Prabhupāda: It is universal, science. It is science. So why this science is kept locket up and distorted by the leaders? If you understand one line of Bhagavad-gītā, your life becomes successful. Now our leaders are supposed to read Bhagavad-gītā, but who understands this one line, tathā dehāntara-prāptir dhīras tatra na muhyati (BG 2.13)? Nobody understands. And they are scholars of Bhagavad-gītā. They cannot understand this one line in the beginning. This is going on. So I would request you to take this matter seriously and... And it is being responded. I am writing these books on Bhagavad-gītā, Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, and we are selling daily five to six lakhs' worth of books. In a foreign country, where their religious system is different, and during Christmas festival we are selling our books, large quantity.
Mr. Rajda: That's a novel thing, no, novel thing.
Prabhupāda: So unless there is something substantial... They are intelligent.
Mr. Rajda: Intelligent people.
Prabhupāda: Why they should accept this? And this is one man's attempt.
Mr. Rajda: It has got to be institutionalized.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Why not make that? This political change, this political situation change, it will go on. Today you are powerful. Tomorrow I am powerful. That does not make any difference. Indira Gandhi was so powerful. In one day everything finished. So it may be finished, my position. Mohitaṁ nābhijānāti mām ebhyaḥ param avyayam (BG 7.13). Tribhir guṇamayair bhāvaiḥ. They do not know, behind these all activities there is a person who can do anything He likes. So what about to know about Him? So these things are there in India. The knowledge is not secret. It is open. So without distorting it, without breaking it and spoiling it, why not give it as it is for the benefit of the whole humanity? You are young man. You can think over.
Indian (1): With a commission.
Prabhupāda: But...
Mr. Rajda: With your blessings... With your blessing I can be sure to be able to do something.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Mr. Rajda: Last time we had talked about this, and in Delhi, actually, I was on the verge of arranging the meeting, but never here. But then our Girirāja telephoned me, and in deference to your health we didn't arrange that meeting in Delhi. When Morarji-bhai is coming here, we shall see that...
Prabhupāda: Yes. First of all you can talk. It is not expected that everyone will be able to understand. It is not expected.
- manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu
- kaścid yatati siddhaye
- yatatām api siddhānāṁ
- kaścin māṁ vetti tattvataḥ
- (BG 7.3)
It is not easy job. But still, some ideal institution should be there who are actually serious to understand. They may be given the chance. That must be there. In the university, when we were students, there were some postgraduate classes that no student was coming. But still, the university maintained that class, paying, in those days, 1,200, 1,500, salaries to the professors. They maintained that. So here there is no question of salary. Here the institution must be maintained, strictly following the principles of Bhagavad-gītā. It is open. It is not difficult at all. Just like Kṛṣṇa says the perfect life, how one can become perfect, man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru: (BG 18.65) "Always think of Me," man-manāḥ, "just become My devotee," mad-bhaktaḥ, "worship me," mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru, "simply offer your obeisances unto Me." One, two, three, four-four items. If you do one item at least, your life becomes successful. Even this child can do this. So to understand Bhagavad-gītā and follow the principle—not at all difficult. It is not reserved for any particular class of men or country or society, such a nice thing, and the human body is meant for understanding this knowledge, not to imitate the cats and dogs, jumping. This is being done by the cats and dogs. By evolutionary process, when we come to the human form of life, it is meant for understanding this science. So this opportunity there is, but we are blocking them not to take this knowledge and try to understand how to jump like cats and dogs. Greatest disservice to the human society. We have got such chance, so instead of helping you to get the chance, if I mislead you another way, is it not greatest disservice?
Mr. Rajda: Yes.
Prabhupāda: That is being done all over the world. If you simply understand this one line, tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ... (BG 2.13). So today I am Indian, and after death I become something else. There are 8,400,000 different bodies. Today I may be very exalted minister, and tomorrow, if I become something else... I'll have to, because nature's law, you cannot check. Tathā dehānt... Just like here is child. You cannot check to become young man. That is not in your power. She must become or he must become. Similarly, tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ, it is not in your hand or in my hand. It is in the hand of the prakṛti. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ, ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā (BG 3.27). So there are so many things that... The human society requires this knowledge and we are trying to give this knowledge alone with our humble attempt, and these foreigners are helping with their prāṇair arthair dhiyā vācā, by their life, by their money, by their intelligence, by their words. (aside:) Give them pad. They cannot sit comfortably. There is pad. Give him. Pads. Yes. No, no. Oh. (Hindi) Sukham asinaḥ.(?) First of all one must... Give her. So we have got, at least in Bombay, the most important place in India, this institution. So come here. Try to understand the philosophy. There is no difficulty. But we neglect it. We are simply ne..., and distorting. Everyone is giving his own interpretation. Eh? Then when, where is the importance of Kṛṣṇa? If Bhagavad-gītā is a book who is authority, and if you interpret and give your own interpretation, then where is the authority? Suppose Parliament passes one law, and if I interpret in my own way, then where is the authority of the law? This is the idea. If you want to give some idea of your own, give it separately. Why do you take Bhagavad-gītā and distort it? This is not gentlemanly, this. We are presenting, therefore, Bhagavad-gītā as it is, and it is being accepted. And before me so many swamis, yogis went there. They also tried to explain Bhagavad-gītā, but nobody accepted. There was... In the history there was not a single devotee of Kṛṣṇa before my going. Now there are thousands. Why? The secret is that I am presenting as it is.
Mr. Rajda: As it is, quite.
Prabhupāda: No distortion, no cheating. This is the secret. They give me credit, "Swamiji, you have done wonderful. You have done..." I say the secret of wonderful is this, that I have not distorted it. I have presented Bhagavad-gītā as it is. It is open secret.
Mr. Rajda: That creates... It has created... Your attempts have created a good impact on the Western world.
Prabhupāda: Everyone is doing(?). But we have rejected. Our misfortune is that our property, we have rejected.
Mr. Rajda: Instead of rejecting, it would be correct to say that we have locked it up.
Prabhupāda: That means we don't take any importance. But now, if you want to do something, then you maintain this institution rigidly, follow the principles of Bhagavad-gītā. It doesn't matter. It doesn't require many men. Ekaś candras tamo hanti na ca tārā sahasraśaḥ. If there is one moon in the sky, that is sufficient. You don't require millions of stars, twinkling. So let there be an institution, and it is open to everyone. There is no question of "secular" and particular.... Let them learn this art. That is wanted. Not blindly, but apply your consideration and take it after mature judgment. No, what is that? Everything is there. There is no difficulty. Why you are neglecting this important business of India? Do you think it is right?
Mr. Rajda: One should not neglect. And as real it is done, it is better, not only for the world, for India also.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Mr. Rajda: Rejected... The impediment was that all those rulers, most of them gave up believing in religion.
Prabhupāda: Why you are bringing religion? It is science. Why you are mistaking again? Is that religion, a child is growing to become a young man? Is that religion? It is science.
Mr. Rajda: But they do not look at from that perspective.
Prabhupāda: That means rascals. They do not accept "Two plus two equal to four."
Mr. Rajda: Yeah, correct. Intelligent...
Prabhupāda: If we do not take mathematics as it is, and if we interpret "Two plus two equal to three," that is rascaldom. "Two plus two equal to four," that is everywhere.
Mr. Rajda: Quite right. Everything is right. Now only put some concrete proposals, how do we want to proceed in this...
Prabhupāda: The proposal is there. Here it is already done. The same principle, the four things, man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru, mām evaiṣyasi asaṁśayaḥ (BG 18.65). These four principles, what is the difficulty? But if you are determined, "No, we shall not follow," then who can educate you? There is no loss. And if there is some gain, why not take it? We have to educate so many young men. So I think that harijana movement... You can bring that... That one gentleman, Dr. Parmar(?), you know him?
Mr. Rajda: Dr. Faramar?
Prabhupāda: Yes?
Mr. Rajda: Faramar, I have... Yeah.
Prabhupāda: He has regretted that "Government has spent so much money and we have tried, but we could not improve our position."
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This gentleman that Śrīla Prabhupāda was mentioning is named Professor Parmar. He's written one article.
Prabhupāda: Profess... Professor.
Mr. Rajda: Professor Parmar. Ah, ha, that is...
Prabhupāda: He is the same man?
Mr. Rajda: No, that's a different.
Prabhupāda: So they are hankering after for improving. Everyone is hankering. So let there be a demi-official, a regular institute to teach people the principles of Bhagavad-gītā as it is. Bas. Don't distort it. Don't amend it. As it is.