So parīkṣin nāma rājarṣiḥ prāptaḥ prācīṁ sarasvatīm. In India, all the rivers, they're coming from the Himalaya, western side, and flowing toward the eastern side, going to the Bay of Bengal. So prācīm, flowing to the eastern side, Sarasvatī... This is also one of the famous rivers. There are many rivers in India. Especially there is sacred rivers-Ganges, Yamunā, Sarasvatī, Godāvarī, Kāverī, Kṛṣṇā, Narmadā, like that. Each river is considered very sacred. So it is understood that Parīkṣit Mahārāja met the Dharmarāja and the earthly planet, talking together on the bank of the river Sarasvatī.
That's all right. Thank you very much. (devotees pay obeisances) Any questions?
Devotee (1): Is Dharmarāja King Yudhiṣṭhira?
Prabhupāda: That King Yudhiṣṭhira is the son of Dharmarāja. He is the son. Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira was begotten by Dharmarāja.
Devotee (1): Vidura was also the...
Prabhupāda: No, Vidura was begotten by Vyāsadeva.
Devotee (1): He was also Dharmarāja?
Prabhupāda: No, he was not Dharmarāja. Oh, yes, yes, you are right. He was Dharmarāja.
Devotee (1): Yamarāja.
Prabhupāda: Yamarāja, yes. By the cursing of some great ṛṣi, he became a śūdra. Yes. I thought that you were asking whether Vidura was begotten by Dharmarāja. No. He's Dharmarāja. Any question? What is the name of that boy?
Devotee (1): Sañjaya.
Prabhupāda: Dhanañjaya?
Devotee (1): Sañjaya.
Prabhupāda: Sañjaya?
Devotee (1): Yes.
Prabhupāda: Who has given you this name?
Sañjaya: You have, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Prabhupāda: Sañjaya uvāca. (laughter) Sañjaya...
Sañjaya: Having heard your wondrous dialogue, Śrīla Prabhupāda, my hair is standing on end.
Prabhupāda: What is that?
Sañjaya: Having heard your holy dialogue, Śrīla Prabhupāda, my hair is standing on end, like Sañjaya says in the Gītā.
Prabhupāda: What is that special...? Which portion?
Sañjaya: This is the last ślokas of Bhagavad-gītā, when the...
Devotee (1): He's relating the conversation to Dhṛtarāṣṭra, the final conclusion of Bhagavad-gītā, saying, "After hearing this holy dialogue, my hair is standing on end."
Prabhupāda: Oh.
Devotee (1): In Bhagavad-gītā.
Prabhupāda: Ha, ha. You want to know about something, about that verse?
Sañjaya: No, I just stated that...
Prabhupāda: Oh.
Sañjaya: ...after hearing your lecture, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Prabhupāda: Every instruction is like that. We should follow the instruction, and if you cannot understand, then consult the spiritual master. Not to give up this association of the spiritual master and interpret in your own way. That is rascaldom. Don't do that. It is said in the Bhagavad-gītā,
- tad viddhi praṇipātena
- paripraśnena sevayā
- upadekṣyanti te jñānaṁ
- jñāninas tattva-darśinaḥ
- (BG 4.34)
If there is any doubt in understanding the Vedic literature, then you try to understand from the person who knows it, tattva-darśī, who has seen actually the truth. Upadekṣyanti te jñānaṁ jñāninas tattva-darśinaḥ. One who has actually seen the truth. And, how to approach him? Tad viddhi praṇipātena paripraśnena. By surrendering, by giving service, and questioning. Question must be preceded and followed by..., preceded by surrender, and followed by service. In the middle, there may be question. Therefore, yasya prasādād bhagavat-prasādaḥ **, we have to please the spiritual master by service and surrender, and then it will be very nice position. If the spiritual master sees that the disciple is a surrendered soul, and he's rendering service to his best capacity, then the answer will be very liberal and convincing, and he will be very glad to answer the question, if it is supported by these two things: surrender, and paripraśnena, and sevayā. Tad viddhi praṇipātena (BG 4.34). The first beginning is praṇipāta. And what is this, that I give up the company of my spiritual master and I invent my own ways of life and own interpretation? That will not help. That will not...
Devotee (3): The war on the battlefield of Kurukṣetra, that lasted for a period of eighteen days?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Devotee (3): And that happened five thousand years ago when Kṛṣṇa was on earth. Is that happening now in some other material universe, the same battle?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Devotee (3): Can we enter into that, or see that?
Prabhupāda: Yes, if you go there.
Devotee (3): We have to... We leave the universe. But then we are associating directly with Kṛṣṇa and Arjuna?
Prabhupāda: Yes. You can associate with Kṛṣṇa and Arjuna every twenty-four hours, by reading Bhagavad-gītā. Why you require to go there? It is already here. You see. You read the Bhagavad-gītā, and you are immediately in the battlefield of Kurukṣetra. His is instructing. That was the instruction. Caitanya Mahāprabhu accepted. You know that story? Illiterate brāhmaṇa was reading Bhagavad-gītā. So he did not know; he was not literary. But because his spiritual master..., he has so staunch faith in the spiritual master... Just see. His spiritual master said that "You read, daily, eighteen chapters of Bhagavad-gītā." Spiritual master knew that he was illiterate, but still he asked him, "You read, eighteen chapters, there will be..." So what can he do? The spiritual master has ordered. So he was simply making a show of reading, "uh-uh-uḥ," like this. So this other friends were criticizing, "Oh, Mr. Such-and-such, how you are reading Bhagavad-gītā?" He knows that this man... His friend is criticizing him, so he did not answer. But when Caitanya Mahāprabhu asked him, "My dear brāhmaṇa, what you are reading?" He knew that this gentleman, Caitanya Mahāprabhu, was really inquisitive, so he explained the whole thing, that "I am trying to read Bhagavad-gītā, but I am illiterate. My Guru Mahārāja ordered me to read; therefore I am reading. But actually I cannot read." So frankly he admits. This is staunch faith in spiritual master. He knew, his spiritual master knew that he is illiterate, and he knew also that "I cannot read Bhagavad-gītā." But still he was trying to read because his spiritual master has said. This is called staunch. Yasya prasādāt. "He has said. I have to satisfy him. I am incompetent—I cannot read—but he has said, therefore I must do it." This is called yasya prasādād bhagavat-prasādaḥ **.
So practical example... Just like this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, and I have simply be (indistinct) human being, "What can I do?" But I tried my best, because my spiritual master said that "You go and try to preach in English." So I tried my best, that's all. I have no qualification. So this is very nice point, yasya prasādāt. We have to try our best to... I may not be able to do that, but that endeavor will be appreciated by Kṛṣṇa and the spiritual master. That is required. I may be most incompetent. Everyone is incompetent. Who can satisfy Kṛṣṇa, this unlimited? But simply what Kṛṣṇa says, if we do, that will satisfy Him. Kṛṣṇa says, man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65). The guidance is, the spiritual master, he orders that man-manāḥ, "Always think of Me," bhava mad-bhaktaḥ, "just become My devotee, worship Me, and offer your obeisances unto Me." And here is the Deity. So that is our business. Think of always, "Here is Rādhā and Kṛṣṇa, here is Jagannātha, here is Lord Caitanya." What is the difficulty? In the temple we get direct contact, and if I go out from the temple and lie down on the station, is that very good, do you think? (laughter) Kṛṣṇa says, man-manā bhava mad-bhaktaḥ. So will it help me to think of Him twenty-four hours by going to the railway station or in the temple? This is common sense. Any sensible man can understand that "Here is Kṛṣṇa, here is Rādhārāṇī, worship is going on, the devotees are offering prasādam, always they are constantly engaged—that is man-manā bhaktaḥ." Or "I give up the association of the devotees and temple and go to hell, that will help me?" This is common sense thing. I manufacture my own way by the advice of some, another rascal. This will not be good. This, this is very good, man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65). "Always think of Me." Here is the chance. As soon as I see... As I advance in my spiritual life, I'll see, "Here is Kṛṣṇa." It is not the doll Kṛṣṇa. Doll Kṛṣṇa is for the kaniṣṭha-adhikārī. But one who is advanced, he sees Kṛṣṇa. Just like you have read the story of, in Caitanya-caritāmṛta, two brāhmaṇas went to Vṛndāvana. So the devotee is seeing, "Here is Kṛṣṇa." When the older brāhmaṇa said that "I promise," the younger said, "Sir, you are talking before Kṛṣṇa. If you regret from this promise, it will be great offense." Because he was seeing Kṛṣṇa. And when he was asked, "Who was your witness?" he said, "Kṛṣṇa is witness." And his eldest son took the opportunity, "All right, if your Kṛṣṇa comes and gives witness, then my sister will be married with you." Because he is atheist. He was thinking, "Kṛṣṇa is not coming. Kṛṣṇa is not coming. It is made of marble statue, how Kṛṣṇa will come?" So he thought that "I have given him some chance which he will never be fulfilled." But to fulfill the words of the devotee, Kṛṣṇa came. Therefore He is called Sākṣi-Gopāla, witness Gopāla. So we must have faith. We must have faith and discharge duties according to the śāstra, guru, sādhu, then our spiritual life is guaranteed. If we manufacture something out of whims, that will not help us. This is the point.
Devotee (3): Śrīla Prabhupāda, in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam it's stated that the Supersoul is measured from the end of the thumb to the end of the ring finger, how does this change take place in the different sizes of species of living entities in this material creation?
Prabhupāda: He can become the smaller than the smallest, the higher than..., the bigger than the biggest. That is Kṛṣṇa's power. (devotees pay obeisances) So, you can go? (end)