. Common men advertise them as God and worship them, and by the foolish they are considered advanced in the principles of religion, or in the principles of spiritual knowledge. They take the dress of the renounced order of life and engage in all nonsense in that dress. Actually there are so many restrictions for one who has renounced this world. The demons, however, do not care for such restrictions. They think that whatever path one can create is one's own path; there is no such thing as a standard path one has to follow. The word avidhi-pūrvakam, meaning 'disregard for the rules and regulations,' is especially stressed here.
Prabhupāda: What can be done?
Darby: Would it help if someone took the Bible and wrote a Vaiṣṇava purport or tried to simplify it so that people could understand it? The language is difficult for the common man now to understand.
Prabhupāda: That we are spreading. Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is that you act what Kṛṣṇa or God says, that's all. In our Bhagavad-gītā the guru's description is there, who is guru. Read the fourth chapter. On this all literature, simply guru and disciple, one is instructing, and one is hearing.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, it is by the common people, ordinary people.
Prabhupāda: Because they are godless, they are uncommon. Educated Bengalis, they are spoiled.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. My feeling was they do not want to stop eating meat.
Prabhupāda: That is the only...
Svarūpa Dāmodara: I think that is the main reason.
Prabhupāda: And Vivekananda says whatever you like, you can eat.
Prabhupāda: No, even in their meat there will be so many germs. What they know?
Rūpānuga: The common people think that by cooking the meat they kill so many worms and germs in their meat.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Rūpānuga: But studies have shown that certain worms and germs are not killed, and they are ingested into the body and cause diseases.
Prabhupāda: You take the yogurt, even by microscope, you see so many germs.
Hari-śauri: Yogurt is made by...
Prabhupāda: So they may, but we have got. Our knowledge is paramparā. That Kṛṣṇa says, whatever He says is all right. Kṛṣṇa is not common man, avajānanti māṁ mūḍhā mānuṣīṁ tanum āśritam (BG 9.11). He's not man at all He's Supreme Personality of Godhead. Abhijñaḥ. Experience in everything.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: We agree that we have more limited senses...
Prabhupāda: He's a scientist, he knows.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Scientists also, when we talk together...
Prabhupāda: They know that they're talking nonsense, but they still want to cheat, to get their salary, that's all. This is the position.
Prabhupāda: No, that is possible, I can become prime minister or any big man. But if I do not work properly, if I work like animal, then my next life is animal. There is no consideration that "Here is a prime minister, why he should become a dog?" Nature will act. If you infect some disease, you may be prime minister or you may be a common man, if you have infected that disease, you must suffer from that disease. That is nature's law. There is no consideration that "Here is prime minister. He has infected the malaria germs. He should not suffer." Nature's law if not like that. Just like you say that in India there is malaria. So your daughter was not excused, that "Here is a girl coming of very respectable, good family. She should be excused." No excuse. You have infected malaria germ, you must suffer. So similarly, kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya sad-asad-yoni-janmasu (BG 13.22).
Prabhupāda: Yes, because spiritually everyone is free from material bondage. So materially we find one is more intelligent, one is less intelligent, but spiritually everyone can be equally intelligent.
Rāmeśvara: So what about the common man? If he accepts the Gurukula system he can also be spiritually advanced?
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes, anyone, anyone.
Rāmeśvara: Prabhupāda's point in the beginning was whether they will accept it or not. But once they accept it, once they get trained, then they will automatically be advanced. His point in the beginning was whether they'll accept it or not. That requires intelligence.
Prabhupāda: That Kṛṣṇa consciousness is developed when one practices according to the prescribed method,
- tapasā brahmacaryena
- śamena ca damena ca
- tyāgena satya-śaucābhyāṁ
- yamena niyamena vā
- (SB 6.1.13)
These are the process, tapasya, brahmacaryena. So it is very difficult for the common man to undergo tapasya. Little tapasya we have introduced, no illicit sex, no meat eating, no gambling, no intoxication. That is also become very difficult nowadays.
Prabhupāda: Sadācāra is there. But these people, asadācārī, and passing as sannyāsī. Cigarette, meat-eating and everything, drinking. We are asking common men to give it up, and they say, "Oh, what is the wrong there?" They do not know what is the wrong there. This time in Iran we initiated some Iranian. Some Afghans also coming.
Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: We have Arabic Īśopaniṣad ready for printing that was translated by your Lebanese disciple.
Prabhupāda: Oh, that he has done. He promised...
Krishna Modi: That is... They say like that, that we are giving very good food to everybody, very good house, and living, and all their (indistinct), education, medical free. We are giving the to common men...
Prabhupāda: Medical (indistinct) is free. Free medical service, education... (break)
Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: ...and in the offices of big, big professors and all, it looks so much lower than in America or Canada.
Krishna Modi: And in the comparison of India?
Indian man (3): No, no, number (indistinct) again and again I had gone to (indistinct) and as to that, ultimately there is no difference. As soon as this (indistinct) when it comes. I would like this because I belong to the sect of our country, middle sect, from Swami Narayana. He's based on Rāmānujācārya philosophy which says that all the souls are there, they are the body of the creator Bhagavān. Just as the human ātmā has a body, this means there is the difference also identity. Identity is one and yet they have their own place. That have been the faith (indistinct). Now in many places this sometimes this differentiation remains, sometimes there is things said which wipe it out. I thought you would be the best person to give a guidance...
Prabhupāda: As you say that, Kṛṣṇa also says in the Bhagavad-gita, mamaivāṁśo jīva-bhūtaḥ (BG 15.7). We living entities, we are part and parcel of God. Aṁśa. So any common man can understand.... (end)
Hari-śauri: They eat off fat banana leaves in Māyāpur all the time.
Prabhupāda: Very good. Common man in Bengal, Orissa, they'll take on banana leaves all vegetable preparations. Caitanya Mahāprabhu, when he was invited by Sarvabhauma Bhaṭṭācārya, he was taking on banana leaves.
Caraṇāravindam: I have some bitter gourd. I'm going to dry it and we can plant the seeds, karelā.
Prabhupāda: Karelā it is also...
Caraṇāravindam: Wonderful sabji.
Hari-śauri: Paṭola?
Prabhupāda: This is kṣatriya. Now, who is kṣatriya? A fourth-class man, he never seen battlefield and by vote he becomes president. And here kṣatriya means yuddhe cāpy apalāyanam. If there is fight he must come forward first of all. He is in his palace, and he's engaging common men, "Go and fight." When there was Battle of Kurukṣetra Arjuna and Duryodhana, they came first. Because the battle was decided as soon as the leader is dead. No more fight. So they used to come first. This is kṣatriya. Where is that kṣatriya? And they are becoming politicians simply by votes, all third-class, fourth-class men. What he'll do? Everyone is trying to keep his position by hook and crook. How he'll think of the people? How they will be happy? He is thinking of his own happiness. And these are politicians. There is no kṣatriya. There is no brāhmaṇa. And there is no vaiśya. What is the vaiśya?
Devotee (3): "The Lord has given Arjuna confidential knowledge of the Supersoul within everyone's heart, and now he is giving the most confidential part of this knowledge: just surrender unto the Supreme Personality of Godhead. At the end of the Ninth Chapter he has said, 'Just always think of Me.' The same instruction is repeated here to stress the essence of the teachings of Bhagavad-gītā. This essence is not understood by a common man, but by one who is actually very dear to Kṛṣṇa, a pure devotee of Kṛṣṇa. This is the most important instruction in all Vedic literature. What Kṛṣṇa is saying in this connection is the most essential part of knowledge, and it should be carried out not only by Arjuna but by all living entities."
Prabhupāda: Guhyatamam, most confidential. This is not for all, but for the advanced person and who is in confidence of Kṛṣṇa, He says, iṣṭo 'si me? What is that next? Iṣṭo 'si?
Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is...
Guest (1): ...for the common man, for the downtrodden, for the poor...
Prabhupāda: Yes, they can chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, and they will understand.
Guest (1): That should be some motivation...
Prabhupāda: Just like if you are hungry, if you get some real food, you'll understand. Example is these American, European boys. They are simply chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, and you see how they are advanced.
Jagadīśa: People are lazy and unfortunate. They have no knowledge. And besides that, they are misled by foolish leaders. The leaders are intent only on deriving sense gratification from their so-called high position. In the Bhāgavatam also it is explained that men who are like dogs, hogs, camels and asses praise those men who do not glorify the Supreme Personality of Godhead. It is a civilization of fools, a fool's paradise where the common people are allowed to elect from amongst them one so-called leader who is the biggest rascal because he doesn't know anything, and none of the others, the common, people know anything about the purpose of life, and yet this so-called leader becomes elected on the basis that he can do something to help suffering humanity. The material existence is nothing but a struggle against material nature which ultimately has no value. But it's an illusory struggle because of the spirit soul...
Prabhupāda: Why it has no value?
Prabhupāda: No. They are eating fish only. Because Bengal is full of rivers. But not for all. Mass of people, that's a fact. But he introduced, "You can eat anything. It has nothing to do with religion." In Bengal in our childhood we have seen if anyone was habituated to take meat... Common man would not. Rich man. The rich men they have their sahis. Sahis you know, who takes care of the horse. So he would cook in the horse shed.
Dr. Patel: And eat there.
Prabhupāda: No. Then he'll bring the (indistinct) and eat it. It was never brought within the precincts of the house.
1977 Conversations and Morning Walks
Devotee (1): Gurujī, the problem which I am putting as a common man is... I am...
Prabhupāda: It is not for the common man. Common man has to learn under the discipline of guru. You cannot expect all these things from a common man. When you actually control all these things then you are not common man. You are representative of Kṛṣṇa. Then you can preach Kṛṣṇa's philosophy.
Dr. Patel: There is one śloka, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇam, ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣa... (BG 18.66). This is pāpa-kāma, krodha and lobha. He will relieve you from that pāpa if you completely surrender.
Prabhupāda: Just like our Nitāi. (chuckles) This is the difficulty. Caitanya Mahāprabhu remained-guru more mūrkha dekhi' karila śāsana: "My Guru Mahārāja has chastised Me because I am fool number one." Caitanya Mahāprabhu is fool? But He's showing the example that you should always remain...
Dr. Patel: The avatāras shall behave like common men. Otherwise they will not be... All avatāras behave like common men.
Prabhupāda: Our Guru Mahārāja, so strict... A little discrepancy, he would chastise like anything. But we liked it very much.
Indian (3): Guru's chastise is the mercy.
Prabhupāda: Śiṣyaṁ ca putraṁ ca tāḍayen na tu lālayet. That is Cāṇakya Paṇḍita's instruction. "The sons and disciples should always be chastised. Never pat them."
Prabhupāda: Actually India is poor. When we give food, how voraciously they eat. They cannot eat. They have no resources to eat nicely at home. That's a fact. Half-fed. At least half-fed. In the villages they are not fully fed. They have no sufficient clothing, no food, that's all. The rascal politicians, realizing heavy tax, and that is divided amongst them. It is not going to the poor. They are imitating Western way of life. They have got huge expenditure. So whatever money is coming, they are spending for their luxury, and poor men... The Gandhi's movement, boycott British goods, but they took it: "Boycott British goods and take our goods." So the consumer goods were the same. Gandhi helped to stop the British capitalist in favor of the Indian capitalist. The consumer remained in the same position, rather, worse. The foreigners, they are thinking that "These people are poor. They cannot pay more to me." And these rascals, Indian capitalists, in the name of nationalism, Birlas and others, they exploit. And they give contribution to Gandhi, Gandhi's staff, Jawaharlal Nehru's staff. And they took the opportunity that "I shall pay this rascal one lakh, and I shall utilize the ten lakhs." That's it. So the object of exploitation remained the same. Rather, by artificial inflation of money market put common men in plight, because the other day I was calculating... The things have gone high priced, thirty times, but the income has not increased thirty times.
Satsvarūpa: Then, in years to come, like five years, ten years, twenty years, how will we be able to keep up our relationship with the universities that we have now? Now they think highly of us, that we've published these books, and they've written all these reviews that "This is a great contribution." We won't be able to... Well, they'll just have them in their libraries, and then we'll switch fields. We'll go to the common man.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Hm. Let them... If the university authorities agree to teach students...
Satsvarūpa: Text orders.
Prabhupāda: The text order. That will be nice.
Prabhupāda: Sahajiyā.
Hari-śauri: No faith in the spiritual master.
Satsvarūpa: So far, though, we have not learned a way to sell standing orders to the common man.
Prabhupāda: Hm?
Satsvarūpa: You say now the standing orders, the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, Caitanya-caritāmṛta, after the universities, should be sold in every home. So far, no one has learned how to do that.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Satsvarūpa: That remains to be done.
Prabhupāda: Not at all! Any common man can pay $250-once. Not that we are getting every month or every few year. Once 250 even ordinary worker can pay.
Hari-śauri: Yes. They do like that with those sets of books.
Satsvarūpa: They don't have to pay all at once.
Hari-śauri: Most things are done in America are on credit.
Satsvarūpa: "Book of the Month Club," they have. Very popular.
Prabhupāda: So you... We have to organize like that. And actually this is greater valuable for their life, changing life.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Jayapatākā: ...be able to come out with the truth.
Prabhupāda: When a common man will challenge them that "You are rascal. You are blind. You are showing us road?" Then it will be. I refuse to accept it.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Also, first of all, we have to show that their theory...
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Svarūpa Dāmodara:...is wrong.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Prabhupāda: These things were not going nicely. Therefore gradually it broke. But if things are going nicely, people will be happy. They will not revolt. You have to keep the citizens satisfied in all respects. You must know the necessity how people are satisfied. You have to arrange the government in that way. Then there will be no revolution. Mass of people, if they are satisfied, they will not revolt. But they do not know the process. The "demoncracy," the common man is allowed to vote. He has no knowledge and he's voting. This is most condemned process. Camara-bhangi, a sweeper, he is voted to become Minister of Defense. His business is to cleanse the street, and now he's voted to become because he has got number of votes. So many bhangis, they vote, "Yes, he is our leader. He should be Defense Minister." You have to do that. This is democracy.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This will not be very popular with the common people, to be told...
Prabhupāda: Huh?
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: People will not very much appreciate being told they have no brains.
Prabhupāda: Actually it is that. "No intelligence" you can say.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No intelligence. That'll be...
Ādi-keśava: But we can say that... Their accusation is that one loses identity. They say we are brainwashing, lose our identity.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Different platform, different field.
Ādi-keśava: We can say that, to the common people, "These persons who are saying that you're being brainwashed, 'You are losing your identity,' they are cheating you, because actually you don't know what your identity is. You have no identity, and they're telling you that you already know."
Prabhupāda: And therefore I say "You have no brain. Where is the question of brainwash?"
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There was an underlying question of whether the magazine... Brahmānanda Mahārāja had mentioned that your original idea was that this magazine was meant for the devotees to write into the magazine and the spiritual master would read the articles and thus see how the devotees were making advancement, and the magazine was for the devotees to read each other's articles. Generally how the one..., the kind of the present-day idea behind the magazine is that it is for the common man outside. It is not so much for the devotee as much as for the karmīs. And therefore...
Prabhupāda: No, what is the purpose? To distribute to the karmīs?
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Hari-bhakti-vilāsa. So Jayatīrtha wants to print it on his own. Means he doesn't want to take BBT funds. So the trustees felt that that was very good, since funds were scarce; he does a nice printing. He said that he would take responsibility for printing and distributing it. Because it is a very limited edition, it's not going to be sold to the common people, just to devotees.
Prabhupāda: No. Few copies.
Dr. Sharma: But I do not want to bring in Raj Kapoor and Lata Mangeskar seriously acting in regard to Lord Kṛṣṇa. I think these people with the God's face, they could themselves very efficiently do these things, without the interference of these people. I think we have (indistinct) a drama, and educated the common man to understand that God, and at the same time depicting the life history of Lord Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: Caitanya-līlā can be played very nicely.
Prabhupāda: So you should stop this, showing this. It may not be a laughing matter.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: For the general public, do you think that they'll get anything from it?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: No. It may be of little use for these common people, just for women, children, that, for these. But personally I feel that...
Prabhupāda: It will not...
Svarūpa Dāmodara: ...the scientific community, they'll make fun of this.
Prabhupāda: Then don't show it.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What about in the universities, the students?
Mr. Myer: Yes. We can develop some sort of training program. The gurukula facilities are there. So if some young men are taken who are trained in that fashion, they could do quite a lot. And then we are having major problem in the distribution of some of the literature. You see, Back to Godhead seems to be a very powerful magazine. It has always been very dear to you. You started this even in India. Unfortunately it comes one year late, and we have about several thousand members in India. So I was wondering whether we should try to publish it in India now, because the quantity is not enough. And then have some members who are subscribing for the Back to Godhead... Because some people are unable to afford the very large membership. Otherwise we will remain very exclusive. We won't be able to reach the common man. So one of the things is that each man who comes into the temple, if he can buy a copy of Back to Godhead magazine, he takes away something with him which he can remember. Otherwise people come to Mathurā, they visit so many temples, and they don't carry any souvenir.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But we're selling our literature here.
Mr. Myer: Yeah, but that's very old. Some of the copies are very old.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But they don't know that when they buy it.
Mr. Myer: And secondly, that doesn't cover much of the activity in India.
Prabhupāda: There is no "old." By date it does not become old.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They're tremendous. Here is a letter from the member of the advisory board of the Sāhitya Academy. You know what that is Śrīla Prabhupāda? Sāhitya Academy? I think it's a literary academy. " 'No earthly writer today can match the vast outpouring of pure verse which our ancient sages, particularly the great Vyāsadeva, have left to the world. Motivated by a deep desire to give moral, cultural, and educational upliftment to all people irrespective of caste, creed or nationality, they have taught us the higher values of life through the medium of historical narrations, biographies, the lives of great men, and simple instructive stories. The unlimited wealth which they have left behind in the Devanāgarī script is sheer ecstasy to read for the poet, the student and the common man. Since dialectic differences began to splinter men into smaller groups, the original language, Sanskrit, was gradually forgotten. It is special grace upon the denizens of this world today that His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda has done such a tremendous job of meticulously translating into so many languages the sacred books of our heritage. Swamiji's most noteworthy achievement is his Encyclopedia of Vedic Education, the multivolume presentation of the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam and Caitanya-caritāmṛta.' " One thing, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that this calling it the Encyclopedia of Vedic..., as he's doing...Everyone has always known the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, but fewer people knew Caitanya-caritāmṛta, and now these two are lumped together as equally very important works.
Prabhupāda: Complete.
Prabhupāda: High place. There is no need of big see.(?) Deity is small Kṛṣṇa or big Kṛṣṇa, the same thing. When Kṛṣṇa was child on the lap of His mother, the same Kṛṣṇa killed Pūtanā. And when He was killing other demons in His young age, the same. Avyaya. He does not change. Acyuta. These are the names of Kṛṣṇa, you'll... So it does not make any difference. So you have got small Deity. Very nicely... So you can bathe them nicely, decorate them nicely, give Them... And big Deity will be difficult to handle. Better keep this Deity and increase the devotional. That will be... More time devoted for taking class, for cleansing the... About Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam consider. That is main business.
- arcāyām eva haraye
- pūjāṁ yaḥ śraddhayehate
- na tad-bhakteṣu cānyeṣu
- sa bhaktaḥ prākṛtaḥ smṛtaḥ
If you simply worship the Deity in gorgeous way and do not preach, see to the interest of devotees and other common men, then you'll remain in the prākṛta state, material stage. You should go further, see the interest of ordinary people, how they are understanding Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Tad-bhakteṣu. To give worship to the guru and honor them. Simply to worship Deity is material platform. Gṛhasthas, we want, this preaching. And not like ordinary. Big Deity worship... (indistinct-too much background noise) Govinda dāsī is not willing to live with you?
| Page Title: | Common man (Conversations) |
| Compiler: | Visnu Murti, RupaManjari |
| Created: | 09 of Dec, 2011 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=111, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 111 |