Expressions researched:
"ram krishna"
|"rama krishna"
|"ramakrishna"
Guest (4) (Indian man): You said the approach to spiritual goal, through this way, Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Rāma. Okay. Now there is another philosophy which has been preached by Ramakrishna and Vivekananda: "The service of man is the service of God."
Prabhupāda: And why not service of God service of man?
Guest (4): It is not my argument. It is argument of Ramakrishna and Vivekananda.
Prabhupāda: Now you are representing Ramakrishna. You are representing Ramakrishna. That's all. I take it.
Guest (4): Because I am also in doubt about... I want to know the truth.
Prabhupāda: The truth is... The example I have given you, that service of the body means service of the stomach. Service of the body does not mean service of the finger.
Mohsin Hassan: My master, what's your opinion on the Ramakrishna Mission? We have a Ramakrishna Mission in Chicago.
Prabhupāda: Ramakrishna Mission, if I say it frankly, they distorted the Bhagavad-gītā to the greatest extent. Because they presented somebody, Ramakrishna, as God. Ramakrishna said that "I am the same Kṛṣṇa, I am the same Rāma," and they accepted it. But one thing is, anybody can say that "I am the same Rāma, I am the same Kṛṣṇa." First of all we have to see the proof. So many, there are many ways of to understand. So Ramakrishna Mission is pushing on this wrong idea. And another thing is that, supposing this Ramakrishna is the same Kṛṣṇa, then the philosophy is different. Ramakrishna's philosophy and Bhagavad-gītā's philosophy is different, because Ramakrishna says that you can accept any method, every method is all right. But Kṛṣṇa says only unto Him, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇam (BG 18.66). "Give up everything, simply surrender unto Me." Now Kṛṣṇa says one: "Simply surrender unto Me," and Ramakrishna says that we can accept anywhere. So which one we shall accept? Kṛṣṇa's or Ramakrishna's? What is your opinion? If something is spoken by Kṛṣṇa and something is spoken by Ramakrishna, so which one we shall prefer to accept?
Mohsin Hassan: Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: That's the answer. Therefore Ramakrishna Mission is misguiding.
Mohsin Hassan: They tell me that..., the Ramakrishna Mission, they offer all kinds variety of books about every religion.
Prabhupāda: We have got varieties of books.
Mohsin Hassan: Yes.
Prabhupāda: We have got at least twelve books, four hundred pages, different ways we are presenting, but our main aim is, end is Kṛṣṇa, to understand Kṛṣṇa through different philosophical thoughts. We have presented, I think. You have not...? You say you say you have seen all these books.
Prabhupāda: You can imagine that God is so insignificant that you can imagine His form. This dangerous theory is going on in India. God is so insignificant that you can imagine at your whims whatever you like. Ramakrishna Mission is also preaching this, and now this big, big sannyāsī, they also preaching this. God is a subject matter for, of my imagination, He is so insignificant.
Prabhupāda: Just like we can say frankly that the Ramakrishna Mission, they are collecting money, huge money from your country, here also, to mitigate the sufferings of the poor people, daridra-Nārāyaṇa seva. But actually you see that how many poverty-stricken people are there in India, and if you go to the Ramakrishna Mission, you will see all the swamis, they are living in royal order. This is going on. But people are still fool that... But your American people now, they are questioning. That one swami, Nikhilānanda, he told me personally that the American people now are questioning that "You collect money for feeding the poor, but when we go to India, we see so many people lying down on the street." So they are questioning. Naturally there will be question.
Bob: So this earth and all is made out of Kṛṣṇa, but is not Kṛṣṇa?
Prabhupāda: It is not Kṛṣṇa. Or you can say, Kṛṣṇa and not Kṛṣṇa simultaneously. That is our philosophy. One and different. You cannot say different because these things without Kṛṣṇa has no existence. At the same time you cannot say, "Then let me worship water. Why Kṛṣṇa?" That the pantheists, they say, that "Because everything is God, so whatever I take, that is God worship." The Rama-Krishna Mission says like that. But that's wrong.
Bob: The Rama-Krishna Mission says that?
Prabhupāda: Yes. And the Māyāvādīs. "Because everything is made of God, therefore everything is God." That is their... But our philosophy is everything is God, but not God also.
Guest (1): No. What do you think of the Maharishi?
Prabhupāda: Why shall I speak of others? Then people will be angry. Better not to touch this point. (break) At least, my position in foreign countries is far better than any swami's, up to date. Vivekananda went there in America about eighty years ago, 1893. So Ramakrishna Mission has got about four or five centers, say, within ten in America. But I have got my centers in America and Europe, forty centers, and so many students. In Ramakrishna Mission you won't find so many American boys as followers, but we have got thousands of followers, all young men, young girls. So that is my hope, that even if I die—I am seventy-six now—these boys will conduct this movement. I am sure.
Prabhupāda: The real Bhagavad-gītā is Kṛṣṇa says that "You surrender unto Me." Nobody says, neither Tilak, Gandhi, this Ramakrishna, this Aravindo. Nobody says that. He's made purposefully avoiding his duty. And these rascals are going as dutiful. His duty was to say as Kṛṣṇa says, if he is actually student of Bhagavad-gītā. Here is Kṛṣṇa saying that you surrender, you surrender to Kṛṣṇa. We are doing that. We are not speaking something nonsense.
Prabhupāda: Oh yes. Ramakrishna Mission, they eat meat.
Guest (2): I don't think so.
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.
Lucille: I don't know about the swamis, but I know a lot of the Vedāntists do.
Guest (2): That's news to me.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Vivekananda says, "What is that, meat-eating?" Kṛṣṇa says, makes division...
Guest (2): Ramakrishna Paramahamsa was the incarnation of Lord Rāma and Kṛṣṇa...
Prabhupāda: That is to Vivekananda, not to others.
Guest (2): Was he not realized?
Prabhupāda: That is another question. Don't bring controversial. If you have got Kṛṣṇa, what is the use of Ramakrishna? When you have got Kṛṣṇa original, why should you go to Ramakrishna? A shopkeeper says, "This is the same medicine, sir, but it is very cheap." But a real customer says, "No, I want the original. I don't want this imitation. Give me the original." Accepting Ramakrishna as incarnation, so why shall I go to incarnation when I have got Kṛṣṇa?
Guest (2): Like you said, guru you know. We go through...
Prabhupāda: There is paramparā. So there is symptoms of guru not that everyone becomes guru. These are controversial points. We don't want this.
Prabhupāda: We are manufacturing incense. That I suggested. Sometimes I went to Ramakrishna mission and I saw they are selling incense. So I suggested that "Why don't you..." So I gave them idea how to manufacture.
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. So, my father was Vaiṣṇava, but when I invited these Gauḍīya Maṭha sādhus, my father thought that I have invited some sādhus of the Ramakrishna Mission. So he was not very interested. When Tīrtha Mahārāja is speaking, I call my... My father was that time invalid, I called him that "Please come down, there is a meeting of the Gauḍīya Maṭha sādhus." So, he could not resist my request, he came down, but he did not think that some devotees have come. They thought, these Ramakrishna Mission rascals have come. (laughter) So he was not very happy, but I told, he was sitting. He, so the meeting he just criticized. Then when he heard the speech of our old Tīrtha Mahārāja, our old Godbrother, he understood, "Oh, they are Vaiṣṇavas." Then immediately after the meeting, he came down on his feet. "I misunderstood you sir, that you are the Ramakrishna Mission sādhu. I am so glad to meet you. So that is the beginning of my intimate relationship with Gauḍīya Maṭha.
Prabhupāda: That is Ramakrishna mission's morality: yata mata tata patha. Whatever you think, that is your way. Yata mata tata patha.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yata mata tata patha.
Prabhupāda: As many ways you think, that's all right.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: That is how they define morality.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That you make your own morality.
Prabhupāda: In India, what is going on as "Hindu dharma," it is a bogus thing. It has no meaning. Just like this Ramakrishna Mission, this Vivekananda, this Aurobindo, this Mahesh Yogi, so many others, all bogus. Anyone who is not going in terms of the Caitanya Mahāprabhu's cult or His teaching, he's a bogus. Anyone. Not only in India, all over the world. At the present moment, the real, transcendental spiritual life means to follow the cult of instructions of Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Otherwise, everyone is bogus. They're simply wasting their time. They have no knowledge of spiritual life.
Prabhupāda: One rascal comes and says, "I am incarnation of God." Another rascal accepts. It is not like that. "Ramakrishna is God." We do not accept. We must see the inconceivable mystic power. Just like Kṛṣṇa, as a child, lifted a hill. This is inconceivable mystic power. Rāmacandra, He constructed a bridge of stone without pillar. The stone began to float: "Come on." So that is an inconceivable power.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: In one of the articles by Bharatiya... There's a man called Bharatiya, in... What is (indistinct) university? He was saying that Nirana Subhas Bose, he wanted to join Ramakrishna Mission. Is this true, Śrīla Prabhupāda?
Prabhupāda: For future. No. Might be. He wanted to join? Why he should join? Why he did not join?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: It was explained that he had a better, great mission, so he should not join, "You should do your..." By that time he was started, fighting for freedom. So he was not allowed...
Prabhupāda: So what was that greater mission?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: For independence, fighting.
Prabhupāda: No. Why he wanted to join Ramakrishna mission? What is the attraction of Ramakrishna mission? What they have done? Ramakrishna mission, what they have done? The Ramakrishna mission is working here in your country...
Prabhupāda: Simply for Kṛṣṇa, there is simply to understand Kṛṣṇa. Anything else-waste of time. But in Kṛṣṇa's connection there are varieties. Does it mean, although the dictaphone is there, still I shall write in my hand? Kṛṣṇa consciousness cannot touch this. We don't follow this nonsense philosophy. Unnecessary vairāgya. Śuṣka-vairāgya, dry knowledge.
Devotee (1): Śuṣka-vairāgya.
Prabhupāda: Śuṣka, śuṣka means dry. Oh, it is material, I shall not touch. I shall not touch. Just like that rascal, Ramakrishna, if anyone wanted to give him some money (gesture). (laughter) How, he does not touch money. These rascals, why shall I not touch? Come on, you have got money, George Harrison, spend. Yes, come on, I shall take it, for Kṛṣṇa. We haven't come to this house for living very comfortably and enjoying. No, we have come here for Kṛṣṇa's service.
Prabhupāda: This Māyāvāda philosophy has created this havoc. Therefore Caitanya Mahāprabhu has recommended that māyāvādī haya kṛṣṇe aparādhi. "All the Māyāvādīs, they are offenders to Kṛṣṇa." Therefore they cannot make any progress in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That difficulty is there—offenders. And later on, there are so many institutions. They say that "You can create your God. You can become God." That is going on. "Whatever you think as God, that is God." So how one can make progress under these circumstances? One gentleman was arguing with me... He was supporting Rama-Krishna Mission. He said, "Even stool I consider God. It is God." (laughter) He came to this point. "If I worship stool as God, then it is also God."
Prabhupāda: No, no, we have got definite goal, Kṛṣṇa... We have got definite goal, Kṛṣṇa... (break) ...Kṛṣṇa, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. He has got His form, He has got His place, He has got His name, He has got His pastimes, and we want to enter in that kingdom.
Yogeśvara: He says that he thought that in our movement we were following Ramakrishna who had discovered everything.
Prabhupāda: No, no. Ramakrishna we kick out. We don't.
Yogeśvara: He says he's not familiar personally with him.
Prabhupāda: Ramakrishna is bogus.
Prabhupāda: But not a single soul became a devotee of Kṛṣṇa. There is no history. Yes. So far we know, that by reading Bhagavad-gītā, it is meant for making a person devotee of Kṛṣṇa. Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). But before my coming here, so many swamis came, and they preached on Bhagavad-gītā, so many scholars came, but not a single soul became a pure devotee of Kṛṣṇa.
Professor: Yes, because other... So, for instance, you have the Ramakrishna Mission...
Prabhupāda: What the Ramakrishna mission has done?
Professor: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Ramakrishna mission has done this, that they have learned to drink wine and eat meat, that's all, from the Western countries. That's all.
Professor: Yes. This is so.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is their contribution. And they have spoiled the Hindu culture.
Professor: Oh. Yes?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. Because Vivekananda said, "Oh, what is the harm there, in eating? You can eat whatever you like. It doesn't matter in religion." It was the first. And he himself was eating anything. So all the Ramakrishna mission sannyāsīs still, they are eating meat, egg and everything, especially in America. Yes. Fish is no consideration. That is daily affair. And the turkey,... Yes. Instead of preaching here, they have taken the Western method. And Vivekananda's preaching is like Western missionaries-open hospitals, school...
Professor: You are right, yes.
Prabhupāda: Yes. He had no spiritual knowledge. So therefore it has not been successful.
Prabhupāda: They are not standard. We are following Bhagavad-gītā As It Is, standard, and they have got their own manufactured way. So we don't recognize them. Our process is evaṁ paramparā prāptam imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ (BG 4.2). Paramparā. What Kṛṣṇa said, the disciplic succession will say the same thing. But they are speaking differently. So therefore we don't take them as bona fide. They are not bona fide. And from external point of view, we have got so many literatures, so many branches, so many devotees, within six years. But they haven't got such thing. Even Ramakrishna Mission. They are working for the last eighty years. And I have worked only for six years. And my result is eighty times more than them. They also acknowledge.
Prabhupāda: If we do not follow strictly our regulative principles, routine work, then the whole scheme will be failure. Then, instead of Christianity, it will be "churchianity." You know this word, "churchianity?" You know? Yes. Everywhere this churchianity is going on. And the real aim is how to enjoy sense, under different cover. That is going on all over the world. Therefore it has come to that Rajneesh. Ramakrishna Mission, Rajneesh mission. Vivekananda has given preached, Yata mata tata patha, Rajneesh also, a mata. They have got also followers. Everyone can manufacture his own way of religion. So sense enjoyment, there is free field.
| Page Title: | Ramakrishna mission (Conversations) |
| Compiler: | Labangalatika, MadhuGopaldas |
| Created: | 13 of Mar, 2010 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=134, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 134 |