Prabhupāda: ...that I shall be happy in this material world, he'll not be able to take Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Cyavana: The slightest tinge of a material desire will force him to take another body. Is that it?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Kṛṣṇa will give him full advantage of enjoying this material world. Unless he is disgusted, he cannot. He'll not become disgusted. Therefore Kṛṣṇa says, "Give up this." Personally, he is not going to be disgusted. māyā. Therefore Kṛṣṇa personally asks him, "Give up this business." Sarva-dharmān parityajya (BG 18.66). But we are thinking, "Eh! Why this man asking like this? Sarva-dharmān parityajya. I shall give up my business, I shall give up my family, I shall give up my country and simply surrender to Him? Oh, it is too much. Sophisticated." What is called? "Sophistry." What is sophistry?
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Sophistry?
Prabhupāda: Yes?
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Half wise, half foolish.
Brahmānanda: Sophistry means some...
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Brahmānanda: ... philosophy that is not sound. Superficial.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that is... That is the remark of Dr. Rādhākrishnan, when Kṛṣṇa said like that. That means "He... Too much," because he thinks, "Kṛṣṇa is..., may be a very big man, but He's a man. Why He is asking like that?" (break) ...first business is to give him always miseries so that he may be disgusted. But he is so foolish, he is not becoming disgusted. Everyone knows this is very troublesome world, but nobody is disgusted.
Cyavana: He's like the horse who chases after the carrot. He never gets it, but still, he keeps trying for it. He never gives up. He keeps trying.
Prabhupāda: There are many examples. Matir na kṛṣṇe parataḥ svato vā. Only for this fault, gṛha-vratānām—"I shall be happy in this material world." In Delhi, we established that center. You had been there?
Brahmānanda: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Ananda...
Brahmānanda: Ananda Niketan.
Prabhupāda: Full of foreign embassies. So nobody came.
Brahmānanda: They came the first night, and that was it.
Prabhupāda: Nobody came.
Brahmānanda: Neither were they very friendly.
Prabhupāda: They thought that "We are living so nicely, embassy and ambassador, and living in such a nice house, comfortably. What is this nonsense, God?" All these embassies and the ambassadors, they are prized post. It has no use.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They're what, Prabhupāda?
Prabhupāda: Prized post only. Governors, the embassies, this is... These are invented to satisfy the agitators, politicians, because the opposite party will agitate.
Brahmānanda: So give them some house and some post.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Give them some. That's all. It has no use. They do not do anything. Simply hold that post and get nice house, nice salary, servants, honor, and sometimes they are called and make some speech. That's all. And whatever nonsense he may be, if he is governor, then everyone will respect him. That's all. And as soon as the same man is not governor, nobody goes to kick on his face. I have seen so many governors. When they retire, nobody... (aside:) Where is that cap? Nobody cares.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Is this desire for material happiness the cause of material attachment?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Kṛṣṇa bhuliya jīva bhoga vāñchā kare. When they forget to serve Kṛṣṇa and wants to enjoy this material world... Don't you see that these Māyāvādī philosophers are trying for liberation, and still, they are expecting to become God. That is another desire. Daridra-nārāyaṇa. The high ambition, to become God or equal to God, that is going on, struggle for existence.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: What about these rascals like Sai Baba? They use Kṛṣṇa's philosophy, and then they twist it in such a way that it becomes Māyāvāda.
Prabhupāda: No, no. He's a cheater. People want to be cheated. They come to sādhu for some material benefit. Don't you see that people are so much anxious to touch the feet of a sādhu? What is the reason? Reason is that if he gets some favor of the sādhu, "Then I shall be happy materially." That's all. They have no idea, becoming servant of Kṛṣṇa. Āśīrvāda (Hindi).
Brahmānanda: Swami(?) Deji(?) once told me he once wanted your āśīrvāda. I didn't know what the word meant. He was shocked. "You don't know what āśīrvāda is?" It was like I did not know anything because I did not know that. It means to take the benefit from the guru.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But if he's a real guru, then the real benefit will be there.
Prabhupāda: Yes.