Prabhupāda: So our method is to pray to Kṛṣṇa to give us the necessary strength. That's all. Otherwise, by regular practice, this age is very difficult. Unfavorable. First thing is memory is very short. We cannot remember. Life is very short. Life is short, at the same time, so much disturbed by anxiety, by disease, by natural disturbances. Roga-śokādibhiḥ. Short life; that is also disturbed by disease and lamentation. Every moment there is something for which you have to lament. "Oh!" Roga-śokādibhiḥ. And disease. This body is a breeding ground of all kinds of disease. Life is short and it is so much disturbed. So how it is possible to practice? Therefore, this one practice—chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, and hearing—that is very nice. And praying to Kṛṣṇa, "Please give me strength." Hare, "O Energy of Kṛṣṇa, O Kṛṣṇa, I am fallen, I have no strength. Please accept me." That's all. "I have no qualification. I am frail. I am trying, but I am failing." All these appeals should be made. And Kṛṣṇa is all-powerful, He can do anything. Even we, we do not perform, trying our best, if we fail, Kṛṣṇa will help us. Just like a child tries his best, but he falls down. The mother takes up and, "All right. Come on. Walk." Like that.
Lamentation (Conversations)
Expressions researched:
"lament"
|"lamentable"
|"lamentation"
|"lamentations"
|"lamented"
|"lamenters"
|"lamenting"
|"lamentingly"
|"lamentment"
|"laments"
Conversations and Morning Walks
1968 Conversations and Morning Walks
1970 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Śāstra-vākya-pramāṇa. And it should be known through the spiritual master. Just like nowadays Bhagavad-gītā is being interpreted in so many foolish ways because they do not accept explanation from the authority. They become themselves authorities. Therefore misused. That is not explanation. Somebody is explaining that Kurukṣetra means this body, pañca-pāṇḍava means the senses. These are all nonsense. You have to accept Bhagavad-gītā as it is. When you cannot understand, you should get it explained by your spiritual master. Therefore one has to accept a spiritual master to understand. Tad-vijnanārtham. In order to understand that transcendental science one must approach a bona fide spiritual master. That is injunction. So here it is said that kānyakubje dvijaḥ. Dvijaḥ means he was offered the sacred thread. That means he was born in a brāhmaṇa family. Janmanā jāyate śūdraḥ. Everyone is born a śūdra, a foolish. Sudra means a foolish man who simply laments.
1971 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Anyway, na tasya śocananarthi. Don't lament which is gone. (laughter)
Mr. Arnold: Yes, thank you, thank you.
Dhanañjaya: Don't cry over spilt milk.
Prabhupāda: That is Sanskrit, na tasya śocananarthi.
Śyāmasundara: Actually, for a place in the center of London like this, it's nice to have offices and a small chapel and maybe a bookstore, but we would not be able to recruit many people to come on a residential basis, being in the center of the city. But in a place a little bit further out, like in a student neighborhood, everybody comes.
Prabhupāda: What? Student neighborhood?
Śyāmasundara: Yes, they'll come.
Prabhupāda: So, why not negotiate that?
Śyāmasundara: Daily they'll come and then gradually become devotees.
Prabhupāda: No, among the young men there is hankering after this sort of an institution. Everyone asks me, "Why the younger generation is attracted to this movement?" so many reporters. So somehow or other, I reply, "The young men, they're receptive, they can understand the value, whereas the old fools cannot." (laughing)
1972 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: That's all. They don't want to see people very enlightened. "It is folly to be wise where ignorance is bliss." But at least how to become wise, that injunction has been given to you. Now you try to save the country, how to do it. These people will not be. You'll have to educate the people, and they'll vote you to the senators, president, and then your country will be nice. Just like by Kurukṣetra, Kṛṣṇa smashed all Duryodhana and company, and He posted Yudhiṣṭhira Mahārāja. That is the Kṛṣṇa's politics. He wanted to smash all these demons and have His own men posted on the royal throne. When Kali could not penetrate into the daily behavior of the people, he planned killing of Parīkṣit Maharaja. So, one Kali brāhmaṇa cursed him to death, for no fault practically. Therefore the brāhmaṇas of this age, they are condemned. The so-called caste brāhmaṇas, they're condemned. That is lamented by the father of the boy who cursed Parīkṣit Maharaja.
Prabhupāda: The same teaching by Bhagavad-gītā. Arjuna was thinking in terms of personal sense gratification: "I shall not fight. It is not good to kill my kinsmen, my brother." That was personal sense gratification. From ordinary point of view people will say, "How Kṛṣṇa is..., Arjuna is nice, that he's giving up his claim, and nonviolent." But this philosophy Kṛṣṇa immediately kicked out. Kutas tvā kaśmalam idaṁ viṣame samupasthitam. "Oh, why you are talking nonsense like this?" That was His answer. (laughs) Next He says, aśocyān anvaśocas tvam prajñā-vādāṁś ca (BG 2.11), "You are talking just like a very learned man, but this kind of lamentation is not done by any learned. That means you are fool number one." (laughter) So after understanding Bhagavad-gītā he agreed to fight. "Yes. I shall fight." That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Now people will say, "Oh, fighting, killing is Kṛṣṇa consciousness?" Yes, if Kṛṣṇa wants it. To... Therefore our business is not in the estimation of this material world to become a good man.
Śyāmasundara: And she was lamenting that she has eight sons, eight sons, but none of them are devotees, and her brother has so many hundreds of sons, real sons.
Ambassador: Oh.
Mrs. Keating: Who is this?
Ambassador: His sister.
Mrs. Keating: Oh.
Ambassador: The sister of who, of uh, His Divine Grace?
Prabhupāda: My sister, my sister.
Mrs. Keating: Oh, your sister.
Prabhupāda: Material sister.
Ambassador: Oh, yes.
Prabhupāda: She is my Godsister also.
1973 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: That is warned by Śaṅkarācārya. Vivekananda lamented at the end of his life, that "I have simply wasted my life." He admitted, "I have not given anything." Bālakānām. He was after this body, and he was recorded, government record, as political sannyāsī. Yes. He had political purpose, but was acting as a sannyāsī. Just like Gandhi, "Saintly statesman." He is recorded, "Saintly statesman." He's a statesman, politician, but he was introducing some morality, non-violence, like that. Actually, his philosophy failed. He wanted Hindu-Muslim unity, but it was divided. The Muslim and Hindu divided. He wanted non-violence. He died out of violence. Therefore all his philosophy failed. And Indian independence was achieved not by Gandhi's non-violence method but (by) Subhas Bose's violence method. And he wanted to explain nonviolence from Bhagavad-gītā. Just see, another foolishness. Bhagavad-gītā is spoken in the battlefield, and he was screwing some meaning to prove his nonviolence.
Prabhupāda: That is not possible. It is very difficult. One saṁskāra, that initiation saṁskāra, and marriage saṁskāra-two, three saṁskāras, can be done, not the ten. It is not possible. Now the circumstances will not allow. It is very difficult.
Śyāmasundara: One thing that Malcolm and I were talking about before was that, he was lamenting that our educational system nowadays in the west, material education, practically spoils the child to understand spiritual life.
Prabhupāda: Why in the West? Everywhere.
Malcolm: More in the West because the child is more constrained in his molding.
Prabhupāda: Yes. The whole defect is that we are missing the goal of life. Therefore we do not know how to conduct business with the goal of life. At the present moment, in every field, they are missing the goal of life.
Lord Brockway: Oh, I approve of it very, very strongly. Very strongly. It must be... It must be the basis of all, of all good.
Prabhupāda: No, basis... Now, suppose if a people in general, they are not advanced, by their votes, somebody is elected, he may not be also advanced. That is the defect of democracy. Mass of people, they are not advanced. So simply by their vote, if somebody is elected, then they will have to repent. Just like Nixon. He's elected, but these people are again decrying him, that "No, you are not good." So why do you, did you elect him? You elect, and again you reject. That is the defect of democracy. that people are not advanced. They can commit mistake, elect somebody wrong. And then they will lament. This is the defect.
Prabhupāda: ...New Gayā, and this is the New Gokula. You are in touch in politics, therefore I'm talking something of politics, that the politicians of India, they wanted the..., from the British government, India, a strong united nation. But they could not achieve that goal. Pakistan was taken away. They're now lamenting, or there is some, always unsettled anxiety due to Pakistan. So... So far this movement is concerned, we are spreading the Indian culture, Kṛṣṇa consciousness, all over the world. So the politicians are lamenting for division of India, and here is a movement that everyone will glorify India for this culture. Why do they not join? It is practical.
Reporter: Yeah. But the trouble is that politicians are not interested in Indian culture; they're interested in power.
Prabhupāda: Therefore they're mūḍhas.
Prabhupāda: Why to lament? "Oh, everyone is becoming good men. Nobody's coming in the prison." It is to be lamented? That nobody's coming in the prison house, it is very good news. But that will not take place.
Guest (3): Should it affect the normal duties?
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Guest (2): Should it affect the normal duties?
Prabhupāda: Real duty is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is normal duty. All, all other duties are abnormal duties, crazy duties. Just like pāgala, they're all crazy.
Prabhupāda: Kṣat means injury, and triya means one who delivers. Just like Parīkṣit Mahārāja, immediately took his sword, "Oh, why you are injuring one cow in my kingdom?" The kṣatriya's business is to give protection to the citizens from being injured by others. That is called kṣatriya. Brāhmaṇa means whose knowledge is so perfect that he knows what is God. That is brāhmaṇa. And śūdra means one who laments. Śocati ti śūdra. (?) Śocati.
Śrutakīrti: Na śocati na kāṅkṣati.
Prabhupāda: Śocati means in everything he laments. "Hai hai, I have lost so much things, I have not these things, I have not that thing." So at the present moment, all the people, they are so dissatisfied that they are all śūdras. Śūdra is always in want. So who is not, at the present moment, not in want? Everybody's in want. Therefore everybody is a śūdra now. Kalau śūdra-sambhavaḥ. And that is his qualification, always feeling in want, śocati. And his work is to serve others, master. A brāhmaṇa will not work under anybody. A kṣatriya will not work under anybody. Nowadays the industrial development has taken place because people are śūdras.
Prabhupāda: Śocati means in everything he laments. "Hai hai, I have lost so much things, I have not these things, I have not that thing." So at the present moment, all the people, they are so dissatisfied that they are all śūdras. Śūdra is always in want. So who is not, at the present moment, not in want? Everybody's in want. Therefore everybody is a śūdra now. Kalau śūdra-sambhavaḥ. And that is his qualification, always feeling in want, śocati. And his work is to serve others, master. A brāhmaṇa will not work under anybody. A kṣatriya will not work under anybody. Nowadays the industrial development has taken place because people are śūdras. They want some service. So-called technologists and laborers, and everything. Everyone is searching after good job. He cannot live independently, just like a dog. A dog cannot live independently. He must have a master. Then he is happy. Is it not? Otherwise it is street dog. So modern education is that they are creating śūdras, to become dependent on others. And therefore modern economic development is taking place because there are so many people, they are prepared to give them service. Suppose in your bank, if you withdraw from the service, the bank will stop. Industry will stop. So because there is no such division as brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra. Everyone is śūdra. Therefore this economic development, so-called economic development, has become possible. But in spite of all this economic development, because people are śūdras, they cannot be happy. Because śocati, they will lament, strike. Even they are getting thousands of rupees, strike. Even they get five hundred thousands of rupees, still there will be strike. Because they are śūdras.
Pradyumna: I just have the black one.
Prabhupāda: Oh yes. Kāmaṁ vavarṣa parjanyaḥ (SB 1.10.4). During Mahārāja Parīkṣit's time, one black man was attempting to kill a cow. Immediately the king wanted to kill him, immediately: "Oh, who are you?" It is the duty of the vaiśyas. Kṛṣi-go-rakṣya-vāṇijyam vaiśya-karma-svabhāva-jam (BG 18.44). It is the duty of the vaiśyas to protect the cows, to increase agricultural activities and trade. But they are now interested in producing electronic parts. No go-rakṣya, no vāṇijyam, no food production. Cheap profit, and for eating, let there be slaughterhouse and eat meat. And to digest meat, you drink wine. This is being taught. So you create the situation and when you suffer, then why should we lament? We have created this situation, godless civilization, do not follow the direction of the śāstras.
Prabhupāda: Ah, you were present. Therefore you are a rascal. You were not allowed to (be) present. Therefore God is great. You are a rascal. God did not allow you to be present there. Now you are lamenting. Therefore God is great.
Hṛdayānanda: Jaya. Because God doesn't lament. He laments.
Prabhupāda: Yes. God did not allow you. Therefore you are under control of God. So you are foolish rascal. God did not allow you. Therefore God is great.
Karandhara: Well they have a philosophy called existentialism, that so long something exists, we can place value on it, but when it ceases to exist, there is no remorse. There is nothing to lament.
Prabhupāda: There is no nothing to lament, but why don't you exist? Why you struggle for existence?
Karandhara: But they say if you have money in your hand, as long as you have it you can utilize it, but if you lose it, don't worry. It's nothing to lament.
Prabhupāda: But they worry. I have practically seen. They cry.
Karandhara: Well, they just fall short of their philosophy, the philosophy they hold as ideal.
Prabhupāda: So, these are all no argument. No sane man will accept this argu...
Karandhara: Most western people are so frustrated, they accept these philosophies wholeheartedly.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is frustration. That is not real life. That is another thing.
Karandhara: Yes. Or it's like a criminal. If he commits a crime, it's nice that he laments, but he can't just lament. He has to start working positively.
Prabhupāda: Yes, he must go to the state and offer, "Please kill me." Then state may consider. "I have committed this murder, so the law is: I must give my life. So I am prepared." Then immediately he will be excused. Yes. (break)
Karandhara: ...a devotee came and told Prabhupāda that he committed some wrong doing, and he was very, very sorry, and he was crying and very sorry, and you said, "That's all right. That's nice. Now do something about it. Engage yourself in Kṛṣṇa's service."
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, yes. That is the duty of the physician. If somebody comes, patient: "Sir, I am suffering like this." "All right, don't be sorry. Sit down. I will give you medicine."
Prabhupāda: So as these rascals are simply trying to extinguish the blazing fire of material existence by so-called bucketful of water, it will not save. It will be waste of time. If the cloud comes, then it will be saved. So guru is the cloud. That is... Saṁsāra-dāvānala-līḍha-loka-trāṇāya kāruṇya-ghanā... **. Ghanāghanatvam means cloud, dense cloud. As soon as there is dense cloud and pours water, finished, all blazing fire finished. That is guru. And Narottama dāsa Ṭhākura says, soṁsāra-biṣānale dibāniśi hiyā jvale: "My heart is burning by the fire of this material existence." Juḍāite nā kainu upāya: "I did not make any arrangement for getting out of this fire." Golokero prema-dhana, hari-nāma-saṅkīrtana: "Now this hari-nāma-saṅkīrtana is coming from Goloka, from the spiritual world. I did not takes care of it." He is lamenting. So this is the fire extinguish instrument. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa in this age, and the fire will be extinguished.
Prabhupāda: Directly, yes. You cannot even tolerate the atomic energy, and He has got reserved so many other energies. Parāsya śaktir vividhaiva śrūyate (Cc. Madhya 13.65, purport). Millions of energies Kṛṣṇa has got. This is one of the energies. You cannot tolerate it. Reservoir of all energies.
Prajāpati: Today everybody is lamenting the energy crisis, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Prabhupāda: There is no crisis. They have created the crisis, the rascals.
Karandhara: Prabhupāda, we will have to cross over to here to get back.
Prabhupāda: All right.
1974 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: ...seen that one who is married, he's lamenting, and who is not married, he's also lamenting. Is it not? Ah? One who is married, he's thinking, "Why did I marry? I would have remained free." He's lamenting. And who is not married, "Oh, I did not accept wife. I would have been happy." (laughs) (Hindi) There's a Hindi... It just like (Hindi). One who has eaten, he's also lamenting, and who has not eaten, he's also lamenting. (break) Tṛpyanti neha... That is said in Sanskrit. Tṛpyanti neha kṛpaṇā bahu-duḥkha-bhājaḥ (SB 7.9.45). Kṛpaṇā, by one's sex life he gets some children and he's... As soon as there is child, there is suffering. The child is suffering and the parents also suffering to take care. So, again he begets another child.
Prabhupāda: Manorathena asati dhāvato bahiḥ. By mental speculation, you will remain on this asati, in this temporary field. Asat means "which will not exist." Anything in this material world, you take, that will not exist. Anywhere man can say. The skyscraper building is constructed, but everyone knows that it will not exist. Some day it will fall down. Everyone knows. It will never exist. That is explained by Kṛṣṇa in the Bhagavad-gītā, that "If you think that by combination of matter, life has come, so life was not there before the combination. And this combination will dismantle. So life, there will be no more life. So why these three period you are lamenting? There is life." Because according to this theory—"The combination of matter makes life"—so before combination there was no life, and the combination dismantled, there is no life. So beginning and end no life. Why you are lamenting in the middle? Very good reasoning. Just see. Therefore Prahlāda Mahārāja says, māyā-sukhāya bharam udvahato vimūḍhān (SB 7.9.43). Māyā-sukhāya, that illusory, illusory happiness. Māyā-sukhāya. And for that reason, they are making huge, gorgeous arrangement and working day and night, which will be zero. It has begun from zero and it will end into zero. In the middle they are busy. Just see. Therefore vimūḍhān.
Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) ...prasannātmā. Brahma-bhūta. That is called brahma-bhūta stage. Na śocati na kāṅkṣati. This happiness and distress is the cause of śocati and kāṅkṣati. Kāṅkṣati means desiring to have something. This is distress. And lamenting for something, that is also distress. Actually, this is the material position. When we haven't got the things, we desire it. That is also distress. And when it is lost, that is also distress. But by illusion, they take it. When they get it, they think that it is happiness. This is māyā. Actually, to get the things, he has to undergo so much hard... A man is given credit... Suppose he was a poor man. He has now become multi-millionaire. He is given credit.
Prabhupāda: We take this body—dead always. This body is actually dead. Just like this microphone is made of iron. It is iron. When it is working, responding, at that time also it is iron. And when it is out of order, does not work, it is also iron. Similarly, this body is working on account of the living force within. When the living force is out, it is called dead. But actually it is dead always. The living force is the important thing. That is making him alive. Actually alive or dead, it is dead matter. But the living force is the active principle. That is distinguishing this body as dead or alive. But factually it is dead always. That is the beginning of instruction, Bhagavad-gītā: "Arjuna, you are lamenting for this body, but the body is dead." Aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ prajñā-vādāṁś ca bhāṣase (BG 2.11). So unless we know that... (aside:) Don't make "cut-cut." The dead body is not the subject matter of study either it is in working order or it is in dead order. The subject matter of study is the active principle which makes the dead body moving.
Satsvarūpa:
- śrī bhagavān uvāca
- aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ
- prajñā-vādāṁś ca bhāṣase
- gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca
- nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ
- (BG 2.11)
"Translation: The Blessed Lord said, While speaking learned words you are mourning for what is not worthy of grief. Those who are wise lament neither for the living nor the dead."
Prabhupāda: What is your opinion about this?
Professor Durckheim: May I ask a question? How do you teach your disciples to become aware of this force which is no matter that makes matter alive?
Prabhupāda: That active principle, life, or living soul.
Prabhupāda: No, as I say, the active principle, I am also the active principle. As I say, the dead body and the living body, difference is, when the active principle is not there, it is dead body. Similarly, I am also the active principle. So 'ham, so 'ham: "I am the same active principle." Ahaṁ brahmāsmi: "I am Brahman. I am not this material body." That is self-realization. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati: (BG 18.54) "When one is self-realized, then he is jolly." Prasannātmā. He is never morose. He is jolly. Na śocati na kāṅkṣati: "He has no lamentation, no hankering." Samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu: "He is equal to everyone, man, animal and everything." And mad-bhaktiṁ labhate parām: (BG 18.54) "Then devotional life begins." So without self-realization, there is no question of devotional life. Or those who are engaged in devotional service, they are all... Just like these boys, my students, they are trained up how to be always in devotional service. So one who is engaged in devotional service, he is supposed to be already self-realized. Because he has understood "what I am," yes. And then he sticks to devotional service. Otherwise, he cannot. If one thinks, "I am this body," then he cannot be engaged in devotional service, or he cannot stick. He knows that "I am part and parcel of God. So my duty is to serve God." This is self-realization. And then he engages himself in devotional service.
1975 Conversations and Morning Walks
Professor (Hṛdayānanda): He's saying that for example he could listen to everything that you were saying, and then he could repeat it, and someone might say to him that "Oh, you are an expert. You are a master," but actually he's not. He's simply repeating.
Prabhupāda: No, this is example. By receiving a knowledge, you must corroborate by your knowledge or by your experience, by the method. Just like in the Bhagavad-gītā, it is said that Arjuna was declining to fight in the war. So Kṛṣṇa said that "You are simply lamenting on this body, but you do not know what is the active principle of the body." So this you can understand very nicely, that everyone is working for this body, but nobody knows what the active principle of the body. Without the active principle of the body, this body, alive or dead, is the same thing, lump of matter. So Arjuna accepted Kṛṣṇa as teacher; therefore He is chastising him that "You are talking like a learned man, but you are lamenting on this body, but no learned man laments on this body, either dead or alive."
Prabhupāda: They have got form worship, Sufis?
Yoga student: They don't worship form as such, but they speak of it in the poetry. They say... In one poem of Hafez(?) there's a meeting between Hafez and his spiritual master. And he asks the spiritual master (recites verse in Parsi). He asked, "I asked him, 'What was this current, this chain of idols that we must worship?' And he replied so that my heart might moan, lament about the dark night..."
Prabhupāda: "Dog night"?
Yoga student: "...the dark night of ignorance of..."
Prabhupāda: Oh, "dark night."
Prabhupāda: They have got form, worship, the Sufis?
Guest: They don't worship form as such, but they ah, they speak of it in the poetry. They say ah...in one point (indistinct) There is a meeting between (indistinct) and his spiritual master. And he asked the spiritual master (unknown language). I asked, He asked what was this current, this chain of idols that we must worship? And he replied, "So that my heart might, might mourn, lament, the dark night."
Prabhupāda: The dark night?
Guest: The dark night of ignorance...
Prabhupāda: Oh, darkness.
Guest: ...of separation from God. So that they use the form of expression, worship...
Prabhupāda: Separation, how it is possible? Separation is expressed when there is separation between man to man, man to woman. First, otherwise what is the meaning of separation?
Guest: Separation from his divine...
Prabhupāda: Yes, then it must be person. They do not believe in the Personality of Godhead?
Guest: They believe, the Sufis, see the personality of Ali.
Prabhupāda: Hm? To obey your spiritual master. Whatever he has said, you follow strictly. Follow the regulative principles. Chant sixteen rounds. That's all.
Devotee (1): Prabhupāda, when Śrīla Vyāsadeva was lamenting after compiling so many Vedic literatures before compiling Śrīmad Bhāgavatam, he said to his spiritual master, Nārada Muni, that "You please enter within me and find out my deficiency. You are as good as the all-pervading Supersoul."
Prabhupāda: That is always the position of spiritual master, to find out the deficiency in the character of his disciple.
Prabhupāda: That is the success of psychiatric treatment. One comes to know, "What I am." Ahaṁ brahmāsmi: "I am spirit soul; I am not this body." That is called brahma-bhūtaḥ stage. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā (BG 18.54). He becomes immediately happy. And happiness means na śocati na kāṅkṣati: "He does not lament, neither he desires." Our present disease is we hanker after things which we do not possess, and when that thing is lost, we lament. So hankering and lamenting. So when one is cleansed in the heart, he has no more hankering or desire. This is the symptom. And samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu: "Then he becomes equal to everyone." Everyone means every living being, man and animal, trees, plants, lower or higher. Paṇḍitāḥ sama-darśinaḥ (BG 5.18). Then he enters into the sphere of devotional service. This is the symptom. Then he is perfectly in his original position. Then he is happy. Just like a diseased man. So long the disease is there, he is unhappy. And as soon as the disease is cured, he will be happy. So this material disease, as soon as it is cured, one becomes happy, because he is, by constitution, spiritual being. People have no knowledge even, his..., even about his spiritual identity. Therefore they are unhappy. So if you forget what you have written, then?
Prabhupāda: Relevance mean you are spirit soul. You are not this body. This thing first you have to understand. Ahaṁ brahmāsmi. That is India's philosophy, that "I am spirit soul." And if you realize brahmāsmi, brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na... (BG 18.54). As soon as you realize that you are not this material body, you are spirit soul, then immediately you become jolly, prasannātmā. Prasannātmā means na śocati na kāṅkṣati. He has no more any hankering for things which he does not possess, no more any lamenting which he has lost. Take, for example, that we have lost our portion of country as Pakistan and fighting since... This was a plan by the British government that divide them in such a way. They will perpetually fight. They will never be happy. This was their plan. That has been successful. But we are lamenting. Both... Pakistan is lamenting or not, I do not know, but Hindustan is lamenting. Gandhi was against this partition. But Jawaharlal Nehru, just to become prime minister, immediately divided.
So these things are going on. So lamenting, we have lost our... But if you take this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement very seriously, you can make the whole world Hindustan.
Dharmādhyakṣa: In other words, Śrīla Prabhupāda, without practice of the method, it's very difficult to understand the philosophical concepts.
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, yes. Therefore it is said that without becoming a brāhmaṇa, nobody should touch Vedas. That is a... Without becoming brāhmaṇa...
- janmana jāyate śūdraḥ
- saṅskarād bhaved dvijaḥ
- veda-pathad bhaved vipro
- brahmā jānātīti brāhmaṇaḥ
These are the different stages. Everyone is born śūdra. Śūdra means the life of lamentation. He does something and laments. This is śūdra. He does not know how to perform, but by whims he does something and laments later on. This is śūdra. And brāhmaṇa means na śocati na kāṅkṣati. He never laments, neither hankers. That is brāhmaṇa. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati, samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu (BG 18.54). Find out this verse, brahma-bhutaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati.
Jayatīrtha:
- brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā
- na śocati na kāṅkṣati
- samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu
- mad-bhaktiṁ labhate param
- (BG 18.54)
"One who is thus transcendentally situated at once realizes the Supreme Brahman. He never laments nor desires to have anything; he is equally disposed to every living entity. In that state he attains pure devotional service unto Me."
Prabhupāda: That means one has to come to the platform of brāhmaṇa. Then he can enter into devotional service. Samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu mad-bhaktiṁ labhate param (BG 18.54). In that brāhminical state he sees every living entity as part and parcel of God. That is samaḥ, equality. He does not see like this, that the human being has soul and the cow has not soul. He does not see like that. He sees the cow has soul, the ant has soul, the elephant has soul, the tree has soul, the human being has soul. That is samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu. By ignorance he thinks that "The tree has no soul; the cow has no soul; the animal has no soul; simply we have got soul." That is ignorance, base quality. But when you come to the pureness of goodness, samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu, this qualification will arise. So a devotee is not willing to kill even an ant because he knows that "He is also soul, part and parcel.
John Mize: But he misused that intelligence in his freedom, his independence.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. Mind is there also. That is spiritual mind. Everything is spiritual. There is nothing material. Body spiritual, mind spiritual, intelligence spiritual, he is spiritual, the land spiritual, water spiritual—everything is spiritual. That is spiritual world. Here in the material world, except the spirit soul, everything is material. And he is encumbered with this material atmosphere by twenty-seven stratas, layers. The five elements, gross elements, then ten senses, and then three guṇas... In this way there are twenty-seven layers. He is within, and he has to be taken out. That is called liberation. Just like if you are covered with twenty-seven layers of dirty things, so it is very difficult position. But there is process to clear the garbage and take him out. That is Kṛṣṇa conscious movement, to take the soul out of the covering of twenty-seven layers of material atmosphere. That śloka is naṣṭa-prāyeṣu abhadreṣu: "almost cleansed." Abhadra, abhadra means dirty things. So this clearing process going on. When it is almost cleansed the man feels, "Oh..." And that process: nityaṁ bhāgavata-sevayā (SB 1.2.18), constantly being engaged in the service of Bhāgavata, grantha-Bhāgavata and the person Bhāgavata. Then it will be cleansed. And then, when he comes out, that is brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā (BG 18.54), "Oh, I am now free." Na śocati na..., no more lamentation, no more greediness. Everything finished. Then he begins his real business as part and parcel of God. That is perfection.
Prabhupāda: That's it. He does not lament. "No, this body is no more useful." Just like this dress is no more useful. Throw it away. Accept another dress. But dress is old, now it is useless, that does not (mean) you are useless. You accept another dress. That's all.
Bahulāśva: Prabhupāda said that those who are on the mental platform will argue that the animal has no soul. They will be hankering and lamenting...
Prabhupāda: These are the signs of material platform.
Jayatīrtha: On the spiritual platform you're able to see all living beings equally, but on the mental platform...
Prabhupāda: Yes. Paṇḍitāḥ sama-darśinaḥ (BG 5.18).
Prabhupāda: You are waiting for getting that life. Wait a few years more. You will get that life. Yes.
Brahmatīrtha: One scientist recently did a study on mosquitoes. They found out that all mosquitoes do is have sex and eat. And he was lamenting, he said, "Oh, these mosquitoes..."
Prabhupāda: Sex and eat.
Brahmatīrtha: That's all they do. He was amazed that they have so much sex life, mosquitoes. So then the scientist he was lamenting. He was thinking, "Oh, these mosquitoes, they probably do not enjoy the sex life." And he sounded as if he wished he was a mosquito to find out.
Prabhupāda: Yes, mosquito, flies, I have seen. Even the sparrows. Sex life is the center of happiness in this material world. In all forms of life. That is the only.
Prabhupāda: In Chapter Two it is said... Arjuna was lamenting that "I shall fight and the other party they are my brother, so I will be sinful. So many problems will come." He was thinking like that. So Kṛṣṇa first gave him lesson that "Why you are thinking on the bodily concept of life? You are not body. You are spirit soul." Then He gave spiritual education.
Dharmādhyakṣa: He recently retired, and he was lamenting how young people are shunning science now. Young people are not so interested in science. He was also very disappointed that the new scientists were not as well trained as the old scientists and did not have the same desire to serve science.
Prabhupāda: What they will do by serving science? The birth, death is already there. So they are becoming saner, that "What is the use of wasting time in this way? We cannot solve any problem." That is sense. They cannot solve any... He is still alive or died?
Dharmādhyakṣa: He's alive.
Prabhupāda: So ask him that "Find out some bomb that you will not die. Why don't you do that?" (laughter)
Dharmādhyakṣa: This inventor of the hydrogen bomb, he said he had no regrets about making the bomb. He had no regrets about his career whatsoever. And he felt that science was still the answer to man's problems. That's why he was lamenting so much that people were not interested anymore.
Prabhupāda: So what is the problem? Real problem is birth, death. So have you any proposal?
Dharmādhyakṣa: No, he has no proposal for those.
Prabhupāda: Then what is this nonsense problem? So far eating, sleeping, even the birds and beasts, they have no problem. They are eating, sleeping. What is this problem in eating, sleeping and mating? There is no problem. Why you are creating problem? You are creating problem, rascal. There is no problem. Where is the... Out of 8,400,000 species, only men are 400,000.
1976 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Hah, yes. Everyone is trying to get more, and nature's order is that you take only to maintain your body and soul together. That's all. If you take more, then you are thief, you'll be punished by the laws of nature. This is going on. Laws of nature are so fine that by material activities you'll never be satisfied, and at the time of death, he'll lament that "I could not satisfy my desires. Let me take..." "All right, take another body. Satisfy." This is nature's punishment. Karmaṇā daiva netreṇa jantur dehopapattaye (SB 3.31.1). Simple things. We desire, and nature will give you another body. māyā-yantrārūḍhāni. He'll give you, "Ride on this car, you wanted, on this body." And this... This is creation of māyā. Īśvaraḥ sarva-bhūtānāṁ hṛd-deśe... (BG 18.61). Kṛṣṇa is there, orders māyā, "He wants to enjoy life. Give him this body." "Come on, here is a hog's body, eat nicely, stool. Come on." He did not like to eat prasādam. He wanted something rubbish. "All right, come here. Take this stool." These things are going automatically. The same way, as you infect some disease, immediately the disease is there. You haven't got to manufacture diseases. Because you have infected yourself with the disease germ, "Take this disease." Therefore it is warned, anyābhilāṣitā-śūnyam (Brs. 1.1.11), "Don't desire anything except Kṛṣṇa's service." Then you are immune. Otherwise you have to take birth. The Māyāvādī philosophers, they take the Absolute Truth void, so they have no good desires, again they come to material desires.
Prabhupāda: Yes, he is gentleman. He is Kṛṣṇa conscious. This can be used very nice dako(?) If you stack it nicely, you can use as dako(?). It is very good...
Jayādvaita: (break) Cintāmaṇi gate.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, the Vaiṣṇavas in general in Vṛndāvana, are they lamenting for the physical upkeep?
Prabhupāda: Hm?
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Are the Vaiṣṇavas in general lamenting for the physical upkeep of Vṛndāvana, or are they indifferent?
Prabhupāda: No, it is the business of the government. Vaiṣṇava can chant Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra anywhere. He doesn't require any nice park. Ahaituky apratihatā. For becoming Kṛṣṇa conscious, for a serious person, there is no obstacle. Any condition he can do it. (break) ...why there is sannyāsī? In the Vedic civilization, ultimately sannyāsa. Why? That one must give up the intimate relationship with wife. This is the ultimate position. Brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, sannyāsa.
Prabhupāda: The example is already given: The child is transmigrating to the boy's body. Already given. Similarly.... Go on.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: "And since it is sure to have another body in the next birth, either material or spiritual, there is no cause for lamentation by Arjuna on account of death, neither for Bhīṣma nor for Droṇa, for whom he was so much concerned. Rather he should rejoice for their changing bodies from old to new ones, thereby rejuvenating their energy. Such changes of body account..."
Prabhupāda: Now, suppose I am old man. If by some medical process, if I am given a young man's body to be more enthusiastic for working, is it not benefit for me? Similarly, in old age, when the body is changed, he gets another new body. That is a profit. There is no loss. The old body, it cannot work nicely. It cannot move nicely. Just old car.... If your old car is changed into new car, will you not accept it? So it is just like machine, car.
Prabhupāda: Yes. He's not devotee. Devotee means the first sign will be happy, brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā (BG 18.54). If he's not prasannātmā, he's a rascal. He has not entered even devotional life. He's outside. That is the test. Just like Dhruva Mahārāja. When he saw Viṣṇu, he said, "Everything is all right. I don't want anything." Svāmin kṛtārtho 'smi. That is Vaiṣṇava. And if he is still in want or unhappiness, that means he has no spiritual life at all. He is simply making a show.
Guru-kṛpā: Our unhappiness is our lamentation for our past sinful activity, and because we're not committing any more...
Prabhupāda: That is another. That is another. That is to remember the terrible condition of karmīs. (break—in car) ...devotee who thinks unhappy because he is thinking, "I am not getting tea. I am not getting cigarette. There is restriction of illicit life, no meat-eating..." In this way he is unhappy.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: He cannot gratify his desire.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Real devotee will think, "Oh, so many botheration I have now given up." Anarthopaśamaṁ sākṣād bhakti-yogam adhokṣaje (SB 1.7.6). Bhakti-yoga means upaśamam: "No more this, all this nonsense." That is bhakti-yoga, anartha-upaśamam, completely given up. Bhakti-yogam adhokṣaje, lokasya ajānato vidvāṁś cakre sātvata-saṁhitām. But they do not know anything. They are increasing anartha. They are to give up cigarette. No, they are manufacturing new brand of cigarette and advertising, "Please come. This cigarette is better than the other." This is going on. This is karmī life. Punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). He has no sense that "I have smoke this cigarette and why, after another cigarette, the same thing?" But no. "I have enjoyed sex here. Why another sex?" He has no sense.
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Kārpaṇya-doṣopahata. Kārpaṇya-doṣa (BG 2.7). "It was my duty to understand myself, and I am thinking of my these nonsense relatives—my grandfather, my son. What is this? I know that. What I can do by thinking about them? It may be they have come to war. But suppose they would have died naturally—what could I do? So why I am perplexed with these things? I know the defect. I cannot cause their death or birth or existence. It is beyond my jurisdiction. And still, I am anxious: If I kill them, then what would happen? What would happen?" You kill or not kill, they'll be killed, today or tomorrow. Gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ (BG 2.11). A learned man knows that the body will be finished, the bodily action, today or tomorrow. So what is to lament after this body? Lamentation is that the person within the body, whether he's going to hell or heaven. Ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti or tamo gacchanti. That is real concern. Body will be finished, today or tomorrow or after a hundred years. Who can protect it? But one should be interested with the owner of the body, where he is going, what is his next position. And that is clearly stated: adho gacchanti tāmasāḥ, ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti sattva-sthāḥ (BG 14.18). So you are interested to go up or down or remain in the same status. There are three status: up, down, and the same.
Prabhupāda: The gopīs got the information that Kṛṣṇa is coming from Dvārakā, so from Vṛndāvana they went to see Him. And when Kṛṣṇa and Rādhārāṇī met, that Rādhārāṇī lamented that Kṛṣṇa—He was the same Kṛṣṇa and the same Rādhārāṇī—so "this is not a good meeting place. So, if You come to Vṛndāvana, then I shall be happy." So it is inviting Kṛṣṇa to Vṛndāvana. That is the feeling of Caitanya Mahāprabhu, Ratha-yātrā. He is inviting Kṛṣṇa to Vṛndāvana. So in Jagannātha Purī still the same feelings are there. Kṛṣṇa, Jagannātha, from the temple goes to Guṇḍicā. So, Lakṣmī is angry that "Kṛṣṇa is leaving me, He has gone to Vṛndāvana." So she was, she is punishing. That is called Herā-pañcamī. Punishing the servants of Kṛṣṇa. The maidservants of Lakṣmī chastising them, threatened them, "Why without permission?" So they, out of very fearful condition, offering their respect to Lakṣmī, "Mother, you don't be sorry (indistinct), we are (indistinct)." So this, this is the play performed, and Caitanya Mahāprabhu associates they saw, and they enjoyed very much when the maidservant of Lakṣmī was slapping the servant of Viṣṇu. That is mentioned Caitanya-caritāmṛta. All the servants arrested, brought before Lakṣmī, and they are punished. But they came to invite Kṛṣṇa, Rādhārāṇī and other gopīs. And actually they do not go at that time. But this Ratha-yātrā ceremony means Kṛṣṇa is coming from Dvārakā to Kurukṣetra. This is the history of Ratha-yātrā.
Rādhāvallabha: In Russia now they have declared one..., that it is a big crisis. Because their grains did not grow properly, they are not able to produce as much meat, so now one day a week everyone is forced to eat fish. So they are lamenting. They were describing how..., about the good old days were when you could go and buy an entire carcass.
Candanācārya: (break) ...country, build cities and then spend billions of dollars to make the city look like the country.
Prabhupāda: Carvita-carvaṇānām. Chewing the chewed, again and again. This is their position. (japa) (break)
Rāmeśvara: On the calendar it says it is Bhīma-ekādaśī.
Prabhupāda: Bhīma-ekādaśī, yes.
Rāmeśvara: So I've been told that if one fasts on Bhīma-ekādaśī, that it is like fasting on all the ekādaśīs. Is that true?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Ekādaśī is meant for fasting, either Bhīma or Arjuna. But we cannot fast, therefore we have to take little fruits and.... Otherwise, ekādaśī means fasting.
Hṛdayānanda: Many times the devotees lament that we could not have been there to help you, because there was so much service.
Prabhupāda: Yes, you are helping me. (pause) Who can create such fragrance except Kṛṣṇa? (devotees laugh) Fragrance is coming from here, from the dirt, muddy dirt, and fragrance is coming. Unless there is fragrance, how it came here? The color is coming, the beauty is coming, the fragrance is coming, the arrangement is coming along the stem. Where is that scientist? They are seeing every day, and "There is no God." Just see, how foolish they are. You do it.
Hṛdayānanda:
- śokāgninā sakala-yoniṣu dahyamānaḥ
- duḥkhauṣadhaṁ tad api duḥkham atad-dhiyāhaṁ
- bhūman bhramāmi vada me tava dāsya-yogam
"O great one, O Supreme Lord, because of combination with pleasing and displeasing circumstances and because of separation from them, one is placed in a most regrettable position, within heavenly or hellish planets, as if burning in a fire of lamentation. Although there are many remedies by which to get out of miserable life, any such remedies in the material world are more miserable than the miseries themselves."
Prabhupāda: Just see (laughs). You want to mitigate some misery, and the process is still more miserable. Is it not?
Hṛdayānanda: Yes.
Prabhupāda: They are trying to solve one problem, but creating another hundreds of problems.
Prabhupāda: That cannot be. Maybe in the beginning due to past habits, but that must be nil very soon. Otherwise he's not following. Just like fan switched off may move for a little, but not that it will go on moving. Must stop. Switch is off. And if it is going on, then the switch is not yet off. (break)
Devotee (2): A devotee is sometimes subject to hankering or lamentation. That is material though, isn't it?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Devotee (2): In other words, if, at that moment, if he desires something other than Kṛṣṇa, that's a material desire.
Prabhupāda: Then he has to learn it. So long one is not competent in that position, he's subjected, he may fall down. What is that temple light?
Devotee (2): That's a fountain.
Prabhupāda: It is just like Jagannātha temple.
Prabhupāda: You realize or not realize, if you remain on the platform, that is same. (break) ...in Kṛṣṇa's service, that is brahma-bhūtaḥ stage. (break)
Makhanlāl: ...says that such a person never laments nor desires anything. So...
Prabhupāda: Yes. If you realize that you are servant of Kṛṣṇa, where is lamentation?
Makhanlāl: Due to māyā's influence, a devotee may sometimes materially lament.
Prabhupāda: That you have to struggle. Tapasā brahmacāryeṇa (SB 6.1.13). That is called tapasya. But if you stick to devotional service, māyā will not be able to touch you.
Prabhupāda: Everywhere, some tension. The Catholic, the Protestant; the black, the white; the Hindu, the Muslim. That must go on because if we accept on the platform of dress, of body, then there must be ignorance. Read that verse and explain to her.
Jayādvaita: "One who is thus transcendentally situated at once realizes the Supreme Brahman and becomes fully joyful. He never laments nor desires to have anything; he is equally disposed to every living entity. In that state he attains pure devotional service unto Me."
Prabhupāda: Equally disposed. As soon as he knows that I am not this body, I am spirit soul, then there is no distinction. Just like two American goes to India. So when they understand that "We are Americans," immediately their interest becomes one, although they are in the foreign country. That is psychology. Similarly, as soon as we come to the spiritual platform, there is no such distinction as black, white, Hindu, Muslim, Christian. Everything finished. Samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu. You are reading the purport?
Prabhupāda: "You have fully delineated the subject of impersonal Brahman, as well as the knowledge derived therefrom. In spite of all this, why should you be despondent, thinking that you are undone, my dear prabhu?" Purport: "The Vedānta-sūtra or Brahma-sūtra compiled by Śrī Vyāsadeva is the full deliberation of the impersonal absolute feature, and it is accepted as the most exalted philosophical exposition in the world. It covers the subject of eternity, and the methods are scholarly. So there cannot be any doubt about the transcendental scholarship of Vyāsadeva. So why should he lament?"
Prabhupāda: The question is "Whether they should be revived?" They should be revived to the lowest necessity, but all of them cannot be revived in this age. But people should be induced to take to chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa maha-mantra. Then all reformation will automatically become manifest and he will come to spiritual platform, brahma-bhūtaḥ, the realization of Brahman. Then prasannātmā, he'll be happy. There is no lamentation, there is no undesirable hankering. Na śocati na kāṅkṣati. He sees everyone on the spiritual platform. Samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu. In this way he comes to the platform of devotional service, and then his life becomes successful. Is that question answered or not?
Prabhupāda: Yes, but still, I am saying, "This will be all failure." And still, they are hopeful. My Guru Maharaja is very pleased. As soon as a book comes out, he is pleased.
Jayatīrtha: Especially one so beautiful.
Prabhupāda: He was lamenting that "These men, they did not make, publish any number of books. They are simply after this stone and bricks." He condemned. He was very, very sorry. So I thought that I must take a risk. And he's pleased.
Bhagavān: So now you have books and temples.
Prabhupāda: Yes, temple is automatically.
Prabhupāda: So what is the use of going there and spending so much money and come back with little sand, and satisfied, "Now we have studied"? Because they have no shelter. So the jñānīs, they have no shelter. Yes. They may go very high in the sky, but because they have no shelter they come back again. Punar muṣaka bhava, again become a mouse. So that is not jñānī, that is ajñānī. Jñānī is described here, mad-bhaktiṁ labhate parām (BG 18.54). Brahma-bhūta (SB 4.30.20) is jñānī, ahaṁ brahmāsmi. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā, "I have nothing to do with material world." Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati (BG 18.54), there is no lamentation, there is no hankering. When he has attained that stage, brahma-bhūta stage, reality, then he is entrance in the bhakti. Otherwise a neophyte.
Prabhupāda: Yes. He was posing himself as the body. So he should not consider himself as a learned man. Nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ. Then?
Harikeśa: "As he did not happen to be a very learned man, he was consequently lamenting for something which was unworthy of lamentation. This body is born and is destined to be vanquished today or tomorrow; therefore the body is not as important as the soul. One who knows this is actually learned, and for him there is no cause for lamentation, regardless of the condition of the material body."
Prabhupāda: The people are not aware of these things, neither they are interested to know that the soul is more important than the body. This is the beginning of the Bhagavad-gītā. Still, they are placing themselves as learned scholars in Bhagavad-gītā. But sticking to the body.
Prabhupāda: Nobody is interested to retire from family life. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇum (SB 7.5.31). The difficulty is they do not know their own self-interest. Svārtha-gatim. Everyone says "My self-interest first." But he does not know what is his self-interest. Na te viduḥ. Actually that is the..., because he does not know self. (Hindi) Beginning of education in Bhagavad-gītā, self-interest. Kṛṣṇa giving first lesson: aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ prajñā-vādān (BG 2.11). "You are talking like a very learned man, but your action is not like learned." Gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ. The subject matter, he was lamenting that "If I kill my brothers, my sister-in-laws will become widows and will become prostitute, and varṇa-saṅkara." "You are talking just like learned man, but on the basis of bodily relationship."
Prabhupāda: They may read and translate. And why in India where there is Bhagavad-gītā? Apart from all other Vedic literatures, set aside, the gist of all Vedic knowledge, Bhagavad-gītā, there is. And still, people are kept into darkness. How much lamentable. Still, big, big leaders, at least, they want to preach Bhagavad-gītā—without Kṛṣṇa. They have set aside lakhs of rupees for preaching Bhagavad-gītā, but condition is if you preach without Kṛṣṇa. Just see. Bhagavad-gītā in every page it is written "śrī-bhagavān uvāca." Not even it is said "kṛṣṇaḥ uvāca." Because some rascal may take Kṛṣṇa as ordinary human being, therefore Vyāsadeva has specifically said... People know it, "kṛṣṇaḥ uvāca," but he says "śrī-bhagavān uvāca." The bhagavān word. People may not mistake that Kṛṣṇa is somebody else. And they want to banish Kṛṣṇa from Bhagavad-gītā. Even Gandhi did it. So you explain Bhagavad-gītā as it is there in Ahmedabad?
Yaśomatīnandana: Yes.
Prabhupāda: In the Bhagavad-gītā Kṛṣṇa says, the first beginning of the teachings of Bhagavad-gītā you have to take. (aside:) No children. Otherwise it will be disturbed. When Arjuna accepted Kṛṣṇa as the spiritual master, śiṣyas te 'haṁ śādhi māṁ prapannam (BG 2.7). First of all, he was talking like friends. When he saw "The friendly talking will not help us," so Arjuna accepted Kṛṣṇa as his spiritual master. Then as spiritual master He said, aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ prajñā-vādāṁś ca bhāṣase: (BG 2.11) "My dear Arjuna, you are lamenting on the subject matter which is not the subject matter of lamentation, and you are talking like a very learned man." Gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ. This body, either alive or dead, it is not a serious subject matter of study, neither a learned man laments over it.
Prabhupāda: And this body is... Either dead or alive, Bhagavad-gītā condemns, gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ (BG 2.11). So these rascals are interested with this body, and they're proud of their advancement of education. Bhagavad-gītā says nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ. So they are passing as great scientists, philosophers, politicians, philanthropists, but all apaṇḍitāḥ. Nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ. That means apaṇḍita. (Bengali) The first thing of Bhagavad-gītā lesson is that aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ prajñā-vādān (BG 2.11). "Talking like a learned man, but you are rascal." Apaṇḍitaḥ. One who is not educated, he's a rascal. So He's indirectly saying, "This kind of lamentation is not for the paṇḍita. It is for the rascal." So whole world is interested with this body, and Bhagavad-gītā's teaching begins condemning the concept of body. Gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ. Dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). Nobody knows this. And they are very learned scholars in Bhagavad-gītā. All these rascals, they're claiming to be learned scholar of Bhagavad-gītā.
Prabhupāda: Bhakti-mārga is enough. Bhakti-mārga means it includes everything. Without jñāna, there is no bhakti. The jñāna is called brahma-bhūta (SB 4.30.20); that is real jñāna. If you... Aiye. If you understand your position, then it is jñāna. If you do not understand your position, then where is jñāna? Do you follow? Therefore Bhagavān says, brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā (BG 18.54). When... So long you are ajñāna, in ignorance, you cannot be happy. You cannot be happy. But when you are in jñāna, then you'll be happy. That is the symptom of becoming jñānī. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā (BG 18.54). Ātmā becomes very happy. Na śocati na kāṅkṣati. He has no more any lamentation and hankering. There are two things in this material world. We are hankering after something which we do not possess, and we are lamenting for something which we possessed and we have lost. This is the disease, material disease. So when one comes to the platform of jñāna, then he has no more such disease, hankering and lamenting. Here the whole world is going on, lamenting and hankering.
Prabhupāda: People are so misled. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). We have to change this body. There is no preparation. "As sure as death." Death will take place, and you have to accept another body. Who understands this philosophy? Nobody. They are so dull-headed. This body finished, everything finished. All big, big leaders, scholars, they say. One gentleman, his name is... He was Rabindranath Tagore's brother, artist. So in a meeting he was saying, "We are so fool. Thinking of next life, next life, we are spoiling this life." He said like that long, long ago when we were children, young men, about eighteen years, twenty years. So I remember distinctly, he is saying in the meeting that "Simply thinking of next life, we are spoiling this life." He said. That was his explanation. So at that time we were young boys: "Yes, why we should think of, so much of next life?" Of course, I was not very much convinced, but naturally... I think his name Aurobindo Tagore, like that. Rabindranath Tagore. He is good artist. Artist means latest fashion, like this, like that, like that. He was considered to be latest artist. And his view is that. I talked with Professor Kotofsky. He said, "Swamiji, after finishing this body everything is finished." Communist. This is the cent per cent idea. The so-called scientists, they are thinking, by chemical evolution the body has come in existence. These things are discussed in Bhagavad-gītā. By accident, if it is a combination of chemicals, that means the bodily existence was not before. It has come in by accident, combination. "So why, Arjuna, you are lamenting for the body which was not in existence? And it will not exist after.
1977 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: So you expand it. A dog is thinking, "I am this body. I am bulldog," "I am greyhound." And man is also thinking, "I am American," "I am Indian." But they do not know their real identity, and they are fighting like dogs. And this is going on in the name of civilization. And when we put forward Bhagavad-gītā, the first lesson is that aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ prajñā-vādāṁś ca bhāṣase: (BG 2.11) "Arjuna, you are talking like a very learned man, but you are lamenting about the body. But actually..." Gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ: "So far the body is con..., this is lump of matter. So whether it is dead or alive, nobody seriously think of it, no learned, paṇḍita." Of course, those who are fools, rascal, they can take it. But those who are actually learned, they do not talk about this body. So upon this statement just see the world situation. Everyone is busy on the concept of body. So what is the position of the world? Apaṇḍita, ignorance. And such people are going on as learned scholars, as politicians and leaders and so on. So how there can be peace? If you bring different types of dogs, greyhound and bulldog and Indian dog and bring them—the "United Dog Association" (laughter)—so will there be peace? That is the position. I declared in Melbourne in a public meeting that this United Nation is the unity of barking dog. I told. It was published in the paper. They also criticized me, "The Swami has come to hound." (laughter) But that is actually the fact. If you become impartial judge, not on behalf of CID or anyone, then you see the actual.
Satsvarūpa: kuṅkuma?
Prabhupāda: No. Alta it is called. And gumta (?). Somebody is giving massage. Lalitā Didi. Rayarāma dāsa's guru-bhai. This Rāma dāsa's, I have... "Nitāi gaura rādhe śyāma." This Rāma dāsa and that Lalitā, they're Godbrothers. So many... And amongst them there was fight—"You said that you have done this wrong," "You said you have done this wrong." But both of them are dead and gone. There are so many that, Sakhībhekhī. All women. Sometimes he—I have heard all this—he will observe the menstrual period. (laughter) To laugh or lament? "He's in menstrual period." This Ramakrishna did. He was also, because Jagamati experimented.
Prabhupāda: "So whatever the cause, but you have no brain. Cause may be so many things. But you have no brain to understand the simple truth. Where is your brain? So this movement is not brainwashing. Brain-giving. You have no brain." Therefore śāstra says, sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13). Animal has no brain. They say animal has no soul, but that's not the fact. Animal has no brain. Otherwise, all anatomical, physical, physiological conditions are there. Āhāra-nidrā-bhaya-maithuna. But they have no brain. They cannot understand what is the difference between dead man and living man. That is the distinction between man and animal. But if you cannot understand, then where is your brain? On this point. Actually he has no brain. Sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13). That was the point Arjuna was chastised, that "You rascal, you have no brain. You are lamenting on this body and talking like very learned man."
Ādi-keśava: Actually they all need brainwashing.
Prabhupāda: Yes, "Every one of you require, because your brain is filled up with stool. You have no brain. Brain is covered with stool." What they will answer?
Satsvarūpa: That "If I want to have a stool brain, it may be lamentable, but don't force me to be washed.
Prabhupāda: It is not force. It is no...
Satsvarūpa: Let me remain in stool.
Prabhupāda: We are preaching. It does not mean that we are forcing. We are saying that "Your brain is in stool. Wash it like this. If one agrees, he does it. Not that in our movement all world has joined. One who is intelligent, he has agreed, 'Yes.' I am not forcing. If I would have possessed that forcive power, what right you have got to bring me in the court? You are forcing me to stop this. You are forcing. Nobody can force, but you are forcing." You should take this argument and expose them at least in the court, licking of the vagina civilization, like dog. Yes animals do that.
Prabhupāda: Now work very strenuously. You are all young men, and somehow or other, dead horse, you have given life. Otherwise the last fortnight I was thinking I am dead now. I was thinking like that, 'Now life is finished." Life can be finished at any time. That is not wonderful. To live, that is wonderful. If my life is finished, that is not wonderful. Nobody will lament. "Oh, he was old man, eighty-two years old." But if I can live for some days more, that is wonderful. If I die, that is not wonderful.
Prabhupāda: "Because you are a rascal. Because you are giving stress on the body." Aśocyān anvaśocas tvam (BG 2.11). The body is a lump of matter. It is not the subject matter for discussing or lamenting. It is a lump of matter. Now this, what is called...
Mr. Koshi: Machine. Tape recorder.
Prabhupāda: This machine, so long it is working, it is valuable. If it does not work, what is the value? Throw it out. Similarly, the machine is not important, but so long it is working, it is important. So we must know what is that working principle. That is knowledge. So generally, people, they are embarrassed with the machine, this body. But they do not know what the power in the machine. Am I right or wrong?
Prabhupāda: We are preaching what Kṛṣṇa says. We do not mind what others says. There may be similarities, there may not be similarities. It doesn't matter. But we are concerned with the instruction that Kṛṣṇa says. I haven't got to tally what Kṛṣṇa says and what you say. I have no business to do that. We are simply concerned what Kṛṣṇa says. Now if you like, you can take it. If you don't like, you take your own. But we are speaking only on Kṛṣṇa. So our lamentable subject matter, subject is that India has got so great exalted knowledge on Bhagavad-gītā, and the government has got Cultural Department, and all leaders, at least they are supposed to give support to Bhagavad-gītā. Why they are not taking seriously and give it to the...? And they are taking it seriously. My single attempt to preach the teachings of Bhagavad-gītā as it is, they are accepting it all over the world. Why not give it an organized way. All the Indian leaders, they are simply imitating jumping like the Western people.
Prabhupāda: If your machine is stopped, you take another machine. That's all. You go on hearing. Not that your work will stop. You give up this machine. Take another machine. Actually you do that. Why shall I be overwhelmed, "Oh, machine is gone, machine is..."? Therefore Kṛṣṇa says, aśocyān anvaśocas tvam: (BG 2.11) "You are lamenting for the machine, nonsense. This is not paṇḍita's business." Nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ. Machine is gone, take another one, that's all.
Prabhupāda: Even if he has committed suicide, he'll be saved.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: If he did that, he'll be...
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. He lamented. He was very grave(?). Yoga-bhraṣṭo 'bhijāyate. He'll get another good opportunity to develop Kṛṣṇa consciousness-until finally he reaches to Kṛṣṇa.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah. And that seems to be more in fitting with his character, very, very... I don't think he left. I don't think he left and went back to the material world. It doesn't seem to fit his...
Prabhupāda: All right.
Prabhupāda: "My dear Arjuna, you are lamenting for your family and bodily relationships. But this is not the subject matter for learned persons. And you are talking just like a learned man, 'What will happen if these, my brothers' wives become widows and this and that?' " That means in a gentlemanly way He said that "You are talking like a nonsense because you have no real subject matter." Agatāsūṁś ca. So far this body is concerned, either living or dead, it is a not a subject matter for learned talk. It is a lump of matter. And what is life?
Indian man (5): So I think we are passing through a greater hell than what was...
Prabhupāda: No, no, the disease is there; the remedy is there. If you take the remedy, so there is no question of suffering from the disease. But you refuse to take the remedy. Just like this verse from Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, Twelfth Canto. This Kali-yuga is the ocean of faults. Why should we lament for that? The remedy is there. Kīrtanād eva kṛṣṇasya mukta... (SB 12.3.51). You chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. You'll become relieved immediately. So why don't you take the remedy? Mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti. Why you are so much disturbed by māyā? Just surrender to Kṛṣṇa. So it is our choice. We do not do that, and we suffer. Mām aprāpya nivartante mṛtyu-saṁsāra... Kṛṣṇa is giving personally. He has taken you, and we are not accepting. What can be done? The knowledge is there, the process is there, the authority is there, all the ācāryas, they have accepted, but we are so stubborn, we'll not accept. That is the difficulty. We'll manufacture our own ways. Yato mata tato patha. That is the difficulty. So it is past six. Have some kīrtana.
Prabhupāda: You haven't got to think over, "What shall I do now?" Never forget. So our first business is preaching. You should always remember. This is the education. These rascals, they have no father-mother-orphans. They may think as well-educated how to earn money. We have no... We are rich man's son. Economic problem is already solved. That is already taken. Tal labhyate yad anyataḥ sukham. We don't care for all this so-called improvement. That is already settled up. Tasyaiva hetoḥ prayateta kovidaḥ. Just see how to become a man of character like Nārada, Vyāsa. That is our goal. Tasyaiva hetoḥ prayateta kovidaḥ. Not for any other. "And what about your material problems?" That is already taken. Tal labhyate duḥkhavad anyataḥ sukhaṁ kālena sarvatra gabhīra-raṁhasā. This is kṛṣṇa-bhakta. Don't care for maintaining body. "What Kṛṣṇa will give, I take. If He does not give, don't mind." So discussing all this twenty-four hours and death takes place. Death, if takes place, then where is the wrong? Where is the lamentation? There is nothing... You are not permanent. You have to die. But if you die discussing all these things, that is your glorious death.
Prabhupāda: Hippie. The result is hippie. In Western countries I see and lament. So many percent of their population are hippies. What is the benefit? They cannot do anything, useless population. They cannot utilize. And in America the Vietnam was selected—"Let them die," in disappointment. Useless waste of... They require... Could not manage. "Let them die." Marawara gar leka.(?) When we have finished all sorts of condemnation, we say, "You die." That's all. Tell them. They have no idea how to reform this degraded population. This is the only way, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. In New York I have seen in ordinary places how niggardly they live. No human being can live like that. In good places, nicely dressed, nicely... But in East... East Village or something?
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, in the East Village.
Prabhupāda: No gentleman can live. So niggardly.
Prabhupāda: There is nothing lamentable. What is the special news from New Vrindaban?
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What is the report from New Vrindaban?
Kīrtanānanda: Everything is going very nice, Prabhupāda. Your palace is almost finished. Already many, many people are coming every day to see it. At least thirty a day are coming just to see your palace now, and it's not even finished. But it will be finished in a couple of months. People are talking... One lady the other day, she went in and she turned to one of the boys and she said, "I cannot tell you what I am feeling. It is so wonderful. I just cannot express it."
Prabhupāda: Yes, it is wonderful in that quarter. Hm. Let us see which palace I am going.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: If you stay longer on this planet, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that will make this movement stronger. That is the real reason for living longer. 'Cause you are a pure devotee of Lord Kṛṣṇa, you have no personal desire. This is Kṛṣṇa's movement. If you stay longer, then this movement will become stronger and stronger. Simply by your presence the devotees become inspired and they work much better. We can understand that there's nothing to lament if you were to depart, because you're always going to be with Kṛṣṇa. But we would have to lament from our own point of view that we would lose you, at least in the way that we have you now. And the whole world would lament because this movement might not be as strong if you were not present.
Prabhupāda: Then make this arrangement, one week or ten days.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Does Lord Jagannātha reside there any more?
Prabhupāda: No, He resides everywhere. Jagannātha says, yatra tiṣṭhati mad-bhaktas tatra tiṣṭhāmi nārada. Things are deteriorating. That I am lamenting. There is no... For thousands of years sanctity—they are killing.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Is there anything we can do about it?
Prabhupāda: Unless the administration comes to us.
Prabhupāda: So you come at four, have kīrtana (?). (break) I wish that you GBC manage very nicely and consider I am dead and let me try to travel all the tīrthasthāna. Without any responsibility. If I become recovered from this malady I shall come back and then I shall die in, what is it when the dead body is there, let them bring to Māyāpur and Vṛndāvana. I am thinking in this way. Bring little medicine and no medicine, little milk, and travel one place to another and if there is death, what is the lamentation? My age is ripe. In the open air and bullock cart or during daytime, eh? Or you can say semi-suicide, although living what consider me dead for the time. You manage and nowadays there is in India ample sunshine. So during daytime I shall travel and nighttime you make a camp under a tree. In this way let me travel all the tīrthas. I am thinking in this way. What is your opinion?
| Page Title: | Lamentation (Conversations) |
| Compiler: | Rishab, Mayapur, Visnu Murti |
| Created: | 25 of May, 2011 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=80, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 80 |