Prabhupāda: Sometimes... Means this is false thing. It appears as a big city. Similarly, this is also. This material world is like that. It is a false cloud only, but we have taken it as fact. Just see, it appears just like big New York City. If you go to the forest, you will find some illusion, that just after that tree there is a big house. Have you experienced that?
Devotee (2): Yes.
Prabhupāda: That is called Gandharvapur. So if anyone wants to enter that big city, then what is his position?
Devotee (2): Illusion.
Prabhupāda: The same thing: the conditioned soul enters the big city of material world, and he struggles. (pause)
Rāmeśvara: I have heard there is a philosophy here amongst some of the devotees that if you chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, you can go back to the spiritual world even if you do not give up your independence.
Prabhupāda: What is that?
Rāmeśvara: Many devotees who have moved outside of the temple are feeling that if they just continue to chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, they can go back to the spiritual world, but they are not giving up their independence.
Prabhupāda: So? What is your philosophy?