So long I deny Krsna, that is disunity, and as soon as I agree, "Krsna, yes," then this is unity. This is unity. Unity does not mean that Krsna and Arjuna become united, homogeneous

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"This is unity. Unity does not mean that Krsna and Arjuna become united, homogeneous"

Conversations and Morning Walks

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

So long I deny Kṛṣṇa, that is disunity, and as soon as I agree, "Kṛṣṇa, yes," then this is unity. This is unity. Unity does not mean that Kṛṣṇa and Arjuna become united, homogeneous. No. Kṛṣṇa is distinct, and Arjuna. They continue to exist. In the beginning Arjuna was denying to fight. That is disunity, and at the end when he said, "Yes, kariṣye vacanaṁ tava (BG 18.73), my illusion is now over," that is unity. Unity does not mean one's self loses individuality.

Śyāmasundara: Śrīla Prabhupāda, I have a question.

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Śyāmasundara: If unity means to agree in purpose...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Śyāmasundara: ...then what is that purpose? What is Kṛṣṇa's purpose?

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa is living force. He has got different purpose.

Śyāmasundara: Oh.

Prabhupāda: Don't say that Kṛṣṇa has only one purpose. That only purpose is that you surrender. Now, when you surrender, whatever Kṛṣṇa says, you do it.

Śyāmasundara: Oh. So His purpose is individual for everyone.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Varieties of purposes. Kṛṣṇa is asking Arjuna to fight with the Kurus, or He's asking me to preach. I am not fighting. So Kṛṣṇa, being all pervasive. He has got varieties of order, and your duty is to carry out the order of Kṛṣṇa, that's all. What kind of order He'll give, you expect, just like you are doing, all my disciples. It is not that you are all doing the same thing. Somebody is pūjārī, somebody is preaching, somebody is collector, somebody is Messiah, somebody is this, somebody is that. So there are different varieties, but your duty is to carry out my order.

Gurudāsa: Just like you're satisfying us all, Kṛṣṇa satisfies everyone, (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: Surrender means, whatever is favorable for Kṛṣṇa we apply, that's all. You cannot say, just like Arjuna, he first of all declined, "Kṛṣṇa, I am not going to fight." That is not surrender.

Guest (1): "I'll do whatever You want, but don't ask me to fight."

Prabhupāda: You cannot deny Him. That is surrender. Then, when he understood Bhagavad-gītā, he said, "Yes, I shall do that." So long I deny Kṛṣṇa, that is disunity, and as soon as I agree, "Kṛṣṇa, yes," then this is unity. This is unity. Unity does not mean that Kṛṣṇa and Arjuna become united, homogeneous. No. Kṛṣṇa is distinct, and Arjuna. They continue to exist. In the beginning Arjuna was denying to fight. That is disunity, and at the end when he said, "Yes, kariṣye vacanaṁ tava (BG 18.73), my illusion is now over," that is unity. Unity does not mean one's self loses individuality. That is cannot..., that cannot be. Kṛṣṇa says that "Both you and Me and all these soldiers and kings, they existed before, now we are existing, and we shall exist in future." So that individuality is always kept. So unity means agreeing with the order of Kṛṣṇa, and disunity means not agreeing with the order. Otherwise, your existence, mine and Kṛṣṇa's existence, always will be.

Śyāmasundara: Sometimes people ask what is..., what is God's ultimate goal? What is... Why is God creating everything and are all these manifestations...

Prabhupāda: These are very old questions. These are not very intelligent questions. God is not creating. God is giving you chance. The conditioned souls who are not with Kṛṣṇa, they wanted to enjoy this material world. Therefore God is giving them chance: "All right, enjoy (indistinct)," and giving instruction also that "You enjoy in this way, so that you may come back again." Just like a father. Children wants to play in the field. "All right, you play." Then, as soon as he asks, "Please come back. It is now time up...," they come back. Similarly this material world, we wanted to enjoy, so Kṛṣṇa has given us freedom, "All right, enjoy." And now Kṛṣṇa gives instruction that "Now you give up all these things. You have enjoyed. (indistinct) can come back," then your... He created for you. Same example I always give: Just like the government, when there is formation of the city, jail construction is also there. You cannot say that "Why government is creating? It is unnecessary, it's premature, construction in jail work." But the government knows that there are some criminals who has to be put into the jail. Therefore the jail created. So because there are criminals, therefore government creates. Similarly, there are many conditioned souls who, instead of serving Kṛṣṇa, they want to enjoy. "All right, for you. You enjoy to your fullest extent." And when he is tired of enjoying, enjoying, enjoying, then Kṛṣṇa says that "If you give up all this nonsense, just surrender to Me, you will be happy." But the demons will never surrender to Kṛṣṇa. They say that this material world is false and Brahman is truth, but they do not know how to act as Brahman. Brahman means to stop. That is nirviśeṣavāda and śūnyavāda: to become void. But you cannot become void. If I say, "Mr. Such-and-such, you sit down here, try to become void," how long you shall remain, void?

Guest (1): No, that's impossible.

Prabhupāda: That's impossible. So this is a wrong theory. Because I am a living entity, I have got my activities. I can remain void for few seconds, for few minutes. (guests enter and pay obeisances) Very glad to see you.

Guest (4): Yes.

Prabhupāda: Oh, thank you (indistinct) good boy. Come on, I... So, you have... You are old (indistinct). Jaya. (break) (end)