Pradyumna:
- tac chraddadhānā munayo
- jñāna-vairāgya-yuktayā
- paśyanty ātmani cātmānam...
- (SB 1.2.12)
Prabhupāda: Paś... Tac chraddadhānā munayo jñāna-vairāgya-yuktayā. Jñāna-vairāgya... Without jñāna-vairāgya you cannot make any spiritual advancement. Then?
Pradyumna: Paśyanty ātmani cātmānam...
Prabhupāda: Ah.
Pradyumna: ...bhaktyā śruta-gṛhītayā.
Prabhupāda: Bhaktyā śruta-gṛhītayā. Śruta-gṛhītayā. By hearing from authority. Śruta. Gṛhītayā. Jñāna-vairāgya-yuktayā. This is the process. Tac chraddadhānā munayo jñāna-vairāgya-yuktayā, paśyanty ātmānam ātmani, śruta-gṛhītayā, bhaktyā śruta-gṛhītayā (SB 1.2.12). This is the process.
Reporter: By devotion, by listening you receive and see the self...
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Reporter: ...within the self.
Prabhupāda: Yes, within the self.
Reporter: Ātmani ātmānam. (break)
Prabhupāda: What is the purport?
Pradyumna: "The Absolute Truth is realized in full by the process of devotional service to the Lord Vāsudeva, or the Personality of Godhead..."
Prabhupāda: This is confirmed in Bhagavad-gītā. Bhaktyā mām abhijānāti yāvān yaś cāsmi tattvataḥ (BG 18.55). Never says by jñāna or karma you'll get.
Reporter: Only bhakti, yes.
Prabhupāda: Go on.
Pradyumna: "...who is the full-fledged Absolute Truth. Brahman is His transcendental bodily effulgence, and Paramātmā is His partial representation. As such, Brahman or Paramātmā realization of the Absolute Truth is but a partial realization. There are four different types of living beings. The karmīs, the jñānīs, the yogis and the devotees. The karmīs are materialistic, whereas the other three are transcendental. The first-class transcendentalists are the devotees who have realized the Supreme Person. The second-class transcendentalists are those who have partially realized the plenary portion of the Absolute person. And the third-class transcendentalist are those who have barely realized the spiritual focus of the Absolute Person."
Reporter: Who are those three, jñānīs...?
Prabhupāda: Jñānīs, yogis...
Reporter: And karm...
Prabhupāda: Karmīs, jñānīs, yogis...
Reporter: And bhaktas.
Prabhupāda: So karmīs are not transcendentalists. They're materialists. But jñānīs, yogis and bhaktas, they're transcendentalists.
Reporter: Yeah. So jñānīs are third class.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Jñānīs are...
Reporter: Why?
Prabhupāda: Because they simply approach the impersonal manifestation of the Absolute.
Reporter: I see. They're intellectual.
Prabhupāda: Brahman. Brahman. Brahman realization.
Reporter: Ah.
Prabhupāda: Ahaṁ brahmāsmi. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā (BG 18.54). They get relief from material conception of life so much. But that is not full understanding of the Absolute Truth. Therefore they're third class, or in the third grade. The second grade, yogis. They realize Paramātmā, Viṣṇu, within the heart. But the first class are the bhaktas. They talk, personally, just like Arjuna is talking. Arjuna is directly talking with Kṛṣṇa. This is the result of bhakti.
Reporter: Hm. You feel the presence.
Prabhupāda: Not feel. Actually talk, just like we are talking. Actually talking.