Himāvatī: Śrīla Prabhupāda? I just have one question about the ending, that Ajāmila, he was calling the name of his youngest son.
Himāvatī: He was thinking but he was calling out to him, and after calling, he was reminded of his early life, of his worshiping the real Nārāyaṇa.
Himāvatī: And therefore Nārāyaṇa saved him. Isn't that true?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes.
Himāvatī: Not that he was simply calling and Nārāyaṇa had to save him...
Prabhupāda: But simply calling, "Nārāyaṇa," he reminded, he remembered. Remembered. Yes.
Himāvatī: He remembered the real Nārāyaṇa.
Prabhupāda: Because actually when one chants Lord Kṛṣṇa's name, Lord's name, immediately he remembers Lord's form, activities, pastimes, everything. That is natural.
Himāvatī: Not that he was unconsciously just chanting and the Lord saved him in that way, but he actually remembered the Lord.
Prabhupāda: That is the remark of Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura. But according to others' opinion, even simply by chanting, that is sufficient. In the Bhāgavata it is stated like that. But Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura has remarked that this chanting referred to the context. Immediately he remembered Nārāyaṇa.
Himāvatī: In that same connection, the story of Ṭhākura Haridāsa and the harlot. She began to chant and told him the reason that she was a prostitute, she was no good and simply by that association she began to chant or by previous association...
Prabhupāda: No, by association. By the influence of Haridāsa Ṭhākura. For three days, three days she associated.
Himāvatī: But Professor Sanyal was putting forward his theory that in previous lives she had had association; therefore she began to chant.
Prabhupāda: Why previous lives? That's not very good reason.
Himāvatī: Subconscious, that she had subconsciously remembered.
Prabhupāda: No, no. No, no. That is not.
Himāvatī: In one of the Back to Godhead magazines
Prabhupāda: That is not. He advocates that.(?) Direct association with Haridāsa Ṭhākura. Why previously?
Himāvatī: We want to say that previously she had done some chanting.
Prabhupāda: We don't find any such thing. Professor Sanyal was not very much advanced. He committed so many blunders.
Himāvatī: You heard about that article?
Himāvatī: That was the (indistinct)
Prabhupāda: Well, if that sort of remark is given it is not against the śāstra, but it was not necessarily previously. His direct association... Caitanya Mahāprabhu says,
- sādhu saṅga sādhu saṅga sarva śāstra kaya
- lava mātra sādhu saṅge sarva siddhi haya
- (CC Madhya 22.54)
"Even a moment's association with a pure devotee—all success." Not necessarily that one has to acquire it previous, no. Generally it is so, but sādhu sanga has got its effect. Caitanya Mahāprabhu said, lavamatra sādhu sanga sarva siddhi haya. You have not read in the Sanātana-śikṣā in the Teachings of Lord Caitanya?
Revatīnandana: Does that also apply to reading the words of a pure devotee?
Revatīnandana: Even a little association with your books has the same effect?
Prabhupāda: Effect, of course, it requires both the things. One must be very eager to take it. Just like Mahārāja Parīkṣit heard Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, and there are so many others. They are also reading Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. So Mahārāja Parīkṣit was very serious. So both things should be serious. Just like the example: the husband and wife must be potent; then there is pregnancy. Otherwise there is no pregnancy. So sewing the seed, the field also must be fertile or receptive, then the seed will fructify. It is reciprocal.
Revatīnandana: If the seed starts to sprout and it lacks sufficient facilities, then it will die completely.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes.
Revatīnandana: But if a spiritual seed sprouts, then whatever sprout is made is never lost. Right?
Prabhupāda: Yes. It is not lost, but it is checked. Sometimes he is checked.
Revatīnandana: Because the tendency to revive again.
Prabhupāda: In that way again one has to... That brings the question of previous life. One was advanced so much; it was checked by some reason; he again begins from that point. Just like Bilvamaṅgala Ṭhākura. Bilvamaṅgala Ṭhākura was advanced in his previous life up to bhava-bhakti. Somehow or other, it was checked. But as soon as he heard the words from the prostitute, "Oh, you are so much after the flesh and similar, and bones and skin. If you had been so much eager for Kṛṣṇa, how you would have been disposed," immediately he came to that point and immediately left.