The measurement of soul is given there in the śāstra: one ten-thousandth part of the tip of the hair. So everything is there. It is not matter. And that is instructed in the Bhagavad-gītā. Nāyaṁ śāstra... Acchedyo 'yam adāhyo 'yam akledyo 'śoṣya eva ca. "This spiritual spark cannot be cut into pieces." Acchedyo 'yam adāhyo 'yam: "It cannot be burned into the fire." So... (aside:) Come on. But these rascals, they are seeing that "The body is burnt into ashes, so everything is finished." And Kṛṣṇa says, adāhyo 'yam: "It cannot be burned." So it remains. And that transmigrates. And that small particle you have no eyes to see. You say, therefore, "Why shall I believe transmigration?" How nature's law is working so subtle way? Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). But the ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā. I say, rascal, not manufactured by me. Ahaṅkāra vimūḍha. Vimūḍha means a great rascal. Mūḍha means rascal, ass, and vi, viśeṣa, particularly, first-class ass, vimūḍha. Under false pride, he is thinking, "I am everything." Ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā kartāham iti... (BG 3.27). "I can do anything by science, by this technology." That's... Vimūḍhātmā, great rascals. And these great rascals, they are leading the world. Therefore people are in darkness. They have become leaders, the so-called scientists and educationists and political leaders. All set of rascals, and they have become leaders. Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānāḥ (SB 7.5.31). They are blind, and they are leading other blind men, so people are kept in darkness, and the opportunity of this human life is lost. By nature's way, by evolutionary process, we get this human form of life. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante (BG 7.19). Manuṣya, arthadam. Prahlāda Mahārāja says durlabhaṁ mānuṣaṁ janma. Such life, important life, they are wasting like cats and dogs. So this is education; this is advancement. People are not given the opportunity to utilize this valuable life for understanding higher things. This is plight of this civilization. They are growing like cats and dogs and dying like cats and dogs. And yathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13), and according to his work, he has to accept another body. That is nature's law. So in this life I am very big man, but by work, karmaṇā daiva netreṇa (SB 3.31.1), by superior administration, I have to accept a body of dog. Then what is the value of your being great now? That technology is unknown, although it is stated there in the Bhagavad-gītā. Everything is. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). So Kṛṣṇa never says that "You'll get such and such body." Dehāntara. "You'll have to change the body." Now, suppose... There are 8,400,000 types of bodies. Suppose next time I become a tree. Then just see horrible position. Here is a tree. I am within this room, sitting so comfortably, and the tree is standing there. I can get that life also, karmaṇā, by my work. So this technology is unknown. And we are very much proud of advancement of knowledge. Boliye. Am I right or wrong?
Guest (4): I don't know. I've never given very serious thought considering and...
Prabhupāda: Well, these are not the subject matter for serious thought? Do you think? You are under the grip of the laws of material nature. Do you admit or not?
Guest (4): Yes.
Prabhupāda: Then why you should be under the grip of material nature? And if there is way, why should you not take? Mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etaṁ taranti te.
Guest (2): Our analysis...
Prabhupāda: Analysis... (Hindi) Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). So why you are trying to get better position? That should be the endeavor, that we may get better position.
Guest (2): Sat-saṅga.
Prabhupāda: Sat-saṅga, satāṁ prasaṅgāt. The sat-saṅga... We know that word only, but if we don't take advantage, then what is meaning?
Guest (5) (Indian man): Execution part is more important of the sat-saṅga.
Prabhupāda: Yes. No, sat-saṅga means sat. Sat means which is true and not contaminated. That is sat. Oṁ tat sat. So sat-saṅga means to associate with spiritual knowledge. That is sat.
Guest (5): And execution of the discourse.
Prabhupāda: Well, saṅga means execution. When you associate with medical association or sharebrokers' association, simply go there and sit down is not your business. You have to do something. You have to do something. Sat-saṅga means that. Tad-yoṣanāt aśu apavarga-vartmani. Sat-saṅga means you have to take the knowledge and use it for practical purpose. That is sat-saṅga. So our this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is trying to give the sat-saṅga, opening centers all over the world. If people take advantage of it they'll be benefited. But if he is ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā, then it is very unfortunate. Mandāḥ sumanda-matayo manda-bhāgyā hy upadrutāḥ (SB 1.1.10). This is Kali-yuga. The leaders also do not associate with sat, and they create their own imagination. Sat, oṁ tat sat. Bhagavān is the supreme sat. So they do not care for Bhagavān, so there is no sat-saṅga. Asat-saṅga.
- sat-saṅga chāḍi kāinu asate vilāsa
- te karaṇe lāgi more karma bandha phāṅsa
"I given up sat-saṅga, and I am trying to enjoy asat." Asato mā sad gamaya. That is Vedic injunction. "But I do not care for sat-saṅga." Sat-saṅga chāḍi. You have to take up something after giving up something. So our present position is sat-saṅga chāḍi kāinu asate vilāsa. "I have given up sat-saṅga, and I am trying to enjoy in asat. The result is I am entangled in karma bandha phāṅsa. According to karma, I am changing my body, and today I am human being and tomorrow I am a dog. And again from dog to another body, another body." This is going on.