Yaśomatīnandana: (break) ...people, they are nice pious people, and they have accepted some of these gymnastic people as their guru. So they say, "Oh, our guruji is here. We have to go see our guruji," this, that. So how should we speak to them or how should we preach to them?
Prabhupāda: That you cannot do immediately unless he understands your philosophy. Paraṁ dṛṣṭvā nivartate (BG 2.59). Unless they understand that this philosophy is better than that, how he can give it up?
Yaśomatīnandana: Sometimes they even say that "You have your guru and I have my guru. It's all the same thing."
Prabhupāda: Yes, and a thief has also a guru. Then that guru is also the same thing. (Hindi) Here guru means tasmād gurum prapadyeta jijñāsur śreya uttaman (SB 11.3.21). (Hindi) Nāpnuvanti mahātmānam saṁsiddhiṁ paramaṁ gataḥ.
Yaśomatīnandana: Isn't there some conditioning between the guru and śiśya, that "The guru should be like this and a śiśya should be like this"?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Yaśomatīnandana: Not that anybody can say, "I am śiśya," and not anybody can say, "I am guru."
Prabhupāda: Saṁsara-dāvā. You are singing daily. Saṁsara-dāvānala-līḍha-loka-trāṇāya kāruṇya-ghanāghanatvam **. One who can deliver from this entanglement of material, miserable condition of life, he is guru. That is the first definition of guru. Saṁsara-dāvānala-līḍha-loka-trāṇāya kāruṇya-ghanāghanatvam, prāptasya kalyāṇa—one who has obtained this qualification—vande guroḥ śrī caraṇāra..., he is guru **.
Yaśomatīnandana: 'Cause nowadays...
Prabhupāda: Nowadays... Nowadays let them talk all nonsense. But this is the definition of guru. "Nowadays the sun is rising on the western side." If somebody says like that, who is going to accept it? "Nowadays." There is no question of "nowadays" and "formerly." The truth is truth always. Hare Kṛṣṇa. That is Absolute Truth. Jaya.
Yaśomatīnandana: So many yajñas and siddhis and everything going on, everywhere you see. It's so hard...
Prabhupāda: Yajñaiḥ saṅkīrtanaiḥ prayair yajanti hi sumedhasaḥ (SB 11.5.32). Those who are very intelligent, those whose brain clear, they, yajñaiḥ saṅkīrtanaiḥ prayair yajanti hi sumedhasaḥ.
- ye yad dhyāyato viṣṇuṁ
- tretayaṁ yajato makhaiḥ
- dvapare paricaryayaṁ
- kalau tad dhari-kīrtanāt
What yajñas they will perform? Not possible. Where is the yajñic brāhmaṇa? (break) "Don't talk. I am very busy." (laughter) (break) ...greatest contribution?
Brahmānanda: "The greatest contribution of the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is its authorized translations of Vedic literature." Oh, "The greatest contribution to scholars." No. "The greatest contribution of the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is that it is providing to scholars authorized translations of these Vedic literatures."
Prabhupāda: That is the remark of a very big professor.
Devotee (3): Śrīla Prabhupāda, how do we support our challenge that they have not gone to the moon?
Prabhupāda: Hm?
Devotee (3): How do we support our challenge to the scientists that they have not actually gone to the moon?
Prabhupāda: First proof is that they say that there is no life. That is foolishness. There is life. Because we find everywhere life, why not in the moon planet? And there are many others. The first challenge is this.
Devotee (3): They say that they have not seen the life, though.
Prabhupāda: But what you can see, rascal? Therefore we say you are rascals. Why do you believe your eyes? You cannot see so many things. We don't find any living entity in the ocean. Does it mean there is no living entity? So what is the value of your seeing? That is the defect. They believe in too much their eyes. Although eyes are... Every sense is imperfect. You can see here: "Oh, we don't find anything. It is all zero." Does it mean the sky is zero? There are millions of planets and millions of living entities. So that is their rascaldom. They think that they are perfect. Whatever they see, that is perfect. That is their mistake. If I say, "No, there is no life. I cannot see," is that very good statement? And in the..., externally you don't find any living entity, but is it void of living entities? Then why shall I assert that "There is no living... I cannot see"? Is that very good proposal? Therefore they are rascals. There cannot be any place within this universe which is without life. There cannot be. We see there is life even within sand. How you can say there is no life? "Because I cannot see." What is this argument? What you are? You are a rascal. Because you cannot see, therefore we have to accept? First of all we say you are rascal. And if he says that "I cannot see," is it to be accepted? And the example is there. "I cannot see any life. It is simply water." But there are millions and trillions of life, big, big fish. Where is your perfection of seeing?
Devotee (3): Prabhupāda? Why are the big authorities, like the government people...?
Prabhupāda: Nobody is authority. That is our first assertion. Nobody is authority. Therefore we have placed Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Kṛṣṇa is only authority. All rascals. That is our first assertion-(aside:) Good morning—that except Kṛṣṇa there is no authority. And one who follows Kṛṣṇa, he is authority.
Devotee (3): Why are the so-called scientists trying to make the common people believe that...
Prabhupāda: Because they are so-called scientists. You have already explained. Why you are asking? (laughter) You have already explained, "so-called scientists." That's all. They are not scientists; they are so-called scientists.
Devotee (3): Why do they want to fool the people?
Prabhupāda: Because you are fool. Because you are fool, therefore you become befooled. We do not become befooled by their words. You are fool; you will be befooled. If you want to remain fool, then you will be befooled. And if you become intelligent, then you will not be befooled. They can befool when there are many fools. If there is no fool they cannot befool. So you follow this?
Devotee (3): Yes.
Prabhupāda: Jaya.
Devotee (3): The scientists, they are also fools.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Devotee (3): The scientists are also fools.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Mūḍha. That is our definition in the Bhagavad-gita. Na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ (BG 7.15). So much educated? māyayāpahṛta-jñānā āsuraṁ-bhāvam āśritāḥ. Their knowledge has no value. The māyā has taken away everything.
Indian man (4): (Hindi)
Prabhupāda: māyayāpahṛta jñānā. Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Indian man (4): Honor...
Prabhupāda: Thank you very much. Unless one understands Kṛṣṇa... Vedais ca sarvair aham eva vedyaḥ (BG 15.15). Veda means knowledge. So all kinds of knowledge, they are aiming at the Supreme Personality of Godhead. So if one does not understand what is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, then māyayāpahṛta-jñānā—he has no knowledge. Knowledge means ultimately he must know what is God. That is knowledge. Ye kṛṣṇa tattva vetta sei guru haya. Anyone who knows Kṛṣṇa, he becomes guru. Otherwise not. The first test is you may be scientist, philosopher, educationist, whatever you may be, but ask him, "Do you know Kṛṣṇa?" If he says, "No," then he is a fool. That's all. This is the test. (chuckles) Hare Kṛṣṇa. So Ambarisa Mahārāja, do you agree?
Ambarīṣa: Yes. It's a good test.
Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) Goldsmith, they take a stone, black stone. Do you know? And they rub the gold on the stone, and they can immediately say whether it is gold or not. So our, that stone, is Kṛṣṇa. If anyone knows Kṛṣṇa, then it is gold. (laughter)
Devotee (3): Haribol! Jaya Prabhupāda.