View source for I could mention a lot of names that are still very close to God and brilliant men in science... Where would we be without our scientists, without our doctors, medicine? They all have to go to university and get a degree before they...

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{{terms|"I could mention a lot of names that"|"still very close to God and brilliant men in science... Where would we be without our scientists, without our doctors, medicine? They all have to go to university and get a degree before they"}}
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[[Category:Questions asked to Srila Prabhupada]]
[[Category:Questions asked to SP... 1973]]
[[Category:Questions On... Modern Science and Scientists]]
[[Category:Questions From... Parents of Devotees]]
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<div id="Conversations_and_Morning_Walks" class="section" sec_index="5" parent="compilation" text="Conversations and Morning Walks"><h2>Conversations and Morning Walks</h2>
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<div id="1973_Conversations_and_Morning_Walks" class="sub_section" sec_index="6" parent="Conversations_and_Morning_Walks" text="1973 Conversations and Morning Walks"><h3>1973 Conversations and Morning Walks</h3>
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<div id="GardenConversationwithMahadevasMotherandJesuitPriestJuly251973London_0" class="quote" parent="1973_Conversations_and_Morning_Walks" book="Con" index="52" link="Garden Conversation with Mahadeva's Mother and Jesuit Priest -- July 25, 1973, London" link_text="Garden Conversation with Mahadeva's Mother and Jesuit Priest -- July 25, 1973, London">
<div class="heading">That I say. You get... You get... But simply to becoming doctor at a medical science will not save me. Unfortunately, they do not believe in the next life.
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<span class="link">[[Vanisource:Garden Conversation with Mahadeva's Mother and Jesuit Priest -- July 25, 1973, London|Garden Conversation with Mahadeva's Mother and Jesuit Priest -- July 25, 1973, London]]: </span><div class="text"><p style="display: inline;">Prabhupāda: ...satisfied to remain in the village. That is the defect of the modern civilization.</p>
<p>Mother: In India, you mean. You're talking of India now.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Everywhere.</p>
<p>Mother: Everywhere.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Yes. Everywhere.</p>
<p>Mother: What about India? I mean, do they believe, the villagers?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: India, actually, they do so.</p>
<p>Mother: Yes.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: The villagers, they have cows and land. That is sufficient for their economic problem. But the industrialists, they are alluring them, "To get more money, come here." So they are going to the cities. And the food production in the village is neglected. And therefore the food grain price is rising. Actually, everyone should be engaged to produce food, but the modern set-up of civilization is that few people are engaged in producing food, and others are eating. They are offering... They are artificially getting money. So they are offering paper, "Here is ten dollars." Although it is a paper, cheating. And they are captivated by cheating. They, they are thinking, "I have got now hundred dollars." What is this hundred dollars? It is paper. So some people are cheating and some people are being cheated. This is the society.</p>
<p>Mother: Yes. But I think one has to be clever enough not to let people cheat you.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Clever means that he must stay in his own land. He should not be cheated by the paper and go to the city.</p>
<p>Mother: But we have to teach our young to be able to define between those who cheat and those who..., be able to tell people who...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: The whole civilization is a plan of cheating others. That's all. And they're all sinful. According to our Vedic understanding, there are four things sinful, pillars of sinful life: illicit sex, unnecessary killing of animals, intoxication and gambling.</p>
<p>Mother: But you can lead a very happy life still, eating...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: No. Our students are trained in that way.</p>
<p>Mother: There are a lot of very good people in the world.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Just see. You can see from your son. They can sit down anywhere. They can lie down. There is no artificial living. They are satisfied with nice foodstuff made from vegetable and milk. And chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, holy name of God.</p>
<p>Mother: I see he's happy. But, you know, he came from a very happy home. So he should be happy, shouldn't he?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Yes.</p>
<p>Mother: Very happy home. Brothers and sisters. And we've all been very happy. And I hope he will remain happy.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: He's still happier.</p>
<p>Mother: Yes, I can see.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: He was happy; now he's happier. That is the difference.</p>
<p>Mother: Yes. Oh, I don't think he's happier. (laughter) You are? I didn't think it was possible.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: You are not happier.</p>
<p>Mother: I didn't think it was possible.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Because your son has come here, you may not be happier. But he happier.</p>
<p>Mother: Oh, you're saying this. I'm not saying this. I'm very disappointed that he is not continuing with education. I'm not sorry that... I'm happy for his happiness, wherever he is.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: But what is the... What is the purpose of education?</p>
<p>Mother: You are a cultured man. You're educated.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Yes.</p>
<p>Mother: Did you not learn...? Who gave you the talent to translate your Vedic scriptures?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Yes.</p>
<p>Mother: Who gave you the talent, father?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: No, I'm asking that what is the best part of education? So far my school, college education is concerned, that is not being used here.</p>
<p>Mother: Oh, but you're cultured. You in your old age are getting tremendous comfort from being able to read and understand what the world is doing, the goodness of your books, and you have..., you're able to understand the spiritual way of life.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Yes. That...</p>
<p>Mother: If you couldn't, if you hadn't been educated, father, well, how would you be able to have...?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: No, education is required.</p>
<p>Mother: Now, I, I, I don't... I am so happy that my son is happy, truthfully. But I am very distressed... And little boys, don't laugh because this is serious. Um. I am very distressed that none of these boys continue their education. What is going to happen to them when they are like you, when they're older, they have no talents?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: But your educational system, in the western countries, the, you have got big, big universities. Why the university students becoming hippies?</p>
<p>Mother: Oh, well, there're always a certain amount becoming hippies, in America, anywhere. But we must...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: No...</p>
<p>Mother: But we must develop...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: I think the college students university students, they're all hippies.</p>
<p>Mother: Yes, but we must develop the good ones that have talent. We must develop them. You have the power to give these boys...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: I mean to say that if the chance of education is there... In India there is no such big, big universities, facilities, but in your western countries you have got nice universities, nice teaching system. Why the result is hippie?</p>
<p>Mother: Oh, but you... We're talking of you. You have got the power. But people follow you because they believe in you. So you have the power to educate them. And you're not hippies, are you?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: My point is that this simple, this education for eating, sleeping, mating and defending, this sort of education will not satisfy.</p>
<p>Mother: Well, you're educated, you see.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: No, I am educated.</p>
<p>Mother: Yes, but how many of these are?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: But I am not educated only on this platform, eating, sleeping and sex life and defense. I am educated in a different platform.</p>
<p>Mother: But you, aren't you translating your books still?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Yes, that's all right.</p>
<p>Mother: Isn't that a great joy, a great joy to you?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: That's... For translating of books it does not require... Of course, it requires when the purport of the translation is given. Otherwise,... Real thing is culture. That education is culture. Simply money-making education for maintaining this body, that education will not satisfy any more. Just like I told you, that despite all arrangements of education, why the young men are turning to be hippies? That is my question.</p>
<p>Mother: Oh, but not your followers. Your followers are not being hippies, people who follow you. Therefore you've got the people who you could help to become cultured like you.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: So my father educated me in a different way. Therefore I have come to this stage. My father never allowed me even to drink tea.</p>
<p>Mother: Well, I'm disappointed in you. I came to see you because I felt that, being so cultured, you would want all your boys to have this culture and to have this, to have the best...</p>
<p>Revatīnandana: We've got, we've got this culture.</p>
<p>Mother: Oh, but you haven't, you see. You're all, you're all young boys...</p>
<p>Revatīnandana: No, your culture, your culture we don't have.</p>
<p>Mother: ...but you're not mature yet.</p>
<p>Revatīnandana: But the culture that he has, he's giving to us.</p>
<p>Mother: Yes, but you're not mature. It takes years to become mature. Hurt, pain, happiness, everything together... You find God? Yes, I've found God. We all... I feel very close to God, and I feel very happy. But I would also still wish to be educated. And fortunately, I was given the chance to have an education.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Education means to know God.</p>
<p>Mother: And I don't misuse it.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: That is education. Our Vedic culture, the high class man is called brāhmaṇa.</p>
<p>Mother: Yes.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Brāhmaṇa, you know that.</p>
<p>Mother: Brāhmaṇa, yes.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: So who is a brāhmaṇa? Who knows God, he is called brāhmaṇa. Therefore culmination of education is to understand God. That is education. Otherwise, to get education how to nicely eat, how nicely sleep, how nicely have sex life, and how to defend, this education is there even in the animals. The animals also, they know how to eat, how to sleep, how to have sex life and how to defend.</p>
<p>Mother: Yes. It seems to worry you, this sex life. I mean, we, we don't take...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: No, no, no. I'm not worried.</p>
<p>Mother: ...any notice if... It fits into its place.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: This is also necessary. This is also necessary.</p>
<p>Mother: It fits into the place in my life or our life.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: No, no. This is also necessary.</p>
<p>Mother: Yes. It doesn't worry us at all.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: But these four type of branches of education is not sufficient for human being. A human being, above all this education, must have the knowledge how to love God. And that is perfection of life.</p>
<p>Mother: Yeah, well, Michael was taught that when he was very small. The Jesuits saw to that.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: That is perfection.</p>
<p>Mother: The Jesuits certainly did.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: So to understand God or how to love God, there is religious system. In every civilized human society, it doesn't matter whether it is Christianity or Hinduism or Mohammedanism or Buddhism, the aim, religious system is there in human society besides the education of eating, sleeping, mating and defending. That is there in the animal society. So a human being is distinct from the animal when he has education how to understand God and how to love Him. That is perfection.</p>
<p>Mother: Well, you've got a good tape there now, haven't you?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Hmm.</p>
<p>Mother: You've got a good tape there now. Yes.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: So that is now wanting. Our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is not depriving people of their education. You get education how to eat, how to sleep, and that's all right. But side by side, you take education how to know God and how to love Him. That is our proposition.</p>
<p>Mother: Yes. I agree with you.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Yes.</p>
<p>Mother: Yes, I agree with you every time.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: We don't say that you stop all this education. No.</p>
<p>Mother: No, I don't agree with you there. No, father, no, no. No, no.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: We don't say.</p>
<p>Mother: No, I think they must...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: You can go on with your industries. You can go on with your university. But side by side, you become competent to know what is God and how to love Him. Then your life is perfect.</p>
<p>Mother: I could mention a lot of names that (are) still very close to God and brilliant men in science... Where would we be without our scientists, without our doctors, medicine? They all have to go to university and get a degree before they...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: That I say. You get.</p>
<p>Mother: Yes, but we need them.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: You get.</p>
<p>Mother: Yes, well, the some of your boys could be doctors.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: But simply to becoming doctor at a medical science will not save me. Unfortunately, they do not believe in the next life.</p>
<p>Mother: Oh, yes they do. I go to... I had a doctor who came to church—and Michael knows him—every Sunday, a very good man.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Mostly. I have spoken with many educated persons. In Moscow I was talking with Professor Kotofsky. He said, "Swamiji, after finishing this body, everything is finished." But he's a big professor. Generally, even they do believe next life, they do not believe it very seriously. If we actually believe there is next life, then we must be prepared: "What kind of next life I am going to have?"</p>
<p>Mother: Yes, well, father...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Because there are eight million, four hundred thousand forms of life. The trees are also life, the cats and dogs, they are also life. And there are higher, intelligent persons in the higher planetary systems. They are also life. The worm in the stool, that is also life. So, calculating all of them, there are 8,400,000 species of life. So if I am going to have next life... Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ ([[Vanisource:BG 2.13 (1972)|BG 2.13]]). We have to change this body to another body. So our concern should be "What kind of body I am going to get next?"</p>
<p>Mother: I agree for some people to, you especially, to think of this because you are a leader of your Vedic religion. But for everybody to do that, where would we be? We couldn't all sit down and think all the time.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: But where is that education?</p>
<p>Mother: But we... You can also work and think.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: No, I mean to say, where is that education in the university to prepare the student for the next life?</p>
<p>Mother: Oh, but he must fit it in.</p>
<p>Jesuit Priest: All the Catholic Universities all over the world are doing it. That's our main purpose, is to teach the young man and the young girl the success in this world, but above all,...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Then the next question...</p>
<p>Jesuit Priest: ...is the success in the next, which means union with God for eternity. That's top priority. And following Christ's words, "Seek ye first the Kingdom of God," then all the other things are of very minor importance. It's closeness to God and return to be one with the Beatific Vision in heaven. That's the top priority, that's our aim in education, and that's what Michael was taught when he was at Sunnyhurst. And that he does well and gets a degree, yes, very good thing. He could be a doctor or an architect or a leader in commerce, what have you, of which all of which are essential for the well-being of the world. This time last year I was dead. I was picked up as unconscious in the corridor, and the doctors said that I had experienced... I was as near death as makes no difference. Well, if it hadn't been for the skill of the man that...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: So...</p>
<p>Jesuit Priest: ...looked after me, I wouldn't be here this afternoon.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: So next life, how it will be ascertained? What kind of body I am going to next life?</p>
<p>Jesuit Priest: I don't think it matters very much. I couldn't care less what's happening after I'm dead. All I know, there's not annihilation. I'm going to be joined with almighty God.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: No, it cannot be blind.</p>
<p>Mother: We're going to almighty God. That's all.</p>
<p>Jesuit Priest: Not that I want another life.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Eh?</p>
<p>Mother: We're going to almighty God when we die. We don't have to worry.</p>
<p>Jesuit Priest: That's in his hands.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: So what is the qualification?</p>
<p>Mother: We know. We...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Everybody is going to God?</p>
<p>Mother: Yes. Everybody who believes in God. Yes. And leads a good life, does their best in this world, and that is truth for me.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Then the question comes: What is the good life?</p>
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