Prabhupāda: So we are trying to make some first-class men. That's all. This is our aim. Even if he is fourth-class man, it doesn't matter. If he takes up the training, he becomes first class. And as soon as he becomes a first-class man, ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti: even if he is not liberated, he goes in higher planetary system amongst the demigods. Then there he gets more advanced. He goes to Brahmā. If he is not directly transferred to the spiritual world, then he gets this facilities. And with Brahmā, at the end of this creation, annihilation, they go to the spiritual world.
Gaṇeśa: Just by becoming first-class men.
Prabhupāda: That is described. Śamo damas titikṣā (BG 18.42), that . . . you were not here, hearing?
Gaṇeśa: I was here.
Prabhupāda: That is first class.
Gaṇeśa: So just by becoming first-class men you can go to the heavenly planets?
Prabhupāda: Yes. But that is meant for a first-class men. Ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti (BG 14.18). Ūrdhvam means higher planetary system.
Gaṇeśa: Are we not training all classes of men? In Kṛṣṇa consciousness . . .
Prabhupāda: We can train any class to become first class. It is simply by education. Just like anyone can become engineer by training. Where is the difficulty? Nobody is born first class, but we can make first class if he agrees to become first class. Two things required: he must agree, and the teachings are there. Then he becomes first class. Where is the difficulty?
Gaṇeśa: But you say, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that the four classes are necessary.
Prabhupāda: They already there, four classes of men, but they should be properly trained up. Then the society will be in order. Just like this man, he is considered to be first-class man in the society. He is in charge of some department. But actually, he is fourth class. So as he is little trained up by a moment's instruction, if he agrees to be trained up, he can become.