Indian: ...that is oṁkāra. Oṁkāra-svarūpa. But what I want to know is who is Lord Śiva, Viṣṇu and Brahmā? Whether these three of them are gods?
Prabhupāda: Yes. They're expansion of God. Just like the earth. And then, from earth, you find trees, wood. And then, in the tree, you can set fire. It becomes smoke. Then comes out the fire. When you get the fire, you can take your work from the fire. So the, everything is one, but... Just the same example: from earth, the wood; from wood, the smoke; from smoke, the fire. But if you have to take business, then it is required the fire, although the, all of them, are the one. Similarly, there are demigods, Brahmā, Viṣṇu, Maheśvara. So if you have to take business, then you have to go to the fire, Viṣṇu, sattama, sattva-guṇa. This is the process. Although they are one, but your business can be completed with Viṣṇu, not with others. What is my business? My business is to get out of these material clutches. So if anyone is eager to be free from these material clutches, then he must take shelter of Viṣṇu, not others.
Indian: Kindly let me know that what is desire. So long desire is there, we can't realize God. And realizing God is also a desire.
Prabhupāda: Desire means material desires. If you think that you are Indian and your desire is how to make your country improve... Or so many desires. Or if you are a family man. So these are all material desires. So long you are enwrapped by material desires, then you are under the condition of material nature. As soon as you think that you are, your, you are not Indian or American, you are not a brāhmaṇa or Vaiṣṇava, brāhmaṇa or kṣatriya, you are eternal servant of Kṛṣṇa, that is called purified desire. Desire is there, but you have to purify the desire. That I have explained just now. Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktam (CC Madhya 19.170). These are upādhis. Suppose you are in a black coat. So does it mean you are black coat? If you say... If I ask you, "Who are you?" If you say, "I am black coat," is that the proper answer? No. Similarly, we are in a dress, American dress or Indian dress. So if somebody asks you "Who are you?" "I am Indian." That is wrong identification. If you say, "Ahaṁ brahmāsmi," that is your real identification. That realization required.
Indian: How can I get...?
Prabhupāda: That requires, uh, you have to go... Tapasā brahmacaryeṇa (SB 6.1.13) . You have to undergo the principle. Ādau śraddhā tataḥ sādhu-saṅgo 'tha bhajana-kriyā (CC Madhya 23.14-15). You have to accept the process. Then you'll realize.
Indian: But yesterday you also represented that there was some devotee, he renounced this whole world, went to forest, and he was chanting the name of Lord Kṛṣṇa, this and that. But he was, some step of (?) bhakti-yoga, and he was having the love of one deer. So at the time of death, he got idea of deer, and next birth, he become deer. So there was no desire intentionally, but anyhow he came in that...
Prabhupāda: No, there was desire. He was thinking of a deer. There was desire.
Indian: We think about so many things...