Vivekananda and meat-eating

Expressions researched:
"Vivekananda" |"meat"

Srimad-Bhagavatam Lectures

Our Vivekananda Swami, he interpreted that "Unless you become stout and strong like the bulls and the buffalo, you cannot realize self." He interpreted like that. So he engaged people to make gymnastics, exercise. "You become very stout and strong, eat meat, and..." This is going on.

Lecture on SB 1.5.22 -- Vrndavana, August 3, 1974:

Prabhupāda: So today is Baladeva āvirbhāva. Baladeva, in the strength. Nāyam ātmā bala-hīnena labhyaḥ. You cannot understand, realize yourself without the help of Baladeva. Therefore in the Vedic literatures: nāyam ātmā bala-hīnena labhyaḥ. You cannot become self-realized without the help of, without the mercy of Baladeva. Now, our Vivekananda Swami, he interpreted that "Unless you become stout and strong like the bulls and the buffalo, you cannot realize self." He interpreted like that. So he engaged people to make gymnastics, exercise. "You become very stout and strong, eat meat, and..." This is going on. This philosophy is going on. Bala-hīnena... "Unless you become as strong as a tiger, you cannot realize yourself." This interpretation is going on. Bala-hīnena labhyaḥ. Therefore they are... Always they put this argument, that "Our countrymen is suffering. There is no food. First of all we must give them food, make them strong, stout. Then we shall talk about Kṛṣṇa consciousness." Do they not say like that?

Brahmānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: This is another nonsense. Bala-hīnena does not mean this physical strength. Bala-hīn... Bala, bala means spiritual strength, Baladeva. Baladeva is spiritual strength. Nityānanda. Balarāma haila nitāi.

Brahmānanda: Hīna, hīna. Bala-hīna?

Prabhupāda: Hīna means without. And bala means strength. So śāstra says, nāyam ātmā bala-hīnena labhyaḥ: "One who is less strong, or one who has no support of the strength, then he cannot make any progress in spiritual self-realization." This is the Vedic injunction. So they interpret that unless you become physically strong, you cannot make any spiritual advancement. So...? But in the Western countries we have seen, so many people physically very strong, stout and strong. Practically everyone. But what is their self..., advancement in self-realization? So these things are going on. So bala means spiritual strength, not material strength. Nāyam ātmā bala-hīnena labhyaḥ. That means one must be spiritually strong. And that spiritually strong means to have good faith in Kṛṣṇa and guru. That is spiritual strength. Therefore Baladeva means guru, spiritual strength.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Here amongst the educated class there is influence of all these rascals, Vivekananda, Aurobindo, and... That is one defect. But in the mass there is no influence. In the class, educated class. Because educated class means wine, women, meat, and Vivekananda allows this. That is the point.

Room Conversation -- January 17, 1971, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: Vivekananda has influence here in higher class, among the educated class. They talk about Vivekananda and this and that, nonsense. In your country, fortunately, that opposition was not there. There was no influence of Vivekananda class men. Here amongst the educated class there is influence of all these rascals, Vivekananda, Aurobindo, and... That is one defect. But in the mass there is no influence. In the class, educated class. Because educated class means wine, women, meat, and Vivekananda allows this. That is the point. Vivekananda has no distinction of eating. "Eat any... All Brahman, all Nārāyaṇa. You are Nārāyaṇa. Goat is Nārāyaṇa. So Nārāyaṇa is going in the belly of Nārāyaṇa. What is the wrong? One Nārāyaṇa is going, being absorbed by another Nārāyaṇa." But he is not agreeable to be eaten by a tiger, another tiger Nārāyaṇa.

Haṁsadūta: They actually say that?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Haṁsadūta: "One Nārāyaṇa is being absorbed by another."

Prabhupāda: One respectable pleader in Allahabad, I said, "Why you are eating this?" We also find that he's a very religious man. So I inquired. He was just like our father; still, I inquired. He said, "No, what is the wrong there? Nārāyaṇa, Brahman. So one Brahman is going into the belly of another Brahman, Brahman being absorbed, brahmeti." So they have got so dangerous theory. But still, we shall not hesitate to kick on their face but because they are making a propaganda, it should be peaceful. But I become very much agitated with this nonsense because I know they are creating havoc. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Come on. (door closes) So many rascals.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Ramakrishna Mission, they eat meat. Yes. Vivekananda says, "What is that, meat-eating?"

Conversation with Bajaj and Bhusan -- September 11, 1972, Arlington, Texas, At Their Home:

Guest (2): Is it our duty to convince everybody and to argue with people and say, "Now..." Because most of the people would argue for, "Where is your protein?" "Needs his protein," and you know, when they talk in terms of body consciousness rather than Kṛṣṇa consciousness. It's very hard to argue with that.

Prabhupāda: Yes, I have argued. All these European boys, I had to argue with them. (laughter)

Lucille: (indistinct) in Bombay and the first thing he did was argue with me.

Prabhupāda: Big, big swamis, they are advocating, "Eat meat."

Guest (2): Is that right?

Prabhupāda: Oh yes. Ramakrishna Mission, they eat meat.

Guest (2): I don't think so.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Lucille: I don't know about the swamis, but I know a lot of the Vedāntists do.

Guest (2): That's news to me.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Vivekananda says, "What is that, meat-eating?" Kṛṣṇa says, makes division...

Guest (2): Ramakrishna Paramahamsa was the incarnation of Lord Rāma and Kṛṣṇa...

Prabhupāda: That is to Vivekananda, not to others.

Guest (2): Was he not realized?

Prabhupāda: That is another question. Don't bring controversial. If you have got Kṛṣṇa, what is the use of Ramakrishna? When you have got Kṛṣṇa original, why should you go to Ramakrishna? A shopkeeper says, "This is the same medicine, sir, but it is very cheap." But a real customer says, "No, I want the original. I don't want this imitation. Give me the original." Accepting Ramakrishna as incarnation, so why shall I go to incarnation when I have got Kṛṣṇa?

Vivekananda was eighty years ago, he came. He learned how to eat meat. Instead of teaching Vedānta, he learned how to eat meat.

Morning Walks -- October 1-3, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: ...before me never dared to ask people to stop meat-eating. Rather, they learned how to eat meat. Vivekananda was eighty years ago, he came. He learned how to eat meat. Instead of teaching Vedānta, he learned how to eat meat.

Jayatīrtha: In the Vedānta Society temple in Santa Barbara, they were offering chicken soup...

Prabhupāda: Prasādam.

Jayatīrtha: ...to the Goddess Kālī an offering, and then they were distributing it as prasādam.

Prabhupāda: In the name of Vedānta.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Vivekananda said, "Oh, what is the harm there, in eating? You can eat whatever you like. It doesn't matter in religion." It was the first. And he himself was eating anything. So all the Ramakrishna mission sannyāsīs still, they are eating meat, egg and everything, especially in America. Yes. Fish is no consideration. That is daily affair. And the turkey,... Yes. Instead of preaching here, they have taken the Western method.

Room Conversation with Sanskrit Professor -- August 13, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Gandhi, Mahatma Gandhi. He has also interpreted. He has interpreted, "This body... Kurukṣetra means this body."

Professor: But he didn't write it...

Prabhupāda: Well, it is not widely read, but this has become a fashion, to give his own interpretation. Yes.

Professor: Yeah, that's right, the fashion. That's the word. That's right.

Prabhupāda: But Kṛṣṇa was not a so, I mean to say, ignorant, that He left something to be interpreted later on by another rascal. No. That was not Kṛṣṇa's intention. What Kṛṣṇa says, that is final. So we accept in that way. Kṛṣṇa says, man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65). So we appeal to the people that "You think of Kṛṣṇa. You become a devotee of Kṛṣṇa." All these disciples, they have been taught like that. "You offer obeisances to Kṛṣṇa." Man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī. "You worship Kṛṣṇa." That's it. And by doing that, they are advancing. Advancing. And before me, for hundreds of years or more than that, the Bhagavad-gītā was known to the European and American countries. As you say, there are so many trans...

Professor: Yes.

Prabhupāda: But not a single soul became a devotee of Kṛṣṇa. There is no history. Yes. So far we know, that by reading Bhagavad-gītā, it is meant for making a person devotee of Kṛṣṇa. Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). But before my coming here, so many swamis came, and they preached on Bhagavad-gītā, so many scholars came, but not a single soul became a pure devotee of Kṛṣṇa.

Professor: Yes, because other... So, for instance, you have the Ramakrishna Mission...

Prabhupāda: What the Ramakrishna mission has done?

Professor: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Ramakrishna mission has done this, that they have learned to drink wine and eat meat, that's all, from the Western countries. That's all.

Professor: Yes. This is so.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is their contribution. And they have spoiled the Hindu culture.

Professor: Oh. Yes?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. Because Vivekananda said, "Oh, what is the harm there, in eating? You can eat whatever you like. It doesn't matter in religion." It was the first. And he himself was eating anything. So all the Ramakrishna mission sannyāsīs still, they are eating meat, egg and everything, especially in America. Yes. Fish is no consideration. That is daily affair. And the turkey,... Yes. Instead of preaching here, they have taken the Western method. And Vivekananda's preaching is like Western missionaries-open hospitals, school...

Professor: You are right, yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes. He had no spiritual knowledge. So therefore it has not been successful.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

In the name of religion you do all nonsense rascaldom, and the leader approves, "Yes, you can do." Vivekananda did it. "Yes, there is no difference between eating meat and not eating eat in terms of religion system." He preached this, and all the sannyāsīs of the Ramakrishna Mission they eat meat, they drink, they have woman secretary, everything.

Morning Walk -- April 24, 1974, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Vishva Hindu Parishad. What is this nonsense Vishva Hindu...? (chuckles) He does not know what is the meaning of Hindu. And his jñāna-yajña. Gītā jñāna yajña. He does not understand even a word of Gītā, and this rascal is preaching Bhagavad-gītā. This is going on. And he has made some name, people after him. People means if you flatter him, that "Whatever you are doing, it is all right."

Mahāṁśa: They will...

Prabhupāda: Then they will be very much pleased. And as soon as you criticize, that "You are doing this wrong, you will suffer." "Oh, yes, this Swamiji is not (indistinct)." That is going on everywhere. In the name of religion you do all nonsense rascaldom, and the leader approves, "Yes, you can do." Vivekananda did it. "Yes, there is no difference between eating meat and not eating eat in terms of religion system." He preached this, and all the sannyāsīs of the Ramakrishna Mission they eat meat, they drink, they have woman secretary, everything. This Chinmayananda is also like that. I know his whole mischief. Unless one is purely Kṛṣṇa conscious, one cannot give up all these bad habits. This is the test. Bhaktiḥ pareśānubhavo viraktir anyatra caiṣa (SB 11.2.42). One... Unless one is substantially advanced in kṛṣṇa-bhakti, they cannot give up this material attachment—illicit sex, meat eating—they cannot. It is impossible. So even in the name of swami or big, big yogis... They are doing all these things. Especially those who go in foreign countries... In USA illicit sex is very cheap. Everything is very cheap. Yes. Intoxication very cheap, meat-eating very cheap, gambling, very cheap, so when they get this cheap amenities, they forget their so-called spiritual life.

They (the Vivekananda group) raise funds from America, huge funds, that "We shall feeding the poor in India." And they eat meat and big, big become fat, these rascals. So the Americans asked them that "You are taking away our money somewhere to feed the poor. But when we go to India, two sides we see all poor men are lying on the street. What you have done?" So this is a slogan. They cannot do anything.

Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: These Aurobindos or Vivekanandas and Gandhis, they have spoiled Hindu culture. Vedic culture they have spoiled. Hodgepodge writing, hodgepodge speaking, dry speaking, speculation-choked up the progress of Vedic civilization. Now here is some hope. People are now taking it. Now, did I say wrong, that "Why shall I go to Aurobindo?"

Nitāi: You never say wrong. (laughs) All of your answers were right, great.

Prabhupāda: I have got better instruction than Aurobindo. Why shall I go to Aurobindo, waste my time? People don't know anything. Nobody has become a devotee of Kṛṣṇa in reading Aurobindo's literature. And here, as soon as they saw our literature, immediately police officer said, "Oh, you are so high." Immediately. Where is the record, the professors and universities eager to purchase Aurobindo's book and Vivekananda's books? There is no record. But here they are eager "All sixty books, please, sir." "All twelve books, please, sir."

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Why are they so attracted to humanitarianism?

Prabhupāda: That is false pride. This has been taught. In the Christianity they have taught like that, giving medicine, open hospital. That is Christianity.

Yogeśvara: He admitted it himself. He said himself, "It's a false pride to think..."

Prabhupāda: That's all.

Yogeśvara: "...think we can do something."

Prabhupāda: You cannot do anything. But they show. They make a collection, that "We are doing such nice work." The Vivekananda also imitated like that and could not do anything. It is not possible. Swami Nikhilananda said... He belongs to the Vivekananda group. Because they raise funds from America, huge funds, that "We shall feeding the poor in India." And they eat meat and big, big become fat, these rascals. So the Americans asked them that "You are taking away our money somewhere to feed the poor. But when we go to India, two sides we see all poor men are lying on the street. What you have done?" So this is a slogan. They cannot do anything. Thinking of poor... Now, those who have accepted voluntarily povertyism, the hippies, what you are doing for them? Why don't you make arrangement for their gentlemanly living? They are not poverty-stricken. Why they are living like wretches, lying on the street, no program for eating, no for sleeping, no for bodily comfort, just like animals? What you have done for them?

That was the support by Vivekananda. He was eating everything. All the Ramakrishna Mission, they say like that, "Oh, without meat-eating, without drinking, you cannot stay."

Room Conversation with devotees about Twelfth Canto Kali-yuga, and Conversation with Guest -- June 15, 1974, Paris:

Yogeśvara: When you were here last year, there was a meeting at the Indian Tourist Bureau, a press meeting, and there was a man who came to meet you at that time who is president of the court of Paris. And he was supposed to be a Buddhist. Do you remember this gentleman? He said to you that "Meat-eating... We must eat meat in the West. Maybe in India, because of the climate, you can get away with that."

Prabhupāda: That is rascaldom, another rascaldom. He's a first-class rascal. That was the support by Vivekananda. He was eating everything. All the Ramakrishna Mission, they say like that, "Oh, without meat-eating, without drinking, you cannot stay." All rascals. Therefore, the conclusion is, all rascals, the religious, social, all rascal. If they want to be saved from their rascal position, this is the only, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. If they don't want to be saved, if they want to go to hell, who can check? Ātma-han. Ātma-han means "self-suicide." Suicide, yes. If you cut your throat yourself, who can save you? So they are all these like, all, all these Buddhists, Christian. We may not speak very strongly. They will be our enemies.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Where he got this information? You did not challenge? We don't find any such thing. In this way they have ruined Indian culture by misquoting, by misleading.

Morning Walk -- November 14, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: As soon as there will be one school and other school, that means all of them are rascals. Just like the sun rises from this side. There cannot be two schools. If somebody says, "No, no. Sun rises from this side," if that is school, he's a fool. Sun rises from the eastern side. That's all. That is knowledge. If somebody says, "No, sometimes in the western side, sometimes in the northern side," is that any value? So as soon as there will be many schools, that means the conclusion is not like that.

Yaśomatīnandana: Someone was telling me, and I was telling that if somebody is not following the particular characteristic of a saintly person mentioned in the śastra, they cannot be accepted as a sādhu. So he was trying to prove that some sādhus, so-called, who eat meat, and who are drinking, they were actually great paramahaṁsas. And then I... He said that because in the previous ages there is mention of... In the śāstras there is mention that there were many ṛṣis and munis who were eating meat.

Prabhupāda: He knows them. He is such a rascal that he knows only and nobody knows. That is the verdict of this Rāmakrishna Mission.

Yaśomatīnandana: They say that they would... These ṛṣis would kill one elephant or something like that, and they would live on him for whole year.

Prabhupāda: Where is that information? Where he got this information? You did not challenge?

Yaśomatīnandana: Well, I said that that muni must be just like the ṛṣis and munis you are talking about now.

Prabhupāda: We don't find any such thing. In this way they have ruined Indian culture by misquoting, by misleading.

Yaśomatīnandana: And he admitted that Vivekānanda smoked gañja and he was eating meat.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Yaśomatīnandana: But for such a soul, he said, there is no conditioning like that. Then, when you quote any verse from Bhagavad-gītā contrary to such statement, immediately he would say, "Well, Bhagavad-gītā is not the only scripture."

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Yes, that is known to everyone.

Morning Walk -- January 2, 1976, Madras:

Acyutānanda: In Calcutta we have a life member, Veni Śaṅkara Sharma? You stayed at his house?

Prabhupāda: Hm, yes.

Acyutānanda: So he wrote a book called An Unknown Chapter of the Life of Swami Vivekananda. And in there he openly says that he smoked a hookah and ate meat.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is known to everyone.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Was he praising that?

Acyutānanda: It was.... You know...

Yaśodānandana: In Hyderabad there is a cook who used to cook for the Rāmakrishna Mission, and he said they used to cook any kind of meat.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Acyutānanda: I said, "Did you ever cook human meat?" He said, "If they told me, I would have done that also." There was nothing beyond their diet. "Anything they told me to cook..."

Prabhupāda: This building belongs to Vivekananda's society, no? Vivekananda house.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What is that?

Acyutānanda: That's Bengali. "The house of Vivekananda."

Prabhupāda: (Bengali)

Acyutānanda: They say Swami Vivekananda walked barefoot all over India at some stage of his...

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Acyutānanda: That.... This statue here is his life as a wandering sādhu.

Prabhupāda: Who is a sādhu? Then question is, who is a sādhu? Who is a sādhu? You cannot say?

Acyutānanda: One who is Kṛṣṇa conscious.

Prabhupāda: Api cet sudarācaro bhajate mām ananya-bhāk, sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ (BG 9.30). Unless one is cent percent Kṛṣṇa conscious, he is not a sādhu. Sādhu-bhūṣaṇa.

titiksavaḥ karuṇikaḥ

suhṛdaḥ sarva-bhūtānām

ajāta-śatravaḥ santaḥ

sādhavaḥ sādhu-bhūṣaṇaḥ

(SB 3.25.21)

This is sādhu.

The real fact is the Bengali educational class do not want to give up meat-eating and fish-eating. Therefore they like Vivekananda. That is the real reason.

Morning Walk -- July 4, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: What will be the technique to attract the Bengali educational class? To attract the Bengalis who are educated, what technique will be most effective?

Prabhupāda: This kīrtana and prasāda distribution.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But it seems to me they are not so much interested. There was a man who came from Calcutta about two months ago, a Bengali, and in fact we were class friends in Calcutta when I was studying in Calcutta. And I discussed this problem with him, why so-called Bengali intellectuals are not attracted to our movement. And his answer was that the Caitanya movement was mostly for less intellectuals. For those who are educated, they want to be followers of Ramakrishna and Vivekananda. In fact, they have a society called Vedanta Society. All the Bengalis get together...

Prabhupāda: And waste their time. The rascals waste their time.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: And they discuss... So I was a little mad at him, this friend.

Prabhupāda: Because the real fact is they do not want to give up meat-eating and fish-eating. Therefore they like Vivekananda. That is the real reason. And Caitanya Mahāprabhu's movement, Vaiṣṇava, they have to give up so many things. That is the disease of the Bengalis. And Vivekananda is recognized only in Bengal. To some part, not all.

Vipina: There is also a small Vedanta Society here in Washington. I had one of our Indian associates, whom I hope you will be able to meet, go there, and he said they could not even discuss the topics of Bhagavad-gītā. They had no conclusions, they were arguing in their own meeting, and no one had any idea what Bhagavad-gītā was, and so many technical points.

Prabhupāda: The meat-eaters are the most sinful. They cannot understand. Vinā paśughnāt, nivṛtta-tarṣair upagīyamānāt (SB 10.1.4). They will have no access.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I think there must be a fundamental mistake in their outlook.

Prabhupāda: Their life is a mistake, because they are sinful. Their life is a mistake, misguided.

We do not make any compromise. Vivekananda went there. He came back. He said, "What is the wrong in meat-eating?" He introduced meat-eating amongst his contemporary sannyāsīs. This is his vedānta-pracāra. So he is advertised that he preached Vedānta all over America, and everyone has become Vedantist. What kind of Vedantist? Now, he introduced meat-eating amongst the sannyāsīs, which was never in India.

Morning Walk -- December 27, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Before me, for the last two hundred years, so many swamis and yogis went to the Western countries. Nobody could convert a single person to Hinduism. That is a fact in the history. These foreigners-giving up meat-eating, illicit sex, no intoxication, no gambling—it is a horrible thing for them. Lord Zetland said, "This is impossible for us." Factually it is impossible, because American government spent millions of dollars to stop this LSD intoxication but it was not successful. But they have seen that as soon as the same boy comes to our camp, he immediately gives up, immediately, without any protest, that "Why shall I give up?" No. I ask, "You have to give up." "Yes, we do." That's a fact. Therefore this Swami Chit?

Jagadīśa: Chandra Swami.

Prabhupāda: Ah, Chandra Swami, has strongly recommended that "This is the only movement which is converting Christian into Hindu." He is pleased on this account. He is not interested our Hare... He has said that "I am not very much interested in Hare Kṛṣṇa, but I am interested in this point." That is natural, that nobody could convert the Christian to Hindu, but this movement is doing that.

Yaśomatīnandana: That is indirectly accepting Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that's a fact. We do not make any compromise. Vivekananda went there. He came back. He said, "What is the wrong in meat-eating?" He introduced meat-eating amongst his contemporary sannyāsīs. This is his vedānta-pracāra. So he is advertised that he preached Vedānta all over America, and everyone has become Vedantist. What is...? What kind of Vedantist? Now, he introduced meat-eating amongst the sannyāsīs, which was never in India, any... There are two sets of sannyāsīs, the Śaṅkara sampradāya and Vaiṣṇava sampradāya. But their ācāra is the same. They may differ in philosophy, but their ācāra is the same. Rather, the Śaṅkara sampradāya sannyāsī are more strict than the Vaiṣṇava sannyāsī. Śaṅkara sampradāya sannyāsī, they'll never occupy a seat, those who are strictly following. They'll sit down on the floor. Without any āsana. They lie down on the floor. They are so renounced. And what is this, that sannyāsī smoking and drinking? And ordinary sannyāsīs, they are drinking also tea, one ghara (?). I have seen it.

These people who were eating meat, they knew that "I am doing wrong." But Vivekananda approved, "No, it is not wrong. It is wrong. Whatever you like you can do." Then they began to eat meat. Fish they were already eating. Meat and chicken and eggs and everything.

Room Conversation -- December 31, 1976, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: Great number of luminaries have been produced by Bengal. Last year we read in Times of India more luminaries were produced in Bengal than any other...

Prabhupāda: No, Bengal... They maintained the culture. But therefore I say that Vivekananda broke that Bengali culture.

Dr. Patel: Bengali culture is fish-eating. Even brāhmaṇas eating.

Prabhupāda: No. They are eating fish only. Because Bengal is full of rivers. But not for all. Mass of people, that's a fact. But he introduced, "You can eat anything. It has nothing to do with religion." In Bengal in our childhood we have seen if anyone was habituated to take meat... Common man would not. Rich man. The rich men they have their sahis. Sahis you know, who takes care of the horse. So he would cook in the horse shed.

Dr. Patel: And eat there.

Prabhupāda: No. Then he'll bring the (indistinct) and eat it. It was never brought within the precincts of the house.

Dr. Patel: (indistinct) Gujarat and Maharastra (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: No, no... These people who were eating meat, they knew that "I am doing wrong." But Vivekananda approved, "No, it is not wrong. It is wrong. Whatever you like you can do." Then they began to eat meat. Fish they were already eating. Meat and chicken and eggs and everything.

Dr. Patel: All the sons of Vallabhācārya's followers are eating.

Prabhupāda: No, everyone is eating. I know that. Therefore our first regulation is you must give it up. Then we talk of Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

And what Vivekananda said, that it is better to water eggplant tree. Why tulasī plant? What you will get? Eggplant tree means you'll get some eggplant. This is his culture. Make your body strong and stout by eating meat, and there is nothing to do with the...

Room Conversation -- December 31, 1976, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: But I think tulasī can be grown in all the countries. Even in cold.

Prabhupāda: Little cold countries with little care.

Dr. Patel: England?

Prabhupāda: Oh yes. We have got tulasī.

Dr. Patel: You may have to keep it in hothouse during winter.

Prabhupāda: Yes. We make that arrangement. And what Vivekananda said, that it is better to water eggplant tree. Why tulasī plant? What you will get? Eggplant tree means you'll get some eggplant, begun. (Hindi) This is his culture. Make your body strong and stout by eating meat, and there is nothing to do with the...

Dr. Patel: The result will be the same as Gandhi's (indistinct). This slaughterhouse, so abominable and so horrible. When I first came to Bombay from my village and I had to pass through that railway, that nasty butcher house. It was so horrible smelling and those vultures sitting on the... I became spite of myself. When I came in Bombay. I had to join the grammatical college here.

Prabhupāda: You were... Two thousand years ago, Christ, he was born in Jewish family, he was horrified by seeing animal sacrifices in the synagogue. Therefore his first commandment is, "Thou shall not kill." He was so horrified. Why he has given this commandment? He was so much horrified. What is this? Therefore he gave up the Jewish religion. He started his own. This is the history. And he first commanded, "Thou shall not kill."

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

I am not imitating them. Of course, all credit to Vivekananda. But Vivekananda learned something from them: how to eat meat. And introduced amongst the sannyāsīs that "There is no harm in eating meat." So Vivekananda learned something from them. And I have gone to—"Forget meat-eating." That is the difference.

Evening Darsana -- January 7, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9). Take this process. This body is material; you have to give it up. But no more material body. Why don't you take this science; how it is possible? Why do you not contribute this science to the whole world as India's contribution? They need it. Why you go beg? Give something. In Berkeley University, one Indian student, "Swamiji, what this hari-kīrtana will do? We require now technology." So I replied, "Yes, you have come to beg here. I have come to give something. I am not a beggar like you." So we are working... Of course, we are Indian, we are poor. That is another thing. But I never went to beg something from them. I never asked them any money. I never asked them. They give me money because they understand that I am giving something. Do you know how we are selling our books? Daily, five, six lakhs rupees collected. They are getting the money. I have given them the knowledge. (aside:) Bring that telegram. In one week how many books we have sold? Because they're hankering after this knowledge. This is Indian culture, or some dancing party goes, that is Indian culture?

D. D. Desai: Presently you are...

Prabhupāda: I am not imitating them. Of course, all credit to Vivekananda. But Vivekananda learned something from them: how to eat meat. And introduced amongst the sannyāsīs that "There is no harm in eating meat." So Vivekananda learned something from them. And I have gone to—"Forget meat-eating." That is the difference. These boys, these young boys... Just see how they have become Vaiṣṇava.