Refute (Conversations)

Expressions researched:
"Refute" |"refutation" |"refutations" |"refute" |"refuted" |"refutes" |"refuting"

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Can you refute this, that God is not the supreme proprietor?

Conversation with Journalists -- August 18, 1971, London:

Journalist (2): Have you got a particular mission for London?

Prabhupāda: I have particular mission for the whole world? Why London? London is included in the world.

Journalist (2): What is that mission?

Prabhupāda: That mission is to make you understand what is God. You cannot say what is God. If I ask you, can you say what is God?

Journalist (2): I can't. Can you?

Prabhupāda: Therefore you have to learn.

Journalist (2): Can you say what is God?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. Yes. Therefore you have to become student.

Journalist (2): Tell me what is God.

Prabhupāda: First of all, you become a student, otherwise you'll not be understand... That I say God is the supreme enjoyer, God is the supreme proprietor. That I already told. Can you understand this? Can you refute this, that God is not the supreme proprietor?

Journalist (2): What sort of people do you want?

Prabhupāda: No, why you are going away? You are talking one thing and then going another thing.

Journalist (2): I have to do, I'm afraid.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Then I cannot waste my time. You question one thing. Make a solution.

Journalist (2): What sort of people do you want to become students?

Prabhupāda: Tell him, Bhagavān.

Bhagavān: We want everyone to become our students. No one has a good understanding of what is God.

I say that God is the proprietor. Now you refute. Those who will not accept, that "God is not proprietor, I am proprietor," this requires discussion. How you become proprietor?

Conversation with Journalists -- August 18, 1971, London:

Prabhupäda: We are simply presenting the fact that everything belongs to God. God is the supreme friend and God is the maintainer of everyone, everything, and He is the supreme enjoyer. These three things, if we understand, then the whole problem is solved. Now, I say that God is the proprietor. Now you refute. Those who will not accept, that "God is not proprietor, I am proprietor," this requires discussion. How you become proprietor? Bhagavad-gétä says, God says, bhoktäraà yajïa-tapasäà sarva-loka-maheçvaram (BG 5.29). I am not manufacturing this. It is stated in the çästra. God is the supreme enjoyer. He is the proprietor. He should be enjoyer. Just like here, if I am the proprietor of a factory, so the profit should come to me, similarly, if God is the proprietor of everything then we cannot enjoy anything without the sanction of God.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Our essential business is to serve God. How do you find this argument? Do you refute this argument?

Room Conversation with Kenneth Keating, U.S. Ambassador to India -- October 14, 1972, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Suppose I say that I don't serve. That is not possible. That being our constitutional position then, just like my finger, it is serving, always, sometimes doing like that, sometimes doing like that, sometimes doing like that. The finger's business is to serve. As part and parcel of my body, the finger's business is to serve the whole body. Similarly, we are part and parcel of God. Our essential business is to serve God. How do you find this argument? Do you refute this argument?

Mrs. Keating: You serve and you share.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

We went to see Prabhupāda, offered our obeisances. So immediately he said that "You are all educated young men, why don't you preach Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu's message throughout the whole world?" So I replied him, "Sir, we are dependent nation, who will hear our message? We can talk all these things after we get independence," because I was politically-minded at that time. So he refuted my argument. Certainly I was defeated, and I took his words very seriously, I appreciated.

Room Conversation -- March 17, 1973, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: So in their house, old Tīrtha Mahārāja went to beg some alms—they are very rich man. So, he informed me that "One nice sannyāsī came to our house," and he was invited, "in Ultadanga there is Gauḍīya Maṭha, so he has invited me. I wish to go there. Why don't you come? Let us go together." He was my very intimate friend. So at that time I was a little pessimistic (?), "I know all these sādhus there, I am not going." So he forced me, "Oh, why not come? Let us go." "All right, let us go." So I went to see His Divine Grace Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī Ṭhākura in 1922 in that Ultadanga building, and that time Prabhupāda was sitting on the roof. There was small house (indistinct) room, and we were welcome, because they thought Naren Mullik was very rich man and he has contributed some money. So, we went to see Prabhupāda, offered our obeisances. So immediately he said that "You are all educated young men, why don't you preach Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu's message throughout the whole world?" So I replied him, "Sir, we are dependent nation, who will hear our message? We can talk all these things after we get independence," because I was politically-minded at that time. So he refuted my argument. Certainly I was defeated, and I took his words very seriously, I appreciated. Then we were offered some prasādam, we came down, and my friend Naren Mullik asked me, "How did you like this sādhu?" "Yes, here is a sādhu in whose hands Caitanya Mahāprabhu's message is there, and it will be done. I think this is very nice." That was my appreciation. Then 1923, I resigned my post as manager in Bose's laboratory, and I accepted the agency of whole U.P., beginning from Mughalsarai (?) up to Delhi, and I made my head office in Allahabad. So I was always thinking, "Oh yes, I met a very nice sādhu." From the very beginning, that was my impression, that "I have met a real sādhu."

We refute that. The chemicals are already there. Otherwise how living entities are coming out?

Morning Walk -- April 19, 1973, Los Angeles:

Karandhara: They don't think that if it's simply a chemical, why cannot they just get a chemical that's a person.

Prabhupāda: No. We refute that. The chemicals are already there. Otherwise how living entities are coming out? We don't say that chemical is missing. Because the same theory: conservation of energy. The chemicals, the energy-producing, that is already there. It may be in different form, but the life-producing-energy is there. Otherwise how the other living entities are coming out?

I told him that "You are a demon." But he was not angry. He admitted. And all his argument was refuted.

Morning Walk At Cheviot Hills Golf Course -- May 17, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Chouri. (laughing) So I told him that "You are a demon." But he was not angry. He admitted. And all his argument was refuted. Perhaps you remember.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, in fact, he was telling that "Kṛṣṇa didn't give me all the procedures, steps, how to do the experiment." He was saying like that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Why shall I give you? You are a rascal, you are against Kṛṣṇa, why Kṛṣṇa will give you facility? If you are against Kṛṣṇa and you want the credit without Kṛṣṇa, that's not possible. You must be submissive first of all. Then Kṛṣṇa will give you all facilities. Just like we dare to face any chemist, any scientist, any philosopher. Why? On the strength of Kṛṣṇa, we believe that "There is Kṛṣṇa. When I shall talk with him, Kṛṣṇa will give give me intelligence." This is the basics.

If it is scientifically presented, how it has come from Kṛṣṇa, then they cannot refute so easily.

Room Conversation -- October 31, 1973, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Now, the Kṛṣṇa says that bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ khaṁ mano, bhinnā me prakṛtir aṣṭadhā (BG 7.4). So it has emanated from Kṛṣṇa. Yato vā imāni bhūtāni jāyante. This is the statement of the Vedas and... So how would you explain that a person can produce such huge quantity of material things, at least to make them understand how it is produced from the person? These are to be scientifically explained, wherefrom so much vast mass of water came. That you have to explain scientifically. Otherwise how they will accept? Simply by saying, It has come from Kṛṣṇa," they will not accept.

Guest (1) Indian man: Yes. We have to convince them about the method of approach.

Prabhupāda: Yes. If these boys, in their scientific language, they try to convince, that will be more effective. We are generally speaking that "Water has come from Kṛṣṇa," or "The earth has come from Kṛṣṇa." That may be blind. But if it is scientifically presented, how it has come from Kṛṣṇa, then they cannot refute so easily. So that I am engaging this doctor of chemistry, Svarūpa Dāmodara and Rāya Rāmānanda. Caitanya Mahāprabhu's two personal associates, Svarūpa Dāmodara and Rāmānanda.

Why you did not refute that idea? We see every moment God. What is that light? Even if you see light, what do you gain by that.

Morning Walk -- December 19, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Unconditionally means, sarva-dharmān parityajya (BG 18.66), giving up all other conditions of faith. (break)

Jayatīrtha: We only hear about him eating.

Prabhupāda: Why you did not refute that idea? We see every moment God. What is that light? Even if you see light, what do you gain by that.

Jayatīrtha: He says that Guru Maharaji is the light.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. Here is electric light also. So what is the benefit? Light, you have got so many lights. So what is the benefit? If you remain in the darkness, then what is the benefit of this light? Light means you are not in darkness. But you are in darkness. If you have got the light, then you can see Kṛṣṇa. But why do you say that by Kṛṣṇa consciousness we cannot see Kṛṣṇa. Rascal. We may not see. But you have seen the light, why don't you see Kṛṣṇa?

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

How to get out of this material nature? That is explained, mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti te: "As soon as that rascal surrenders unto Me, immediately he's out of control." Hare Kṛṣṇa. How these rascals, scientists, philosophers, politicians can refute this arrangement? Is it possible?

Morning Walk -- January 18, 1974, Hawaii:

Prabhupāda: He thinks that "I am now independent of the Supreme Lord." But because he's foolish, he cannot understand that you are not independent. You are being controlled by another agent of God. And because, although he's being controlled, he's thinking, "I am free," therefore he's in illusion. This is called illusion. Illusion means something which is not fact. That is illusion. So this materialist, the so-called scientist, he's thinking, "There is no God. We are independent." So many things, like rascal they are thinking. Foolish rascal, childish. And that is illusion. Ahaṅkāra-vimudhātmā. Therefore this very word is used, vimūḍhātmā: "befooled rascal." Actually, he's being controlled by material nature. So how to get out of this material nature? That is explained, mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti te: "As soon as that rascal surrenders unto Me, immediately he's out of control." Hare Kṛṣṇa. How these rascals, scientists, philosophers, politicians can refute this arrangement? Is it possible?

Bali-mardana: Yes, they refuse.

Prabhupāda: They refuse. That is..., means rascaldom. They do not actually understand the fact. How they can refuse? Every moment they are controlled by the material nature. Every step.

These Māyāvādīs' accusation that bhakti is meant for the less intelligent class and jñāna is meant for the higher class of men, so this accusation is refuted that "No, don't think that the devotees are less intelligent, because I am guiding them."

Morning Walk -- April 3, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Satata-yuktānāṁ bhajatāṁ prīti-pūrvakam, teṣām. It is a special favor for them. Teṣām evānukampārtham. So if Kṛṣṇa dissipates ignorance from the heart of a person, how he can be less intelligent? If somebody is guided by the most perfect intellect, intellectual, then how he can be less intelligent? So these Māyāvādīs' accusation that bhakti is meant for the less intelligent class and jñāna is meant for the higher class of men, so this accusation is refuted that "No, don't think that the devotees are less intelligent, because I am guiding them."

Dr. Patel: Nāśayāmy ātma-bhāva-stho, aham ajñāna-jaṁ tamaḥ. Tamaḥ nāśayāmy ātma-bhāva-stho.

Prabhupāda: Tamaḥ. No more ignorance, darkness. So how a devotee can be in darkness, in ignorance? This is refuted.

Here the latest theory of the rascals, that life has come from matter, is refuted.

Morning Walk -- April 3, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: The body develops so long the ātmā is there. So similarly, because Kṛṣṇa is there, therefore whatever manifestation you see, that is due to Kṛṣṇa. Now here the latest theory of the rascals, that life has come from matter, is refuted.

Dr. Patel: That is Carvaka's theory, this Karl Marx, the communists.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Now He says aham. Aham is living entity. So living entity is the origin of everything.

Within the universe there is only one sun, and by the brilliance of sunshine, all these stars and moons are glittering. Just like moon shining, being reflected by the sun, similarly, all the stars they are glittering, being reflected by the sun, not that all of them are different suns. This theory is refuted.

Morning Walk -- April 3, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Moon is like one of the stars. So if you say the stars are sūrya, then there is contradiction. How the moon and the sun can be equal? But actually, that is not. According to our Vedic astronomy, there is one sun only in one universe, although there are millions of universes, we cannot count. So there are millions of suns. That is another thing. But within the universe there is only one sun, and by the brilliance of sunshine, all these stars and moons are glittering. Just like moon shining, being reflected by the sun, similarly, all the stars they are glittering, being reflected by the sun, not that all of them are different suns. This theory is refuted.

This water is Kṛṣṇa's energy. So how can you refute it? Kṛṣṇa says, "It is My energy."

Morning Walk -- April 11, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Paraṁ bhāvam ajānanto mama-bhūta maheśvaram. Avajānanti māṁ mūḍhā mānuṣīṁ tanum āśritam (BG 9.11). (break) ...says, bhūmir āpo analo vayuḥ (BG 7.4). This water is Kṛṣṇa's energy. So how can you refute it? Kṛṣṇa says, "It is My energy."

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Refute their arguments, then it will be nice.

Room Conversation -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I have interest for these journals, say life, origin of life, that started from last year. So here the international scientists from all over the world, they have combined together and then they formed this, this is all chemicals, this. And they're a big group.

Prabhupāda: So why don't you protest?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, that's what we're starting the background.

Prabhupāda: Refute their arguments, then it will be nice.

If you study the whole Bhagavad-gītā, where is any word there which you can refute or which is not good for you? Study whole Bhagavad-gītā. All practical and very congenial for human civilization.

Morning Walk -- March 4, 1975, Dallas:

Prabhupāda: Ekala īśvara kṛṣṇa ara saba bhṛtya. "Only master is Kṛṣṇa. Everyone is servant." Accept this principle and everything will be all right immediately. Immediately. If you study the whole Bhagavad-gītā, where is any word there which you can refute or which is not good for you? Study whole Bhagavad-gītā. All practical and very congenial for human civilization. Kṛṣṇa teaches from the very beginning, "First of all learn what you are. You are not this body. You are within this body." Now, who knows this? This is the first study. As soon as you understand that "I am not this body, I am within this body," immediate you understand what is spirit. Then your spiritual knowledge advances further. But these rascals, they do not know what is spirit, what is spiritual knowledge.

They are rascals, they are speculating. They do not understand how knowledge is gathered. This is our charge. You refute it.

Interview with a German Girl and Assorted Devotees -- March 30, 1975, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: There are many sources of knowledge, but the summary is that knowledge gathered by experience and knowledge gathered by, through authority. So both knowledge is helping me about the change of body. So how can you deny it? And still, if you remain ignorant, then you are foolish. How you can say there is no life after death? I am giving you evidence by experience and by authority. Then mostly, perhaps you have got experience of the... In the, especially in the Western countries... Here, if you ask ordinary cultivator, he'll believe: "Yes, there is life." They they are philosopher. "Yes, in my past life I did something wrong. Therefore I am suffering. And if I do wrong, I'll suffer in my next life." You'll get this knowledge even from the cultivator. This is India.

Girl: India has the knowledge.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Anyone who is born in India, he has got immediately this knowledge. He immediately knows there is God. That is the advantage of taking birth in India. What it will take hundreds of years to understand, they understand it by the birth. You have seen, so many thousands of people came. So the... Apart from this, the whole world, they do not believe that there is soul and after annihilation of this body, we shall get another body, another chapter of life. They do not believe it.

Girl: (German)

Haṁsadūta: Then, she says, why do the philosophers not study in India?

Prabhupāda: Hm? Then again, the same question. Because they are rascals.

Haṁsadūta: (German)

Prabhupāda: Because they are rascals, they are speculating. They do not understand how knowledge is gathered. This is our charge. You refute it.

That is refuted. The other scientists, they have said these rocks can be found here.

Conversation with Devotees -- April 14, 1975, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: You materialistic people say that "We have not seen God, therefore don't believe." Therefore I say, "I have not gone with you, that you have gone to moon, I don't believe." That's all. Finished. How can I believe? You say that you have gone. But I have not gone with you. So how can I believe. That's all. That is my argument. You did not take me with you. How can I believe?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Pictures.

Prabhupāda: Why I shall believe pictures? I have not seen it. This is false picture. As you say that you could not saw God therefore don't believe. Therefore I say that I did not go with you, I don't believe.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But we can arrange to put you on a ship to take you to the moon.

Prabhupāda: When you take then I shall believe.

Devotee: Well, we can show some rocks. We can show some rocks that you won't find anywhere on this planet.

Prabhupāda: No, that is refuted. The other scientists, they have said these rocks can be found here.

There is no standard knowledge. You speak something, and if somebody refutes it with something else, then he is advanced.

Garden Conversation with Dr. Gerson and devotees -- June 22, 1975, Los Angeles:

Dr. Gerson: If you put ten psychologists in a room and ask them for their opinion, you'll get ten opinions on the same subject.

Bahulāśva: Like munis. So many minds, so many ways.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Nāsau munir yasya mataṁ na bhinnam: "If a muni, thoughtful man, hasn't got a different opinion then he is not muni." (laughter) And that is going on. They take it as advancement. There is no standard knowledge. You speak something, and if somebody refutes it with something else, then he is advanced. And then another comes, he becomes more advanced than the second one. And then another comes. So there is no standard knowledge. What is today standard knowledge, tomorrow it is obsolete. Another standard knowledge. So in that way nobody knows what is the standard knowledge.

So long you will work on the mental plane, then the tendency will be that "Let me refute you, and I become prominent." And he will think that "Let me refute him. I become." This business will go on. But there will be no end of philosophy.

Garden Conversation with Dr. Gerson and devotees -- June 22, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Ostrich. When there is danger, it closes eyes: "No danger." But that does not mean no danger. The danger is there. You may close your eyes. This is going on. The whole education system is foolish. Because they are thinking independent.

Bahulāśva: Now we can change that, Śrīla Prabhupāda, with this college. We can get our men in all religious departments.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is our duty, to give them knowledge. The knowledge is there. The candidates are there. Only the guardians should be sane, that "Save the children." Otherwise they will produce only hippies. That's all. (break) So long you will work on the mental plane, then the tendency will be that "Let me refute you, and I become prominent." And he will think that "Let me refute him. I become." This business will go on. But there will be no end of philosophy. So what is the use of such philosophy, simply continually go on mentally speculating, no conclusion? Philosophy means, "Here is the conclusion."

Even amongst the topmost thinkers, if he does not refute other thinkers, he is not a good thinker. That enviousness. He will not be established a good thinker if he cannot... If a scientist, if he cannot refute the previous scientist, he is not a scientist. This is material world.

Conversation with Professor Hopkins -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prof. Hopkins: So you would see the Bhagavad-gītā then as accessible to a wide range of people, at an elementary level or beginning level, whereas Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam would be for more advanced, more advanced people.

Prabhupāda: Not only advanced, completely advanced. Because so long one will be, stay on the material platform, he will be envious of others only, animal propensity, dog. Dog does not like another dog is coming. So unless one is spiritually realized, the dog mentality will remain there. It is said nāsau munir yasya mataṁ na bhinnam, even amongst the topmost thinkers, if he does not refute other thinkers, he is not a good thinker. That enviousness. He will not be established a good thinker if he cannot... If a scientist, if he cannot refute the previous scientist, he is not a scientist. This is material world. Everyone is envious of the other. So Bhāgavata meant for who is no more envious. Simply loving.

This argument, how he can refute, that he has died twenty-two years?

Room Conversation -- October 4, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: There is no similarity. Why the child... There was no mustaches. Why you have mustaches? How you can say "The same body"? You shall have to give your own argument. Child had no mustaches; you have got now mustaches. How you can say the same body? The child had no sex desire; now you have got sex desire.

Brahmānanda: They would say all these things are dormant within the child's body, and now they are coming out.

Prabhupāda: That we also say, but that body not... That "dormant" means dormant in the soul, not in the body. That is the knowledge. Dormant it is, but dormant in the soul, not in the body.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They have to admit that it's a different body because if the body is simply made of food and they are eating so much and evacuating so much, then it has to be a different body.

Prabhupāda: No, it is different body, undoubtedly. If they foolishly argue, that is different thing. Therefore rascal. Their argument has no value. How you can be the same body? So many changes. The body is changed. (to Indian man:) What is that? It was not garam?

Indian man (1): No, garam not.

Prabhupāda: So this argument, how he can refute, that he has died twenty-two years?

If you remain in a dog's position, is that civilization? I proved that you are in a dog's position. How can you refute the argument which I have put, that you are in a dog's position?

Morning Walk -- October 6, 1975, Durban:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They think that this is the most civilized that human beings have ever been, this modern so-called civilization.

Prabhupāda: Civilization... If you remain in a dog's position, is that civilization? I proved that you are in a dog's position. How can you refute the argument which I have put, that you are in a dog's position? Exactly the dog. Śva-viḍ-varaha. Dog's position, hog's position, camel's position, and ass's position. These four animals have been compared. Śva, viḍ-varāha, uṣṭra, khara. And "I have been given vote." Yes, śva-vi-varāhoṣṭra-kharai saṁstuta puruṣa paśuḥ. You are animal, and other animals, they are giving you vote. That's all. You are very much proud that you are minister, you have got vote, but who has given you vote? The same animal class. What is the meaning of your vote? Śva-viḍ... How selected words in the Bhāgavatam. Śva-vi-varāhoṣṭra-kharai saṁstuta puruṣa paśuḥ.

We are already captive under the laws of material nature, and the more we advance in material education, we'll be more and more rigidly captive. So this is the version of Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura. What is your answer? Can anyone refute Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura, that he is wrong?

Morning Walk -- October 18, 1975, Johannesburg:

Prabhupāda: The Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura has sung one nice... (tape recorded section accidentally plays) "eating meat and drinking wine." (Prabhupāda and devotees laugh at interruption. Harikeśa apologizes) That... He says, jada vidy saba māyāra vaibhava. Jada vidyā means material education, the so-called material science. So jada vidyā. Vidyā means education, so this expansion of knowledge means expansion of the influence of māyā. Jada vidyā saba māyāra vaibhava. And the result is tomāra bhajane bādhā. People will forget God. With the advancement of so-called material science or material knowledge, the result will be that people will forget God. And then next, next is anitya saṁsāre moha janamiya. "This material world, which is temporary, where we cannot stay, we are already captivated, but this advancement of material knowledge will make me more captive, and I shall work just like an ass." That's all. Now, whether he is right or wrong, tell me. His charge is that advancement of material education is advancement of the influence of material energy, and if you say that "What is the wrong there?" the wrong is that we are already rascals, and this education will make me more rascal. Anitya saṁsāre moha janamiya. "I am already captivated in this temporary material world, and these things will make me more advanced to be captivated in this material world." Now this is the version of Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura. Now, if you don't like, tell what is the reason. Tell me. Material education... We are already captive under the laws of material nature, and the more we advance in material education, we'll be more and more rigidly captive. So this is the version of Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura. What is your answer? Can anyone refute Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura, that he is wrong?

If you say "That is not soul, something missing," so you can replace it. What is that something? That something also you do not know. Then how can you refute my argument, soul? You do not know anything. I at least know something on the basis of śāstra. But you have neither śāstra nor experiment, nothing else. So who is strong? I am strong or you are strong?

Morning Walk -- October 21, 1975, Johannesburg:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: It seems that you've made it so easy to defeat the scientists.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yet all the universities, schools throughout the world, they're simply following this experimental knowledge of the scientists. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...machine is recording, but as soon as electricity stops—the machine is there—it will not record. You cannot say the machine is the ultimate. Machine is there; it will not record as soon as the electricity is missing. So that electricity, either you say soul or something else, you replace it. Just like electricity means the battery you charge, it will work, again record. Similarly, if you say "That is not soul, something missing," so you can replace it. What is that something? That something also you do not know. Then how can you refute my argument, soul? You do not know anything. I at least know something on the basis of śāstra. But you have neither śāstra nor experiment, nothing else. So who is strong? I am strong or you are strong?

When Brahmānanda was speaking that word yesterday, I refuted your argument?

Morning Walk -- November 17, 1975, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: All the movements that the heavenly stars and other things are going on in a particular way.

Prabhupāda: No, you do not know what are the movements. You therefore say there are several movements, but you do not know what are these movements. That is not scientific. To avoid the explanation, if the scientist says that there are several movements... But you explain what is that movement? According to our śāstra there is no individual movement. The whole system is moving, making center the polestar. That we can see at night. They have... Star and planet, they have no separate movement. They are fixed up. Just like this tree. There are so many leaves. The tree is moving, so the leaves and twigs, they are moving, not that the leaf is moving.

Dr. Patel: This is a question of relativity, sir.

Prabhupāda: Yes. But that we can see, this...

Dr. Patel: Now, the earth moves round the sun and the moon moves round the earth...

Prabhupāda: No, no...

Dr. Patel: And the rate of movement is different on either side. And the axis or ground on which it moves also differs. So when all of them collide or sort of a thing, then eclipse comes. That is the modern understanding.

Prabhupāda: And the... When Brahmānanda was speaking that word yesterday, I refuted your argument?

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Only some of the authorized books, just to take their parts(indistinct) and to refute, otherwise, we haven't got to take lesson from anyone.

Room Conversation -- May 7, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: For us there is no readable books in the whole world.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No.

Prabhupāda: We cannot waste our time.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, of course. But is there any, I mean, of course we would like to...

Prabhupāda: But only some of the authorized books, just to take their parts(indistinct) and to refute, otherwise, we haven't got to take lesson from anyone.

We have already refuted. There is no such thing as Hinduism in the Vedic conception. It is sanātana-dharma or varṇāśrama-dharma.

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: It appears from his question that his idea is that Hinduism is so flexible that whatever condition of life the masses are in, Hinduism will kind of envelop them, and they can still call themselves Hindus. But what you're saying is that actually the standard is there...

Prabhupāda: We have already refuted. There is no such thing as Hinduism in the Vedic conception. It is sanātana-dharma or varṇāśrama-dharma.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Is sanātana-dharma so wide that everyone can be...

Prabhupāda: Sanātana means eternal. So na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). The identification of the living entity is already described, that it does not perish after annihilation of this body. That is sanātana. So that is meant for everyone. Not that the Hindus, after giving up this body, exist, and the Muslim or Christian does not exist. Everyone exists. Everyone is eternal, so sanātana-dharma is meant for everyone.

Anyone who is in bodily concept of life, he's animal. First of all, refute. If you are thinking that "I am this body," "I am Hindu," "I am Muslim," "I am American," "I am this," "I am that," then you are animal. This is our first charge.

Morning Walk -- July 4, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: This man, there's a Professor Mitra, he's in Emory University in Department of Sociology. They claim he's a Vedantist, and they have a group. And this Das, actually his name was Das, he told me that he has Śrīla Prabhupāda's Bhagavad-gītā As It Is and worships it, he recites every day. And he told me that he praises very much, that it's the best Gītā he has seen. So although he's involved in something else, but still he's taking Śrīla Prabhupāda's.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Any man who is reasonable, he'll come. If he's animal, he cannot come. That is the difference. The first charge is that anyone who is in bodily concept of life, he's animal. First of all, refute. If you are thinking that "I am this body," "I am Hindu," "I am Muslim," "I am American," "I am this," "I am that," then you are animal. This is our first charge. What they will answer? What is the difference? If a dog is thinking "I am dog," and I am thinking "I am Indian" or "American," what is the difference? What is the difference between the dog and the man? That first charge should be answered.

You refute.

Room Conversation -- July 7, 1976, Baltimore:

Prabhupāda: If they are getting respect talking all nonsense, and here we shall glorify the Supreme Lord, why not respect?

ataḥ pumbhir dvija-śreṣṭhā

varṇāśrama-vibhāgaśaḥ

svanuṣṭhitasya dharmasya

saṁsiddhir hari-toṣaṇam

(SB 1.2.13)

When they try to satisfy the senses of Kṛṣṇa, His glory, then the Ph.D. is perfect. And if continues to talk nonsense, then it is useless waste of time and labor.

Devotee: Another point about this journal is that we will present controversial things, and people may want to write something to refute what we have said.

Prabhupāda: You refute.

Devotee: We can publish that and also our refutation?

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is nice. We invite, "All right, come on."

If people are interested to talk like gentlemen, how they can refute the proprietorship of God of everything?

Room Conversation -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:

Jñānagamya: They want to be Christians, but not go to church.

Prabhupāda: That means it has no effect. Now talk about something substantial. Yesterday we were talking about the proprietorship of God. So if people are interested to talk like gentlemen, how they can refute the proprietorship of God of everything? Talk on this point.

Jñānagamya: They say God has given us everything for our pleasure, that God is not worried about whether He owns it or not, He simply wants to give to us.

The so-called rascal philosophers, scientists, politicians, they have created all troubles. He's completely dependent on nature, on the laws of nature, and still he says, "I am independent. I have grown up." What you have grown up? You have grown up as a great fool, that's all. You have not grown up to be intelligent. You have grown up a great rascal, that's all. So refute them in this way, then you'll be preacher.

Room Conversation -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: So how we are independent? Did Mr. Freud not die? When prakṛti, nature, kicked on his face, he immediately died. So how he's independent? These rascals have created all troubles. The so-called rascal philosophers, scientists, politicians, they have created all troubles. He's completely dependent on nature, on the laws of nature, and still he says, "I am independent. I have grown up." What you have grown up? You have grown up as a great fool, that's all. You have not grown up to be intelligent. You have grown up a great rascal, that's all. So refute them in this way, then you'll be preacher. So what is your argument about humanity?

If a human being is not interested to know about God, then he's dog. This is our first charge. Now let the agnostic refute.

Evening Darsana -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: ...the existence of God. There must be. How can you deny existence of God? It is not possible. Now, if you are convinced that there is God, then the next question will be What is that God? Is He a living being or a stone? What is the nature of God or the features of God? Whether He has... So many things we have to study about. But first of all we have to accept there is God. God, what kind of thing is that God, that is called brahma-jijñāsā. That is the beginning of philosophy. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. What is God, what is His nature, what is His feature, what does He do—these things can be inquired by human beings. A dog cannot inquire. So if a human being is not interested in these things, he's a dog. Do you agree or not? If a human being is not interested to know about God, then he's dog. This is our first charge. Now let the agnostic refute. Hmm? In human life... There are varieties of living entities, so many. The trees are also living entities, but it is standing, it has no other capacity. The birds are there, they're little improved, they're flying, they can move from one tree to another, but they have no capacity to inquire about God. There are so many insects, they are also living entity, but they do not inquire about God. It is only human being, he can inquire. That particular facility is given.

The Bhagavad-gītā is there and he is refuting Bhagavad-gītā. He is not master.

Room Conversation with Indian Man -- December 22, 1976, Poona:

Indian man: (indistinct) ...somewhere in Chapter Five that if you do bad deeds (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: But you do not know what is bad deeds is your disobedience to Kṛṣṇa is the most dangerous path.

Indian man: He interpreted more what sort of deeds you cannot go back to the...

Prabhupāda: That is nonsense. That means he does not know what is good or bad. He does not know. Therefore he cannot become master. He cannot become master. The Bhagavad-gītā is there and he is refuting Bhagavad-gītā. He is not master.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

"We say that the law given by God is religion. Now you refute this." Nobody can manufacture religion. "God is one, and whatever He has given, law, that is religion. Now you refute it?" Give them this challenge.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Prabhupāda: First of all ascertain what is religion. Then we shall see whether your religion is genuine or my religion is genuine. First of all ascertain. Let there be an assembly, that "What is religion?" "We say that the law given by God is religion. Now you refute this." Nobody can manufacture religion. "God is one, and whatever He has given, law, that is religion. Now you refute it?" Give them this challenge.

Rāmeśvara: "Well we may accept that the Kṛṣṇa movement is a religion, but..."

Prabhupāda: Apart from name-name is not very important. In your country you say water. I say jala, pānīya. Does it mean that because I say pānīya, it will be different thing? In different countries, in different societies, things are... We say am, you say mango. Does it mean the thing, substance, is different?

Rāmeśvara: No.

Prabhupāda: Then why do the rascals say like that? Because we say God, Kṛṣṇa, therefore He's not. Why is... This is nonsense. I can say in my language, you can say in yours, but God is one. That you have to accept.

Our definition of religion is this, that the law given by God is religion. Now you refute it.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Prabhupāda: So this is your nation, that if one gentleman and lady remain as husband-wife for long time, it is a wonderful thing. So first of all decide what do you mean by religion; what is the definition of religion. Our definition of religion is this, that the law given by God is religion. Now you refute it. That is everywhere. Just like any state, you... The law given by government is law. That is universal truth. You cannot manufacture law at your home. What is given by your state, that is law. Similarly, religion means what is given by God, that is religion.

You cannot see your father because the father was before your birth. Only mother can see. How you can refute this argument? Therefore she is the only proof.

Morning Walk -- February 1, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: That is logical positivism, saying that... How, there's a house. Let's say there is a temple there, but since I don't see the temple there, but I don't know that the temple is existing or not, but it is convenient to assume that there is a temple.

Prabhupāda: No, no. When there is a possibility of getting proof, why shall I assume?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Because they say they cannot see.

Prabhupāda: Now, just the same example: You cannot see. You cannot see your father because the father was before your birth. Only mother can see. How you can refute this argument? Therefore she is the only proof.

"How can you deny the existence of God?" "I am not seeing." "And you see or not see; there must be father." I think this commonsense argument nobody can refute.

Room Conversation -- April 19, 1977, Bombay:

qPrabhupāda: You put this question and answer amongst the scientists. "How can you deny the existence of God?" "I am not seeing." "And you see or not see; there must be father." I think this commonsense argument nobody can refute.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No. (laughs) It is little... Common sense, a little intelligence, and everything can be solved. They are obstinate.

Prabhupāda: That means rascal. Obstinate means rascal. Obstinate is not a sane person.

He is under the control of something higher, but he refutes, tries to avoid. That cannot be avoided.

Discussions with Devotees and Conversation with Dr. Ghosh -- June 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: He finishes his childhood; he accepts boyhood. Why he has left childhood? Finish childhood. Finish. That's all. Why again bother?

Harikeśa: Force of time.

Prabhupāda: That means he is under the control of something higher, but he refutes, tries to avoid. That cannot be avoided. A child must become a boy. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13).

That argument also I have refuted. Just like animal, he is bound up. He is rotating around the log, and within that there may be Japan, there may be Calcutta, there may be Los Angeles. You can think this is there. But that is not all.

Discussion about Bhu-mandala -- July 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: "You are imperfect. So whatever you have written, that is nonsense. And everywhere problem. Why should we waste our time?" Now just try to settle from point of. He's showing this book, I am showing the Bhāgavatam. So you are imperfect, that's a fact. What is the value of your book? If you are basically a rascal, then what is the value of your book? Why shall I waste my time? First of all I take it and I prove it that you are a rascal. You show your book, I show my book. But you have been proved that you are a rascal. Because practically you cannot cross Himalaya. You have no idea what is the Himalaya. You are giving some conflict.

Bhakti-prema: This..., we have to reply to this question. They say if we go, we start from Los Angeles and arrive Japan, according to Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam...

Prabhupāda: Japan and Los Angeles and India, that is not the whole thing.

Bhakti-prema: Yeah, that is not the whole thing, but it is basic point.

Prabhupāda: Huh... Insignificant.

Bhakti-prema: According to Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, if we start from London...

Prabhupāda: That argument also I have refuted. Just like animal, he is bound up. He is rotating around the log, and within that there may be Japan, there may be Calcutta, there may be Los Angeles. You can think this is there. But that is not all. Within that rounding circle, whatever is there, you may think this is all. But that is not all. He's limited condition. So within his limitation (Bengali). Within that limitation he's speaking. But Himalaya and other things, far beyond their limitation. That I have already explained. He's speaking within his limitation. Our position should be, correctly represent what is described in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.

He was walking with me on the seaside, and I was chastising him, kicking him, and refuting. (laughs) Now he has organized this Bhaktivedanta Institute.

Room Conversation Gaurasundara, Dr. Kapoor -- July 26, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: This boy was stubborn atheist.

Dr. Kapoor: Svarūpa Dāmodara.

Prabhupāda: And he was walking with me on the seaside, and I was chastising him, kicking him, and refuting. (laughs) Now he has organized this Bhaktivedanta Institute.