Prabhupāda: We are under the rules of nature. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). Everything is acting under the rules of material nature. Just like you are young man. Now, you cannot say, "I'll not become old man." Can you? And you are forced by the rules of nature. Can you deny?
Young man (3): No. In one way...
Prabhupāda: So you accept or not accept, you have to follow the rules of material nature.
Young man (3): I admit I can't...
Prabhupāda: Then you are under the rules of material nature. You have to admit.
Young man (3): Ah, but in spiritual life...
Prabhupāda: Why do you jump over spiritual life? First of all try to understand your material nature, what you are at the present moment, that you are on the rules of material nature. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). That you cannot avoid. So what is the use of making your own rules?
Young man (3): Ah, but you're not understanding the rules of nature.
Prabhupāda: No, that understanding... First of all you have to understand that you are under the rules of material nature, and you accept or not accept, you'll be forced by nature.
Young man (3): Ah, this is understood.
Prabhupāda: That understanding... Then it will be all right. And what is the use of your own rules? If you are forced to accept the rules of material nature, then what is the use of foolish rules? You have to accept. When material nature rules, you must die. You cannot avoid it. You must die. You must change body. You must be. So what is the use of your rules? You can manufacture as a madman. You are completely forced to accept the material nature.
Young man (6): What are the rules of the material nature? Again, from experience, I know that one year, I couldn't do something and then, with a certain amount of practice, the next year I could. And so the rule has changed. It no longer is out of my grasp.
Prabhupāda: Not changed. You think that.
Young man (6): But my ability to work...
Prabhupāda: Your ability to work is destined. Why don't you understand this? What you are? Why you are thinking yourself very big? That is your nonsense. You are under the rules of material nature. You'll be forced. That is real understanding, that "I don't want this. Why material nature forces me?" That is real knowledge. "Why? Why I am under the material rules?" Then knowledge begins.
Young man (3): Ah, this is understood, but...
Prabhupāda: Yes. But if you think stick to your own rules, that "I don't care for your material rules," who cares for you?
Young man (3): But one must train themselves...
Prabhupāda: Yes, this is knowledge. You meditate upon this, that "I do not want to die. Why there is death?"
Young man (6): "I don't want..."?
Indian man (1): "Why is there death? I am forced to die."
Young man (3): I'm thinking he's not (indistinct) properly.
Prabhupāda: So the real problem is birth, death, old age and disease, and by following any rules, if you can stop this problem, then you are successful. It doesn't matter what is your brand of rules, but the problem is there. And we are suggesting that mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etām... If you want to avoid the rules of material nature, then you surrender unto Kṛṣṇa. We are suggesting. If you like, you can take it. But you are under the rules of material nature. That you cannot say, "No." (aside:) Now give them prasādam.
Trivikrama: Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: If you come tomorrow again at five o'clock, every day there'll be darśana.
Devotees: Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. Thank you very much for your coming. Jaya. (end)